[00:16] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell, hi
[00:17] <rickspencer3> TheMuso, good morning
[00:35] <TheMuso> Hey rickspencer3.
[00:35] <TheMuso> rickspencer3: have you tried pulseaudio from the ubuntu-audio-dev PPA?
[00:35] <rickspencer3> TheMuso, nope
[00:36] <rickspencer3> I did a dist-upgrade last week, and it's been a mess since then (last Wed to be exact)
[00:36] <rickspencer3> may I ask what is in the ppa that is not in karmic?
[00:36] <TheMuso> rickspencer3: I suggest you try that. Unfortunately it seems that a lot of users are having crashes/getting memory eaten, so its not just you having issues.
[00:36] <rickspencer3> mmm
[00:36] <rickspencer3> I was wondering
[00:37] <TheMuso> rickspencer3: A newer git snapshot of pulseaudio/c
[00:37] <rickspencer3> so the PPA may have bug fixes?
[00:37] <rickspencer3> I see
[00:37] <rickspencer3> I asked marjo to ask pedro to take a look at the pulseaudui bugs
[00:37] <rickspencer3> YDdraigGoch, hi scott!
[00:38] <YDdraigGoch> rickspencer3, I'm not called scott O.o
[00:38] <rickspencer3> ?
[00:38] <rickspencer3> ok
[00:38] <YDdraigGoch> :s
[00:38] <rickspencer3> YDdraigGoch, you know you have a blueprint for Karmic, right?
[00:38] <rickspencer3> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-karmic-wine-integration
[00:39] <rickspencer3> (or am I getting people and nicks hideously confused?)
[00:39] <YDdraigGoch> rickspencer3, you're getting them hideosly confused ^^
[00:39] <rickspencer3> dang it!
[00:41] <rickspencer3> oh well
[00:41] <rickspencer3> sure sign I've been working too much today
[02:22] <jcastro> rickspencer3-afk: you're looking for yokozar
[05:35] <robert_ancell> hey mvo, is there any special trick to running compiz from git?  I've compiled it and when I run it I don't get any decorations or window switchers
[05:37] <mvo> hey robert_ancell
[05:38] <mvo> robert_ancell: yeah, we run it via a wrapper, you need to pass it the plugins we load
[05:38] <mvo> robert_ancell: so "./compiz ccp" should work better
[05:39] <mvo> robert_ancell: I have updated package in the compiz PPA (I have not commited them to bzr, but I can do that now)
[05:39] <robert_ancell> mvo, do you know when the 0.8.4 release will occur?  I can't find a lot of information on their mailing list
[05:41] <mvo> robert_ancell: no precise info yet, I was mostly gathering it from the #compiz-dev channel
[05:41] <mvo> and the git activity
[05:41] <robert_ancell> ah ok.  Do you think the 0.8.3 release will be good enough for us to take now?
[05:41] <mvo> I except the release within the next two weeks, but I can also ask again on #compiz-dev about the plans
[05:42] <mvo> yes
[05:42] <robert_ancell> cool
[05:42] <mvo> its the stable git branch, it should be safe
[05:42] <mvo> and the git log is mostly memleak fixes, crash fixes etc
[05:42] <mvo> good stuff
[05:45]  * mvo needs to have a word with seb when he comes back - not commiting changes to bzr ;)
[05:46] <robert_ancell> mvo, heh the old hands often forget :)
[05:47] <mvo> :)
[05:49] <robert_ancell> mvo, are you going to release compiz 0.8.3 today?
[05:49] <mvo> robert_ancell: I need a freeze exception first
[05:49] <robert_ancell> mvo, is that in process?
[05:49] <mvo> robert_ancell: but it would be good to get it in for alpha5
[05:50] <mvo> robert_ancell:  its described in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess - generally, file a bug on the package, add info, subscribe release-team
[05:50] <mvo> robert_ancell: it changed over time, in the past a diffstat was needed too, I think that was removed
[05:51] <robert_ancell> mvo, is there a bug open?  If not lets open one now
[05:51] <mvo> robert_ancell: could you please add one? I will do the bzr commits in the meantime
[05:51] <robert_ancell> mvo, ok, doing now
[05:53] <robert_ancell> mvo, bug 422384
[05:53] <mvo> thanks robert_ancell
[05:57] <mvo> for the next cycle we should also rename compiz-fusion-plugins-extra to compiz-plugins-extra (upstream dropped the fusion bits)
[05:59] <robert_ancell> mvo, yes
[06:17] <mvo> robert_ancell: I tightened some depends and uploaded the whole lot to the compiz ppa agian to double check that it upgrades clearnly, if it works well for you too, we should (hopefully) reach the goal of a upload today
[06:20] <mvo> Amaranth: hey, I'm preparing a compiz update - did you had a chance to commit the idea about compiz-manager you had (command line defaults for minimal plugin set?)
[06:22] <robert_ancell> mvo, do you know specific ubuntu bugs that this release will fix?
[06:25] <mvo> robert_ancell: upstream thinks it fixes bug #131679
[06:25] <mvo> that bug has a gazillion dupes
[06:26] <mvo> and more of the random fixes, because of valgrinding the whole thing and fixing issues found
[06:26] <robert_ancell> mvo, I thought upstream said that bug was just broken stacktraces? That would be awesome if it fixes it
[06:26] <mvo> robert_ancell: yeah, but it seem the real problem was that on shutdown (exiting of compiz) when plugins got unloaded, not all timers were stopped
[06:27] <mvo> so it tried to access already freeed structures during program exit and crashed
[06:27] <mvo> not a big thing because it was exiting anyway :) but a bit anoying
[06:28] <robert_ancell> at least in terms of the bug traffic!
[06:28] <mvo> :)
[06:28] <mvo> yeah
[06:29]  * mvo is away for a few minutes to have breakfirst
[06:49] <rugby471> good morning
[06:51] <mvo> hey rugby471! nice work on the webkit branch :)
[06:52] <mvo> rugby471: I merged it this morning
[06:52] <rugby471> mvo: cool
[06:52]  * mvo goes and really has breakfirst now
[06:52] <rugby471> did you see the bug with the icons?
[06:52] <rugby471> oh okay :-)
[06:52] <mvo> rugby471: what bug?
[06:52] <rugby471> with the icon in the lobby view
[06:53] <mvo> oh, the sizes?
[06:53] <rugby471> I requested in the code for them to be 48*48
[06:53] <rugby471> yeah
[06:53] <rugby471> and also you can only get the sizes of 48$8, 64*64 etc.
[06:53] <rugby471> they aren'y variable
[06:53] <rugby471> t
[06:54] <mvo> right, I can check why its giving you just the small ones - I need to check how I can request only scalables from the icon cache
[06:54] <mvo> that might solve the problem nicely
[06:54] <rugby471> yup
[06:54] <rugby471> anyway have your breakfast
[06:55] <rugby471> :-)
[06:55] <rugby471> mvo: mac_V has our installed icon
[06:55] <rugby471> http://imagebin.ca/view/CW3zY3q.html
[06:56] <rugby471> and I found our lobby screen effect http://hungred.com/wp-content/demo/jQuery-closing-opening-door-effect/demo.html
[06:56] <mvo> rugby471: cool :) I go and have breakfirst first, but that sounds awsome
[06:57] <rugby471> sure
[07:04] <didrocks> good morning o/
[07:12] <rugby471> didrocks: bon jour
[07:12] <rugby471> didrocks: that was a silky takeover yesterday in UDW :-)
[07:14] <didrocks> rugby471: hello. Thanks a lot ;)
[07:14] <rugby471> hehe
[07:15] <pitti> Good morning
[07:16] <rugby471> pitti: hello
[07:16] <bratsche> Morning pitti
[07:16] <didrocks> hey pitti
[07:17] <bratsche> So, xsplash window won't become translucent and fade when I use a certain jpeg image file in it.  But it works fine with another one.  Anyone have any idea why this might be? :)
[07:17] <bratsche> They're both RGB.
[07:17] <bratsche> 3-channel, no alpha.
[07:21] <rugby471> didrocks: I just made the Ubuntu Wiki quickly page pretty :-) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Quickly
[07:22] <didrocks> rugby471: quite better, yes, thanks! Once I'll have finished my blog post suit on quickly, it will replace the ugly "Command Reference" which was initially a mail for rick :)
[07:25] <rugby471> yup
[07:28] <asac> morning
[07:28] <pitti> hey asac! how are you?
[07:29]  * pitti hugs asac and hopes he had a good holiday
[07:30] <asac> hi pitti
[07:30] <asac> holiday was best experience for quite  some time
[07:30] <asac> ;)
[07:30] <asac> didnt know how nice it is to just do nothing
[07:31]  * asac glances at overly crowded mailbox ... and gets reminded of the bad side of holidays ;)
[07:32] <asac> pitti: hope your holidays were similar good ;)
[07:33] <pitti> asac: yes, they were; we bicycled from Luebeck to Ahlbeck (Ostseekueste) and then to Goerlitz (Oder-Neisse Radweg)
[07:33] <pitti> asac: we had quite nice weather, too, so the tents were still comfortable after 2 weeks :)
[07:34] <asac> yeah. i can figure the weather was reawlly good for you
[07:35] <asac> sounds like adventour. didnt do such a bicycle tour after i was 15 ;)
[07:42] <rugby471> mvo: we have man page :-)
[08:04] <robert_ancell> mvo, when I run the git version I get this error:
[08:04] <robert_ancell> Error: Plugin 'core' has ABI version '20090619', expected ABI version '20090207'
[08:04] <robert_ancell> Any ideas?
[08:05] <mvo> robert_ancell: have you upgraded everything from the ppa repo? including the plugin packages? the ppa might still be in the middle of building the packages
[08:05] <robert_ancell> mvo, yes the PPA version works fine but I'm running the git version - it's installed in a local directory so shouldn't be accessing anything installed
[08:06] <robert_ancell> mvo, I mean my locally checked out git version
[08:06] <mvo> robert_ancell: hm, that like its trying to load the plugins from the wrong place
[08:07] <mvo> i.e. using not the ones in your checkout - 20090207 is a old abi version as well - strnage
[08:07] <mvo> rugby471: cool!
[08:07] <mvo> rugby471: in a bugreport?
[08:07] <rugby471> in my webkit branch
[08:07] <rugby471> I am just working on the installed icon that mac_v made
[08:07] <mvo> rugby471: cool, I merge :)
[08:07] <mvo> rugby471: is there a way to make the category view keyboard navigatable?
[08:07] <rugby471> unfortunately that is all I can do today, I really have to do some homework :-)
[08:08] <rugby471> dunno :-)
[08:08] <robert_ancell> mvo, yeah I'm confused, the logs say it is loading the .so files from the correct place. Do you run git versions from a checkout or via .debs?
[08:08] <mvo> robert_ancell: I usually just build them (thanks to bzr-buildpackage pretty easy). its been a while that I run from git checkouts directly, there were some magic environment variables iirc
[08:08] <mvo> robert_ancell: I can have a look if you want
[08:10] <rugby471> mvo: ok our installed icon and the code that displays it if a package is installed is up in my branch now
[08:11] <rugby471> that is my code for today :-)
[08:11] <robert_ancell> mvo, I'll play a bit more, let me know if you think of anything.  It doesn't appear to need any special env variables
[08:11] <rugby471> this is the effect we are going to use for the lobby http://hungred.com/wp-content/demo/jQuery-closing-opening-door-effect/demo.html
[08:11] <rugby471> but I cannot do anything like that today
[08:12] <rugby471> mvo: in my branch I have used absolute paths in the css, you will need to change that
[08:14] <rugby471|away> bbiab
[08:14] <mvo> rugby471|away: cool, merging now
[08:14]  * mvo waves
[08:22] <mvo> rugby471|away: thanks, merged
[08:26] <seb128> good morning there
[08:26] <pitti> hey seb128
[08:26] <seb128> hello pitti
[08:27] <rugby471> mvo: cool
[08:28] <rugby471> mvo: I was thinking about the webkit view,
[08:28] <rugby471> mvo: are we making a new webkit view everytime we switch view or not?
[08:28] <rugby471> mvo: becuase if we are that isn't good :-)
[08:29] <rugby471> mvo: and we could create some javascript that simply updated the contents of the page
[08:29] <rugby471> mvo: anyway
[08:29] <rugby471> mvo: I shall be on the IRC channel, and I can speak but I can't do any work today
[08:29] <mvo> rugby471: not a new view, we just load a new page
[08:29] <rugby471> mvo: okay good
[08:29] <mvo> rugby471: sure, no problem
[08:30] <rugby471|hmwork> mvo: if I get it all finished otday then I can do work tommorrow and day after :-)
[08:30] <rugby471|hmwork> *today
[08:33] <mvo> rugby471|hmwork: cool :) - good luck with your work
[08:33] <rugby471|hmwork> hehe
[08:33]  * seb128 enjoys his box not crashing on alt-tab
[08:37] <mvo> rugby471|hmwork: *wehh* I figured that by assigning tabindex to the table the keyboard navigation works (it just looks ugly, but I'm sure that can be fixed :)
[08:38] <rugby471|hmwork> :-)
[08:38]  * mvo should called m'html'vo
[08:38] <rugby471|hmwork> hehe
[08:39] <asac> ArneGoetje: there?
[08:39] <asac> i am back ... status on translations?
[08:41] <seb128> hey asac
[08:41] <asac> hi seb128 ;)
[08:41] <pitti> asac: current langpacks don't seem to work with ffox 3.5
[08:41] <seb128> did you have good holidays?
