[06:34] <DKcross> jono, :)
[06:34] <jono> hey DKcross :)
[06:35] <DKcross> hey jono how are you?
[06:37] <jono> DKcross, good thanks, you?
[06:37] <DKcross> good :D
[06:37] <DKcross> testing karmic koala :\
[06:38] <DKcross> are you testing?
[10:12] <indus> hi
[10:12] <indus> need some help
[10:12] <Daviey> indus: what with?
[10:13] <indus> ubuntu membership
[10:13] <indus> i am trying asia oceania region but i dont know how to contact them
[10:13] <indus> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership/RegionalBoards/AsiaOceania
[10:13] <indus> its not updated and dont list contact info
[10:15] <Daviey> indus: they'll be here in 45 mins, if that helps? :)
[10:15] <indus> oh really? super
[10:16] <indus> why here? whats today? some meeting?
[10:16] <Daviey> indus: "The next meeting is scheduled for 08-Sep-2009, 10:00 UTC and will be held in #ubuntu-meeting"
[10:17] <czajkowski> indus: you still lost :)
[10:17] <indus> czajkowski: lol yeah
[10:17] <indus> hello
[10:17] <czajkowski> this going on now for about 2 weeks,
[10:17] <czajkowski> indus: did you contact any of the board members, popey gave you the email address
[10:17] <indus> czajkowski: ya did 1,but no reply
[10:18] <indus> czajkowski: so iam not sure if they will attend the meeting today here
[10:18] <czajkowski> indus: unless the mail is waiting moderation I stil suggest contacting one of the board members and leave them an IRC message or email
[10:19] <indus> leave an irc message hmm how do i do that
[10:19] <czajkowski>  /msg nick bleugh
[10:19] <czajkowski> indus: so find a board member on the list, and find user nick on the lp ac
[10:20] <indus> czajkowski: i think i tried a few,but they dont seem to be in here at some time or other
[10:20] <popey> indus: there is a link on that page which does have contact details
[10:20] <indus> there is a melissa draper
[10:20] <popey> the first link
[10:20] <indus> wait
[10:20] <popey> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-membership-board-asia-oceania
[10:20] <czajkowski> indus: that;s elky
[10:20] <popey> that lists members of the team, which you can also click on
[10:21] <popey> to find their irc nicknames, and potentially their email addresses too
[10:21]  * Daviey notes that "Email: No contact email" should probably be resolved :)
[10:21] <popey> not really
[10:21] <popey> you can click the contact link and it will send to all members of the team
[10:21] <Daviey> rly?
[10:21] <popey> ya rly
[10:22] <Daviey>     Contact this team's owner
[10:22] <Daviey> Owner:
[10:22] <Daviey>     Ubuntu Community Council
[10:22] <popey> hm
[10:22] <popey> thats suboptimal :)
[10:22] <Daviey> exactly :)
[10:22] <indus> team owner is mark shuttleworth so i dont want to disturb him
[10:22] <popey> you dont need to
[10:22] <popey> the members are listed as I said
[10:23] <popey> https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-membership-board-asia-oceania/+members#active
[10:23] <czajkowski> indus: do let us know how you get on, curious after 3 weeks of trying ;)
[10:23] <czajkowski> fair duce to you
[10:24] <popey> and to be fair...
[10:24] <popey> 08:42:29 < indus> guys i need your help
[10:24] <popey> 08:47:22 < hyperair> wrong place. /join #ubuntu
[10:25] <popey> that wasn't exactly helpful
[10:25] <hyperair> hmm?
[10:25] <popey> nvm, the moment has passed
[10:28] <indus> i messaged elky
[10:28] <popey> cool
[10:28] <indus> she is away
[10:28] <indus> i try another maybe
[10:28] <popey> although you could technically talk to any of the membership boards
[10:28] <popey> try me :)
[10:28] <indus> popey: hello ,i need help with membership
[10:28]  * Daviey wonders if this conversation would be better suited elsewhere :)
[10:29] <popey> if it's about asia team scheduling then they're best people to speak to, if it's a general membership question I can probably help
[10:29] <popey> Daviey: hang on
[10:29] <popey> lets find out what the question is first
[10:29] <popey> indus: whats the specific details of your required help
[10:29] <indus> popey: i want to become an ubuntu member
[10:29] <popey> ok, great!
[10:29] <popey> !member
[10:29] <popey> thats a good starting page, have you seen it before?
[10:29] <indus> popey: i followed wiki , and thanks to czajkowski i added all formalities
[10:30] <czajkowski> indus: you've done all the stuff last week we went through right, the coc, lp ac, and wiki. so you're just needed to sign up to a review board
[10:30] <popey> ok, great
[10:30] <popey> so the next step is to choose a board and add your name to their wiki page
[10:30] <popey> then attend their meeting via irc
[10:30] <indus> popey: also did
[10:30] <popey> ok
[10:30] <indus> popey: asia oceania'
[10:30] <popey> so whats the question ? :)
[10:30] <czajkowski> popey: he was trying that, but their pages hasnt been updated to know when the next meeting is on
[10:31] <popey> the page says its in 30 mins
[10:31] <indus> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership/RegionalBoards/AsiaOceania
[10:31] <popey> The next meeting is scheduled for 08-Sep-2009, 10:00 UTC and will be held in #ubuntu-meeting on irc.freenode.net.
[10:31] <popey> its now 09:30 UTC
[10:31] <indus> hmm interesting, it was updated now i believe
[10:31] <indus> few hours before it wasnt
[10:32] <indus> so will meeting be in here then?
[10:32] <czajkowski> indus: so you're set :)
[10:32] <indus> wow cool
[10:32] <popey> it was updated yesterday
[10:32] <popey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership/RegionalBoards/AsiaOceania?action=diff&rev2=170&rev1=169
[10:32] <indus> popey: hmm well, persistence of vision happened to me i think
[10:33] <popey> hehe
[10:33] <popey> it happens
[10:33] <indus> :) ya i was on that page and i kept seeing august 11
[10:33] <popey> I tend to subscribe to pages I am interested in
[10:33] <popey> then I get an email when they get updated
[10:33] <popey> it's a useful feature of the wiki we use
[10:34] <indus> so what do you folks do for work
[10:36] <popey> this isn't really a "chat" channel as such. You might get more/better responses in one of the loco team channels
[10:37] <indus> hmm i thought ill get to know the members
[10:37] <indus> nvm
[10:37] <popey> or indeed #ubuntu-locoteams where pretty much everyone who has spoken in the last hour or so hangs out :)
[10:37] <indus> popey: but meeting will happen here?
[10:37] <popey> yes
[10:51] <indus> who keeps record or minutes of the meeting
[10:52] <czajkowski> indus: the room is logged
[10:52] <czajkowski> hmm dpm may have forgotten to change the topic in here since last week
[11:01] <indus> ok has meeting begun?
[11:01] <indus> its time isnt it
[11:01] <ziroday> indus: not yet, you'll know when its started don't worry
[11:01] <indus> its 10 utc
[11:01] <indus> ok i wait
[11:02] <amachu> persia: elky: lifeless: Hi
[11:03] <indus> aah amachu
[11:07] <indus> probably they are reviewing my membership :)
[11:07] <indus> from wiki i mean
[11:08] <amachu> persia, elky, lifeless: Hello
[11:12] <indus> why does he keep quitting
[11:12] <czajkowski> connection?
[11:13] <indus> let me call him
[11:18] <indus> hi
[11:20] <amachu> indus, Hi
[11:21] <amachu> we need a quorum to continue the meeting
[11:22] <indus> ok
[11:23] <amachu> persia, elky, lifeless: there?
[11:25] <indus> so now what
[11:25] <amachu> indus, We need four of us present to take up membership considerations
[11:28] <amachu> indus, else we have to take it up in next meeting
[11:28] <indus> so why arent anyone here then
[11:29] <indus> shouldnt someone update on the wiki if they are not available
[11:29] <indus> next meeting will be when then amachu
[11:31] <amachu> fourth tuesday
[11:31] <indus> hmm ok but can you be sure there will be at least 4 of you here?
[11:32] <amachu> well, people of the board are from different countries, India, Australia, Japan
[11:32] <indus> amachu also, what do i need to make my membership application stronger?
[11:32] <amachu> and we cover a vast geography..
[11:32] <ziroday> indus: you are aware that if you don't find it convenient to meet with the Asia/Oceania board you are free to request membership from any of the other two boards
[11:33] <indus> ziroday: yes aware
[11:33] <ziroday> indus: :)
[11:33] <indus> ziroday: probably ill be trying that next
[11:33] <amachu> indus, your wiki lack references to your claims
[11:33] <indus> ziroday: just wanted to irritate the asia members first :D
[11:33] <indus> amachu hmm ok
[11:34] <indus> amachu wait
[11:34] <amachu> indus, we would like to see more of your Ubuntu specific contributions than rest
[11:34] <indus> amachu well , all of the workshops we do ,the focus is on ubuntu
[11:34] <amachu> and some testimonials favouring your membership or people present here at the time of meeting to endorse your work
[11:35] <indus> amachu and we distribute cds to all of them, and now, we are supporting mozilla service week with free ubuntu installs
[11:35] <indus> maybe ill add ngoinabox site link to wiki?
[11:35] <amachu> indus, not here, make it in the wiki, and turn back next time..
[11:35] <indus> i was afraid of spam so i didnt
[11:35] <czajkowski> Ngo in a box?
[11:35] <indus> yeah
[11:35] <indus> you know of it?
[11:35] <amachu> we regret for the caused to you, time
[11:36] <czajkowski> indus: pop into -locoteams or -ngo will you, meeting isn't going to take place in here
[11:36] <amachu>  we regret for the inconvenience caused to you, this time
[11:36] <indus> ya ok np
[11:37] <indus> bye folks
[11:37] <indus> amachu thanks
[11:38] <amachu> indus, you are welcome :-)
[13:03] <elky> oh crap, sorry. a friend was flying through and i forgot it was this tuesday :(
[14:00] <lool> Hola
[14:01] <lool> I didnt think Michael was on leave
[14:01] <paulliu> hi
[14:02] <lool> plars, ogra, dyfet: ping
[14:02] <plars> yep, here
[14:02] <ogra> moop
[14:02] <bjf> here
[14:02] <lool> Hey Brad
[14:03] <dyfet> hi
[14:03] <lool> njpatel: Hey!
[14:03] <lool> #startmeeting
[14:03] <MootBot> Meeting started at 08:03. The chair is lool.
[14:03] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[14:03] <njpatel> hey hey
[14:03] <lool> Crap the meeting link is out of date
[14:03] <lool> Imagine https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Meeting/2009/20090908 here
[14:04] <StevenK> four-oh-four
[14:04] <lool> I'll co NCommander's items
[14:04] <lool> StevenK: Hence the need for your imagination   :)
[14:05] <lool> GrueMaster isn't here eithre
[14:05] <lool> dyfet: You had an action to get lxde-meta sponsored
[14:06] <lool> But I understand that's blocked on the FFE?
[14:06] <dyfet> Yes
[14:06] <lool> Ok; that's all we had for last week
[14:06] <lool> Moving to specs review
[14:06] <lool> [topic] specs review
[14:06] <MootBot> New Topic:  specs review
[14:06] <lool> http://piware.de/workitems/mobile/karmic/report.html
[14:06] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://piware.de/workitems/mobile/karmic/report.html
[14:06] <lool> The graph looks better for various reasons
[14:07] <lool> mobile-unr-karmic-applications > needs gruemaster to comment
[14:07] <lool> StevenK: Do you know whether gwibber is going in desktop or not after all?
[14:07] <StevenK> lool: I do not
[14:07] <lool> bjf: mobile-karmic-marvell-desktop > are you aware of any work with respect to CONFIG_s which is still pending?
[14:08] <lool> bjf: or are there any reported issues with the dove kernel in karmic?
[14:08] <lool> ogra: Only an oem-config item remaining for this spec to be completed for karmic: mobile-arm-karmic-offline-installer-gui
[14:08] <bjf> lol, no issues that I'm aware of, continue to look at CONFIG_s but at this point we are probably good
[14:08] <ogra> yep
[14:08] <lool> ogra: Could you get to that today so that we can mark it implemented?
[14:08] <ogra> no
[14:08] <bjf> lool, **
[14:08] <lool> bjf: excellent thanks
[14:09] <lool> bjf: Yeah it wasnt very funny so I figured it was for me
[14:09] <ogra> i need a lot of test builds for that, its very time consuming
[14:09] <lool> mobile-karmic-armel-toolchain > looking good; no big regressions except oo.o
[14:09] <bjf> lool, 6am here, just woke up, can't type yet
[14:09] <lool> ogra, dyfet: Did you notice any other regression in the ftbfs lists?
[14:09]  * ogra ponders to defer the oem-config stuff in favor of qemu-arm-static
[14:09] <lool> Or is oo.o the only package hit by the toolchain changes?
[14:10] <ogra> eigen seems to have probs
[14:10] <lool> ogra: new problems?
[14:10] <ogra> not sure thats toolchain though
[14:10] <ogra> nope
[14:10] <lool> ok
[14:10] <lool> StevenK: You were testing wubi with UNR but that failed
[14:10] <lool> StevenK: Did that get fixed?
[14:10] <ogra> eglibc ftbfs but doko preferred to care for that
[14:10] <ogra> and gst-pliguns-good
[14:10] <lool> Actually doko sent a list of work items on glibc
[14:10] <dyfet> no either....
[14:11] <ogra> *plugins
[14:11] <lool> I'm happy to share it if some people have time to take care of some of them
[14:11] <StevenK> lool: Not as I'm aware, I'll talk to evand about it
[14:11] <lool> StevenK: Do we have a bug for the unr wubi issue?
[14:12] <StevenK> lool: No, I don't think so
[14:12] <lool> moblin remix > I just updated status, we asked for a FFE to allow merges into karmic
[14:13] <lool> StevenK: Could you please file one asap?
[14:13] <lool> lsb-compliance > seems to lack A5 update; need gruemaster to clarify
[14:13] <lool> unr-translations > I've sent merge requests for all translated modules
[14:14] <lool> plars: mobile-unr-karmic-compliance-autotesting > on track for A6?
[14:14] <plars> lool: yes
[14:14] <plars> just adding tests at this point
[14:15] <lool> plars: There were some chats about updating test plans and getting coverage reports on execution of test cases for Ubuntu alphas; are the UNR and ARM testcases/test plans on http://testcases.qa.ubuntu.com/ already?
[14:15] <lool> this was between mdz and qa + release teams IIRC
[14:15] <ogra> plars, since you do a lot of checkbox stuff, did you ever test checkbox on babbage or dove ?
[14:15] <plars> lool: I was unaware of that... testplans are on testcases.qa, individual tests are mostly going into checkbox
[14:16] <lool> plars: Ok
[14:16] <plars> ogra: yes, I do use checkbox on armel as well
[14:16] <ogra> intresting, how does it work ?
