[00:00] <TheSteve0> having problems with my nvidia drivers - if I enable Xinerama I get my dual screens to work but then Compviz does not. If I do not Xinerama then compviz kinda works but there the two screens are all screwed up
[00:00] <TheSteve0> is this a known issue
[00:01] <Nareth> Ah I think I figured out the problem, well isolated it. Pidgin seems to be causing it
[00:01] <Nareth> Anyways, any insight on why/how pidgin would cause it to freeze?
[00:02] <crdlb> TheSteve0: use TwinView if you can
[00:07] <TheSteve0> crdlb but that just sets up a mirror display
[00:07] <TheSteve0> I want my desktop to extend over both screens
[00:07] <crdlb> nope
[00:07] <TheSteve0> it did when I checked it. I would love to hear how to do it otherwise
[00:08] <crdlb> I don't have nvidia here, but it shouldn't be too difficult
[00:08] <crdlb> make sure your xorg.conf doesn't have two screens in it though
[00:08] <crdlb> well, nvidia-settings should handle that too, but you never know ...
[00:09] <TheSteve0> I am using nvidia-settings - trying to test as what the typical user is doing. I could go in and edit but most people don't want to do that
[00:09] <bucky> System=>Preferences=>Display has a set up for twin monitors
[00:09] <crdlb> I don't think that works for nvidia
[00:10] <bucky> yes it does nvidia has their own set up dialog for it
[00:10] <crdlb> since that relies on XRandR 1.2, which nvidia didn't support last I checked
[00:10] <bucky> at least in ver 180 and greater
[00:10] <crdlb> when you go to system->preferences->display, an nvidia dialog shows up?
[00:10] <TheSteve0> doesn't work on my machine
[00:11] <TheSteve0> tells me RandR is not present
[00:11] <bucky> it will ask you if you want to use the nvidia set up software
[00:11] <TheSteve0> brb I need to reboot X
[00:11] <TheSteve0> bucky: not in the build I am using - you need to use NVidia
[00:11] <crdlb> bucky: well, that's just nvidia-settings, right?
[00:12] <bucky> It appears that your graphics driver does not support the necessary extensions to use this tool.  Do you want to use your graphics driver vendor's tool instead
[00:12] <crdlb> fancy
[00:12] <bucky> it is kinda nice
[00:13] <crdlb> XRandR 1.2 support in the nvidia driver would be better, though :)
[00:13] <thesteve0> it works
[00:13] <thesteve0> thanks crdlb
[00:14] <thesteve0> and now compviz is working too
[00:18] <eurythmia_> I found the answer to my problem, but I think that it is only a temporary solution.
[00:19] <Dr_Willis> hwllo all.
[00:20] <Dr_Willis> ANyone noticed that if you dont have a 'Downloads' directory, thers some tool that keeps asking if you want to rename your 'Desktop' Directory to be 'Downloads'  "Convert directory names to your locale language" (was teh dialog text i recall)
[00:21] <bucky> crdlb, http://omploader.org/vMjliaQ
[00:23] <bucky> i haven't noticed but there was a bunch of gnome-ish upgrades today
[00:23] <Dr_Willis> I just installed ubuntu-desktop over kubuntu last night.. lets try some upgrades and see whats new. :)
[00:24] <bucky> Dr_Willis, you still have gadmin-tools installed?
[00:24] <RichardWolfVI> Nareth: That issue is confirmed as a Kernel issue
[00:24] <RichardWolfVI> the only workaround ATM is downgrading mesa to 7.5
[00:24] <RichardWolfVI> or disabling compiz
[00:24] <Dr_Willis> bucky:  actually i just removed proftpd and squid that removed  some of the gadmin tools
[00:24] <Nareth> RichardWolfVI: thanks
[00:24] <RichardWolfVI> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/419264
[00:25] <bucky> sorry.. i thought you would look at the description before installing all that
[00:25] <bucky> my bad
[00:25] <Dr_Willis> Noticeing this 'smart monitor' warning also on my external usb hard drive.. cant seem to find a good way to turn that off.. 'yes i know that drive has reported bad sectors.. the  Segate tools  verified/fixed/flagged them.. Mr smart tool.. now leave me alone...' :)
[00:27] <bucky> i've heard of that a lot.. it's a common complaint
[00:27] <Dr_Willis> yea it has a yellow 'ball' and says passed.. then a flag 'disk has bad sectors'
[00:27] <Dr_Willis> Neat tool, neat idea.. but its not really telling me any 'usefull' information
[00:28] <Dr_Willis> Assement 'passed'  - :) so.. was it like a D- passing?
[00:28] <Dr_Willis> 'does not play well with others'  I guess...
[00:29] <Dr_Willis> Im not convinced the 'smart monitering' stuff really does give any good info. but i guess they have to start soemwhere to  monitor these drives.
[00:29] <xcdfgkjhgcv> Is it just me or is Transmission not recording statistics?
[00:30] <xcdfgkjhgcv> It's a real pain for me because I'm trying not to go over our bandwidth caps.
[00:30] <Dr_Willis> hmm.. is the pcspkr module blacklisted by default now? Im not gettitng annoying beeps where i used to. :) Now THATS progress!
[00:31] <aboSamoor> Hi, how am I supposed to switch between the internal and the external mic ?
[00:31] <bucky> alsamixer ?
[00:32] <Dr_Willis> brb
[00:32] <bucky> System=>Preferences=>Sound
[00:33] <aboSamoor> bucky: sound dialog does not have switch or capture flag   ?
[00:33] <bucky> Input.. with a drop down menu to select which microphone ?
[00:36] <aboSamoor> bucky: nice, this means that internal mic is not recognized. easy indicator
[00:36] <nhasian> is 2.6.31-8 out yet?
[00:40] <nhasian> i finally borked my karmic install with an apt-get dist-upgrade today but was back up and running in 10 mins thanks to Clonezilla
[00:41] <bucky> 2.6.31.8.19 is out
[00:41] <bucky> aboSamoor, what's your hardware?
[00:41] <bucky> a lappy? what kind?
[00:42] <aboSamoor> bucky: thinkpad r61
[00:43] <bucky> aboSamoor, you got your mic boost on and vol up?
[00:43] <bucky> http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_GMF5dyzKQUw/SeVFwFBo44I/AAAAAAAABQI/KPXkyjsQWw0/s1600-h/t60_sound.png
[00:44] <bucky> http://ossnotebook.blogspot.com/2009/04/ubuntu-jaunty-904-skype-sounds-problems.html
[00:50] <bucky> aboSamoor, you may need to install oss-compat and alsa-oss
[00:50] <aboSamoor> bucky: installed alsa mixer gui and now checking ...
[00:51] <bucky> aboSamoor, you may need to install oss-compat and alsa-oss
[00:52] <bucky> i always install those anyway
[00:53] <aboSamoor> bucky: installed. should I restart  ?
[00:54] <bucky> lsmod and see if you have snd_pcm_oss or similar
[00:54] <bucky> ls -l /dev/dsp
[00:54] <Dr_Willis> Hmm.. Cups isent seeing my laserjet6l - bummer... dmesg shows it.. but cups web interface and the gnome printer config are not seeing it.
[00:55] <eurythmia_> I have an ext4 filesystem that I want to mount as a shared data directory with the mountpoint /data  ... I've tried using acl and relatime flags (exclusively) in my fstab to try and acheive the desired results, but it doesn't quite seem to work. How would I go about this?
[00:56] <alteregoa> convert from ext3 to ext4 takes years
[00:57] <nhasian> eurythmia, i have an entire hard drive mounted as /data with ext4
[00:57] <nhasian> in my /etc/fstab it is just listed as:
[00:57] <nhasian> # /data was on /dev/sdb1 during installation
[00:57] <nhasian> UUID=35dc8f8c-8f88-4e2e-8b4a-22138aea0e88 /data           ext4    relatime
[00:57] <bucky> eurythmia_,  did you specify ext4 for type in fstab?
[00:58] <alteregoa>  tune2fs -O extents,uninit_bg,dir_index /dev/sdb1
[00:58] <alteregoa> then do a fsck
[00:58] <alteregoa> fsck -pf /dev/sdb1
[00:59] <alteregoa> if ext4 is your boot device edit grub
[01:00] <alteregoa> _/boot/grub.conf and change rootfstype=ext4
[01:01] <alteregoa> then sudo update-grub
[01:01] <akgraner> BUGabundo, dude... what's up
[01:02] <BUGabundo> hello dear lady friend
[01:02] <eurythmia_> bucky: yes, I did.
[01:02] <BUGabundo> leaving for the confort of bed akgraner
[01:02] <bucky> eurythmia_, listen to alteregoa  grub2 is picky about ext4 ^^
[01:02] <akgraner> BUGabundo, I was just sayin' howdy... get some rest!
[01:03]  * BUGabundo $ kick.user(BUGabundo)->bed();
[01:03] <eurythmia_> oh ... this isn't a boot device ... it's a totally separate partition.
[01:03] <alteregoa> ah ok
[01:03] <bucky> eurythmia_, so you can mount it ok with just the mount command?
[01:03] <BUGabundo> akgraner: ****
[01:03] <alteregoa> then you don't have to care about grub
[01:03] <eurythmia_> yeah.
[01:03] <eurythmia_> it's just that I can't mount it and access it rw as a user
[01:04] <bucky> eurythmia_, can you read it as a usre?
[01:04] <alteregoa> did you mount it with sudo?
[01:04] <alteregoa> mount /dev/sdb1 /media/yourharddiskname
[01:04] <eurythmia_> I've got it mounted using my fstab
[01:04] <alteregoa> strange it should be accessable somewhere on /media
[01:05] <eurythmia_> no .. I *want* it to mount at /data ... I set it up that way ... that was it is easily accessible.
[01:06] <eurythmia_> it is mounted at /data, like I want, and I can run "sudo touch file.ext" and it'll make the file, but even doing "cd /data" as a regular user gives me a permission denied.
[01:07] <bucky> eurythmia_ ls -ld /media/data
[01:07] <alteregoa> _/dev/sdb1 /data  ext4 2 2
[01:08] <eurythmia_> bucky: it's not there.
[01:08] <eurythmia_> alteregoa: sorry, what's that ?
[01:08] <alteregoa> fstab
[01:08] <eurythmia_> alteregoa: is the underscore the prefix to my name, or a typo, or what?
[01:09] <alteregoa> ah
[01:09] <bucky> oh it's on /
[01:09] <alteregoa> eurythmia do following
[01:10] <bucky> eurythmia_ you're logged in twice and it screws with auto complete
[01:10] <alteregoa> sudo chown -R yourusername:yourusername /data
[01:10] <eurythmia_> bucky: ah. sorry about that ... that's my work machine.
[01:11] <odinsbane> anybody had luck with the new ATI catalyst 9.8
[01:11] <eurythmia_> alteregoa: still getting permission denied.
[01:13] <alteregoa> eurythmia umount /dev/sdb1
[01:13] <eurythmia_> does it make a difference that this drive is an LVM volume? ... also, it's not sdb* ... the partition is /dev/mapper/trotsky-datadir
[01:14] <alteregoa> yeah thats a difference
[01:14] <alteregoa> im not familiar with lvm volumes i have to study that now
[01:14] <eurythmia_> sorry, I should have mentioned that earlier.
[01:15] <eurythmia_> I don't think there's much of a difference with the way mount handles them, just the way they are managed. So, effectively, it *should* only come down to mount options.
[01:15] <commander_> is this the beta upgrade i get
[01:15] <alteregoa> ok i studied it
[01:15] <alteregoa> type vgscan
[01:15] <eurythmia_> ... unless there's a limitation with ext4 that doesn't allow a user read/write access to the root of a device ... then all bets are off.
[01:16] <eurythmia_> alteregoa: done.
[01:16] <eurythmia_> Found volume group "trotsky" using metadata type lvm2
[01:16] <alteregoa> fascinating
[01:16] <bjsnider> how's hte karmic artwork/theme coming along?
[01:17] <eurythmia_> alteregoa: how so?
[01:17] <alteregoa> yeah im still reading the docs
[01:24] <alteregoa> this stuff is complex, you need a mapfile
[01:25] <eurythmia_> alteregoa: a mapfile eh?
[01:26] <alteregoa> yeah
[01:26] <eurythmia_> alteregoa: would you mind linking me to the docs you're reading ... the girlfriend is calling me to bed :P
[01:26] <alteregoa> ok call your girlfriend to your computer
[01:26] <eurythmia_> lol.
[01:26] <alteregoa> http://docs.huihoo.com/redhat/rhel-5-manual/Cluster_Logical_Volume_Manager/
[01:26] <eurythmia_> thanks
[01:33] <commander_> beta is out right?
[01:35] <minimec> commander_: http://www.ubuntu.com/testing
[01:36] <bucky> commander_, yes install the updater
[01:37] <commander_> whew!! ok .
[01:38] <bucky> update-manager -c -d
[01:39] <bucky> or better yet kill X and drop down to a console
[01:39] <bucky> sudo apt-get install update-manager-core
[01:39] <bucky> sudo vi /etc/update-manager/release-upgrades
[01:39] <bucky> Prompt=normal
[01:40] <bucky> sudo do-release-upgrade
[01:40] <alteregoa> Prompt=$p$g
[01:41] <Brian> hey ineed to do a fresh install and kinda wanna try karmic is it stable enough to give it a go
[01:41] <bucky> better yet
[01:44] <bucky> Brian, same problems as jaunty... sound, X wireless all that.. grub2 can suck other than that peachy
[01:45] <Brian> what are the notable changes from 9.04
[01:46] <RichardWolfVI> Brian: Intel graphis are usable
[01:47] <sebsebseb> Brian: Karmic is  good
[01:48] <Brian> is alfa 4 the newest one
[01:48] <sebsebseb> Brian: ,but there are a few issues here and there of course,  or  a bit more then here and there, but in that case,  I haven't noticed those
[01:48] <sebsebseb> Brian: yes, but alpha 5 will be released this Thursday
[01:49] <Brian> out of all the alfas what one is most stable
[01:49] <Brian> 4?
[01:49] <sebsebseb> well  yeah
[01:49] <Brian> or 3 cause its been worked on
[01:49] <sebsebseb> the later  stuff will be more stable than the older
[01:49] <alteregoa> mr. meowagi
[01:49] <Brian> ok
[01:49] <sebsebseb> ,but that's not reall how it works for alpha
[01:49] <Brian> lol
[01:49] <sebsebseb> alpha is alpha  whichever one your running, expect bugs
[01:50] <sebsebseb> and  things can go wrong in the later alphas as well,   and  sort of serious issues
[01:50] <sebsebseb> hence why you should only be running alpha, if  you can  deal with problems that effect you, or at least work around them
[01:50] <alteregoa> alpha is pre alpha, beta is alpha and final is beta, SP1 is final and sp2 is sp1
[01:50] <sebsebseb> alpha is alpha, beta is beta,   then the release candidate, and then the final
[01:52] <sebsebseb> alteregoa  Brian  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KarmicReleaseSchedule
[01:52] <bucky> Brian, you using jaunty?
[01:53] <alteregoa> my pc uses 1.12 jiggawatts
[01:54] <bucky> alteregoa, is it in a DeLorian ?
[01:54] <billybigrigger> alteregoa: not 1.21?
[01:54] <billybigrigger> :P
[01:54] <alteregoa> my name is biff
[01:54] <billybigrigger> hello!!! mcfly!!!
[01:54] <billybigrigger> haha i just watched the trilogy the other week
[01:55] <alteregoa> yeah the dad got kicked in bttf2+3
[01:55] <alteregoa> did you see the bloopers?
[01:55] <sebsebseb> Brian: if  you want to do Karmic soon,  and  can deal with any issues you might end up getting,   then it makes sense to download the  ISO for alpha 5  (which is released this Thursday as I already put)  md5sum the ISO and burn the contents to CD and install
[01:55] <alteregoa> they put real whisky into it on the car scene with his mother
[01:55] <bucky> Brian, you using jaunty? use update manager ^^ scroll up
[01:56] <sebsebseb> bucky: sometimes upgrades go wrong
[01:56] <sebsebseb> Brian: you can attemtp upgrading from 9.04,  it may go wrong though
[01:57] <sebsebseb> bucky: anyway  unless he done  Ext4 in  9.04,   and  wants full  Ext4 in Karmic,  he has to clean install right?
[01:57] <bucky> i've just had good luck i guess
[01:57] <bucky> oh
[01:57] <bucky> yeah.. have fun
[01:57] <sebsebseb> bucky: hmm?
