| === rickspencer3 is now known as rickspencer3-afk | ||
| mac_v | !log | 07:21 |
|---|---|---|
| ubot4 | Official channel logs can be found at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ - For LoCo channels, http://logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/ | 07:21 |
| Mark__T | Hey, I just compiled indicator-messages to work with the new seperated libindicator/libindicate. Do I need to do some action for pidging to work with that? (restarting/rebuilding ...) | 08:53 |
| Mark__T | Okay, found the reason: undefined symbol: indicate_indicator_set_property_icon | 09:13 |
| Mark__T | in pidgin-libnotify | 09:13 |
| mac_v | mpt: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareStore/Icons progress icon , you need to subscribe to the page ;) | 09:51 |
| Mark__T | SiDi: did you manage to build xfce4-indicator-plugin? | 09:53 |
| SiDi | Mark__T, hi | 09:54 |
| SiDi | not really :D | 09:54 |
| SiDi | Well, i did, the applet works | 09:54 |
| SiDi | but it doesnt display messages | 09:54 |
| SiDi | because of no indicator-messages. And this one depends on indicator-applet so i'm back at the start point | 09:54 |
| Mark__T | SiDi: I have the plugin running, and the 'No indicators' messages is gone because I rebuilt indicator-messages, but pidgin refuses to load pidgin-libnotify plugin | 09:57 |
| SiDi | lawl | 09:57 |
| Mark__T | I think I should try {em,tele}pathy | 09:58 |
| SiDi | i think there are unit tests in one of the indicator packages | 09:58 |
| Mark__T | SiDi: I get undefined symbol: indicate_indicator_set_property_icon from pidgin-libnotify | 09:58 |
| Mark__T | I guess I need to talk to kenvandine or ted | 10:00 |
| SiDi | yeah :/ | 10:12 |
| SiDi | maybe a side effect of the split | 10:12 |
| * MacSlow -> lunch | 12:03 | |
| === MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch | ||
| === MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow | ||
| === jblount_ is now known as jblount | ||
| dashua | SiDi, notify-osd in the middle of the desktop now? | 14:27 |
| SiDi | dashua, yeh, im not responsible for that :P | 14:28 |
| dashua | Ah alright ;) | 14:28 |
| SiDi | dashua, that's a bit shocking but it might be better than in a corner | 14:28 |
| SiDi | i dont have an opinion yet :P | 14:28 |
| dashua | Yeah, I'm indifferent as well. | 14:28 |
| mac_v | dashua: which type bubble does that? for me all seem on top right | 14:31 |
| dashua | All notifications now it seems | 14:31 |
| dashua | Oh nice. Camera shutter sound in sound-theme-freedesktop 0.4 on screenshot | 14:33 |
| dashua | Cool | 14:33 |
| dashua | http://www.ubuntu-pics.de/bild/23031/screenshot_A6RaYJ.png | 14:34 |
| mac_v | i think i need to *not* update ;p | 14:38 |
| SiDi | dashua, i know someone who has a notify-osd branch in which you can change the color of the bubble :P | 15:50 |
| SiDi | To make even sexier screenshots | 15:50 |
| dashua | Oh, link me please :) | 15:50 |
| SiDi | (lp:~sidi/notify-osd/xfconf-experimental :P) | 15:53 |
| SiDi | (but its based on 0.9.16, not 18 | 15:53 |
| dashua | Ok thx | 15:54 |
| dashua | http://paste.ubuntu.com/260378/ | 15:57 |
| dashua | I need any flags? | 15:58 |
| DanRabbit1 | is that really going to be the new default behavior? | 15:58 |
| mac_v | DanRabbit1: yes! | 15:58 |
| DanRabbit1 | ah... | 15:58 |
| DanRabbit1 | I hope there's a preference to put it back. | 15:58 |
| mac_v | i'm updating to join in on the confusion ;0 | 15:58 |
| DanRabbit1 | I mean, yea it's more noticeable | 15:59 |
