[00:15] hello [00:15] hey TLF [00:15] using grub2 from alpha6 I'm unable to view boot menu, it just boots into ubuntu [00:15] what can I do? [00:16] TLF: not sure, but someone mentioned holding SHIFT on the forums [00:16] try SHIFT [00:17] left shift to be more correct [00:17] but even I, is having trouble getting it right [00:19] it works, thank you very much to both [00:20] but, may I ask, are there any options to change this behavior in grub.conf? [00:20] yes [00:28] TLF: Edit /etc/default/grub [00:28] Can I install Alpha6 over alpha5 without formating [00:29] compintuit: sure [00:29] just choose NOT to format [00:30] A y packages left? I want to at least get rid of usplash [00:30] Any* [00:30] a [00:30] ah? [00:31] TLF: You still here? [00:31] Will it remove the old packages? [00:31] not sure actually [00:32] AFAIK it should leave you with a clean instal [00:32] plus user space settings [00:32] Ah heck I'll just reformat, lucky if it boots! [00:32] Oh, /home is on another partition [00:55] drs305: yes [00:55] drs305: it's commenting a line, isn't it? [00:55] TLF: The default is to hide the menu unless you have another OS. Edit /etc/default/grub Uncomment the GRUB_TIMEOUT= line. Then run "sudo update-grub" [00:55] TLF: Use whatever timeout value you want, in seconds. [00:56] thanks, drs305 [00:57] TLF: I haven't seen the default. I assume it's commented ... [00:58] TLF: It's possible it's deactivated in another manner, but the comment would be my guess. [00:58] ok [00:58] I'll check and try, thanks :) [00:59] If the line is missing completely, just add it [01:03] well, that's a disappointing day. Installed karmic, only to discover google gadgets can't work on it. Tomorrow I'll have to reinstall back to 9.04 which does work with google gadgets. [01:07] Rods_Tiger, yeah, that's a bummer. Alphas are rough [01:08] I tried compiling that new version on my karmic system, but it wouldn't finish [01:26] i'm having trouble with my intel 5300 wifi card [01:27] it won't connect to my wide channel N network [01:27] it seems to try to connect in G mode [01:28] Ok it seems the .fdi file that xorg used is part of hal and hald right? [01:28] So i guess it's using HAL now. [01:28] my question is, how does HAL determine a device name for a match? [01:28] Dang, Rods_Tiger just logged off, but it looks like the Qt version of google gadgets runs just fine on karmic [01:29] don't know why I'm debugging this. I should go home :) [01:32] whooooo kernel panic [01:45] how do I get settings for shared folders to actually stay in 'shares-admin'? Each time I set it all up, the next time I go into it theres nothing there. [01:45] it's as if it's ignoring everything I do, or forgetting it. [01:52] Omg [01:53] I joined linux because of /proc [01:53] and now hal... hal is so beautyfull! [01:53] I just upgraded my test laptop to 9.10 Alpha 5 and it is getting stuck when trying to boot at starting NFS kernel daemon. It just sits there and never goes any further. I did notice that above it, "starting NFS common utilities" failed. Twice. [01:55] Bookman: Alpha 6 is released, could you see if this fixes your problems? [01:55] er, problem, rather [01:56] ah [01:56] Cynthia: was it released today? [01:56] Cynthia: Actually I did not now that. I just did a fresh upgrade tonight so I may just be running that! What kernel level is it using? [01:56] 2.6.31-10? [01:56] uname -a says: Linux voltorb 2.6.31-10-generic [01:56] Ok, same [01:56] actually, full output: Linux voltorb 2.6.31-10-generic #34-Ubuntu SMP Wed Sep 16 01:09:15 UTC 2009 x86_64 GNU/Linux [01:57] see the compilation date, it might be Sep 10 even for 2.6.31.10 [01:57] I will check....although tough to see if it won't boot! [01:57] All I can do is look in /boot to see what the latest rev is [01:58] With another install O/S [01:58] or a live cd [01:58] Bookman: you could always burn the Alpha6 disc on this computer you're using and reinstall unconditionally [01:58] it's not the best solution, but it is one [01:58] I have dual monitors, does anyone know how to adjust the graphic at startup (after login) so it's on one of the monitors instead of split between them? [01:59] Cynthia: yes but I'd really like to see what the problem is. That kind of is the point of trying Alpha releases, no? [01:59] :) [01:59] Bookman, I used the cd to chroot into my system and I was able to repair it [01:59] yes Bookman, but maybe the problem was already fixed, and it would be