[02:00] <bucky> i guess ext4 has it's advantages.. like in this pgBench
[02:00] <bucky> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=ubuntu_karmic_leopard&num=8
[02:02] <Brian> im just downloadin alfa 4
[02:02] <sebsebseb> Brian: not much point now
[02:02] <sebsebseb> alpha 5 just round the corner
[02:03] <sebsebseb> and if you install that,   I guess you get less updates,  then if you put alpha 4 on now, and  then  upgrade
[02:03] <Brian> well is there going to be a huge diff between 4  and 5
[02:04] <sebsebseb> Brian: it will keep on improving yeah
[02:04] <sebsebseb> Brian: there will be differences here and there I think
[02:04] <sebsebseb> that are noticable, or maybe not
[02:05] <sebsebseb> Brian: ,but either way  makes more sense to put alpha 5 on,  and then hopefuly you can just upgrade that one untill the final, without  any issues
[02:05] <sebsebseb> Brian: ,but sometimes in the alpha's,  updates will even brake things
[02:05] <alteregoa> alpha5?!
[02:06] <sebsebseb> alteregoa: yep this Thursday https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KarmicReleaseSchedule
[02:06] <alteregoa> yeah i have to update my notebook from alpha3 to 5
[02:11] <alteregoa> but who cares
[02:23] <sebsebseb> alteregoa: update  when alpha 5 is out, and  things will probably go well
[02:24] <sebsebseb> alteregoa: or if you like apply the updates that are available now
[02:41] <codevarun> okay my problem is very common.. I am using the HCL leaptop and the speaker don't mute when I insert headphone
[02:41] <codevarun> help me
[02:41] <codevarun> :D
[02:51] <codevarun> I need help
[02:51] <codevarun> okay my problem is very common.. I am using the HCL leaptop and the speaker don't mute when I insert headphone
[02:59] <xxploit> question: is there a current problem with gdm in karmic? when i install the gdm package gdm refuses to set itself as the display manager
[03:00] <bjsnider> set it in /etc/X11/default-display-manager
[03:01] <xxploit> kk gonna see how that works out brb
[03:03] <codevarun_> okay my problem is very common.. I am using the HCL leaptop and the speaker don't mute when I insert headphone\
[03:03] <bjsnider> no repeat messages
[03:04] <codevarun_> I didn't get ans
[03:04] <codevarun_> so I thought that new guys will read it
[03:04] <codevarun_> sorry
[03:04] <codevarun_> will you tell me how can I registe here?
[03:05] <bjsnider> wait until dtchen getshere. he can deal with your issue
[03:06] <codevarun_> what is dtchen?
[03:06] <codevarun_> is it a guy?
[03:06] <bjsnider> he's our sound expert
[03:06] <bjsnider> and whatnot
[03:09] <codevarun_> ok
[03:09] <codevarun_> what about the registering in irc?
[03:09] <codevarun_> I am not able to register here
[03:09] <codevarun_> :(
[03:10] <bjsnider> on freenode?
[03:10] <bjsnider> look at their documentation
[03:10] <codevarun_> ya
[03:10] <codevarun_> where?
[03:10] <bjsnider> google it
[03:10] <codevarun_> whein I user it it says invalid email
[03:14] <IdleOne> FeLonG: #freenode for help with registration
[03:14] <xxploit> after changing the default display manager line from slim to gdm still wouldnt work, installing gdm freshly complains of not being able to reload gdm from the init.d file, and so after looking at the init script the one of the top lines says about changing HEED"blah blah" to false and after doing so gdm will start up for me. But its so slow
[03:16] <FeLonG> now I am registered
[03:17] <DKcross> hello dear friends
[03:31] <codevarun> i have registered here
[03:31] <codevarun> but how to login?
[03:33] <FeLonG> how can I login here any one can tell me?
[03:33] <BluesKaj> you are logged in
[03:33] <FeLonG> no
[03:34] <FeLonG> when I am trying to verify it says login first
[03:34] <FeLonG> Please log in before attempting to verify your registration.
[03:34] <FeLonG> I am getting this
[03:35] <BluesKaj> use the server textbox and type  /msg nickserv help
[03:36] <RichardWolfVI> Write /nickserv identify yourpasswordhere
[03:36] <FeLonG> ok
[03:37] <FeLonG> thanks it worked
[03:37] <FeLonG> now anyone here to solve my sound related problem?
[03:39] <RichardWolfVI> FeLonG: What issue do you have?
[03:39] <FeLonG> well sir when I insert the headphone it doesn't mute the speaker
[03:41] <FeLonG> RichardWolfVI can you resolve it? or I should go to make a tea :?
[03:41] <FeLonG> :D
[03:42] <BluesKaj> where are you plugging in the headphones ?
[03:51] <FeLonG> in the headphone jack
[03:51] <FeLonG> I can hear the sound from both
[03:51] <FeLonG> speaker as well as headphone
[03:57] <FeLonG> can any one help me in resolving my sound issue?
[04:00] <RichardWolfVI> I'm afraid I have no headphones to test
[04:08] <BluesKaj> RichardWolfVI, he left , typical , asks for help but doesn't give us enuff info to help him
[04:08] <MindVirus1> BluesKaj: patience is key.
[04:08] <codevarun> shall i proceed to my problem again?
[04:10] <BluesKaj> sacktime for me
[04:10] <MindVirus1> codevarun: I doubt I can help, but I can try. What is the issue?
[04:12] <FeLonG> well when I put the headphone it doesn't mut the speaker
[04:12] <FeLonG> i am hearing the voice from bothside
[04:12] <FeLonG> speaker as well as headphone
[04:12] <MindVirus1> FeLonG: is there a control on your soundcard to mute just the speakers?
[04:13] <FeLonG> no
[04:13] <FeLonG> it mute both
[04:13] <FeLonG> i have installed alsa and pulseaduio
[04:14] <FeLonG> but no luck
[04:14] <FeLonG> :(
[04:14] <MindVirus1> FeLonG: has it ever behaved as intended?
[04:14] <FeLonG> what is intended?
[04:14] <FeLonG> i am new at english too
[04:15] <FeLonG> :D
[04:15] <FeLonG> in windows it was working fine
[04:15] <FeLonG> when i inserted the headphone it mute the speaker in windows
[04:16] <FeLonG> but not in ubuntu
[04:16] <MindVirus1> FeLonG: "intended" means "expected".
[04:16] <MindVirus1> Basically.
[04:16] <FeLonG> no
[04:16] <FeLonG> never
[04:17] <MindVirus1> OK. The sound card driver in Linux may not have all of the capabilities then.
[04:17] <MindVirus1> Try #alsa
[04:17] <FeLonG> ok
[04:17] <FeLonG> shall i type it in terminal?
[04:18] <FeLonG> nothing happen in terminal
[04:18] <FeLonG> :(
[04:19] <MindVirus1> FeLonG: the channel.
[04:19] <MindVirus1> #alsa.
[04:19] <FeLonG> means?
[04:19] <FeLonG> I am new at ubuntu
[04:19] <MindVirus1>  /join #alsa
[04:19] <FeLonG> will you explaing me
[04:19] <MindVirus1> Type that into your IRC client.
[04:19] <FeLonG> shall i type this?
[04:19] <FeLonG> ok
[04:19] <MindVirus1> FeLonG: you shouldn't use Karmic if you are new to Ubuntu.
[04:19] <FeLonG> karmic means?
[04:19] <FeLonG> what is this?
[04:20] <MindVirus1> FeLonG: the new, alpha version of Ubuntu.
[04:20] <FeLonG> I am having 9.04
[04:20] <MindVirus1> This channel, #ubuntu+1, is for Ubuntu Karmic.
[04:20] <MindVirus1> OK. This channel is not for you.
[04:20] <MindVirus1> Try #ubuntu.
[04:20] <FeLonG> ok
[04:20] <FeLonG> how?
[04:20] <MindVirus1> In the same place where you typed "how?", type in "/join #ubuntu".
[04:21] <FeLonG> ok
[04:21] <FeLonG> thanks
[04:21] <MindVirus1> FeLonG: You are using Jaunty, not Karmic.
[04:21] <MindVirus1> They will be able to help you better. :)
[04:21] <FeLonG> I am there
[04:21] <FeLonG> ok
[04:21] <FeLonG> thanks
[04:22] <FeLonG> jaunty what is this and how its diff from karmic?
[04:22] <MindVirus1> FeLonG: Jaunty is 9.04.
[04:23] <MindVirus1> FeLonG: Karmic is 9.10.
[04:23] <MindVirus1> FeLonG: Jaunty is the current version; Karmic comes out in October.
[04:23] <FeLonG> ok
[04:23] <FeLonG> thanks
[04:33] <virtuald> something happened, i can't switch windows with alt-tab or clicking anywhere outside the active window doesn't do anything
[04:33] <virtuald> what could cause this?
[04:33] <MindVirus1> virtuald: With metacity.
[04:33] <MindVirus1> *?
[04:34] <bjsnider> sounds like a lockup
[04:34] <bjsnider> might have to restart gnome
[04:34] <bjsnider> or x
[04:34] <alteregoa> how can i restart iproute?
[04:34] <alteregoa> i installed wondershaper but the maintainer is such an idiot, he shapes everything including the LAN traffic, what a arkward
[04:35] <alteregoa> a wonderangry shaper, now i have to restart the machine to get rid of this crap
[04:35] <virtuald> yes metacity. and metacity --replace doesn't help
[04:35] <alteregoa> such crap packets should be fixed or deleted, no excuse
[04:36] <bjsnider> virtuald, kill nautilus
[04:37] <virtuald> ok
[04:39] <virtuald> that worked
[04:39] <bjsnider> i rool
[04:39] <virtuald> no it didn't really :p
[04:39] <virtuald> can't move the window
[04:39] <virtuald> i guess it locked up again
[04:40] <virtuald> anyway i'll close down for today
[04:43] <virtuald> um
[04:43] <virtuald> sdb2: unable to read superblock :/
[04:44] <virtuald> that's for the ext driver
[04:44] <virtuald> also got FAT: bogus number of reserved sectors
[04:45] <bjsnider> you've got critical filesystem errors
[04:45] <virtuald> i've heared the drive clicking
[04:45] <virtuald> :/
[04:45] <bjsnider> clicking?
[04:45] <bjsnider> that ain't good
[04:45] <bjsnider> that indicates a hardware failure
[04:46] <bjsnider> an abnormal sound?
[04:46] <virtuald> yeah like 5-10 times with about a second in between
[04:46] <bjsnider> well, you can do what you want, but i'd be grabbing a new drive while i can still get stuff off the current one
[04:47] <bjsnider> i've never heard of abnormal clicking sounds turning o ut well
[04:47] <virtuald> yeah i'll do that i have a few unused
[04:47] <virtuald> but now sleep :>
[04:47] <alteregoa> so i made now a copy of eth1
[04:47] <virtuald> afk
[04:48] <alteregoa> eth1:1 and let wondershaper run on eth1:1 with another static IP, and the other LAN stuff on eth1
[04:49] <alteregoa> or i install a second nic whatever
[04:54] <jiohdi> what does it mean on ubuntu channel that karmic WILL BREAK?
[04:54] <billybigrigger> it means what it says
[04:54] <billybigrigger> you WILL have breakage
[04:54] <jiohdi> break as in fail?
[04:54] <billybigrigger> yes
[04:54] <jiohdi> why?
[04:55] <billybigrigger> because it's an alpha
[04:55] <billybigrigger> things will go wrong
[04:55] <jiohdi> they go wrong on all versions, no?
[04:55] <billybigrigger> yes, but more so now
[04:55] <cwillu> yes, but the alpha and betas release break in new and wonderful ways that we have no interest in supporting
[04:56] <jiohdi> can't make an omlette without breaking a few eggs I suppose
[04:56] <cwillu> so if you need to be handheld through restoring from a backup, or fixing things from an initramfs, or so forth, you really shouldn't be running karmic
[04:56] <jiohdi> not me :)
[04:57] <jiohdi> just morbiddly curious
[04:58] <jiohdi> jaunty jackalope is a full version, not an alpha or beta right?
[04:58] <MindVirus1> Anyone experienced with podsleuth?
[04:58] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: Yes.
[04:58] <DanaG> hmm, I still am confused by the presence of both cron and anacron.
[04:59] <cwillu> DanaG, anacron isn't a daemon
[04:59] <abb> Hi, I'm setting up a new Dell Latitude E6500 (Intel Core Duo, 4GB ram) and I'm looking to play with Karmic a bit.  On my other system, I run Jaunty (x32) because it's not x64, has 1 GB ram, etc.  Long story short -- on the new (x64 Intel) Latitude, is there any compelling reason why I should install x32 (and NOT x64)?
[04:59] <MindVirus1> abb: x64 is slower.
[04:59] <cwillu> MindVirus1, uh?
[04:59] <MindVirus1> cwillu: yes.
[04:59] <abb> I ask because when I first installed Intrepid (and then Jaunty) on the other machine -- bwhwaa? slower?
[05:00] <MindVirus1> x64 needs more space to address; cache isn't as fast.
[05:00] <DanaG> wait, it's actually slower?
[05:00] <MindVirus1> It is faster with some intensive floating-point operations.
[05:00] <DanaG> I've never noticed this in practice.
[05:00] <MindVirus1> And large integers.
[05:00] <MindVirus1> DanaG: up to 10-15%.
[05:00] <abb> I was going to guess that the whole "various stuff still isn't quite available in 64-bit code yet, so you'll run into compatibility problems (eg Adobe Flash, etc)" answer... lol
[05:00] <DanaG> Subjectively, it's about the same to me.
[05:00] <DanaG> I have 4 gigs of RAM, though.
[05:00] <MindVirus1> By all means use x64; all the bugs from a few years ago are sorted out.
[05:02] <MindVirus1> There is no reason not to use it anymore. It's just inherently slower.
[05:02] <MindVirus1> Flash works, finally. :)
[05:02] <abb> Mindvirus:  this is interesting to hear. (er, "read")  Several forums I've skimmed *seemed* to suggest that using 64-bit procs to run x32-bit OSes in fact *lowers* performance, vs x64 running x64 which (ostensibly) doesn't.  ... ?
[05:02] <cwillu> I'm just gonna leave it at "citation needed"
[05:02] <MindVirus1> abb: absolutely; 32-bit is emulation mode for 64-bit processors.
[05:02] <MindVirus1> Basically.
[05:02] <MindVirus1> Nowadays both architectures are implemented without emulation.
[05:03] <abb> MindVirus: "inherently slower" as in "still not optimized"-slow, or as in "64-bit will always be slower than 32-bit, due to architecture stuff"-slow?
[05:03] <MindVirus1> abb: the latter.
[05:03] <MindVirus1> Just like 32-bit is slower than 16-bit.
[05:03] <cwillu> it's cute when people who haven't done benchmarking start talking about stuff they obviously don't know much about
[05:03] <MindVirus1> You need a longer address.
[05:03] <cwillu> it's _way_ more complicated than that
[05:03] <cwillu> http://www.osnews.com/story/5768/Are_64-bit_Binaries_Really_Slower_than_32-bit_Binaries_/page3/ is probably a good starting point
[05:03] <MindVirus1> cwillu: you don't need to take my inexperienced, untrained word for it.
[05:04] <cwillu> MindVirus1, I know I don't, I've actually done my own benchmarking
[05:04] <abb> cwillu -- to whom are you responding? if it's me, I admit: zero knowledge with regard to x64, ergo my inquiry! :)
[05:04] <abb> thanks for the url, i will go begin the long process of confusing myself further !  :)
[05:05] <MindVirus1> cwillu: I am not trying to convince you. I've read this; you've read that.
[05:05] <cwillu> I've performed testing, you've performed... thought experiments?
[05:05] <abb> Mindvirus, do you have any um...alternative links that would explain your POV?  I'd like to know what I'm getting into...
[05:05] <MindVirus1> cwillu: you can be a dick if you'd like.
[05:05] <MindVirus1> I think it's kinda low but whatever.
[05:05] <MindVirus1> abb: I'll get you some links.
[05:05] <abb> MindVirus: much obliged
[05:06] <abb> cwillu: hey don't say bad things about thought experiments (says the PHL major, at least back in Undergrad) they were like 99% of that degree track...lol
[05:06] <MindVirus1> http://www.osnews.com/story/5768/Are_64-bit_Binaries_Really_Slower_than_32-bit_Binaries_/page2/
[05:07] <MindVirus1> Funny.
[05:07] <MindVirus1> Just one page before. :)
[05:07] <billybigrigger> i don't know if i'll ever reboot into ubuntu :P
[05:07] <MindVirus1> That page shows you more benchmarks with a more noticeable difference.