| DanRabbit1 | but, it's also going to be invasive | 15:59 |
| mac_v | DanRabbit1: i dont think we will get a pref | 15:59 |
| DanRabbit1 | :( | 15:59 |
| DanRabbit1 | I guess that's what god created hackers for... | 15:59 |
| SiDi | dashua, Oo | 15:59 |
| SiDi | dashua, you dont only have this ? give me the whole output please :) | 16:00 |
| mac_v | DanRabbit1: notify-osd has too many rules , prefs for that would break a lot of stuff | 16:00 |
| SiDi | DanRabbit1, actually on a pure technical plan, you're less likely to be disturbed by it if its on the middle than if its on the top | 16:00 |
| SiDi | except during presentations | 16:00 |
| DanRabbit1 | and videos | 16:00 |
| SiDi | in which case you're likely to have disabled them | 16:01 |
| SiDi | yeh, videos too | 16:01 |
| dashua | SiDi, http://paste.ubuntu.com/260379/ | 16:01 |
| DanRabbit1 | i don't even know how to disable | 16:01 |
| SiDi | dashua, EPIC | 16:01 |
| SiDi | i forgot to push a file :D :D | 16:01 |
| dashua | Ah | 16:01 |
| SiDi | pushed | 16:02 |
| SiDi | MacSlow, the last diff i gave you is probably wrong then :D | 16:02 |
| mac_v | DanRabbit1: actually for me this works out great , i use a single right vertical panel , and previously for notification daemon i had the area in the exact same spot... so yah \o/ | 16:02 |
| mac_v | ;p | 16:02 |
| DanRabbit1 | that's why I suggest a pref | 16:03 |
| MacSlow | SiDi, sorry... very busy atm and not near the gconf/xconf stuff atm | 16:03 |
| mac_v | DanRabbit1: if keep saying perfs MacSlow will strangle you ;) | 16:04 |
| mac_v | DanRabbit1: bring it up in ayatana mailing list | 16:04 |
| SiDi | MacSlow, no problem :P better that way since i forgot a file in the tree | 16:04 |
| MacSlow | DanRabbit1, listen to mac_v :) | 16:04 |
| SiDi | if i add 20 lines of code it'll be a 3000 lines patch :d | 16:04 |
| SiDi | DanRabbit1, the code for positioning has probably changed A LOT | 16:05 |
| SiDi | which means setting up a pref would be long | 16:05 |
| SiDi | and require some code split, probably | 16:05 |
| DanRabbit1 | I'm just saying | 16:05 |
| DanRabbit1 | for me | 16:05 |
| DanRabbit1 | I'm going to block the update | 16:06 |
| DanRabbit1 | We need one of these things: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_RU2A985UKbY/SOrPTW4FZ4I/AAAAAAAABnw/b4aspUNuhfk/s400/Picture+6.png | 16:06 |
| DanRabbit1 | the little desktop, I mean | 16:06 |
| SiDi | DanRabbit1, if there are MANY complaints about it post release, feel free to bug me ~1 or 2 months before 10.04 feature freeze ;P | 16:09 |
| DanRabbit1 | haha... why wait for tomorrow? | 16:10 |
| SiDi | because i have tons of bugs to fix in other apps :P | 16:10 |
| DanRabbit1 | SiDi: have you blogged about the change? | 16:10 |
| SiDi | about which ? i'm not a notify-osd dev, i just like messing with it :P | 16:10 |
| DanRabbit1 | ah, well whoever decided it would look better in the middle of the screen should blog about why it's better | 16:11 |
| SiDi | because it doesnt cover your apps toolbar | 16:11 |
| SiDi | for instance DanRabbit1, with the top right positioning, firefox's search entry was covered | 16:12 |
| DanRabbit1 | ah, I think a better fix would have been a close button. | 16:12 |
| SiDi | which was preventing from seeing what you write | 16:12 |
| DanRabbit1 | SiDi: you can click through. | 16:12 |
| SiDi | close button == need to move the mouse too, and to _accurately_ click on a part of the bubble | 16:12 |
| SiDi | yeh but usually you use keyboard shortcuts | 16:13 |
| SiDi | so the entry is focused but covered by a bubble | 16:13 |