[08:41] <pitti> asac: they were built with "devmode", FYI
[08:42] <asac> pitti: ok. are they in ppa?
[08:42] <pitti> asac: no, in Karmic
[08:42] <huats> morning everyone
[08:42] <pitti> asac: I figured I might as well upload them, the previous ones didn't work either after all
[08:42] <asac> ok
[08:43] <seb128> vuntz, hey, what Name= are .desktop supposed to use nowadays?
[08:43] <seb128> lut huats
[08:43] <didrocks> hey seb128
[08:43] <seb128> vuntz, ie, is gedit using Name=gedit correct? looks weird
[08:43] <seb128> didrocks, lut
[08:43] <huats> hey seb128
[08:43] <asac> pitti: ok. is arne gone?
[08:44] <asac> pitti: did you check whether ffox 3.0 works still a bit with the devmode stuff?
[08:44] <asac> anyway. now that they are in karmic the damage is done. i can do that now ;)
[08:44] <pitti> asac: I didn't
[08:45] <pitti> I have to run out for ~ 2 hours for a doctor appointment and getting a new passport
[08:45] <pitti> BBL!
[08:45] <asac> cu later
[08:45] <asac> ok so german at least works a bit ;)
[08:46] <asac> i see a few translation bugs, but nothing that broke UI ... good
[09:10] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson
[09:10] <seb128> robert_ancell, hi, do you know if gnome-panel not displaying categories icons is a wanted change?
[09:11] <seb128> hum, looking at the changelog it seems to be
[09:11] <seb128> looks weird
[09:11] <robert_ancell> seb128, It does look weird
[09:13] <robert_ancell> hey, can someone look at uploading bug 385850?
[09:14] <seb128> will do when I'm done with gnome-panel
[09:21] <asac> mvo: bonjour mr. vogt ... http://paste.ubuntu.com/262967/
[09:22] <asac> LANG=ml ;)
[09:22] <asac> if thats expected (i just installed the -ml langpacks) ignore it
[09:22] <asac> just wonder if we really should bail out
[09:22] <asac> let me know if you want a bug
[09:23] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128
[09:23] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson
[09:24] <mvo> asac: geh, "ml"?
[09:24] <asac> malay ;)
[09:24] <mvo> asac: always up for a challenge ;)
[09:25] <mvo> asac: welcome back btw :)
[09:25] <asac> hehe
[09:25] <asac> thx
[09:26] <mvo> seb128: meh, help - why does gtk crash when I use set_label? bug #417992 and 418812
[09:27] <asac> mvo: {stock_id = 0x0 ?
[09:27] <seb128> mvo, no idea, could be a corruption and a misleading stacktrace?
[09:27] <asac> err label = 0x13
[09:27] <mvo> asac: hm, this is a python app
[09:27] <seb128> valgrind log would be useful
[09:28] <seb128> mvo, still that's an invalid adress for a label
[09:28] <seb128> mvo, I did try to get a valgrind log for this one I think some time ago but didn't manage to trigger it
[09:29] <mvo> seb128: ok, thanks - I look into it again a bit more today, I was never able to trigger it myself
[09:29] <mvo> but it has a bunch of dupes
[09:29] <seb128> yeah I noticed
[09:29] <seb128> as said my call is corruption somewhere
[09:29] <seb128> or a ref counting issue
[09:30] <seb128> but it's not easy to say without being able to trigger the bug under valgrind or python-dbg
[09:31]  * mvo nods
[09:57] <mvo> I guess I'm the last person noticing this change, but why does the notification bubble open in the right-middle of the screen now?
[09:57] <chrisccoulson> mvo - it's an "experiment" i think
[09:57] <mvo> I mean, what is the advantage over the edge (either lower or upper)?
[09:57] <mvo> aha
[09:58] <mvo> interessting
[09:58] <chrisccoulson> there's a long discussion on the ayatana mailing list
[09:58] <chrisccoulson> (or one of the lists i'm subscribed too)
[09:59] <seb128> mvo, their rational is that corners are often used
[09:59] <seb128> mvo, ie the corner they used conflict with firefox quick search
[10:02] <vuntz> seb128: re categories in menu
[10:02] <vuntz> seb128: we're talking about reverting this
[10:02] <seb128> vuntz, it looks very weird in my opinion ;-)
[10:02] <seb128> vuntz, is there a bug open about that?
[10:03] <vuntz> seb128: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=322932 and thread on r-t
[10:03] <seb128> vuntz, thanks
[10:05] <seb128> vuntz, and about desktops naming? ;-)
[10:05] <seb128> vuntz, ie gedit using Name=gedit
[10:06] <vuntz> seb128: ask fredp about this one
[10:08] <seb128> vuntz, ok
[10:22] <ArneGoetje> asac: here
[10:24] <asac> ArneGoetje: hi.
[10:24] <asac> ArneGoetje: so 3.5 translations dont get produced at all?
[10:24] <asac> do you have the log?
[10:25] <asac> or is it because there are no translations in rosetta et?
[10:25] <asac> yet?
[10:25] <asac> also did you manage to do the "re-import" for those that dont have upstream xpis?
[10:28] <ArneGoetje> asac: reimport worked except for zh-hk and the en-* ones. There must be a bug i the script, those ones were empty.
[10:28] <ArneGoetje> asac: seems ff3.5 didn't get built at all.
[10:29] <asac> ArneGoetje: ok. so you have a log for the last full run? and the export tarball that was used?
[10:29]  * ArneGoetje is looking
[10:29] <asac> ArneGoetje: we dont have zh-hk anymore afaik... its now zh-trans etc.
[10:29] <asac> not sure about the names
[10:29] <asac> but lets check that later
[10:30] <ArneGoetje> asac: zh_HK language code, which should be in the zh-hant tarball.
[10:30] <asac> ok
[10:31] <ArneGoetje> asac: log is on rookery in /srv/language-packs.ubuntu.com/log/karmic
[10:32] <ArneGoetje> asac: tarball is on rookery in /srv/language-packs.ubuntu.com/langpack-o-matic/ubuntu-karmic-translations.tar.gz
[10:34]  * asac checks
[10:35] <asac> ls /srv/language-packs.ubuntu.com/log/karmic/
[10:35] <asac> ls: /srv/language-packs.ubuntu.com/log/karmic/
[10:35] <asac>  No such file or directory
[10:35] <asac> ArneGoetje: ^^
[10:38] <ArneGoetje> asac: err... s/log/logs/
[10:38] <asac> ArneGoetje: please gimme full path ;)
[10:38] <asac> still no such file or directory
[10:39] <asac> ls /srv/language-packs.ubuntu.com/logs/karmic
[10:39] <asac> ls: /srv/language-packs.ubuntu.com/logs/karmic: No such file or directory
[10:39] <seb128> Laney, hey, are you still working on the fspot update?
[10:39] <asac> ah
[10:39] <asac> ArneGoetje: found it
[10:39] <asac> + .log
[10:39] <asac> /srv/language-packs.ubuntu.com/logs/karmic.log
[10:40] <ArneGoetje> asac: yeah
[10:40] <Laney> seb128: waits for sponsorship in sid
[10:41] <Laney> you can pull from git and upload
[10:41] <Laney> I can't do it because I'm away at a conference
[10:41] <seb128> ok thanks
[10:41] <seb128> would be nice if you could update the launchpad bug to say that in such cases
[10:41] <seb128> we might want to get it for the coming alpha
[10:41] <Laney> ok
[10:41] <seb128> thanks
[10:44] <asac> ArneGoetje: ok can you rerun and show log?
[10:44] <asac> there was a list of legal apps ... i didnt adjust
[10:45] <asac> now i allow all firefox-* and xulrunner-* with keeping the special case for firefox/xulrunner to 3.0/1.9
[10:45] <ArneGoetje> asac: ok
[10:45] <ArneGoetje> asac: takes a few hours though
[10:46] <asac> ArneGoetje: hmm. yeah i assume it does ... one sec
[10:46] <pitti> re
[10:49] <asac> ArneGoetje: i will rerun just the xpi manually to see whats happening
[10:49] <ArneGoetje> asac: ok
[10:52]  * asac waits for rookery to finish copying/extracting stuff
[10:52]  * mpt ponders relabelling "Other" as "Grab Bag" in the Software Store
[11:13] <mac_v> ach :(
[11:15] <rugby471|hmwork> mpt: sounds like a bag that is out to get you...
[11:16] <rugby471|hmwork> mpt: pick 'n mix?
[11:16] <rugby471|hmwork> hehe
[11:16] <mpt> http://thesaurus.reference.com/browse/grab+bag
[11:16] <mac_v> mpt: "assorted" ?
[11:17] <rugby471|hmwork> mpt: grab bag -s is that more american, I have never heard it used in england
[11:17] <mac_v> grab bag wont really make sense , to most of the worlD!
[11:17] <mpt> hum
[11:18] <mac_v> mpt: or even "mixed bag" , simpler
[11:19] <rugby471|hmwork> http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/26708/ditch-ie6-ie8-feeding-america - Microsoft is saying they'' donate more money to feeding america if you upgrade from ie6 to ie8
[11:19] <rugby471|hmwork> hehe
[11:19] <mpt> well, it's neither assorted or mixed
[11:19] <mpt> it's more "uncategorized"
[11:19] <rugby471|hmwork> uncategorized - yuck
[11:19] <mac_v> unsorted ;p
[11:19] <mpt> yeah
[11:19] <mpt> precisely
[11:19] <mpt> "Hodgepodge"
[11:19] <rugby471|lunch> see ya
[11:20] <mac_v> mpt: hodgepodge is better , alteast funny sounding :)
[11:20] <asac> ArneGoetje: run looks promissing. its currenty processing 3.5 locales ... /tmp/outtest1.log
[11:23] <mac_v> mpt: "potpourri" ;)
[11:23] <mpt> "Leftovers"
[11:24] <mac_v> that sounds like scrap , something worthless
[11:28] <mpt> indeed
[11:30] <asac> ArneGoetje: also spotted the rror output for locales that have a country code ... looks like this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/263013/
[11:30] <asac> i will investigate later today i guess
[11:37] <pitti> seb128: there, just seeded langpack-fr back to desktop and alternate
[12:10] <seb128> pitti, rock on!
[12:10] <pitti> it's so nice to have plenty of CD space for a change
[12:19] <rugby471|lunch> mpt: utilities?
[12:23] <fredp> seb128: (I am going back to a meeting in a moment); about Name=gedit, I don't like it but they want to advertise the gedit name (a way out would be to use X-GNOME-FullName=gedit Text Editor, this wouldn't give "Text Editor" back but is better than gedit in my opinion)
[12:37] <andreasn> mpt, I'm trying to get rid of some headers with just a single entry beneath them, but I'm not sure exactly how deal with some of them
[12:37] <andreasn> mpt, http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/184285/headers.png
[12:37] <andreasn> any tips for what I could do in this situation?
[12:44] <mac_v> hmm... rugby471 eats lunch then eats homework ;p
[12:46] <seb128> fredp, what was wrong with having "Text Editor"?
[12:46] <seb128> I've been reading some of the discussions about desktop naming
[12:47] <seb128> but I didn't read that anything was decided
[12:49] <baptistemm> heya
[12:51] <rugby471|hmwork> mac_v: yup :-)
[12:53] <davmor2> pitti: what the hell did you do to get space on the cd?
[13:18] <kenvandine> pitti, wow... 687M with couchdb :)
[13:18] <kenvandine> pitti, impressive!
[13:24] <rugby471|hmwork> seb128: have you had time to look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/debian/+source/xscreensaver/+bug/385850 yet ?
[13:24] <seb128> rugby471|hmwork, yes this morning and it seems to lack Replaces
[13:24] <seb128> if files move between binaries Replaces are required
[13:24] <rugby471|hmwork> seb128: sorry?
[13:25] <rugby471|hmwork> oh
[13:25] <seb128> well if you move a file from binary to binary-extra
[13:25] <seb128> you need to use a "Replaces: binary (<< version)"
[13:25] <rugby471|hmwork> right
[13:26] <seb128> cassidy, Zdra: where are empathy accounts stored?
[13:27] <cassidy> seb128: depends on the MC version
[13:27] <Zdra> seb128: now it is in ~/.mission-control/accounts.cfg
[13:27] <seb128> I still have 2.27.5
[13:27] <seb128> ie the old mission control I think
[13:27] <Zdra> seb128: now it is in ~/.mission-control/accounts/accounts.cfg
[13:27] <seb128> I'm trying to clean the config to see how imports from pidgin are working
[13:27] <Zdra> seb128: then it is in gconf
[13:27] <cassidy> Zdra: shouldn't we use ~/.config for extra XDG goodness ?
[13:28] <Zdra> cassidy: we should, yes... but it's MC's problem
[13:28] <cassidy> indeed
[13:29] <Zdra> seb128: in gconf it is /apps/telepathy/mc/accounts
[13:29] <seb128> Zdra, thanks
[13:29] <seb128> I'm newing empathu 2.27.91
[13:29] <seb128> let's see how the new one works
[13:34]  * seb128 grrr at this crossposting discussion about the software store
[13:34] <rugby471|hmwork> seb128: huh?