[05:07] <abb> lol, haven't read the urls yet to compare -- but I was surprised by your source (and how similar the titles are...heh  okay, off to the reading-farm I go.  Thanks much, all!
[05:07] <cwillu> ... differences that go _both_ _ways_
[05:08] <MindVirus1> http://gmplib.org/32vs64.html
[05:08] <billybigrigger> linux from scratch is the best system i've ever ran haha
[05:08] <MindVirus1> If you'll look at that, it proves your point in the exact way that I said.
[05:08] <abb> wait, I'd hate to leave if the conversation is getting into -- oh wait, you mean "both ways" as in... er, nevermind
[05:08] <MindVirus1> They're using bignum libraries.
[05:09] <MindVirus1> http://www.google.com/search?q=64-bit+slower+than+32-bit
[05:09] <cwillu> it's asinine to translate that into "64bit is slower, full-stop."
[05:09] <MindVirus1> cwillu: You were too much of a dick to read what I wrote.
[05:09] <abb> but your point, if I understand it, MV, is that in "everyday use" I would see a slowdown (using my core duo machine) running x64, vs running x32 ... right?
[05:09] <MindVirus1> (12:00:29 AM) MindVirus1: It is faster with some intensive floating-point operations.
[05:09] <MindVirus1> (12:00:33 AM) MindVirus1: And large integers.
[05:10]  * abb thought we were BEYOND thunderdome... *sigh*
[05:10] <MindVirus1> abb: you wouldn't see a slowdown; the difference is difficult to percieve.
[05:10] <MindVirus1> You would see a large speedup with intensive operations.
[05:10] <MindVirus1> Not large, but substantial.
[05:10] <abb> and in other operations it would be... something I wouldn't perceive?
[05:11] <MindVirus1> Pardon?
[05:11] <abb> that seems like a perfectly fine tradeoff,  oh -- what i mean is
[05:11] <MindVirus1> abb: Absolutely. x64 is great.
[05:11] <abb> I was interpreting what you said -- "i wouldn't see a slowdown, the difference is difficult to perceive" --
[05:11] <abb> oh, now you're just screwing with me, MV.  lol
[05:11] <MindVirus1> No.
[05:11] <MindVirus1> I  told you from the get-go to get x64.
[05:11] <MindVirus1> It IS slower for some tasks though.
[05:12] <MindVirus1> Though it's difficult to perceive.
[05:12] <abb> Par example?
[05:12] <MindVirus1> abb: I showed you benchmarks.
[05:12] <MindVirus1> abb: I have no examples on this 32-bit machine.
[05:12] <MindVirus1> More and more we'll be switching to 64-bit.
[05:12] <MindVirus1> So you should stay ahead of the curve.
[05:12] <MindVirus1> People will drop dev for 32-bit in a few years' time.
[05:13] <MindVirus1> Same thing happened with 8- and 16-bit.
[05:13] <abb> (my bad, I made that age-old error of confusing the "academic" arguments between you and cwillu -- with actual "reasons I should/shouldn't use 64/32bit")
[05:13] <MindVirus1> abb: Not at all; use x64 bit.
[05:13] <abb> academic arguments are great; I'm just (apparently) sleepy :)
[05:13] <abb> thanks much.
[05:13] <abb> but i'll read the pages, naturally!
[05:13] <MindVirus1> The best thing you can do is not listen to either of us and make your opinion based on reliable benchmarks.
[05:14] <MindVirus1> You will see that they agree with us both.
[05:14] <MindVirus1> :)
[05:14] <abb> I figured x64 was the way to go, unless there was a strong reason not to do so -- if only because I'm reclaiming the portion of my RAM that is otherwise inaccessible, and theoretically I can use KVM to boot x32 kernels and such
[05:14] <MindVirus1> There is no longer a strong reason to stay away from 64-bit.
[05:14] <MindVirus1> Flash works well and there are almost no incompatibilities.
[05:14] <MindVirus1> Flash used to be a BITCH.
[05:14] <abb> "But don't take my word for it, read the book(s) yourself and then have no idea what to do!"  (with apologies to lavar burton
[05:15] <MindVirus1> abb: It is better to be neutral and have no idea what to do than to side with either side for a bad reason.
[05:15] <abb> yeah, when I was looking at intrepid (my first Ubuntu, ah those were the days...my ill-spent youth) I recall lots of bitching about the bitch that was Flash x64
[05:16] <MindVirus1> Adobe recently put out a 64-bit Flash.
[05:16] <MindVirus1> Recently as in a few months ago.
[05:16] <billybigrigger> it's still alpha isn't it?
[05:16] <abb> MindVirus1: so that would exclude my default position, which is "Intel made 64-bit processors for my system, ergo Intel things 64 > 32, ergo I do what Intel says" :)
[05:16] <abb> things thinks*
[05:16] <MindVirus1> There was a lot of marketing for 64-bit machines.
[05:17] <MindVirus1> They made it sound like there would be a 2x speedup because there are more bits.
[05:17] <abb> but bits are useful!
[05:17] <MindVirus1> Absolutely.
[05:17]  * abb bumps/sets the ball, waits for spike
[05:17] <DanaG> And AMD had been there for quite a while already.
[05:17] <MindVirus1> I hope I'm making sense. If not, I'll go back into my cave.
[05:18] <jiohdi> bottle necks can still exist if the rest of the electronics supporting the processor do not have enough cache etc
[05:18] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: AFAIK that is rare?
[05:18] <abb> Yeah.  To the point that (AFAICT) the common "platforms" seem to be referred to as x86/i32 and Amd64 (which supposedly covers both AMD and Intel 64-bit procs)?  That's what my karmic-desktop-alpha4-amd64.iso seemed to imply. :)
[05:19] <MindVirus1> abb: they should be called x86 and x86_64.
[05:19] <MindVirus1> Those are their proper names.
[05:19] <MindVirus1> x86_64 is brand-agnostic; x64 is a Windowsism.
[05:19] <abb> jodhi: dumb question, but wouldn't a manufacturer tend to provide an appropriate cache amount for their machines  (lest they risk being labeled as "crappy/slow/insert-negative-thing-here")?
[05:20] <jiohdi> abb, you would hope... but I have read of it still happening
[05:20] <MindVirus1> I've never heard "i32".
[05:20] <abb> ack.  x64 = windows?  That's good enough reason for me to jump ship and change my wording (see MV's note, above, regarding "appropriate reasons for selecting sides in a debate") heh
[05:20] <MindVirus1> It came from the Microsoft camp.
[05:21] <abb> Shame, though -- x32 / x64 sure is shorter than *SIGH* x86_64 and x86_32
[05:21] <MindVirus1> x86 refers to 32-bit exclusively.
[05:21] <abb> so x86_64 != AMD64?
[05:21] <xxploit> question, usually after doing a minimal install ill grab the xdg-users-dir package and then issue the update command for it and then it will populate the home dir with the usual folders (Video/Pictures/Projects/etc) well after installing Karmic with its minimal image I cant seen to get the folders to populate anyone know whats up?
[05:21] <MindVirus1> It is the same thing, in essense.
[05:21] <MindVirus1> *essence
[05:22] <MindVirus1> Back in the day, they called it AMD64 because AMD started it.
[05:22] <abb> kinda figured. :)
[05:22] <SwedeMike> it's still called amd64 by a lot.
[05:22] <MindVirus1> Right, but it's not AMD-specific anymore.
[05:22] <MindVirus1> So it's misleading at best.
[05:22] <abb> (yeah, the ubuntu cdimage/ISO repos label them either x86 or amd64)
[05:23] <abb> And appropriately, I was misled.  At least I knew where to find the Truth!
[05:23] <MindVirus1> x86 refers to the architecture; x64 makes it sound like there was a 364/464/564/664 instead of a 386/486/586/686..
[05:23] <SwedeMike> but I do agree that amd64 or x86_64 are the two correct terms to be used.
[05:24] <abb> yeah, but the 686 numbering scheme died off and made that all the more confusing...
[05:24] <abb> Pentium IV's weren't called 886's (etc)
[05:24] <MindVirus1> SwedeMike: hopefully "amd64" will be used less.
[05:24] <abb> and who knows WTF the latest Intel scheme ("E6000" and the like) is supposed to mean.
[05:24] <MindVirus1> abb: marketing. They wanted something new for the consumer so they came up with Pentium which was really just 686.
[05:25] <SwedeMike> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X86-64 seems to provde some background etc.
[05:25] <MindVirus1> 586? I don't remember the difference between Pentium and Pentium Pro.
[05:25] <SwedeMike> I bet that's in wikipedia as well :P
[05:25] <MindVirus1> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X86-64#Industry_naming_conventions
[05:25] <MindVirus1> This is where you want to go.
[05:25] <abb> Reminds me of when Cyrix/AMD would name their chips something like "The Cyrix 150+" (which IIRC was a 133 processor that was *claimed* to run "as good as" a 150MHz proc...ugh)
[05:25] <crdlb> MindVirus1: pent == 5
[05:26] <MindVirus1> Ahh, crdlb, that's a great mneumonic!
[05:26] <MindVirus1> *mnemonic
[05:26] <abb> Yeah, it's a sad thing to have dual(ing?) degrees in CS and Marketing.  I mean, it helps me with the whole "running a business" thing, but *so* much cognitive dissonance! :)
[05:26] <crdlb> that's where the name comes from
[05:26] <MindVirus1> crdlb: Never realized it. :)
[05:26] <DanaG> "x64" is also used in naming UEFI platforms.
[05:26] <MindVirus1> abb: the lesson you should take away is that people change shit around to fuck with you.
[05:27] <MindVirus1> :P
[05:27] <abb> MindVirus1: except you, I should trust YOU, right?!
[05:27] <abb> heh
[05:27] <MindVirus1> Nice to see discussion in #ubuntu+1 instead of a flood of joins/parts.
[05:27] <abb> But now all my basic assumptions (Jesus exists and thinks I'm cool, Santa and the Easter Bunny are friendly yet invisible, etc) are called into question, as well!
[05:27] <billybigrigger> !ot
[05:27] <billybigrigger> hahaha
[05:28] <jiohdi> abb.  www.jesusneverexisted.com :)
[05:28] <MindVirus1> Well then.
[05:28] <billybigrigger> anyone have any suggestions for a tabbed terminal besides konsole or gnome-terminal?
[05:28] <billybigrigger> rxvt or the like don't support tabs do they?
[05:28] <abb> lol, I've always wanted to try out some of those !blah-blah commands but was afraid to do so in the #ubuntu channel, for fear of incurring the wrath of...well...I don't know.  Tux, I guess.
[05:29] <billybigrigger> watch that ubottu, he's a sneaky one
[05:29] <abb> billybob: I think Terminator can run in tabbed mode, but note the *think in the prior statement.
[05:29] <billybigrigger> isn't terminator a WM?
[05:29] <abb> jiohdi: www.DontNeedAWebsiteToTellMeThat_ButThanks.edu
[05:30] <abb> hmm
[05:30] <abb> !terminator
[05:30] <abb> doh!
[05:30] <abb> that was my chance, and I BLEW it!
[05:30] <jiohdi> try skynet :)
[05:30] <abb> !skynet
[05:30] <abb> LIAR
[05:30] <billybigrigger> bahahaha
[05:30] <abb> ahem, sorry
[05:30] <jiohdi> liar? I never said it would do anything :)
[05:30] <billybigrigger> muahaha
[05:31] <abb> No, I was calling the lying machine a liar
[05:31] <abb> It knows...
[05:31] <billybigrigger> shhhh!!!!!
[05:31] <abb> They ALL know.
[05:31] <jiohdi> its a conspiracy I tell you!
[05:31] <abb> *beep* (/PART disconected by xchat for "talking crazy things that are crazy and shut up")
[05:32] <abb> !things-I-really-ought-to-know-about
[05:32] <abb> doh
[05:32] <crdlb> billybigrigger: try mrxvt
[05:32] <abb> there goes my attempt at feeble humor
[05:32]  * crdlb sees nothing wrong with gnome-terminal though
[05:32] <jiohdi> Sorry Dave.... I can't do that
[05:32] <MindVirus1> crdlb: it is preferred for me.
[05:32] <jiohdi> !hal
[05:33] <MindVirus1> Depreciated?!
[05:33] <MindVirus1> Someone needs to change that to "deprecated".
[05:33] <crdlb> heh
[05:33] <crdlb> I used to think those were the same word
[05:33] <MindVirus1> Me too. :X
[05:33] <abb> hmm, so I tried to boot my Dell on the x86_various_other_numbers_here_64 version of Karmic (Daily, 30-Aug) and it was unbootable.  Decided to be a bit less adventurous and went with Alpha-4 (x64), booted fine ... hard freeze at desktop.  Methinks Jaunty is calling my name . :)
[05:34] <MindVirus1> Karmic shouldn't be that unstable.
[05:34] <jiohdi> will karmic become anything but alpha or do they change the name again?
[05:34] <MindVirus1> It is Karmic forever.
[05:35] <jiohdi> so how long until karmic is stable?
[05:35] <abb> yeah, I agree. I think I was trying to do something crazy (like install a proprietary network driver) -- shouldn't judge the alpha-4 on that  alone.  (That kind of stuff crashes other versions, sometimes, too!)
[05:35] <MindVirus1> October 29th is the official release date, jiohdi.
[05:35] <jiohdi> so by october all the testing should be done?
[05:35] <MindVirus1> Yes.
[05:35]  * abb will give the Koala another chance.  But then he gets it.  (motions threateningly towards innocent marsupial)
[05:35] <jiohdi> in therory :)
[05:35] <MindVirus1> October 1 is beta day IIRC.
[05:36] <abb> yeah, and I wanted to be ready!
[05:36] <abb> I had my Beta Blouse all ironed and ready to wear... and my Beta Bonnet
[05:36] <MindVirus1> Wow.
[05:36] <abb> eh
[05:36] <abb> they can't *all* be funny.
[05:37] <MindVirus1> Haha.
[05:37] <abb> EXPORT MindVirus1_Expectations="-5"
[05:37] <MindVirus1> abb: :D
[05:37] <jiohdi> will the massive beta lead to a satisfying release?
[05:37] <abb> hey, I think you have double-meaning in them there words of yours!
[05:37] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: I already see Karmic to be a satisfying release with a few corner cases left over to fix.
[05:37] <jiohdi> :)
[05:38] <jiohdi> is karmic still lean enough for older machines?
[05:39] <abb> One of the reasons I was considering setting up this (new) machine with Karmic, rather than Jaunty (and then upgrading later) is GRUB 2.  I read that machines running grub 1.5 won't be auto-upgraded to the new bootloader, and (insert other, non-GRUB examples of similar stuff) it seemed like this was a better way to get *close* to a "clean install of Karmic" when it's out of beta...
[05:39]  * abb is certain that last sentence makes no sense, but is hesitant/lazy to diagram it and figure out why. He blames 64-bit processing.
[05:40] <abb> karmic-mobile should be lean!
[05:40] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: Should be; remove all the recommended programs that you don't need though.
[05:40] <abb> I have jaunty-minimal on my Android/G1 phone -- but that's only because I'm a ginormous nerd, not because it "proves" anything.
[05:40] <MindVirus1> I don't like f-spot for example.
[05:41] <abb> !f-spot (does it dislike me, too?)
[05:41] <jiohdi> having programs without using them will slow the system?
[05:41] <abb> doh
[05:42] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: no; what do you mean by lean?
[05:42] <abb> jiohdi: not necessarily, but it wastes HDD space and you can *easily* make stuff WAY too confusing if you hit the repo and install everything that looks "cool."  I speak not from personal experience, but I have this *friend*, see...
[05:43] <jiohdi> if you remove lots of stuff... will that take other stuff needed by left over programs/
[05:43] <jiohdi> likes windows does?
[05:43] <abb> jiohdi: as long as you use one of the package managers (apt-get, aptitude, synaptec) it will not remove files that (other) programs still depend on.
[05:44] <abb> so:  # rm /application-directory    (NO!)
[05:44] <abb> and # apt-get remove application  (yes!)
[05:44] <abb> or apt-get delete... something
[05:44] <abb> !apt-get
[05:44] <abb> hooray!
[05:44] <abb> first time it worked for me today.
[05:44] <jiohdi> when you use the program labelled add/remove, which one is that/
[05:45] <MindVirus1> apt is a very smart system, jiohdi.
[05:45] <MindVirus1> It makes sure that your dependencies are in order.
[05:45] <MindVirus1> Just make SURE that when you remove something you're not also removing ubuntu-desktop.
