[02:54] <maco> hey guys
[02:54] <maco> what kind of bot is Kubottu?
[03:00]  * ScottK guesses apachelogger is the one that would know.
[03:04] <ScottK> OK, all the -security/-proposed patches for KDE 4.2 are in the backports packages now.
[03:16] <JontheEchinda> maco: he's an rbot
[03:16] <maco> JontheEchinda: thanks
[07:05] <rgreening> ScottK: bug 436648 - I assume Software Center is a happier name :)
[09:34] <Riddell> good morning, how's beta week looking?
[09:34] <Riddell> I wonder if KDM works
[10:08]  * apachelogger finds it interessting that KDM broke to begin with
[11:31]  * seele yawns
[11:32]  * Nightrose waves to seele and thanks for blog ;-)
[11:32]  * seele waves back
[11:42] <Riddell> well KDM seems to work
[11:42] <Riddell> Tonio__: did you find anything out about getting rid of that kbluetooth dialogue?
[11:52] <Riddell> french translations seems pretty complete
[11:59] <Riddell> except for openoffice that is
[12:01] <jussi01> Riddell: Ive a small bug in open office here, care to confirm?
[12:01] <jussi01> open an existing presentation, click save as, at the bottom of the save dialog, you have 4 tick boixes, 3 of them without descriptions
[12:02] <apachelogger> known bug
[12:02] <jussi01> apachelogger: ok, thanks.
[12:02] <apachelogger> the kde file dialog in ooo is somewhat broken
[12:02] <jussi01> pls fix kthxbai :P
[12:03] <jussi01> also, is the "not connected when connected icon" in knetworkmanager on someones todo?
[12:04] <apachelogger> *shrug*
[12:04]  * apachelogger gave up on knm 4 cycles ago
[12:06] <Riddell> I have no problems with knm currently
[12:09] <apachelogger> well, it doesn't show any wifi networks on my laptop it seems
[12:09] <apachelogger> anyway, gotta get myself a new hair cut :)
[12:09] <jussi01> Riddell: I still have the bug where when connected to a wired network it shows a disconnecte icon
[12:11] <jussi01> says on LP that its fixed, however Im fully updated...
[12:11] <jussi01> bug 404309
[12:11] <jussi01> although thats in the plasmoid it seems
[12:14] <jussi01> screenshot here: http://imagebin.ca/view/Yl2akDFC.html
[12:16] <Riddell> jussi01: that's connected
[12:16] <jussi01> o.O
[12:17] <jussi01> SO what does disconnected look like?
[12:17] <Riddell> not an ethernet cable
[12:17] <jussi01> ok. Maybe the icon needs a re work then, because that to me screams disconnected.
[12:18] <jussi01> thanks for clarifying though.
[12:28] <Quintasan> Shouldn't mplayerthumbs depend on mplayer or mplayer-nogui, not only on mplayer?
[12:51] <Tonio__> Riddell: yep I'll patch this, probably toonight
[12:51] <ghostcube> hi humans
[12:51] <Tonio__> Riddell: I'm just back to paris in fact
[12:51] <Tonio__> Riddell: also I'll push the patch upstream
[12:52] <Tonio__> Riddell: talking about knetworkmanager, it sometimes crashes and restart, then I get 2 icons in the systray, one of them not responding to clicks
[12:52] <Tonio__> Riddell: no idea if I'm the only one concerned
[13:00] <wstephenson> hi, could someone check what the latest version of knetworkmanager available for 9.04 is?
[13:01] <wstephenson> i am getting a lot of bug reports for fixed bugs and i fear it is going to be something like svn revision 1017xxx and nothing fresher
[13:32] <wstephenson> Riddell: horses-mouth ping
[13:35]  * seele wonders what that means
[13:35] <wstephenson> as in "straight from the horses mouth"
[13:35] <seele> ah hah
[13:35] <wstephenson> since nobody answered my general query and friendly kubuntu users i asked privately couldn't find out
[13:36] <wstephenson> but then allegedly "riddell has some packages with 1017xyz, but only for karmic"
[13:36] <wstephenson> and those could be installed on jaunty right?
[13:36] <wstephenson> i have 188 duplicate bug reports from people using that svn revision knetworkmanager on "9.04"
[13:43] <Riddell> hi wstephenson
[13:43] <jussi01> !info knetworkmanager jaunty-backports
[13:43] <Riddell> sorry was busy doing upgrade testing
[13:44] <Riddell> https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ppa/+archive/backports  plasma-widget-networkmanagement   0.1~svn1023224-0ubuntu1~jaunty1
[13:44] <wstephenson> jussi01: it's something like plasmoid-network-management not knetworkmanager
[13:44] <jussi01> ahh
[13:44] <wstephenson> Riddell: are there any stale 1017xyz versions in anyone else's repo?
[13:45] <Riddell> I seem to have 0.1~svn1017841 in my PPA
[13:45] <Riddell> wouldn't expect anyone is using that but I can delete it
[13:46] <wstephenson> Riddell: please do
[13:46] <wstephenson> 188 users seem to be using it
[13:46] <jussi01> and 0.0+svn966653-0ubuntu0.1 is in jaunty normal repos.
[13:49] <Riddell> wstephenson: all gone
[13:49] <wstephenson> Riddell: would it be possible to correct the package version number?  1017841 was 0.8, 102xxxx is 0.9
[13:49] <Riddell> wstephenson: yes although not until next week, beta freeze this week
[13:50] <wstephenson> Riddell: want me to add a todo to nag you next week?
[13:50] <Riddell> sure :)
[14:03] <ScottK> rgreening: That was a sabdfl decision, I understand.
[14:04] <ScottK> Riddell: On the topic of KDM, the regression is in fact fixed, but I stil can't log out successfully.
[14:05] <wstephenson> are you shipping policykit-1 or the earlier versions, btw?
[14:09] <ScottK> Policykit-1 in Karmic
[14:10] <JontheEchidna> there's no kde frontend, though
[14:11] <Riddell> Version: 0.9-4ubuntu1 of libpolkit for Kubuntu
[14:12] <rgreening> ScottK: yeah. I thought it would make you happier though :)
[14:13] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: ouch...