pointless to report it after Alpha6 when it's an A5 bug [01:59] see if A6 still does it, then you can try to debug [02:00] Canonical devs made a lot of fixes to Upstart and the boot process in general this week. [02:00] let me see.... [02:05] can anyone help me I get this error when i want to transfer a file via bluetooth [02:05] Couldn't execute command: nautilus --no-default-window "obex://[00:1F:00:BA:0E:8F]" [02:09] because there was a large load of updates to download today [02:09] Btw I finally got my touchpad working as I wanted as well! I'll try rebooting and if the fdi file works well I'll eb so happy! [02:10] cool, finally [02:13] I wonder what we're going to do about customizing mouse settings when hal is gone? [02:13] back to xorg.conf, i guess [02:14] Is it true then that hal's deprecated? [02:15] isn't it odd that xorg chose the last two versions to switch to it? [02:16] heh, yeah [02:16] I think at this point if xorg was not using hal we wouldn't even bother installing it [02:16] There are some other minor users but Xorg is the only big one not ported [02:16] Cynthia: I think the whole problem is with my grub. I have multiple operating systems on this machine and I don't think Ubuntu modified the correct grub [02:17] Bookman, you have both grub legacy and grub2? [02:17] How would I tell? [02:17] and grub legacy is in the MBR [02:18] What should it be ported to? udev or devicekit? [02:18] I'd check what grub looks like [02:18] Lars_G: yes [02:18] Cynthia: I have no idea what you mean [02:18] it's an either or question, can't be answered with a boolean [02:18] Lars_G: Actually DeviceKit is going away too [02:18] .... [02:18] If it's a text interface, it's grub legacy. And there's another way to tell: if you can hold LeftShift to launch it, it's grub2 [02:18] We're just using udev for device notifications [02:19] And what about configurations, like xorg? [02:19] back to xorg.conf as you said? [02:19] Amaranth: isnt' devicekit new? [02:19] Cynthia: leftswitch? [02:19] DeviceKit-disks and DeviceKit-power will still exist but the core "tell me about new devices" part is gone [02:19] left Shift [02:19] Lars_G: Yeah, back to xorg.conf [02:19] * Lars_G shoots himself [02:19] it's the key 2 below Tab, and the key 1 below Caps Lock [02:19] I kinda liked the idea of configuring xorg with .fdi files.... [02:19] why was hal deprecated? it was so nice.... [02:20] Damn it I just discovered the love of hal!!! [02:20] arrrrgh [02:20] hal is a mess [02:20] * Lars_G suffers a stroke [02:20] sudo apt-get install pacemaker [02:20] :) [02:20] hal became the dumping ground for things you needed to be root for that you wanted normal users to be able to do [02:20] Cynthia: hold left-shift during reboot? [02:20] Yes Bookman [02:20] udev hal upstart dbus.... soo many event subsystems... [02:21] am i forgetting any? [02:21] you could probably technically include compiz in there if you wiggled the rules a bit :P [02:21] Cynthia: see, normally Ubuntu modifies the incorrect grub. I normally just boot into mint, modify the grub to reflect the new kernel and reboot. All is well. Now it is not working. [02:21] it's basically an event manager for the plugins [02:22] Amaranth: how? isn't compiz just a window manager (like metacity, kwin, xfce, etc)? [02:22] Cynthia: I like that you're a voice of tranquility in here [02:22] Cynthia: If I boot into recovery mode, uname -a give 2.6.28-11 kernel. Even though I changed the menu.lst to 2.6.31-11 [02:22] maccam94: it's an event manager and bag of functions for the plugins :P [02:23] Bookman: I'm not entirely sure what your configuration is, sorry. When you boot, does Left-Shift work? Or does GRUB say "Press ESC to enter the menu... 2... 1..." [02:23] + question mark [02:23] it'd be nice if xorg used dbus [02:23] but as I said, that's stretching it a bit [02:23] xorg uses dbus [02:23] for config [02:23] Lars_G: A voice of tranquility? :o [02:23] to talk to hal :P [02:23] Amaranth: compiz without any plugins still handles basic window management though [02:23] maccam94: Not really [02:23] My audoi just randomly dies on me [02:23] audio [02:23] maccam94: windows have no decorations, you can't minimize/resize/move them, you can't change workspaces, etc [02:24] pulseaudio [02:24] The only thing you get running compiz with no plugins vs not running any WM is focus handling [02:24] Amaranth: you can't move/order/resize? i knew there were no decorations but... [02:24] Hmmm