[05:45] <abb> I think MindVirus1 will agree: the main thing you want in a package manager is Super Cow Powers.
[05:45] <MindVirus1> abb: most important thing.
[05:45] <abb> MV: yeah, it tends to want to do that...a LOT
[05:45] <MindVirus1> abb: apt-get moo
[05:45] <abb> yup
[05:46] <abb> There was a wikipedia article on it, I think.  or it might have been everything2.  I loved how there were like, 6 different cow messages you could drill-down through...
[05:46] <DanaG> aptitude moo?
[05:47] <abb> jiohdi: the add/remove program is kind of a limited version of apt/synaptec, but you'll find that it often says something akin to "um, this is too hard for me to remove, I'm stupid, try the other package managers instead"
[05:47] <abb> (when removing, not adding, apps)
[05:47] <abb> hit System-Menu/Administration/Synaptic Package Manager
[05:47] <jiohdi> synaptic should work better than, right
[05:48] <abb> It will allow you to remove packages without saying "no, I don't know how to do that" yes
[05:48] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: Yes.
[05:48] <abb> features ++ FTW
[05:48] <jiohdi> synaptic does not list things apt-get installed, does it? because I could not find things I installed there
[05:49] <abb> It lacks the fun "stars that show what is popular with other people" stuff in the simple Add/Remove dialog, which is disappointing if (like me) you live and die based on the popularity of your chosen apps...
[05:49] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: it does.
[05:49] <abb> jiohdi yep
[05:49] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: same structure.
[05:49] <abb> oops, go ahead MV
[05:49] <MindVirus1> Does anyone have experience with podsleuth?
[05:49] <MindVirus1> abb: eh?
[05:49] <abb> jiohdi: oh the RHS, click "Status" and then select "Already Installed" to show only installed programs.
[05:50] <abb> MV: I thought we were both about to (in tandem) try to explain something, so I was telling u to go ahead.  Nevermind.  Best to ignore me, as you'll learn is generally a good idea altogether. ;)
[05:51] <MindVirus1> abb: please type the first few letters of my name and press Tab.
[05:51] <abb> !podsleuth
[05:51] <jiohdi> what is auto-removable?
[05:51] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: packages that were dependencies and are now not.
[05:51] <abb> MindVirus1, ooh... you teach me another trick, sir!  thank you.
[05:51] <MindVirus1> abb: this way I get highlighted and see a popup notification about you.
[05:51] <MindVirus1> And I respond quicker to you.
[05:51] <jiohdi> if they are auto-removable, why didnt something already remove them?
[05:52] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: packages shouldn't be removed unless explicitly told to do so.
[05:52] <abb> MindVirus1, most people would not want a pop-up notification "about me" -- hopefully it's very vague and without any naughty pictures... :)
[05:52] <MindVirus1> Haha. It's just your name and what you typed to me.
[05:52] <abb> jiohdi: ah, the 1000000000.00 USD question!
[05:53] <abb> MindVirus1, how does that differ from when I preface a comment with YOUR_NAME: or @YOUR_NAME?
[05:53] <MindVirus1> abb: as long as MindVirus1 is in there somewhere.
[05:54] <MindVirus1> abb: if you'll notice in your IRC client the lines in which I type your name are bold or a different color.
[05:54] <abb> jiohdi: when uninstalling an app, you can Right Mouse Click on the package in Synaptec and select "purge" -- this will attempt to delete the app and all of the dependencies it installed; it will give you a pop-up warning if something else uses one of those dependencies, though.  So no worries.
[05:54] <MindVirus1> abb: no.
[05:55] <MindVirus1> Purge does not mean that.
[05:55] <abb> MindVirus1, yeah, and because I was lazy (using MV) this didn't happen for you.
[05:55] <MindVirus1> Purge removes the app as well as configuration files.
[05:55] <abb> MindVirus1, let's not argue in front of the kids, honey.
[05:55] <MindVirus1> Dependencies remain.
[05:55] <MindVirus1> abb: Right. I had to check back to see if you typed to me.
[05:55] <MindVirus1> If you want to remove unneeded dependencies, do sudo apt-get autoremove.
[05:55] <jiohdi> dependencies refers to things like dll libraries/
[05:56] <jiohdi> ?
[05:56] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: there are no DLLs in Ubuntu.
[05:56] <abb> MindVirus1, but there *is* a command for doing that, right?  I think I'm saying "purge" when I mean.....(your answer here)
[05:56] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: dependencies refer to packages.
[05:56] <MindVirus1> abb: autoremove. I don't know anything else.
[05:56] <abb> MindVirus1, there are dlls in WINE, which is in Ubuntu.  EXPLAIN THYSELF!
[05:56] <MindVirus1> AFAIK the only way to remove some unneeded dependencies without manually removing each is by removing all of them with sudo apt-get autoremove.
[05:57] <MindVirus1> abb: Ubuntu does not depend on DLLs. DLLs are a Windows-only thing.
[05:57] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: Dependencies are packages that were installed and no longer needed. For example, "pidgin" is a dependency of "pidgin-otr".
[05:57] <abb> MindVirus1, I know, I was just arguing for the sake of arguing -- since that other guy left, someone needed to be your foil, yes?
[05:58] <MindVirus1> pidgin-otr is a plugin for Pidgin that encrypts. It cannot run without Pidgin, but Pidgin can run without it.
[05:58] <DanaG> Technically, libraries in Linux are often "shared object" (I think) files: ".so" files.
[05:58] <MindVirus1> Right, DanaG.
[05:58] <MindVirus1> Kernel libs are .ko.
[05:58] <abb> jiohdi, one possible place to look would be in Synaptic, under "Status" --> Installed (local or obsolete)
[05:59] <jiohdi> is there a linux program for docx formats?
[05:59] <MindVirus1> jiohdi: OpenOffice I think.
[05:59] <abb> MindVirus1, similarly, "wings" are a shared dependency of "Pidgin" and "Bluebird" (and several other Avian packages).  Pidgin needs "wings" to fly, but so does Bluebird, and the point of all this is....not important...er
[05:59] <MindVirus1> I don't know if it supports that.
[06:00] <jiohdi> I dont think oo does that yet
[06:00] <abb> jiohdi, OpenOffice definitely supports docx, but I think you need to install one of the "not-so-free" plugins from the Mediabuntu repo, IIRC.   I know *my* OO reads docx.
[06:01]  * billybigrigger shivers looking at the word OO.o
[06:01]  * abb shivers at the thought of someone claiming CHAR+CHAR+dot+CHAR == "word"
[06:02]  * abb is reminded (and not in a good way) of the movie se7en
[06:02] <jiohdi> my clock is looking like a tie fighter 1:01 so its time for bed :)
[06:02] <abb> jiohdi, night!  take it easy
[06:02] <jiohdi> thanks for the tips
[06:03] <abb> jiohdi, don't remove any wooden nickel...packages...um
[06:04]  * abb provides MindVirus1 with extra kudos and a "huzzah" for this whole "tab-completion within Xchat" thing.  What a gloriously obvious feature that might have gone forever un-noticed!
[06:04] <abb> !tab
[06:04] <MindVirus1> :)
[06:04] <abb> yeah, you think you know everything ubottu, but lemme tell ya (shakes fist)
[06:05] <abb> !ubottu
[06:05] <abb> yuck -- "search my brain"?
[06:05] <billybigrigger> abb: don't worry, i didn't know gnome-terminal had tabs for the longest time
[06:05] <billybigrigger> i used to open a million gnome-terms :P
[06:05] <billybigrigger> kind of like your tab completion awareness :P
[06:06] <abb> billybigrigger, lol.  yeah, but I knew there was tab-completion in a million other programs...amazes me I never even *once* tried hitting tab while in xchat.... *facepalm*
[06:06] <abb> billybigrigger, wait...gnome-terminal supports tabs?
[06:06]  * abb prepares for facepalm #2
[06:06] <billybigrigger> bahaha
[06:06] <billybigrigger> file>new tab
[06:06] <billybigrigger> hahaha
[06:06] <abb> File --> new tab DOH  *facepalm*
[06:06] <billybigrigger> yeah, its pretty obvious
[06:07] <billybigrigger> i facepalmed a week after i found that one out
[06:07] <billybigrigger> that's a little more obvious that xchat tab completion :P haha
[06:07] <mkoehler> hey....I've got a quick question for ya'll.  I was running a few standard upgrades from the repos and it turns out that it broke gdebi & the update manager
[06:07]  * abb appreciates the info, but thinks billybigrigger is rubbing it in a bit.  (begin_plotting_death: billybigrigger [ok])
[06:07]  * billybigrigger watches his back
[06:07] <abb> mkoehler, The answer to your question is "ok."
[06:07] <billybigrigger> i'm not rubbing it in! haha i'm admitting that it happens
[06:07] <abb> oops, sorry.  go on. :)
[06:08] <mkoehler> haha
[06:08] <billybigrigger> mkoehler: $ sudo aptitude safe-upgrade
[06:08]  * abb guesses his question is something like "So how do I un-fucking-do this??!!"
[06:08] <mkoehler> haha not far off there
[06:08] <mkoehler> I'll give that a shot
[06:08] <abb> billybigrigger, sudo aptitude install-some-balls-and-upgrade-like-a-man
[06:09] <abb> mkoehler, I think he was referring to *future* upgrades, rather than fixing your current dilemma
[06:09] <kernco> Did anyone else have problems with upgrading libavutil-extra?
[06:10]  * abb wonders aloud: "Isn't there a way (with aptitude) to like "roll back" the last set of apt-get updates/upgrades? Or am I loony?"
[06:10] <billybigrigger> abb: haha safe-upgrade is your friend :P
[06:10]  * billybigrigger thinks loony
[06:10] <abb> billybigrigger, maybe, but sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get upgrade && sudo apt-get install WHATEVER is my preferred friend
[06:10] <mkoehler> heh, yeah, I can understand the 'yes' answer to the question
[06:10] <abb> billybigrigger, you're asking me to add a whole extra 5 characters to that !
[06:10] <brassmaster> abb:your mom is my friend.
[06:11] <billybigrigger> abb: not really
[06:11] <billybigrigger> i'm serious safe-upgrade will save your ass
[06:11] <abb> brassmaster, I wouldn't be surprised.  Wear a rubber, son.
[06:11]  * billybigrigger waits for mkoehler to say thank you......
[06:11] <brassmaster> billybigrigger:I have a feeling your advice comes a bit too late...
[06:11] <mkoehler> haha billy, I will......I'm waiting to see some magic =)
[06:12] <abb> billybigrigger, what does safe-upgrade do that (unsafe)upgrade doesn't?  I mean, why not "safe upgrade" always rather than "stupid-ass upgrade" or whatever the default is?
[06:12] <billybigrigger> brassmaster: we can only hope it isn't
[06:12] <billybigrigger> safe-upgrade won't get into broken packages or removed deps
[06:12] <abb> billybigrigger, yeah, he was asking what to do now that he's *already* clobbered the update manager, etc.  So I don't think safe-upgrade will help him (right now) fix that problem.
[06:13] <billybigrigger> as an apt-get update can sometimes remove packages if the deps are built fully
[06:13]  * billybigrigger sips his beer and reads the question again....
[06:13] <abb> billybigrigger, I thought "update" merely refreshed the repo information ...
[06:13] <billybigrigger> ya no, he might be ok
[06:13] <billybigrigger> mkoehler: what's happening? what's your 20?
[06:14] <mkoehler> just finished all of the downloads, starting the installation
[06:14] <abb> billybigrigger, no, too late.  he went off to implement your "fix my computer with safe-upgrade" method.
[06:14] <abb> oops
[06:14] <mkoehler> haha
[06:14] <billybigrigger> bahahaha
 billybigrigger, I thought "update" merely refreshed the repo information ...
[06:14] <abb> so much for my big guilt trip lol
[06:14] <billybigrigger> it sure does
[06:14] <billybigrigger> that's good thinking abb  :P
[06:15] <abb> billybigrigger, <billybigrigger> as an apt-get update can sometimes remove packages if the deps are built fully
[06:15] <billybigrigger> s/update/upgrade
[06:15] <billybigrigger> :)
[06:15]  * billybigrigger gulps his beer
[06:15] <abb> billybigrigger, that's what I thought you dick && s/dick/TRUSTED-FRIEND
[06:15] <mkoehler> haha sips -> gulps
[06:16] <billybigrigger> mkoehler: :)
[06:16] <mkoehler> that's not a good sign for me
[06:16] <billybigrigger> it sure is :)
[06:16] <mkoehler> but I have a feeling I should do the same
[06:16]  * abb takes handful of random prescription meds, due to peer pressure
[06:16] <billybigrigger> it's my friday
[06:16] <mkoehler> haha...it's always friday
[06:16] <mkoehler> @ beer-thirty
[06:16] <abb> mkoehler wait, let's focus on your problem lol
[06:16] <billybigrigger> true true
[06:16]  * billybigrigger waits for the thank you....
[06:16] <abb> mkoehler, you're still having update manager woes, yes?
[06:16] <mkoehler> I'm still waiting to see the magic
[06:16]  * abb thanks everyone
[06:17] <billybigrigger> wtf man, are you on dial-up?
[06:17] <mkoehler> it's running through the installations right now
[06:17] <billybigrigger> geez
[06:17] <mkoehler> nah man
[06:17] <billybigrigger> haha ok
[06:17] <abb> mkoehler, have you tried re-installing the update manager yet?
[06:17] <mkoehler> I would guess that I have the quickest internet connection here heh
[06:17] <billybigrigger> mkoehler: ooooooh, whatcha got?
[06:17] <mkoehler> it's not really mine
[06:17] <billybigrigger> work?
[06:17] <mkoehler> I'm on a campus
[06:17] <billybigrigger> nice
[06:17]  * abb 's internet connection could whip your dad's ass
[06:17] <mkoehler> haha, sounds good
[06:18] <billybigrigger> mkoehler: so you got a blazing ass pipe, but running an old P3?
[06:18] <billybigrigger> wtf man
[06:18] <mkoehler> nah, core duo
[06:18] <mkoehler> not the best
[06:18] <billybigrigger> :)
[06:18] <billybigrigger> haha
[06:18] <billybigrigger> its all good
[06:18] <mkoehler> but it also doesn't help that I haven't updated in months
[06:18] <billybigrigger> how many MB in updates?
[06:19] <mkoehler> well earlier, when I broke my connection, it was 639MB
[06:19] <mkoehler> this time I didn't bother to look
[06:19] <abb> back when I was on campus, as part of my assistantship I was in charge of one of the dorms -- had a nice engineering key that allowed me to do fun stuff like remove cable tv filters, plug my room's net connection directly into the (1000Mb) router instead of the wimpy 10MB switch, etc.  *sigh*
[06:19] <billybigrigger> you know if you commit to running an alpha you should update daily, if not 2-3 times a day, a bug report :)
[06:19] <billybigrigger> s/a/and
[06:19] <mkoehler> yeah yeah, I always say I'll get right on that
[06:19] <mkoehler> then I try to fix them, then I just get caught up in other things
[06:19] <kernco> core 2 duo?  Or core duo?
[06:19] <mkoehler> just core duo
[06:20] <mkoehler> she's over 3 years old now
[06:20] <billybigrigger> abb: haha nice
[06:20] <mkoehler> that's really the way to go
[06:20] <kernco> ah, I didn't know they made those
[06:20] <billybigrigger> i had ubuntu running on an old p1 166mhz earlier this summer :)
[06:20] <billybigrigger> 3 years aint shit haha
[06:20]  * abb looks at the sticker on his new machine: Um, apparently my system has a "Dual Windows Vista" processor.  Is that a new AMD product?
[06:20] <mkoehler> haha, and let me guess, it runs better than vista on a quad-core comp
[06:20] <jussi01> billybigrigger: mind the language please
[06:21] <billybigrigger> my bad
[06:21] <kernco> Do you get keep getting popups that say "Your CPU wants to perform a floating point operation.  Allow it to continue?"
[06:21] <abb> ubuntu-minimal runs on my G1/Android phone better than Vista does on most machines...
[06:21] <billybigrigger> it slipped, i've been hanging in some not-so-family-orientated chans lately
[06:21] <abb> (but i *Might* be a bit biased)
[06:21] <mkoehler> I believe it
[06:21] <billybigrigger> i know better, my bad jussi01
[06:21] <abb> kernco, lol
[06:22] <jussi01> And this is startign to really wander from karmic support, so please try to keep on topic
[06:22] <abb> kernco, and the occasional ad that says "Buy a NEW MATH-COPROCESSOR!  Never do math again!"
