[07:31] What's the correct way to set up permissions for an apache server on Ubuntu for a PHP app to access and modify files? [08:45] hi guys [08:45] I was wondering if there are any objections to this bug [08:45] https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/387696 [08:45] Ubuntu bug 387696 in hundredpapercuts "Missing thumnails on OpenDocument files - add libgsf-gnome to default install?" [Undecided,Confirmed] [08:46] otherwise I am going to try and get it in the LiveCD [08:46] basically it just needs for libgsf-bin to be installed on the LiveCD [08:46] (all it's dependencies are already installed) [08:46] and we get thumbnails for the opendocument format [09:13] rugby471: Bug 82724 how is the progress? [09:13] Launchpad bug 82724 in hundredpapercuts "Cannot install fonts using method described in help" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/82724 [09:14] mac_v: the bug says it is going to be fixed in gnome 2.28 [09:14] mac_v: so there is no point leaving it in the list of not taken bugs [09:14] rugby471: yeah , that was what i was asking , are you fixing it as its going to be done in gnome 2.28 [09:15] mac_v: no I am not [09:15] hehe got it ;p [09:15] :-) [09:15] sorry if I keep making a nuisance, I shall stop now :-) [09:16] rugby471: no probs , just wanted to confirm no harm done :) [09:16] rugby471: just got too busy with humanity/bugs, wasnt triaging papercuts ;p [09:16] hehe [09:19] rugby471: remind me when mpt pops in :) [09:19] sure [10:02] can you send/ receive files via bluetooth to any device? on 9.10 [10:02] using the gnome-bluetooth which is installed by default out of the box [10:02] \in jaunty it was not possible === asac_ is now known as asac === Daviey_ is now known as Daviey [19:17] hello [19:17] can someone help me with [19:17] x serever [19:17] to start [19:20] dzibo - you want #ubuntu for support [19:20] yes i tried but there are so many people [19:21] i am writing but they are already trying to resolve some other problems [19:21] and they may have no time to answer i dont know [19:21] !topic > dzibo [19:21] dzibo, please see my private message [19:22] dzibo: also #ubuntu-x is for xorg problems [19:22] thanx [21:15] johanbr: hrmm. I wonder if it's just compiled bad on 32-bit then. The installer from java.com doens't work for me either... [21:17] I guess that's possible, but you'd think that would affect more people [21:17] it used to be the other way around, that there were problems with the plugin on 64-bit [21:18] it probably doesn't seem like effects a lot of people, because not many sites use java in the browser any more [21:20] but it sucks that i have to boot into windows to use java in the browser... [21:20] sort of kills the whole cross-platform marketing [22:04] the gtk menu icon dropping change is an upstream thing, right? [22:07] Ng - yes [22:07] cool, I'll stop using gtk.ImageMenuItem() then :) [22:08] noooooo [22:08] Ng: that's not how it works [22:08] Ng - people can still switch them back on ;) [22:08] so you should carry on as normal AFAICT [22:09] upstream is just going through a period of fascist insanity :) [22:09] haha [22:09] dobey - i take it you don't like the decision ;) [22:10] i quite like the icon-less menu's, but icon-less buttons look truly hideous [22:10] chrisccoulson: no i don't like the 'decision' [22:10] which wasn't really a decision so much [22:10] it's like "some apps are broken, so let's just disable icons in all apps by default!" [22:11] hrm, I thought it was a usability driven decision [22:11] it's like using a 3 M-ton nuke to kill a mosquito swarm in the desert [22:11] Ng: no no [22:12] Ng: it was a "a couple artists decided to do it, since the app developers don't listen to them" sort of thing [22:13] hmm [22:13] ohh! great - icon talk, i just have to toss some wood to the fire; why oh why did "we" remove the icons from the gnome-panel menu? [22:14] it's great we're having a guide to help us deciding when to have icons and when to not - but i think that guide has to have a few exceptions [22:14] MDC1: we didn't. upstream did [22:15] what guide are you talking about? [22:16] i think it was mpt "guide" (actuallt a blogpost stating when we should use icons and when not) [22:16] dobey: but still we cant revert it right? its not too difficult a fix [22:16] MDC1 - i think those icons are coming back aren't they? [22:16] there's a bug report on b.g.o somewhere i think [22:16] they are? [22:16] i think so [22:17] can* [22:17] chrisccoulson, the last bug i saw (and commented) was closed as fixed.. let me find it.. [22:17] mac_v: it's a theme thing [22:17] MDC1: blog posts aren't guides. [22:18] dobey, i know - but it seems that it is what people are using as reference.. [22:18] chrisccoulson, http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=322932 [22:18] dobey: no, i meant we could revert this setting > Bug #407621 [22:18] Gnome bug 322932 in Panel "Always show icons on panel menus" [Normal,Resolved: fixed] [22:18] Launchpad bug 407621 in libgnome "(design decision) Icons missing from context menu , dialogue buttons , firefox bookmark favicons" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/407621 [22:19] hmmmmm [22:19] mac_v: it's a gconf key, which gnome-settings-daemon exports as a GtkSetting on the screen. you can change it on a theme-by-theme basis, although I think the gnome-settings-daemon thing overrides it [22:19] dobey, that's another thing - i'm just talking about the gnome "main" menu - it looks really stupid with just some icons and menu items double the height of a normal menu [22:20] vuntz may know if those icons might come back or not [22:20] MDC1: i don't know what you're talking about [22:20] dobey: yeah , i know what it is and can revert it but for a lot it seems like a bug [22:20] all