[00:00] slangasek: I don't know. I simply put it back to the way things were before. I'll have a look. [00:00] slangasek: afaik originally they conflicted. [00:01] TheMuso: ah, indeed they do [00:01] TheMuso: perhaps ia32-libs needs to have a Conflicts: added in the other direction? [00:02] they originally conflicted and there was a bug about that [00:02] I think you need to revert slightly less far - I think that was fixed at one point? === bjf is now known as bjf-afk [00:06] Anyway, I'll have a look today. [00:06] cjwatson: I'm not sure that's true; my recommendation (which, er, somehow isn't in the list web archive?) was to put alsa back into ia32-libs [00:06] It will take me several hours to upload ia32-libs as it is. [00:06] yeah [00:06] ia32-libs is in universe, not blocking anything for beta, so take your time [00:06] slangasek: that may be, I might be misremembering === milli` is now known as milli [00:15] cjwatson, TheMuso: reviewing the current state: lib32asound2-plugins is built from alsa-plugins, which build-depends on libpulse-dev, which has no biarch equivalent; so we end up with a biarch plugins package without the key default plugin - I think that binary package should be nuked entirely for karmic, and ia32-libs have a conflicts: added only if that conflicts: is needed for upgrades from jaunty [00:15] slangasek: Ok I can take care of both. [00:26] slangasek, I've uploaded a patched indicator-session with changes from ted to fix the crash at login issue [00:27] I tried the change there they seem to work correctly, ie I didn't get the crash yet where I was getting it half of the time before [00:30] slangasek, regarding your question above about bug #431103. we need a kernel build of 2.6.31-300.3. jjohansen was looking to get one, i think. [00:30] Launchpad bug 431103 in linux-ec2 "ssh host key fingerprint no longer available in the console log" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/431103 [00:49] hi all [00:49] how can I enable more than 4 serial ports [00:50] I need some help please [00:51] 2 pci cards 6 + 4 serial ports but only 4 ports is active [00:51] how can I enable more than 4 serial ports [00:51] smoser: slangasek: is uec-images.ubuntu.com rsyncable? [00:52] according to soren at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UEC/Images/Testing , yes. and my experience agrees === dendrobates is now known as dendro-afk [01:15] smoser: the kernel build is already done; I'm asking about the task open on ec2-init [01:15] as far as I know the kernel build is not done. [01:16] $ rmadison --suite karmic linux-ec2 [01:16] linux-ec2 | 2.6.31-300.3 | karmic | source [01:16] linux-ec2 | 2.6.31.300.0 | karmic | amd64, i386 [01:16] and my feeling about ec2-init is that no changes are needed, but I would like an official kernel build to verify that in. [01:16] i could be reading that information wrong, or otherwise ignorant [01:17] smoser: your rmadison is out-of-date wrt the archive [01:18] oh? [01:18] our rmadison only updates every six hours [01:19] this makes me happy [01:22] slangasek, so, maybe nothing. i'll wait till the build pulls that version, and picks it out with initrd/kernel then will upload those kernels and test them. [01:24] smoser: the current build /already/ has that version :) [01:24] would be good to have this confirmed, since that's marked as a beta blocker [01:30] i'm having some problems building a kernel package on 8.04 which will automatically run update-initramfs. I am passing the --initrd flag to make-kpkg however it does not seem to update the initramfs [01:30] slangasek, i meant http://uec-images.ubuntu.com/karmic/current/ubuntu-uec-karmic-amd64.manifest [01:31] smoser: yes, I see -300.3 listed there [01:33] smoser: oh, I see; you're looking at the linux-ec2 *binary* package, which is not built from linux-ec2 source - it's built from linux-ec2-meta source and will not have a matching version number [01:33] smoser: the actual kernel image is already at version -300.3, so this fix should be present [01:33] mase_wk_: this is not a support channel; please see #ubuntu [01:33] slangasek: np, thanks [01:38] slangasek, ok. there will be a 0929 build in the next 20 minutes or so. i'll take its output and upload to ec2 later tonight. [01:38] smoser: why are you waiting when the existing one already has the relevant kernel? [01:39] i guess i can upload the kernel from last nights you're correct. i just was being lazy. [01:39] and i might as well refresh the nightly that i have out there (or at least check whats different in the manifest0 [02:13] ScottK: ping [02:13] Can you look at bug 425751 [02:13] Launchpad bug 425751 in usb-creator "usb-creator transitional package should be seeded?" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/425751 [02:14] ScottK: not sure if you can fix or at least direct to someone who can and set the correct milestone === Whoopie_ is now known as Whoopie [02:32] rgreening: Fixed. [02:32] ty ScottK [02:36] ScottK: will you be updating the bug to reflect? Thanks [02:37] rgreening: Did already. [02:37] ah.. I see it has updated. [02:37] cool [02:37] yay [02:38] ScottK: just read the comment... does this mean it is ok for Ubuntu seed as well? Or does it just need to be in 'a' seed? [02:39] rgreening: "a seed" is all that was needed. [02:39] cool. understood. === dendro-afk is now known as dendrobates [03:00] so hmm, I can't seem to get Karmic to play a CD [03:01] seems to be bug 435035 but there's not a lot of info [03:01] Launchpad bug 435035 in gstreamer0.10 "rhythymbox doesn't play cds (No URI handler implemented for "cdda")" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/435035 [03:04] darn it, now I can't get the CD to eject :( [03:13] * ScottK hands LaserJock a large hammer and a screwdriver ... [03:15] I got it out eventually [03:15] but still sucks that I can't listen to my brand new CD :( [03:16] Yes, it does seem a bit of a problem if it just doesn't work in karmic [03:17] I'm too used to having all the music on the computer already [03:17] rhythmbox, banshee, totem, nothing works [03:17] they all use the same gstreamer plugins [03:18] yep [03:18] I guess I could try amarok ... but yuck [03:18] or try & use sound-juicer to create .oggs? [03:18] hmm, perhaps. I was assuming if it wouldn't play it wouldn't rip very well [03:19] from what I read in that bug, they still had sound-juicer working, which is odd [03:19] since it also uses gstreamer for ripping & encoding [03:19] * ajmitch doesn't have an up-to-date karmic install booted to check === e-jat is now known as ejat [03:49] It's looking like the upcoming ubuntu release will have a default chat client that will not let you use it without saving your passwords. [03:50] How do I get the attention of somebody who can prevent that? [03:50] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/empathy/+bug/118800 [03:50] Launchpad bug 118800 in empathy "Cannot add account" [Undecided,New] [04:02] Darxus: That's a pretty old bug, is it still accurate for the current release? [04:05] ScottK: yup reproduced here [04:05] the apply button is greyed out unless you type in a password [04:05] * ScottK looks [04:06] I see no obvious way from the UI to create an account without saving a password === Whoopie_ is now known as Whoopie [04:07] ScottK: Yup. [04:07] Bizarre, huh? [04:08] well yeah kind of; I can certainly understand the concern [04:08] though I have to point out 99% of users will want their passwords remembered [04:08] (not saying we shouldn't cater to the others) [04:09] Darxus and jdong: I did the LP magic to get it on the release team's radar. Not sure what they will do with it. [04:09] ScottK: *nods* thanks [04:10] I just admit I haven't touched Empathy much to know if it'd be a big deal (tm) to implement this feature [04:10] ScottK: Thank you. [04:10] It would likely break UI freeze [04:11] we could just... bring back pidgin [04:11] *puts on flamesuit* [04:13] jdong: +1 [04:17] I thought pidgin had a good chance of coming back, but I guess it's a little late now [04:17] LaserJock: Why did you think it had a good chance of coming back? [04:18] well, it's hard to put it well [04:18] I just felt like empathy really didn't rise to the occasion [04:19] Ah. [04:19] it seems like a basic, minimalistic IM client but not much more [04:19] Heh. [04:20] I haven't