[00:01] <Riddell> evening
[00:04] <EagleScreen_> we need a sustitude for krec http://packages.ubuntu.com/hardy-updates/krec
[00:06] <neversfelde> Riddell: evening, we need a place for koffice beta before we do upgrade tests for jaunty 4.3.1
[00:07] <Riddell> neversfelde: can you create a new PPA under kubuntu-ppa?  call it "beta"
[00:08] <neversfelde> Riddell: I can't find an option to do it, probably only admins or team owners are allowed
[00:10] <Riddell> neversfelde: https://edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ppa/+archive/beta voila
[00:10] <Riddell> neversfelde: you should be able to just copy the koffice2 packages across
[00:10] <neversfelde> Riddell: thanks, I move koffice there
[00:10] <lex79> I already moved it in experimental btw
[00:10] <Riddell> make sure you copy the binaries too
[00:15] <neversfelde> they are moved and deleted in the other ppas
[00:28] <neversfelde> we should probably announce the koffice packages
[00:28] <neversfelde> ryanakca: would you do it?
[00:55] <ryanakca> neversfelde: Sure, where are they?
[00:55] <neversfelde> ryanakca: in the new backports beta ppa
[00:56] <neversfelde> https://edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ppa/+archive/beta
[00:58] <ryanakca> neversfelde: OK
[00:58] <neversfelde> thank you
[01:00] <ryanakca> Riddell: How would you recommend I get the more drastic changes to the website done (ex, changes to the layout, etc.)... is taking the website offline for an hour or so (well, make it a few so that we have breathing room) reasonable so that we can make the changes, or should I try to get the sysadmins to setup a testsite that they can just migrate the changes to the real site?
[01:01] <ryanakca> neversfelde: is it on archive.u.c for karmic too?
[01:02] <neversfelde> ryanakca: no, there are packages for karmic and jaunty in the ppa. It won't make it in karmic
[01:02] <ryanakca> OK
[01:05] <ryanakca> neversfelde: and what's special about these packages? Is it the final release for KOffice2 or are they just now available for testing or ?
[01:05] <neversfelde> ryanakca: koffice 2.1 beta1 for testing
[01:06] <ryanakca> Can someone please re'ack bug 421061 ?
[01:06] <ryanakca> neversfelde: OK
[01:12] <JontheEchidna> ryanakca: re-acked
[01:13]  * JontheEchidna is glad to see that he doesn't have to reconfigure his printer after each reboot anymore
[01:13] <ryanakca> neversfelde: Done... give the cache a second or two...
[01:14] <neversfelde> ryanakca: thank you
[01:28] <Trouble-> Isn't the details of the Jaunty PPA wrong in the KOffice 2.1 beta news?
[01:39] <ryanakca> Trouble-: yes, thanks
[01:40] <Trouble-> np :)
[01:41] <ryanakca> Trouble-: fixed
[03:21] <ryanakca> JontheEchidna: Thanks :)
[04:24]  * spstarr is coming to the point of snapping on Fedora and sh*ty yum
[04:24] <spstarr> I want my apt back NOW
[04:26] <nixternal> lol
[04:26] <nixternal> gimme my apt!!!
[04:26] <nixternal> spstarr: I am working on some stuff for Yum now for a company....you get used to it after a while
[04:26] <spstarr> downgrading with yum? forget it
[04:27] <spstarr> see:
[04:27] <spstarr> nixternal: http://www.sh0n.net/spstarr/yum-horror.txt
[04:27] <spstarr> im getting very close to coming back 'home' to debian/kubuntu
[04:28] <nixternal> ya dude, dep hell big time
[04:28] <spstarr> this time, kubuntu but im caught cause my radeon GPU works in Fedora but not other distros.. unless i manually compile Mesa/libdrm/ddx
[04:28] <spstarr> yes
[04:28] <spstarr> nixternal: im sick of it, im so close to snapping and just reinstalling with kubuntu karmic
[04:28] <nixternal> I have had that problem as well...and funky enough, it is/was with openssl :)
[04:29] <spstarr> at least i can upgrade to the next kubuntu development from apt
[04:29] <spstarr> nixternal: haha
[04:29] <spstarr> nixternal: notice it wants to REMOVE everything
[04:29] <nixternal> I am trying to remember the package I was working on...I was like, damn, don't need this for this appliance, it takes up space...let me get rid of it...NOPE! it uninstalled pretty much everything
[04:29] <nixternal> it was for another company I was working for
[04:30] <nixternal> we used centos which is the same garbage
[04:30] <spstarr> maybe my horror with RPM will come to and RSN
[04:30] <nixternal> hehe
[04:37] <spstarr> nixternal: im serious, im fed up, i want to come home
[08:48] <Riddell> ryanakca: taking the website down for an hour or so is fine with me
[10:36] <agateau> Riddell: I have been told that kmail package is missing the ui to enable/disable indicators
[10:36] <agateau> Riddell: It seems the package is lacking the last patch
[10:36] <agateau> Riddell: can you have a look at this?