I wonder if I have audio again [02:24] hmph [02:24] maccam94: Not without the move, place, and resize plugins :) [02:24] oh yeah resize is a plugi... o_O [02:24] *plugin [02:24] is it a bug that kills pulseaudio? [02:25] haha [02:25] Cynthia: If I use left-shit to reboot, I get a strange text message, then I press enter, get a bunch more, press enter get a ton more that look like a text listing of menu.lst. Then it finally comes up with the regular grub boot screen [02:25] I don't have audio in Totem, though MPEG-2 demux and decode works [02:25] Amaranth: i recall that there used to be debates over what should be dbus vs hal functionality [02:25] some event sounds don't work, but otherwise I'd say I have decent sound [02:25] maccam94: You mean dbus system activation? [02:25] yes I have audio!!! [02:25] Amaranth: i'm guessing hal got cannibalized from the hardware (udev) and software (dbus) sides until there wasn't really a need for it anymore? [02:25] music! [02:25] weeeee [02:26] congrats Lars_G :) [02:26] Cynthia: that's what I meant [02:26] maccam94: it's clear, hal handles starting things when devices are plugged in, dbus handles starting things when someone running wants to talk to them [02:26] Or really it's the audio in youtube that's died now [02:26] flash, not youtuve, flash [02:26] maccam94: More like udev does basically everything hal ever did [02:26] flash and audio used in the same phrase is the synonym of "eternal pain" [02:26] Lars_G, Yes, of course, sorry [02:27] Amaranth: hotplug wise yes, configuration wise not. [02:27] Lars_G: Java and audio are the same [02:27] maccam94: And we have policykit and dbus system activation for the things you want regular users to be able to do even though they need root access [02:27] Sun Java, at least. It accesses /dev/dsp. [02:27] maccam94: so yeah, I guess you got it right :) [02:27] Cynthia: wait until you try to code JavaFX [02:27] Amaranth: what does upstart do that udev could never do? [02:27] is there a problem with flash and audio in alpha 6? [02:27] Lars_G: no thanks :p [02:27] maccam94: udev doesn't have callouts [02:28] Amaranth: callouts? [02:28] maccam94: With hal you can say "when this hardware is plugged in run this app" [02:28] maccam94: With upstart and upstart reading udev events you can make an upstart job do the same thing [02:28] Amaranth: so upstart is basically replacing hal? [02:29] maccam94: No, upstart is replacing callouts in hal [02:29] upstart is the equivalent to hotplug I guess [02:29] no... [02:29] maccam94: upstart, udev, and dbus have had the features of hal almost as long as hal has existed [02:29] Upstart is init + hal [02:29] But no one ever put it all together [02:30] Amaranth: What I care for is atomized configuration that can be shared in a communal manner [02:30] yeah i'm just sensing like there's something unnecessary here, there's a way things could be more streamlined [02:30] Well, I guess upstart came late but no one cared about callouts anyway :P [02:30] Cynthia: I have sda1 with Ubuntu on it, and sda6 with Mint on it. My machine seems to want to boot to the sda6/boot/grub/menu.lst. Ubuntu modifies sda1/boot/grub/menu.lst. Does that help describe my setup? [02:30] maccam94: Not really [02:30] maccam94: They all 3 work together to handle what they're good at [02:31] Bookman: when you setup grub, you tell it the partition where it'll read it's config from, you can only set one afaik [02:31] we've got hardware and services... what other types of events are there? [02:31] Bookman: You could merge mint's and ubuntu's /boot into a mixed extra partition [02:32] Bookman, yes. What I recommend is to make one single partition with all the kernels and the single grub config --> set it as the 'root' in GRUB --> install it there. then tell both Linuxen (Mint + Ubuntu) that you want to mount that new partition as /boot, in /etc/fstab. [02:32] upstart handles starting your system and starting services based on hardware events, udev handles hardware events, dbus handles communication between them all and starting services when another program is trying to communicate with them [02:32] So udev+upstart runs things based on hardware events, dbus runs things based on user events [02:32] basically [02:33] couldn't one system handle hardware? [02:33] udev does that [02:33] Cynthia: ok, beyond me. [02:33] Caveats: You have to make this new boot partition as a primary partition, sda1-sda4; you have