seen much of an "improvement" in empathy in like a year, I expected more I guess [04:20] I'm disappointed it doesn't have the gui and backend separated into client / server pieces like quassel. [04:21] Because as long as I can't do a single reattach to get back to my four irc servers, jabber, aim, and yahoo, I'll still primarily be using a console client in screen :/ [04:22] well I'm not impressed with how quassel is separated either [04:23] I haven't actually tried it yet. [04:23] why is there a single system daemon installed by the package to be shared by all users? [04:23] Ew. [04:23] Well... I don't know.... [04:23] but yeah, the IDEA behind quassel/smuxi is nice [04:24] Oh, thanks for mentioning smuxi, wasn't aware of that one. [04:25] Darxus: it's pretty nice and I found its codebase to be very clean to work with; though in terms of raw features it lags behind quassel, irssi, weechat [04:25] But it would be nice to be able to drop bitlbee too (mostly requiring jabber support). [04:26] How hard could this stuff really be, I've done irc over telnet? :P [04:26] but as far as empathy is concerned, I totally agree with what LaserJock's opinions are on the matter [04:26] in its current state it still looks and feels like a proof-of-concept/rough-cut basic IM client, not something I feel should've replaced pidgin by default [04:27] jdong: I don't think that there is a single system daemon shared by all users with the quassel monlithic client (the one we use as default). [04:27] If you use a remote core on a server somewhere, it can support multiple clients. [04:27] And you feel that pidgen is more solid? [04:27] ScottK: the last time I installed it on Jaunty (two weeks ago) it ran a single server via an init job [04:28] I'll have a look. [04:28] Darxus: yes, I do feel it's more solid and featureful though it lacks the AV capabilities [04:28] Interesting. [04:28] and it has *gasp* preferences [04:28] LaserJock: but... we don't need those! [04:28] LaserJock: the last time *I* made an IM client, it had a big textbox and a little textbox! [04:29] Hehe. [04:36] I created a bug for quassel/smuxi type functionality in empathy: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/empathy/+bug/438502 [04:36] Launchpad bug 438502 in empathy "Break UI and backend into client / server." [Undecided,New] [04:36] I realize it's not going to happen any time soon. [04:36] I can't nominate for Lucid yet? :P [04:37] That's something to file in an upstream bug tracker. Ubuntu wouldn't do that split without upstream. [04:38] Oh, hmm. [04:39] it is a fairly major change for an app [04:39] I realize. [04:39] I'm filing an upstream bug. [04:40] ajmitch: pfft, I'm sure it'd make the Papercut list ;-) [04:42] Doesn't LP have a way to link to a gnome bug? [04:42] LaserJock: I'll let you take on that one :) [04:44] Hehe. [04:44] hello. [04:47] Cool, figured out how to link the upstream bug. [04:47] ("also affects project") [05:45] package ttf-tahoma-replacement 1.1.30-0ubuntu2 failed to install/upgrade: error writing to '': No such file or directory [05:45] ^^ best error report yet :) [05:46] Haha [05:47] https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/438391 [05:47] Launchpad bug 438391 in wine1.2 "package ttf-tahoma-replacement 1.1.30-0ubuntu2 failed to install/upgrade: error writing to '': No such file or directory" [Undecided,New] === bjf is now known as bjf-afk === Tonio__ is now known as Tonio_ [06:36] Good morning! [06:39] * slangasek waves [06:44] TheMuso: hmm, your alsa-plugins upload also drops three patches out of debian/patches [06:49] good morning [07:18] slangasek: hrm I'll have a look. [07:22] slangasek: hrm screwed up with creating the package. Feel free to reject, and I'll re-upload. [07:29] Good morning [07:31] Good morning pitti [07:37] TheMuso: ack, rejected the first one === tkamppeter_ is now known as tkamppeter [08:21] YokoZar: Just wanted to say thanks so much for the wine1.2 packages and quick updates. Its really awesome :) === robert_ancell_ is now known as robert_ancell [08:33] stefanlsd: at some point soon I'm going to have to freeze it for karmic though [08:33] although I still need some