[10:54] <Riddell> agateau: these are the patches http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Ekubuntu-members/kdepim/ubuntu/files/head%3A/debian/patches/kubuntu-message-indicator/
[10:55] <agateau> It's a different list from what I posted on my people page
[10:55] <agateau> for some reason, they are shifted by 1
[10:55] <agateau> (your 0002 is my 0001)
[10:56] <agateau> and you are lacking my 0005, which adds the configuration ui
[10:56] <Riddell> ok I'll update those
[10:58] <agateau> thanks
[11:10] <jussi01> yay for kde microblog plasma widget being borke.... :/
[11:16] <Riddell> ++`````
[11:16] <davmor2> jussi01: no never I don't believe you :P
[11:17] <jussi01> davmor2: shush now :P
[11:18] <jussi01> davmor2: Ive it configed fro twitter, but it leaves the configure buttone active on top of it, which is kinda annoying
[11:18] <davmor2> jussi01: I think I bugged that ages ago I at least told Riddell if not :)
[11:19] <davmor2> jussi01: also it doesn't display other peoples posts only your own :)
[11:19] <jussi01> davmor2: ahh, I only just got to karmic now, hence I noticed it
[11:34] <jussi01> So is it just me or is open office in kde lacking icons?
[11:34]  * jussi01 thinks theres a few bugs to reports here...
[11:42] <Riddell> wait for 4.3.1 to see what's fixed there
[11:44] <jussi01> Riddell: ahh, ok. can you tell me when thats due? (of course I can look myself, but if you know quickly thats appreciated)
[11:44] <ScottK> jussi01: Tuesday
[11:45] <jussi01> ahh, k. thanks ScottK
[11:47] <Riddell> we'll probably upload tonight
[11:47] <ScottK> Riddell: I did talk about it at the release team meeting on Friday, so people know it's coming.
[11:48] <Riddell> yeah saw that thanks
[11:50] <jussi01> Riddell: excellent. thanks a lot.
[11:51]  * jussi01 is looking forward to it, there are a lot of bugs still in the current karmic (expected of course, but itll be great to see them getting fixed)
[11:55] <jussi01> also, real quick question, is there a reason the old koffice is still available in karmic?
[11:55] <davmor2> ScottK: I'm mostly testing wubi today unfortunately ubiquity appears to be crashing at the end.  Will test kne-wubi on my netbook shortly
[11:55] <ScottK> Thanks davmor2.
[11:56] <davmor2> ScottK: 2 days to install and update xp and it runs so slow :(
[11:57] <davmor2> oh and the official atheros xp driver only supports wep and not wpa :)  but xp is better than linux right :D
[11:59] <Riddell> jussi01: the koffice devs don't want 2.0 in main
[12:00] <jussi01> Riddell: is there a reason koffice needs to be in main though?
[12:01] <ScottK> jussi01: On the dvd.
[12:01] <jussi01> ScottK: ahh, ok.
[12:03] <jussi01> Itlle be interesting to see what gets fixed in 4.3.1 as neither koffice, koffice kde4 or open office are currently in a close to usable state.
[12:03] <Riddell> open office works fine
[12:03] <Riddell> 4.3.1 won't touch any of those
[13:04] <jussi01> Riddell: it does? hrm, my upgrade mustve borked something...
[13:05] <jussi01> I have  no icons, and several other UI inconsistencies...
[13:17] <ScottK> I've seen icon issues in other apps too (Quassel)
[13:18] <Sput> ScottK: that still seems to be kubuntu problem though... maybe KDE's icon cache is stale after you stopped installing the icons we ship?
[13:19] <Sput> I've had bad experiences with KDE's icon caching before :)
[13:23] <jussi01> remind me how to refresh the icon cache?
[13:25] <ghostcube> update-icon-cache ?
[13:25] <ghostcube> its definetly an update-*
[13:25] <jussi01> No command 'update-icon-cache' found, did you mean:
[13:25] <jussi01>  Command 'update-icon-caches' from package 'libgtk2.0-bin' (main)
[13:25] <ghostcube> oh missed  an s but it was very close hehe
[13:26] <jussi01> I dont really want to install libgtk2.0-bin if I can help it...
[13:26] <Sput> jussi01: wouldn't help either
[13:26] <Sput> you gotta remove the cache file somewhere in your .kde4
[13:27] <Sput> ~/.kde4/cache-$hostname/kpc/kde-icon-cache.*
[13:28] <ghostcube> hola i must remember this i have icon probs too and was wondering why
[13:28] <ghostcube> -_-
[13:28] <Sput> well, who knows if it helps with your problems :)
[13:28] <Sput> certainly helped with mine, but I'm not a kubuntu user
[13:28] <jussi01> since when did we have a.kde4 anymore?
[13:28] <ghostcube> hmm i dont have the restart icon if an krnel is new or some others
[13:28] <Sput> jussi01: ...or wherever you guy have your $kdehome
[13:28] <Sput> *guys
[13:29]  * jussi01 hugs Sputand says thanks :)
[13:29] <Sput> jussi01: did it work?
[13:29] <jussi01> got to test, work right this sec, brb
[13:32] <davmor2> ScottK: Install inside windows option is still missing from the wubi install.  I'm going to see if it is down to the drive space left being too small
[13:34] <davmor2> ScottK: no not showing up on a real xp pc either so one for evand when he gets back I think :(
[13:34] <ScottK> OK.  Thanks for testing
[13:35] <davmor2> ScottK: I'll have a look at a full install latter if I get the time if not then tomorrow to prep for alpha5
[13:36]  * ScottK nods
[13:42] <ScottK> Sput: Clearing cache didn't help and AFAIK it's just the quassel channel icons in the 'chat' list.
[13:42] <Sput> ScottK: you have stopped installing our icons for rc1, right?