[06:22] <MindVirus1> Does anyone know anything about podsleuth?
[06:22] <billybigrigger> jussi01: are you on night shift language patrol? haven't seen you say a peep all night and you just pop out of nowhere :) must have the bad words on auto-notify or something :)
[06:22] <abb> jussi01, oops. my bad.  I too wandered, and was lost.   Back to topic for me!
[06:22]  * billybigrigger waits for mkoehler's updates....
[06:23] <mkoehler> yeah, you and me both
[06:23] <jussi01> billybigrigger: its 8.20 am here ;)
[06:23] <billybigrigger> ping me with a thank you, i need to get back to drinkin'
[06:23] <mkoehler> 1:23 am here
[06:23] <MindVirus1> Podsleuth anyone?
[06:23] <billybigrigger> 11:23pm
[06:23]  * abb adds "****" to list of "terrible four-letter-words"
[06:23] <abb> MindVirus1, sorry dude, still nothing here but us chickens.
[06:23] <mkoehler> yeah, sorry, I've got nothing for your problem
[06:23] <billybigrigger> podsleuth!?!!??!?!?!
[06:23] <MindVirus1> Aye.
[06:23] <billybigrigger> .....
[06:23] <billybigrigger> never heard of it....
[06:23] <billybigrigger> :)
[06:24] <MindVirus1> It's a program that automatically detects your iPod if you plug it in.
[06:24] <MindVirus1> I'm getting a weird exception in it.
[06:24] <abb> billybigrigger, what is your obsession with being thanked?  I mean, yeah...politeness is good...but... Are you going for some kind of record?  hehe
[06:24] <billybigrigger> gtkpod?
[06:24] <billybigrigger> abb: no, just proving you wrong with your negativity haha, no, i'm not obsessed with being thanked
[06:24] <abb> MindVirus1, oh...I generally just use Yamipod (on the ipod) with the 'pod set as a removable media device.  I know this info doesn't help, but I like to contribute...!
[06:24] <jml> did someone say podsleuth
[06:24] <billybigrigger> just kidding around...making conversation...
[06:24] <MindVirus1> No, no.
[06:25] <jml> MindVirus1, what exception are you getting?
[06:25] <abb> billybigrigger, thanks for telling me that.  :)
[06:25] <jussi01> !ot
[06:25] <abb> wait, so offtopic stuff goes in #ubuntu?
[06:25]  * abb instantly apologizes
[06:25] <MindVirus1> jml: yes, we have the sam eproblem.
[06:25] <billybigrigger> #ubuntu-offtopic
[06:25] <jml> MindVirus1, http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=586508
[06:25] <jml> MindVirus1, look at that bug report, are you getting the same errors as the reporter?
[06:25] <MindVirus1> jml: remember, I helped you out. :)
[06:26] <jml> MindVirus1, yeah, I remember. But I'm not getting errors from podsleuth, I'm just getting "No iPod"
[06:26] <MindVirus1> Ahh.
[06:26] <mkoehler> alright, all of the updates have been installed....time to restart - if I'm not back soon, X probably broke....or worse.....
[06:26] <MindVirus1> Podsleuth is a mess.
[06:26] <MindVirus1> I'm getting exceptions everywhere.
[06:27] <billybigrigger> bah, i was gonna tell him if he installed 30-7 don't bother trying to boot it :P
[06:27] <billybigrigger> oh well
[06:27] <MindVirus1> jml:
[06:27] <brassmaster> 30-7?
[06:27] <MindVirus1> http://pastebin.com/f5699716c
[06:27] <billybigrigger> 2.6.31-7
[06:27] <billybigrigger> brassmaster: i've had a few ok?!? :P give a guy a break
[06:28] <jml> MindVirus1, is this from the podsleuth in karmic?
[06:28] <MindVirus1> Aye.
[06:28] <jml> MindVirus1, or from a more recent version?
[06:28] <jml> MindVirus1, hmmm.
[06:28] <MindVirus1> From karmic.
[06:29] <jml> MindVirus1, were you getting this yesterday as well?
[06:29] <MindVirus1> I do believe this is the case, yes.
[06:29] <jml> MindVirus1, if so, it looks like we actually have different problems :)
[06:29] <MindVirus1> jml: same symptom though.
[06:29] <MindVirus1> And the cause is podsleuth.
[06:29] <MindVirus1> What a piece of crap.
[06:29] <jml> MindVirus1, I don't get those errors.
[06:29] <MindVirus1> You get other errors, also caused by podsleuth, no?
[06:30] <jml> MindVirus1, well, podsleuth fails to find my ipod at all
[06:30] <jml> MindVirus1, and thus, Banshee doesn't find it.
[06:30] <MindVirus1> jml: this verifies my hypothesis that podsleuth is a craphole.
[06:31] <jml> MindVirus1, it's actually quite common for software to have two or more defects :)
[06:31] <MindVirus1> jml: you'd think, eh?
[06:31] <MindVirus1> Generally though defects aren't obvious and critical.
[06:31] <mkoehler> more than just podsleuth is a craphole...including my computer lol
[06:31] <mkoehler> didn't quite work out
[06:31] <MindVirus1> It's like buying a new car missing a tire.
[06:32] <jml> MindVirus1, does rhythmbox detect your ipod?
[06:32] <MindVirus1> It does! :)
[06:32] <MindVirus1> For this I am grateful.
[06:33] <mkoehler> no go on the safe-update
[06:33] <billybigrigger> mkoehler: what's your errors now?
[06:33] <mkoehler> same thing
[06:33] <billybigrigger> update-manager still broken?
[06:33] <billybigrigger> :(
[06:33]  * billybigrigger hides
[06:33] <mkoehler> I'm just getting crashes on quite a few things
[06:33] <billybigrigger> haha welcome to alpha4
[06:33] <mkoehler> like gdebi, update-manager, the mixer applet (i think) just crashed on me
[06:33] <mkoehler> ah it's all good
[06:34] <mkoehler> but I'd like to update to alpha 5 one day
[06:34] <mvo> a new update-manager got uploaded last night that should fix it
[06:34] <mkoehler> yes, but how do I get an update-manager without an update-manager
[06:34] <brassmaster> apt-get?...
[06:34] <mkoehler> and without the ability to install deb files
[06:34] <billybigrigger> i guess purge the old one
[06:34] <brassmaster> hmmm,
[06:34] <MindVirus1> brassmaster brings up a good point
[06:34] <brassmaster> now that is a problem...
[06:34] <mkoehler> but I can't get that
[06:35] <mkoehler> and if I get the source
[06:35] <mkoehler> I probably don't have the dev dependencies
[06:35] <MindVirus1> mkoehler: what's wrong?
[06:35] <brassmaster> no gdebi.
[06:35] <mkoehler> basically I was running a few upgrades and I broke some stuff
[06:35] <mkoehler> gdebi, update-manager, etc
[06:36] <brassmaster> you should be able to use apt-get just fine.
[06:36] <MindVirus1> Oh man.
[06:36] <MindVirus1> mkoehler: does dpkg work?
[06:36] <mkoehler> I'm working on that
[06:36] <mkoehler> give me a couple
[06:37] <MindVirus1> mkoehler: take your time. I will try to help you as best as I can because you are in quite a pickle.
[06:37] <mkoehler> haha yeah, thanks
[06:37] <MindVirus1> Ain't no thang.
[06:41] <MindVirus1> Does anyone get python-launchpadlib held back?
[06:49] <MTecknology> This sucks....
[06:49] <mkoehler> what's that?
[06:49] <MTecknology> I have no audio outpu
[06:49] <MTecknology> oh - and tryng to interact with flash and videos (like youtube) isn't working :(
[06:50] <MTecknology> interesting because lspci detects the sound device just fine
[06:51] <mvo> gdebi should work again now too (with the latest update)
[06:51] <MTecknology> oh - alsa was removed during an upgrade.. might be the issue..
[06:51] <mkoehler> gdebi still isn't, but that's the least of my concerns ;-)
[06:52] <MTecknology> My right alt key still isn't working either....
[06:52] <MTecknology> everyone - stop what you're doing and fix everything that's not working on this system
[06:53] <MTecknology> all in all though - karmic has been pretty stable
[06:54] <MTecknology> *for the most part
[06:54] <MTecknology> kvm otoh..
[07:01] <MTecknology> ok - audio works
[07:01] <MTecknology> my university is killing the bandwidth available for watching videos though :(
[10:41] <arvind_khadri> hi, is flash working properly?as in when i hit the replay button or try to move backward using the timeline bar, i cant do it.This is about youtube... anyone else facing it?
[10:48] <richardcavell> arvind_khadri: lots of people have had that
[10:48] <richardcavell> are you on 64-bit?
[10:48] <arvind_khadri> richardcavell, yes
[10:48] <richardcavell> yeah, me too
[10:48] <richardcavell> several people have had that issue
[10:49] <richardcavell> it's the Adobe Flash plugin
[10:49] <richardcavell> the 64-bit linux version is still officially an alpha
[11:24] <tawmas> Hello! Xorg can no longer found the nvidia driver (the nvidia kernel module is installed an loaded). I tried reinstalling xserver-xorg-video-all but to no avail, and I can't seem to find a package for the nvidia driver. Can you please point me in the right direction?
[12:03] <dutchie> $ firefox
[12:03] <dutchie> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
[12:09] <dutchie> reinstalled (with purge) and FF is still segfaulting on startup
[12:22] <piquadrat> Hi! Any Kubuntu Karmic users here? Does akregator crash on start for you to, or is it only me?
[13:18] <BluesKaj> G'Day folks
[13:24] <Dr_Willis> Hmm. anyone notice when you 'should' be getting a console beep.. the speakers sort of make a noise. Like when you first plug a spealker into a port.. but not a actual beep?
[13:25] <nemo> you're supposed to get a beep when you plug in a speaker?
[13:25] <nemo> I thought you just would get the burst of static
[13:27] <Dr_Willis> this isent eevn static.. its more of just a 'little thud' :)
[13:27] <nemo> Dr_Willis: yeah, that's what it sounds like :)
[13:27] <Dr_Willis> like when you plug in a speaker for the furst time.. almost like the sound card initilizing or somthing
[13:27] <nemo> naw
[13:27] <nemo> just a bit of stray current
[13:27] <Dr_Willis> i thoght my ears were popping...
[13:27] <Dr_Willis> :)
[13:27] <nemo> happens even without a sound card
[13:28]  * Dr_Willis wonders how ya get sound without a sound card...
[13:28] <Dr_Willis> :P
[13:28] <Dr_Willis> but it dont seem todo it all the time either heh. which is what i find weird.
[13:29]  * Dr_Willis modprobes pcspkr
[13:29] <Dr_Willis> :)
[13:30] <Dr_Willis> it still does it.. but i hear the beep from the  case at the same time.  so i dont notice it.
[13:30] <Dr_Willis> I actually did think it was my ears popping.. I got a cold from the grandkids.
[13:30] <nemo> heh
[13:30] <nemo> grandkids?
[13:31] <nemo> well. you're ahead of me on that score
[13:31] <BluesKaj> ok, now the libavcodec-unstripped-52 required for some media to run without restriction has been orphaned on my box. It appears to be replaced by libavcodec-extra-52 , I'm wondering if it is also fully loaded or is it stripped like the othe medibuntu medialibs
[13:34] <BluesKaj> my version of ffmpeg requires the unstripped codecs for some special encoding on streaming media to our TiVo
[13:34] <Dr_Willis> Im not even sure whats loaded/stripped means in this case..  somthing about debugging  'stuff' ?
[13:35] <Dr_Willis> Hmm. I wonder why it would require unstripped.
[13:35] <nemo> ah
[13:35] <nemo> BluesKaj: yeah.
[13:35] <BluesKaj> some encode-decode capabililties are stripped out
[13:35] <nemo> that apple codec
[13:36] <Dr_Willis> Guess thats show i was wrong in my thinking stripped was for 'debugging' code.
[13:36] <nemo> well, I needed it in Jaunty
[13:36] <Dr_Willis> 'extra features need to be stipped out' ?
[13:36] <nemo> where the medibuntu support was replaced by some other package
[13:36] <nemo> now it sounds like I'll need yet another approach in karmic
[13:36] <nemo> wheee
[13:36]  * Dr_Willis is confused even more. but it may be the Cold Meds..
[13:36] <BluesKaj> to appease the MPPA and RIAA  and those other evil money grasping corp lobby assocs
[13:37] <Dr_Willis> somthing seems  backards in this logic.. but im not sure quite what...
[13:38] <BluesKaj> nemo, i dumped the medibuntu repos and had to go with the svn versionof ffmpeg to get my media setup up and running again
[13:38] <nemo> BluesKaj: that wasn't necessary in Jaunty
[13:38] <nemo> oh well. I don't need it quite yet
[13:38] <Dr_Willis> for ffmpeg to  'play' some apple formats.. its need 'stripped' libs?
[13:38] <nemo> I'll worry about it when I get to it
[13:38] <nemo> Dr_Willis: unstripped :)
[13:38] <BluesKaj> nyeah, jaunty was fine , ageed
[13:38] <BluesKaj> agreed
[13:39]  * Dr_Willis thinks there would be a better term then 'stripped'
[13:39] <nemo> actually, I care more about karmic pulseaudio failing hard w/ SDL. again :(
[13:39] <nemo> and my sound card
[13:39] <nemo> free/non-free is typical
[13:39] <nemo> but maybe they were worried that would be confusing
[13:39] <nemo> given it is a bundle
[13:39] <BluesKaj> well unstripped is the word used for the full version , there is ni stripped as such
[13:40] <Dr_Willis> so..err.. whats the term for things that have special debugging info in them?
[13:43] <BluesKaj> Dr_Willis, usually it will say dbg or some such
[13:43] <Dr_Willis> thats it.. dbg...
[13:43] <Dr_Willis> im all confusified today it seems
[13:43] <BluesKaj> like libdbg
[13:45] <Dr_Willis> I noticed somthing else ... odd today.. i got ubuntu-desktop and kubuntu-desktop both installed..
[13:46] <Dr_Willis> it used to be i could switch from kdm to gdm and visa versa with
[13:46] <Dr_Willis> 'sudo dpkg-reconfigure gdm'
[13:46] <Dr_Willis> but that fails to work.. and i cant seem to figur eout how to get gdm to be the default login manager now
[13:47] <Dr_Willis> sudo service gdm start , and sudo service kdm start. BOTH say they wont start because they are not the default display manager.
[13:52] <Dr_Willis> aha   - fixed that.. (sort of) :) oh well time to sleep off the Nyquill
[13:54] <shadeslayer> Dr_Willis: um sudo dpkg --configure kdm ?
[13:54] <Dr_Willis> actually i cheated and edited /etc/X11/default-login-manager
[13:54] <shadeslayer> hehe
[13:55] <Dr_Willis> Thats what got me.. it did NOT select gdm by default like it used to.
[13:55] <Dr_Willis> normally if you install ubuntu-desktop it defaults to gdm. (or it asks which touse)
[13:55] <shadeslayer> Dr_Willis: yep
[13:56] <shadeslayer> btw xsplash uses GDM right now..... right?
[13:56] <Dr_Willis> Hmm dident notice.
[13:56] <Dr_Willis> i did a 'nosplash' in my grub tweaks
[13:56] <shadeslayer> Dr_Willis: i have kdm and xsplash.... never works
[13:57] <Dr_Willis> !info xsplash
[13:57] <shadeslayer> Dr_Willis: how do you edit grub 2
[13:57] <Dr_Willis> i followed the grub2 'getting started with grub2' forum thread.
[13:57] <shadeslayer> Dr_Willis: ah..
[13:57] <Dr_Willis>  edit the various /etc/grub.d/ config fules and rerun update-grub
[13:57] <Dr_Willis>  and /etc/default/grub (i think)
[13:58] <Dr_Willis> theres one grub config file you DONT edit by hand. :) it gets generated by the other config files you do edit
[13:58] <Dr_Willis> I was able to get my grub menu at a 'higher res' with the following 2 lines in /etc/default/grub
[13:59] <Dr_Willis> GFXPAYLOAD=true
[13:59] <Dr_Willis> GRUB_GFXMODE=1024x768
[13:59] <shadeslayer> ooh
[13:59] <Dr_Willis> but its still mono-grey them not figured how to set a background. or some color yet.
[14:00] <shadeslayer> Dr_Willis: can i edit /etc/default/grub by hand?
[14:00] <Dr_Willis> That one you can shadeslayer
[14:01] <Dr_Willis> more /etc/grub.d/README to figure out the proper things to edit. :)
[14:01] <shadeslayer> i just need to add a vga option to the end of GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT="quiet splash"
[14:01] <Dr_Willis> the vga option may or may NOT be  proper now...
