=== rickspencer3 is now known as rickspencer3-afk [08:42] is anyone noticing notify-osd place notifications in in the middle-right portion of the screen [08:50] hyperair: are you subscribed to ayatana mail? [08:50] ;) [08:50] eh no i'm not [08:50] why? [08:50] hyperair: thats a new "Feature" [08:50] ..what? [08:52] MacSlow: just a small doubt , how are the bubbles classified? the ones over the line and the ones below the line? is it user triggered and non-user-triggered? [08:52] hyperair: yup a feature [08:52] this looks pretty annoying. [08:52] hyperair: take it to the man ;) [08:53] i didn't really like removing them actions on notifications, but at least that was tolerable [08:53] this is *ridiculous* [08:53] mac_v, atm the sync. notifications appear above the "half line" and async. ones below it [08:54] hmm... [08:54] it looks like it's floating in the middle of nowhere. [08:54] * mac_v checks notify-osd wiki for sync and async difference [08:55] imo, i have text in the middle of the screen more often than at the corner [08:55] mac_v, synchronous bubble = feedback bubble [08:55] mac_v, e.g. like screen-brightness, volume etc. [08:56] MacSlow: so those are usually user triggered right? except for switching from DC to AC , which is actually user triggered [08:56] the async are just mail/wireless notifications and stuff [08:56] mac_v, correct [08:56] MacSlow: ah... thanx :) [08:57] hyperair: if you are irritated you *need* to discuss this in ayatana mailing list and convince sabdfl [08:57] maybe i will. [08:58] i still have to read through that entire thread first [10:37] hello MacSlow . What is going to happen with notifications? [10:39] Michalxo, could be a bit more specific with your question? [10:40] that irritating middle section.. will you move it to top/bottom right or are you going to keep it as it is now? [10:40] I like notifications very much, but that middle is *yuck* [10:43] Michalxo: you need to express your dissent to ayatana mailing list [10:44] ok thank you :) [10:45] Michalxo: the discussion has already started against the position , but awaiting a bigger response to revert to top [10:46] well.. few of us has already "signed" this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/notify-osd/+bug/419894 [10:46] Launchpad bug 419894 in notify-osd "notify-osd images appear at the middle right of screen" [Undecided,Invalid] [10:47] Michalxo: oh... didnt notice that bug , kindly add that bug in your response too :) [10:47] Michalxo, be sure to read the "New notification placement" thread there. [10:47] ayatana seems to be "down"? I can't connect to server [10:48] ok thank you very much guys :) [10:48] Michalxo, in http://macslow.net/?p=381 I explicitly wrote "experiment with centering bubbles vertically ..." [10:50] well.. I think I missed that.. but at first we thought it's a bug :) [11:05] silly questoin.. how can I respond on that mailing list? [11:06] I am not in any subscribed team... [11:14] Micahlxo: Go to https://launchpad.net/~ayatana, near to "Members" section, click on "join the team" [11:21] ahaaa :) [12:10] * MacSlow -> lunch === MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch [13:03] what's the ayatana list address? [13:05] ayatana@lists.launchpad.net I think [13:05] alright, thanks [13:06] * hyperair is *very* annoyed with the new notify-osd behaviour [13:07] because some people appear to have in the top right corner, notify-osd now renders its notifications in the middle, right of the screen, as if i don't have things there >=( [13:07] so much for staying out of my way. it's not blocking everything i do, from emails to terminals to web pages, among other things [13:08] ugh [13:11] hmm wait, there's already a thread about it === MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow [13:16] MacSlow: what do you think about the new notifications position, honestly? [13:18] hyperair: everyone agrees they need to be back on top , but Mark is waiting for dissent from a lot of users , so pls show dissent ;) [13:18] hyperair: https://lists.launchpad.net/ayatana/msg00557.html [13:18] mac_v: i'm afraid i might not be able to keep a civil tone if/when i do begin showing dissent. [13:19] hehe , we need to try :) [13:19] hyperair, I like it better (because it revmoves a bit of complexity from the code, if stays like that) :) [13:19] * mac_v > reboot [13:19] heh [13:20] but it now gets in my way without fail :-( [13:20] i have thunderbird in its three-pane layout mode, and hence the email contents are all squashed in the right side [13:20] now, when a notification appaers, it completely blocks a few rows of text [13:22] after my previous rant here, i was trying to keep an open mind about it, but when that happened while i was reading my mail, it seriously got on my nerves. [13:22] hyperair, I move the mouse over it and it fades [13:22] MacSlow: yes, good idea. move your mouse over it. but there's another bug in that. [13:22] MacSlow: have you tried having an entire *queue* of notifications? [13:22] leave your mouse over it, and see what happens when the next notification comes in [13:23] the new notification