[13:34] <seb128> it's annoying to get same mails several times on to figure what are duplicates or not
[13:34] <seb128> it's crossposted between devel and desktop lists
[13:34] <rugby471|hmwork> hehe
[13:34] <rugby471|hmwork> ah
[13:34] <seb128> and some people are not subscribed to one of the list or the other
[13:35] <seb128> so you don't know what to read to get the whole discussion and no duplicate
[13:35] <rugby471|hmwork> annoying ...
[13:35] <seb128> cross-posting without reply-to set should be forbidden ;-)
[13:35] <rugby471|hmwork> hehe
[13:38] <seb128> hum
[13:38] <seb128> for whatever reason empathy doesn't let me enable the msn account it has importe
[13:38] <seb128> imported
[13:39] <rugby471|hmwork> mvo: made any more progress?
[13:39] <Zdra> seb128: account ID and password are correctly imported?
[13:40] <mvo> rugby471|hmwork: a bit, some code in bzr, but I was doing some other work mostly
[13:40] <seb128> Zdra, yes but the account is not listed after a restart
[13:40] <rugby471|hmwork> mvo: kl
[13:40] <seb128> Zdra, I don't have butterfly installed
[13:40] <mvo> rugby471|hmwork: I also updated the TODO
[13:40] <seb128> Zdra, ie I'm using libpurple for that one
[13:40] <Zdra> ah
[13:40] <Zdra> I don't know... :p
[13:41] <seb128> Zdra, it works one papyon is installed
[13:41] <seb128> once
[13:42] <seb128> Zdra, other issue, it tries to import the salut account from pidgin and fail too ... known?
[13:42] <seb128> I though empathy had a bonjour account set by default?
[13:42] <Zdra> seb128: I have no idea... I didn't made the importer... you should probably ping cosimoc on #telepathy
[13:43] <seb128> ok
[13:43] <seb128> and you know about empathy having bonjour by default?
[13:43] <Zdra> seb128: IIRC, it is supposed to create a bonjour account at first launch
[13:43] <seb128> it doesn't
[13:43] <Zdra> seb128: but it's possible that it does not work :p
[13:44] <seb128> ok thanks
[13:46] <Zdra> seb128: oh, that's still that old bug... you have to first edit your own information in about-me
[13:46] <mvo> rugby471|hmwork: but I think I merge the webkit branch into trunk/ today and do a upload with it, its a big step foward already
[13:46] <Zdra> seb128: otherwise self contact is not created in your eds book, and e_book_get_self() fails
[13:46] <Zdra> seb128: and if that fail, empathy does not created the salut account...
[13:46] <Zdra> seb128: we should fallback, really
[13:46] <cassidy> Zdra: could you open a bug about that?
[13:47] <rugby471|hmwork> mvo: yup, it is going to be pretty awesome :-)
[13:47] <seb128> Zdra, oh, really not obvious indeed
[13:53] <seb128> mvo, you found an issue in gdebi with the label?
[13:54] <mvo> seb128: not really, I was just trying a workaround
[13:55] <seb128> mvo, ok, you think that's a race somewhere?
[13:58] <mvo> seb128: might be, the label is set twice in short time
[13:58] <mvo> but it should just be a single thread
[13:58] <mvo> I'm still a bit clueless
[14:03] <pitti> davmor2: squeeze it really hard! :-)
[14:04] <davmor2> pitti: sounds more like you dropped it in a commercial crusher :)
[14:05] <pitti> davmor2: we strip gnome help file translations now and put them into langpacks
[14:05] <pitti> they are biiiig
[14:06] <davmor2> pitti: meh whole world should know how to use gnome by now anyway, don't need help surely, anyway isn't that what google is for :D
[14:06] <kenvandine> pitti, that was a HUGE win
[14:08] <pitti> kenvandine: s/was/is/, it's only just the beginning; wait until all gnome packages have been uploaded once :)
[14:09] <kenvandine> oh
[14:09] <kenvandine> wow
[14:16] <ArneGoetje> asac: so, did the zh- and en- locales build?
[14:17] <kenvandine> good morning rickspencer3
[14:18] <pitti> hey rickspencer3
[14:18] <rickspencer3> good morning gents
[14:18] <didrocks> seb128: when you have some time, if you can take a look to the xdg list for the default application mimetype. We get close to an agreement with David Faure and Alexander L., but Stanislav Brabec came and is proposing a totally different path (and it seems that David and Alexander are busy recently)
[14:18] <didrocks> hey rickspencer3
[14:19] <asac> ArneGoetje: no the bug is still there. the rest worked fine though
[14:19] <seb128> didrocks, I've been reading quickly this discussion
[14:19] <seb128> didrocks, it's like hours to read that amount of emails and I'm still catching up from vac
[14:19] <seb128> didrocks, I was trying to stay away from having to read all that ;-)
[14:20] <seb128> didrocks, it's late for karmic anyway, I would let some day for david or alex to comment
[14:26] <asac> ArneGoetje: checking again in a few
[14:38] <didrocks> seb128: ok, let's wait for the moment, so :)
[14:40] <seb128> didrocks, ok
[14:41] <seb128> didrocks, I did update pygtk btw
[14:41] <didrocks> seb128: ok. I'll try to play with clutter and python a bit now that I have an experimental binding for last Alexander's branch :)
[14:42] <fredp> seb128: (still in a meeting), nothing wrong about "Text Editor", mccann policy was to have menu items matching the name displayed in the title bar
[14:42] <fredp> and gedit has "gedit" in its menubar
[14:42] <seb128> bah
[14:42] <seb128> I think it doesn't bring anything useful
[14:42] <seb128> the menu just looks very weird now
[14:42] <fredp> I agree.
[14:46] <fredp> seb128: you could file a bug against gedit, asking for X-GNOME-Fullname=Text Editor
[14:47] <fredp> (rationale being we want gnome 2.28 menu item to be identical to the one we had in 2.26)
[14:47] <seb128> hum, I can do that but was is X-GNOME-Fullname now?
[14:47] <seb128> has that been decided somewhere or that's something some people try enforcing?
[14:49] <fredp> seb128: David Faure was ok with a new FullName key, as we are doing it before getting it in the spec, we prefix it with X-GNOME-
[14:49] <mclasen> fredp: thats not a full name
[14:49] <mpt> andreasn, "Shredder" is Firefox nightly?
[14:49] <mclasen> fredp: it doesn't help anything to introduce a new field, only to immediately muddy its semantics again...
[14:50] <fredp> mclasen: you mean "Text Editor" ?  I actually proposed "gedit Text Editor" earlier here.
[14:50] <mpt> andreasn, oh, Thunderbird nightly
[14:50] <mclasen> fredp: yes, 'gedit Text Editor' would be a fullname
[14:52] <pitti> seb128: current me-tv fails to start with "Duplicate object id 'hbox1' on line 1220 (previously on line 535)"
[14:52] <andreasn> mpt, yes
[14:53] <pitti> seb128: I think I saw something similar in a changelog of your's
[14:53] <pitti> seb128: it sounds like something gtk builder related?
[14:53] <seb128> pitti, yes, new gtk exit on such issues
[14:53] <pitti> seb128: do you have a quick hint where to look and what this is all about?
[14:53] <seb128> pitti, well theorically it's a .ui bug, the same id should not be used twice
[14:53] <seb128> pitti, you use the same name twice in the .ui for 2 different widgets
[14:53] <pitti> ah
[14:53] <mpt> andreasn, a "table of contents" of secondary dialogs is inevitably kinda lame, but yes, removing the headings would help a bit
[14:53] <pitti> that sounds fixable
[14:54] <seb128> pitti, right, just change the name of one of the widgets ;-)
[14:54] <mpt> andreasn, one thing you might try is making the intro text a summary of the settings that have been set in the secondary dialog.
[14:54] <pitti> seb128: I installed the jaunty version last night, that worked fine (my mother asked me to record something from TV)
[14:54] <seb128> mclasen, is exiting on duplicate gtkbuilder ids a wanted change?
[14:54] <pitti> seb128: okay, thanks; I'll check the code for which of the widgets should keep the original name then
[14:54] <pitti> hah, and sure enough there's a bug for it, bug 422126
[14:55] <seb128> pitti, gtk started to exit rather than returning a warning with the recent update
[14:55] <mpt> andreasn, for example, "Shredder currently connects to the Internet through a proxy. ( Connection Settings... )"
[14:55] <seb128> pitti, I'm not sure if that's wanted or a gtk bug
[14:55] <andreasn> ah, yeah, that makes sense
[14:55] <pitti> seb128: makes sense for a development version
[14:55] <mpt> andreasn, another simple fix would be to make the "Offline..." button the same width and height as the others. :-)
[14:55] <pitti> seb128: well, it's a potential problem in the .ui file either way
[14:55] <seb128> right
[14:55] <mclasen> seb128: it is not a change at all
[14:56] <seb128> mclasen, it started happening since 2.17.9
[14:56] <andreasn> mpt, it feels like currently the others are wrong :)
[14:56] <mclasen> duplicate ids were never supported
[14:56] <seb128> well programs use to run and display a warning
[14:56] <mclasen> now you get a clean exit instead of undefined behaviour...seems like progress to me
[14:56] <seb128> right, that was the question
[14:56] <seb128> thanks
[15:27] <pitti> well, except that in this case, the duplicate IDs were never referred to
[15:27] <pitti> (hbox1 twice)
[15:27] <pitti> so claiming "no change" is a little harsh
[15:28] <pitti> (nevertheless it's a bug which needs fixing, of course)
[15:29] <davmor2> pitti: wasn't there talk of dropping gwibber in for social desktop?
[15:31] <pitti> kenvandine said it would stay in universe for karmic
[15:31] <davmor2> pitti: Ah okay :)
[15:35] <kenvandine> that is still the plan as of now
[15:42] <dobey> james_w: hi! how was paris?
[15:44] <james_w> hey dobey
[15:44] <james_w> great thanks
[15:44] <james_w> how was your weekend?
[15:45] <dobey> not too bad.
[15:46] <dobey> james_w: i fixed up some of poauth yesterday, and made an 0.1 release, created a package branch, and uploaded to revu... http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/poauth :)
[15:47] <james_w> thanks
[15:49] <pitti> MacSlow: oh, thanks for reverting the bubble position default
[15:49] <dobey> james_w: i've also got branches proposed for ubuntuone-client and ubuntuone-storage-protocol to switch to poauth, and working on the server now. but we can't really land the client branches yet, if we don't get poauth into karmic. so let me know if there's anything i need to do so we can get it in :)
[15:50] <james_w> I'll take a look once I've stopped chatting to your boss :-)
[15:52] <MacSlow> pitti, "piece of cake" ;)
[15:52] <dobey> :)
[16:08] <pitti> kenvandine: hm, indicator-session doesn't let me choose anythign else than "offline"; is that known?
[16:08] <SlickT10> Hey guys, Ive exuasted every resource on this issue. Ive run out of leads, and have no idea where to go next. Im not expecting you guys to have to give me support on this one, but maybe at least point me in the right direction. It is important that I get this working. The question has been posted at: https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/81460. No one in the #ubuntu support channel even notice my inquiries, i think thats due to the high
[16:08] <kenvandine> humm
[16:08] <kenvandine> pitti, that was working for me
[16:08] <kenvandine> but it isn't now
[16:08] <kenvandine> oh
[16:08] <kenvandine> pitti, yeah... that is known
[16:09] <seb128> pitti, you need to start the service after your im client
[16:09] <kenvandine> if you reload the applet and the session indicator service *after* empathy is running... it works
[16:09] <pitti> also, is the top entry ("Martin Pitt") actually supposed to do something when you click on it? it's selectable, after all
[16:09] <seb128> pitti, bug #422031
[16:09] <pitti> seb128: I just added the applet back to my panel, since I want to start working on the guest session now
[16:09] <seb128> there is a similar for empathy too
[16:09] <kenvandine> pitti, good question
[16:09] <pitti> I didn't restart my session
[16:09] <seb128> pitti, right but applet != service
[16:09] <pitti> seb128: ah, pidgin
[16:09]  * pitti on empathy
[16:10] <kenvandine> pitti, it affects both
[16:10] <seb128> pitti, there is a similar bug for empathy
[16:10] <pitti> aah
[16:10] <pitti> works now
[16:10] <kenvandine> :)
[16:10] <pitti> hm
[16:10] <kenvandine> pitti, it is weird that you can select your name... but it does nothing
[16:10] <pitti> so changign the status in empathy reflects to the applet
[16:10] <kenvandine> i don't know if it is suppose to do anything
[16:10] <pitti> but I can't change it in the applet
[16:10] <kenvandine> yeah
[16:10] <kenvandine> you need to restart the indicator user session service
[16:10] <pitti> kenvandine: it could bring up the personal settings
[16:11] <kenvandine> yeah
[16:11] <kenvandine> that would be nice
[16:11] <pitti> anyway, will test again after restarting session
[16:11]  * kenvandine files a bbug
[16:11] <johanbr> SlickT10, #ubuntu-kernel might be a better place to ask
[16:11] <kenvandine> pitti, that doesn't really fix it
[16:11]  * pitti dives into gdm to port the guest session code
[16:11] <SlickT10> thanks
[16:11] <kenvandine> pitti, empathy needs to be running before the indicator start
[16:11] <kenvandine> +s
[16:11] <seb128> pitti,
 ted, what is the first line in the applet supposed to do when selected?
 seb128: Nothing, it should be insensitive.
[16:12] <pitti> heh, about still gives me indicator-applet-sus
[16:13] <seb128> "indicator-applet-session 0.1" there
[16:13] <pitti> kenvandine: is empathy supposed to still show its green dot in the panel when the indicator is running?