i know is icons are off by default in a lot of places upstream, because of some silly decisions [22:21] +1^ [22:21] mac_v: well yes, it's a rather horrible way to try and fix things [22:21] * dobey would rather people make stuff work first [22:21] dobey, i can understand the decision and mostly respect it BUT not in the case of the gnome panel menu [22:23] chrisccoulson, did you have another bug about the gnome menu icons? [22:23] MDC1 - no, that was the one i was thinking of [22:23] dobey, didn't we try to get people to reduce icon usage for like 5 years straight now, and that approach didn't really work [22:23] chrisccoulson, so we're screwed? [22:23] apparenly this one did, and no bombs in my post box yet! [22:24] MDC1 - i don't know, i'm not really in a position to answer that ;) [22:24] chrisccoulson, who should i ask? [22:24] andreasn: uhm, this didn't fix the problem [22:25] chrisccoulson, http://www.mejlamej.nu/broken.png <-- don't tell me this doesn't look broken?! [22:25] MDC1 - see my earlier comment about who might know about this. he will probably see the scrollback at some point and then you might get an answer^^^ [22:26] chrisccoulson, vuntz? mpt? [22:26] MDC1 - i'm not disagreeing that it looks broken now, and i hope it will change [22:26] andreasn: why not try to reduce the icons in gnome [22:26] MDC1 - yes [22:26] chrisccoulson, great - someone understand me :-) [22:26] hrmm, i would totally paste a link to a clip from The Adventures of Baron Munchausen, which is totally appropriate and describes exactly how this icon 'fix' works, but i can't find the clip on youtube :( [22:26] andreasn: then people will use less [22:27] mac_v: we've done that [22:27] mac_v: and then we just end up with distributors putting more crap in their own themes anyway [22:27] compared to how it was 4 years ago, there are like 300 less icons in there [22:27] i dont think we have done enough [22:28] dobey: i mean reduce this list > http://standards.freedesktop.org/icon-naming-spec/icon-naming-spec-latest.html#guidelines [22:28] mac_v: are you kidding? [22:28] it might also be partly a design philosophy thing, I tend to get the reaction that "the more the merrier" from certain app developers [22:28] if we are not going to show the icons for half of those why have them? [22:28] and well, the opposite isn't better either [22:29] andreasn: yes, well app developers are like kids in a candy store [22:29] andreasn: give them a gumdrop and they want the whole damn store [22:29] andreasn: the current 2.27 is just as bad as having too many icons [22:29] now we don't have enough by default [22:30] * mac_v has no objections to having as many icons as possible ;p [22:32] I like the clean feeling, but I guess I'm kind of crazy when it comes to that :) I tend to prefer minimalistic stuff [22:33] my desktop was clean before [22:33] lol^ [22:33] now it's clean and harder for me to find stuff [22:34] andreasn: if the main goal is to *not* show all the icons in the guidelines? why are they in the guidelines? why not just remove the ones which are decided to not be used? [22:35] its like a strip tease! [22:35] mac_v: what are you talking about? [22:35] dobey: the gconf setting [22:35] no, what guidelines are you talking about? [22:35] http://standards.freedesktop.org/icon-naming-spec/icon-naming-spec-latest.html#guidelines [22:36] you are confused about what that is :) [22:36] hmm... :( [22:36] the idea was bounced around a bit, and mpt suggested it at some point, but we ended up doing it that way [22:36] the icon naming spec does not provide guidelines for the user interface [22:36] mac_v, I guess we could do it for the next release, if someone patches every single application [22:37] sigh [22:37] the patch will be pretty quick, the discussion(s) for including it would go on for maybe 2-3 years [22:37] :) [22:37] ;p [22:37] mac_v, you mean the bug report about the gnome hig addition? [22:38] i didnt understand? which bug? [22:40] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=588668 ? [22:40] Gnome bug 588668 in General "Guideline on appropriate usage of icons in menu" [Normal,Unconfirmed] [22:40] dobey: oh.. that i understood , that those are the guidelines. but what i'm saying is the UI should have been driven to update the list [22:41] mac_v: the problem is that gnome, kde, and xfce all think they need different sets of icons, and need to display them in different ways [22:41] ah! [22:41] mac_v: nobody wants to agree with anyone [22:41] ;) [22:41] mac_v: otherwise we'd have sane HIG that works for all the desktops [22:41] and everything would work nicely together [22:41] but alas [22:41] we are open source, and everyone has to do it their own way, because obviously it's better [22:43] andreasn: oh this bug ... i remember , but nothing seems to have moved forward :( [22:44] * mac_v for now has icons set to TRUE , until a sane decision is made [22:46] why did I ever get involved in this bug? I want to work on bugs that noone cares about :/ [22:47] andreasn: people care about icons. get used to it :) [22:47] maybe I should become a Bar Pianist [22:48] playing the piano to drunk people, I think I would like that [22:50] anyway, it might have been a crazy thing to do, but I kind of like that we do stupid, crazy things sometimes, because the opposite would be really bad [22:50] not doing anything at all [22:50] wouldn't the opposite be doing non-stupid crazy things? :) [22:53] chrisccoulson: hehe we had a mid air collision ;) [22:53] i really wish java worked right on karmic [22:57] andreasn: i'v seen a bar pianist get hit on the head with a bottle ;p [22:57] really? sounds fun :) [22:58] andreasn: he kept planning some song which reminded the guy of an old girlfriend ! [22:58] heh [22:59] but whatever [22:59] later