[14:16] <lool> plars: I think we want the test plans to be in very good shape for next alpha
[14:16] <plars> except for some things
[14:16] <plars> i.e. boot loader test, etc... obvious stuff
[14:16] <ogra> given neither dove nor imx51 expose a pci bus
[14:16] <lool> Cause it's going to be a big focus that we actually test each test case in full
[14:16] <ogra> so i guess it wont find much HW
[14:17] <lool> mobile-karmic-arm-cloud-builds > no progress, i suck  :-(
[14:17] <plars> ogra: right, it would just miss some things like that in the report
[14:17] <ogra> smoe things ? :)
[14:17] <plars> pci
[14:17] <ogra> like all hardware ? :)
[14:17] <plars> usb should work
[14:17] <ogra> right
[14:17] <plars> disks, etc
[14:18] <lool> Any other questions for spec review?
[14:18] <lool> [topic] UNR status
[14:18] <MootBot> New Topic:  UNR status
[14:19] <lool> StevenK: I think we're pretty much up to date with seeds
[14:19] <StevenK> Indeed
[14:19] <lool> I just checked and didn't see any functional change since evo-couch
[14:19] <lool> StevenK: I think you can readd some langpacks just like the desktop team did
[14:19] <lool> we're at 680M
[14:19] <lool> Hmm actually is 712730624 oversize?
[14:20] <lool> njpatel: So 5 new tarballs released today IIUC
[14:20] <lool> StevenK said he will pick them up
[14:20]  * ogra wonders if we should bump armel to 1G ... we're still using .img there and thats unlikely to change any time soon
[14:20] <njpatel> lool: yep, definitely by EOD
[14:20] <ogra> so we could ship an extra ton of langs
[14:20] <njpatel> lool: will mail you, steve and ubuntu-mobile as per usual
[14:20] <lool> We want translations if possible since otherwise you'll have to reroll tarballs == pain
[14:20] <lool> njpatel: Ok cool
[14:21] <lool> ogra: Not sure, 700 M might be the actual limit
[14:21] <ogra> not for .img
[14:21] <lool> StevenK: Could you please check that and perhaps add langpacks
[14:21] <ogra> i changed that weeks ago
[14:21] <lool> ogra: oh for ARM, sure
[14:21] <ogra> .img files are 1G
[14:21] <lool> feel free
[14:21] <ogra> will need some seed fiddling
[14:21] <lool> I was discusing *UNR* status which is why I was confused
[14:21] <StevenK> lool: I'll check tomorrow
[14:22] <lool> StevenK: k thanks
[14:22] <lool> Any other business related to UNR?
[14:22] <lool> [topic] Ubuntu Moblin Remix
[14:22] <MootBot> New Topic:  Ubuntu Moblin Remix
[14:22] <lool> (feel free to bring up anything I forget to cover and I'll reschedule it)
[14:22] <lool> bfiller: Hey
[14:22] <lool> bfiller: thanks for joining
[14:22] <paulliu> OK. Today empathy update breaks the build and gnome-menu updates breaks moblin-menu
[14:22] <lool> So with paulliu we had a plan to move stuff to karmic
[14:22] <lool> But still waiting on FFE  :-(
[14:22] <paulliu> I'll fix it tomorrow. Or the day after tomorrow. I have a session on FAE sprint tomorrow.
[14:23] <bfiller> lool: what is FFE?
[14:23] <lool> I'll poke motu-release at weekly release meeting if we dont get the FFE before that
[14:23] <paulliu> Feature freeze Execption
[14:23] <lool> bfiller: feature freeze exception
[14:23] <bfiller> lool: thanks
[14:23] <lool> for the addition of the moblin packages to karmic
[14:23] <lool> bfiller: I think you wanted me to make the OEM moblin PPA public
[14:23] <paulliu> For packages that cannot uploaded, I'll compile a list of patches and see which patches is *good* to go into karmic packages.
[14:23] <lool> bfiller: But as I wrote in my mail, paulliu told me it had some non-distributable bits
[14:23] <lool> like flash and what not
[14:24] <bfiller> lool: flash is ok to be in public ppa, just can't be in the ubuntu repos because it's not open source
[14:24] <lool> paulliu: Ok; I think we want some wiki page like the one for new packages
[14:24] <lool> paulliu: With a list of patches added to each packages and a comment on go/no-go
[14:24] <paulliu> lool: Yes, I'll write it in the same page.
[14:24] <bfiller> lool, paulliu : was there anything else in the private ppa that worried you?
[14:24] <lool> bfiller: Aha
[14:24] <lool> bfiller: I think paulliu also mentionned non-free drivers
[14:25] <paulliu> bfiller: broadcom drivers? Is it ok to open it?
[14:25] <StevenK> lool: WRT Wubi bug, bug #426238 (already filed)
[14:25] <lool> StevenK: thanks
[14:25] <paulliu> bfiller: I didn't find it in our kernel. Maybe we should send it to kernel team?
[14:25] <bfiller> lool: right, bcmwl-kernel-source is what we are using and it's ok, it's in ubuntu, I'll remoe the the other broadcom package as no longer using it
[14:26] <bfiller> paulliu: it's in restricted: http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?suite=default&section=all&arch=any&searchon=names&keywords=bcmwl-kernel-source\
[14:26] <paulliu> bfiller: ok. Thanks.
[14:26] <lool> [action] bfiller to remove bcmwl-kernel-source and give a quick check over the private PPA's contents
[14:26] <MootBot> ACTION received:  bfiller to remove bcmwl-kernel-source and give a quick check over the private PPA's contents
[14:26] <bfiller> paulliu: oops, ignore trailing slahs
[14:26] <bfiller> slash
[14:26] <lool> [action] lool to switch moblin p3a to public
[14:26] <MootBot> ACTION received:  lool to switch moblin p3a to public
[14:27] <lool> bfiller: We wanted you to check whether we could use the OEM tracker to compare PPA with karmic
[14:27] <lool> bfiller: Does it turn out to be possible?
[14:27] <bfiller> lool: the package for me to release is broadcom-wl, that is unused, bcmwl-kernel-sources will stay
[14:27] <bfiller> lool: sorry, meant to remove
[14:27] <lool> ok; cant edit the action but you'll know what to do :)
[14:27] <bfiller> lool: I haven't check with Cody yet, will do this today
[14:27] <lool> bfiller: Can you please ping me when PPA is ok to be made public?
[14:27] <bfiller> lool: sure
[14:27] <lool> bfiller: Ok; carrying over
[14:28] <lool> Any other business with Moblin?
[14:28] <lool> bfiller: Anybody else should be added to ~ubuntu-moblin?
[14:29] <bfiller> lool: just fyi - the guys from Intel who have been working with OEM group are testing out u-m-r for karmic
[14:29] <lool> bfiller: Any comments so far?
[14:29] <bfiller> lool: I asked them to file bugs in the ~ubuntu-moblin project with issues they find
[14:29] <lool> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-moblin/+members
[14:29] <bfiller> lool: do you have to be a member to file bug? I don't believe you do but wanted to check
[14:29] <lool> bfiller: (Project is ubuntu-moblin-remix I think)  thanks!
[14:29] <lool> bfiller: you dont
[14:30] <lool> bfiller: you're typically a member if you're interested in tracking bugs in UMR
[14:30] <bfiller> lool: ok, no comments yet but expect some soon, they are very intersted in moblin compliance
[14:30] <lool> that is, you'll receive bug mail for important moblin bugs
[14:30] <lool> bfiller: We didnt do any effort in testing it yet but I guess we could ask Tobin to look into it
[14:30] <bfiller> lool: haven't tried umr yet, does it boot into moblin ui yet?
[14:31] <lool> Yes
[14:31] <bfiller> lool: cool
[14:31] <lool> Since 8 days or so
[14:31] <bfiller> that's great, I will try it today
[14:31] <lool> bfiller: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-moblin-remix/daily-live/current/ as usual
[14:31] <lool> bfiller, paulliu: thanks
[14:31] <lool> [topic] review of >= high bugs
[14:31] <MootBot> New Topic:  review of >= high bugs
[14:31] <lool> canonical-mobile > none
[14:31] <lool> [link] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+bugs?field.subscriber=ubuntu-armel
[14:32] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+bugs?field.subscriber=ubuntu-armel
[14:32] <lool> ooo > ccheney asked upstream for help and will look into it since he didn't get any reply
[14:32] <lool> I suggested using porter box and plars has setup remote access
[14:32] <plars> yep, ready if/when he wants to use it
[14:32] <lool> 422101 initramfs-tools > ogra?  It seems your initial debug was incomplete says the bgu?
[14:32] <plars> probably a pretty slow option though
[14:33] <lool> plars: I did setup my b2.5 for remote access now though, even if slow
[14:33] <ogra> lool, yes, i will take care for it this week
[14:33] <lool> 359049 udeb kernel filenames > I raised this for kernel sprint
[14:33] <lool> bjf: This is for you and/or amitk to fix during sprint or earlier, but really easy
[14:33] <lool> 391588 banshee > dyfet/ogra?
[14:34] <ogra> dyfet ?
[14:34] <bjf> lool, ack
[14:34] <lool> 420447 sound on babbage > also kernel sprint
[14:34] <lool> 423767 enable rt3070sta driver > in progress
[14:34] <ogra> unusable it seems
[14:35] <lool> 424400 mac address of usb nics > not reproducible; needs gruemaster to sort out
[14:35] <dyfet> I dont have an update other than I was having trouble with debugging the native parts of mono and have yet to see the original issue reported, I hope to have something new on this though when I can test it in a live desktop rather than a xnest, though
[14:35] <lool> dyfet: You dont have a native desktop yet?
[14:35] <lool> I thought dove was working
[14:35] <ogra> lool, i still suspect gruemasters strange USB KVM to be interfering here
[14:35] <lool> And you have b2.5 too?
[14:36] <dyfet> lool: I have the dove working with the live usb filesystem Friday, I havent setup an install yet
[14:36] <lool> dyfet: And what about your 2.5?
[14:36] <dyfet> 2.5 I have no video
[14:36] <lool> ogra and I have video; you dont have any other screen to use with it?
[14:36] <lool> You tried other res?
[14:37] <dyfet> yes, I have, ogra said there was no analog signal for the dvi-vga adaptor
[14:37] <lool> You dont have a DVI screen?
[14:37] <lool> I mean digital?
[14:37] <ogra> at least with my DVI->VGA cable i get nothing out of the thing
[14:37] <lool> I wonder how much it would cost to fix that
[14:38] <ogra> a cheapo DVI display shouldnt be to hard to expense i bet :)
[14:38] <plars> right, I had to get a new monitor
[14:38] <dyfet> I can get a dvi monitor today, but since dove is working, I was going to shift to that
[14:38] <lool> dyfet: Can you please send me a quote for a basic DVI D screen in the US?  I'll see if davidm can allow the expense
[14:38] <lool> dyfet: Well you need to do 2.5 testing too
[14:38] <ogra> dove is very powerfull
[14:38] <dyfet> true
[14:38] <ogra> you likely dont want to do daily test installs on it
[14:39] <ogra> but keep a persistent dev env on it
[14:39] <lool> dyfet: Can you please raise blocking issue like this one to me?  We're really short of babbage hardware so any person with a board which doesn't do graphics testing is a pain
[14:39] <dyfet> lool: sorry...okay
[14:39] <lool> dyfet: Please send me an email with a quote and we'll try to sort it out ASAP
[14:39] <plars> lool: hard to find cheap/small ones anymore, I got one off craigslist
[14:39] <lool> dyfet: thanks
[14:40] <lool> bestbuy has a 129 USD one
[14:40] <lool> 20"
[14:40] <lool> I think that's not too bad
[14:40] <lool> It's like a SATA disk
[14:40] <lool> anyway
[14:41] <lool> 383240 ffmpeg neon opts > my bad, will get to it this week
[14:41] <bjf> lool, dell outlet hase refurbished 17 inch for $89.00
[14:41] <ogra> DVI capable ?
[14:41] <ogra> thats cheap
[14:41]  * plars got a 22" for $75
[14:41] <lool> 385325 thunderbird/jaunty > poked asac and we researched the upstream moz bug; dunno if it's still on track but not critical
[14:41] <plars> dvi and vga connector, no hdmi though
[14:41] <lool> 420555 mxcfb crash > also scheduled for kernel sprint
[14:41] <ogra> not as critical as it seems though
[14:41] <lool> Any other armel bugs / stuff to cover?
[14:41] <ogra> workaround in place
[14:42] <lool> ~ubuntu-unr > no milestoned bugs
[14:43] <ogra> pfft
[14:43] <lool> plars: I find that suspicious ^  :)
[14:43] <bjf> lool, ogra, dyfet, http://www.dell.com/us/en/dfh/monitor/monitor-dell-e1909wfp/pd.aspx?refid=monitor-dell-e1909wfp&s=dfh&cs=22
[14:43] <plars> lool: was from craigslist, so it was not new
[14:43] <lool> plars, njpatel: I dont want mdz raising critical bugs not on our radar next release meeting  ;-)
[14:43] <bjf> lool, ogra, dyfet, that's $119
[14:43] <dyfet> okay :)
[14:43] <lool> plars: I mean the list of bugs
[14:43] <ogra> bjf, perfect i think
[14:44] <plars> lool: will spend some extra time reviewing this week
[14:44] <lool> plars: Ok thanks
[14:44] <lool> plars: I did some armel triage this morning so we'll be even   :-P
[14:44] <lool> [link] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+bugs?field.subscriber=ubuntu-moblin
[14:44] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+bugs?field.subscriber=ubuntu-moblin
[14:44] <lool> only the ffe
[14:45] <lool> No other moblin / unr bugs to discuss?
[14:45] <lool> ian_brasil: Are you with us?  :)
[14:45] <ogra> not 100% related, but what happened to the lubuntu FFE discussion
[14:45] <ogra> dyfet, ^^^
[14:45] <ogra> i get you guys had a meeting on sun.
[14:45] <dyfet> Well, there was concerns raised about how the team maintains the seed
[14:45] <lool> ogra: I mentionned it during specs review but it might be good to track it in karmic + sub canonical-mobile
[14:46] <ogra> dyfet, what was the outvome of the meeting
[14:46] <dyfet> And the team did not want to change to existing release policies until everyone votes on it over the week
[14:46] <ogra> i know whats written in the bug :P
[14:46] <lool> dyfet: Is there a clear leadership subset of lxde developers in launchpad/ubuntu?
[14:46] <dyfet> Yes
[14:46] <lool> dyfet: Oh so a vote is in progress to sort that out?
[14:46] <dyfet> Yes
[14:46] <lool> Did it happen yet?
[14:46] <ogra> it starts getting urgent slowly ...
[14:46] <dyfet> lool, they want it to happen over the next 5 days
[14:46] <ogra> FF was long agfo
[14:46] <ogra> *ago
[14:47] <dyfet> yea...
[14:47] <lool> dyfet: Could you track the bug for karmic + sub canonical-mobile so that it shows in our weekly reviews?
[14:47] <dyfet> okay
[14:47] <lool> Any other mobile bugs to discuss?
[14:47] <lool> armel unr moblin
[14:48] <lool> [topic]     * Ubuntu MID - current status (Ian)
[14:48] <MootBot> New Topic:      * Ubuntu MID - current status (Ian)
[14:48] <lool> ian_brasil: Hola
[14:48] <ogra> there is activity in MID ?