| DanRabbit1 | it could just show on mouseover | 16:13 |
| DanRabbit1 | the close button I mean | 16:13 |
| SiDi | if it covers content in the middle you can scroll up/down in almost all apps to move the content you wanna read | 16:13 |
| SiDi | with both mouse & keyboard | 16:13 |
| SiDi | but the close button requires to hover the bubble, aim a corner, and click | 16:13 |
| SiDi | while with n-o we can prevent a bubble from disturbing just by hovering it | 16:14 |
| DanRabbit1 | yea, I dunno | 16:14 |
| DanRabbit1 | I just disgree with the whole behavior of notify-osd sometimes | 16:14 |
| DanRabbit1 | It's confusing | 16:14 |
| DanRabbit1 | and weird. | 16:14 |
| SiDi | Yes, it's weird | 16:14 |
| DanRabbit1 | and, I'm not a total computer noob | 16:15 |
| DanRabbit1 | my mom would explode. | 16:15 |
| SiDi | but i think that once the old habits are gone, n-o will be more agreable than the previous ones | 16:15 |
| SiDi | DanRabbit1, iits because you're not a 'noob' :) you got habits | 16:15 |
| SiDi | i love being able to royally ignore notifications when i focus on something else | 16:15 |
| SiDi | and i love being notified about whats going on in my computer | 16:15 |
| SiDi | and n-o allows me both much more easily than notification-daemon with its down timeouts and actions | 16:16 |
| DanRabbit1 | Yea, notify OSD definitely needs to get actions | 16:16 |
| DanRabbit1 | that was convenient | 16:16 |
| SiDi | NO | 16:17 |
| SiDi | definately, no :P | 16:17 |
| SiDi | i was so sick of things opening without my consent when i wasnt aiming the close button correctly | 16:17 |
| SiDi | notifications are for notifying | 16:17 |
| DanRabbit1 | adjust your mouse :p | 16:17 |
| SiDi | if they want actions, there's the messaging applet | 16:17 |
| DanRabbit1 | which is bad juju | 16:17 |
| ScottK | SiDi: That's one view. It doesn't seem widely shared so far. | 16:17 |
| SiDi | ScottK, people dont like things that respect semantics :D | 16:18 |
| DanRabbit1 | messaging applet is all about bad :( | 16:18 |
| DanRabbit1 | we need less clutter, not more. | 16:18 |
| ScottK | SiDi: Personally I'm not a fan of "Ha! I'm going to tell you about something, but not actually let you deal with it", but I understand this isn't going to change. | 16:20 |
| DanRabbit1 | ScottK: I agree fully | 16:25 |
| DanRabbit1 | That was the killer feature that got me to switch to Banshee | 16:26 |
| ScottK | DanRabbit1: It's also a settled issue for notify-osd and Gnome in Ubuntu. | 16:26 |
| ScottK | There's no point in rediscussing it. | 16:26 |
| DanRabbit1 | I know :( | 16:26 |
| mac_v | DanRabbit1: FWIW , it protested against it when proposed in the ayatana mailing list :) | 16:42 |
| mac_v | DanRabbit1: this was proposed a long time back , you can check out the discussion in archives | 16:43 |
| mac_v | s/it/I | 16:44 |
| djsiegel__ | DBO lamalex DanRabbit1: http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2009/08/26/losing-my-religion/ | 17:07 |
| ScottK | He has some valid point, but is fundamentally wrong. Design is no different than code in these regards. | 17:13 |
| DBO | morning djsiegel__ | 17:32 |
| DBO | is otto around? :) | 17:33 |
| djsiegel__ | DBO: he's coming, his nick is chaotic | 17:35 |
| === beuno is now known as beuno-lunch | ||
| DBO | awesome | 17:35 |
| chaotic | DBO: hey | 17:35 |
| DBO | hey chaotic :) | 17:36 |
| chaotic | DBO: I've just realised I never got back to you on that last email - really sorry about that | 17:36 |