[14:13] <ScottK> rgreening: It does, a bit.
[14:13]  * rgreening 2 ScottK
[14:13] <ScottK> Policykit + KDE is a feature goal for KDE 4.4.
[14:14] <rgreening> so, do we need a KDE front end? or the gtk/gnome nust be installed?
[14:14] <JontheEchidna> nothing we have requires it yet
[14:14] <Riddell> it's why we're on an old version of packagekit
[14:18] <wstephenson> i see
[14:18] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: reason I ask was I did a clean install the other day, and could not get authed to used kpackagkit...
[14:18] <JontheEchidna> rgreening: kpackagekit still uses policykit 0.9, by virture of packagekit using 0.9
[14:19] <wstephenson> does ubuntu allow co-installing both the old packagekit and the new one (for gnome) then so kpackagekit can work?
[14:19] <wstephenson> fedora are shipping the gnome auth agent in -kde, looks like we will do the same since nobody has time to rewrite polkit-qt and write a kde UI.
[14:19] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: well, it was busted on a clean install the other day. Hav't tried in last two days...
[14:21] <rgreening> wstephenson: we'll need to add it to the seeds I guess... ScottK, Riddell ^
[14:21] <Riddell> UDS sponsorship deadline today https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2009-September/000622.html
[14:21] <Riddell> anyone who hasn't filled in the form should
[14:21] <JontheEchidna> rgreening: packagekit doesn't use policykit-1
[14:21] <JontheEchidna> your bustage is a totally separate issue
[14:21] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: hmm... what are we shipping then? Im confused
[14:22] <JontheEchidna> regular old policykit 0.9
[14:22] <rgreening> and what is wstephenson referring too then... heh
[14:22]  * rgreening see this all through a shady haze of winter
[14:22] <Riddell> he's talking about policykit 1.0
[14:23] <Riddell> which in the way of these kits is incompatible
[14:23] <wstephenson> JontheEchidna: is polkit 0.9 coinstallable on *buntu with 1.0 ?
[14:23] <Riddell> wstephenson: yes
[14:23] <wstephenson> otherwise i can imagine updates breaking...
[14:25] <rgreening> lol
[14:34] <ScottK> Riddell: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdebase-workspace/+bug/432521/comments/3
[14:36] <Riddell> ScottK: I can confirm that, milestoned
[14:58] <yuriy> Riddell: kdm wasn't working for me yesterday.
[14:59] <Riddell> yuriy: how about today?
[15:00] <yuriy> was there an update? i'll give it a try
[15:00] <Riddell> no
[15:00] <Riddell> does "start kdm" work ?
[15:00] <Riddell> what's in /etc/init/kdm.conf ?
[15:01] <davmor2> Riddell: you forgot the magic of sudo ;)
[15:02] <Riddell> I concur with rgreening, kpackagekit isn't working
[15:03]  * yuriy wonders why he has to fsck every time he boots
[15:05] <rgreening> Riddell: something broke within the last 5 days I believe...
[15:06] <rgreening> Riddell: but only on the live install. Updating with a current system.. my kpackagkit is still working
[15:06] <rgreening> not sure why...
[15:23] <yuriy> Riddell: it seems to be working now, dunno what happened yesterday
[15:34] <Quintasan> karmic rocks!
[15:49]  * apachelogger falls in
[15:49] <apachelogger> Quintasan: disagree
[15:49]  * Quintasan gets a tape and tapes apachelogger
[15:50] <apachelogger> I am taped it seems
[15:50] <apachelogger> freeze--
[15:51]  * apachelogger prepares bzr push
[15:53] <Quintasan> oh, looks like two less plasmoids in archive
[15:53]  * apachelogger is not sure if he likes that but probably does
[15:53] <Quintasan> amarok and kopete runners are in kdereview
[15:54] <apachelogger> technical those are not plasmoids :P
[15:54] <apachelogger> having them packaged is about as useless as the python plasmoids though :P
[15:55] <Quintasan> well I only packaged kopete runner :P
[15:55] <apachelogger> ah darn it
[15:55]  * apachelogger syncs qt bzr branch with archive
[15:55] <Quintasan> lol
[15:56] <Quintasan> I uploaded some packages to ubuntu and I was like: "WTF why there are not in REVU?"
[15:56] <apachelogger> huh?
[15:56] <apachelogger> dont get that
[15:57] <apachelogger> Riddell: should I not get round to poke into it ... the bzr qt branch holds a fix that makes the package create kdeqt.pot
[15:57] <Quintasan> I forgot to put revu in command and did "dput sauce.changes"
[15:57] <apachelogger> that template then somehow needs to be hooked up with that comes in via kde-l10n
[15:58] <apachelogger> Quintasan: oh
[15:58] <apachelogger> in dput.cf
[15:58] <apachelogger> [DEFAULT]
[15:58] <apachelogger> default_host_main   = notspecified
[15:58] <apachelogger> [notspecified]
[15:58] <apachelogger> fqdn = SPECIFY.THE.STUPID.ARCHIVE
[15:58] <apachelogger> incoming = .
[15:58] <Quintasan> hmm, which input method the plasmoid uses? xim or ibus?
[15:59] <apachelogger> Quintasan: that pretty much forces you into providing a name :)
[16:00] <Quintasan> lol, thanks
[16:00] <Riddell> apachelogger: great
[16:00] <Riddell> apachelogger: I can't persuade you to come to UDS I suppose?
[16:02] <apachelogger> nope, I might get arrested in a public toilet, happens quite often in texas I have been told ;)
[16:02]  * Quintasan lol'd very hard
[16:03] <apachelogger> though on a more important matter I will start studying soonish, and I'd rather not get out of the loop the first semester
[16:04] <apachelogger> I should be able to attend >=10.10 though
[16:05] <Riddell> more studying?