[14:48] <ogra> wow
[14:48] <lool> Current status of Ubuntu MID from my end: image is disabled since a long time, I dropped the image from trackers because it was raising red flags without any active maintenance on it
[14:49] <ogra> yeah
[14:49] <lool> At some point there was chat to move it into Mer's hands but that didn't really happen for unclear reasons
[14:49] <ogra> and i havent heard from YoKoZar
[14:49] <lool> If there's desire to revive it I'm happy to help getting things on track
[14:49] <ogra> persia, do you know anything by chance ?
[14:49] <lool> We dont have time to do actual development of a hildon based spin right now, but we can certainly help with integration/cdimage etc.
[14:49] <ogra> well, people still ask in -mobile from time to time
[14:50] <lool> Yes
[14:50] <ogra> would be good to have an answer
[14:50] <ogra> more than "we dont know"
[14:50] <lool> So that's all I know of MID; I'm not devoting any time to it unless someone needs help with getting it in shape
[14:50] <ogra> and given there was a community team that wanted to take it over, a clear statement would be nice
[14:50] <lool> ian_brasil: Feel free to reschedule if you wanted to clarify stuff about MID
[14:51] <lool> Ok folks, any other business?
[14:51] <lool> We have to find something to say in these 9 minutes
[14:52] <lool> Alpha 6 in 10 days
[14:52] <ogra> lalalala
[14:52] <lool> Thanks all!
[14:52] <lool> #endmeeting
[14:52] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 08:52.
[14:52] <ogra> doobedoobedoo
[14:52] <ogra> thanks
[14:52] <paulliu> Thanks.
[14:52] <paulliu> What does "co" mean?
[14:52] <ogra> carry over
[14:52] <ogra> into next week
[14:53] <ogra> or next $timeframe_of_work
[14:53] <paulliu> ogra: I see. Thanks..:)
[14:59] <mdz> #startmeeting
[14:59] <MootBot> Meeting started at 08:59. The chair is mdz.
[14:59] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[14:59] <mdz> technical board meeting (regardless of what /topic says)
[14:59] <Keybuk> hullo!
[15:00] <kees> good morning :)
[15:00] <mdz> cjwatson, pitti, ping
[15:00] <pitti> hello all
[15:01] <mdz> [TOPIC] Review actions from 2009-08-25
[15:01] <MootBot> New Topic:  Review actions from 2009-08-25
[15:01] <mdz> [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TeamReports/August2009#Technical Board
[15:01] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TeamReports/August2009#Technical Board
[15:02] <cjwatson> hi
[15:02] <mdz> cjwatson was to set up a couple of ACLs, which I believe he did
[15:02] <cjwatson> yep,
[15:02] <mdz> cjwatson, update on Debian technical committee?
[15:03] <cjwatson> Bdale said:
[15:03] <cjwatson> "I was sort of waiting to see if anyone else on the committee jumped in.
[15:03] <cjwatson> Since they haven't, sign me up, and I'll personally make time at least
[15:03] <cjwatson> long enough to help define what the role of a Debian representative
[15:03] <cjwatson> should be and see how this works out...
[15:03] <cjwatson> "
[15:03] <cjwatson> ... so argh, we should reply
[15:03] <cjwatson> sorry, I know this was on me but I haven't done it
[15:03] <mdz> cjwatson, should we subscribe him to the list?
[15:03] <mdz> or just invite him to the meetings?
[15:04] <pitti> sorry for my ignorance, what was this about?
[15:04] <cjwatson> let's do both
[15:04] <mdz> [topic] Debian technical committee participation in techboard
[15:04] <cjwatson> pitti: we agreed to invite a member of the Debian Technical Committee to sit on the TB
[15:04] <MootBot> New Topic:  Debian technical committee participation in techboard
[15:04] <mdz> [action] cjwatson to respond to Bdale, make arrangements for him to participate
[15:04] <MootBot> ACTION received:  cjwatson to respond to Bdale, make arrangements for him to participate
[15:05] <kees> (pitti: ah, the URL mdz gave is sorted by newest-last... just found the Action list they're working from now ...)
[15:05] <mdz> [topic] Java SRU policy
[15:05] <MootBot> New Topic:  Java SRU policy
[15:05] <mdz> [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#sun-java*
[15:05] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#sun-java*
[15:06] <mdz> this has been discussed on the mailing list a fair amount
[15:06] <mdz> and revised
[15:06] <kees> since I was involved in this pre-TB, what's the best way to involve myself in this discussion?  I have a somewhat biased opinion on it...
[15:06] <mdz> kees, you can abstain from the vote if you think it's appropriate
[15:06] <cjwatson> surely we can apply some useful testing in addition to just "it's a new microrelease"?
[15:06] <mdz> but you should still speak up about it
[15:07] <cjwatson> at least validation
[15:07] <kees> mdz: ok
[15:07] <cjwatson> I agree that it doesn't make sense to apply the full rigor
[15:07] <pitti> doko said that there is a test suite (the Java Certification Kit thingy), but it's not public
[15:07] <cjwatson> oh, I think that implicitly applies to that whole section actually
[15:07] <cjwatson> pitti: yeah, it also takes man-days just to run it, it's a bit much
[15:08] <mdz> I think it wouldn't hurt to make it explicit
[15:08] <cjwatson> given that those weren't certified beforehand on Ubuntu anyway
[15:08] <pitti> right, and nobody really knows how to do or where to get it :/
[15:08] <cjwatson> we have it for openjdk
[15:08] <cjwatson> but you can't get hold of it without a complicated process
[15:08] <pitti> this basically sounds like a "take it or leave it" thing to me
[15:08] <mdz> pitti, Canonical does have it and we've certified using it
[15:08] <cjwatson> pitti: I agree, I just want to make sure we don't break the world by accident during an updatee
[15:08] <cjwatson> -e
[15:08] <kees> yeah, we can't really "reject" the new versions -- they are what they are, as provided by Sun
[15:09] <cjwatson> right, but, for example, it's possible that new versions might need packaging tweaks that we miss
[15:09] <kees> sure, smoke-testing is appropriate
[15:09] <pitti> this is also why I really wouldn't like to see this being extended to intrepid/jaunty, just hardy
[15:09] <cjwatson> yes, I agree
[15:09] <pitti> in the last SRU, we had three or four people testing the update with some programs, the browser plugin, etc., and vouch that they work
[15:09]  * kees puts on security-team hat
[15:09] <pitti> but that can hardly cover the entire API, of course
[15:10] <kees> a lot of people complain about the lagging sun-java* packages, even in intrepid/jaunty
[15:10] <pitti> kees: but jaunty has openjdk?
[15:10] <kees> since these packages are in non-LTS, I think we need to support them there.
[15:10] <mdz> I think that's probably sufficient, given that we can presume the base JDK has been through the JCK test within Sun already
[15:10] <kees> pitti: agreed, which is why I want to see sun-java* removed entirely from the archive for karmic
[15:10] <mdz> we just need to know that the packaging hasn't horribly broken it
[15:10] <pitti> kees: +1
[15:10] <pitti> mdz: that should be covered by the basic usage testing, though
[15:11] <mdz> kees, I'm pretty sure we agreed that was OK to remove, is there anything blocking it?
[15:11] <pitti> I never let anything to -updates without at least someone saying "it still by and large works"
[15:11] <mdz> pitti, yes, I'm agreeing
[15:11] <kees> mdz: not sure, I saw sun-java5 vanish, but not sun-java6
[15:11] <mdz> so we can add a blurb which explains the testing methodology which will be applied, based on what has been done for previous SRUs
[15:11] <mdz> kees, it won't go away on its own ;-)
[15:12] <kees> mdz: sure, but I think it was this meeting that was going to kick sun-java6 out officially.  sun-java5 was removed because support for it is ending.  a different reasoning.
[15:12] <mdz> kees, please add that to the agenda directly after this so we don't forget it
[15:12] <cjwatson> checkrdepends shows some dependencies on sun-java6, but I think that those are mostly non-default alternative dependencies; I need a slightly smarter script to be able to tell me that
[15:13] <mdz> are there any other questions on the java SRU policy other than the testing issue, which I tihnk we've resolved?
[15:13] <mdz> I'd like to put it to a vote
[15:13] <pitti> if cjwatson: heh, currently running that, too; yes, the samples I did just have alternative dependencies
[15:13] <kees> mdz: added
[15:13] <mdz> ok
[15:13] <pitti> some are wrong, like "Depends: sun-java6-jre | java1-runtime | java2-runtime"
[15:13] <pitti> but not wrong enough to break
[15:14] <mdz> [vote] proposed Java SRU policy at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#sun-java* as amended for appropriate smoke testing by pitti/kees
[15:14] <MootBot> Please vote on:  proposed Java SRU policy at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#sun-java* as amended for appropriate smoke testing by pitti/kees.
[15:14] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[15:14] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[15:14] <cjwatson> confirmed, I only see alternative deps
[15:14] <cjwatson> +1
[15:14] <MootBot> +1 received from cjwatson. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[15:14]  * jdstrand is catching up
[15:14] <pitti> +1
[15:14] <MootBot> +1 received from pitti. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[15:14] <kees> +0 (I'll abstain since this involves me rather directly)
[15:14] <MootBot> Abstention received from kees. 2 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 2
[15:15] <mdz> MootBot, poke
[15:15] <mdz> argh, I'm lagging
[15:15] <mdz> +1
[15:15] <MootBot> +1 received from mdz. 3 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 3
[15:15] <mdz> Keybuk, ?
[15:15] <Keybuk> +0
[15:15] <MootBot> Abstention received from Keybuk. 3 for, 0 against. 2 have abstained. Count is now 3
[15:15] <mdz> #endvote
[15:15] <Keybuk> abstaining, since I have no real clue of the technical implications
[15:16] <mdz> or is it
[15:16] <mdz> [endvote]
[15:16] <MootBot> Final result is 3 for, 0 against. 2 abstained. Total: 3
[15:16] <pitti> I'll take the action of changing the page, and amend the smoke testing procedure
[15:16] <mdz> [action] pitti to update SRU document per vote
[15:16] <MootBot> ACTION received:  pitti to update SRU document per vote
[15:17] <mdz> [topic] Removal of sun-java6 from Karmic
[15:17] <MootBot> New Topic:  Removal of sun-java6 from Karmic
[15:17]  * kees keeps security-team hat on
[15:17] <pitti> I'd really like to get doko's opinion on that
[15:17] <mdz> given that we're certifying openjdk-6, this seems like a no-brainer
[15:17] <kees> I feel that since openjdk-6 passes JCK, there is no reason to carry sun-java6 in karmic.
[15:17] <mdz> pitti, is he available?
[15:17] <jdstrand> wrt sun-java5-- removing it was a no-brainer cause is is EOL by SUn in )ct
[15:17] <pitti> mdz: not right now :(
[15:18] <pitti> it seems like an obvious thing to me as well
[15:18] <mdz> pitti, we can always reupload it ;-)
[15:18] <kees> jdstrand: correct, and has been removed so that's all good.
[15:18] <pitti> if someone really needs it, they can install it from upstream
[15:18] <pitti> mdz: true :)
[15:18] <pitti> but I'd really like to see it go
[15:18] <kees> pitti: that has been my thinking as well.
[15:18] <mdz> I've heard that alfresco (jaunty/partner) depends on it
[15:18] <cjwatson> I like to confirm with the maintainer if possible for any removal, but I don't know of any obvious blockers
[15:18] <jdstrand> someone from server should comment, but last I looked the ec2 tools needed sun-java6 and didn't work with openjds-6
[15:18] <jdstrand> openjdk-6
[15:19] <mdz> jdstrand, I don't think that is true anymore
[15:19] <kees> jdstrand: which tools?  I've always used openjdk-6 for my ec2 work
[15:19] <cjwatson> in the past there have been bits and pieces that didn't quite work with openjdk for some reason or another and I'd like to extract a quick status dump from doko's head
[15:19] <pitti> jdstrand: not possible anyway, since ec2 is in main and sun-jdk in multiverse
[15:19] <jdstrand> it might just be that amazon only certified on sun-java6 (I really don't know)
[15:19] <mdz> ok, how about we vote on it, contingent on an ack from doko when he gets back?  then we don't need to wait for another meeting
[15:19] <jdstrand> pitti: not ec2-- the amazon tools
[15:19] <mdz> jdstrand, we have the euca2ools now as well
[15:19] <pitti> jdstrand: ah, sorry, mixed up with euca
[15:20] <jdstrand> it very well may have changed, I am not up on its status, but wanted to at least mention it
[15:20] <mdz> [vote] remove sun-java6 from karmic in favor of openjdk-6, contingent on approval from the maintainer (Matthias Klose)
[15:20] <MootBot> Please vote on:  remove sun-java6 from karmic in favor of openjdk-6, contingent on approval from the maintainer (Matthias Klose).
[15:20] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[15:20] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[15:20] <mdz> +1
[15:20] <MootBot> +1 received from mdz. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[15:20] <kees> +0 (boy I'm helpful today -- this is directly related to security-team work)
[15:20] <cjwatson> openjdk bugs should be a lot more tractable than sun-java ones were, so even if there are some problems at the moment, I'm:
[15:20] <MootBot> Abstention received from kees. 1 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 1
[15:20] <cjwatson> +1
[15:20] <MootBot> +1 received from cjwatson. 2 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 2
[15:21] <Keybuk> +1 on the basis it's what doko wants
[15:21] <pitti> +1
[15:21] <MootBot> +1 received from Keybuk. 3 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 3
[15:21] <MootBot> +1 received from pitti. 4 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 4
[15:21] <Keybuk> *that* it's...
[15:21] <mdz> [endvote]
[15:21] <MootBot> Final result is 4 for, 0 against. 1 abstained. Total: 4
[15:21] <cjwatson> (because given the TCK pass I think it's unlikely that the problems are fundamental)
[15:21] <jdstrand> the SRU policy doesn't mention what happens when Sun EOLs a release. eg what will happen with sun-java5 in hardy after Oct?
[15:21] <mdz> can someone take the action to check with doko?
[15:21] <pitti> jdstrand: we are not bound to support it; it's multiverse, after all
[15:22] <pitti> updates for it are a courtesy, not something people can rely on anyway
[15:22] <kees> mdz: I will check with doko
[15:22] <mdz> [action] kees to confirm removal of sun-java6 with doko
[15:22] <MootBot> ACTION received:  kees to confirm removal of sun-java6 with doko
[15:22] <jdstrand> pitti: yes, but should it be removed entirely?
[15:22] <pitti> but if they are being used heavily, we could write it to ubuntu-announce@? or u-s-a@?
[15:22] <mdz> [topic] Developer Application Board
[15:22] <MootBot> New Topic:  Developer Application Board
[15:22] <cjwatson> we can't remove packages from older releases, at least not without breaking some rules ...