| DBO | its okay | 17:36 |
| chaotic | DBO: been super busy | 17:36 |
| chaotic | how you doing? | 17:36 |
| DBO | that project has been stalled by my being super busy also | 17:36 |
| DBO | I have been alright, enjoying my new job, loving working with canonical :) | 17:37 |
| chaotic | DBO: cool | 17:37 |
| DBO | so I have a challenge for you | 17:37 |
| chaotic | DBO: so what can I help with? | 17:37 |
| chaotic | DBO: uh huh | 17:37 |
| DBO | http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/269345/wpa_active_window.png | 17:37 |
| DBO | that is the new look of the icons of the window picker applet | 17:38 |
| DBO | they are bigger in general | 17:38 |
| DBO | which means they are no longer actually gtk buttons | 17:38 |
| DBO | but I need a method of identifying the active window from the not active ones | 17:38 |
| DBO | you can kinda see what I came up with, but I am not really happy with it | 17:39 |
| DBO | are you familiar with the window picker applet from UNR? | 17:39 |
| === rickspencer3 is now known as rickspencer3-afk | ||
| chaotic | DBO: in that png it's the one in the middle right? | 17:39 |
| DBO | yes | 17:39 |
| chaotic | DBO: not really familiar | 17:40 |
| DBO | ok, well the philosophy is really simple, there is an icon for every window. These icons are height of the panel (24px) and are packed next to each other. There is a 3px border on each side we can play with also. | 17:40 |
| chaotic | DBO: deselected could go to greyscale? | 17:41 |
| chaotic | DBO: they look a little blurry - are they scaled? | 17:41 |
| DBO | unfortunately yes | 17:41 |
| chaotic | DBO: ah | 17:41 |
| DBO | there is no good way to get quality icons 100% of the time :( | 17:41 |
| DBO | I am working on that problem in another one of my projects, but it isn't ready yet | 17:42 |
| chaotic | DBO: know what you mean | 17:42 |
| chaotic | can you use a highlight colour behind? | 17:43 |
| DBO | sure | 17:43 |
| DBO | just keep in mind sometimes that icon can be pretty much wholly consuming of the 24x24 area leaving only the 3px borders... | 17:44 |
| DBO | so I am also dimming the opacity of the other icons, but its hard to notice that... | 17:44 |
| chaotic | no I see that | 17:44 |
| chaotic | can deselected become greyscale? | 17:45 |
| DBO | I could do that | 17:45 |
| DBO | Im pretty sure I can make anything you can dream up happen :) | 17:46 |
| DBO | thats why its a challenge, you dream up the awesome, I make it happen | 17:46 |
| chaotic | DBO: hahaha | 17:46 |
| chaotic | DBO: can you send me some full screenshots so I can see it in context? | 17:47 |
| DBO | yes | 17:48 |
| DBO | let me put on a UNR theme also | 17:48 |
| DBO | http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/269345/UNR-wpa-screen.png | 17:53 |
| DBO | chaotic, ^^ | 17:54 |
| chaotic | DBO: looking | 17:54 |
| chaotic | DBO: hmmm, does get lost a bit | 17:54 |
| DBO | yeah | 17:55 |
| === rickspencer3-afk is now known as rickspencer3 | ||
| chaotic | DBO: that mail icon stands out a lot - how come that's highlighted so much | 17:55 |
| DBO | on the right? | 17:56 |
| DBO | no idea, ignore that... | 17:56 |
| DBO | thats not really part of this issue :) | 17:56 |
| chaotic | DBO: no, I know but they background colour makes a big difference there | 17:56 |
| DBO | it does make a difference, we could do something like that | 17:57 |
| DBO | however I really was hoping to be more subtle :P | 17:57 |
| DBO | excuse me for a moment, I need to restart my x server | 17:58 |