manual patches (eg one that lets photoshop install) [08:35] YokoZar: yeah. will go back to your ppa then i guess once its frozen. [08:40] morning YokoZar and stefanlsd === highvolt1ge is now known as highvoltage [08:51] LP 438092 [08:51] Launchpad bug 438092 in texlive-bin "Candidate revision texlive-bin_2007.dfsg.2-7ubuntu1" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/438092 [08:59] cjwatson_: AFAICT you fixed the alt-f7 gdm switching thing - good work! :) === dholbach_ is now known as dholbach === asac_ is now known as asac [09:17] pitti, hi [09:19] hey tkamppeter [09:21] pitti, it is about bug 420015 [09:21] Launchpad bug 420015 in cups "usblp Kernel module needs to be removed and /dev/bus/usb/*/* made accessible for USB printers to work with CUPS 1.4.x" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/420015 [09:21] There are still users who cannot access their USB printers. [09:23] tkamppeter: Debian users complain _a lot_ about the libusb change as well [09:23] it breaks tons of stuff and third-party apps which need it [09:23] pitti, then I have tried the situation of my HP printers and found that the HP DesignJet 130 appears in "ls -l /dev/bus/usb/*/*" but not in "lsusb". Looks like a low-level USB problem. [09:23] tkamppeter: nope [09:23] tkamppeter: try "sudo lsusb" [09:23] tkamppeter: the problem is that these devices aren't world-readable any more with the new udev rule (it makes them 660 root:lp) [09:25] cjwatson_: It seems that something is causing postinst failure on upgrade - your emit events change seems like a likely candidate [09:25] Yes, it is exactly only the DesignJet 130 which needs "sudo usblp". [09:25] asac: Hi, I tested the patch for bug 413053 and it's working. [09:25] Launchpad bug 413053 in gnome-bluetooth "Bluetooth-applet drops paired phone from list of devices" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/413053 [09:25] cjwatson_: err, oops, the word "gdm" was supposed to be in that sentence somewhere :-) [09:26] lp 438561 [09:26] Launchpad bug 438561 in gdm "package gdm 2.28.0-0ubuntu8 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/438561 [09:27] pitti, what I have seen in bug 420015 is that a user uses /dev/usbmon3 as URI for an Epson. Seems that this is a third-party device generated by a daemon of a manufacturer-supplied driver and this daemon passes the data on to something like /dev/usb/lp0 which does not exist any more with CUPS 1.4.x. [09:27] Launchpad bug 420015 in cups "usblp Kernel module needs to be removed and /dev/bus/usb/*/* made accessible for USB printers to work with CUPS 1.4.x" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/420015 [09:30] Whoopie: checking [09:30] asac: just told you as you were asking in the report. ;) [09:31] ok [09:31] we will get it fixed after beta [09:32] asac: ok, a new 2.28.1 was tagged in gnome-bluetooth git which fixes it (and some other issues I debugged with the maintainer) [09:33] Whoopie: ok. thanks. if you know further launchpad bugs fixed, please set to fix committed [09:34] asac: what do you think about bug 436694? Could we ship the same udev rule as fedora does? [09:34] Launchpad bug 436694 in gnome-bluetooth "[karmic] gnome-bluetooth applet menu does not have "Turn Off Bluetooth" as described in help and needed." [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/436694 === cjwatson_ is now known as cjwatson [09:34] dholbach: excellent, glad it works for you [09:34] maxb: hmm [09:35] maxb: I don't think that can possibly be my change, since the gdm postinst doesn't actually restart the job [09:35] maxb: it's more likely the pre-existing 'status gdm' in the postinst [09:35] asac: epiphany> if you want it demoted, please go ahead and unseed it [09:36] maxb: I could be wrong of course, but I can't see the mechanism by which my change would have broken this [09:37] asac: btw, why after beta? it's one month since then. [09:37] Whoopie: one month? read /topic ;) [09:38] slangasek: ok. i will double check with seb one last time. [09:38] asac, go for it [09:38] kk [09:39] * asac updates seeds [09:39] asac: hehe, sorry. on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KarmicReleaseSchedule, I