[13:42] <ScottK> I did.
[13:43] <Sput> ok, should still work of course
[13:43] <Sput> except they're missing from your oxygen somehow
[13:43] <ScottK> But I did a test build where I put those back and it didn't help.
[13:43] <Sput> did it still work in the packages you had before?
[13:43] <ScottK> I didn't try that.
[13:43] <Sput> well, you probably would've noticed :)
[13:43] <ScottK> It does work with the same package built on Jaunty.
[13:43] <Sput> oh
[13:44] <ScottK> But I'm shipping your icons in that one.
[13:44] <ScottK> So it's officially weird.
[13:44] <Sput> ScottK: so maybe check your installation for /usr/share/icons/oxygen/16x16/actions/irc-*
[13:44] <Sput> do the icons work in the toolbar?
[13:45] <ScottK> Gotta turn it back on ...
[13:46] <ScottK> Yep
[13:46] <Sput> that makes it even weirder :)
[13:46] <Sput> so looks like only 16x16 is missing
[13:46] <Sput> (the toolbar uses larger ones)
[13:46] <ScottK> Except they are present.
[13:47] <ScottK> /usr/share/icons/oxygen/16x16/actions$ ls irc-*
[13:47] <ScottK> irc-close-channel.png  irc-join-channel.png  irc-operator.png  irc-remove-operator.png  irc-unvoice.png  irc-voice.png
[13:47] <Sput> oh... wait
[13:47] <Sput> just saw something confusing
[13:48] <ScottK> Also they render fine with gwenview, so I don't think it's a corrupt icon problem.
[13:48] <Sput> we have irc-channel-active in the code
[13:48] <Sput> now I wonder two things: why does it work here, and why did I pick that name?
[13:50] <jussi01> Sput: isnt irc-channel-active the one for the blue "active" chans?
[13:50] <ScottK> jussi01: One isn't provided by that name either in Quassel's Oxygen icons nor in KDE's.
[13:50] <jussi01> heh
[13:51] <jussi01> maybe that was nuno's original name? (guessing now...)
[13:53] <Sput> ScottK: it's provided in Quassel's icons in fact, but not in KDE
[13:53] <Sput> now I remember, it's slightly modified icons that Nuno never put in Oxygen for some reason
[13:53] <Sput> (prolly because we didn't poke him hard enough)
[13:54] <ScottK> I don't see it at 16x16 in my rc1 tarball?
[13:54] <Sput> ScottK: in status/ rather than actions/
[13:54] <ScottK> Ah
[13:54] <ScottK> So I need to ship that one.
[13:54] <Sput> I'll have a stab at the build system later today
[13:55] <Sput> we actually have a -DWITH_OXYGEN option in cmake
[13:55] <Sput> but never use it :)
[13:55] <ScottK> OK.
[13:55] <ScottK> Well for now I can adjust my build system to ship those.
[13:55] <Sput> yep
[13:56] <Sput> sorry for the confusion, I didn't remember that we still had some icons not in upstream KDE
[13:57] <Sput> ScottK: basically you want to ship all the icons in icons/oxygen_quassel
[13:57] <Sput> those contain the tray animation as well
[13:58] <ScottK> I don't have that.  I have hicolor, import, and oxygen under icons.
[13:58] <Sput> I think I'm going to make that clearer, move oxygen_quassel to oxygen and the things we import from kde to oxygen_kde, and allow for a build flag that doesn't install the KDE ones
[13:58] <Sput> interesting :)
[13:59] <Sput> aha, now I remember that other little details
[13:59] <Sput> *detail
[13:59] <Sput> they're in git, but not in the tarballs
[13:59] <Sput> well, I'm gonna fix this somehow. for now, status/ and animations/ should be shipped
[14:14] <ScottK> Sput: All of animations or just the irc* ones?
[14:14] <Sput> ScottK: there should be only quassel_tray* ones?
[14:14] <Sput> if I'm not mistaken again :)
[14:14] <ScottK> Sput: Right.  Meant actions.
[14:15] <Sput> the irc-channel-* ones from status
[14:15] <Sput> should be sufficient
[14:15] <ScottK> err status
[14:15] <ScottK> OK
[14:15] <ScottK> Got that set up.
[14:16] <Sput> you also might want to have apps/quassel_inactive
[14:16] <davmor2> ScottK: obvious question but one I think you'll get lots of bug reports for how do I shut kne down?
[14:16] <ScottK> Sput: I ship all the ones with quassel in the file name.
[14:16] <Sput> ScottK: ah ok.
[14:16] <ScottK> davmor2: Touch the power button and you should get the logout/shutdown/restart dialogue
[14:19] <davmor2> ScottK: I know but I can see lots of bug reports coming from it.  I can see a lot of people looking for the off button :)
[14:19] <ScottK> davmor2: We have one already.  On the TODO.
[14:19] <davmor2> ScottK: I figured it would be :)
[14:20] <ScottK> Although I'm very tempted to keep it the way it is.
[14:20] <ScottK> I netbook isn't meant to me just like a big computer.
[14:20] <ScottK> I/A
[14:22] <davmor2> ScottK: I think you would miss new user market if you did.  Too many people are used to hitting windows/shutdown or of course the linux equivalent in order to shutdown their machine
[14:22] <ScottK> Probably.