[15:22] <mdz> Keybuk, you're up
[15:22] <jdstrand> pitti: I ask because there was a lot of rather heated discussion about this, and if nothing else, it should be documented
[15:22] <Keybuk> the Developer Membership Board has been created
[15:22] <Keybuk> the LP permissions changed
[15:22] <cjwatson> (namely that Packages/Sources in the release pocket *never* change)
[15:22] <Keybuk> the ML created
[15:22] <Keybuk> and everybody subscribed
[15:23] <pitti> jdstrand: u-d-a@ ?
[15:23] <Keybuk> we're ready to switch over to it
[15:23] <Keybuk> (and update documentation as we go)
[15:23] <Keybuk> the MC should begin sending reviews to the DMB rather than the TB
[15:23] <mdz> should it have a regular meeting?
[15:23] <Keybuk> (and then we should open a discussion up about merging the MC and DMB later)
[15:23] <Keybuk> I think that's up to the DMB to decide
[15:23] <mdz> Keybuk, has the DMB been updated for the new TB?
[15:23] <kees> (sorry for context-loss: who makes up the DMB?)
[15:23] <jdstrand> pitti: u-d-a seems reasonable to me (and an update to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#sun-java* reflecting that?)
[15:24] <Keybuk> when we discussed it over dinner, the idea was to try and reduce the requirement that people turn up for a time-limited meeting to answer questions
[15:24] <mdz> kees, DMB has the same membership as TB for the moment
[15:24] <pitti> jdstrand: seems fine
[15:24] <kees> ok
[15:24] <Keybuk> mdz: is has
[15:24] <Keybuk> it has
[15:24]  * jdstrand goes to update
[15:24] <cjwatson> kees: two board memberships for the price of one
[15:24] <kees> \o/
[15:24] <mdz> Keybuk, so what remains to be done?
[15:24] <mdz> has it been announced on -devel-announce?
[15:24] <Keybuk> mdz: we need to use it
[15:24] <Keybuk> we need to announce it
[15:24] <mdz> does it matter?
[15:24] <Keybuk> and we need to update the documentation :)
[15:25] <Keybuk> I think an announcement as part of the TB minutes should suffice
[15:25] <mdz> Keybuk, we should notify the MC explicitly to start sending applications elsewhere
[15:25] <cjwatson> it's a governance change, I think -devel-announce would be appropriate
[15:25] <mdz> that too
[15:26] <mdz> [action] Keybuk to announce DMB to MC, -devel-announce and update documentation
[15:26] <MootBot> ACTION received:  Keybuk to announce DMB to MC, -devel-announce and update documentation
[15:26] <mdz> anything else?
[15:27] <Keybuk> if it's going to wait on me having time to do all that, it'll be waiting a while
[15:27]  * Keybuk is supremely busy
[15:27] <mdz> Keybuk, this is just finishing off the action you took to implement the DMB; if you want to hand it off, now is a good time
[15:27] <Keybuk> cjwatson: you were already attacking the TB/membership documentation
[15:27] <Keybuk> could you fix wrt DMB as you go?
[15:27] <mdz> he already finished that I think
[15:27] <cjwatson> yeah
[15:28] <cjwatson> I think I took an action to but haven't yet
[15:28] <cjwatson> (can you tell I've been running behind?)
[15:28] <cjwatson> but I can certainly do it
[15:29] <cjwatson> it's more or less a find-replace job after all
[15:29] <mdz> I don't think we can foist this off on one of the new TB members, since it requires context from before
[15:29] <mdz> cjwatson, thanks
[15:30] <mdz> [action] cjwatson to announce DMB to MC, -devel announce and update documentation
[15:30] <MootBot> ACTION received:  cjwatson to announce DMB to MC, -devel announce and update documentation
[15:30] <mdz> [topic] Archive reorganisation (Colin Watson)
[15:30] <MootBot> New Topic:  Archive reorganisation (Colin Watson)
[15:30] <mdz> cjwatson, you're up
[15:30] <cjwatson> right, so last time round I said I would aim to get us running on package sets by this meeting
[15:31] <cjwatson> I didn't *quite* make it, but having tested on dogfood, I (a) discovered a couple of non-critical bugs (b) am ready to push the button
[15:31] <mdz> "Action: cjwatson to do a final check with the Soyuz team on the details, and start pushing initial sets into LP"
[15:31] <cjwatson> there's one thing I want to get signed off quickly before I push said button
[15:31] <mdz> cjwatson, Keybuk, hmm, actually, reviewing the notes from the last meeting, jono was to update the documentation based on the announcements, so he can help with that
[15:31] <mdz> (re: DMB)
[15:31] <cjwatson> today, I did a validation pass on the permissions, to ensure that I wasn't granting anyone any new permissions *to start with* (I expect we'll do that as we go along)
[15:32] <cjwatson> there were two failures on that validation pass; I think they're not a problem in practice, but I'd like the TB to check
[15:32] <cjwatson> karmic-ubuntustudio/kino grants additional permissions to ubuntustudio-dev
[15:32] <cjwatson> karmic-ubuntustudio/ttf-kochi grants additional permissions to ubuntustudio-dev
[15:32] <cjwatson> i.e. those two packages are in main, and now ubuntustudio-dev will be able to upload them as well
[15:32] <cjwatson> is that OK?
[15:32] <jono> mdz, no worries
[15:33] <mdz> ttf-kochi is used by openjdk-6
[15:33] <pitti> cjwatson: ubuntustudio-dev -> kino seems very reasonable to me
[15:33] <cjwatson> or rather whoever gets attached to ubuntustudio will be able to upload them
[15:33] <pitti> cjwatson: I don't mind ttf-kochi personally, but I'm curious how that happens?
[15:33] <mdz> I don't have a problem with either of those grants
[15:33] <Keybuk> me neither
[15:34] <cjwatson> err, I'd checked this for kino, let me quickly check for ttf-kochi
[15:34] <kees> sounds fine
[15:34] <cjwatson> usually it's because the package was previously in main for edubuntu or something
[15:34] <cjwatson> I think it's a build-dependency of a font that's only otherwise in ubuntustudio
[15:34] <pitti> ah, I remember
[15:35] <pitti> we recently changed some fonts to a smaller default set
[15:35] <pitti> I suppose that wasn't merged to -studio yet
[15:35] <cjwatson> probably not
[15:35] <cjwatson> second question, team ownerships for the package sets that have been defined so far
[15:35] <cjwatson> this essentially amounts to delegations of upload privileges
[15:36] <mdz> do you have a proposed list?
[15:38] <mdz> cjwatson, ?
[15:38] <cjwatson> I do, although I don't expect we'll be able to ratify everything at this meeting - many of the obvious teams have membership that goes well beyond ubuntu-{core-,}dev at the moment
[15:38] <cjwatson> but:
[15:38] <cjwatson>     'core': 'ubuntu-core-dev',
[15:38] <cjwatson>     'desktop-core': 'ubuntu-core-dev',
[15:38] <cjwatson>     'ubuntu-desktop': 'ubuntu-desktop',
[15:38] <cjwatson>     'ubuntu-server': 'ubuntu-core-dev',
[15:38] <cjwatson>     'kubuntu': 'kubuntu-ninjas',
[15:38] <cjwatson>     'edubuntu': 'edubuntu-dev',
[15:38] <cjwatson>     'xubuntu': 'xubuntu-dev',
[15:38] <cjwatson>     'mobile': 'ubuntu-mobile-dev',
[15:38] <cjwatson>     'unr': 'ubuntu-mobile-dev',
[15:38] <cjwatson>     'mythbuntu': 'mythbuntu',
[15:38] <cjwatson>     'ubuntustudio': 'ubuntustudio-dev',
[15:39] <cjwatson> I couldn't see an obvious team for server
[15:39] <cjwatson> (174 active members)
[15:39] <cjwatson> there's ubuntu-server but it seemed like more of an "interested" team?
[15:39] <pitti> yes, I know people there who don't have any idea about packaging
[15:39] <mdz> cjwatson, I can bring that up at the server team meeting directly after this
[15:39] <Keybuk> it seems to me that the right way to address this would be to have each team apply to own its set
[15:39] <cjwatson> I'm not entirely sure about mythbuntu either
[15:39] <Keybuk> describing its membership, and membership conditions
[15:40] <Keybuk> we may want "-dev" teams to be created in some circumstances, for example
[15:40] <cjwatson> Keybuk: I certainly intend to start by assigning them to ubuntu-core-dev or motu as appropriate
[15:40]  * pitti invokes superm1 for mythbuntu
[15:40] <Keybuk> it also occurs that the -dev teams should be owned/admin'd by the dmb, as well as any local administrators
[15:40] <pitti> superm1: hi
[15:40] <superm1> hi piti
[15:40] <superm1> er pitti
[15:41] <pitti> superm1: is the "mythbuntu" launchpad team a set of developers whom you'd trust to upload packages, or more like an "users"/"interested people" team?
[15:41] <piti> failtab :)
[15:41] <superm1> well they are developers, but I wouldn't trust them to all upload packages as of yet
[15:41] <pitti> superm1: (context: archive reorg to package sets)
[15:41] <superm1> i generally help review everything before it gets a push
[15:41] <pitti> superm1: is there a smaller "core developers" team?
[15:42] <superm1> not currently, it's just me doing uploads right now.  eventually some of them were going to apply for MOTU though
[15:43] <mdz> cjwatson, what do we need to decide here in order to enable you to proceed?
[15:43] <cjwatson> just a general note on package sets: there is no UI in LP that will tell you what package set a source package is in (I filed a bug, of course). I've bodged a query interface into edit_acl.py in lp:ubuntu-archive-tools, so you can use that to find out what's going on with any given package
[15:43] <pitti> superm1: could we create a mythbuntu-dev team with the subset which should be allowed to upload?
[15:43] <kees> perhaps creation mythbuntu-dev with just superm1 for now?
[15:43] <kees> s/ion/e/
[15:43] <superm1> that sounds fine to me for now
[15:43] <cjwatson> mdz: the first question was my only blocker (I could have worked around it but it would have taken another pile of work). This team question is just a discussion I wanted to start
[15:43]  * Daviey would be happy with that.
[15:44] <cjwatson> I'm not blocked at the moment
[15:44] <superm1> and as people seem ready to have upload rights for the stuff they care about, add them to the -dev team
[15:44] <mdz> cjwatson, ok, maybe a good one to send to the mailing list, where we can copy in the relevant folks and handle them one by one
[15:44] <mdz> can we move on?
[15:44] <pitti> superm1: right; thanks for hopping in
[15:44] <superm1> np
[15:44] <cjwatson> right, we need to decide whether the -dev team is owned by the DMB or by superm1/whoever though (the latter implies delegation of the ability to grant upload rights)
[15:44] <cjwatson> yes, we can move on
[15:44] <mdz> [topic] community bugs
[15:44] <MootBot> New Topic:  community bugs
[15:44] <mdz> zarro boogs found
[15:45] <Keybuk> cjwatson: the latter in my mind is correct ;)
[15:45] <mdz> [topic] select a chair for the next meeting
[15:45] <MootBot> New Topic:  select a chair for the next meeting
[15:45] <cjwatson> Keybuk: probably, yes, but it's a noticeable step
[15:45] <mdz> I nominate kees
[15:46] <cjwatson> initial package sets are on production now :-)
[15:46] <kees> woo, uhm, okay.  means mootbot familiarity, action-review, and agenda-following?
[15:47] <mdz> kees, preparing the agenda, rounding up folks for the meeting as necessary, driving mootbot and the agenda, facilitating the meeting
[15:47] <pitti> cjwatson: with mythbuntu disabled for now?
[15:47] <kees> cool, I'm on it.
[15:47] <mdz> great, thanks
[15:47] <cjwatson> pitti: with motu attached to mythbuntu
[15:47] <mdz> [topic] AOB
[15:47] <MootBot> New Topic:  AOB
[15:47] <pitti> cjwatson: ah, great
[15:47] <mdz> anything else?
[15:47] <mdz> 10 seconds
[15:48] <mdz> [endmeeting]
[15:48] <mdz> #endmeeting
[15:48] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 09:48.
[15:48] <pitti> 09:48? yay time zones
[15:48] <pitti> thanks everyone
[15:49] <cjwatson> http://paste.ubuntu.com/267330/
[15:50] <kees> mootbot must be in central US
[15:51] <kees> mdz: who sends minutes, updates TeamReport, etc?
[15:52] <mdz> kees, the chair (me today, you next time)
[15:52] <pitti> StableReleaseUpdates wiki page changed for sun-java* FYI
[15:52] <mdz> kees, you should update the agenda for the enxt meeting
[15:52] <kees> mdz: okay.  where do you think a good place would be to record the chair duties in the wiki (I want to make sure I don't drop anything)
[15:54] <pitti> kees: If I were to look, I'd probably start with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TechnicalBoard
[15:54] <kees> pitti: yeah, that's what I was thinking.
[15:54] <kees> I'll adjust it.
[15:55] <pitti> cjwatson: so in the future we could e. g. switch karmic-ubuntu-desktop to ~ubuntu-desktop from ~ubuntu-core-dev?
[15:55] <cjwatson> yeah, that's the theory
[15:55] <cjwatson> and then everything you see in './edit_acl.py -P karmic-ubuntu-desktop query' would become uploadable by karmic-ubuntu-desktop
[15:56] <cjwatson> err, by ~ubuntu-desktop
[15:56] <pitti> so far that team can commit to the bzr branches; I trust most of them to do unreviewed uploads
[15:56] <cjwatson> desktop-core is actually a bit more interesting though
[15:56] <cjwatson> the dependencies made the sets somewhat tricky to figure out ...
[15:56] <cjwatson> you'll see what I mean if you look through the lists
[15:57] <cjwatson> though I think there's actually a bug there too, I'll be continuing to refine
[15:57] <pitti> what is desktop-core?
[15:57] <mdz> kees, on the agenda page I'd think
[15:59] <cjwatson> desktop-core is basically platform.karmic/desktop-common plus platform.karmic/supported-installer-desktop; but there's a bug in the generation which I just spotted which is pulling in rather more than that, looking at fixing that
[15:59] <pitti> $ ./edit_acl.py -s gnome-panel query
[15:59] <pitti> == All uploaders for package 'gnome-panel' ==
[15:59] <pitti> (empty)
[15:59] <pitti> hmm
[16:00] <cjwatson> it doesn't follow the package set chain yet, so that's only telling you about people explicitly authorised to upload just gnome-panel
[16:00] <cjwatson> some tool work is needed
[16:00] <cjwatson> (we should move)
[16:00]  * mathiaz waves
[16:00] <soren> o/
[16:01] <kirkland_> o/
[16:01] <nijaba> o/
[16:01] <Sam-I-Am> morning
[16:01] <smoser> o/
[16:01] <soren> Oh, are we intruding?
[16:01] <alexm> o/
[16:01] <cjwatson> nope
[16:01] <Daviey> \o
[16:01] <cjwatson> we were just having a follow-on discussion
[16:01] <ivoks> o/
[16:01] <mdz> #startmeeting
[16:01] <MootBot> Meeting started at 10:01. The chair is mdz.
[16:01] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[16:01] <niemeyer> Yo
[16:02] <mdz> mathiaz, here?
[16:02] <mathiaz> mdz: sure
[16:02] <mdz> zul, here?