[16:13] <kenvandine> pitti, yes...
[16:13] <kenvandine> until ted finishes that patch
[16:13] <pitti> ah, nice
[16:14] <kenvandine> we considered the indicator support in empathy as a regression from jaunty... so it's a bug fix :)
[16:14]  * kenvandine hopes he gets to it soon...
[16:21] <pedro_> asac, are you around?
[16:22] <asac> yes
[16:22] <asac> pedro_: ^^
[16:22] <pedro_> asac, are you going to be here on Thursday?
[16:22] <asac> bug day?
[16:22] <pedro_> asac, want to help on cleaning up the New bugs on network-manager
[16:22] <asac> what time?
[16:22] <asac> pedro_: you rock ;)
[16:22] <asac> yes. i will be here .. i might have a dinner in the evening though
[16:23] <pedro_> asac, mm well whenever you can that day, just be around at #ubuntu-bugs at that's it
[16:23] <pedro_> asac, awesome ;-)
[16:24] <pedro_> asac, will create/setup everything and send you the hug day page to you later for a quick review
[16:24] <pedro_> asac, thanks ;-)
[16:25] <asac> pedro_: could be that i am out by then. in worst case i give you feedback on the hug page tomorrow. guess thats ok?
[16:26] <pedro_> asac, yeap, that's fine
[16:35] <seb128> pitti, congrats for your tb nomination
[16:35] <pitti> seb128: thanks!
[16:35] <pitti> seb128: not just that, I've been elected
[16:36] <seb128> right, that's what I meant
[16:36] <seb128> I wonder who was voting
[16:36] <seb128> either I didn't get anything about that or I skipped it
[16:36] <seb128> anyway congrats ;-)
[16:36] <pitti> I didn't get the announcement either
[16:36] <pitti> seb128: thanks!
[16:40] <Amaranth> seb128: looks like the proper fix for gnome-appearance-properties switching to compiz is to use libwnck and connect to the WnckScreen::window-manager-changed signal
[16:40] <Amaranth> or patching GTK+ but that's less proper :)
[16:40] <seb128> Amaranth, want to do a patch for that?
[16:41] <Amaranth> gah, gnome-appearance-properties doesn't link to libwnck right now
[16:52] <Amaranth> seb128: what's the command used to regenerate the autoreconf patches again?
[16:52] <Amaranth> what are the flags to autoreconf, I mean
[16:52] <seb128> autoreconf
[16:52] <seb128> no flag
[16:53] <Amaranth> heh, I could have sworn Keybuk said to always use some flags
[16:53] <chrisccoulson_g1> I always use "-i"
[16:54] <Keybuk> run autoreconf -i after checking out from revision control
[16:54] <Keybuk> then don't worry about it - the automake-generated makefiles will automatically keep everything up to date
[16:54] <baptistemm> :)
[17:03]  * Amaranth is going to make it use wnck_screen_get_window_manager_name instead for now
[17:04] <Amaranth> build fail :/
[17:04] <Amaranth> on second though, I'll just make the current functions not do silly things :p
[17:04] <Amaranth> thought*
[17:05] <seb128> Amaranth, why do you need libwnck for there?
[17:05] <Amaranth> seb128: I don't, since I'm not using the signal
[17:06] <Amaranth> Thus I'm going to fix what is there to not use the gdk call
[17:06] <seb128> ok
[17:15] <didrocks> pitti: late congrats too :)
[17:15] <pitti> didrocks: merci
[17:16] <seb128> didrocks, are you still working on some updates?
[17:16] <seb128> ie clutter or introspection, etc?
[17:16] <seb128> just to not conflict with what you are doing
[17:16] <didrocks> seb128: yes, I planned to update clutter/mutter and deps to merge with last releases
[17:17] <seb128> didrocks, you rock
[17:17] <didrocks> seb128: I'm just programming a little on edge clutter those days :)
[17:17]  * didrocks hugs seb128 
[17:17]  * seb128 hugs didrocks
[17:20] <rickspencer3> desktop team meeting in 10 minutes!
[17:28] <Amaranth> seems like terrible timing for a meeting, developer week and all
[17:29] <Amaranth> ah, no desktop team guys doing sessions today
[17:29] <pedro_> hello folks
[17:30] <pitti> hey all
[17:30] <rickspencer3> time to go :)
[17:30] <rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-09-01
[17:30] <seb128> ups
[17:30] <seb128> I'm there now
[17:31] <seb128> Laney, new fspot wants a flicker lib not in ubuntu
[17:31] <rickspencer3> ArneGoetje, asac , awe, bryce , ccheney , KenEdwards , pitti , Riddell ,
[17:31] <ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: here
[17:31] <rickspencer3> who am I missing?
[17:31] <Riddell> hi
[17:31]  * awe waves
[17:31]  * rickspencer3 taps gavel
[17:31] <ccheney> hi
[17:31]  * pitti drops staring at gdm code for guest session porting -- ugh
[17:32] <rickspencer3> hehe
[17:32] <rickspencer3> okay, there were no action items from last meeting, as it was all Feature Freeze status
[17:32]  * kenvandine is here
[17:32] <rickspencer3> so that means, in general, we are turning to bug fixing and stabelization
[17:32] <asac> hi
[17:33] <rickspencer3> the good news for you all, bug-zapper is temporarily stymied by a launchpadlib change
[17:33] <rickspencer3> :)
[17:33] <rickspencer3> so, let's run through the agenda
[17:33] <bryce> heya
[17:34] <rickspencer3> kenvandine, partner update?
[17:34] <kenvandine> sure
[17:34]  * asac notes that burn down chart looks pretty good
[17:34] <asac> not even that much yellow
[17:34] <kenvandine> dx and ols landed lots of stuff last week
[17:34] <kenvandine> although desktopcouch is actually busted now... fix coming real soon
[17:35] <kenvandine> there is also new artwork coming in xsplash... we hope today
[17:35] <rickspencer3> kenvandine, "real soon" means in the next hour or so?
[17:35] <kenvandine> rickspencer3, it is being tested now
[17:35] <kenvandine> well
[17:35] <kenvandine> for xsplash?
[17:35] <kenvandine> or dc
[17:35] <ccheney> ooo 3.1.1 (final) coming in about 15m
[17:35] <rickspencer3> dc
[17:35] <kenvandine> maybe... they have a branch being reviewed now
[17:36] <pitti> ccheney: for the build, please just make sure that it works, since we are in alpha-5 soft freeze
[17:36] <kenvandine> xsplash has a new bug, introduced by the artwork
[17:36] <pitti> ccheney: but, great to see it land in time!
[17:36] <ccheney> pitti: already tested :)
[17:36] <kenvandine> bratsche is working on it
[17:36] <rickspencer3> kenvandine, ok
[17:36] <kenvandine> i think that is all i have..
[17:36] <ccheney> pitti: otherwise would have been uploaded yesterday took around 5 hr to build, heh
[17:36] <kenvandine> expect bug fixes :)
[17:36] <kenvandine> and expect bugs :-p
[17:36] <rickspencer3> I would really like to see xsplash updated before I wake up tomorrow am, any chance of that happening?
[17:36] <kenvandine> yes
[17:37] <kenvandine> there is a chance :)
[17:37] <pitti> with a real throbber?
[17:37] <kenvandine> pitti, yes
[17:37] <kenvandine> and it looks awesome
[17:37] <pitti> \o/
[17:37] <kenvandine> built in my daily builds ppa :)
[17:37] <rickspencer3> so who can upload it when it is ready?
[17:37] <kenvandine> but the fading broke
[17:37] <pitti> kenvandine: my wife will leave for the evening, so I'll be around for a bit
[17:37] <pitti> rickspencer3: o/
[17:37] <kenvandine> pitti, awesome
[17:37] <bratsche> kenvandine: I found a way to get it working for now.
[17:37] <rickspencer3> thanks pitti
[17:37] <kenvandine> bratsche, great!
[17:37] <kenvandine> bratsche, release coming?
[17:37] <rickspencer3> bratsche, what do you mean "for now"?
[17:38] <rickspencer3> is it not a permanent solution?
[17:38] <bratsche> kenvandine: For some reason only the larger images break it.  So I posted a revision for review now that won't use any images higher than 1280x1024.
[17:38] <kenvandine> rickspencer3, means a hack to make it not suck... until we can fix it for real :)
[17:38] <kenvandine> bratsche, ewwww
[17:38] <kenvandine> ok
[17:38] <rickspencer3> hmmm
[17:38] <asac> hmm ... dont fix things hacky if you want to do it for real this cycle still
[17:38] <asac> ;)
[17:38] <bratsche> rickspencer3: There's something wrong with the large three images, and I can't figure out what the problem is yet.  On my system the 1280x1024 image still looks good at higher res, so it's a workable solution for now.
[17:38] <rickspencer3> I have to agree with asac
[17:39] <kenvandine> temporary solutions are always permanent :)
[17:39] <rickspencer3> and they take time
[17:39] <rickspencer3> is this just to meet my upload deadline?
[17:39] <kenvandine> rickspencer3, however... you are pushing us :)
[17:39] <rickspencer3> okay
[17:39] <bratsche> It's a one-line change in the source code, pending upon getting new images that work.
[17:39] <kenvandine> we could upload the temp hack to just the team ppa
[17:39] <rickspencer3> but I'm not pushing to upload poor hacks
[17:40] <kenvandine> rickspencer3, just for that review
[17:40] <kenvandine> although it would be nice to have it in alpha5 :)
[17:40] <rickspencer3> if you can't meet my upload deadline without a proper fix, so be it
[17:40] <bratsche> Actually, a two-line change.
[17:40] <asac> how bad is it if that hack stays in forever? if its bad we should have a bug to track so it doesnt get forgotten ;)
[17:40] <rickspencer3> ok ... I'll follow up with kenvandine and bratsche after the meeting
[17:40] <kenvandine> thx
[17:40] <kenvandine> moving on
[17:40] <kenvandine> i'm done
[17:40] <bratsche> asac: If this gets merged into master I will open a bug immediately.
[17:40] <asac> one partner question
[17:40] <rickspencer3> but doing this right is more important to me than doing it by my artificial deadline ;)
[17:40] <bratsche> asac: If it gets solved first then I won't. :)
[17:41] <asac> bratsche: we are concerned about packages
[17:41] <bratsche> Oh okay.
[17:41] <asac> if it has to go we better file a release critical bug so we can fix it later
[17:41] <asac> kenvandine: ubuntuone client + bindwood on demand. is that off the table for karmic?
[17:41] <pitti> rickspencer3: it's not so artificial, for the alpha-5 candidate images will be built tomorrow morning
[17:41] <asac> or anything you need input on?
[17:41] <pitti> i. e. in ~ 15 hours
[17:41] <kenvandine> asac, i think so...
[17:41] <kenvandine> it isn't in the UI now
[17:42] <kenvandine> asac, i will confirm
[17:42] <asac> kenvandine: i would feel better if we can get a final NO on that one so it doesn suddenly pop up later
[17:42] <asac> kenvandine: thanks
[17:42] <rickspencer3> ok, kenvandine keep going :)
[17:42] <kenvandine> rickspencer3, i am done
[17:43] <rickspencer3> ok
[17:43] <rickspencer3> bryce, x, mesa 7.6, 100% bug?
[17:43] <kenvandine> oh... thx pitti for all the uploads last week!
[17:43] <bryce> rickspencer3, good news, we have 4 people confirming the kernel patch solves it
[17:43] <pitti> you're welcome :)
[17:43] <pitti> rock!
[17:43] <rickspencer3> bryce, that is good news indeed
[17:43] <pitti> that means we don't need to rollback mesa?
[17:43] <rickspencer3> what about that long running freeze you discovered?
[17:44] <rickspencer3> bryce, does that seem to be related?
[17:44] <bryce> rickspencer3, it sounds like intel is not sure about their "not-fixed" case, but they're working with upstream to understand what's going on
[17:44] <rickspencer3> bryce, do you still feel 100% confident that we should be moving forward with 7.6?
[17:44] <bryce> rickspencer3, right, I had tried downgrading mesa instead of using the kernel fix, and found the same bug
[17:44] <bryce> rickspencer3, in fact, going through the bug trackers I see there are several different ways to trigger the bug
[17:45] <rickspencer3> oh
[17:45] <bryce> rickspencer3, still checking back with people, however I believe the kernel patch will solve all cases
[17:45] <rickspencer3> and does that bug manifest with mesa 7.6?
[17:45] <rickspencer3> okay, so mesa 7.6 ftw
[17:45] <pitti> can freezes really be related to mesa?
[17:45] <bryce> indeed on the upstream bugs there are already indications it solves these other cases (e.g. certain 3d games)
[17:45] <rickspencer3> and also thanks to Jesse and intel pulling the weeked work
[17:45] <pitti> mesa sounds like something that would crash a program, or does it do more?
[17:45] <rickspencer3> weekend, even
[17:46] <bryce> rickspencer3, at this stage, once the kernel fix gets in, I don't see any reason not to move forward with mesa 7.6
[17:46] <ogasawara> bryce: I'll submit the kernel patch today for Karmic inclusion
[17:46] <rickspencer3> ogasawara, thanks for your awesome engagement, as usual
[17:46] <Amaranth> pitti: Really all mesa bugs that lock up the system are technically kernel drm bugs
[17:46] <rickspencer3> was nice to get the patch tested so fast
[17:46] <Amaranth> like the recent 100% one
[17:46] <pitti> Amaranth: so I guessed
[17:46] <pitti> Amaranth: well, I guess it can uncover DRM bugs with new features
[17:47] <bryce> rickspencer3, I did a scrub through all our bug reports again to see if there's any other mesa issues.  There's a few, but they look like ones that can be sorted out.