[14:23] <Sput> Alt+F2 -> "shutdown" -> Enter
[14:23] <Sput> :)
[14:23] <Sput> clicking things is so KDE3
[14:24] <ScottK> Touch power button.
[14:25] <ScottK> Hit enter
[14:25] <ghostcube> clicking things is so ... normal
[14:26] <ghostcube> -_-
[14:26] <ghostcube> i didnt know we had biolocical interface settings owadays
[14:26] <ghostcube> :D
[14:27] <davmor2> ScottK: that logs you out :P
[14:27] <ScottK> Yeah.
[14:27] <ScottK> Which doesn't, last I checked, work with Intel and kdm.
[14:27] <davmor2> not shutdown :)
[14:28] <ScottK> We probably ought to change that.
[14:51] <ScottK> Sput: Fix uploaded.
[14:51] <Sput> cool :)
[14:51] <Sput> I'll stab our buildsys later today
[14:54] <ryanakca> Hmmm... for frescobaldi, seeing that we're in FF, I'm guessing it won't be possible to sync rumor in from Debian. Therefore, should I remove the 'Suggests: rumor' line?
[14:54] <ScottK> ryanakca: Unmet suggests are OK.
[14:54] <ryanakca> ScottK: OK
[15:21] <rgreening> Tonio_: k3b extra codecs broken as it doesn't allow -unstripped52 packages and should
[15:26] <Tonio_> rgreening: needs a conditional dep, I agree, but howto ????
[15:26] <rgreening> ScottK: ^ any advice for Tonio_?
[15:27] <Tonio_> I have no option to do this since those deps are shbuildep....
[15:27] <rgreening> Tonio_: it used to work...
[15:27] <rgreening> not sure what changed
[15:27] <Tonio_> rgreening: ffmpeg packages where changed
[15:27] <Tonio_> and renamed
[15:27] <Tonio_> -unstripped packages don't exist anymore
[15:28] <ScottK> ffmpeg is what used to be unstripped
[15:28] <Tonio_> rgreening: new ffmpeg packages don't have those, check out the versions :)
[15:28] <Tonio_> ScottK: see with siretart, I worked with him on that point
[15:29] <Tonio_> ScottK: he reuploaded reintroducing the packages and asked me to change kubuntu-restricted extras to install the stripped ones
[15:29] <ScottK> So what's the issue?
[15:29] <Tonio_> since there is very few differences according to him
[15:30] <ScottK> He should know
[15:30] <Tonio_> ScottK: the issue is that the ffmpeg -dev packages have a conditional dep on libavcodec52 OR libavcodec-unstripped-52
[15:30] <Tonio_> but, as k3b package uses shbuilddeps to build the deps, it'll only depend on libavcodec52
[15:30] <Tonio_> ScottK: we could hardcode the deps, but that sounds a bit nasty
[15:31] <Tonio_> ScottK: shbuilddeps should know about conditional deps when they exist on -dev packages instead of just playing with ld
[15:31] <ScottK> I don't think they do though.
[15:31] <ScottK> So you get to write a debian/rules hack to fix it.
[15:31] <Tonio_> ScottK: I see there a limitation of the tools, so we can decide the good override
[15:32] <Tonio_> ScottK: at work right now, so I can ping siretart, but feel free to do so, and we can decide the best override later
[15:32] <rgreening> we need to allow the unstripped and stripped I believe in order for some of the codec stuff to work.. but I could be wrong.
[15:33] <ScottK> List unstripped first and then stripped so if they have the repo enabled they get unstripped.
[15:33] <Tonio_> ScottK: no ! restricted extras install the stripped now
[15:34] <ScottK> OK
[15:34] <Tonio_> ScottK: this part was asked form all ubuntu restricted packages bu siretart, he should know more the real reason
[15:34] <Tonio_> ScottK: I just did what he asked me to do :)
[15:35] <ScottK> Right
[15:37] <Tonio_> ScottK: ouch ! sorry for the keyboard issues
[15:38] <Tonio_> ScottK: I'm trying to get used to qwerty, that's pretty hard :)
[15:38] <ScottK> Seems fine to me.  I think I just automatically edit it as I read.
[15:40] <Riddell> doesn't it defeat the point of restricted extras to depend on the stripped version?
[15:44] <rgreening> I agree
[15:47] <Riddell> you can work around shlibs if needed
[15:48] <nixternal> oi oi
[15:50] <Riddell> it's nixternal!
[15:50] <nixternal> where?
[15:51] <nixternal> catch him, don't let him get away...he needs to do some work around here!
[15:59] <Riddell> agateau: http://paste.ubuntu.com/262566/
[16:00] <Riddell> quassel fail
[16:02] <ScottK> Riddell: FYI, I did just update the quassel package this morning, so please base any upload on that one.
[16:02] <ScottK> (just added some icons back in, so it won't affect testing)
[16:03] <agateau> Riddell: @phone
[16:04] <Riddell> ScottK: yeah using bzr
[16:07] <ScottK> Riddell: Cool.  Just making sure.
[16:07] <Riddell> agateau: you can have both WANT_QTCLIENT and WANT_MONO on, not sure if the CMake code takes that into account
[16:10] <agateau> back
[16:11] <agateau> Riddell: looks like I did not properly escape the desktop file path
[16:11] <agateau> odd that it builds on my machine
[16:11]  * agateau looks
[16:12] <Riddell> yes, needs quote marks around it
[16:14] <agateau> Riddell: being able to have both  WANT_QTCLIENT and WANT_MONO is annoying
[16:15] <agateau> Riddell: does the package define both?