[16:02] <zul> yep sorry
[16:02] <mdz> [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting
[16:02] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting
[16:02] <mdz> has the agenda
[16:03] <mdz> mathiaz, were there any actions from the previous meeting to review?
[16:03] <mathiaz> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/Server/20090901
[16:03] <mdz> [topic] action items from 20090901
[16:03] <MootBot> New Topic:  action items from 20090901
[16:03] <mathiaz> Asterisk
[16:03] <mathiaz> Daviey: ^^?>
[16:03] <mdz> ACTION: Daviey to follow up with the Asterisk Debian maintainers about adopting dkms for dahdi
[16:04] <mdz> ACTION: Daviey to call for testing of Asterisk 1.6
[16:04] <Daviey> mdz: Been very quiet
[16:04] <Daviey> i pinged debian-voip the other day, asking for more discussion.. but nobody has replied
[16:04] <Daviey> the irc channel is often too quiet to get a discussion.
[16:04] <mdz> Daviey, how about the CFT?
[16:04] <Daviey> Apologies, CFT?
[16:04] <mdz> call for testing
[16:05] <mdz> you had an action to call for testing of asterisk 1.6 above
[16:05] <Daviey> Oh, that hasn't been done yet.
[16:05] <mdz> ACTION: mathiaz to produce a list of accepted bugs for packages related to the ubuntu-server team.
[16:05] <mathiaz> mdz: on my todo list
[16:06] <mdz> ok
[16:06] <mdz> [topic] Review status of projects for the current release
[16:06] <MootBot> New Topic:  Review status of projects for the current release
[16:06] <mdz> so I'd like to sync up across the board on 9.10 projects
[16:06] <mdz> the list on the agenda is not 100% complete, and doesn't necessarily map 1:1 to specs, but I think it will help us cover the territory
[16:07] <mdz> [topic] UEC images (smoser)
[16:07] <MootBot> New Topic:  UEC images (smoser)
[16:07] <smoser> - want to release hardy refresh (ideally this week, maybe next)
[16:07] <smoser> - add more detail to Refresh Policy, send to ubuntu-devel ( https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting )
[16:07] <smoser> - update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UEC/Images/Publishing with better instructions (and provide tools for all of it if possible)
[16:08] <smoser> - go through and triage bugs and tag which ones for alpha 6 (will do that today)
[16:08] <smoser> - open bug and implement kernel/initrd publishing to uec-images
[16:08] <mdz> smoser, how do we keep track of which bugs affect the UEC images presently?
[16:09] <smoser> i dont know that there is a way specifically for euc images
[16:09] <mdz> ok, I'd like to fix that straight away
[16:09] <mdz> can we agree on a tag to use now?
[16:09] <smoser> for ec2 (whihc ideally is identical) we mark them as affecting the ubuntu-on-ec2 project
[16:09] <mdz> we should use a project for this purpose only if it is important to track the status separately in each place
[16:09] <niemeyer> mdz, smoser: We have to create a process to integrate released images in the image store as wlel
[16:10] <smoser> regarding a tag, i dont think i have enough launchpad experience to say.  ttx and soren didn't want tag (i thought)
[16:10] <mdz> soren, ?
[16:10] <soren> I would have preferred if there was another way, but if not, a tag is fine.
[16:10] <smoser> i think the main reason is that it is harder to tell someone to open a bug and add a tag. easier to say "open against this project"
[16:10] <mdz> smoser, you can do that with a +filebug URL which automatically adds the tag
[16:11] <mdz> smoser, we can also set it up so that running ubuntu-bug within a running instance does the right thing (like for UNR and the ubuntu-unr tag)
[16:12] <mdz> it's important that we get to a point where we can ask Launchpad for all of the relevant bugs in one report so that we know where we stand
[16:12] <mdz> tags are the simplest way to do that at the moment, I think
[16:12] <smoser> mdz, i'm generally fine with whatever is the launchpad-best-practice for doing things.  and yes, i'd like to get ubuntu-bug working, and provide a apport hook to collect data also
[16:12] <mdz> ok, I suggest the tag "uec-images"
[16:12] <mdz> which matches the download URL and should be reasonably unique
[16:13] <soren> Fine with me.
[16:13] <mdz> [action] smoser to tag existing UEC image bugs with "uec-images"
[16:13] <MootBot> ACTION received:  smoser to tag existing UEC image bugs with "uec-images"
[16:13] <smoser> can-do
[16:14] <mdz> [action] mdz to follow up on ubuntu-bug/apport for uec images
[16:14] <MootBot> ACTION received:  mdz to follow up on ubuntu-bug/apport for uec images
[16:14] <mdz> [topic] EC2 AMIs (smoser)
[16:14] <MootBot> New Topic:  EC2 AMIs (smoser)
[16:14] <mdz> presumably all of the UEC stuff applies here as well, but since there are EC2-specific bits, I thought it would be useful to cover it separately
[16:15] <mdz> I sent out a todo list for EC2 for alpha 6 last week
[16:15] <mdz>  * Add signed MD5SUMS [Steve?]
[16:15] <mdz>  * Add manifest file for each image, including both the package versions
[16:15] <mdz>    inside the image (like the livefs does) and the version numbers of the
[16:15] <mdz>    relevant build tools (such as vmbuilder)
[16:15] <mdz>  * Automate publishing of AMIs to EC2 [Scott?]
[16:15] <mdz>  * Automate updating ec2-version-query [Soren?]
[16:15] <mdz>  * Publish ec2-version-query in a more appropriate place [Soren?]
[16:15] <mdz>  * Ensure inclusion of relevant news in release notes [Eric?]
[16:15] <mdz> are any of these done already?
[16:16] <smoser> well, MD5SUMs is written in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UEC/Images/Publishing
[16:16] <soren> mdz: "Automate updating ec2-version-query" /was/ done, but given Steve's feedback on directory structure, I'll have to rework that.
[16:16] <smoser> but we should make the script that builds them do that, so they're automatically there for all nightlys
[16:17] <mdz> smoser, do you have the access rights to make the changes to the scripts?
[16:17] <smoser> i dont knwo if i can push to that bzr branch or not. soren ?
[16:17] <smoser> it is something that i need to be able to do, so we'll get that figured out
[16:17] <soren> smoser: I think you can.
[16:18] <smoser> if not, i'll bother soren
[16:18] <soren> smoser: If not, let's fix that today.
[16:18] <soren> smoser: (I believe the ubuntu-on-ec2 team owns it.)
[16:18] <mdz> [action] soren to ensure that smoser can update the UEC publishing scripts
[16:18] <MootBot> ACTION received:  soren to ensure that smoser can update the UEC publishing scripts
[16:18] <mdz> [action] smoser to add MD5SUMs for UEC images
[16:18] <MootBot> ACTION received:  smoser to add MD5SUMs for UEC images
[16:19] <mdz> [action] soren to add manifest files for UEC images
[16:19] <MootBot> ACTION received:  soren to add manifest files for UEC images
[16:19] <mdz> smoser, is automatic publishing to EC2 doable for alpha 6?
[16:20] <smoser> maybe..
[16:20] <mdz> I understand there's likely some IS work involved here, so we should at least get the ball rolling in RT
[16:20] <soren> heh :)
[16:21] <smoser> i absolutely want to improve it over what is there now, but fully automated might not make it.
[16:21] <mdz> [action] smoser to open dialog with IS about automated publishing to EC2 and agree on a plan
[16:21] <MootBot> ACTION received:  smoser to open dialog with IS about automated publishing to EC2 and agree on a plan
[16:21] <mdz> smoser, sound achievable for the coming week?
[16:22] <niemeyer> mdz, smoser: We have to include the image store in these discussions too
[16:22] <smoser> to open a dialog, yes.  we dont 100% *need* anything changed, since we can just start an ec2 image that pulls from euc-images rather than pushing from data center to ec2
[16:22] <mdz> niemeyer, I think that's a separate discussion; we hadn't talked about putting dailies or alphas into the image store
[16:23] <smoser> ie, without any IS changes, it can still be automated.
[16:23] <mdz> smoser, I meant the "agree a plan" bit ;-)
[16:23] <mdz> [action] soren to automate updating of ec2-version-query
[16:23] <MootBot> ACTION received:  soren to automate updating of ec2-version-query
[16:23] <niemeyer> mdz: Oh, sorry, I thought it was about what to do in general
[16:23] <mdz> niemeyer, this is about the release engineering process for the UEC images, what happens when we want to publish a new build
[16:24] <mdz> soren, have you agreed with slangasek where to publish ec2-version-query?
[16:24] <niemeyer> mdz: Ok, I guess the image store is a subset of this discussion then
[16:24] <mdz> the thread went quiet over the US holiday I think
[16:24] <soren> mdz: No.
[16:24] <soren> mdz: It did. My fault, though, so not related to the holidays :)
[16:24] <mdz> [action] soren to publish ec2-version-query in a more appropriate place
[16:24] <MootBot> ACTION received:  soren to publish ec2-version-query in a more appropriate place
[16:24]  * soren nods
[16:25] <mdz> erichammond doesn't seem to be here; does he not usually attend these meetings?
[16:25] <smoser> mdz, i can try.  i'd like to get insight/thoughts from soren or anyone else if publish-from-amazon is not an acceptable solution. it actually is faster.
[16:25] <mdz> smoser, I like the idea, but it depends on how much complexity/risk it would add to change the approach this late
[16:26] <smoser> mdz, that is what i did for alpha 5 (i used amazon)
[16:26] <mdz> what's happening with the EC2 kernel?
[16:26] <smoser> for *publishing* not building
[16:26] <mdz> smoser, oh
[16:26] <smoser> building i think we keep in data cetner for now. but publishing just pulls from uec-images and runs through the upload-bundle, registher-image....
[16:27] <smoser> zul, you have ec2 kernel info ?
[16:27] <soren> smoser: It's mostly an IS decision I think. (I.e. can we get the relevant credentials onto EC2 in a secure enough manner)
[16:27] <zul> mdz: we have a 2.6.31-rc6 kernel working on ec2, jj was working on packaging before he left the sprint
[16:27] <mdz> zul, working on packaging = merging it into the karmic kernel tree?
[16:27] <soren> zul: Working in all zones?
[16:27] <mdz> (I don't think we want a separate package)
[16:28] <zul> mdz: yes he was merging it into the karmic kernel tree
[16:28] <zul> soren: yep
[16:28] <soren> zul: Based on the Xen patches or pv-ops? Sorry, you probably told me already, but I forgot.
[16:28] <zul> soren: Xen patches :(
[16:28] <soren> Ok.
[16:28] <smoser> just for the record, major applause is due to zul and jjohansen. this was really a impossible task.
[16:28] <zul> i havent had a chance to sync up with jj yet
[16:28] <mdz> pgraner, could you follow up with jj regarding merging the ec2 kernel into the karmic tree and providing it as a package? we need that for alpha 6
[16:29] <mdz> zul, did we end up going with pv_ops or xen patches?
[16:29] <pgraner> mdz: ack
[16:29] <zul> mdz: xen-patches
[16:30] <mdz> pgraner, I guess in that case, we need feedback on whether the patches can actually go into karmic or if they're problematic
[16:30] <mdz> we have something which works, but it's unknown whether it's mergeable
[16:30] <mdz> [action] mdz to confirm ec2 kernel status for alpha 6
[16:31] <MootBot> ACTION received:  mdz to confirm ec2 kernel status for alpha 6
[16:31] <pgraner> mdz: we have our team meeting later today would be good to have some server reps there when we discuss. I'll add it to the agenda
[16:31] <smoser> jj's thoughts friday were that it was not significant effort to go from 2.6.31-rc6 (what we have) to karmic-ified
[16:31] <mdz> smoser, same question as for the uec images, how do we keep track of bugs which are specific to the AMIs?
[16:32] <mdz> smoser, can you make it to (the relevant part of) the kernel team meeting later today?
[16:32] <smoser> i've been doing 'also-effects-project' to the ubuntu-on-ec2 project
[16:32] <smoser> time ? pgraner ?
[16:33] <mdz> smoser, I'd like to ask that we use tags there as well, to keep things simple. having multiple status/importance/assignee is just noise unless they're being handled by separate people (which in this case they aren't)
[16:33] <mdz> what would be a good tag to use? ec2? ec2-ami?
[16:34] <pgraner> smoser: : 1700UTC
[16:34] <mdz> (~90m from now)
[16:34] <smoser> mdz, i dont like ec2-ami. as it indicates to me that kernel is not relevant
[16:34] <smoser> ec2-images, corresponding to uec-images ?
[16:35] <mdz> smoser, sounds good
[16:35] <smoser> soren, anyone else, is that tag-based approach ok ?
[16:35] <soren> smoser: Sure.
[16:35] <mdz> it lets us get a very simple report out of launchpad of the open issues and their current status
[16:35] <mdz> and it's a lot more lightweight (fewer clicks to add the tag)
[16:36] <mdz> adding a task is pretty cumbersome just to group the bugs
[16:36]  * smoser makes no objection
[16:36] <mdz> [action] smoser to add ec2-images tag to the relevant bugs
[16:36] <MootBot> ACTION received:  smoser to add ec2-images tag to the relevant bugs
[16:36] <mdz> anything else on EC2?
[16:36] <smoser> mdz, so should i just kill all tasks related to ubuntu-on-ec2 ?
[16:37] <mdz> smoser, kill or ignore as you see fit
[16:37] <mdz> I assume there's also documentation to be updated
[16:37] <mdz> [action] mdz to see that bug documentation is updated for uec-images, ec2-images tags
[16:37] <MootBot> ACTION received:  mdz to see that bug documentation is updated for uec-images, ec2-images tags
[16:38] <smoser> mdz, where does MootBot publish meeting minutes ?
[16:38] <mdz> I'm wondering why we have a #ubuntu-ec2 IRC channel
[16:38] <mdz> smoser, I'll email them out and add them to TeamReports on the wiki
[16:39] <mdz> I've been hanging out in #ubuntu-ec2 lately, and it seems very dead
[16:39] <mdz> when someone does come along with a question, there's nobody there to answer it
[16:39] <nijaba> mdz: it is indeed now a bit rudundant with #ubuntu-cloud, which not very active as well
[16:39] <mdz> since the amount of traffic is so low, I'd like to suggest that we fold it into #ubuntu-server
[16:39] <kirkland_> mdz: there's also #ubuntu-virt
[16:39] <mdz> aieee, irc fragmentation
[16:40] <mdz> kirkland, nijaba, how many messages per day in those channels?
[16:40] <nijaba> mdz: less than 10 on avg, apart for virt which can be more active
[16:41] <Daviey> -cloud has had nothing since the 4th
[16:41] <mdz> nijaba, if it's <10 messages per day, it would be beneficial to fold it into #-server where there are more people around and it's still on topic
[16:41] <nijaba> mdz:  agreed
[16:41] <mdz> kirkland_, how about #-virt?
[16:41] <mdz> nijaba, could you take care of obsoleting #-ec2 and #-cloud in favor of #-server, updating web pages etc.?
[16:41] <soren> mdz: ubuntu-virt is very active at times.