to mark it as bootable; you may have to perform some extra steps in the BIOS [02:33] upstart is needed anyway to boot your system so feeding udev events into upstart is a pure win [02:34] And, if you use initrd images you need to put and read them in your /boot partition [02:34] (note: I don't think upstart getting udev events works yet :P) [02:34] upstart getting udev events would be cool ;) [02:35] no more need to run a smartcard daemon 24/7 [02:35] Bookman: ls /dev/sda* [02:35] where does the event go when i want to adjust my laptop screen brightness? [02:35] or can't you access anything on that machine right now? [02:36] JanC: No more need to run cups and bluetooth daemons and modemmanager for users who have no such hardware [02:36] Cynthia: Sorry, I had to get the charger for it in the basement. [02:36] sigh [02:36] Bookman: ok [02:36] Cynthia: the thing that still tires me is that the machine goes to sleep every time I plug or unplug the ac [02:36] Cynthia: I am booted into Mint on sda6 at the moment [02:37] Bookman: I don't know Mint, but does it have GPartEd or any intuitive partition editor? (I don't think 'parted' counts) [02:37] For sure. It is Ubuntu [02:37] Bookman: Ok. Do 'ls /dev/sda*' in a terminal and tell me the numbers it says [02:38] I remember someone saying a lot of cruft needs to be cleaned off gnome before power management is fixed [02:38] Amaranth: upstart triggers software based on hardware events. what about triggering hardware based on software events? or would upstart just spawn daemons to handle such input? [02:38] maccam94: Err, that'd be dbus system activation, I guess [02:38] Cynthia: sda, sda1, sda2, sda5, sda6, sda7 [02:38] Lars_G: I have no idea about power management. Is your computer a desktop, a laptop or a netbook? [02:38] Amaranth: i thought dbus was software to software [02:39] (Who knows, this might be a desktop with a UPS) [02:39] Cynthia: netbook [02:39] maccam94: You need to give me a concrete example, I have no idea what you mean [02:39] Bookman: Ok. Can you resize sda2 so it has 128 less megabytes, and create an ext3 partition right after it? [02:39] Amaranth: laptop hotkeys for brightness, wifi, etc [02:40] oh, that's actually udev [02:40] those are hardware events [02:40] brightness keys go to udev? [02:40] o_O [02:40] Keypresses, that is [02:40] Lars_G: I remember that happening with my laptop actually, it was mostly the screen turning off and locking itself if I plugged it 3 times in 10 seconds (unstable power made it trip past that, easily) [02:40] that sort of keys is ACPI-based often [02:40] Nah in this case it's been borked for about four weeks, it worked well before. [02:40] Cynthia: not letting me resize. I sudo gparted [02:41] basically it goes to sleep (in memory suspend) every time I plug or unplug the ac [02:41] You press the brightness key, it gets converted into something X will understand as the brightness key, X tells gnome-power-manager about it, gnome-power-manager tells.... I got lost [02:41] Bookman: try sda1 then [02:41] Amaranth: and udev would talk to dbus to show the notifications? [02:41] the first conversion (something X would understand) is handled by udev [02:41] JanC: and brightness is also controlled by acpi sometimes [02:41] Ooh, that's right, we still have DeviceKit-power [02:41] That's where gnome-power-manager sends it [02:42] This stack can be hard to follow sometimes :) [02:42] Cynthia: so, you want me to create 128MB of free space Following the sda1 [02:42] i think it might be a bit messy [02:42] maccam94: nah, everything is handling what it is supposed to [02:43] Yes Bookman [02:43] maccam94: and udev only gets involved in brightness keys when your OEM did something stupid like make them not real keys [02:43] Amaranth: what handles when i hit the kill switch on my wifi card? [02:43] maccam94: udev [02:43] "non-keyboard keys" [02:43] Amaranth: isn't there an rfkill daemon? [02:43] Cynthia: primary? [02:43] maccam94: I don't think so [02:44] This part is new [02:44] Bookman: yes. And for the filesystem, use ext3 or ext2 [02:44] maccam94: There is an rfkill command if you want to do it from userspace [02:44] Cynthia: created. ext3, primary [02:44] And heck, udev might not even be involved in this, it depends on how that kill switch works [02:44] It could be all in hardware, it could be all in the kernel [02:45] i think hal is confusing me [02:45] But anything to do with hardware events that