[16:15] <ScottK> agateau: It does
[16:16] <agateau> ScottK: so it create different binaries I guess
[16:16] <ScottK> agateau: Exactly.
[16:16] <agateau> Then I need to find a way to have my define change depending on the binary
[16:17] <ScottK> Riddell: Your Kopete trayicon change got a fair amount more grumbling while you were away over the weekend.  Any thought about reverting it yet?
[16:20] <Riddell> I still maintain my lifelong dislike of excessive tray icons
[16:21] <Riddell> I don't see a purpose in the tray icon if the message indicator is on as it is currently
[16:21] <Riddell> and we should have a meeting soon to decide if we want to keep it on or not
[16:21] <rgreening> Riddell: mi is broken for tray icon stuff
[16:21] <Riddell> rgreening: how do you mean?
[16:21] <rgreening> try opening Kopete using mi
[16:22] <Riddell> works for me
[16:22] <ScottK> Riddell: Since it's fully configurable in 4.3, I think you should just let people that don't like it hide it.
[16:22] <rgreening> it only works if the app main window is not hidden
[16:22] <rgreening> i.e the app is running and window minimized.
[16:23] <rgreening> whereas I like hiding the window with the app running. mi doesn't allow unhiding the app and raising the window, only the tray icon does that
[16:23] <rgreening> so, if mi can do that, then we are ok, otherwise...
[16:23] <rgreening> we have issues.
[16:24] <Riddell> right, either Kopete should treat the Close button as a Close button and quit, or it should reappear from the message indicator
[16:25] <Riddell> that should be entirely fixable n'est pas agateau?
[16:26] <agateau> Riddell: I hope so
[16:27] <agateau> rgreening: so what you do is click the "x" button, Kopete goes away and you can't bring it back with mi, that's it?
[16:30] <JontheEchidna> moderation required in #kubuntu
[16:31] <JontheEchidna> maco: thanks
[16:31] <maco> i forgot to op myself before typing kick the first time :P
[16:34] <rgreening> agateau: yeah
[16:34] <agateau> rgreening: but you can still see a Kopete entry in mi?
[16:34] <rgreening> agateau: mi doesn't know it's running cause the window is hidden I guess. And yep, still in mi.
[16:35] <agateau> rgreening: I am afraid it's simpler than that:
[16:35] <rgreening> agateau: same happens for Kmail/Kontact btw
[16:35] <agateau> rgreening: if systray is disabled, then clicking (x) cause Kopete to quit
[16:35] <agateau> rgreening: same reason I think
[16:35] <Riddell> agateau: ps says it's still running for me
[16:36] <agateau> Riddell: strange
[16:36] <rgreening> agateau: clicking X causes window to hide and app to remain running in background is what is desired, and mi to know about this.
[16:36] <Riddell> it's also still listed in the message indicator which isn't the case after I killall kopete
[16:37] <rgreening> I noticed that too. It requires a restart of mi to pick up this change (i.e. remove it and re-add it)
[16:37] <rgreening> ^that was when the kopete icon was misbehaving though.
[16:37] <agateau> rgreening: what I fail to understand is how can your mi entry disappear if the plugin is enabled and kopete is running
[16:38] <rgreening> agateau: do you have skype :)
[16:38] <Riddell> agateau: the message indicator entry is still there for me
[16:38] <agateau> Riddell: ok, this makes more sense
[16:38] <agateau> Riddell: then I just need to figure out what is called when the systray is clicked and do the same
[16:39] <rgreening> unhide()
[16:39] <rgreening> :)
[16:39] <rgreening> or .show()
[16:39] <rgreening> lol
[16:39] <Riddell> show()  I expect
[16:39]  * agateau digs in the code
[16:40] <smarter> I think we need a way to notify the user that his app went into the mi
[16:41] <smarter> either a popup or a modal window
[16:41] <smarter> an animation would be nice too, but it requires a fallback for non-composite systems
[16:41]  * rgreening thinks we needs a "slurping" sound for when MI slurps the app in. j/k
[16:41] <agateau> :)
[16:41] <Riddell> it currently has a not very elegant dialogue to tell the user it went into the systray, that could be adapted
[16:41] <ScottK> Apparently notifications in the middle of the screen are all the rage in Ubuntu.
[16:42] <smarter> let's not do that.
[16:42] <agateau> smarter: I agree we need such a notification, not sure about the best way to implement this
[16:42] <Riddell> agateau: Quassel MI lights up when I get pinged but the window doesn't come to the forground when I select it in MI
[16:42] <agateau> Riddell: is the window on another desktop?
[16:42] <ScottK> Riddell: Got focus stealing prevention on?
[16:42] <Riddell> agateau: no
[16:43] <Riddell> ScottK: not that I know of
[16:43] <ScottK> Riddell: It defaults on Low.
[16:43] <ScottK> Which we might want to reconsider.
[16:43] <Riddell> ScottK: mm, yes
[16:44] <Riddell> if I change it to None it starts to work
[16:44] <agateau> I am getting a bit overflowed here :)
[16:44] <agateau> it's probably time to log those to LP
[16:44] <ScottK> Riddell: Same problem with clicking on the notification.