[16:05] <rgreening> apachelogger: you only get arrested if you slide your briefcase to the side, tap your foot and hum softly to the person in the next stall, at least according to Boston Legal :P
[16:06] <apachelogger> Riddell: university this time http://portal.tugraz.at/portal/page/portal/TU_Graz/Studium_Lehre/Studien/Softwareentwicklung_bak
[16:06] <ghostcube> :O new episodes for boston legalö ???
[16:06] <ghostcube> where ?
[16:06] <ghostcube> :D
[16:06] <rgreening> haha.. that last last season I believe. season 4? maybe
[16:06] <apachelogger> rgreening: hm, I am quite sure I would go beyond that :P
[16:07] <rgreening> And I believe they ended the show at season 5.
[16:07] <rgreening> apachelogger: hahah
[16:07] <rgreening> I bet...
[16:07] <apachelogger> talking about tv entertainment
[16:07] <apachelogger> I am the doctor
[16:08] <apachelogger> and I will heal our reputation
[16:08] <rgreening> lol
[16:08]  * apachelogger gets his sonic screwdriver and jumps right at the problems
[16:08] <rgreening> oh oh oh.. I want one
[16:10]  * Quintasan is looping one track in Amarok since yesterday
[16:11] <apachelogger> that happened to me once
[16:11] <apachelogger> only noticed after half a day
[16:11] <apachelogger> was too busy with other things to notice anyway though :P
[16:11] <Quintasan> the problem is I 've done it on purpose :P
[16:11] <apachelogger> now that is kinda weird
[16:12] <Quintasan> I wonder how's Shaman and Raptor Menu doing
[16:12] <apachelogger> isnt shaman a package manager or something?
[16:12] <Quintasan> it is
[16:13] <Quintasan> far better than packagekit imo
[16:13] <Quintasan> +k
[16:13] <Quintasan> or it was "way better"
[16:13] <Quintasan> hmm
[16:14] <JontheEchidna> Man, the next Doctor Who special isn't until November
[16:14] <JontheEchidna> oh, that's next month
[16:14] <apachelogger> xmas special is going to be epic
[16:14] <JontheEchidna> it's a two-parter, I hear
[16:15] <apachelogger> that is the rumor
[16:15] <ghostcube> wants frindge back
[16:15] <ghostcube> i love pacy inside of frindge
[16:15] <ghostcube> :D
[16:16]  * apachelogger is sure looking forward to torchwood season 5
[16:16] <apachelogger> season 4 was quite awesome alright
[16:16] <ghostcube> nah
[16:16] <ghostcube> torhwood bah
[16:16] <ghostcube> -_-
[16:16] <ghostcube> why is everyone loving this damn soap
[16:16] <ghostcube> :D
[16:17] <apachelogger> john barrowman is considerable hot, even though he is >40y
[16:17] <apachelogger> though that might not be the main reason :P
[16:18] <Quintasan> meh, I want my japanese input back
[16:18] <apachelogger> Quintasan: I really must wonder how you manage to break stuff that often
[16:18] <Quintasan> apachelogger: my skill in breaking things is over 9000 ;P
[16:18] <Quintasan> apachelogger: also skim isn't working since 4.0 :P
[16:19] <Quintasan> now I have input method plasmoid but dunno if it uses ibus or xim :/
[16:20] <apachelogger> cool
[16:20] <apachelogger> so localization for all of asia is broken since 8.10?
[16:21] <Quintasan> propably yes
[16:22] <apachelogger> rofl
[16:22] <apachelogger> and you said karmic rox :P
[16:22] <apachelogger> anywho
[16:22] <apachelogger> even better: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/quassel/+bug/427335 last comment
[16:23] <rgreening> apachelogger: new torchwood!?!?!??! OMG awesome. Loved that show
[16:23] <apachelogger> see, even rgreening likes john barrowman :D
[16:23] <Quintasan> apachelogger: well its possible to use input methods once again :P
[16:23] <rgreening> Im straight and think he's awesome :)
[16:23] <rgreening> haha
[16:23] <apachelogger> rgreening: rumor has it that some dude from BBC america stated that there will be a 5th season
[16:24] <rgreening> cool
[16:24] <rgreening> The last mini series was awesome. My wife even watched and loved it
[16:24] <rgreening> I want a UNIT series :P
[16:25] <apachelogger> yeah, loved it, also they got the music right for once
[16:25]  * rgreening agrees. very moving
[16:25] <maco> rgreening: thatd be awesome. a series full of Dr Martha Jones
[16:25]  * rgreening has started collecting the Doctor Who and Torchwood BBC books
[16:25] <rgreening> Martha was the best
[16:25] <maco> but she's going to Law & Order: London :(
[16:25] <rgreening> nooooooo
[16:25] <rgreening> :(
[16:25] <apachelogger> oh well
[16:25] <apachelogger> UNIT
[16:26] <apachelogger> like they just wanted to blow up earth in the season finale of DW season 4 :P
[16:26] <apachelogger> bastards
[16:26] <rgreening> hah
[16:27]  * rgreening orders sonic screwdriver set from amazon
[16:27]  * apachelogger giggles
[16:27] <maco> also: after that mini-series, it seems we wont get to ogle John Barrowman in future Torchwood.  Jack left :( But maybe Gwen's in charge now?
[16:30] <apachelogger> hm, unlikely
[16:30] <apachelogger> getting rid of Gareth David-Lloyd was bad enough :P
[16:31] <apachelogger> maco: the leaving was possibly just shown because they were not sure there will be another season
[16:31] <apachelogger> educated guess that is
[16:32] <steveire> Hi.
[16:32] <steveire> How do I build the sesame2 backend from nepomuk on kubuntu?
[16:32] <steveire> http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.kde.devel.buildsystem/4767
[16:33] <steveire> What am I missing from there?
[16:34] <JontheEchidna> sudo apt-get build-dep soprano-backend-sesame should get you all that you need
[16:35] <JontheEchidna> then you'll be able to build it
[16:37] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna, steveire: that will install the openjdk though ... which requires export JAVA_HOME=/usr/lib/jvm/java-6-openjdk
[16:38] <apachelogger> AFAIK that is
[16:38] <Quintasan> wut, where is dontzap?