just read "23" and "october". ;) [09:52] Whoopie: how does that udev rule help? [09:54] cjwatson: hi [09:54] seb128: I believe https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=468445 needs to be reopened now (and you are the reporter upstream) [09:54] Gnome bug 468445 in GtkFileChooser "gtkfilechooser save/save as dialog misplaces focus" [Normal,Resolved: fixed] [09:55] mat_t: hello [09:56] YokoZar, reopening closed bugs because you have a similar issue in newer versions is usually not the right thing [09:56] I think it's the same issue though [09:56] The save as dialog is still focusing wrong [09:57] YokoZar, the code could have changed and comments about debugging on the old code will just creating confusion [09:57] Ahh ok [09:57] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+2.0/+bug/130224 <-- launchpad link, should file a new gnome one then [09:57] Launchpad bug 130224 in gtk+2.0 "gtkfilechooser save/save as dialog misplaces focus" [Low,Confirmed] [09:57] open a new bug if you want rather [09:57] and mention the old one number [09:57] yeah np [09:57] thanks [09:57] I'm too busy to work on minor issues like that [09:57] but opening upstream would be nice [09:58] tkamppeter: right, what I meant; there are also tools for ink levels etc. which only work with usblp [10:00] casper on slow media with no progressbar at all in usplash is not a very pleasant experience [10:01] asac, can you quickly look over https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/notify-osd/+bug/438312 [10:01] Launchpad bug 438312 in notify-osd "[Karmic]Network manager notification about being connected not shown when connecting with mobile phone(3G)" [Undecided,Incomplete] [10:05] MacSlow: invalidated and moved to applet ... even though i dont think its something we did before [10:05] thx [10:06] asac, ok thanks... I wasn't sure... initially I thought Mio ran into a "suppress display of a notification"-situation, but then I wanted to also get your view on it as I don't know what network-manager does and does not with notifications. [10:08] i might be wrong, but afaik we dont display notifications for that ... but i kept it open for nm-applet to check [10:08] ok [10:13] mvo_, does it make sense to have a "Price: Free" field on a Get Free Software section :) ? [10:15] joaopinto: check bug 419295 for a discussion about this [10:15] Launchpad bug 419295 in software-store ""Price: Free" is redundant when user is navigating in the "Get Free Software" section" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/419295 [10:15] ah ops :P [10:16] joaopinto: its a valid question, no problem. I think we need a faq or something to link to the discussion [10:18] mvo_, in the long term apturl will be integrated with aptdaemon right ? [10:18] cjwatson: we'll need at least one more cycle on the eucalyptus package, I'm fixing critical issues revealed in my UEC-install-from-daily testing [10:19] I would like to be able to install apps from a web page using multiple links without entering the password for each click, I am not sure it that will be available keeping a reasonable security [10:19] joaopinto: with software-center and aptdaemon, yes [10:19] joaopinto: should be done for lucid already [10:20] joaopinto: I mean, it will be done for lucid [10:20] that would require some whitelist mechanism, to keep credentials for a specific page [10:20] cjwatson: the PUBLICIPS postinst fails if you set multiple addresses, see bug 438586 [10:20] Launchpad bug 438586 in eucalyptus "Public IPs settings are not propagated to configuration" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/438586 [10:22] ok, apturl will just queue the requests into software-center [10:25] asac: right now, /dev/rfkill has permission 644 so that gnome-bluetooth can enable/disable BT. This rule seems to allow users the access to /dev/rfkill. [10:25] joaopinto: right, the current ui will just be integreated with software-center (and made look nicer) [10:25] ok :) [10:27] asac: http://www.spinics.net/lists/hotplug/msg02404.html [10:28] pitti, should we perhaps return to the usblp-based CUPS backend and tell the manufacturers to stop using