[16:44] <Riddell> agateau: yes, time for a bug tracker probably
[16:44] <agateau> ScottK: Riddell: yes, the problem is we can't use the kde api to bring app to front
[16:45] <agateau> or maybe we can... since we build with KDE support
[16:45] <Riddell> check for -DWITH_KDE=ON ?
[16:45] <agateau> Something like this yes
[16:45] <ScottK> agateau: There is an open bug asking for Qt only binaries too, so please do check for KDE=ON
[16:46] <agateau> ScottK: sure
[16:46] <agateau> it won't get upstream otherwise
[16:47] <smarter> agateau: did you post your patches to a kde ml?
[16:47] <Riddell> smarter: that's actually next on my todo for discussing with agateau
[16:47] <agateau> I posted quassel patches to sput
[16:47] <smarter> okay
[16:47] <Riddell> the konversation ones got posted
[16:48] <agateau> I posted some my api to detect support for action in notifications
[16:48] <ScottK> kdelibs too, but that conversation isn't going so well.
[16:48] <agateau> but it's not going in I'm afraid
[16:48] <smarter> 'cause we still have no idea what upstream thinks of that
[16:48] <agateau> smarter: I also had good feedback from kmail devs on irc
[16:49] <ScottK> BTW, is there an FFe approved for this MI patching?
[16:49] <agateau> ScottK: it was done before FF, am I wrong?
[16:49] <agateau> Now it's bug fix
[16:49] <ScottK> agateau: I don't think so.
[16:49] <ScottK> Adding MI support to an app I would think is a feature change.
[16:49] <Riddell> they were except for this Quassel one which I've been late with
[16:50] <Riddell> I can do a FFe
[16:51] <Riddell> agateau: so bugs, we can report them on the ubuntu package and use a tag?
[16:51] <ScottK> Quassel doesn't have a lot of bugs open on it, so a tag is probably overkill
[16:52] <agateau> Riddell: you are more used to LP than me, just tell me what feels better
[16:55] <Riddell> apachelogger: having a crisis of faith?
[17:06] <Riddell> agateau: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=message-indicator-kde
[17:09] <agateau> time to go
[17:09] <agateau> see you at 20:00 utc for udw
[17:09] <Riddell> agateau: see you then
[17:19] <Riddell> Sime_: Phil got back to us and said next Sip will be GPL by the way, so that's the licence issue there sorted
[17:19] <Sime_> sweet
[17:19] <Sime_> thanks you guys for that.
[18:03] <nixternal> apachelogger: oh you just enjoy flame baiting don't you? :D
[18:07] <ScottK> What'd he do now?
[18:17] <ScottK> I see it now.
[18:17] <ScottK> nixternal: Odd for you to suggest that.  I guess it takes one to know one.
[18:25] <nixternal> ScottK: :)  ya, but I know to keep the flame bates off my blog...I just do it here on IRC...just ask sabdfl :p
[19:02] <lex79> ScottK: can you retry this: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/eet/1.2.2-2 ?
[19:03] <Riddell> lex79: I can
[19:03] <lex79> ok
[19:05] <Riddell> although only if I manually add +retry to the end of the URL it seems
[19:05] <Riddell> ~twitter update Plasmoid tutorial in #ubuntu-classroom in two hours
[19:05] <kubotu> status updated
[19:11] <nixternal> ooh, Quickly kind of looks groovy...though I think rickspencer3 might look at creating more work for you Riddell :)
[19:11] <nixternal> though, I wonder how much of a benefit we would get from it over KDevelop and its templates?
[19:11] <Riddell> kapptemplate is the equivalent
[19:11] <nixternal> and he just answered my question in the classroom :)
[19:12] <Riddell> and could do with being more slick
[19:12] <nixternal> right
[19:13] <nixternal> though having it tie into bzr and lp is what is pretty slick too
[19:14] <Riddell> having .deb packaging too
[19:15] <nixternal> that is going to far now....we can't make it that easy for people ;p
[19:16] <nixternal> Riddell: I just might have to take that on as a future project...I think it is koolicious
[19:26] <Riddell> nixternal: which, posting quickly or making kapptemplate more complete and slick?
[19:27] <nixternal> making kapptemplate more complete and slick
[19:34] <ghostcube> hmmm i just updated on jaunty to 4.3.1 anyone did this too today ?
[19:34] <ghostcube> sudo apt-get autoremove shows a strange amount of packages
[19:35] <freinhard> 4.3.1 is still in staging, isn't it?
[19:35] <neversfelde> ghostcube: support => #kubuntu
[19:35] <neversfelde> freinhard: yes
[19:35] <ghostcube> no just a question no need for support
[19:35] <ghostcube> i have no probs neversfelde
[19:35] <ghostcube> :)
[19:41] <nixternal> then join #neversfelde :p
[19:41] <neversfelde> hehe
[19:41] <nixternal> there are still some packages to go through it seems...you aren't the first one to notice the mass amounts of 'no longer needed'
[19:42] <nixternal> I have a friend who must have 'sudo apt-get dist-upgrade' in a cron job that runs every minute, because he messaged me 5 times already today
[19:43] <ghostcube> oh ok i doesnt wanted to bother anybody just was surprised cause the packages the apt wants to remove had been installed 10 secs before
[19:44] <nixternal> lol
[19:44] <ghostcube> :)
[19:44] <nixternal> I wasn't paying attention and ran into that the other day on karmic and ended up autoremoving more than I wanted to
[19:45] <ghostcube> i doesnt touch autoremove for a long time now
[19:45] <ghostcube> :D
[19:45] <ghostcube> *hasent touched
[19:45] <nixternal> I do it to often I think
[19:45] <nixternal> especially after removing libpulse by accident
[19:45] <ghostcube> yeah  ihad this to in feisrty
[19:45] <ghostcube> till the day all was gone
[19:46] <ghostcube> the bad is if you autoremove by cron
[19:46] <ghostcube> -_-
[19:46] <ScottK> Do that and all you get is what you deserve.