| DBO | maximus always screws up my windows... | 17:58 |
| DBO | back | 18:00 |
| chaotic | DBO: I'll have a think, have to leave shortly I'm afraid | 18:04 |
| DBO | chaotic, thats all I ask :) | 18:04 |
| DBO | chaotic, one more thing, if you think it should be animated or something like that, I can do that too. | 18:07 |
| === beuno-lunch is now known as beuno | ||
| djsiegel__ | mrooney|w: any idea which project this affects? https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/344228 | 19:20 |
| ubot4 | Launchpad bug 344228 in hundredpapercuts "Deleting an image that's used as a desktop wallpaper removed it as a wallpaper without notice" [Undecided,Confirmed] | 19:20 |
| djsiegel__ | gnome-settings-manager or something? | 19:20 |
| mrooney|w | well, I guess it would depend on how you want to fix it | 19:20 |
| mrooney|w | nautilus handles deleting it I believe, so you might want a warning there | 19:21 |
| djsiegel__ | gnome-control-center ? | 19:21 |
| djsiegel__ | nah | 19:21 |
| djsiegel__ | the user should be able to download a photo to their desktop | 19:21 |
| djsiegel__ | set it as the background | 19:21 |
| djsiegel__ | and delete the photo | 19:21 |
| djsiegel__ | deleting a file should not change you desktop | 19:21 |
| djsiegel__ | users don't think how the software works | 19:21 |
| === DrPepperKid is now known as MacSlow | ||
| === rickspencer3 is now known as rickspencer3-afk | ||
| Mark__T | SiDi: ping | 20:28 |
| SiDi | pong | 20:28 |
| SiDi | average lag : 6000ms | 20:28 |
| SiDi | packet loss : 0% | 20:28 |
| Mark__T | do yo still have the pidgin error I pasted here in your history? | 20:28 |
| SiDi | hm, no ? :P | 20:29 |
| SiDi | well, its somewhere in my history... but i dont even know in which browser | 20:29 |
| Mark__T | just the missing symbol thing I pasted in this channel | 20:30 |
| SiDi | do you want me to search for it ? | 20:30 |
| SiDi | (and, which paste site was it ?) | 20:30 |
| Mark__T | it was a oneliner in here, me explaining why pidgin-libnotify doesn't work | 20:31 |
| SiDi | oh | 20:33 |
| SiDi | Mark__T, i cant find it in my history | 20:35 |
| Mark__T | np, tomorrow I need to send it to me from the box I try to run latest indicator foo | 20:36 |
| Mark__T | so that I have that information at hand when kenvandine or tedg wake up | 20:37 |
| SiDi | :) | 20:39 |
| lamalex | djsiegel_: that would definitely be nautilus | 20:59 |
| djsiegel_ | lamalex: I don't know... | 20:59 |
| lamalex | seems like it'd be an easy fix too, just copy the photo to a private nautilus directory ~/.local/share/nautilus/ or something, and use that | 20:59 |
| djsiegel_ | right, but the piece of software that would make the copy | 21:02 |
| djsiegel_ | unfortunately, there needs to be a background API | 21:02 |
| djsiegel_ | right now, I think individual apps just set the gconf key | 21:02 |
| djsiegel_ | but something watches that key for changes | 21:03 |
| djsiegel_ | does nautilus draw the desktop wallpaper? | 21:03 |
| lamalex | nautilus draws it yes | 21:03 |
| lamalex | well it would just always be $XDG_DATA_HOME/nautilus/wallpaper | 21:03 |
| lamalex | what would be *the* wallpaper file | 21:03 |
| lamalex | s/what/that | 21:04 |
| lamalex | when you set new wallpaper it would get copied there | 21:04 |
| lamalex | unrelated to the old file | 21:04 |
| * lamalex thinks that ^ is a decent solution | 21:06 | |
| djsiegel_ | well, there's a lot of push behind being able to edit the current image | 21:07 |
| djsiegel_ | see my user story on the bug | 21:07 |