[14:02] <Dr_Willis> You are tryingto enable the framebuffer?
[14:02] <shadeslayer> Dr_Willis: yeah
[14:02] <shadeslayer> i changed the line to : GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT="quiet splash vga=0x0365"
[14:03] <Dr_Willis> i was thinking i saw in a modules blacklist file.. that most of the framebuffer modules were blacklisted.. ive not tried any yet.
[14:03] <Dr_Willis> famebuffer is a neat idea.. that causes SO much problems...
[14:03] <shadeslayer> :D
[14:03] <Dr_Willis> It would be neat to get a little higher res for my console..  but i rarely use the console these days
[14:04] <Dr_Willis> would be really cool to get both monitors working in the console. :) but im not sure how doable that is
[14:05] <shadeslayer> Dr_Willis: i just run grub-update right?
[14:05] <nemo> Dr_Willis: heh. yeah. I used to have fun w/ console, but, well, TBH, have better things to do these days
[14:05] <Dr_Willis> shadeslayer:  yes.
[14:05] <Dr_Willis> i dont have the urlof that 'grub 2 basics' it was a forum thread on the ubuntu forums.. worth checking out
[14:06] <nemo> not like I really *need* images in w3m, and it is more convenient to run it in screen anyway.
[14:06] <Dr_Willis> mainuse i have for the console. is in geexbox. it uses framebuffer enabled  mplayer for videos.
[14:06] <Dr_Willis> but even now the newer geexbox uses a mini-X server.
[14:07] <Dr_Willis> well night all....
[14:16] <c_korn> is it just me or is the gnome-panel currently always reloading in karmic ?
[14:17] <nemo> c_korn: yeah, mine seems kinda crashy
[14:17] <nemo> or rather seemed
[14:17] <nemo> c_korn: most of my problems went away when I wiped ~/.gconf
[14:17] <nemo> since gconf was running wild
[14:17] <nemo> unfortunately since I had to set everything up again, I'm not sure whether the gnome panel issue was related :-/
[14:21] <c_korn> nemo: ok, I will try that
[14:22] <nemo> c_korn: really? :)
[14:22] <nemo> c_korn: well. you might want to shut down gconf and log out first
[14:22] <c_korn> it's a vm
[14:22] <nemo> just as a precaution
[14:22] <nemo> I did wipe from a terminal
[14:22] <c_korn> I can save the current state and just return to it
[14:23] <nemo> anything in check ~/.xsession-errors  ?
[14:23] <nemo> s/check//
[14:25] <shadeslayer> yayyy.... KDE 4.3.1 in the repos
[14:26] <vasuvi> dist-upgrade wants to remove k3b though for some reason
[14:27] <shadeslayer> vasuvi: um no
[14:27] <vasuvi> (kubuntu-desktop too, oh my)
[14:27] <c_korn> nemo: http://www.ubuntu-pics.de/bild/23454/screenshot_001_rDWNWJ.png
[14:27] <shadeslayer> vasuvi: http://pastebin.ca/1550244
[14:28] <nemo> c_korn: you couldn't pastebin that from the vm? :-p
[14:28] <c_korn> nemo: was faster this way :)
[14:28] <nemo> but much much less useful
[14:29] <nemo> anyway. dunno.
[14:29] <vasuvi> shadeslayer: http://pastebin.ca/1550246
[14:29] <vasuvi> I'll try updating again to see if that helps...
[14:29] <vasuvi> nope, same thing
[14:30] <shadeslayer> vasuvi: you have lesser updates too...
[14:31] <c_korn> here, it is pastebin'ed http://pastebin.com/f54f2e813
[14:31] <vasuvi> shadeslayer: so you think it's a different update that's causing the problem then?
[14:32] <shadeslayer> vasuvi: do you have the pre release repo? it is also possible that some new dev files are being downloaded since i have kde-devel as we
[14:32] <shadeslayer> *well
[14:33] <vasuvi> yeah, I guess you're right; I do a plain apt-get upgrade (instead of dist-upgrade), and I still get 4.3.1 ( http://pastebin.ca/1550250 )
[14:34] <vasuvi> so the problem has to be one of the packages that have been kept back...kdebase-workspace-data (likely) or the new kernel (unlikely)
[14:34] <shadeslayer> vasuvi: i think youre either missing a repo or you have a different server than mine
[14:35] <vasuvi> shadeslayer: I'm using exclusively the normal Karmic Koala repos, and my server is se.archive.ubuntu.com (blazing fast speeds!)
[14:35] <shadeslayer> vasuvi: ah you see i have the main server,maybe thats why
[14:35] <shadeslayer> the servers are probably syncing
[14:36] <vasuvi> shadeslayer: yeah, possible that some of the updates haven't hit Sweden yet ;)
[14:37] <c_korn> nemo: purging gconf did not make difference
[14:38] <nemo> reinstall that clock thingy? :)
[14:39] <nemo> c_korn: oh. sometimes my panel crashes seem related to pulseaudio sucking...
[14:39] <nemo> c_korn: also, I suppose you could try running the panel in gdb - just speculation
[15:09] <nemo> ack
[15:09] <nemo> why do I have:
[15:09] <nemo> libswt-gtk-3.4-java
[15:09] <nemo> and
[15:09] <nemo> libswt3.4-gtk-java
[15:09] <edgy> Hi, Today I am getting ALSA lib conf.c:3979:(snd_config_expand) Expand error (walk): File exists
[15:09] <edgy> when i try to play any file, what's wrong please?
[15:10] <edgy> billybigrigger: I see you are saying [20:05:38] <billybigrigger> ripps_: alsa 1.0.21 could cause more bugs than it's worth, why please?
[15:12] <nemo> edgy: strace might tell you what file it is trying to make
[15:12] <nemo> ln: creating symbolic link `/dev/sndstat' to `/proc/asound/oss/sndstat': File exists
[15:12] <nemo> random googling turns up that alsa related error
[15:13] <nemo> some alsa/oss conflict?
[15:13] <nemo> might not be the actual error
[15:13] <nemo> since presumably if the symlink fails, no big deal
[15:17] <edgy> nemo: you mean when I play a file a symlink is created?! strace shows write(2, "ALSA lib conf.c:3979:(snd_config"..., 41ALSA lib conf.c:3979:(snd_config_expand) ) = 41
[15:17] <edgy> write(2, "Expand error (walk): File exists", 32Expand error (walk): File exists) = 32
[15:18] <nemo> that's not the part of the strace that would be helpful :-p
[15:19] <nemo> edgy: the helpful part would be before that, where the actual file I/O happens
[15:19] <nemo> pastebin the entire thing if you want
[15:23] <edgy> nemo: please look at: http://pastebin.ca/1550311
[15:24] <maco> is there no partner repo for karmic yet?
[15:25] <arvind_khadri> i guess partner repo comes when the release is final
[15:26] <edgy> maco: what does this partner repo contains useful?
[15:26] <arvind_khadri> edgy, nothing :P
[15:26] <edgy> arvind_khadri: so why is needed? :0
[15:26] <Gnome64> bad jokes
[15:27] <arvind_khadri> edgy, it contains some third party applications.. artworks kind of afaik
[15:28] <edgy> arvind_khadri: artworks with patents or what?
[15:28] <edgy> nemo: did you spot any thing useful?
[15:29] <arvind_khadri> edgy, no idea, i never used them...
[15:29] <maco> edgy: adobe flash
[15:30] <edgy> maco: but flash is already on multiverse
[15:30] <sageNsand> whats the latest on update manager. will i get a automatic update or what?
[15:32] <nemo> edgy: work emergencies. will be busy for a while
[15:32] <edgy> nemo: np, I will be waiting for a while
[15:33] <edgy> sageNsand: I don't understand your question
[15:33] <maco> edgy: oh that package still exists?
[15:34] <arvind_khadri> sageNsand, see the changes that have been committed to it, or wait till it happens :)
[15:34] <sageNsand> my update manager fails, its broken and i get a error, so how do i do the manual update on Karmic
[15:34] <sageNsand> Where do I see the changes
[15:35] <maco> edgy: ok so i shouldve said "the flash plugin ackage that doesnt break when adobe updates theirs on their website"
[15:35] <edgy> maco: yes sure
[15:36] <edgy> sageNsand: you can do sudo aptitude update && sudo aptitude dist-upgrade till your problem is resolved
[15:36] <sageNsand> thanks edgy
[15:39] <edgy> maco: why should it break? flashplugin-installer installs from adobe website and it's in multiverse
[15:40] <maco> edgy: because it does an md5sum on tar it downloads and when adobe updates with a new version, the md5sum fails and it doesnt get installed
[15:40] <maco> edgy: the partner repo contains adobe's own up-to-date packages that'll get you the newest flash in your regular updates and when adobe releases a new version, you get it
[15:41] <maco> so if you try to install flashplugin-installer or flashplugin-nonfree during the week or so after adobe releases a new version, it wont install
[15:42] <edgy> maco: I think I got  you now but the strange thing is the one in partner is older (10.0.22) compared with 10.0.32 in multiverse, isn't this strange?
[15:43] <maco> yes
[15:43] <maco> unless its to do with adobe's ban on non-final releases in partner
[15:43] <maco> like, betas cant go in there
[15:44] <edgy> maco: thanks for the clarification
[15:47] <edgy> maco: but 10.0.32 is not beta. it's the official version
[15:47] <maco> then i dunno
[15:48] <maco> wait 10's released?
[15:48] <maco> 10 the one that has a 64bit version? is that out too now?
[15:54] <edgy> maco: yes http://get.adobe.com/flashplayer/
[15:55] <edgy> maco: I don't know whether that supports 64 bit or not but at least it's for 32 bit
[16:20] <Michalxo> hello
[16:23] <eurythmia> how do I disable dontzap? It's an annoying feature.
[16:24] <maco> eurythmia: in your keyboard settings
[16:24] <eurythmia> ... er, I should specify "without using the gui" ... I don't have gnome or kde installed.
[16:24] <maco> oh
[16:25] <maco> eurythmia: put terminate:ctrl_alt_bksp in your xsetkbd stuff
[16:25] <maco> oh uh
[16:25] <maco> setxkbmap -option terminate:ctrl_alt_bksp
[16:25] <eurythmia> maco, thanks, I'll give that a shot
[16:26] <maco> grr this is annoying. quassel's the only app thatll make sounds
[16:26] <eurythmia> maco, beautiful. Works like a charm.
[16:26] <eurythmia> maco, pulseaudio issues?
[16:27] <maco> doubt it. thats the sort of thing pulseaudio fixes
[16:28] <maco> more like quassel is bound to the audio device and so pulseaudio cant access it
[16:28] <maco> i still dont understand how phonon affects this though. i only have practice debugging gnome
[16:29] <maco> oh. its knotify4
[16:30] <Michalxo> guys? anyone haveing this problem in ALT+F2?
[16:30] <Michalxo> Unable to load file '/usr/share/gnome-panel/glade/panel-run-dialog.glade'
[16:30] <Michalxo> there is no such dir in my system :-/
[16:32] <arvind_khadri> Michalxo, maybe a bug in gnome-panel
[16:32] <Michalxo> anyone?
[16:32] <Michalxo> sure :) alt+f2 is not working.. so I am asking if there;s only problem for me.. or some global too :)
[16:33] <Gnome64> only you
[16:33] <Gnome64> :)
[16:33] <Michalxo> damn
[16:33] <Michalxo> where should I search for a fix? :-/
[16:35] <Gnome64> Michalxo: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu or www.ubuntuforums.org
[16:36] <Michalxo> Gnome64, THANK you :)
[16:38] <Michalxo> hmm... there is only 1 result :-/
[16:39] <maco> Michalxo: aptitude reinstall gnome-panel?
[16:40] <Michalxo> not worked :-/
[16:41] <Michalxo> I miss that directory usr/share/gnome-panel/glade
[16:42] <dholbach> Ubuntu Developer Week starting in 19 minutes in #ubuntu-classroom
[16:43] <lase> Hi, I have a problem installing karmic with virt-install. After running this command: sudo virt-install --connect qemu:///system -n karmic -r 512 -f karmic.qcow2 -s 4 -c Desktop/karmic-desktop-i386.iso --vnc --noautoconsole --os-type linux --os-variant ubuntuKarmic --accelerate --network=network:default
[16:43] <lase> when i connect with vnc i get this error: MP-BIOS bug: 8254 timer not connected to IO-APIC
[16:44] <lase> i would guess it would work if apic is disables? but how to do that?
[16:49] <Michalxo> how to file a bug using "apport"?
[16:49] <Michalxo> ubuntu-bug gnome-panel ?
[16:59] <natewiebe13> with notify-osd_0.9.20-0ubuntu1, they added a gconf key, does it require a restart to appear in the gconf-editor, or is there a way to refresh the keys?
[17:01] <Michalxo> natewiebe13 I have only 9.19... in repos :-/
[17:03] <Michalxo> oh, just came into sk. repos too :)
[18:10] <DanaG> aplay: device_list:223: no soundcards found...
[18:30] <billybigrigger> how is everyone today?
[18:30] <Machtin> my throat hurts. :(
[18:30] <Machtin> you?
[18:31] <billybigrigger> hungover
[18:31] <itswhatev> !ot
[18:31] <billybigrigger> :P
[18:32] <JEEB> so I guess alpha5 tomorrow?
[18:33] <Gnome64> JEEB: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KarmicReleaseSchedule?action=show&redirect=ReleaseSchedule
[18:33] <JEEB> argh, misread today's date
[18:33] <JEEB> sorry
[18:33] <JEEB> 3rd it was, yeah
[18:42] <Spike1506> i was wondering what the reason is why empathy replaced pidgin in 9.10
[18:43] <sgallagh> Is the inability to use ctrl-c on Ubuntu Karmic when connected via SSH a known issue?
[18:45] <Gnome64> Spike1506: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EmpathyVsPidginUsability
[18:45] <albert23> sgallagh: could be bug 407428
[18:45] <sgallagh> albert23: Yup, that sounds exactly like it
[18:46] <BluesKaj> sgallagh, when copying or pasting anything in karmic , leave the source open until the apps or test are pasted in th deatination file ..I have the same prob , it's irksome.
[18:47] <BluesKaj> test=text
[18:47] <BluesKaj> deatination file=destination file
[18:47] <sgallagh> BluesKaj: ctrl-c is SIGINT, I'm not talking about the desktop session
[18:48]  * DanaG is wheeled.  er, tired.  (oof, bad pun!)
[18:48] <BluesKaj> oh sorry , didn't notice the ssh
[18:48] <sgallagh>  BluesKaj: No worries. Just clarifying.
[18:48] <BluesKaj> anyway errands to do
[18:48] <BluesKaj> BBL
[18:49] <Spike1506> Gnome64, if i read that pidgin looks much better then empathy :/
[18:49] <BluesKaj> sgallagh, it's apita that one has keep stuff open after copying content then not being able paste it if the source is closed
[18:50] <sgallagh> BluesKaj: Not a problem I face. I never use the GUI in Ubuntu.
[18:51] <alteregoa> what exaclty saves a screensaver?
[18:51] <Gnome64> Spike1506: I'd say the counterpart, but I might be biased. Nonetheless you must try them both to see the pro's and con's of each one.
[18:52] <alteregoa> i got kde 4.1 and a problem
[18:52] <sgallagh> alteregoa: I think you mean two problems :-)
[18:52] <alteregoa> how do you know my wife?
[18:52] <sgallagh> hahahaha
[18:52] <Spike1506> it would be neat to give users the option when installing ubuntu like microsoft does with browser in their upcoming release. :)
[18:53] <sgallagh> Spike1506: Option? As in "Use our browser or don't install our OS?"
[18:53] <Gnome64> Spike1506: wrong comparison buddy!
[18:53] <alteregoa> is someone able to build a nautifox?
[18:54] <mkoehler> hey guys - are the little libnotify notification config options hardcoded, or is there a configuration file somewhere
[18:54] <mkoehler> I removed then added a second monitor, and they aren't in the right spot - not sure if it's something I should look into
[18:55] <mkoehler> instead of being at the top right hand corner of the screen, they're along the right edge in the middle
[18:55] <DanaG> unable to load /usr/share/gnome-panel/glade/panel-run-dialog.glade
[18:56] <DanaG> ls: cannot access /usr/share/gnome-panel/glade/panel-run-dialog.glade: No such file or directory
[18:56] <DanaG> odd.  file doesn't exist in any package.  so why is it looking for it?