[16:38] <apachelogger> got moved to kxkb
[16:39] <apachelogger> ohhhh
[16:39] <apachelogger> that is not translated
[16:39] <apachelogger> -.-
[16:40] <steveire> apachelogger: I've already got the jdk
[16:40] <apachelogger> then you possibly just need to export the java_home var
[16:41] <steveire> Ok, I did that, and it worked.
[16:41] <steveire> I'm very surprised that I have to manually set an env var like that.
[16:41] <steveire> Usually packages do that for me, right?
[16:42] <apachelogger> not really
[16:43] <apachelogger> you could have multiple jdks installed
[16:43] <apachelogger> so setting the var would require the packages to somehow know which one is best choice or something
[16:44] <Quintasan> はははは
[16:44] <Quintasan> lol
[16:44] <Quintasan> works
[16:44] <Quintasan> :D
[16:44] <apachelogger> oh dear
[16:45] <apachelogger> oh
[16:45] <apachelogger> fun
[16:45] <Quintasan> karmic > all
[16:45] <apachelogger> the whole keyboard layout kcm is not translated here
[16:45] <apachelogger> very weird
[16:45]  * apachelogger checks laptop
[16:45] <apachelogger> hum
[16:45] <apachelogger> there it works
[16:45] <apachelogger> weird
[16:47] <Quintasan> ばか！
[16:48] <maco> Quintasan: well thats not very nice
[16:48] <Quintasan> maco: not directed at anyone :P
[16:49] <maco> so how'd you do that? i usually use scim (not skim) and umm...well i found out i have to set an environment var then lauch app from same shell and blah blah :(
[16:49] <steveire> So how do I permanently set JAVA_HOME systemwide?
[16:50] <Quintasan> maco:  sudo aptitude install ibus ibus-anthy, place Input Panel Method somewhere, run ibus-setup and Add anthy
[16:51] <Quintasan> maco: then you need to manually set input method for each window to ibus manually, press ctrl+space and you are ready to go
[16:51] <maco> ok thanks
[16:52] <maco> do i need ibus-qt4?
[16:52] <Quintasan> propably
[16:52] <Quintasan> wtf, why rand() returns same numer each time? (C++)
[16:52] <Quintasan> number*
[16:59] <yuriy> Quintasan: you probably need to seed it
[17:00] <apachelogger> I find it funny that usually bugs in any language other than english get rejected but apport is allowed to report in any language
[17:01] <apachelogger> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/32615839/DpkgTerminalLog.txt
[17:01] <apachelogger> ideas?
[17:02] <apachelogger> the postinst of akonadiprivate only contains a call to ldconfig
[17:06] <Quintasan> some progress on PK in shaman == FTBFS
[17:06] <Quintasan> :D
[17:07] <ScottK> Lovely.  Kpackagekit crashes while trying to update packages and then Apport kindly explains the bug can't be reported because I have obsolete packages.
[17:07]  * ScottK goes back to apt.
[17:08] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: that usually means the post-inst script is corrupted
[17:11] <JontheEchidna> nothing we can fix from a package standpoint. But it's quite a sticky situation for the user.
[17:11] <ScottK> Makes it reasonably impossible to report upgrading bugs on packagekit
[17:21] <rgreening> Riddell: I think we should register the KDE ubuntu/debian bzr branches with CIA. Can we discuss doing this at UDS (or sooner)?
[17:22] <Riddell> rgreening: for what purpose?
[17:22] <rgreening> Riddell: attacha bot here for one to see changes being made...
[17:22] <rgreening> CIA is a great way to track changes
[17:23] <rgreening> and you can subscribe to the RSS feed for it
[17:23] <JontheEchidna> didn't apachelogger do something like that with kubotu?
[17:23] <rgreening> so you can track changes in a package you ar einterested in.
[17:23] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: doesn't seem active if he did...
[17:23] <rgreening> or I am unaware of it.
[17:24] <JontheEchidna> well, yeah. Just saying that we might already have some infastructure in place for that
[17:24] <rgreening> I found it extremely useful in developing usb-creator with evand under ubuntu-installer. We used CIA and had RSS feeds of the project. I was always aware of changes.
[17:24] <rgreening> Riddell: ^
[17:24] <rgreening> especially when more than one is working on a change...
[17:25]  * rgreening thinks it would be useful.
[17:26]  * JontheEchidna too
[17:26] <rgreening> It's also nice to know when someone has committed a bit you wish to test.
[17:27] <rgreening> without having to go and manually check or ask if it was updated...
[17:27]  * rgreening think automagic it nice
[17:28] <rgreening> brb.. rbt
[17:29] <JontheEchidna> it's currently planned to make kdm start really early on in the boot process, right?
[17:30]  * yuriy is afraid of "currently planned" a month before release
[17:31] <JontheEchidna> if all else fails, I don't think it'd be too hard to revert to usplash at the last moment
[17:32] <JontheEchidna> just wondering where to place a bug saying that there's no splash screen
[17:37] <rgreening> anyone else having issues with indicator icon not "indicating" when new messages are showing up?
[17:37] <JontheEchidna> for me the indicator always has the not-new-mail icon
[17:38] <JontheEchidna> even though the indication items show up in the applet just fine
[17:38] <JontheEchidna> the icon just never changes
[17:39] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: yeah. exactly. It did work a little while back.. but stopped...
[17:39] <rgreening> Riddell: ^ something to bug agateau with if you see him before I do
[17:39] <rgreening> "see" being "is online"
[17:40] <rgreening> :P
[17:40] <apachelogger> rgreening: it causes quite the flood
[17:41] <rgreening> apachelogger: what does? CIA?
[17:41] <apachelogger> any kind of commit notification
[17:41] <apachelogger> also, CIA integration would require client side submission
[17:41] <rgreening> if it is busy flooding, thats good, means we are developing
[17:41] <apachelogger> or something that hooks into launchpad branches and submits to CIA
[17:41] <apachelogger> rgreening: makes discussion difficult though
[17:41] <rgreening> apachelogger: look at #ubuntu-installer. we do it there.