[16:42] <nijaba> mdz: can do
[16:42] <kirkland_> mdz:   wc says: 44437  525008 3627666 #ubuntu-virt.log since Apr 29, 2008
[16:42] <nijaba> mdz: should I just update the topic on the channel to invite people to go elsewhere?
[16:42] <mdz> [action] nijaba to fold #ubuntu-ec2 and #ubuntu-cloud into #ubuntu-server
[16:42] <MootBot> ACTION received:  nijaba to fold #ubuntu-ec2 and #ubuntu-cloud into #ubuntu-server
[16:42] <mdz> nijaba, yes
[16:42] <nijaba> ok
[16:42] <mdz> kirkland_, soren, is there anything in #-virt which would be unwelcome or off-topic in #-server?
[16:43] <kirkland_> mdz: i don't think so; merely more traffic, IMO
[16:43] <Daviey> it is worth noting that -server is increasingly being used for support, and some devel discussion.
[16:43] <soren> mdz: Not per se, no.
[16:43] <mdz> Daviey, #ubuntu-devel is available if folks need a place to go for devel discussion when #-server is too noisy
[16:43] <nijaba> mdz: note that there re more 50p logged on #-virt
[16:43] <soren> mdz: ...there are a bunch of people interested in virtualisation who don't care about servers, though.
[16:43] <Daviey> mdz: agreed.
[16:44] <mdz> soren, good point
[16:44] <mdz> let's leave #-virt for now in any case
[16:44] <mdz> [topic] Packaging and integration of Eucalyptus 1.6 (Soren)
[16:44] <MootBot> New Topic:  Packaging and integration of Eucalyptus 1.6 (Soren)
[16:44]  * Daviey suggests -cloud and -ec2 automatically redirects to -virt.. easy fix then
[16:44] <Daviey> then no docs are really broken.
[16:44] <mdz> I talked with the eucalyptus team yesterday and we agreed to use the 'eucalyptus' tag to track the bugs they care about
[16:44] <mdz> [link] https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=eucalyptus
[16:44] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=eucalyptus
[16:45] <soren> Oh, neat.
[16:45] <mdz> I asked them to file all of their current issues as bugs so that we can track them
[16:45] <soren> Right. Eucalyptus 1.6 has landed in Ubuntu, now. In main, even. I've been going through some of the bugs today, and hope to get through the list tomorrow and get it all triaged.
[16:45] <mdz> soren, if there are bugs which we should discuss with the eucalyptus team, please add the tag to them
[16:46] <mdz> then when we have our meeting with them, we'll just go over the list of tagged bugs
[16:46] <soren> mdz: Makes sense. Will do.
[16:46] <nurmi> i'll also be tracking these bugs in LP in case any discussions come up bug comments
[16:46] <mdz> [action] soren to triage all eucalyptus bugs, and use the 'eucalyptus' tag for bugs which should be escalated to the eucalyptus team
[16:46] <MootBot> ACTION received:  soren to triage all eucalyptus bugs, and use the 'eucalyptus' tag for bugs which should be escalated to the eucalyptus team
[16:46] <mdz> nurmi, oh, good, you're here. welcome!
[16:46] <soren> mdz: Should I add them for eucalyptus bugs as well, so we get a complete list when querying for the tag?
[16:47] <soren> mdz: Bugs in the eucalyptus source package itself, I mean.
[16:47] <mdz> soren, I suggested we use the tag only for bugs which we're tracking together with eucalyptus
[16:47] <mdz> maybe it would have been less confusing to use eucalyptus-systems or something
[16:47] <soren> So.. "Yes"? :)
[16:48] <mdz> soren, it's hard for me to say without having looked at many of the bugs
[16:48] <soren> mdz: Ok. I think I'm on top of it.
[16:48] <mdz> ok
[16:49] <mdz> soren, if I made a bad guess at who to assign any of those bugs to, please fix them up for me
[16:49] <soren> mdz: Already done.
[16:49] <mdz> ttx is on holiday, or I would have sought his advice
[16:49] <mdz> soren, thanks
[16:49] <mdz> nurmi, is there anything you want to put on the agenda wrt eucalyptus 1.6 in karmic?
[16:50] <nurmi> mdz: i think the bug list is pretty comprehensive thus far
[16:50] <mdz> how is the installer side looking?
[16:50] <nurmi> if we encounter new issues, should we be tagging them with the 'eucalyptus' tag if they effect the karmic package?
[16:51] <mdz> nurmi, if the bug should be on the list when we look at bugs together, it should get the tag
[16:51] <mdz> otherwise, no
[16:51] <nurmi> mdz: we went through the install process yesterday, just a few issues that were encapsulated in the bug reports (post-install type questions for networking parameters, multiple interface configuration)
[16:52] <mdz> if you want to always look at all bugs on the eucalyptus package, we can skip the tag for those and consider it implicit
[16:52] <mdz> but we need to be able to tag the bugs which are not on the eucalyptus package itself anyway
[16:52] <nurmi> mdz: got it, perfect
[16:52] <mdz> soren, who is tracking uec installer issues on our side?
[16:52] <soren> mdz: Colin.
[16:52] <mdz> cjwatson, ping?
[16:52] <soren> mdz: I've talked to him already.
[16:52] <soren> ...and reassigned the bugs to him.
[16:53] <mdz> soren, perfect, thank you
[16:53] <mdz> [topic] Alfresco appliance (kirkland)
[16:53] <MootBot> New Topic:  Alfresco appliance (kirkland)
[16:53] <mdz> kirkland_, how is this coming along?
[16:53] <kirkland_> mdz: i first noticed that I was assigned this as of your edit of the wiki page yesterday
[16:54] <kirkland_> mdz: i'll get some info from soren today about how he's creating appliances
[16:54] <mdz> soren, kirkland_, is it doable to get this done in the next week?
[16:54] <mdz> at least an alpha quality appliance?
[16:55] <soren> mdz: I presume so. We need some changes to the alfresco package to get done. Other than that, we should be fine.
[16:55] <kirkland_> mdz: on the alfresco side, it would help if it were in multiverse
[16:55] <kirkland_> mdz: such that we could make changes and upload fixes to that package ourselves
[16:55] <kirkland_> mdz: as it stands, it's in partner
[16:55] <soren> mdz: It currently has a hard dependency on sun's java.
[16:56] <mdz> I don't mind if we hand-hack it at this stage, so long as we have an image that we can try out
[16:56] <soren> mdz: This makes it difficult to distribute, as the user is required to accept the EULA, afaiui.
[16:57] <mdz> kirkland_, we're short on time. can you agree to give it your best shot? it doesn't need to be a clean build at this stage, something is way better than nothing
[16:57] <kirkland_> mdz: yes, i'll have something alpha quality this week
[16:57] <mdz> [action] kirkland to build a proof of concept alfresco appliance
[16:57] <MootBot> ACTION received:  kirkland to build a proof of concept alfresco appliance
[16:57] <mdz> kirkland_, lovely, thanks
[16:57] <mdz> [topic] Appliance store (niemeyer)
[16:57] <MootBot> New Topic:  Appliance store (niemeyer)
[16:57] <mdz> niemeyer, how are we doing?
[16:57] <kirkland_> mdz: note that the real issues will probably be licensings, non-technical ones
[16:58] <niemeyer> mdz: Moving along
[16:58] <niemeyer> mdz: Here are some status details I wrote down
[16:58] <niemeyer> Image Store UI has been pushed upstream and is integrated into 1.6.
[16:58] <niemeyer> Image Store UI depends on local proxy, which is being written at the moment.
[16:58] <niemeyer> Proxy coding status:
[16:58] <niemeyer> - Already done: full architecture, internal service and task dispatching        infrastructure, frontend API, AWS signature checking, part of the storage       mechanisms, proxying of API calls to the upstream API (e.g. get dashboard), etc.
[16:58] <niemeyer> - Being written now: downloading of images.
[16:58] <niemeyer> - To be written: checking of gpg signature, bundling of images, uploading into  Eucalyptus, obtaining credentials through euca_conf.
[16:58] <niemeyer> We have the following external dependencies thus far for the overall concept:   images released by server team must be registered in the store, proxy must be   packaged with Eucalyptus.
[16:58] <niemeyer> We hope to have most of it done by the 14th.
[16:59] <mdz> niemeyer, is the image store UI in the 1.6 packages in karmic today?
[16:59] <niemeyer> mdz: It is
[16:59] <mdz> great
[16:59] <mdz> niemeyer, will the proxy be added to the eucalyptus package or shipped separately?
[16:59] <niemeyer> mdz: There might be some minor CSS details to fix, but that's just a detail
[16:59] <niemeyer> mdz: Either way works for us
[17:00] <mdz> soren, what do you think?
[17:00] <niemeyer> mdz: Might be easier to upgrade being separate
[17:00] <niemeyer> mdz: But might be easier to package initially being integrated
[17:00] <soren> mdz: It
[17:00] <niemeyer> mdz: Whatever soren is happy with is great by us
[17:00] <soren> It's hard to say. I'm not familiar with the code base.
[17:01] <soren> If it's in a separate package, who will do the packaging=
[17:01] <soren> ?
[17:01] <niemeyer> soren: It's a python package, with a command for starting the proxy up, and a storage directory for cache and image work
[17:01] <mdz> soren, could you look into it with niemeyer this week, decide what to do and help him get it packaged?
[17:02] <soren> niemeyer: Separate package.
[17:02] <niemeyer> soren: Rick originally told me "I'll keep someone on the line for packaging this when it's ready."
[17:02] <cjwatson> mdz: responding to ping, although it looks like it's been dealt with
[17:02] <niemeyer> soren: I understand it's not very helpful information now
[17:02] <mdz> I think niemeyer can maintain the package
[17:02] <mdz> once it's set up, if someone can get the initial packaging into place so he can stay focused on the proxy
[17:03] <soren> niemeyer: I'd prefer it if you could do the packaging. It's hard to commit to packaging something within any timeframe when you haven't seen it yet.
[17:03] <niemeyer> soren: I'm not great with deb packaging.. I'd be very happy to have someone's help with this
[17:03] <mdz> mathiaz, do you think you could give niemeyer a hand getting it packaged?
[17:03] <niemeyer> soren: I'll be on the line for any issues
[17:03] <soren> niemeyer: Unless of course, you could give us the code before a last minute code drop?
[17:04] <mathiaz> mdz: I can give it a shot - I have access to the code
[17:04] <mathiaz> mdz: I can give it a shot - *if* I have access to the code
[17:04] <niemeyer> soren: It's already the "last minute" in a way :(
[17:04] <mdz> [action] mathiaz to get niemeyer's proxy code packaged
[17:04] <MootBot> ACTION received:  mathiaz to get niemeyer's proxy code packaged
[17:04] <niemeyer> Either way, I'll be on the line for any issues with the code, or any questions related to building the package
[17:04] <niemeyer> mathiaz: Thanks a lot
[17:04] <mdz> niemeyer, is there any reason it can't be released publicly today?
[17:04] <niemeyer> mdz: It is released publicly.. it's just not working yet
[17:05] <mdz> ok
[17:05] <soren> niemeyer: Oh? WherE?
[17:05] <mathiaz> niemeyer: where?
[17:05] <niemeyer> lp:~niemeyer/+junk/image-store
[17:05] <mdz> niemeyer, is there anything else you need?
[17:05] <mdz> we're running late, so I'd like to move on
[17:05] <niemeyer> mdz: We need to sync up on the registration of images in the store, but nothing else I can think of now
[17:06] <mdz> [topic] Canonical application support (zul)
[17:06] <MootBot> New Topic:  Canonical application support (zul)
[17:06] <nurmi> niemeyer: re euca_conf get credentials - do you need just the query/access keys for 'admin'?
[17:06] <niemeyer> mdz: Thanks
[17:06] <niemeyer> nurmi: That and the certificates
[17:06] <zul> mdz: rabbitmq-server hasnt been reviewed yet by the MIR team but kees said he was going to look at it today
[17:06] <niemeyer> nurmi: Dmitrii had some working code in the Dublin sprint.. I'm not sure if it's been integrated
[17:06] <mdz> zul, ok, sounds good
[17:06] <nurmi> niemeyer: nod, i'll send you a note later
[17:06] <niemeyer> nurmi: Do you know details about this?
[17:07] <niemeyer> nurmi: Awesome, thank you
[17:07] <mdz> [action] zul to ensure rabbitmq-server gets reviewed and promoted
[17:07] <MootBot> ACTION received:  zul to ensure rabbitmq-server gets reviewed and promoted
[17:07] <zul> ack
[17:07] <mdz> [topic] Directory items (mathiaz)
[17:07] <MootBot> New Topic:  Directory items (mathiaz)
[17:07] <mathiaz> mdz: openldap 2.4.18 was released sunday
[17:07] <mdz> mathiaz, openldap 2.4.18 is the only item outstanding, right?
[17:08] <mathiaz> mdz: FFe granted last night
[17:08] <mdz> excellent
[17:08] <mathiaz> mdz: I'll upload the package today
[17:08] <mdz> [action] mathiaz to upload openldap 2.4.18
[17:08] <MootBot> ACTION received:  mathiaz to upload openldap 2.4.18
[17:08] <mdz> mathiaz, anything else in this area worth discussing?
[17:08] <mathiaz> mdz: nope
[17:08] <mathiaz> next step: more testing
[17:09] <mdz> [topic] CIM/WBEM (mathiaz)
[17:09] <MootBot> New Topic:  CIM/WBEM (mathiaz)
[17:09] <mathiaz> mdz: provider are available in the archive
[17:09] <mathiaz> mdz: next step: more testing
[17:10] <mdz> mathiaz, are all of the work items in the wiki completed?
[17:10] <mdz> update wbem stack, package pywbem, package libopendrim, package opendrim providers?
[17:10] <mathiaz> mdz: yes
[17:10] <mdz> ok, perfect
[17:11] <mdz> [topic] Followups from server team sprint
[17:11] <MootBot> New Topic:  Followups from server team sprint
[17:11] <mdz> I'm sorry I missed the end of the sprint
[17:12] <mdz> thierry sent me a summary and mentioned a few things we should follow up on
[17:12] <mdz> one was testing procedures for the UEC images
[17:12] <mdz> smoser, where does that stand?
[17:13] <mathiaz> I've updated the test cases - http://testcases.qa.ubuntu.com/System/CloudImages
[17:13] <smoser> regarding testing, we need to get to where the tests in iso tracker are fully automated (at least on ec2)
[17:13] <mdz> ttx said we should add additional tests, because there was only one and it was dependent on a working UEC
[17:13] <mathiaz> the main issue we had was that we didn't have access to a working UEC
[17:14] <mdz> mathiaz, so the "bundle uec image for ec2" case should cover that now?
[17:14] <smoser> once we get a reasonable framework down, adding additional tests should be fairly easy. for now, it is very error prone to run the tests.
[17:14] <mdz> smoser, do you think that is achievable for alpha 6?
[17:14] <mathiaz> mdz: hm - kind of.
[17:15] <mathiaz> mdz: but yes - to test the UEC image delivrable rebundling to ec2 should cover it
[17:15] <mdz> mathiaz, well, in that it should be possible to test without UEC if necessary
[17:15] <smoser> mdz, it "should be" a reasonable thing to achieve. at least to get through the tests we have there.