[18:56] <nemo> hm. I decided to switch my PPA build of Eclipse 3.4 to the one actually in karmic
[18:56] <nemo> aaaand it causes Sun Java 6 to crashi n SWT
[18:56] <nemo> in SWT
[18:56] <nemo> I wonder why
[19:00] <dutchie> Having problems with FF 3.5
[19:01] <mkoehler> what problems?
[19:01] <dutchie> it's segfaulting on open
[19:01] <dutchie> $ strace firefox 2>&1 | pastebinit
[19:01] <dutchie> http://pastebin.com/f77581398
[19:02] <alteregoa> aaaaaaand?
[19:02] <Gnome64> DanaG: someone reported same bug a few minutes ago.
[19:02] <DanaG> hmm, it seems the file went away.  I had to kill gnome-panel, and now the thingy works again.
[19:05] <alteregoa> i got  a problem with kshinkansen, if i start it, it disappears very fast, where can i catch it?
[19:07] <commander_> 9.10 looks very promising
[19:07] <billybigrigger> alteregoa: run it in a terminal
[19:07] <dutchie> commander_: apart from the gdm screen
[19:07] <mkoehler> billy, time for a beer yet? =)
[19:07] <dutchie> massive regression imo
[19:08] <commander_> let's hope it can beat Mac Snow Leopard
[19:08] <commander_> gdm screen?
[19:08] <dutchie> login screen
[19:08] <mkoehler> I actually liked my old one better
[19:08] <commander_> login screen can use some touching up
[19:09] <mkoehler> that's something that I'd consider to be a regression - most other things I consider to be upgrades
[19:09] <commander_> but wait til they have a snow leopard theme for it
[19:09] <alteregoa> 200 mechabytes, and i still cannot find yoshi
[19:10] <billybigrigger> mkoehler: nope i ran out last night haha
[19:10] <billybigrigger> mkoehler: did you figure out your apt problem??
[19:10] <mkoehler> haha
[19:10] <billybigrigger> err update-manager
[19:10] <mkoehler> yeah, I finally got through it around 3am
[19:10] <billybigrigger> ewwww
[19:11] <billybigrigger> safe-upgrade my friend :)
[19:11] <mkoehler> hey, it's all good, it's solved
[19:11] <mkoehler> i'll keep that one in mind
[19:11] <mkoehler> every time I upgrade I prepare myself for the worst
[19:11] <billybigrigger> $ sudo apt-get update && sudo aptitude safe-upgrade
[19:11] <mkoehler> I always wait until I'm not too busy to upgrade heh
[19:11] <mkoehler> yeah
[19:11] <billybigrigger> should be doing it a few times a day :P
[19:12] <alteregoa> paranoid android
[19:12] <mkoehler> I'll just write some script to automate it =P
[19:13] <alteregoa> what is an denkbold?
[19:27] <mac_v> !schedule
[19:40] <dutchie> http://pastebin.com/f77581398
[19:40] <dutchie> any suggestions? should I file a bug?
[19:43] <Guest12914> hey guys something funny is happening with my kernel updates, I upgraded to karmic, but only jaunty kernels are showing up in my grub menu
[19:43] <chrisccoulson> dutchie - you should have apport report a crash report rather than reporting it manually
[19:43] <dutchie> ok, will do
[19:43] <chrisccoulson> strace is often not useful for debugging crashes like that - it doesn't show what makes it crash there
[19:43] <bjsnider> dutchie, do you have _any_ files or directories on that system?
[19:44] <dutchie> bjsnider: er, yes
[19:44] <dutchie> chrisccoulson: what should I do then?
[19:45] <chrisccoulson> you should have a crash report in /var/crash to submit
[19:45] <dutchie> _usr_lib_firefox-3.5.2_firefox.1000.crash
[19:45] <alteregoa> i got a problem with jack
[19:46] <alteregoa> it doesnt off
[19:53] <_iTroll> upgraded to karmic from jaunty, grub only shows the old jaunty kernels, still on grub legacy apparently.  Any ideas?
[19:55] <BluesKaj> _iTroll, in the terminal :sudo update-grub
[19:56] <_iTroll> BluesKaj: I tried that actually, but menu.lst did not update, even though it told me it had found the new kernel
[19:56] <BluesKaj> _iTroll, sudo update-legacy-grub
[19:57] <BluesKaj> or grub-legacy , not quite sure
[19:57] <_iTroll> BluesKaj: only update-grub on my system
[19:57] <BluesKaj> the kernels and updates expect to see grub2
[19:58] <_iTroll> hmm, is there any reason that it would not have been installed?
[19:58] <BluesKaj> _iTroll, are trying to remove old kernels ?
[19:58] <BluesKaj> !grub2
[19:59] <_iTroll> nope i am trying to get it to boot the updated kernel
[20:00] <_iTroll> so should i install grub2?
[20:01] <BluesKaj> maybe you already have , try apt-cache policy grub2
[20:03] <_iTroll> http://pastebin.com/m23580218
[20:10] <_iTroll> ok i see that grub2 will not be installed by default no upgrades from jaunty!
[20:10] <_iTroll> i didnt realise that
[20:16] <TylerRichard> hey guys gnome-wm isn't running after resume anyone having this problem??
[20:21] <TylerRichard> hey guys gnome-wm isn't running after resume anyone having this problem?? bump
[20:21] <guntbert> !patience
[20:23] <BluesKaj> !bump
[20:23] <BluesKaj> always wondered what ppl meant by that
[20:24] <BluesKaj> <--- a bit old and out of touch sometimes
[20:25] <guntbert> BluesKaj: in the forums it is used to give your question more weight after a few days when no one answers (like a knock on the table or so...)
[20:28] <BluesKaj> guntbert, ok , as if that would have much weight :)
[20:29] <mac_v> not more weight , just bring it back to the "new" posts ;p , bumping it to the top
[20:29] <Logi> as per the /topic, my systemis now broken. X dies a horrible death after I log in.
[20:29] <Logi> Has this been seen? on kubuntu, btw, but installing ubuntu-desktop now but it takes a while
[20:29] <mac_v> !topic
[20:29] <mac_v> ah!
[20:32]  * loevborg has trouble with sound: amarok is silent. mplayer -ao oss works; mplayer -ao alsa hangs (!)
[20:33] <loevborg> anyone else have this?
[20:33] <loevborg> (karmic w/ current updates)
[20:33] <mac_v> loevborg: Bug #411962 ?
[20:34] <Logi> hmm... now X runs (through startx) without me having changed anything. I'm just going to cross my fingers...
[20:36] <loevborg> mac_v, that might be it...
[20:37] <loevborg> mac_v, it seems my pulseaudio daemon was hanging; killall seems to fix it
[20:38] <mac_v> loevborg: check my workaround, it worked for me , if it does save the folders and them to the bug report
[20:38] <mac_v> in the comments
[20:38] <mac_v> add them*
[20:39] <loevborg> mac_v, well.. I did rename .pulse, though I'm not sure if this was required
[20:40] <loevborg> mac_v, I'll upload the folder anyway, just in case
[20:40] <mac_v> loevborg: just move the some where , $pulseaudio -k , then relogin
[20:40] <mac_v> them*
[20:43] <mint_> #ubuntu-fi-devel
[20:44] <loevborg> mac_v, I added my .pulse to your bug report. thanks for the pointer
[20:45] <mac_v> loevborg: did it fix the problem?
[20:45] <loevborg> mac_v, well removing .pulse and restarting pulseaudio did fix the problem, yes
[20:45] <loevborg> not sure if it's the same bug though
[20:45] <mac_v> great :)
[20:49] <loevborg> bye
[20:54] <shadeslayer> upgrading to KDE 4.3.1..... at 1.30 AM in the morning...lol
[21:05] <commander_> 9.10 looks like a sleeper
[21:05] <commander_> i'll wait til it comes in Beta
[21:06] <SKB> aff nautilus has somewhere a mem leak :|
[21:06] <SKB> any ideas how to catch it?
[21:09] <SKB> does nautilus crash for you when right clicking on a video thumbnail ?
[21:10] <SKB> when menu rolls upward
[21:16] <TheOriginalRippe> not realy a problem just curios as to whether anybody else is getting reports of SSD disk in disk utilities when actualy HDD in use?
[21:23] <StateS> hello, I'm having trouble booting into ubuntu, I installed it just a couple a minutes ago and it gives me a grub 15 error (9.10, i386, Kubuntu)
[21:24] <StateS> I am using ext4 as the filesystem
[21:24] <Michalxo> StateS, try this
[21:24] <Michalxo> HOWTO Restore GRUB: http://grub.enbug.org/Grub2LiveCdInstallGuide
[21:24] <Michalxo> or on #grub ;)
[21:24] <Michalxo> gn!
[21:41] <ActionParsnip> hey all
[21:42] <ActionParsnip> is this a known issue: http://pastebin.com/d45f992a2
[21:44] <ActionParsnip> !bug
[21:48] <bucky> ActionParsnip, is this in karmic because my path is /usr/share/pyshared/AptUrl/gtk/
[21:48] <hggdh> ActionParsnip, I do not know if this was already reported. Just found it myself
[21:48] <ActionParsnip> yep its karmic
[21:48] <hggdh> and the path is clearly wrong...
[21:48] <ActionParsnip> hggdh: was just logging a bug myself
[21:48] <hggdh> ActionParsnip, cool, thanks, will not open on then ;-)
[21:49] <komputes> bucky: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apturl/+bug/422825
[21:49] <BUGabundo> para o caso de n terem notado, o gmail está em baixo :D
[21:49] <bucky> ActionParsnip, it's almost as if you're installing from a repo from a wrong release
[21:49] <BUGabundo> hey guys
[21:49] <hggdh> yo BUGabundo
[21:49] <komputes> there is an apt-url upgrade bug affecting all karmic users^
[21:49] <bucky> ActionParsnip, listen to komputes
[21:49] <hggdh> komputes, yes
[21:49] <hggdh> just reported
[21:49] <BUGabundo> any one reported probs with applying a proxy system wide on gnome,
[21:49] <BUGabundo> being asked twice for pass??
[21:50] <hggdh> not me
[21:50] <bucky> BUGabundo, is it asking for the key ring passwd?
[21:50] <BUGabundo> or that the unlock of the keychaine has seen it password change to match the login one ?
[21:51] <BUGabundo> bucky: no. User pass
[21:52] <ActionParsnip> komputes: just added my 2p worth
[21:52] <ActionParsnip> komputes: just gonna uninstall it for now
[21:52] <komputes> ActionParsnip: 2p, hehe must be brittish ;)
[21:53] <ActionParsnip> komputes: indeed
[21:53] <komputes> ActionParsnip: 2c is how we roll
[21:53] <ActionParsnip> komputes: thats only 1p here, so i contributed more :D
[21:53] <Twigaathy> maybe it was 2 euro cent >_>
[21:54] <ActionParsnip> j/k
[21:54] <Twigaathy> I think an upgrade just broke complaining about Python..
[21:54]  * Twigaathy notes upchannel... I'll be quiet :D
[21:54] <bucky> wajig apturl hold
[21:56] <ActionParsnip> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apturl/+bug/422825
[21:57] <ActionParsnip> if you just uninstall it then you can upgrade as normal
[21:58] <ActionParsnip> haha if you --purge uninstall it, then reinstall it. its fine
[21:58] <ActionParsnip> you need to --purge remove apturl-common too
[22:01] <ActionParsnip> can anyone confirm this please?
[22:01] <bucky> i'm chicken
[22:01] <bucky> i'll wait till after the freeze to install it
[22:01] <ActionParsnip> sudo apt-get --purge remove apturl-common apturl; sudo apt-get --purge autoremove; sudo apt-get update; sudo apt-get install apt-url
[22:01] <BluesKaj> confirm what ActionParsnip , i just rejoined
[22:02] <ActionParsnip> BluesKaj: apturl has a bug with upgrades
[22:02] <BluesKaj> ok
[22:02] <ActionParsnip> BluesKaj: but if you uninstall it and reinstall it then its ok
[22:03] <BluesKaj> never used that command apturl
[22:06] <ActionParsnip> fair point
[22:06] <BUGabundo> ActionParsnip: shiiiiii
[22:09] <ActionParsnip> BUGabundo: ?
[22:11] <BUGabundo> ActionParsnip: all that line to purge :D
[22:11] <BUGabundo> use aptitude. takes less parameters
[22:11] <ActionParsnip> BUGabundo: i have most of that scripted so mines shorter still
[22:19] <ActionParsnip> so can anyone confirm my fix, albeit very ungraceful?
[22:19] <alteregoa> burp
[22:23] <alteregoa> is there a tool to export the program settings from ubuntu to another machine?
[22:25] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: most are stored in ~
[22:26] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: if you copy the hidden folder for that app then the settings will transfer
[22:28] <bucky> alteregoa, like a server?
[22:28] <bucky> tar up /etc
[22:29] <alteregoa> action, ok its time to write a tool for that stuff
[22:29] <alteregoa> like windows 7 i just have to click a few buttons and it works
[22:30] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: if you run: cd ~; ls -a
[22:30] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: you will see the folders
[22:30] <alteregoa> yeah i hate command line crap
[22:30] <alteregoa> command line is 80's tech, i am a GUIan huamn
[22:30] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: its where real power is harnessed in linux, gui is too clunky and hides useful output
[22:31] <alteregoa> a gui is to easy
[22:31] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: no, it just takes too long to do multiple tasks that the command line can do in a single command and you can walk away while it works its magic
[22:31] <alteregoa> thats why linux is not widely used on desktops
[22:31] <bucky> alteregoa, are you upgrading?
[22:31] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: you'll find it is
[22:32] <alteregoa> no i just ask for such a feature, maybe to export my program settings from the desktop to the laptop
[22:32] <bucky> linux is widely used on my desktop and has been for ten years
[22:32] <alteregoa> yes on your desktop, but 98 percent uses windows
[22:32] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: theres just no concrete figures, unlike microsoft who sell licenses wo have an absolute figure
[22:32] <bucky> and lie about it anyway
[22:33] <keith> Compiz was working fine, then I disabled it to run a program in wine. Now it won't enable. Does anyone have an idea why?
[22:33] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: maybe 98% maybe not. Does a dual boot count as half a user?
[22:33] <alteregoa> i don't care about microsoft or drdos or apple
[22:33] <cwillu> keith, how did you disable it?
[22:33] <alteregoa> i care about the users
[22:33] <keith> cwillu, Through the Appearance dialog
[22:33] <cwillu> keith, incidently, this would fall under the class of things that you should be able to work through if you're going to run an unreleased operating system :p
[22:33] <ActionParsnip> keith: what window manager do you use if its not compiz? metacity?
[22:33] <alteregoa> a average user is not able to work with the command line, its the usability of it
[22:33] <DanaG> watch out: it'll trample on settings if you don't choose "custom".
[22:34] <cwillu> keith, try compiz --replace from a console
[22:34] <keith> ActionParsnip, That is what I am using at the moment, yes
[22:34] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: me too, thats why i advise ubuntu. The user model is much better
[22:34] <DanaG> And "custom" only appears with simple-ccsm... even if you intend to use compizconfig-settings-manager.
[22:34] <alteregoa> but most geeks cannot see the world of the average, they are far above the ground, to far, and thats very sad
[22:34] <bucky> i took dos at community college
[22:34] <ActionParsnip> keith: ok in terminal run: compiz --replace
[22:34] <Oli``> ARGL! gnome-panel is crashing and reloading twice a second
[22:34] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: they can as they make the internet work so have to cater for all users
[22:34] <keith> ActionParsnip, cwillu: oddly ,that worked. :)
[22:35] <ActionParsnip> keith: great :)
[22:35] <cwillu> keith, file a bug
[22:35] <alteregoa> shuttleworth want to make money with ubuntu, do you think he is the great donator?
[22:35] <ActionParsnip> keith: press ctrl+c in terminal to end it, then press alt+f2 and type the same command
[22:35] <guntbert> !ot | alteregoa
[22:36] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: i wouldnt know. I dont get into all that. I just see an OS and users, maybe I'm seeing the OS as the average user eh
[22:36] <ActionParsnip> keith: better?
[22:36] <alteregoa> this is very ontopic i think
[22:36] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: nope, this is support ONLY
[22:37] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: thats why #ubuntu-offtopic exists
[22:37] <BUGabundo> ActionParsnip: don't incentivate hime
[22:37] <alteregoa> if you still believe a command line is the way to go believe that, but don't think many users switch to linux
[22:37] <ActionParsnip> alteregoa: fine, think that as much as you wish
[22:38] <ActionParsnip> BUGabundo: I eat trolls for breakfast
[22:38] <keith> ActionParsnip, cw
[22:38] <ActionParsnip> keith: better :D
[22:39] <DanaG> http://www.wincustomize.com/zoom.aspx?skinid=6941&libid=1   -- interesting.  Brown as in coffee and wood.