[17:42] <apachelogger> that is one branch
[17:42] <rgreening> in fact, there are pages on ubuntu docs as to how to set it up
[17:42] <apachelogger> not >20
[17:42] <rgreening> apachelogger: maybe is can be setup for RSS only or go to a kubuntu-devel-cia channel
[17:43] <rgreening> if you are afraid of floods
[17:43]  * rgreening doesn't see an issue
[17:43] <apachelogger> for RSS it still would output each rss entry which represents one commit :P
[17:43] <rgreening> #ubuntu-installer has ubiquity, usb-creator, etc... btw apachelogger
[17:43] <apachelogger> that still does not make >20, does it :P
[17:44] <rgreening> apachelogger: In that suggestion I assumed a RSS feed one would sub to and not on the channel though (in that case)
[17:44] <apachelogger> also, with more movement towards bzr based development the amount of stuff kubuntu would be interested in rises
[17:44] <rgreening> stop being argumentative for the sake of being argumenetative :) hahah
[17:44] <rgreening> :P
[17:44] <apachelogger> srsly
[17:44] <apachelogger> there is a problem
[17:44] <apachelogger> use vs. disruptiveness
[17:45] <rgreening> gak!
[17:45]  * rgreening goes back to bieng non-productive
[17:46] <apachelogger> lol
[17:46] <apachelogger> sweet baby jesus
[17:46] <apachelogger> I am in the urgent need of making my sister stop singing
[17:47] <apachelogger> that is worse than a cat crying
[17:47] <apachelogger> seriously
[17:47] <apachelogger> wtf
[17:47] <jussi01> apachelogger: turn up your music....
[17:47] <apachelogger> aye
[17:47] <apachelogger> Roeyksopp!
[17:47] <apachelogger> GO AWAY :D
[17:49] <apachelogger> hm
[17:49] <apachelogger> whatever happened to the bot anyway
[17:53] <apachelogger> kubotu: hi
[17:53] <kubotu> re apachelogger :D
[17:58] <jussi01> ~np apachelogger
[17:58] <kubotu> apachelogger is listening to "Go Away" by Röyksopp [The Understanding (bonus disc), 2005]; see http://www.last.fm/user/apachelogger for more
[17:59] <ejat> ~np jussi01
[17:59] <kubotu> jussi01 listened to "What If You" by Joshua Radin [We Were Here] 5 days ago; see http://www.last.fm/user/jussi01 for more
[18:13] <txwikinger_work> this is odd.. copying selections from qt-based apps does not work anymore.. but other apps do
[18:14] <Riddell> davmor2: have you tested wubi on kubuntu recently?
[18:14] <davmor2> not today why I've been doing uec
[18:14] <davmor2> I can fire up an install in about 15 minutes-ish
[18:15] <davmor2> Riddell: ^
[18:16] <Riddell> davmor2: I just havn't tried it all cycle, but I presume you must have at some point?
[18:16] <davmor2> hahahahahahahahaha yes
[18:17] <txwikinger_work> all cycle? can you install wubi on wine?
[18:19] <rgreening> ~np rgreening
[18:19] <kubotu> rgreening is listening to "The Islander" by Nightwish [Dark Passion Play, 2008]; see http://www.last.fm/user/rgreening for more
[18:19] <rgreening> \o/ works again for me :)
[18:19] <txwikinger_work> rgreening: I found a couple of reproducible bugs for arora
[18:20] <txwikinger_work> but it is on jaunty and version 0.8... so I am not sure if that is still relevant
[18:20] <apachelogger> kubotu: rescan
[18:20] <kubotu> saving ...
[18:20] <kubotu> rescanning ...
[18:20] <kubotu> done. 10 core modules loaded; 50 plugins loaded; 33 plugins ignored; 1 plugin failed to load
[18:20] <apachelogger> identica status
[18:20] <apachelogger> kubotu: identica status
[18:20] <kubotu> http://2tu.us/sjt Konversation vs. Quassel swarm (15 days, 1 hour, 46 minutes and 34 seconds ago via choqoK)
[18:20] <apachelogger> hrrr
[18:20] <apachelogger> <= leet
[18:20] <rgreening> heh. ok... yeah, 0.9.0 has lots of fixes
[18:21] <apachelogger> kubotu: identica dent just made rbot able to dent... I suppose
[18:21] <kubotu> incorrect usage, ask for help using 'kubotu: help identica'
[18:21] <txwikinger_work> Is there a 0.9 package for jaunty?
[18:21] <apachelogger> darn you
[18:21] <Riddell> ~identica update hello
[18:21] <kubotu> incorrect usage, ask for help using 'kubotu: help identica'
[18:21] <apachelogger> ah
[18:21] <rgreening> dont think so... Riddell JontheEchidna ^ arora backport of rjaunty?
[18:21] <apachelogger> kubotu: identica dent just made rbot able to dent... I suppose
[18:21] <kubotu> status updated
[18:21] <apachelogger> kubotu: identica status
[18:21] <kubotu> just made rbot able to dent... I suppose (7 seconds ago via rbot)
[18:22] <apachelogger> yay
[18:22]  * apachelogger does the doctor dance
[18:23] <Riddell> ~identica update hello from #kubuntu-devel
[18:23] <kubotu> incorrect usage, ask for help using 'kubotu: help identica'
[18:24] <txwikinger_work> rgreening: Doesn't matter... I think I will try to install the kamic beta somewhere and check it there before submitting any bugs
[18:24] <apachelogger> Riddell: you need to use dent
[18:24] <Riddell> ~identica dent hello from #kubuntu-devel
[18:24] <kubotu> good evening Riddell :D
[18:24] <kubotu> status updated
[18:24] <Riddell> groovy, if inconsistent
[18:24] <apachelogger> kubotu: rescan
[18:24] <kubotu> saving ...
[18:24] <kubotu> rescanning ...