[17:47] <Amaranth> but new versions of mesa can expose these bugs so mesa is technically responsible for them
[17:47] <pitti> Amaranth: ok, I understand now, thanks
[17:47] <rickspencer3> bryce, ok, I guess the next step is to get tselliot caught up
[17:47] <rickspencer3> on all the info
[17:47]  * seb128 didn't get any compiz hang since running ogasawara's kernel today
[17:47] <bryce> rickspencer3, yep
[17:47] <rickspencer3> ok, this is encouraging indeed
[17:48]  * rickspencer3 felt Jaunty deja view
[17:48] <pitti> ("vu")
[17:48] <bryce> yeah, but seems quite solid now
[17:48] <rickspencer3> hehe
[17:48] <rickspencer3> okay, next is pulseaudio
[17:48] <pitti> I still experience X freezes some hours after suspend, otherwise it's very solid here as well
[17:48] <rickspencer3> TheMuso is asleep
[17:49] <rickspencer3> pedro_, I asked marjo for some qa help in sorting through the pulse bugs
[17:49] <rickspencer3> anything to report yet
[17:49] <rickspencer3> ?
[17:49]  * Amaranth rapidly flips back and forth between compiz and metacity using gnome-appearance-properties...fixed!
[17:49] <bryce> ogasawara, thanks, it'll be good to see that patch get in :-)
[17:49] <pedro_> I've been doing some triage there lately
[17:49] <pitti> did anyone here expect major sound regressions recently?
[17:49] <pedro_> and so far:
[17:49] <pitti> Amaranth: nice!
[17:49] <pedro_> bug 409897
[17:49] <pedro_> bug 418448
[17:50] <seb128> sounds work fine there
[17:50] <pitti> here, too
[17:50] <rickspencer3> pedro_, what do you think ...
[17:50] <rickspencer3> is it working fine for users?
[17:50] <rickspencer3> (totally loaded question)
[17:50] <pedro_> yes that's true, i didn't see a lot of "audio" issues there
[17:50] <rickspencer3> ok
[17:50] <pitti> pedro_: except for crashes (which sound easy to fix), did you notice a significant "cutoff point" where people started to report regressions in quality, stuttering, etc.?
[17:50] <pedro_> on that direction the only ones i saw are:
[17:50] <pedro_> bug 410446
[17:51] <pedro_> bug 409723
[17:51] <pedro_> and bug 410948
[17:51] <rickspencer3> ok
[17:51] <pitti> nice
[17:51] <pedro_> those seems to be the ones affecting more users there, but not crackling or anything bad
[17:51] <rickspencer3> ok
[17:51] <pitti> I mean, they sound like something that is manageable
[17:51] <rickspencer3> this is good news
[17:51] <pitti> not "weird and bad sound" type of stuff
[17:51] <pedro_> nope, nothing yet
[17:51] <pitti> pedro_: as usual, you rock; thanks!
[17:52] <pedro_> i need to look into this more deeply though
[17:52] <pedro_> there's too many reports there!
[17:52] <rickspencer3> TheMuso mentioned my last night, that users were experiencing instability
[17:52] <rickspencer3> and I certainly am
[17:52] <pedro_> pitti, thanks! ;-)
[17:52] <rickspencer3> thanks pedro_
[17:52] <pitti> rickspencer3: due to the crashes mentioned above?
[17:52] <pedro_> my pleasure
[17:52] <rickspencer3> pitti, not sure atm
[17:52] <mpt> bratsche, dbarth told me you're working on the path button now. How's it going?
[17:52] <rickspencer3> I'll look at it after the meeting, and bring up with TheMuso
[17:53] <rickspencer3> moving on
[17:53] <rickspencer3> Riddell ... Kubuntu?
[17:53]  * pitti is relieved
[17:53]  * rickspencer3 is still concerned
[17:53]  * rickspencer3 is always concerned
[17:53] <rickspencer3> :)
[17:53] <bratsche> mpt: I'm starting on it today.. but I'm trying to finish getting the new assets from mt ready for xsplash first.  It seems like desktop team needs this finished asap.
[17:53]  * kenvandine passes rickspencer3 a pill
[17:53] <Riddell> afternoon
[17:53] <pitti> rickspencer3: "fuzzy and foggy feeling" -> "clearly described bugs" is a good step
[17:53] <Riddell> - 4.3.1 all uploaded and working well
[17:53] <Riddell> - Upstream Plasma Netbook has just decided to depend on KDE 4.4, we're hopeful but not certain if we can salvage enough for a version that work with KDE 4.3 to be worth releasing
[17:54] <Riddell> - usb-creator-kde all fixed and working as well as the gtk one
[17:54] <Riddell> - quassel patch for message indicator has issues that need fixed before upload.  aurelien has said he wants to create Ayatana style notifications too as this is easier than he expected, would need FFe.
[17:54] <Riddell> any questions? :)
[17:54] <pitti> 4.3 got a great review in c't
[17:54] <pitti> Riddell: what's the status of the network-manager plasmoid?
[17:54] <dobey> hmm
[17:55] <pitti> Riddell: I understood that it got broken all over again with NM 0.8?
[17:55] <Riddell> pitti: knetworkmanager 4 working well (it's not currently a plasmoid UI)
[17:55] <pitti> *phew*, good work!
[17:55] <Riddell> pitti: asac and others sorted that out bless them
[17:55]  * pitti cheers asac
[17:55] <rickspencer3> this is so awesome
[17:55] <mpt> bratsche, ok
[17:56] <Riddell> I'm still to test it for VPN or 3G functions though, not sure the best way to do that
[17:56] <rickspencer3> Riddell, great job with Kubuntu Karmic so far
[17:56] <rickspencer3> lots of great innovations
[17:56] <rickspencer3> and addressing some of the Jaunty pain points
[17:56]  * rickspencer3 extends to Kubuntu team as well
[17:56] <pitti> Riddell: I can download a current daily and test with my USB 3G card, if you don't have something to test?
[17:56] <rickspencer3> if anyone has a netbook, please try out the Kubuntu netbook version
[17:57] <awe> where can we get it?
[17:57] <Riddell> pitti: go for it (although I believe today's daily's have an issue, maybe after alpha better)
[17:57] <davmor2> Riddell: I can test 3g latter tonight
[17:57] <Riddell> davmor2: oh cool
[17:57] <rickspencer3> awe, http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu-netbook/daily-live/
[17:57] <awe> cool
[17:57] <pitti> Riddell: sure, I'll grab alpha-5 then
[17:58] <rickspencer3> hmm
[17:58] <rickspencer3> last thing
[17:58] <rickspencer3> please look at the burndown chart
[17:58] <Riddell> I don't know what state today's kubuntu-netbook daily is in either, testing for alpha is on my todo for this evening
[17:58] <davmor2> knm is still cycling for me on wep but connects fine to everything else
[17:58] <rickspencer3> oh, sorry
[17:58] <pitti> Riddell: oh, does kubuntu netbook have the same NM UI? (i. e. coudl I just test that?)
[17:58] <Riddell> pitti: yes
[17:58]  * pitti is curious and will get that then
[17:59] <asac> pitti: yes. just install the UI and start that.
[17:59] <rickspencer3> moving on?
[17:59] <Riddell> yep
[17:59] <rickspencer3> thanks Riddell
[17:59] <rickspencer3> okay, burndown chart
[17:59] <rickspencer3> as you can see, last week was absolutely epic
[17:59] <pitti> http://piware.de/workitems/desktop/karmic/report.html
[18:00] <rickspencer3> I especially want to call out pitti
[18:00] <rickspencer3> he was the rock that we were using for a foundation last week
[18:00] <rickspencer3> the OLS team, and Dx, as well as the desktop team
[18:00]  * seb128 notice that he can go back to vac ;-)
[18:00] <rickspencer3> hehe
[18:00] <rickspencer3> so next release, no vacations during Feature Freeze week (except for pitti)
[18:00] <rickspencer3> :)
[18:00] <rickspencer3> (just kidding)
[18:01] <pitti> seb128: nooo
[18:01] <seb128> heh, that's that what we learnt there
[18:01] <rickspencer3> asac, could you please check two specs
[18:01] <seb128> what we learn is that other people are just slowing pitti ;-)
[18:01] <rickspencer3> I'm wondering if the browser blueprint is redundant with the Firefox one
[18:01]  * seb128 hugs pitti
[18:01] <pitti> I spent 90% of my work week on sponsoring and MIRs
[18:01] <rickspencer3> or if, the work items may be done
[18:01] <bryce> go piip go
[18:01] <pitti> and the other 90% on some urgent feature stuff :)
[18:01] <rickspencer3> lol
[18:01] <bryce> er, epic spelling fail there
[18:02] <pitti> asac: indeed, your two specs (firefox-3.5 and browsers) seem to have a lot of potential for "DONE", woudl be great if you could update them
[18:03] <rickspencer3> also, could someone follow up with scott richie regarding the wine blueprint?
[18:03] <rickspencer3> it's fine to postpone, etc... but would be nice to know
[18:03] <pitti> rickspencer3: asking him in #u-devel
[18:03] <rickspencer3> pitti, thanks
[18:03] <rickspencer3> any other business?
[18:03] <asac> rickspencer3: the browser one has just a few tasks. one task is redundant with the firefox-3.5 one iirc
[18:04] <asac> rickspencer3: i will go through them again
[18:04] <rickspencer3> asac, as you have time
[18:04] <rickspencer3> say, before next meeting
[18:04] <pitti> asac: thanks; then you can claim that you brought us below the trend line :)
[18:05] <rickspencer3> if there is no other business ... until the Eastern Edition
[18:05] <rickspencer3> :)
[18:05] <pitti> thanks all
[18:06]  * rickspencer3 taps gavel
[18:06] <pitti> 35 minutes, nice
[18:06] <rickspencer3> thanks everyone
[18:06] <asac> thanks
[18:06] <ccheney> thanks
[18:06] <pedro_> thanks
[18:06] <rickspencer3> pitti, that's because bug-zapper is busted :)
[18:06] <seb128> thanks
[18:06] <ArneGoetje> thanks
[18:06] <awe> ciao
[18:06] <pitti> shh, nobody tell rickspencer3 how we broke launchpadlib!
[18:06] <kenvandine> hehe :)
[18:06] <pitti> <jedi wave>There are no bugs
[18:07] <Amaranth> ok, seb128 is marked as reviewer for merge requests on all my branches :)
[18:07] <pitti> at an improbability level of 1000:1 they just seem to be
[18:07] <Amaranth> seb128: blame mvo, he said you should look at them :P
[18:07] <bratsche> kenvandine: Seems to be texture memory running out somehow.. it works fine on my beefy nvidia desktop when using the maximum size.
[18:07] <seb128> Amaranth, thanks, I'm not so sure how this feature work let's see if I get emails
[18:07] <pitti> seb128: for merge requests?
[18:07] <bratsche> kenvandine: I still don't get why it's not working on my Intel laptop though.
[18:07] <Amaranth> seb128: you should, mvo did when I had him as reviewer for a compiz one
[18:07] <Amaranth> otherwise it's just https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~amaranth
[18:07] <pitti> I noticed that LP spectacularly fails to send me the initial merge request by email
[18:08] <pitti> but I get replies just fine
[18:08] <seb128> Ampelbein, I got emails indded
[18:08] <kenvandine> bratsche, that rocking intel hardware i guess
[18:08]  * pitti -> dinner
[18:08] <rickspencer3> kenvandine, bratsche - in terms of follow up
[18:09] <bratsche> kenvandine: I still don't get what the problem is.  It should just be uploading the contents of the window framebuffer to the texture.  So it should be the same size no matter what.
[18:09] <bratsche> Or this is what I would expect...
[18:09] <rickspencer3> I'll check in later today?
[18:09] <bratsche> Sure.
[18:09] <Amaranth> bratsche, kenvandine: afaik with kms/dri2/etc fun there is no limit on texture memory for intel, it just gets it from your system RAM as needed
[18:09] <kenvandine> rickspencer3, please
[18:09] <rickspencer3> bratsche, you're east coast us, right?
[18:09] <bratsche> rickspencer3: Central.. it's 12:10pm here now.
[18:10] <kenvandine> rickspencer3, he is central
[18:10] <rickspencer3> k
[18:10] <bratsche> Amaranth: Any idea why using a larger pixbuf in a GtkImage would prevent this window from being composited?
[18:10] <rickspencer3> ttyl
[18:10] <bratsche> Amaranth: That seems really bizarre to me...
[18:10] <Amaranth> bratsche: unless you go over the max size no
[18:10] <Amaranth> but if you go over the max size DRI will be disabled and such as well
[18:11] <bratsche> Amaranth: Well, the window is the same size no matter what.  It's the size of your display.  And I'm scaling the pixbuf to that size anyway, so wtf.
[18:11] <Amaranth> bratsche: indeed
[18:11] <Amaranth> bratsche: what exactly happens with the larger sizes?
[18:12] <mvo> rugby471: hey, how do you feel about going back to 24px icons for now in the categories view? until humna-icon theme grows other than 24px versions .) ?
[18:12] <bratsche> Amaranth: It displays on the screen, but when I modify the alpha of the window to fade the window out.. it does not appear to fade out.