[22:39] <Oli``> Anyone know how I might find out why gnome-panel is crashing?
[22:39] <keith> ActionParsnip, cwillu: actually, it didn't seem to like that... it caused everything to freeze-ish
[22:39] <DanaG> I actually have my own desktop set to a rather bright orange theme.
[22:39] <cwillu> keith, which, hitting control-c?
[22:39] <ActionParsnip> keith: read: dmesg | tail
[22:39] <cwillu> keith, that's because you killed the window manager without running something else to replace it
[22:39] <keith> cwillu, compiz --replace
[22:39] <ActionParsnip> cwillu: it will default to metacity if it does
[22:40] <keith> cwillu, i hadn't hit ctrl+c
[22:40] <ActionParsnip> Oli``: you could read some log files, see whats going on
[22:40] <keith> ActionParsnip, I don't see anything useful in dmesg
[22:40] <ActionParsnip> keith: hmm
[22:40] <Oli``> ActionParsnip: just applying some updates and just as some gtk ones went through, the crashing stopped =)
[22:41] <Oli``> magic
[22:41] <ActionParsnip> Oli``: good to hear
[22:41] <keith> ActionParsnip, cwillu: compiz isn't dependant on gnome-panel in any way, is it?
[22:41] <ActionParsnip> keith: no, compiz can be ran on kubuntu which has no gnome stuff at all
[22:42] <cwillu> well...
[22:42] <keith> ActionParsnip, I am aware of that, but I know there are gnome-specific compiz packages
[22:42] <cwillu> there are interactions with gnome-session if it was launched via gnome-session (or metacity), and gnome-panel is related to that
[22:42] <ActionParsnip> !info compiz-gnome
[22:42] <ActionParsnip> maybe?
[22:42] <cwillu> if gnome-panel is dying for some reason, it could actually be a gnome-session issue, which could cause other issues
[22:42] <keith> ActionParsnip, cwillu: the reason I asked is because I disable gnome-panel
[22:43] <cwillu> define disable :p
[22:43] <ActionParsnip> keith: thats fine, some do yo use AWN
[22:43] <keith> ActionParsnip, gnome-do
[22:43] <ActionParsnip> s/yo/to
[22:43] <cwillu> I'd expect in that case it should just work, but you're not in extremely well tested ground anymore :p
[22:43] <keith> cwillu, removed it from desktop/gnome/session/required_components
[22:44] <cwillu> wouldn't expect that to break it then
[22:44] <keith> cwillu, ActionParsnip: I'm going to try the replace command on the command line again... i'll be back if I have to restart X.
[22:46] <keith> is this important? "Checking for Xgl: not present."
[22:46] <cwillu> not at all
[22:46] <cwillu> xgl is largely abandoned
[22:46] <keith> cwillu, ActionParsnip: ok... seems ok now...
[22:47] <ActionParsnip> keith: sweet
[22:47] <keith> ActionParsnip, cwillu: that command isn't making a permanent change though, right?
[22:47] <cwillu> nope
[22:48] <ActionParsnip> keith: if your sesion is remembered it may, you can easily add an entry to startup items to make it run
[22:49] <keith> ActionParsnip, cwillu: would changing it in /desktop/gnome/session/required_components work?
[22:49] <ActionParsnip> !startup
[22:49] <BUGabundo> hey fellow cwillu
[22:49] <BUGabundo> miss you dude
[22:49] <BUGabundo> pvt me
[22:49] <cwillu> poke poke :)
[22:49] <cwillu> I'm utterly exhausted, to the point that I can't sleep :)
[22:50] <keith> ActionParsnip, lol. I could do that too I suppose.
[22:50] <keith> ActionParsnip, ActionParsnip, cwillu: I'm not actually running the latest updates. I suppose I should update before I file a bug.
[22:50] <cwillu> keith, generally, although you want to be sure you can reproduce it _now_ before you apply updates
[22:50] <cwillu> i.e., you can't say "it's gone now" if you haven't established that you can _tell_ if its gone
[22:51] <keith> cwillu, good point.
[22:51] <cwillu> everyone together:  reproducibility!  reproducibility!  reproducibility!
[22:52] <keith> Say that 5 times fast
[22:53] <keith> sad... my core dumped me
[22:53] <keith> when I hit ctrl+c on compiz --replace, I got a crash. Is that acceptable behavior?
[22:53] <BUGabundo> I need a friendly tester to test the Network Proxy thingy
[22:54] <BUGabundo> I set mine, rebooted, unset
[22:54] <BUGabundo> but it still was stuck on Cli variable
[22:54] <ActionParsnip> BUGabundo: i'll pitch in
[22:54] <ActionParsnip> BUGabundo: sup
[22:55] <cwillu> I only have one machine in front of me right now, I'm not good for testing
[22:55] <BUGabundo> cwillu: eheh
[22:55] <BUGabundo> ActionParsnip: open the proxy settings
[22:55] <BUGabundo> set a valid proxy
[22:55] <BUGabundo> apply system wide
[22:56] <BUGabundo> test a cli to see if it is there (ie, $ export)
[22:56] <BUGabundo> then remove it again and test again
[22:57] <cwillu> noting that any existing terminals will still have the old export, which is mostly unavoidable
[22:57] <keith> ActionParsnip, cwillu: So... behavior is not going to be reproducible. After running running compiz --replace and changing settings in appearance, I hit ctrl c and enabled in appearance and now it works as e
[22:57] <keith> expected
[22:57] <ActionParsnip> BUGabundo: let me find a proxy address, or if you can shoot me one
[22:58] <BUGabundo> no
[22:58] <BUGabundo> I only have portuguese ones
[22:58] <BUGabundo> :(
[22:58] <BUGabundo> won't help you much
[22:58] <keith> ActionParsnip, You can always install squid. lol
[22:59] <ActionParsnip> BUGabundo: i found one
[22:59] <ActionParsnip> sec
[22:59] <BUGabundo> great
[23:00] <ActionParsnip> BUGabundo: like this: http://pastebin.com/d7483ba8a
[23:02] <cwillu> BUGabundo, did you note my comment about existing terminals?  that isn't the problem you're seeing is it?
[23:03] <BUGabundo> cwillu: I didnt see it,fellow
[23:04] <BUGabundo> ActionParsnip: no. don't set it manually
[23:04] <BUGabundo> I'm trying to see if there's a bug on gnome proxy settings
[23:04] <ActionParsnip> BUGabundo: thats the only way i know how
[23:04] <BUGabundo> not reseting cli
[23:04] <cwillu> BUGabundo, sorry, I still haven't gotten an answer from you ;p
[23:04] <BUGabundo> System->pref->network proxy
[23:04] <cwillu> BUGabundo, Do you specifically mean new cli's opened after changing the setting?
[23:05] <BUGabundo> cwillu: I'm sorry, I don't know what you are tlakign about
[23:05] <BUGabundo> cwillu: yes, that!
[23:05] <cwillu> BUGabundo, okay, then I have nothing to add :p
[23:06] <cwillu> BUGabundo, I just wanted to make sure you knew that already-opened-cli's wouldn't show the change, and that's an expected deficiency that is fundamentally hard to address
[23:06] <cwillu> but you're not talking about that, so yes :)
[23:06] <BUGabundo> I know
[23:06] <ActionParsnip> BUGabundo: ok echo $http_proxy doesnt output anything once i apply it system wide in the dialogue you named
[23:06] <BUGabundo> but I opened new ones too
[23:06] <BUGabundo> ActionParsnip: :(
[23:06] <cwillu> BUGabundo, hmm
[23:06] <cwillu> BUGabundo, does it magically work if you do sudo -k -u bugabundo?
[23:06] <ActionParsnip> BUGabundo: sounds like a bug
[23:07] <cwillu> crap
[23:07] <cwillu> not -k
[23:07] <cwillu> sudo -i bugabundu
[23:07] <cwillu> does that make it work?
[23:07] <BUGabundo> ActionParsnip: I know. that's why I needed a tester
[23:07] <cwillu> new terminals might be inheriting the environment of existing terminals rather than getting a fresh new environment
[23:08] <ActionParsnip> BUGabundo: never used that I always use terminal, well...tilda
[23:08] <BUGabundo> cwillu: let me chefck
[23:08] <BUGabundo> I've manually removed it from cli envirement
[23:08] <BUGabundo> declare -x http_proxy="http://proxy.sonae.pt:8080/"
[23:08] <BUGabundo> cwillu: its set on root :(
[23:08] <BUGabundo> declare -x ftp_proxy="ftp://proxy.sonae.pt:8080/"
[23:08] <BUGabundo> declare -x http_proxy="http://proxy.sonae.pt:8080/"
[23:08] <BUGabundo> declare -x https_proxy="https://proxy.sonae.pt:8080/"
[23:09] <BUGabundo> and all of them on my account
[23:09] <BUGabundo> very very strange
[23:09] <ActionParsnip> or you can use:  export hhtp_proxy=
[23:09] <ActionParsnip> etc
[23:11] <binarymutant> is it kosher to use an older kernel on karmic? or is there something in karmic that ties into 2.6.31?
[23:11] <BUGabundo> yeah that's what I did on another cli ActionParsnip
[23:13] <guntbert> BUGabundo: why do you use declare -x instead of export?
[23:13] <ActionParsnip> binarymutant: i'd shoot for yes it needs it, no harm in trying i guess
[23:14] <binarymutant> ActionParsnip, I'll give it a shot, ty :D
[23:14] <cwillu> binarymutant, should work, although kms will be broken in some ways
[23:14] <binarymutant> cwillu, what's kms?
[23:14] <ActionParsnip> !kms
[23:14] <binarymutant> :D
[23:14] <cwillu> binarymutant, although if its a fresh install with new and wonderful filesystems used, you may need to find a kernel with that backported
[23:15] <binarymutant> it was a dist-upgrade
[23:15] <cwillu> kernel mode switching.  makes suspend and vterm switching very fast and unflickery
[23:15] <binarymutant> ah ty
[23:18] <BUGabundo> back
[23:18] <cwillu> not sure if its enabled with -ati yet, -nv has it though I believe, and -intel is the best case.  Doesn't work with -nvidia or -fglrx at all
[23:22] <Polterge|st> ok I finally made the decision today to upgrade to Karmic Koala
[23:22] <Polterge|st> I know it may break my system but is still going to be better than what I had
[23:22] <Polterge|st> considering that my system was already broken
[23:22] <Polterge|st> I tried to install the 190 nvidia driver... didn't go too well
[23:22] <Polterge|st> installed but packages were broken and held
[23:23] <Polterge|st> an upgrade will at least resolve some of that and make it so that I can download the updates as they are released though
[23:23] <Polterge|st> and eventually my system will end up stable again hopefully
[23:23] <Polterge|st> seems like the best option and only choice in my circumstance
[23:23] <Polterge|st> can anyone tell me any improvements in 9.10 ?
[23:24] <ActionParsnip> Polterge|st: http://webupd8.blogspot.com/2009/08/ubuntu-910-karmic-koala-alpha-4.html
[23:24] <billybigrigger> http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/karmic/alpha4
[23:25] <bucky> Polterge|st, what kind of video card do you have?
[23:38] <alteregoa> fehler beim anlegen des verseichnisses /usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/apturl/gtk no such file or directory
[23:39] <alteregoa> this happened after update
[23:40] <alteregoa> sub process dpkg blah returned an error code 1
[23:43] <keith> How can I give an autostart application a delay when I sign in?
[23:43] <Polterge|st> bucky I have an nvidia 8400 GS
[23:43] <bucky> alteregoa, i guess you missed out on that discussion a while ago ^^
 sudo apt-get --purge remove apturl-common apturl; sudo apt-get --purge autoremove; sudo apt-get update; sudo apt-get install apt-url
[23:43] <alteregoa> thanks
[23:45] <bucky> Polterge|st, that's an old card, i backed down to the legacy driver and mine was happier
[23:45] <bucky> nvidia-glx-173
[23:46] <bucky> !paste
[23:47] <alteregoa> couldn'^t find packet apt-url
[23:47] <bucky> Polterge|st, i lost nvidia-xconfig so i just threw this into /etc/X11/xorg.conf http://paste.ubuntu.com/263445/
[23:47] <alteregoa> maybe the repo is not synched?
[23:47] <bucky> alteregoa, that's because it's called apturl
[23:48] <Polterge|st> well, I actually added the repositories to install the 190 series driver
[23:48] <Polterge|st> and little did I know it needed the newer kernel I guess
[23:48] <Polterge|st> 185 was working but I wanted to get it as up to date as possible for the possibility of bugfixes
[23:49] <alteregoa> fantspastic it works
[23:49] <bucky> yep and all these legacy nvidia cards don't seem to work with the newer drivers very well anyway
[23:49] <Polterge|st> since compiz was crashing and I thought it might be possible that it was a bug between X and compiz
[23:49] <Polterge|st> I updated it and it said it installed correctly and then it would not give me a display
[23:49] <Polterge|st> then I booted into recovery mode and used xfix
[23:50] <Polterge|st> and I booted in normally without accelerated graphics
[23:50] <Polterge|st> at that point I tried to re-download the drivers and fix the problem but was getting an error message stating that packages were broken and being held
[23:50] <Polterge|st> and I tried to get more updates but to no avail
[23:50] <komputes> How do i set the timeout value in GRUB2?
[23:50] <Polterge|st> and then it asked me to do a partial upgrade
[23:50] <bucky> nvidia-glx-180 and nvidia-glx-185 gave me a lot of artifacts on my 6800 GS
[23:51] <Polterge|st> I did that and then it did not have anymore updates for me and it was all broken pretty much
[23:51] <Polterge|st> that is when I was like "oh well... when in doubt" and issed the "update-manager -d" in the run box and decided to dive in
[23:52] <bucky> komputes, might be in /boot/grub/grub.cfg now *shrug*
[23:52] <Polterge|st> if nothing else, this should fix the packages that are broken and should install newer more up to date software
[23:52] <komputes> bucky: I know it is
[23:52] <komputes> bucky: what is the syntax
[23:52] <Polterge|st> even if it is somewhat buggy it will work better than it was working I think
[23:52] <alteregoa> load "$",8,1 or something
[23:52] <DanaG> # DO NOT EDIT THIS FILE
[23:52] <bucky> haha.. i don't know i still have grub1
[23:52] <DanaG> # It is automatically generated by /usr/sbin/grub-mkconfig using templates
[23:52] <DanaG> # from /etc/grub.d and settings from /etc/default/grub
[23:53] <Polterge|st> are you wanting to install grub2 ?
[23:53] <bucky> not me
[23:53] <Polterge|st> ah ok
[23:53] <DanaG> It rather appalls me how often people completely ignore, or miss, those lines in grub.cfg
[23:53] <Polterge|st> well just so anyone knows ... "sudo apt-get install grub2"
[23:53] <Polterge|st> and use the chainloader option
[23:53] <alteregoa> is grub related to the gorges?
[23:53] <Polterge|st> just to make sure it will work
[23:54] <Polterge|st> and if it works ... "sudo upgrade-from-grub-legacy"
[23:54] <Polterge|st> and that should remove the old grub and leave grub2
[23:55] <bucky> DanaG, then you answer his question <komputes> How do i set the timeout value in GRUB2?
[23:55] <DanaG> Edit /etc/default/grub
[23:55] <bucky> komputes, listen to DanaG
[23:55] <komputes>  /usr/sbin/grub-mkconfig got it
[23:56] <DanaG> Come to think of it, the "is generated using templates" is a red herring.
[23:56] <BUGabundo> anyone here with Firefox 3.6 or 3.7 ?
[23:56] <BUGabundo> and uses Greader?
[23:56] <BUGabundo> its not loading for me
[23:56] <DanaG> A better header would be for it to say "edit /etc/default/grub instead!"
[23:56] <BUGabundo> even with safemode
[23:58] <Polterge|st> also something else worth mentioning ... I think installing dev plugins from GIT made my old compiz unstable so installing the new Ubuntu upgrade may fix this if it removes that and installs a standard compiz with it
[23:58] <Polterge|st> the only problem is that if it does not then I may have to purge compiz
[23:58] <Polterge|st> and reinstall the latest stable branch and all of the plugins from repositories
[23:59] <Polterge|st> although I do like the stackswitcher, freewins plugin and the tab switcher plugin