[18:24] <kubotu> done. 10 core modules loaded; 50 plugins loaded; 33 plugins ignored; 1 plugin failed to load
[18:25] <apachelogger> Riddell: now update should work as well
[18:25] <apachelogger> anyway, I need to give that another shot currently it copies the twitter plugin, even though statusnet got all fancy twitter-like api which enables one plugin to be used for both services since only the root url changes
[18:26] <davmor2> Riddell: unless cjwatson and evand have fixed things then wubi and grub2 weren't playing nicely together but I need to try an install before beta to see if evand got the fix in for cjwatsons mod
[18:26] <rgreening> ~identica new arora package 0.10.0 will be out this week. available in karmic shortly after.
[18:26] <kubotu> incorrect usage, ask for help using 'kubotu: help identica'
[18:26] <rgreening> ~identica update new arora package 0.10.0 will be out this week. available in karmic shortly after.
[18:26] <kubotu> you must identify using 'identica identify [username] [password]'
[18:27] <rgreening> ~identica identify rgreening Gumby007
[18:27] <kubotu> the command must not be given in public
[18:27] <rgreening> lol
[18:27]  * rgreening changes pass
[18:28]  * Riddell tries  ssh rgreenin@198.165.63.165 to no success
[18:28] <apachelogger> meh
[18:28] <Riddell> how do I get identi.ca talking to facebook?
[18:28] <apachelogger> you don't I suppose
[18:29] <Riddell> the website has a Connect -> Facebook tab but all it says is "There is no Facebook user connected to this account."
[18:29] <rgreening> identica identify
[18:29] <rgreening> grr
[18:29] <rgreening> ~identica help
[18:29] <kubotu> incorrect usage, ask for help using 'kubotu: help identica'
[18:29] <rgreening> kubotu: help identica
[18:29] <kubotu> identica status [nick] => show nick's (or your) status, use 'identica friends status [nick]' to also show the friends' timeline | identica dent [status] => updates your status on identi.ca | identica identify [username] [password] => ties your nick to your identi.ca username and password | identica actions [on|off] => enable/disable denting of actions (/me does ...)
[18:30] <apachelogger> Riddell: it does?
[18:30] <apachelogger> fancy
[18:30] <apachelogger> rgreening: query kubotu
[18:30] <apachelogger> then do the identify there
[18:30] <rgreening> how
[18:30] <seele> Riddell: you might need to configure identi.ca in Facebook first
[18:30] <rgreening> kubotu: identica identify rgreening
[18:30] <kubotu> incorrect usage, ask for help using 'kubotu: help identica'
[18:30] <rgreening> ~kubotu identica identify rgreening
[18:30] <kubotu> incorrect usage, ask for help using 'kubotu: help identica'
[18:30] <apachelogger> ah
[18:30] <Riddell> seele: ah hah, I might
[18:31] <apachelogger> Riddell: rendering bug
[18:31] <apachelogger> underneat that message is an image to connect with facebook
[18:31] <Riddell> although that would reset my facebook outtime again
[18:31] <rgreening> kubotu: identica
[18:31] <kubotu> incorrect usage, ask for help using 'kubotu: help identica'
[18:32] <rgreening> ~identica update new arora package 0.10.0 will be out this week. available in karmic shortly after.
[18:32] <kubotu> status updated
[18:32] <rgreening> ~identica status
[18:32] <kubotu> new arora package 0.10.0 will be out this week. available in karmic shortly after. (8 seconds ago via rbot)
[18:32] <rgreening> yay
[18:32] <rgreening> lol
[18:36] <JontheEchidna> Nightrose: http://imagebin.ca/view/kGf2Tz.html <- that should be a yes/no message box instead of an ok/cancel one
[18:38] <Nightrose> JontheEchidna: indeed - can you file a bug or give me a patch? then i will take care of getting it changed after tagging
[18:38] <Nightrose> sorry - too much going on right now
[18:39] <Riddell> was about to say, poor Nightrose isn't a magic bug proxy :)
[18:39] <JontheEchidna> yeah, same here or else I'd have a patch
[18:39] <Nightrose> hehe
[18:39] <Riddell> even if sometimes she acts like one
[18:39] <Nightrose> Riddell: i should add that to my elevator pitch ;-)
[18:40] <JontheEchidna> I'll file a bug when I get back, brb
[18:40] <Nightrose> thx
[19:02] <apachelogger> kubotu: dent @maninalift I am not sure I understand
[19:02] <apachelogger> kubotu: identica update @maninalift I am not sure I understand
[19:02] <kubotu> status updated
[19:02]  * apachelogger is wondering if rbot does shortcuts
[19:23] <neversfelde> How can I configure my soundcard in Karmic without asoundconf?
[19:59] <Quintasan> Riddell: how long it takes until list of sposored atendees is announced?
[20:12] <Riddell> Quintasan: I've no idea
[20:15] <blueyed> Is it by design that apport isn't used for crashes in Karmic anymore?
[20:20] <Riddell> blueyed: no, it's still enabled in /etc/default/apport
[20:20] <blueyed> Riddell: but KDE apps use the KDE crash handler now.. since a few days at least, e.g. KMail.
[20:20] <blueyed> "Crash Reporting Assistant"
[20:21] <Riddell> blueyed: what's in /etc/default/apport ?
[20:21] <blueyed> enabled=1
[20:21] <blueyed> maxsize=209715200
[20:21] <blueyed> pretty much the defaults I'd say.
[20:22] <Riddell> kill -SEGV still brings up apport here
[20:22] <blueyed> nothing in /var/log/apport.log - seems like some hook is missing.
[20:22] <blueyed> I'll try that..
[20:23] <blueyed> Riddell: not for me.. just tried with kate.
[20:24] <blueyed> Updates as of yesterday.
[20:27] <rgreening> Riddell: should apport-kde be running multiple times? I have 8 instances running now apparantly. Looks like it isn't closing the app correctly on exit.
[20:27] <blueyed> The new KDE crash handler is really nice though..
[20:27] <yuriy> rgreening: so it is still hanging. damn.