[18:12] <bratsche> Amaranth: So it seems like the compositor is displeased with this window. :)
[18:12] <Amaranth> hmm, so you did turn on metacity compositing in gdm?
[18:12] <bratsche> No, this is compiz in my user session.
[18:13] <Amaranth> oh
[18:13]  * Amaranth hides
[18:13] <bratsche> We're not doing the fade in the gdm session.
[18:13] <bratsche> HOWEVER... I just forced it to use the largest image file we have on my desktop with an nvidia 9800 or whatever.. and it was just fine.
[18:13] <Amaranth> bratsche: before we start digging into compiz on this one, are you using the 0.8.3 compiz snapshot from the compiz PPA? :)
[18:13] <bratsche> Which is what makes me think maybe it was running out of texture memory somehow.
[18:13] <bratsche> Amaranth: I'm using whatever compiz comes with Karmic.
[18:14]  * bratsche checks
[18:14] <Amaranth> bratsche: alright, can you switch to the PPA? it should be in karmic after alpha 5
[18:14] <bratsche> 0.8.2
[18:14] <bratsche> Okay, let me find it.
[18:14] <Amaranth> deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/compiz/ppa/ubuntu karmic main
[18:14] <rickspencer3> Amaranth, are you sure it's not 0.8.4?
[18:14] <Amaranth> rickspencer3: when it is released it will be 0.8.4
[18:14] <Amaranth> in development it is 0.8.3
[18:15] <rickspencer3> righto
[18:15] <bratsche> Adding that, give me a minute.
[18:15] <Amaranth> we take even/odd to the extreme
[18:19] <bratsche> Restarting...
[18:19] <Amaranth> bratsche: if it still doesn't work you'll have to help me setup a test environment so I can poke at it
[18:19] <Amaranth> my only intel system is only 1280x800 though
[18:20] <bratsche> Okay.
[18:20] <bratsche> You're welcome to pull down the branch if you're interested in taking a look at it.
[18:22] <Amaranth> bratsche: which branch?
[18:22] <bratsche> Let me remove the temporary hack so you can reproduce..
[18:22] <Amaranth> bratsche: also, did you try it with metacity compositing?
[18:22] <bratsche> Nope.  Let me try that.
[18:23] <bratsche> lp:~bratsche/xsplash/new-assets
[18:25] <asac> kenvandine: you run gwibber dailies? could you coordinate with fta who runs gwibber dailies for quite some time? and most likely reuse the ppa used by him?
[18:25] <kenvandine> i have talked to him
[18:25] <asac> when?
[18:25] <kenvandine> mine aren't meant to be permanent
[18:25] <asac> hmm
[18:25] <kenvandine> and not really for others to consume :)
[18:26] <asac> k
[18:26] <asac> thx for clarifying
[18:26] <kenvandine> i am going to whack mine at some point :)
[18:26] <asac> kenvandine: are you at least use the same packging branches?
[18:26] <kenvandine> my builds may very well have random branches merged in... etc
[18:26] <kenvandine> yes
[18:26] <asac> ok
[18:27] <kenvandine> hopefully mine will die when we hit beta
[18:27] <asac> kenvandine: json module is not available in python2.5?
[18:27] <kenvandine> i don't really know... that is a question for ryan
[18:27] <asac> can we please try to not pull in python2.6
[18:27] <kenvandine> ryan would need to port it to 2.5
[18:27] <kenvandine> or someone
[18:27] <asac> ok i will talk to segphault
[18:27] <kenvandine> i could try
[18:27] <kenvandine> please do :)
[18:28] <asac> kenvandine: please do. its good practice to not just rely on modern stuff just because its available ;)
[18:28] <asac> we want backports ... the more software we have backportable the more mature linux desktop becomes imo ... of course not blocking innovation because of that
[18:28] <kenvandine> for ppas perhaps... it isn't in universe for anything older than jaunty
[18:28] <asac> still
[18:29] <kenvandine> asac, yeah... i just didn't lean on ryan about it
[18:29] <asac> yeah. thanks. i will check what is fixable with him then too
[18:29] <asac> or if you talk with him first let me know
[18:29] <kenvandine> will do
[18:30] <kenvandine> i have him on jabber now
[18:30] <kenvandine> will ask
[18:31] <bratsche> Amaranth: The new compiz didn't help.  I'll test out metacity after lunch.
[18:31] <Amaranth> bratsche: alright, I'll do some testing with it after lunch as well
[18:32] <bratsche> Thanks
[18:34] <rugby471> mvo: that's fine
[18:34] <rugby471> mvo: however I have a feeling I won't be able to do much on the software-store front
[18:35] <mvo> rugby471: you did a lot already :)
[18:35] <rugby471> my parents are being ***** - Ubuntu CoC blocker and I had to write up a plan of my computer time >;-(
[18:35] <rugby471> hehe
[18:35] <rugby471> anyway....
[18:35] <mvo> *meh*
[18:35] <mvo> sorry to hear that
[18:36] <mvo> well, thanks a lot for all the effort you put into it already, that was a great help
[18:36] <rugby471> that's okay
[18:36] <rugby471> I suspect they will forget about it in a while anyway :-)
[18:36] <mvo> :)
[18:37] <rugby471> (or maybe i'll have to implant an IRC client in my head...)
[18:38] <kenvandine> asac, he said if it is just a matter of fixing up 2.6 style conditionals he is fine with support intrepid but not hardy
[18:38] <kenvandine> he is also concerned about webkit, gtk and pywebkit
[18:40] <asac> kenvandine: hardy had 2.4?
[18:40] <kenvandine> no idea
[18:40] <kenvandine> but some of the other requirements are in ppas only for hardy
[18:40] <kenvandine> which he isn't comfortable with supporting
[18:41] <kenvandine> he isn't thrilled about supporting 2.5, since he really wants to make the transition to 3.0 smooth
[18:43] <asac> so python isnt differnt from hardy in intrepid
[18:43] <kenvandine> the stuff he mentioned for hardy wasn't python related
[18:43] <asac> if it requires just webkit/pywebkit bump that can be done in hardy ppa
[18:43] <kenvandine> webkit, pywebkit, gtk... etc
[18:43] <asac> unless that requires new gtk
[18:43] <asac> if he needs bleeding edge gtk stuff it feels wrong
[18:44] <asac> webkit/pywebkit is probably right
[18:44] <asac> (so if that needs gtk+ then that too)
[18:44]  * asac checks gtk/etc. version
[18:46] <asac> so webkit 1.0.1 (in intrepid - jaunty) needs gtk 2.10
[18:46] <asac> which is in hardy
[18:47] <asac> so should work to just pump 1.0.1 to hardy ppa at least
[18:47] <asac> let me check about webkit in karmic
[18:47] <asac> control still suggests >= 2.10 ... but you never know ;)
[18:47] <asac> ok thanks.
[18:48] <mpt> mvo, is the WebKit version of the application screen going to be in Karmic?
[18:48] <asac> kenvandine: do you know where the "json" module is shipped that is used by gwibber?
[18:48] <mvo> mpt: yes, I'm working on integrating it into trunk/ - unfortunately it bring a new bunch of problem, but it gives us a lot more flexibility
[18:48] <kenvandine> asac, no
[18:49] <mpt> mvo, neat.
[18:49] <mvo> mpt: have you tried the code from the webkit branch?
[18:49] <mpt> mvo, no, I've just been using the package, but I guess that's frozen for alpha 5
[18:49] <rugby471> mpt: go on ... :-)
[18:53] <mvo> mpt: its not on the cd so it should be ok
[18:54] <mpt> mvo, oh, is it only the CD seed that's frozen?
[18:57] <mvo> mpt: yeah
[19:01] <mvo> mpt: I'm going to need some help with the ccs/html though, my skillz are not that great
[19:01]  * mvo promises to improve
[19:03] <asac> pitti: so latest NM dailies have now new polkit1 stuff and the packges are ready and i tested them. do you want that on alpha5 CDs?
[19:03] <mvo> mpt: my initial goal was to merge/uplaod the webkit branch today, but I will not manage that today :/
[19:03]  * mvo needs to leave
[19:03] <mpt> ok
[19:04] <mvo> I commit more stuff into the webkit branch and continue tomorrow, the html/ccs is all under templates/*.html
[19:04] <mvo> if you are interessted
[19:19] <pitti> asac: right, I saw the polkit branch being merged upstream
[19:19] <pitti> asac: I don't think there's a particular hurry; if you tested them, and it works well, go ahead, but otherwise after a5 should be just fine
[19:22] <asac> pitti: ok. i think we will wait then
[19:24] <pitti> kenvandine: the two items on https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+bugs?field.milestone=12713, are they fixed by the release you are currently preparing?
[19:24] <pitti> kenvandine: their status is still "new"
[19:25] <pitti> seb128: hm, a dist-upgrade wants to remove empathy now
[19:29] <kenvandine> pitti, yes... we are waiting on both of those
[19:34] <seb128> pitti, why?
[19:34] <seb128> pitti, what arch do you use?
[19:34] <pitti> seb128: i386 ATM
[19:34] <seb128> worked fine here on i386
[19:34] <seb128> pitti, hum, weird, can you copy the log somewhere?
[19:36] <pitti> http://paste.ubuntu.com/263339/
[19:37] <pitti> seb128: it's weird, I don't see any Conflicts: on libempathy-common or libempathy-gtk-common
[19:37] <seb128> pitti, urg
[19:37] <pitti> seb128: ah, interesting: http://paste.ubuntu.com/263340/
[19:37] <seb128> pitti, can you try with sudo aptitude dist-upgrade?
[19:38] <pitti> so apt doesn't like to shuffle around so many dependencies
[19:38] <seb128> it seems so
[19:38] <pitti> aptitude figures it out
[19:39]  * pitti tries update-manager
[19:39] <pitti> glib.GError: Duplicate object id 'vbox2' on line 409 (previously on line 311)
[19:39] <pitti> bwah
[19:39] <pitti> update-manager is busted
[19:39] <seb128> pitti, I fixed that yesterday!
[19:39] <pitti> 1:0.124.9ubuntu1 here
[19:39] <seb128> pitti, dpkg -l update-manager?
[19:40] <seb128> hum
[19:40] <pitti> seb128: I see your changelog
[19:40] <pitti> (broken version number, BTW)
[19:40] <seb128> the dist-upgrade question thingy might have a similar issue
[19:40] <pitti> seb128: that was a partial upgrade, though, so perhaps a differnet .ui
[19:41] <seb128> it worked here when I tested
[19:41] <pitti> ok, I think I leave this in place for a bit
[19:41] <seb128> pitti, oh? update-manager-core?
[19:41] <seb128> dpkg -l update-manager-core
[19:42] <seb128> pochu, hey
[19:42] <pitti> seb128: same version
[19:42] <seb128> pitti, ok, let me have a look to that
[19:42] <pochu> seb128: bonsoir :)
[19:42] <seb128> pochu, would you be interested by upgrading the libunique debian version?
[19:43] <seb128> and add the ubuntu change, it('s a one liner in rules
[19:43] <seb128> pochu, congrats for being accepted as dd btw
[19:43] <rugby471> well done
[19:44] <pochu> seb128: thanks :)
[19:45] <pochu> seb128: to 1.1, I guess?
[19:45] <seb128> pochu, 1.1.2
[19:45] <seb128> I don't think it's an unstable version but I'm not sure
[19:45] <pochu> seb128: that's unstable, right? I can upload it to experimental
[19:45] <pochu> let me see
[19:45] <seb128> in any case the ubuntu change is to delete an empty pot would be nice to get in debian so we can sync
[19:45] <pochu> [ANNOUNCE] LibUnique 1.1.2 (unstable)
[19:45] <seb128> ah ok
[19:46] <seb128> thanks for looking ;-)
[19:46] <seb128> so experimental sounds right if you want to do it there
[19:46] <pochu> you may want to make sure there's going to be a stable release for 2.28 ;)
[19:47] <seb128> I don't think GNOME guys would roll unstable version and not stable when required
[19:48] <pochu> yeah
[19:48] <pochu> it was blocking the SINGLE_INCLUDES defines too
[19:48] <rugby471> see ya
[19:49] <seb128> pitti, I'm not in a config to trigger the update-manager bug
[19:49] <seb128> pitti, could you edit /usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/DistUpgrade/DistUpgradeQuirks.py and rename one vbox1 to something else?
[19:49] <seb128> vbox2 rather
[19:50] <seb128> and see if that fixes the issue
[19:50] <seb128> it might have other similar issues
[19:50] <pitti> /usr/share/update-manager/glade/DistUpgrade.ui perhaps?
[19:50] <pitti> the .py file wouldn't have a vbox2 object
[19:51] <seb128> pitti, /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/DistUpgrade/DistUpgradeQuirks.py
[19:51] <seb128> yes sorry
[19:51] <seb128> gra
[19:51] <seb128> pitti, yours is right
[19:52] <seb128> or /usr/share/pyshared/DistUpgrade/DistUpgradeQuirks.py
[19:52] <pitti> /usr/share/update-manager/glade/DistUpgrade.ui
[19:52] <seb128> doh, I've copy issues there
[19:52] <pitti> line 408
[19:52] <seb128> right
[19:52] <pitti> I changed it to vbox17 (first not taken), works now
[19:52] <seb128> ok thanks
[19:52] <pitti> is update-manager in bzr?