| lamalex | I don't think that's right, if you edit the image you should have to reset it, or expect that if you delete it, it goes away | 21:09 |
| djsiegel_ | hmm | 21:11 |
| djsiegel_ | I think editing an image is a more advanced action than deleting or moving a file | 21:11 |
| djsiegel_ | novice users will delete and move files often | 21:11 |
| lamalex | god these fscking notifications are driving me nuts | 21:12 |
| djsiegel_ | but if you open an image and edit it | 21:12 |
| djsiegel_ | haha | 21:12 |
| djsiegel_ | I am updating now | 21:12 |
| mac_v | lamalex: me too! seems totally weird when a mail notification pops up in the center! | 21:19 |
| lamalex | mac_v: you should 2nd my post to the ayatana list | 21:20 |
| lamalex | every time one pops up ive got like a 3 second "wtf is this?" period | 21:20 |
| mac_v | lamalex: FWIW , i did protest the minute it was proposed > https://lists.launchpad.net/ayatana/msg00106.html | 21:25 |
| lamalex | mac_v: yah, i think i remember | 21:25 |
| mac_v | lamalex: but when its not something they are going to listen to ... its like why bother! uninstall and use mumbles ;) | 21:26 |
| DanRabbit1 | djsiegel_: I agree with that article quite a bit. Sometimes you need a little dictatorship. The democracy should be in choosing who's in charge. | 21:26 |
| mac_v | DanRabbit1: when you install mumbles , it will block a lot ot notify-osd bubbles :) | 21:27 |
| DanRabbit1 | mumbles? | 21:27 |
| mac_v | yeah , mumbles , it uses old notification daemon | 21:28 |
| DanRabbit1 | so we can use actions and that? | 21:29 |
| DanRabbit1 | I'll check it out. | 21:29 |
| DanRabbit1 | I have to go make lunch right now though :D | 21:29 |
| popey | so i take it the middle of the right side of the screen for the notification bubble is intentional, i dont need to file a bug? | 22:03 |
| DanRabbit1 | yea, it's intentional :/ | 22:03 |
| popey | how [insert_word_I_havent_thought_of_yet] | 22:04 |
| DanRabbit1 | yea, that was my reaction too | 22:04 |
| lamalex | seems to be the concensus | 22:04 |
| DanRabbit1 | I'm glad you agree as well, lamalex | 22:05 |
| lamalex | there's a thread going on the list | 22:05 |
| lamalex | DanRabbit1: how's that tictactoe icon coming | 22:05 |
| lamalex | :) | 22:05 |
| DanRabbit1 | give me one second | 22:07 |
| DanRabbit1 | thoughts? http://elementary-project.com/abuse/tictactoe.svg | 22:07 |
| SiDi | DanRabbit1, write a hacker symbol with o's ? :D | 22:08 |
| lamalex | the triple Os should have a line through them, that's a winning move! | 22:09 |
| DanRabbit1 | I was thinking along those lines, but it just didn't look good. | 22:09 |
| popey | SiDi: I was thinking the same thing! | 22:09 |
| lamalex | DanRabbit1: you should move the top X to the top left and block the O | 22:09 |
| popey | the hacker logo but in a game of O and X | 22:09 |
| lamalex | and leave it asymatric | 22:09 |
| lamalex | asymmetric | 22:09 |
| DanRabbit1 | okay | 22:10 |
| DanRabbit1 | let me check my french fries real fast :D | 22:12 |
| lamalex | yum | 22:14 |
| DanRabbit1 | they're ready | 22:17 |
| DanRabbit1 | I'll brb | 22:17 |
| === rickspencer3-afk is now known as rickspencer3 | ||
| mrooney|w | djsiegel1: do you think the papercutters team could be unsubscibed from all papercut bugs, and let that up to individual members if they want to? | 22:50 |
| mrooney|w | it is too much volume for me and is making it hard for me to process the actual bugs I am subscribed to | 22:50 |
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