doesn't fade, and now i have to keep moving my mouse every time a new notification comes in [13:23] for that case we're considering to skip the initial fade-prevention [13:24] i still find it annoying that it gets in my way. =\ [13:24] just fyi, when i'm programming, i generally have a two-paned editor [13:24] when a notification comes in, it completely blocks my view of the file on the right. [13:25] and when you're using something like emacs or vim, chances are that one of the reasons you're using it is *because* you don't want to touch your mouse. [13:26] I have a question. Why not make a GUI where the user can choose? [13:27] Just a window with a dropdown list for the position. Many people would welcome this. [13:27] yeah, i'm rather curious about that as well [13:27] shakaran: why dont you ask on the ML? or MacSlow you wanna answer that ;p [13:28] I do not mean that ML [13:28] shakaran: hyperair: repeating from yesterday "if keep saying perfs MacSlow will strangle you ;)" [13:29] ML= mailinglist [13:29] mac_v: perfs? [13:29] user preference for changing the position [13:30] mac_v: and i'd say bring it on. i'm going to need someone to strange if notify-osd stays like this. [13:30] strangle* [13:30] lol [13:30] its a tough coding , but sure coding help is welcome from all sources :) [13:31] * mac_v wonders what he has to do with notify-osd anyway and shuts up [13:32] * hyperair stamps "User" on mac_v's forehead [13:32] Some users have made to customize the color patches, I've also seen patches to restore the former position [13:33] correction "notify-osd User" ;) [13:33] heh [13:33] well, customization is needed [13:34] If you give it to the users, you have more users and the more important thing, good desktop experience [13:35] * hyperair nods [13:35] it would be nice to be able to customize notify-osd even if gconf-editor needs to be used [13:36] also it appears that i now get two updates available icons [13:36] fun. [13:36] or a simple file, only give the option [13:36] too hackish [13:37] well, I have to write this on ML for the record? [13:37] go ahead, imo [13:37] and while you're at it, please post a post dripping with sarcasm about the whole change in position on my behalf. [13:37] sarcasm being the most important ingredient. [13:38] don't quote me, though [13:38] dont respect is more important [13:38] ? [13:39] nono respect is important. be very polite [13:39] Sarcasm is not a good way to ask for things. [13:40] dissent needs to be shown ;) [13:40] * hyperair shuts up before he leads anybody astray [13:56] mac_v, shakaran, hyperair: I really don't like preferences in general... it is usually a sign that interaction-design failed or missed something... furthermore it makes code more complex, in order to avoid or intercept "stupid" inputs. [13:57] MacSlow: but lack of preferences makes software rigid and takes away freedom of choice, somewhat [13:57] yeah notify-osd is being rigid more and more [13:57] mac_v, shakaran, hyperair: and once you start to move in that direction, the tendency is to have people tweak the s**t out of things... just look at the gazillion options you can tweak in compiz and its plugins [13:58] MacSlow: you're looking at an extreme case. [13:58] hyperair, shakaran: finding the right balance here is the "art" I guess. [13:58] imo just a little bit of tweaking would be nice [13:58] yes, but your balance for now is zero prefs [13:58] MacSlow: i really dont care much for prefs , but would be fun to have , just bling for me... [13:59] if the people make a lot patch for prefs you could include in the official branch [14:00] shakaran, there is some work for gconf in the pipe already... but it'll take some time before I can turn to that. [14:01] hmm nice [14:01] Well, it's a start [14:01] actually i don't really care about prefs as long as it works nicely for me (and appearing in the middle of my screen is *not* nice. [14:03] MacSlow: Unless you assume everyone is the same and uses a computer the same way, I don't see how preferences are avoidable. It's not just getting design right. [14:06] ScottK, some tweaks will be possible (afore mentioned gconf work) I just stated my general/personal view on the topic... and the ultimate goal of interaction-design (ok it's a bit utopian :) [14:06] we'd all have to be clones of each other for one size to fit all [14:07] Unfortunately, at least so far, the lack of configurability has been the source of a lot of resistance from people. I'd care a lot less about default config if things could be changed to suit. [14:07] MacSlow: does the ppa of notify-osd for jaunty have vertical placement of notifications [14:07] tgpraveen1, I don't know which PPA you're talking about. I did not create one. [14:11] How do I join the mailing list? [14:11] I want to send a message [14:12] launchpad.net/~ayatana [14:15] There we go [14:16] thank you [14:23] lololol , notify-osd is creating more interest than the update notifier ;p [15:01] tedg: ping === ian_brasil is now known as IAO [15:04] Good morning Mark__T [15:16] good morning [15:55] tedg: I get 'undefined symbol: indicate_indicator_set_property_icon' with