[19:52] <seb128> yes
[19:52]  * pitti mutters about not having Vcs-Bzr:
[19:53] <pitti> anyway, update-manager fails the empathy upgrade as well
[19:53] <seb128> lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/update-manager/main/
[19:53] <seb128> I did upload without changing bzr yesterday though
[19:53] <seb128> but I think mvo merged
[19:53] <seb128> I wanted to fix the crash but was not sure if bzr was in an upload state
[20:05] <seb128> Ampelbein, should you include Xlib.h and pkg-config x11 for your changelog?
[20:05] <seb128> change
[20:29] <Laney> seb128: we can either sync the new lib
[20:29] <Laney> or fix the dep
[20:31] <seb128> Laney, want to have a look at fixing the dep now?
[20:31] <seb128> we can look at syncing the lib but not before the alpha image now
[20:31] <Laney> I cant
[20:32] <Laney> just change the dep and fix the flickrnet patch
[20:32] <Laney> thats what is needed, but I can't do it myself
[20:32] <Laney> sorry
[20:33] <seb128> Laney, what sort of change is required for the patch there?
[20:33] <seb128> I can have a look
[20:33] <seb128> would copying the previous version work?
[20:33] <Laney> http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-cli-apps/packages/f-spot.git;a=commitdiff;h=ec3ad97122b4e0d74b312d5b94660439b8e4ff74
[20:33] <seb128> or does upstream require a newer version now?
[20:33] <Laney> revert that one
[20:33] <Laney> that
[20:33] <Laney> they dont use any changed API it seems
[20:33] <seb128> ok thanks
[20:40] <pedro_> asac, could you have a look to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/20090903 later and tell me if everything is ok to you?
[20:46] <bratsche> Amaranth: It works fine in metacity compositing.
[20:46] <Amaranth> bratsche: well that helps somewhat
[20:47] <bratsche> Amaranth: And it works fine on my nvidia desktop with compiz.. so it seems like it might be a texture size limit?
[20:47]  * Amaranth goes back to trying to make it build
[20:47] <Amaranth> bratsche: if that was the case you would not be able to run compiz at all
[20:47] <Amaranth> or DRI, for that matter
[20:47] <bratsche> Why?
[20:48] <Amaranth> bratsche: if you mean size as in dimensions the max size restricts compiz as well
[20:48] <Amaranth> and compiz has to draw things the size of your display resolution
[20:48] <bratsche> Hmm, okay.
[20:49] <kenvandine> pitti, ping
[20:49] <Amaranth> bratsche: I think your xsplash autogen.sh is a bit...screwy
[20:49] <kenvandine> pitti, are you still around?
[20:49] <Amaranth> bratsche: it fails to find libtool.m4 and pkg.m4
[20:49] <bratsche> Amaranth: Oh shit.. mt was saying the same thing earlier.
[20:49] <Amaranth> it also seems to do way too much
[20:49] <bratsche> I kind of lazily copied it from another project.. :/
[20:50]  * Amaranth skips autogen.sh, runs autoreconf -i
[20:50] <Amaranth> that worked :)
[20:50] <Amaranth> bratsche: see what I mean about too much? :)
[20:50]  * bratsche tries
[20:51] <Amaranth> bratsche: so how do I test this thing without installing and logging out?
[20:52] <bratsche> Amaranth: There is a file ./data/xsplash.conf that gets generated and should be installed to /etc/dbus-1/system.d
[20:52] <bratsche> Once that is there you can run:
[20:52] <bratsche> sudo -u gdm ./xsplash
[20:54] <Amaranth> nope, configure sets it up to be run as root by default
[20:54] <bratsche> Oh okay.. then just do sudo ./xsplash
[20:54] <bratsche> Or you can set the user on the configure script.
[20:54] <bratsche> ./configure --with-user=gdm
[20:56] <Amaranth> bratsche: ok with `sudo ./src/xsplash -b images/bg_2560x1600.jpg -l images/logo_xtra_large.png  -t images/throbber_xtra-large.png` I see your bug
[20:57] <bratsche> Amaranth: Turn on metacity compositing for a minute and you can see how it should look.
[20:57] <Amaranth> I do with 1440x900 background too though
[20:57] <bratsche> Yes, I stop seeing the bug with 1280x1024
[20:57] <bratsche> My nvidia desktop never sees the bug with any of these images.
[20:58] <Amaranth> whoa, much different with metacity
[20:58]  * Amaranth goes digging
[21:01] <Amaranth> ok so it's not fade screwing with you...
[21:03] <Amaranth> fun bit I found that is completely unrelated: fading in from 0 to 1 will never work because you don't use the opacity variable in fade_frame_cb
[21:04] <bratsche> Oh, oops.
[21:04] <bratsche> Thanks. :)
[21:05]  * bratsche commits and pushes
[21:05] <seb128> Laney, did you try to build your f-spot update?
[21:05] <Laney> yes
[21:06] <Laney> why what's the problem?
[21:07] <seb128> Laney, debian/f-spot/usr/libexec/gnome-screensaver: no such file or directory
[21:07] <seb128> Laney, the mv in the rules seems to not be required
[21:07] <Laney> huh
[21:08] <Amaranth> "temporary_hack_for_initial_fade" worries me :P
[21:08] <Laney> it really was, that was something i investigated with someone in here
[21:08] <Laney> the screensaver was in the wrong place
[21:08] <bratsche> I should rename it since it seems that it's not going away.
[21:08] <Amaranth> Oh, wait, I'm not supposed to be doing a code review here ;)
[21:08] <bratsche> heh.. no please, you're more than welcome to. :)
[21:08] <seb128> Laney, weird
[21:08] <Amaranth> bratsche: That's your "where did gnome-session go?" timeout, right? For when it fails to notify you the desktop is loaded
[21:09] <bratsche> Amaranth: Yeah, that's the fallback.. if no signals have hit and told it to fade out, it happens here.
[21:09] <bratsche> In master I increased the time to 15s now.
[21:10] <Amaranth> bratsche: A whole animation framework just for the fade in/out is a bit much, no?
[21:11] <bratsche> Amaranth: Fade, and also for drawing the throbber animation.. and possibly other stuff in the future.
[21:11] <seb128> Laney, ah, I see
[21:11] <Laney> maybe I forgot to push my last change or something
[21:11] <bratsche> Amaranth: Karmic+1 will likely have an OS chooser in xsplash, and I've been using this timeline code to write more animated gtk widgets so it will possibly be used here.
[21:12] <Amaranth> ah
[21:12] <seb128> Laney, it uses gnome-screensaver.pc for the location
[21:12] <seb128> Laney, and you don't build-depends on gnome-screensaver
[21:12] <seb128> Laney, but i've it installed there
[21:12] <Laney> oh I didn't know where it came from
[21:12] <Laney> please forward the patch
[21:12] <seb128> "if test "$have_gs_pkgconfig" = "yes" && test "x$gs_pc_prefix" = "x$gnome_screensaver_prefix"; then
[21:12] <seb128> 	GNOME_SCREENSAVER_SAVERDIR=$gs_pc_saverdir
[21:12] <seb128> elif test -d $gnome_screensaver_prefix/lib/gnome-screensaver; then
[21:12] <seb128> 	GNOME_SCREENSAVER_SAVERDIR=$gnome_screensaver_prefix/lib/gnome-screensaver/gnome-screensaver
[21:12] <seb128> else
[21:13] <seb128> 	GNOME_SCREENSAVER_SAVERDIR=$gnome_screensaver_prefix/libexec/gnome-screensaver"
[21:13] <Amaranth> bratsche: I'd say something is wrong with your images
[21:13] <seb128> Laney, well, I'm not sure what to do yet
[21:13] <Amaranth> bratsche: If I tell it to use /usr/share/backgrounds/warty-final-ubuntu.png it works fine
[21:13] <seb128> Laney, your version is correct but should build-conflict on gnome-screensaver
[21:13] <Amaranth> and that's a pretty large image
[21:13] <seb128> Laney, or you should build-depends on gnome-screensaver
[21:14] <bratsche> Amaranth: That's kind of what I thought at first as well, although I'm not sure how to debug it yet.  These images work on the desktop machine though, which is what is confusing me right now.
[21:14] <Laney> seb128: where does gnome-screensaver.pc install it to?
[21:14] <Laney> the correct place?
[21:14] <seb128> Laney, yes
[21:14] <Laney> if so that is obviously a better solution
[21:14] <Laney> patches welcome
[21:15] <seb128> build-depends on gnome-screensaver?
[21:15] <Laney> yeah
[21:15] <Laney> its difficult for me to do anything here
[21:15] <Laney> (remove the mv/rm too)
[21:16] <seb128> Laney, http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=544204
[21:16] <seb128> Laney, I'm sending a comment there about the build-depends
[21:16] <Nafallo> seb128: la soleil or le?
[21:16] <seb128> Nafallo, le
[21:16] <Nafallo> seb128: ta :-)
[21:16]  * Nafallo hugs seb128 
[21:16] <seb128> np
[21:16]  * seb128 hugs Nafallo
[21:16] <Laney> seb128: yeah thats where i saw it first
[21:18] <seb128> Laney, comment sent on the bug now
[21:19] <Laney> thanks
[21:19] <Laney> i might be able to push
[21:19] <Laney> if i can get this vm working
[21:19] <Laney> but 3g is not ideal
[21:21] <Amaranth> hmm, a brand new 2560x1600 jpg image still does it
[21:24] <pitti> good night everyone
[21:24] <seb128> 'night pitti
[21:24] <pitti> I'll do some kubuntu CD testing and then cd ~/bed/
[21:24] <pitti> night seb128
[21:25]  * didrocks is going to bed too, good night pitti and seb128
[21:25] <seb128> 'night didrocks
[21:27] <bratsche> Good night pitti and didrocks
[21:29] <Amaranth> bratsche: why are you redirecting to the composite overlay window?
[21:29] <seb128> asac, there?
[21:30] <seb128> asac,
[21:30] <seb128> $ pkg-config --cflags mozilla-nss
[21:30] <seb128> %FULL_NSS_CFLAGS% -I/usr/include/nspr
[21:30] <seb128> that seems buggy
[21:30] <seb128> known issue?
[21:30] <bratsche> Amaranth: Because xsplash starts before compiz, and then once compiz starts there is this ugly flicker.  This seems to solve it.
[21:30] <Amaranth> bratsche: hrm
[21:30] <asac> seb128: yes.
[21:31] <asac> seb128: which package?
[21:31] <bratsche> Amaranth: I know, it seems a little bit evil.  But I didn't know what else to do.  If you have better suggestions I'm open to them. :)
[21:31] <seb128> asac, that breaks pidgin build do you know if there is any workaround?
[21:31] <asac> usually we dont use mozilla-nss, but nss directly
[21:31] <asac> seb128: pkg-config --cflags nss
[21:32] <asac> let me file a bug
[21:32] <seb128> asac, on pidgin or xulrunner?
[21:32] <seb128> asac, pidgin does test things in order apparently
[21:32] <asac> seb128: hmm
[21:32] <seb128>                 if `$PKG_CONFIG --exists mozilla-nss`; then
[21:32] <seb128>                         PKG_CHECK_MODULES(NSS, mozilla-nss, [
[21:32] <seb128>                 elif `$PKG_CONFIG --exists nss`; then
[21:32] <seb128>                         PKG_CHECK_MODULES(NSS, nss, [
[21:33] <seb128>                 elif `$PKG_CONFIG --exists microb-engine-nss`; then
[21:33] <seb128>                         PKG_CHECK_MODULES(NSS, microb-engine-nss, [
[21:33] <seb128> I guess I can easily switch order
[21:33] <asac> usually such configure scripts provide a --use-nss=... or something. does piding provide that?
[21:33] <seb128> but that's still a bug
[21:33] <asac> sure
[21:33] <asac> seb128: do you depend on xulrunner-dev?
[21:33] <asac> does piding need something else from xulrunner?
[21:34] <seb128> hum no
[21:34] <asac> otherwise it should work if you just build depend on libnss3-dev ... the mozilla-nss thing is shipped by xulrunner
[21:34] <seb128> it build-depends on libnss3-dev
[21:34] <seb128> the build issue is on my box
[21:34] <asac> seb128: do you see that locally?
[21:34] <asac> yeah
[21:34] <seb128> it might build fine on a buildd
[21:34] <asac> yep
[21:34] <seb128> or a clean install config
[21:35] <Amaranth> bratsche: hmm, seems to specifically happen to files over a certain size created by the gimp
[21:35] <Amaranth> if I download a rather large wallpaper or something and have xsplash use it there is no problem
[21:35] <bratsche> Amaranth: I believe mt said he made these in Photoshop.. but maybe I'm wrong.
[21:36] <bratsche> Hmm.
[21:36] <asac> seb128: bug 422829
[21:36] <seb128> asac, thanks
[21:36] <bratsche> Amaranth: This is a really weird bug ;)
[21:36] <Amaranth> indeed
[21:36] <seb128> asac, right using libnss seems to be working
[21:37] <bratsche> gmail is down, everyone prepare for the apocalypse!
[21:38] <asac> too bad ... all my bug mail is gone then :-P
[21:38] <bratsche> hehe
[21:38]  * asac not really sad about that ;)
[21:40] <bratsche> Amaranth: Intel hates GIMP :)
[21:40] <Amaranth> bratsche: it gets even more hilarious
[21:40] <bratsche> Tell me.
[21:40] <Amaranth> bratsche: I added the 2560x1600 image to fspot, told it to desaturate it (so it would modify it) and that version works fine
[21:41] <bratsche> Did you try to desaturate it in GIMP?