aren't keypresses and mouse clicks that userspace would want to know about go through udev [02:45] because right now lots of hal daemons control things [02:46] right, hal does too much [02:46] Bookman: ok. Now you'll need to edit both Mint's and Ubuntu's /etc/fstab file, to refer to what you just created. (sudo gedit /etc/fstab is fine) [02:46] but doesn't X grab keypresses and mouse clicks? [02:46] maccam94: Right, I said other than those [02:46] the line should look like this: /dev/sdaNEWNUMBER /boot ext3 defaults 0 2 [02:47] NEWNUMBER is the number of the partition that gparted just made, I think it'll be sda3 [02:47] Cynthia: oops, I forgot to apply in gparted. Working............ [02:47] Sorry [02:47] No worries [02:48] what hal used to do is now handled by udev, devicekit-disks, devicekit-power, dbus, and (eventually anyway) upstart [02:48] Amaranth: and udev will now talk directly to dbus? [02:48] nope [02:49] you use libudev and libgudev (glib wrapper) to work with udev [02:49] ...which i would consider part of udev...? [02:49] yeah [02:49] rather maybe udevd doesn't talk to dbus, but dbus may listen to udevd? [02:50] you could make a daemon that listens to udevd and uses dbus to forward such messages [02:50] but that's hal :P [02:50] well yeah, i'm trying to figure out how those communications happen without hal [02:50] udev sends out events using its own system [02:51] but you wouldn't see those in your X session [02:51] those libraries are how you communicate with udev [02:51] although it's one-way communication, you can't tell udev anything [02:51] i mean right now i'm mainly thinking of notify-osd notifications [02:51] notify-osd is completely different [02:51] notify-osd uses dbus, no? [02:51] it does [02:52] but if you mean notifications for battery and brightness and such those have always been handled by gnome-power-manager [02:52] so if i want to see notifications of a power cable being unplugged, or see how high the brightness is set, or how much battery life is remaining... [02:53] there would need to be some sort of communication between udev and dbus [02:53] gnome-power-manager was responsible for showing those when hal was around and it's just as responsible for showing those now that we're using udev and devicekit-power [02:53] another example not involving power would be plugging in an audio cable [02:54] I guess pulseaudio could handle such things ;) [02:54] pulseaudio or a plugin to gnome-settings-daemon [02:54] with the realtek driver on a windows machine i have, if i plug a speaker cable into the microphone jack on my laptop, it will tell me i've connected an output device and make the port act like an audio output [02:54] Cynthia: this is taking awhile. You must have thought I either had a tiny hard drive or a really, really, really fast one before! [02:55] Bookman: I didn't expect it to take a very short time [02:55] I resized a partition before, of 20 GB, and it took 6 hours [02:55] 6 HOURS??????????????????? [02:55] Bookman: resizing or moving partitions with gparted takes longer than it would take to backup the partitions, wipe them out, and restore the backups [02:55] Amaranth: not always [02:55] But it preserves UUIDs etc., which is desirable here :) [02:55] This is 100 GB so I'm beat for the night then? [02:56] Bookman: come back in 24 hours [02:56] Oh crap. [02:56] gparted is very protective [02:56] it does everything in such a way to make sure nothing is lost [02:56] The 20 GB partition only took 6 hours to resize because gparted took the 128-block copy [02:57] after every step it runs fsck [02:57] I don't know why it thought this was optimal [02:59] Shoot.....ok, maybe a complete wipeout and fresh install is the best idea. I would have thought an upgrade would handle my situation better. I guess not. [03:00] Multibooting with two grubs is not the best idea, unfortunately [03:00] You have to use only one, and dump the configuration there, and make all Unix-based OSes honor the same configuration [03:00] otherwise things start to not work, as you saw [03:00] Yeah, I thought that the distros would look for that. [03:00] Hey, I have to learn. [03:01] yeah :) [03:01] You do that by making both distros use this same partition as /boot [03:01] you can put each OS's GRUB in the partition boot record, and a main grub in the MBR that runs the OS-maintained ones as some sort of "submenu" ;) [03:01] I have never had a problem on a single machine with