[19:47] <ghostcube> :D
[19:48] <ghostcube> but 4.3.1 is working faster as it seems
[19:49] <ScottK> NCommander: Packagekit build failure on armel is causing my CD images not to build.  Please fix.
[19:49] <NCommander> ScottK, normal packagekit or kpackagekit?
[19:49] <ScottK> NCommander: Normal packagekit
[19:50] <NCommander> *groan*
[19:50] <ScottK> NCommander:   packagekit-backend-apt: Depends: python-packagekit (= 0.4.8-0ubuntu5) but it is not going to be installed
[19:50] <ScottK> E: Broken packages
[19:50] <ScottK> Dunno if kpackagekit gets there or not.  We don't get that far.
[19:51] <NCommander> *swears*
[19:51] <ScottK> It also died on   libgtk2.0-bin: Depends: libgtk2.0-0 (>= 2.17.9-0ubuntu1) but 2.17.7-0ubuntu3 is to be installed, but I expect that's just a transient.
[20:09] <Riddell> Sime_: if you're about do pop into our Plasma tutorial in #ubuntu-classroom in an hour, we'll be covering basicly your tutorial from techbase
[20:49] <Riddell> agateau: ready in 10?
[20:50] <agateau> Riddell: yes sir!
[20:50] <Riddell> agateau: I've found at least one critical mistake in the techbase tutorial
[20:50] <agateau> Riddell: and fixed it i home
[20:51] <agateau> *hope
[20:51] <ScottK> I think he left it to you to find during the presentation.
[20:52] <agateau> nice :)
[20:54]  * vorian want's to make a Riddell plasmoid
[20:55]  * vorian gets some fun questions ready :P
[22:02] <ghostcube> wow 4.3.1 fixes notification bugs
[22:02]  * Riddell high fives agateau 
[22:03] <ghostcube> and its definetly faster than 4.3.0
[22:04] <ghostcube> and the fonts look different
[22:07] <nixternal> agateau and Riddell: hats off, good job!
[22:07] <agateau> nixternal: thanks!
[22:10] <agateau> sleep time
[22:11] <Riddell> bon nuit
[22:20] <nixternal> Riddell: I take it the feedback applet is out? I just got an email about the survey itself being a bit to generic
[22:21] <maco> feedback applet?
[22:22] <maco> can someone add the weather plasmoid and tell it to report temperatures in Kelvin
[22:22] <maco> im pretty sure its wrong because its telling me 273K and thats 0C and um its summer. its 22C here. that should be 295K
[22:26] <maco> also, did kmail dimap break very recently? it fails after syncin 1/3 of the first folder when i add an account now
[22:27] <Riddell> nixternal: yes it's in main and still pointing at your server, I hope to get it pointing at another server toot sweet
[22:27] <maco> Riddell: you been watching too much Chitty Chitty Bang Bang?
[22:39] <apachelogger> Riddell: no crysis no flame bait, I just want to establish some identity (cause that is really missing from my POV), and to get that started people first have to think about what Kubuntu is all about + I am really not so sure what the vision is ... is it being a KDE distribution or is it being Ubuntu with KDE, cause the latter would suggest little to no changes to upstream while the latter would indeed mean a lot of em
[22:40] <apachelogger> nixternal: ^
[22:40] <nixternal> apachelogger: "To create the greatest KDE implementation ever"
[22:40] <nixternal> :)
[22:40] <apachelogger> well, that would also mean changing upstream a lot, since implementation usually differs a lot from concept :P
[22:41] <Riddell> hense kubuntu-default-settings
[22:41] <apachelogger> kds is rather non-intrusive
[22:42] <apachelogger> kmenu icon is more what I mean
[22:42] <nixternal> make everyone use krunner, get rid of the menu all together ;p
[22:43] <apachelogger> that is mutually exclusive with what you said earlier :P
[22:43] <nixternal> here are some important things in my eyes that need to work or work better: Printer (time to hack some more on the applet?), Samba (yes, even I need to access a Windows machine from time-to-time), Bluetooth, multiple-displays
[22:44] <nixternal> I am going to read jono's book and make our community even better!
[22:44] <apachelogger> so our identity should be a printer applet? Oo
[22:44] <nixternal> I should write a book called, "The Art of Destroying Community" :P
[22:45] <apachelogger> lol
[22:45] <nixternal> no, not talking about identiy on that one
[22:45] <apachelogger> you know
[22:46] <nixternal> our identity could be: "Making your desktop work, so you don't have to" :)
[22:47] <apachelogger> that is a slogn :P
[22:47] <apachelogger> anyway, what I wanted to say ... how would you make our community even better with knowledge that should already be applied to it :P
[22:47] <nixternal> but it would make creating the vision easier unless you are used creating charters for a living :)
[22:48] <apachelogger> since kubuntu is a subset of ubuntu and jono is community dude of ubuntu it would seem like the subset kubuntu already got the magic touch
[22:49] <nixternal> there is just so much work to do, and so little time
[22:49] <apachelogger> well
[22:49] <nixternal> right now I am trying to earn a living, and unfortunately Kubuntu isn't helping there :/  otherwise I would spend day-and-night on it
[22:50] <apachelogger> cause yer aint not getting new minions
[22:50] <ScottK> nixternal: I think Canonical has the destroying community book on internal distro already.