[17:15] <mathiaz> mdz: I still think that testing on UEC is important.
[17:15] <smoser> given other things on my list, i don't really want to commit to it though
[17:16] <mdz> mathiaz, I agree. the issue ttx raised was that we couldn't pass any tests for the UEC images unless UEC itself was passing tests
[17:16] <mathiaz> mdz: right - with rebundle-to-ec2 with got another option for testing
[17:16] <mdz> smoser, ok, we can survive with manual tests if necessary
[17:16] <mathiaz> mdz: testing UEC images. which is better than nothing
[17:16] <mdz> is there anything else which was an open issue at the end of the sprint?
[17:17] <mathiaz> not that I can think of.
[17:17] <mdz> kirkland_, there is some confusion over the image upgrade issue
[17:18] <kirkland_> mdz: yes, i was wondering if we were going to get to that today
[17:18] <mdz> kirkland_, I suggested that we defer it so that we can focus more on bug fixing and all of the infrastructure/process work we need to do
[17:18] <kirkland_> mdz: i'd like some advice on how to proceed
[17:18] <mdz> kirkland_, is that ok with you?
[17:18] <kirkland_> mdz: that's fine with me, bug fixing sounds more important at this point
[17:18] <kirkland_> mdz: my patch is tested, and posted in the bug, for posterity
[17:18] <mdz> kirkland_, qemu-kvm is listed as a sprint agenda item which was not crossed off yet
[17:18] <kirkland_> mdz: we can revisit at any time
[17:19] <kirkland_> mdz: yes, i uploaded qemu-kvm-0.11~rc2 this morning
[17:19] <kirkland_> mdz: upstream should GA qemu-kvm-0.11 just before our Beta
[17:19] <kirkland_> mdz: these rc's are bug-fixes only, stabilizing the package
[17:19] <kirkland_> mdz: we are in lock-step with upstream and Fedora on this particular package
[17:19] <mdz> kirkland_, have you sent a call for testing?
[17:19] <kirkland_> mdz: which is a very good thing, as we're sharing the testing/debugging burden
[17:19] <mdz> I think I saw one from you
[17:20] <kirkland_> mdz: http://blog.dustinkirkland.com/2009/09/qemu-kvm-011rc2-uploaded-to-karmic.html
[17:20] <mdz> what is the next step we need to take?
[17:20] <kirkland_> http://blog.dustinkirkland.com/2009/08/qemu-kvm-call-for-testing.html
[17:20] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://blog.dustinkirkland.com/2009/08/qemu-kvm-call-for-testing.html
[17:20] <zul> kirkland_: i still dont understand why you need bochbios as a build dependency since it builds it own bios
[17:20] <kirkland_> mdz: we need significant testing of kvm, itself, by our community
[17:20] <kirkland_> mdz: soren and I have noticed that most kvm bugs don't get filed until after GA, sadly
[17:21] <mdz> kirkland_, do you need help organizing that?  maybe the QA team could help you run a testing day or something?
[17:21] <kirkland_> mdz: and we always SRU several kvm fixes, most of which could have been caught earlier
[17:21] <kirkland_> mdz: it's our theory that people just don't test servers until after we release
[17:21] <kirkland_> mdz: i would welcome a QA bug day on kvm
[17:21] <soren> I find the spike to be between RC and final. Annoyingly.
[17:21] <mathiaz> kirkland_: it seems that you're more looking for a QA Testing day
[17:21] <kirkland_> soren: ack, okay, just before GA, then
[17:22] <kirkland_> mathiaz: agreed, Testing Day, not Bug Day
[17:22] <Daviey> It is hard to test kvm boxes with production level burden, to be fair.
[17:22] <mdz> [action] kirkland to speak with marjo about how to get qemu-kvm tested prior to release (and more generally server applications like it)
[17:22] <MootBot> ACTION received:  kirkland to speak with marjo about how to get qemu-kvm tested prior to release (and more generally server applications like it)
[17:22] <kirkland_> Daviey: understood
[17:22] <kirkland_> mdz: accepted
[17:22] <mdz> kirkland_, please CC me in if you discuss it by email
[17:22] <mdz> [topic] Server developer team in LP for ArchiveReorganisation (Matt)
[17:22] <MootBot> New Topic:  Server developer team in LP for ArchiveReorganisation (Matt)
[17:23] <mdz> so we now have package sets in Launchpad, and cjwatson was looking for the appropriate teams to have privileges on them
[17:23] <mdz> but there didn't seem to be an appropriate team for Server Edition
[17:23] <Daviey> ~ubuntu-server is an open team..
[17:23] <mdz> right, which makes it incredibly inappropriate for this :-)
[17:23] <cjwatson> yeah, it's clearly inappropriate here
[17:24] <kirkland_> Daviey: yeah, too broad to dole out upload perms there
[17:24] <mdz> I think what's needed is the creation of an ubuntu-server-dev team, but I would need help populating it
[17:24] <mdz> can someone take the action to sort this out with cjwatson?
[17:24] <mathiaz> mdz: I can look into this
[17:24] <cjwatson> this isn't a blocker for archive reorg, but if the server team wants to take advantage of the ability to provide upload privileges for server bits without requiring core-dev, somebody will need to sort it out
[17:24] <cjwatson> cool
[17:25] <mdz> mathiaz, thanks
[17:25] <mdz> [action] mathiaz to get a server dev team set up in LP and work with cjwatson to get it set up for archive reorg
[17:25] <MootBot> ACTION received:  mathiaz to get a server dev team set up in LP and work with cjwatson to get it set up for archive reorg
[17:25] <mdz> [topic] Assigned and to-be-assigned bugs: http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/team-assigned/canonical-server-assigned-bug-tasks.html (all)
[17:25] <MootBot> New Topic:  Assigned and to-be-assigned bugs: http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/team-assigned/canonical-server-assigned-bug-tasks.html (all)
[17:25] <mdz> [link]  http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/team-assigned/canonical-server-assigned-bug-tasks.html
[17:26] <MootBot> LINK received:   http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/team-assigned/canonical-server-assigned-bug-tasks.html
[17:26] <mdz> I don't know if this list was a regular part of your workflow previously, but I'd like to start using it to keep track of active bugs in the team
[17:26] <mdz> it looks like there's a lot of noise on it at the moment
[17:26] <kirkland_> mdz: i'm going to go through mine today
[17:26] <mdz> including 3 old bugs which are assigned to me
[17:26] <Daviey> mdz: previously this was where we discussed potential SRU acceptance.
[17:27] <mathiaz> Daviey: not yet
[17:27] <mdz> Daviey, we're following https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting
[17:27] <Daviey> oh :)
[17:27] <Daviey> <-- fail.
[17:27] <mathiaz> Daviey: there is another section for SRU
[17:27] <mdz> so please look at your list of assigned bugs, and make sure it's up to date
[17:27] <mdz> that's all
[17:28] <mdz> [topic] weekly SRU review (mathiaz)
[17:28] <MootBot> New Topic:  weekly SRU review (mathiaz)
[17:28] <mathiaz> http://people.canonical.com/~mathiaz/buglists/fixedbugs.ubuntu-server.latest.html
[17:28] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://people.canonical.com/~mathiaz/buglists/fixedbugs.ubuntu-server.latest.html
[17:28] <mathiaz> anything sru worthy on this list^^?
[17:28] <zul> the net-snmp one
[17:29] <mathiaz> zul: bug 406171
[17:29] <mathiaz> kirkland_: any of the kvm-qemu would apply to kvm?
[17:29] <zul> mathiaz: and the samba one might be as well
[17:29] <mathiaz> zul: bug 423854?
[17:30] <zul> mathiaz: that has to be investiaged a bit more as well
[17:30]  * nurmi has another engagment to go to; thanks all - i'll be in touch
[17:30] <mathiaz> zul: for hardy? jaunty?
[17:30] <zul> mathiaz: jaunty
[17:30] <Daviey> The mysql one was a regression in karmic mysql 5.1, so not relevant.
[17:30] <mdz> maintenance on jaunty should be minimal at this stage
[17:31] <mathiaz> zul: both bugs nominated for jautny
[17:31] <mdz> unless it's a critical bug (and both of those are Undecided), I'd default to "no"
[17:32] <mdz> mathiaz, ready to move on?
[17:32] <mathiaz> sure
[17:32] <mathiaz> there are 4 other lists to look at:
[17:32] <mathiaz> http://us-dappernominated.notlong.com/
[17:32] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://us-dappernominated.notlong.com/
[17:32] <Daviey> nice!
[17:32] <mathiaz> nothing in there
[17:32] <mathiaz> http://us-hardynominated.notlong.com/
[17:32] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://us-hardynominated.notlong.com/
[17:32] <mdz> the dapper one is empty
[17:33] <mdz> the hardy ones are all fix released
[17:33] <mathiaz> kirkland_: ^^ any bugs worth accepting for hardy?
[17:33] <mathiaz> kirkland_: they're all libvirt/kvm bugs?
[17:34] <kirkland_> mathiaz: most of the kvm bugs have been solved in the hardy-backports package of kvm-84
[17:34] <kirkland_> mathiaz: i believe it unwise to waste any more time on kvm-62, unless we find data corruption issues
[17:34] <mathiaz> kirkland_: so all the bugs should be declined for hardy?
[17:35] <mathiaz> kirkland_: http://us-hardynominated.notlong.com/
[17:35] <kirkland_> mathiaz: i'll go through those, but yes, i'll decline then with a note to try kvm-84 in backports
[17:35] <kirkland_> mathiaz: and the correspoding libvirt
[17:35] <mathiaz> kirkland_: ok - same question for intrepid nominated
[17:35] <mathiaz> kirkland_: http://us-intrepidnominated.notlong.com/
[17:35] <mathiaz> kirkland_: they're all libvirt/kvm bugs
[17:35] <soren> Sorry, guys. The real world is calling.
[17:36] <mdz> unless any of them are Critical importance, skip it
[17:36]  * soren runs off
[17:36] <mdz> soren, understood
[17:36] <kirkland_> mathiaz: ditto ... same thing.  kvm-72 was also clearly beta-quality code
[17:36] <mathiaz> kirkland_: ok - could go through them and decline them?
[17:36] <mdz> as a general policy, we should focus maintenance almost exclusively on the current stable and current LTS
[17:37] <mathiaz> kirkland_: and there is one bug in the jaunty list
[17:37] <mathiaz> http://us-jauntynominated.notlong.com/
[17:37] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://us-jauntynominated.notlong.com/
[17:37] <mathiaz> that's all for the SRU review
[17:38] <mathiaz> I'll write up a script to review which bugs have been assigned
[17:38] <mathiaz> and make sure they're not get stalled
[17:38] <kirkland_> mathiaz: i don't think that's SRU-worthy
[17:38] <mdz> mathiaz, thanks
[17:38] <mdz> [topic] Progress on Roadmap
[17:38] <MootBot> New Topic:  Progress on Roadmap
[17:38] <mathiaz> kirkland_: ok - I'll decline them
[17:38] <mdz> I'm not sure how this section normally works; I find it a bit confusing because the wiki page doesn't list the projects that most of you are working on
[17:38] <mathiaz> mdz: the Roadmap is not really up-to-date
[17:38] <mathiaz> mdz: we should skip it
[17:39] <mdz> mathiaz, we should also update the Roadmap, no? :-)
[17:39] <mdz> I'll ask ttx to take care of that when he gets back from his holiday
[17:39] <mathiaz> mdz: yes - that would be helpful
[17:39] <mdz> [action] ttx to update server team Roadmap to reflect current projects
[17:39] <MootBot> ACTION received:  ttx to update server team Roadmap to reflect current projects
[17:39] <mdz> [topic] AOB
[17:39] <MootBot> New Topic:  AOB
[17:39] <mdz> anything else?
[17:40] <mdz> canonical folks, remember there is a conference call immediately following this meeting
[17:40] <Daviey> fortunes-ubuntu-server got MIR approval.
[17:40] <Daviey> needs to be added to server seed.
[17:40] <Daviey> (and a version bump, to reflect some MIR review changes)
[17:41] <mdz> I've not been tracking that as a 9.10 feature
[17:41] <Daviey> nijaba: ^^ ?
[17:41] <nijaba> Daviey: MIR: bug #423667, FFe: bug #423678.  MIR has been granted, nothing has happened on FFe.
[17:42] <mdz> ok, so it's not actionable yet anyway
[17:42] <mdz> can we wrap up?
[17:42] <nijaba> mdz: it was not a tracked feature per say, more something that came along
[17:42] <Daviey> sure.
[17:43] <mdz> great, sorry for running so long, we had a lot to catch up on and this is my first server team meeting in a while
[17:43] <mdz> thanks a lot, everyone
[17:43] <mdz> [endmeeting]
[17:43] <mdz> #endmeeting
[17:43] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 11:43.
[17:43] <Daviey> thanks mdz
[17:43] <mdz> mathiaz, can I ask you to send out the notes and update the TeamReport?
[17:43] <mathiaz> mdz: sure
[17:55] <lieb> kernel meetiing in 5
[17:58] <lieb> Roll Call
[17:59]  * manjo waves 
[17:59]  * cking_ here
[17:59]  * jjohansen waves
[17:59]  * smb is here
[17:59]  * sconklin is here
[17:59]  * pgraner waves
[18:00] <lieb> #startmeeting
[18:00] <MootBot> Meeting started at 12:00. The chair is lieb.
[18:00] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[18:00] <lieb> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeam/Meeting
[18:00] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeam/Meeting
[18:00] <lieb> I will fill in Leann' status as we go along...
[18:00] <lieb> Last week's meeting cancelled due to team travel etc.
[18:00] <lieb> #startmeeting
[18:00] <MootBot> lieb, There is already a meeting in progress.
[18:00] <lieb> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeam/Meeting
[18:00] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeam/Meeting
[18:00] <lieb> I will fill in Leann' status as we go along...
[18:00] <lieb> Last week's meeting cancelled due to team travel etc.
[18:01]  * pgraner hears an echo
[18:01] <lieb> cut and paste silliness.
[18:01] <lieb> [TOPIC] Open Action Items: (apw) Check up on drdb status in dkms package and kernel
[18:01] <MootBot> New Topic:  Open Action Items: (apw) Check up on drdb status in dkms package and kernel
[18:01] <lieb> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeam/ReleaseStatus/Karmic
[18:01] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeam/ReleaseStatus/Karmic
[18:01] <apw> thats still hanging about
[18:02] <apw> i've not gotten to it as i was out
[18:02] <lieb> ok tnx
[18:02]  * amitk sneaks in
[18:02] <lieb> [TOPIC] Karmic Release Status: Bugs (Release Meeting Bugs / RC Milestoned Bugs / Release Targe
[18:02] <MootBot> New Topic:  Karmic Release Status: Bugs (Release Meeting Bugs / RC Milestoned Bugs / Release Targe
[18:03] <apw> ogasawara normally reports on those i think
[18:03] <lieb> yes.  I'll dump her status from lastweek
[18:03] <lieb> From ogasawara:
[18:03] <lieb> [LINK]  http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/ogasawara/hwdb/driver-stats.html
[18:03] <MootBot> LINK received:   http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/ogasawara/hwdb/driver-stats.html
[18:03] <lieb>  * I finally got around to writing a hwdb script to search for all known
[18:03] <lieb> drivers and the total number of owners.  In the future this will also
[18:03] <lieb> show the total number of bugs related to a specific driver as checkbox
[18:03] <lieb> just recently provided a way to save the hw profile submission id for
[18:04] <lieb> apport to link to a bug.  Note some drivers will have an "*" by their
[18:04] <lieb> name indicating LP timed out while gathering the data so the stats will
[18:04] <lieb> be inaccurate for those.