[20:27] <rgreening> seems so
[20:27] <yuriy> blueyed: I get apport here. you have apport-kde installed?
[20:28] <blueyed> no. since it did not work for reporting bugs.. (fixed by now IIRC). Is this required? I thought that's just the frontend?!
[20:29] <blueyed> (that's what the desc says, too)
[20:30] <blueyed> "kill -SEGV" on gedit triggers apport.
[20:32] <yuriy> and you get the gtk version? well i guess it's tied to it somehow then.
[20:33] <yuriy> need to check the crashing patch in kdelibs
[20:33] <blueyed> no.. I have no update-manager running, which looks for reports.. it's just being written to /var/crash
[20:33] <Riddell> is update-notifier-kde running?
[20:33] <blueyed> update-manager-kde has a memory leak, therefore I do not have it running all the time.
[20:33] <blueyed> Riddell: no
[20:33] <Riddell> ah well, that's it then
[20:34] <blueyed> but why do KDE apps check for update-notifier-kde, but other apps don't?
[20:34] <Riddell> other way around
[20:34] <Riddell> update-notifier-kde checks for crashes
[20:34] <Riddell> which doesn't expl
[20:34] <Riddell> which doesn't explain how other apps wouldn't need it
[20:35] <blueyed> Riddell: well.. with e.g. gedit a crash gets written (but not picked up). But with kate, no crash gets written.
[20:35] <Riddell> blueyed: are you running KDE?
[20:35] <blueyed> when apport kicks in, a report gets written (and I manually call apport-gtk/-kde from time to time).
[20:35] <blueyed> Riddell: sure.
[20:36] <blueyed> ..but no, for KDE apps no report gets written, but the kde crash handler kicks in.
[20:36] <Riddell> blueyed: do you have /usr/share/apport/apport-kde ?
[20:36] <blueyed> I'll try with update-notifier-kde installed.
[20:37] <blueyed> Riddell: no, I did not have it.
[20:37] <Riddell> then /that's/ the problem
[20:37] <blueyed> Riddell: prolly the apport mechanism checks, if apport-$foo is installed?
[20:37] <blueyed> ok, let me try.
[20:38] <yuriy> yes i believe the don't-use-drkonqi patch checks for it
[20:40] <blueyed> yes, with apport-kde being installed, apport kicks in.. sorry for the noise! However, I think that's bad, since it's only meant to be the frontend..!
[20:40] <blueyed> should I file a bug about it, or is it by design?
[20:41] <yuriy> I think if apport-gtk is installed that should work too, so file a bug against kdelibs
[20:41] <yuriy> assign to me
[20:42] <blueyed> yuriy: is it necessary that any frontend is installed?
[20:42] <blueyed> I think we should just let apport decide if it wants to kick in.
[20:43] <yuriy> blueyed: hmm. I'm not sure
[20:44] <blueyed> why not?
[20:45] <ScottK> Riddell: Looks like Kubuntu amd64 alternate is oversized.
[20:52] <yuriy> blueyed: well I think if apport is not installed dr konqi should be used
[20:56] <Riddell> ScottK: I took off a langpack earlier today
[21:01] <blueyed> yuriy: but apport _is_ installed, just apport-kde wasn't.
[21:08] <yuriy> blueyed: right, you had the apport-gtk front-end, but if that wasn't installed either, don't you think dr konqi should have been popping up?
[21:11] <JontheEchidna> what are we going to do when apport is disabled for crashes on final release?
[21:16] <ScottK> Riddell: I thought we were going to stick with upstream KDE on the default notification stuff?
[21:19] <yuriy> JontheEchidna: good question, I think the plan was to decide that as we get close
[21:19] <yuriy> so.. next meeting
[21:21] <blueyed> yuriy: I think, if apport is installed and enabled, use it, regardless of frontend. If it is not installed, or disabled, use DrKonqi.
[21:21] <blueyed> yuriy: after all.. apport-kde being installed but apport being disabled, should trigger DrKonqi, too - shouldn't it?
[21:21] <yuriy> mhmm
[21:26] <ScottK> Riddell: Switching the battery critical notification from a notification to a dialogue got totally rejected upstream.  I think it is a mistake for us to take on such a patch we will have to maintain indefinitely.
[21:27] <davmor2> Riddell: wubi still broken :(
[21:27] <ScottK> BTW, I also got such a notification today on suspend with the lid closed when the battery was full, so inaddition to being against upstream, it's also bugged.
[21:29] <yuriy> ScottK: ML thread link?
[21:29] <ScottK> Hard to miss in the kde-devel ml archive
[21:30] <apachelogger> we do outsmart upstream again?
[21:30] <neversfelde> kid3 does not build with taglib 1.6
[21:31] <ScottK> apachelogger: We did.
[21:31] <apachelogger> cool
[21:37] <yuriy> ScottK: kde-devel? don't see it there
[21:41] <JontheEchidna> might have been kde-core-devel
[21:41] <ScottK> IIRC it was on two lists
[21:46] <ScottK> yuriy: Thread starts at http://lists.kde.org/?l=kde-core-devel&m=125362617220332&w=2
[21:46] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: It was core-devel
[21:46] <yuriy> found it, wow it is a long thread
[21:46] <JontheEchidna> \o/
[21:46] <ScottK> The conclusion was pretty clear though.  This patch has not one chance in a thousand of going upstream.
[22:00] <yuriy> ok aseigo has it summed up pretty well in this one in actually useful terms http://lists.kde.org/?l=kde-core-devel&m=125366899423674&w=2 if those things are indeed "easy to solve" how about a patch for that?
[22:05] <Riddell> my reading of the meeting was that we wanted the patch as a sensible change (if the computer is about to be shut down I want to be notified very clearly), I have a vauge recollection of seele wanting the change although I could be wrong
[22:05] <yuriy> mhmm. but bigger buttons, no collapsing and at least 15 seconds would do the trick for me at least
[22:06] <Riddell> I don't think maintainance is an issue, it's agateau's problem.  should be easy enough to get agateu to make it apply only in ayatana mode though if that's what people want
[22:07]  * seele looks around
[22:07] <seele> huh?