[22:50] <apachelogger> can't even leave you alone for 9 months without running low on minions :P
[22:50] <nixternal> ScottK: lol
[22:50] <nixternal> I got rid of my minions...they just got in the way :)
[22:50] <ScottK> apachelogger: I tried to demote nixternal to minion, but he still wouldn't do any work.
[22:51]  * nixternal is waiting for end of october to go spend a nice sunny month in mexico
[22:51]  * apachelogger better doesn't do that joke now
[22:51] <nixternal> haha
[22:51] <apachelogger> ScottK: sounds sensible, he is nixternal after all
[22:51] <apachelogger> sounds like human after all ... mhhhh .... daft punk
[22:51] <nixternal> ScottK: I have been doing the minion work for the greater part of 4 years... DOCUMENTATION :/
[22:51] <nixternal> which I need to work on some more, just trying to find the energy to do so
[22:52] <ScottK> nixternal: Last I heard you were complaining no doc work got done since Hardy.  Please pick one story and stick to it.
[22:52] <ScottK> kairmode is appreciated though.
[22:52] <nixternal> ScottK: Dapper :p
[22:53] <apachelogger> one more python app to eat up my poor poor mem
[22:55] <nixternal> apachelogger: so true...wonder if it is to late to convert it to c++ yet
[22:56] <apachelogger> its never to late Gautama said
[22:56] <apachelogger> too even
[22:57] <apachelogger> btw, are python apps really that slow on starting? to me it feels like KDE is starting up way faster if I remove the printer applet and jockey from autostart
[22:59] <nixternal> ya, the autostarting is something different...but just on starting alone they are no slower than a c++ alternative
[23:01] <apachelogger> nixternal: how is autostart different?
[23:02]  * apachelogger thinks that he moved everything to autostart phase 2 yet somehow KDE loads quite slowish
[23:02] <nixternal> autostart has always seemed sluggish to me
[23:03] <nixternal> phase=2 or not, it seems sluggish
[23:03] <yuriy> nixternal: are you sure? it always seemed to me like c++ kcms load instantly while python ones take a while
[23:03] <ScottK> The first python app is slow, because Python has to start.
[23:03] <ScottK> After that, not so much.
[23:03] <ScottK> IME
[23:03] <jkary> Hi Folks... Is there anyone else who just attended the PythonPlasmoids tutorial?
[23:03] <nixternal> yuriy: that would be probably be very true for larger apps
[23:03] <nixternal> but small apps you can hardly tell the difference
[23:03] <yuriy> kcms are small apps
[23:04] <yuriy> ScottK: good point, and that's not so good for autostarts
[23:04] <nixternal> oh, i didn't catch the kcms in the sentence
[23:04] <jkary> on this IRC I mean
[23:04] <nixternal> jkary: what's up?
[23:06] <jkary> I tried to install the hello-python and I am getting "No metadata file in package" error?  I am running Jaunty with plasma and kde-workspace-bin packages installed.
[23:07] <nixternal> jkary: did you create the .plasmoid file for the install?
[23:07] <jkary> I've verified the file contents for both source files.
[23:07] <jkary> nope.
[23:07] <nixternal> zip -r dir plasma-foo.plasmoid
[23:07] <jkary> hmmm
[23:07] <jkary> let me try that... one sec
[23:08] <nixternal> jkary: http://techbase.kde.org/Development/Tutorials/Plasma#Plasma_Programming_with_Python   <- you can also review that as well for more info
[23:08]  * nixternal takes the dogs out for a quick run
[23:10] <jkary> nixternal: I am following http://techbase.kde.org/Development/Tutorials/Plasma/Python/GettingStarted...
[23:10] <_3vi1_> X-KDE-PluginInfo-Depends only refers to other plasmoids, right?
[23:14] <jkary> nope... still getting the same error and I seem to be following the tutorial exactly.
[23:15] <jkary> plasapkg -v returns Qt 4.5.0, KDE 4.2.2  Plasma Package Manager 0.1
[23:31]  * _3vi1_ is away: Gone away for now
[23:53] <shtylman> Riddell seele: any counter thoughts to removing the quit button and putting it in the upper right corner? or does it seem like a sensible thing to do?
[23:54] <Riddell> isn't that different from every other app/dialogue?
[23:55] <shtylman> well...in some ways yes and others no... you mean every other install app right?
[23:56] <shtylman> on one hand...having it in the upper corner makes it similar to a window that you can close
[23:56] <shtylman> on the other hand, having it as a button with text makes it very clear what will happen
[23:57] <shtylman> and also doesn't begin to clutter the upper right with small icons
[23:57] <shtylman> that do various things
[23:58] <Riddell> is there a problem that it would solve?
[23:59] <jkary> hmmm... I guess the plasma example doesn't work in Jaunty... I've spent the last hour reviewing and tried the zip file from http://people.canonical.com/~jriddell/plasma-python/hello-python.zip
[23:59] <jkary>  with no luck either