[18:04] <lieb> to blue pring status..
[18:04] <lieb> [TOPIC] Blueprints: kernel-karmic-kms (apw)
[18:04] <MootBot> New Topic:  Blueprints: kernel-karmic-kms (apw)
[18:04] <apw> kms is basically business as usual now
[18:04] <lieb> close?
[18:04] <apw> for intel, fixes coming down the pipe
[18:05] <rtg> apw, have you been following the GPU lockup issues?
[18:05] <apw> for radeon we are still waiting on that coming
[18:05] <apw> rtg not been aware of them no
[18:05] <apw> got a pointer to the discussion and i'll see what i can find out
[18:05] <cking_> which GPUs?
[18:05] <rtg> apw, ok, there appear to be some tools that help debug that
[18:05] <rtg> cking_, i915 so far
[18:05] <apw> i think there was at least one hang fix in the -rc9 fixes
[18:06]  * cking_ wonders if we need some GPU tests on the USB test dongle
[18:06] <lieb> apw, keep this open?
[18:06] <apw> i did see some discussion ongoing on making it use its own workqueues to help keep the machine up should it be hanging
[18:06] <rtg> apw, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/424055
[18:06] <apw> lieb, sounds like it to me
[18:06] <lieb> ok
[18:07] <lieb> next?
[18:07] <apw> rtg thx
[18:07] <lieb> [TOPIC] Blueprints: kernel-karmic-new-kernel-on-lts (rtg)
[18:07] <MootBot> New Topic:  Blueprints: kernel-karmic-new-kernel-on-lts (rtg)
[18:07] <rtg> lts kernel - was ready to upload last week but got side tracked by a  trip top St Louis
[18:07] <pgraner> rtg: its time to get QA involved to start testing this on the boxes we have
[18:08] <rtg> need to ask archive admins if I need a MIR. should sort that out this week.
[18:08] <pgraner> rtg: don't dump it into the archive yet
[18:08] <rtg> pgraner, ack
[18:08] <pgraner> rtg: lets get some cycles in testing
[18:08] <rtg> pgraner, I'll get a PPA version uploaded
[18:08] <pgraner> rtg: I have a call with QA today and we can work out a plan
[18:08] <pgraner> rtg: outstanding
[18:09] <rtg> lieb, thats all from me
[18:09] <lieb> [TOPIC] Blueprints: kernel-karmic-review-of-non-upstreamed-code (smb)
[18:09] <MootBot> New Topic:  Blueprints: kernel-karmic-review-of-non-upstreamed-code (smb)
[18:09] <smb> Remaining:
[18:09] <smb> - lenovo-sl: Partially updated, still has one update pending which needs
[18:09] <smb>              some more work.
[18:09] <smb> - lmpcm_usb: Has not been enabled for a while (patch to remove it ready)
[18:09] <smb>              This Logitech gizmo driver sounds like it should be supported
[18:09] <smb>              by the normal drivers by now but I have not been validating
[18:09] <smb>              this.
[18:09] <lieb> [TOPIC] Blueprints: kernel-karmic-sponsoring-staging-drivers (smb)
[18:09] <MootBot> New Topic:  Blueprints: kernel-karmic-sponsoring-staging-drivers (smb)
[18:10] <apw> that one is still on hold iirc
[18:10] <smb> No progress
[18:10] <lieb> ok open for next week
[18:10] <lieb> [TOPIC] Blueprints: kernel-karmic-suspend-resume (manjo)
[18:10] <MootBot> New Topic:  Blueprints: kernel-karmic-suspend-resume (manjo)
[18:10] <manjo> a lot of progress made on the USB testing last week
[18:10] <manjo> * bug reporting on failed results
[18:10] <manjo> * no suite selection dialog
[18:10] <manjo> * a 'view report' page at the end of the test
[18:10] <manjo> * the actual XML report file saved correctly
[18:11] <manjo> also marc is working on supporting HTML tags to descriptions
[18:11] <manjo> so that we can have RTF for descriptions
[18:11] <manjo> need to work on uploading test results to server
[18:12] <pgraner> manjo: rt ticket is filed, I'll ping IT today
[18:12] <lieb> tnx
[18:12] <manjo> pgraner, thanks a ton
[18:12]  * manjo over 
[18:12] <lieb> [TOPIC] Blueprints: kernel-karmic-wifi (rtg)
[18:12] <MootBot> New Topic:  Blueprints: kernel-karmic-wifi (rtg)
[18:13] <rtg> no progress this last week
[18:13] <pgraner> rtg: we missed this earlier I added it to the agenda
[18:13] <pgraner> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/409233
[18:13] <rtg> pgraner, can you still repro?
[18:13] <pgraner> rtg: which goes with the killswitch
[18:13] <pgraner> rtg: yep like a charm
[18:13] <pgraner> manjo: ????^^^^
[18:14] <rtg> pgraner, ok, its probably time to get focused
[18:14] <manjo> pgraner, want me to look at that one ?
[18:14] <pgraner> rtg: I'll test with the latest rc mainline to see if its there
[18:14] <pgraner> manjo: can't hurt
[18:14] <manjo> ok
[18:14] <pgraner> manjo: I can tell you that I've look at kernel.org bz
[18:14] <apw> manjo, there are some whats to test steps in the bottom of the bug
[18:15] <manjo> apw, yep reading that now
[18:15] <pgraner> manjo: and there are no reports and on LKML either
[18:15] <manjo> I have a 1330
[18:15] <apw> excellent
[18:15] <apw> there is anew -10 kernel as of about 20 mins ago you could test
[18:15] <apw> and thats a 31-rc9 kernel, for mainline comparison
[18:15] <pgraner> apw: ack
[18:16] <lieb> [TOPIC] Blueprints: kernel-karmic-better-power-mgt (amitk)
[18:16] <MootBot> New Topic:  Blueprints: kernel-karmic-better-power-mgt (amitk)
[18:16] <manjo> apachelogger, ack
[18:16] <manjo> apw, ack
[18:16] <bjf> remove from agenda?
[18:16] <amitk> lieb, no progress. This was supposed to be removed
[18:16] <lieb> done
[18:16] <lieb> [TOPIC] Other Release Tasks: AppArmor (jjohansen)
[18:16] <MootBot> New Topic:  Other Release Tasks: AppArmor (jjohansen)
[18:16] <jjohansen> AppArmor closed out bugs affecting security team #419308 #408473 #4084454
[18:17] <jjohansen>   #419222 #401931 #419505
[18:17] <jjohansen> turned #359338 over to jdstrand which he finished testing and closed
[18:17] <jjohansen> have a new bug #415632
[18:17] <apw> is that the only outstanding bug now?
[18:17] <lieb> keep open?
[18:18] <pgraner> lieb: yep
[18:18] <jjohansen> apw: no
[18:18] <lieb> ok
[18:18] <jjohansen> there are a couple tool bugs still open
[18:18] <jjohansen> I haven't looked at them yet, need to meet with kees over a couple issues
[18:19] <lieb> [TOPIC] Other Release Tasks: EC2 kernel (jjohansen)
[18:19] <MootBot> New Topic:  Other Release Tasks: EC2 kernel (jjohansen)
[18:19] <jjohansen> we managed to get a vanilla 2.6.31 kernel working late friday
[18:19] <jjohansen> it boots and gives console in all US east zones
[18:20] <jjohansen> #418130
[18:20] <jjohansen> we still don't have any idea why bug #398568
[18:20] <pgraner> jjohansen: so does this mean you can get us a Karmic kernel? If so can we make Alpha6?
[18:20] <jjohansen> is occuring and need to follow up with amazon, after we get some more detailed time with it one centos 5.0
[18:21] <jjohansen> pgraner: I believe so
[18:21] <jjohansen> I have the patches applied, but it is currently failing to link on some missing symbols
[18:21] <pgraner> jjohansen: we prob need to keep a daily irc meeting on this one until we have a solid kernel.
[18:21] <jjohansen> as far as I have gotten it is patching in some stuff
[18:21] <jjohansen> to the xen-tree
[18:22] <jjohansen> pgraner: sounds like a good idea
[18:22] <lieb> action?
[18:22] <pgraner> jjohansen: set up a time and channel, prob #ubuntu-kernel would be best, make sure the server team is invited
[18:23] <lieb> [ACTION] jjohansen: set up a time and channel, prob #ubuntu-kernel would be best, make sure the server team is invited
[18:23] <MootBot> ACTION received:  jjohansen: set up a time and channel, prob #ubuntu-kernel would be best, make sure the server team is invited
[18:23] <jjohansen> pgraner: okay, early morning  work best?
[18:23] <pgraner> jjohansen: up to the server team, works for most of us since your west coast
[18:24] <jjohansen> pgraner: okay I will check with the server team
[18:24] <lieb> more?
[18:24] <pgraner> lieb: not for now
[18:24] <lieb> [TOPIC] Other Release Tasks: ARM-Freescale (amitk, bjf)
[18:24] <MootBot> New Topic:  Other Release Tasks: ARM-Freescale (amitk, bjf)
[18:24] <bjf> i'm in the middle of rebasing mvl-dove to -rc9 and testing, that should be done today (real soon now)
[18:24] <amitk> I've rebased imx51 to -rc8 and currently testing.
[18:24] <rtg> bjf, just pushed a udeb name patch
[18:24] <amitk> will rebase to -rc9 soon
[18:25] <amitk> also working on bug 418238, bug 420447
[18:25] <rtg> the kernel udeb version thingy
[18:25] <bjf> rtg, ack
[18:25] <lieb> [TOPIC] Other Release Tasks: Union Mount Solution (apw)
[18:25] <MootBot> New Topic:  Other Release Tasks: Union Mount Solution (apw)
[18:25] <pgraner> lieb: that one is dead
[18:25] <apw> i think this one is closed now.
[18:26] <lieb> closed
[18:26] <apw> we are using aufs2
[18:26] <lieb> [TOPIC] Other Release Tasks: ARM-Freescale (amitk, bjf)
[18:26] <MootBot> New Topic:  Other Release Tasks: ARM-Freescale (amitk, bjf)
[18:26] <lieb> sorry..
[18:26] <lieb> [TOPIC] Security & bugfix kernels - Jaunty/Intrepid/Hardy/Others (smb/gnarl)
[18:26] <MootBot> New Topic:  Security & bugfix kernels - Jaunty/Intrepid/Hardy/Others (smb/gnarl)
[18:26] <smb> * Dapper:   2.6.15-54.79 (security)
[18:26] <smb> * Hardy:    2.6.24-24.59 (security)
[18:26] <smb>             2.6.24-24.60 (proposed)[17] 1/2 verifications
[18:26] <smb>             LUM-2.6.24-24.40 (proposed, uploaded today)
[18:26] <smb> * Intrepid: 2.6.27-14.39 (security)
[18:26] <smb>             2.6.27-14.41 (proposed)[8] 9/24 verifications
[18:26] <smb> * Jaunty    2.6.28-15.49 (security)
[18:26] <smb>             2.6.28-15.52 (proposed, uploaded today) 8/17 verifications
[18:26] <smb>                           1 regression caused by #228399 fixed by revert
[18:26] <smb> As always anyone listening/reading here and having bugs fixed in proposed,
[18:27] <smb> please update the bug with test information.

[18:27] <lieb> [TOPIC] Status: Karmic (rtg, apw)
[18:27] <MootBot> New Topic:  Status: Karmic (rtg, apw)
[18:27] <apw> we have just rebased to 2.6.31-rc9 based kernel
[18:27] <apw> this is expected to be the last -rc, though so was -rc8
[18:27] <apw> should have a .31 kernel in before beta
[18:28] <rtg> apw, likely late this week I think
[18:28]  * apw concurs
[18:28] <pgraner> We need to turn the troops on regression hunt and killing
[18:28] <pgraner> Then high pri bugs in that order
[18:28] <apw> pgraner, ack
[18:29] <lieb> [TOPIC] Status: ARM (amitk, bjf)
[18:29] <MootBot> New Topic:  Status: ARM (amitk, bjf)
[18:29]  * smb feels DejaVu
[18:29] <bjf> confused at to which meeting agenda we are following
[18:29] <pgraner> Yea, we just discussed that
[18:29] <bjf> that's covered already
[18:30] <lieb> [TOPIC] Status: Netbook (sconklin, apw)
[18:30] <MootBot> New Topic:  Status: Netbook (sconklin, apw)
[18:30] <sconklin> No work by me - apw?
[18:30] <apw> rebasing karmic netbook in progress.  should be ready tommorrow
[18:30] <apw> nothing else going on to my knowledge
[18:31] <pgraner> sounds like we can drop this one
[18:31] <lieb> [TOPIC] Incoming Bugs: (ogasawara)
[18:31] <MootBot> New Topic:  Incoming Bugs: (ogasawara)
[18:31] <pgraner> What I want to replace it with is manjo's netbook testing
[18:31] <pgraner> manjo: ^^^^^
[18:31] <apw> pgraner, sounds like a good plan
[18:31] <sconklin> ack
[18:31] <lieb> done
[18:32] <lieb> wrt bugs, see Leann's email from Sunday
[18:32] <lieb> [TOPIC] Open Discussion or Questions: Anyone have anything?
[18:32] <MootBot> New Topic:  Open Discussion or Questions: Anyone have anything?
[18:33] <lieb> move on?
[18:33] <apw> nothing here
[18:33] <cking_> silence
[18:33] <manjo> I will have the usb key image out for team testing sometime this week
[18:33] <manjo> comments & suggestions welcome
[18:33] <cking_> 'k
[18:33] <smb> ack
[18:34] <manjo> probably based on latest alpha/beta
[18:34] <manjo> and not alpha4 as I had said earlier ..
[18:34] <lieb> [TOPIC] Next Meeting Chair:
[18:34] <MootBot> New Topic:  Next Meeting Chair:
[18:34] <bjf> ogasawara is next i believe
[18:34] <lieb> Leann is next?
[18:34] <sconklin> didn't we have a list?
[18:34] <sconklin> where is the list?
[18:35] <cking_> alphabet?
[18:35] <manjo> sconklin, leann is next
[18:35] <lieb> motion to ajourn?
[18:35] <pgraner> ack
[18:35] <apw> seconded
[18:35] <lieb> #endmeeting
[18:35] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 12:35.
[19:00] <czajkowski> pgraner: what time is it over there?
[19:00] <pgraner> czajkowski: 1400
[19:01] <czajkowski> pgraner: cheers