[21:43] <Amaranth> bratsche: yeah, it still fails
[21:43] <Amaranth> bratsche: perhaps there is some metadata in the file that screw with it that fspot strips out
[21:43] <Amaranth> I know there is a color profile but that doesn't seem to make a difference
[21:43] <bratsche> Yeah.
[21:43] <bratsche> The same color profile is on the smaller ones as well.
[21:43] <bratsche> Okay, this is interesting.
[21:44] <bratsche> I'll try to find another image editor that is unaware of the metadata.
[21:47] <Amaranth> bratsche: no luck, `jhead -purejpg bg_2560x1600.jpg` stripped all the metadata from the image but it still doesn't fade
[21:47]  * Amaranth wonders wtf is going on
[21:48] <bratsche> I tried storing it as a .bmp as well, and that didn't help.
[21:51] <Amaranth> and doing a "Straighten" in fspot doesn't fix it
[21:51] <Amaranth> so it has to make an actual change to the file for it to work
[21:55] <Amaranth> maybe is has to be a desaturate as well, tweaking the color temp a little in fspot didn't fix it
[21:55]  * Amaranth boggles
[21:56]  * bratsche hates on Intel, just to have someone to hate on
[21:56] <bratsche> :)
[21:58] <pitti> asac: hm, why does n-m icon suddenly look like a pacman ghost?
[21:59] <asac> pitti: i am not using the default theme atm ;) ... i dont see a ghose. let me switch to human
[21:59] <pitti> Riddell: so, my USB 3G stick doesn't really work with KnetworkManager, I'm afraid; it recognized the stick, then asks me for all the data (it doesn't use mobile-broadband-provider-info), I picked that from m-b-p-i's XML file, but it still doesn't connect
[22:00] <pitti> and unhelpfully /var/log/dameon.log seems very quiet unfortunately
[22:00]  * asac confused that there is now human + human-clearlooks + _humanity_ (havent seen that before iirc)
[22:00] <asac> hmm
[22:00] <asac> still the two monitors for me
[22:00] <asac> pitti: wifi/wired or ?
[22:00] <pitti> asac: wired
[22:00] <pitti> ooh
[22:01] <pitti> perhaps that should symbolize an rj45 jack
[22:01] <pitti> but it still looks much more like a pacman ghost
[22:01] <pitti> asac: I get it on a fresh user profile, too, so I'm reasonably sure that it's not just a weird gconf setting of mine
[22:02] <asac> pitti: odd. i dont see it. when did it start? just now?
[22:02] <pitti> and on today's desktop CD
[22:02] <pitti> asac: todayish
[22:02] <seb128> I don't get the issue but I'm on wireless
[22:02] <asac> hmm /me updated this morning
[22:02]  * asac upgrades again
[22:02] <seb128> that's probably an icon theme issue
[22:02] <pitti> I think dholbach sponsored a theme package today
[22:02] <asac> human-icon-theme human-theme
[22:03] <asac> is in the list
[22:03] <asac> so lets see
[22:03] <asac> takes a bit
[22:03] <asac> getting a bunch of daily -dbg packages
[22:04] <asac> ok 8 minutes i guess ... will be back then
[22:04] <pitti> window decoration bars also have a new icon in the top left corner
[22:04] <pitti> I get a round dot instead of the app icon
[22:04]  * asac reconsiders and just installs the theme bits
[22:04] <asac> yeah ;)
[22:04] <asac> i have it
[22:04] <pitti> human-icon-theme (0.34) karmic; urgency=low
[22:04] <pitti>  -- Kenneth Wimer <kwwii@ubuntu.com>  Tue, 01 Sep 2009 06:46:21 +0200
[22:04] <asac> its _HUGE_
[22:04]  * asac takes a screen
[22:04] <pitti> asac: the package, or the icon?
[22:05] <asac> the icon
[22:05] <pitti> I bet it's h-i-t from above
[22:05] <pitti> asac: yes, and scary
[22:05]  * pitti quickly moves to a super-pill and swallows the monster
[22:07] <asac> http://people.canonical.com/~asac/tmp/human_wired_icon_in_panel.png
[22:08] <asac> http://people.canonical.com/~asac/tmp/new_human_network_icons_conneditor.png
[22:08] <asac> mobile broadband is definitly a regression too ;)
[22:08] <asac> wireless?
[22:08] <asac> looks wrong i guess
[22:08] <asac> awe: did we get the new icons for the applet yet=?
[22:09] <awe> no
[22:09] <awe> we may have one slight hitch...
[22:10] <asac> awe: that is?
[22:10] <awe> i think the column in the menu that the lock shows up in, may also have another icon... that looks like two arrow.   eg.  <->
[22:10] <awe> not sure if that's for adhoc or not.
[22:10] <awe> ...but it would predicate us having to do three versions of each signal strength icon
[22:10] <asac> any hints to the code?
[22:10] <asac> awe: no. we overlay it on the fly
[22:11] <asac> or isnt that what you mean?
[22:11] <asac> awe: check how we overlay the vpn lock over the try icon for instance
[22:11] <asac> tray icon
[22:11] <asac> (sorry)
[22:12] <awe> so the new icons we wanted were versions of each signal strength icon, with small lock symbols to the upper left.  if that can be done w/an overlay cool
[22:12] <asac> we only want the icon we want to overlay
[22:12] <awe> but we also know need to consider this <-> icon
[22:12] <asac> the icon should look good for all signal strength
[22:12] <asac> but we only need the lock and whatever icon you discovered ;)
[22:12] <awe> correct
[22:13] <asac> awe: where in the code is that icon?
[22:13] <asac> where on disc is it?
[22:13] <awe> i haven't looked...
[22:13] <awe> lemme check
[22:13] <asac> how did you find out?
[22:13] <asac> ok
[22:13] <awe> i saw it...
[22:13] <awe> displayed next to a network
[22:14] <awe> the only thing i figured it could be, was for adhoc
[22:14] <asac> lets check the code
[22:14] <awe> fyi, i checked out maemo on the 810 recently, and they use locks with one ( WEP ) or two ( WPA ) keyholes.  ;)
[22:14] <asac> maybe there are even more icons used
[22:15] <asac> not sure if that is something we can do on a tiny overlay icon ;)
[22:15] <awe> right, in which case we just replace progress bars with sig str icons
[22:15] <awe> still will look much better IMHOP
[22:15] <asac> i think its ok to use the same. maybe we can make the wep icon silver and the wpa one gold ;)
[22:15] <awe> lol
[22:15] <asac> actually feels like not so bad idea ;)
[22:16] <asac> yes
[22:16] <asac> just do what was planned for now
[22:16] <awe> honestly, i've *never* met anyone who cared...
[22:16] <asac> if we dont get a good lock from design team just use the vpn one for now
[22:16] <asac> the vpn upstream one
[22:17] <asac> do it as a proper upstream patch that ships that icon under a new name
[22:17] <asac> so we can replace it in case we get something better
[22:17] <awe> so what's the current "secure" icon supposed to be anyways?
[22:17] <awe> it looks a bit like a bell
[22:17] <asac> awe: dont ask me. we should just drop it ;)
[22:17] <asac> i think its supposed to be a "thick signal wave" ;)
[22:17] <asac> at least thats how it looks to me
[22:17] <asac> or actually
[22:17] <asac> i think its a shield ;)
[22:18] <asac> the pristine upstream icon looks more like a shield
[22:18] <awe> yea, sure...
[22:18] <asac> than what we have in human (i think)
[22:18] <asac> but maybe we just use upstream everywhere ;)
[22:18] <asac> just remove it
[22:19] <awe> ok.  i'll spend time this evening going over it, and will send you a status email to let you know how things look.  we can ping kwii in the morning too
[22:19] <asac> yes. i think its ok to just send a reminder mail though
[22:20] <asac> he probably has plenty of stuff to do and we have a lock icon we can overlay to begin with
[22:20] <awe> ok.  unless we need the <-> icon too, then we can't use the overlay approach
[22:21] <awe> let me find out what is... i'll spell out the possibilities, and also send kwii an email this evening...
[22:22] <awe> can the libgeoclue MIR wait till tomorrow, or does that need to be done today?
[22:22] <asac> awe: i borwsed through all icons in -gnome package
[22:22] <asac> there is nothing like <->
[22:23] <asac> /usr/share/icons/hicolor/22x22/apps/nm-adhoc.png
[22:23] <asac> thats ad hoc
[22:23] <asac> i think its displayed next to the signal strength, yes.
[22:24] <asac> i think we shouldnt block the implementation on that
[22:25] <awe> do the nm icons vary per theme?
[22:25] <davmor2> asac: you got the back and forward arrows for browsers ;)
[22:26] <asac> awe: i think for now assume that we want to keep displaying the adhoc icon on the left of the signal strength
[22:26] <asac> maybe we will align that next to the name or move to overlay
[22:26] <awe> ok
[22:27] <Amaranth> ok, as of the next upload of compiz it will not let you disable certain plugins considered essential to have a working window manager
[22:27] <awe> asac: did you talk to pitti re: uploading the latest nm snapshots?
[22:27] <asac> davmor2: yeah ... i reduce them to 8px size and then they probably are as comprehensible as we want them
[22:27] <Amaranth> so if you click the wrong thing or something screws up your configuration it won't matter
[22:29] <asac> awe: he would be ok with that. but i thought it would be ok to wait two more days ;)
[22:29] <asac> e.g. he didnt express a special interest to get the polkit1 stuff in on CD
[22:31] <awe> asac: that's probably the best bet.  just wanted to know if I can defer the MIR & modemmanager work till tomorrow.  I'd like to spend some time on the menu
[22:31] <asac> awe: its ok. what work is due on modemmanager?
[22:31] <asac> jsut new snapshot? that certainly can wait a bit
[22:33] <awe> asac: loic wanted us to clean some stuff up in the MIR.  we might also want to bump to the latest snapshot with the other packages ( nm, -applet )
[22:34] <bratsche> Amaranth: How about just compiling those into compiz so they're not even plugins?
[22:36] <Amaranth> bratsche: *cough*
[22:36] <Amaranth> bratsche: Supposedly the C++ rewrite will gain that feature at some point
[22:37] <bratsche> Amaranth: That would be really nice.  I haven't done any profiling to back this up, but I can't imagine that keeping everything pluginified is helping the startup time.
[22:37] <Amaranth> bratsche: Startup time is almost certainly finding the plugins, finding the xml files for the plugins, and parsing the XML files
[22:38] <Amaranth> The XML parser uses DOM
[22:38] <bratsche> Bummer.
[22:39] <bratsche> Still, fewer plugins is less the find and parse right? ;)
[22:45] <Amaranth> bratsche: sure but unless 0.9 is released in time to get through a couple 0.9.x or even an 0.10 release for karmic+1 I'm going to look into protobuf support in compiz for loading plugin metadata
[22:45] <Amaranth> ccsm and the ccp plugin already use it and it helps a lot
[22:45] <bratsche> What is protobuf?
[22:45] <Amaranth> that's another stupid thing, compiz has to load all the metadata for the plugins then ccp (which is itself a plugin) has to read all the metadata for the plugins
[22:46] <Amaranth> bratsche: google format for efficient storage/transmission/parsing of data where XML is used now
[22:46] <bratsche> Oh, cool.
[22:46] <Amaranth> something like binary XML, I guess
[22:46] <bratsche> And what is ccp? :)
[22:46] <Amaranth> more limited though
[22:46] <Amaranth> ccp is the compiz plugin that handles configuration
[22:46] <bratsche> Okay.
[22:46] <Amaranth> compiz loads the ccp plugin, the ccp plugin then tells compiz what other plugins to load and what their settings should be
[22:47] <Amaranth> Compiz Configuration Plugin
[23:08] <statik> hi, we have a merge proposal which fixes two karmic alpha5 blockers: james_w suggested I ping him to have someone look at it when it was ready, but I thought I should mention it here as pitti was also expecting it.  https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-control-tower/ubuntu/karmic/desktopcouch/spb/+merge/11017
[23:19] <statik> kenvandine, rickspencer3: ^ I know you guys were anxiously waiting on that merge proposal also
[23:20] <rickspencer3> statik, thanks
[23:20] <rickspencer3> I'll ping kenvandine
[23:21] <statik> rickspencer3, ok. it just needs a main sponsor to merge to lp:ubuntu/desktopcouch, we changed over to using sourcepackage branches per the nice tutorial from james_w this morning
[23:25] <kenvandine> cool
[23:25] <kenvandine> statik, problem is our team isn't used to using merge proposals yet :)
[23:29] <statik> thats ok, james_w said he would sponsor since he is familiar with merge proposals and spb. just wanted you guys to know it was there and ready. if anything needs to be changed just leave a comment in the merge proposal and chad or I will fix it
[23:30] <statik> kenvandine, i made sure we pulled the last change you had in the old packaging branch including the changelog entry, and updated the Vcs-Bzr headers
[23:30] <kenvandine> ok
[23:30] <statik> and james_w explained how we sync back up if a core-dev ever needs to upload directly without going through a merge proposal
[23:31] <statik> so it all seems relatively sane
[23:57] <TheMuso> Morning robert_ancell, rickspencer3.
[23:57] <robert_ancell> Hey TheMuso
[23:59] <rickspencer3> hi TheMuso and robert_ancell
[23:59] <rickspencer3> I haven't had a chance to update the meeting wiki yet