an upgrade. Just a problem with Ubuntu and multiple o/s's [03:01] JanC: but that requires more advanced stuff like chain-loading [03:02] does it not? [03:02] indeed [03:02] bookman, you could do that if you weren't afraid of editing the config manually [03:02] (you want to learn, hm? :) [03:02] nah, each o/s is different. [03:03] Multi distro setups is new then? [03:03] It seems to be kind of raw [03:03] you could use GAG as the main bootloader, as it has a built-in menu-based UI to configure it ;) [03:03] hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm [03:03] it is raw, the bootloader uses these hard disk references -- as seen by the BIOS -- to boot your OSes [03:04] Yeah, and drive assignments are another nightmare. [03:04] hence why it's not sda3 or whatever, it's going to be (hd0,2) [03:04] yeah [03:04] ok....I hope I have a cd of 9.04 here still! [03:04] the problem with bootloaders is that there is no agreement about how OS's can cooperate in their configuration [03:05] JanC: hey, complex task! [03:05] I understood the risk, hence the test machine [03:05] it's not that complex, if OS writers wanted to cooperate [03:05] good point! [03:05] starting with MS of course [03:05] No need [03:06] Just obsolete their stuff. [03:06] well, considering that most computers still need Windows, there is no point it cooperating nicely between linux distros and then being wiped away by Windows 7 [03:07] Might be so. My business and personal machines have no need for Windows [03:07] that's why I was taught to install Linux last in my classes [03:07] but users are not going to know this [03:08] No, Linux will never dominate until pre-installed. [03:08] well, if you have Ubuntu now, and need Win 7 when it gets released, there is no way you could have installed Windows first ;) [03:08] (ProTIP: Linux installed last will make GRUB the bootloader and detect Windows, adding a chainload entry) [03:08] JanC: Aye :P [03:09] Cynthia: ok, my 24 hours is complete! [03:09] Already, Bookman? That was quick! :) [03:09] sda3 it is [03:09] things might be better on EFI systems though (but I haven't one, so can't test that :) ) [03:09] (good little laptop) [03:09] or CoreBoot systems [03:10] Anyway. Now you need to copy the files in Linux Mint's /boot directory to this new partition, and for that, you need to mount it. [03:10] sudo mkdir /mnt/sda3 && sudo mount /dev/sda3 /mnt/sda3 [03:10] sudo cp -r --archive /boot/* /mnt/sda3 [03:11] Now, I did not follow your other instructions yet though [03:11] oh, the fstab thing, right [03:11] Correct, I did not do that yet [03:11] remember that you'll need to do this in Ubuntu too, so write that part down [03:12] Yes, but I can access ubuntu from Mint, correct? [03:12] oh, you could, you need to mount it in much the same manner [03:14] im having some problems running kiba dock in karmic it freezes everytime i click to add stuff to it [03:14] I can mount via nautilus [03:15] Easy Peasy [03:18] Now, my current fstab refers to hda1 and hda5 and hdc [03:18] Not sdaX [03:20] Actually those are commented. It just refers to hdc which is my cd [03:22] bookman, most of the partitions are mounted by UUID, but I don't know the UUID of the partition you just created. I guess you could get the UUID with the 'blkid' utility [03:22] im trying to find the folder that stores all the app launchers , as in if i wanted to add a app to my dock [03:22] and have you copied the files to /mnt/sda3 yet? [03:23] sbin is close but the icon arent [03:23] Cynthia: you know what? This is way too complicated for the average experimenter I'm afraid. [03:23] webbb82: application launchers refer to icons, and they're in /usr/share/applications [03:23] icons are in /usr/share/icons [03:23] Cynthia, thank you [03:24] Cynthia: forums and maillists make it sound so easy. Just dual boot. [03:24] bookman: I agree. which is why I usually rely solely on installers to configure my grub [03:24] redhat's installer, ubuntu's and CentOS's as of yet [03:24] Cynthia: but the average experimenter would not know that. [03:25] Or maybe I missed a huge step [03:25] for dual booting, with any sort of half-complicated setup, automatic grub configuration is not guaranteed to work if both OSes don't have the same partition as /boot :s [03:26] Bookman: are you giving up now, or shall I try to continue? I must warn you, I don't really know my way around grub as I once did - that's what GUI installers do to you [03:27]