[22:07] <neversfelde> Riddell: new amarok is in bzr and currently building in the ninja ppa. Don't know when it will be released.
[22:08] <seele> so i thought on critical notification the computer automatically sleeps after n seconds unless the user cancels the process, yes?
[22:08] <rgreening> I wish Ayatana notifications would have a fullscreen do not disturb mode for KDE! <- Riddell maybe its on the list for agateau
[22:09] <Riddell> seele: yes
[22:14] <seele> Riddell: then yes, it should be a popup dialog and not a bubble notification. the computer is about to do something automatically and the user should be well aware of that
[22:15] <seele> maybe the change wasnt explained well enough to upstream
[22:15] <yuriy> I think it was
[22:15] <seele> or they just had a stick up their butts from the other ayatana changes and rejected everything
[22:16] <yuriy> they are dead set against any kind of dialog. and to an extent they have a point -- I for one would be satisfied with aseigos proposed "easy" changes
[22:17] <seele> that's stupid to be against any kind of dialog, they have a purpose and this is an excellent use of one
[22:17] <seele> bubbles have a greater chance to be missed where a popup dialog will steal focus and attention
[22:17] <Riddell> I wonder if the low disk space notifier should be a dialogue or a notification
[22:17] <seele> the computer is about to shut down, that is a pretty good reason to steal the user's attention
[22:17] <seele> Riddell: depends, is it a warning or critical?
[22:18] <Riddell> warning (200MB to go)
[22:18] <Riddell> if we want actions on our notifications we should use a notification for the restricted installer stuff rather than yet another  systray icon, that would be consistent with kpackagekit too
[22:18] <seele> notification bubble might be ok for that, but it should be pinged to repop every n seconds
[22:19] <seele> can we also set it if it hits 50MB to use a popup? or not really?
[22:19] <yuriy> Riddell: +1, never got why that gave me an extra icon that sticks around for no reason
[22:19] <seele> 50MB left on a partition is scary, especially if you are downloading something
[22:19] <seele> but i guess 50MB on a netbook is a lot of room
[22:19] <Nightrose> neversfelde: didn't i add you to the packagers list? i wrote the release date in my email ;-)
[22:19] <Nightrose> and thanks for packaging already :)
[22:20] <Riddell> neversfelde: yes thanks, was going to ask
[22:20] <Riddell> seele: we could although mostly we just steal the patch from suse and slap it in
[22:20] <neversfelde> Nightrose: a yes, there it is :)
[22:21] <seele> Riddell: eh, put it on a list and we can make it a papercut for karmic+1
[22:21] <seele> whatever it's called
[22:21] <seele> lucid
[22:21] <Riddell> good idea
[22:22] <Riddell> then we can claim the patch as our own and finally put it upstream :)
[22:23] <yuriy> what's suse's patch?
[22:23] <Riddell> low disk space notification
[22:28] <nixternal> didn't we do that patch for kde3 about 3 or so years ago?
 but i guess 50MB on a netbook is a lot of roomn a netbook is a lot of room
[22:29] <Nightrose> it is
[22:29] <Nightrose> the constant warning gets annoying at some point if you're constantly running on around 100mb free space ;-)
[22:30] <seele> Nightrose: yeah
[22:32] <yuriy> Nightrose: the system is usable with a constant 100mb free space?
[22:32] <Nightrose> yuriy: it's all relative if you only have 4 gb ;-)
[22:33] <Nightrose> i removed a ot of crap i don't need on the netbook a week ago or so
[22:33] <Nightrose> that improved a lot
[22:33] <Nightrose> but a default kubuntu install isn't so nice on 4 gb
[22:34] <Nightrose> specifically i removed all of pim and lots of bindings stuff
[22:34] <Nightrose> and i think OOo
[22:34] <Nightrose> oh and amarok
[22:34] <Nightrose> damn did that free up a lot
[22:34] <Nightrose> :(
[22:53]  * rgreening doesn't understand why KDE upstream isn't willing to negotiate or discuss.. it seems they cry "I want help" but when people try to show them how to make things better they cry foul and "dont touch my stuff".. of course thats a oversimplification :)
[22:54]  * rgreening thinks OSS got lost somewhere along the way during localization
[23:22] <ScottK> Riddell: My recollection was we thought things could be improved, but I don't recall deciding to go against upstream.  As it is, the patch is seriously bugged.  I got the dialogue on resume from suspend when the battery was fully charged.
[23:23] <ScottK> seele: "the computer is about to shut down, that is a pretty good reason to steal the user's attention" was discussed upstream and the conclusion was it was OK to make the notification more visible, but that dialogues from out of nowhere we wrong.
[23:25] <ScottK> rgreening: When the entity offering help is stuck on silly designs (oh no, we can't let the user actually do anything when we notify them), I think it's quite natural to be careful of their other ideas.
[23:25]  * ScottK doesn't think Ayatana is going to get very far with either Gnome or KDE upstream as long as they stick to that.
[23:25] <rgreening> careful != stubborn
[23:26] <rgreening> I've seen too much negativity all around
[23:26]  * rgreening thinking on switching to E17
[23:26] <rgreening> :P
[23:26] <rgreening> or freedos
[23:26] <rgreening> hah
[23:26] <ScottK> rgreening: There was a lot of openness to fixing the notification and extending the timeout.  But KDE has a view that apps should do dialogues and the system should use notifications.
[23:27] <rgreening> Im thinking from a usability perspecitve, wouldn't the usability experts have some weight?
[23:28] <ScottK> Yep, unfortunately none of those were consulted.
[23:28] <rgreening> heh
[23:28] <rgreening> I though seele had weighed in
[23:29]  * rgreening digresses
[23:29] <ScottK> Riddell: If it's agateau's to maintain, I'll just drop it after beta until it's fixed.
[23:39] <Riddell> ScottK: if it's broken, yes, maybe I should take my power cable out and test it