pidgin-libnotify 0.14 [15:56] I guess my indicator patches aren't up to date [15:58] anyway, gtg [15:59] Ah, he left. [15:59] Yes, you need libindicate-gtk... [15:59] If someone sees him tomorrow... can you mention that? [15:59] kenvandine: Do you know Mark__T's mail by chance? [16:00] mark@foresightlinux.org [16:08] kenvandine: Thanks, mail sent. [16:18] hm... weird, the messaging menu , indicates a new message and as soon as i access evolution via the menu , it changes to regular icon , even when mail is not read... is that the design ? or a bug? [16:18] on the contrary if i access from evolution from the window list , the indication does not change [16:19] *access evolution from [16:19] mac_v: It should change back no mater how you select evolution. [16:20] tedg: nope it does not , i checked several times , selecting from the window list does not change the status , [oh i'm using cairo-dock , would that have something to do?] [16:20] mac_v: Shouldn't. File a bug in evolution-indicator if there isn't one already. [16:21] hmm... ok [16:22] actually i think the indication should change only when all the mail is read , not simply on selecting the app ;) so i'm gonna let this bug stay ;p [16:23] BTW tedg ,what is the icon indicator-red gonna be used for? [16:24] mac_v: I'm not aware of an indicator-red... where is it? [16:24] Infact, I don't have it on my system :) [16:25] tedg: .. humanity icon theme has a new 3rd icon , indicator-messages-red [16:25] since that icon theme is directed heavily by sabdfl , i was wondering maybe new feature :) [16:26] already in feature freeze [16:27] so unlikely [16:27] mac_v: btw mind uploading the icor a ss [16:27] icon or SS [16:27] tgpraveen1: that was there a long before [16:27] ohok [16:27] tgpraveen1: SS? [16:27] screen shot [16:28] tgpraveen1: just do ~$ bzr branch lp:humanity [16:29] by long before i mean around 1-2 weeks :) [16:45] hi i wanted to know what was decided for notification for fullscreen apps [16:45] how will it be handled in karmic i rmeember a long discussion taking place [16:46] what is the final decision? === beuno is now known as beuno-lunch [16:49] probably asked too many times.. but what is the status of notify-osd? (is it being changed back to the top or is there going to be an option as to the location?) [16:54] anyone? [17:03] tgpraveen1, from what I remember the IM-status should be used to determine if or if not to suppress non-critical/urgent notifications. [17:04] gee... some folks are impatient [17:06] mac_v: I don't know what it is [17:06] it was in Human so I just made one ;D [17:07] DanRabbit: yeah , some knows what it is for but who ? [17:07] ;p [17:07] someone* [17:07] haha [17:07] I bet ken put it in there just to make us freak out [17:08] kenvandine: booo , [17:08] any ideas what the icon indicator-messages-red is for? [17:08] away [17:08] i assume [17:08] mac_v: I named it wrong :) [17:09] it's supposed to be new-messages-red [17:09] oh [17:10] DanRabbit: booo to you too! [17:10] haha, see I have no idea what I'm doing :) [17:10] DanRabbit: i confused tedg with the wrong label [17:10] I just draw things [17:11] DanRabbit: btw.. interested in drawing an icon for Software store? [17:11] or hands already full ;p [17:11] Software Store? [17:12] app center = software store [17:12] DanRabbit: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareStore/Icons [17:13] oh [17:13] cool [17:13] the little store ones are cute, but it doesn't really look like anything :D [17:14] yeah i too think its cute , just needs a bit of touch up [17:15] too much detail for a small space [17:15] plus, optical media [17:15] we don't use optical media [17:15] it's going away [17:15] so those icons are going to have to go away pretty soon :) [17:18] DanRabbit: the progress icon is in the branch , they are jsut figuring a way to animate it ;) , the rest are still open to ideas [17:18] just* [17:18] sweet :D [17:18] yea, the progress looks goof [17:18] good* [17:18] goofy? ;0 [17:18] I meant to put good :) [17:22] * mac_v was just teasing ;) [17:33] mac_v: hmm, I'll think about it [17:34] right now I can't think of anything better than the generic package installer icon I have now :) [17:34] DanRabbit: me too , totally blank :( === beuno-lunch is now known as beuno [21:19] tedg: so what can I do to make pidgin-notify work again? [21:21] Mark__T: You just need to add "indicator-gtk" to the PKG_CONFIG check. [21:21] Mark__T: Sorry, indicate-gtk [21:21] okay thx [21:22] can't try before monday though [21:22] Mark__T: Oh, and probably a "#include " [21:25] will you ship these new splitup packages with 09.10? === vorian is now known as stevie [21:53] Mark__T, yes. [21:53] * tedg misses jabber. [22:16] mrooney|w: hey, can you try to find where this bug belongs? https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/387791 [22:16] Launchpad bug 387791 in hundredpapercuts ""Do not disconnect" and "ok to disconnect" device notifications should not use the same icon" [Undecided,Confirmed] [22:16] Surely! [22:16] Want to unsubscribe papercutters from all papercut bugs? ;) [22:27] mrooney|w: hmm?