usblp, so that in the next release we can switch over to not use usblp. [10:28] tkamppeter: is that possible with 1.4? [10:29] tkamppeter: allegedly it is with --enable-libusb=no [10:29] tkamppeter: but I didn't test it [10:29] pitti, problem is once that next release is LTS and second, if we stay with usblp manufacturers could stay using it. [10:29] tkamppeter: but that would again break system-config-printer, I guess? [10:30] tkamppeter: the advantage would be that people upgrading from jaunty and earlier would actually not end up with a broken printer (since libusb changes the device strings) [10:30] tkamppeter: or does s-c-p get along with both? [10:30] pitti, principally, CUPS can be built also with a usblp-based "usb"backend. [10:30] tkamppeter: for LTS I wouldn't change the backend, we should keep with what we have in karmic [10:31] s-c-p works with both versions, and CUPS intends that both give the same URLs. [10:31] tkamppeter: oh, so why didn't we do this from day one then? [10:31] (build with usblp support) [10:31] it was a real pain to do the switch to libusb, and it feels wrong, too [10:32] pitti, the USB backend of CUPS can be built EITHER usblp-based OR libusb-based, not both (with auto-detection of usblp presence) in one backend. [10:32] tkamppeter: right, I understand [10:32] tkamppeter: I meant, why didn't we keep usblp in 1.4.0? [10:34] One could make a workaround building both backend versions and renaming them (usb-usblp and usb-libusb), then add a wrapper script (usb) which checks presence of the usblp module with lsmod and then starts the appropriate real backend. [10:34] tkamppeter: what's the advantage of using the libusb one? [10:34] it seems so much easier and backwards compatible to use usblp only [10:36] pitti, once HPLIP is libusb-based, it grabs the device and takes it away from the usb backend (usblp) of CUPS 1.3.x. [10:36] pitti: as ogra observes, casper on slow media is pretty nasty with no progress bar. Is there any way we could make the progress bar run-time-optional in usplash-theme-ubuntu somehow, rather than just commenting it out entirely? [10:37] tkamppeter: right (but that's a different backend?) [10:37] ++ [10:37] the bouncing bar would suffice i think [10:37] cjwatson: with some small hacks, yes [10:37] so you see it didnt die at least [10:37] we could have a new command in usplash to turn it on [10:37] pitti, this causes sonme confusion, especially the UDEV scripts must always check both the low-level signals and the usblp signals coming from the printer to reliably determine when a printer appears and when it disappears. [10:38] I guess it won't be precise any more with upstart scripts, but it'd at least show something [10:38] another option would be to drop quiet on slow live media [10:38] it requires changing the logo position and adding a new command line switch or usplash_write command [10:38] but i guess that would require additional translations we havent prepared [10:38] I'll ask the design team [10:38] oh, mat_t is here ^ [10:39] mat_t: since you asked for dropping the progress bar, any opinion about bringing it back on the live system boot? [10:39] Whoopie: yes. understood that. didtn know how that ACL_MANAGE works ... but now i know ;) [10:39] thx [10:39] pitti: in the meeting atm - will get back to you in a bit [10:40] it also requires new artwork, and moving the icon further up by default (not almost-centered) [10:40] pitti: you could just drop the progress bar down [10:40] pitti: I was actually wondering yesterday if it would be worth adding a way for upstart to prod usplash occasionally, say when events occur [10:40] Amaranth: then the text area gets pretty small on smaller resolutions (like 400 pixel y) [10:40] or let the icon pulsate or something [10:41] text area? I thought you just wanted a progress bar [10:41] the text area is still there, and required [10:41] pitti: if it were built-in, it would be fairly efficient [10:41] Amaranth, you can still drop quiet [10:41] (fsck, password entry, etc.) [10:41] pitti, second, the usblp backend disables bi-di access for several important manufacturers, as usblp does not work with most printers of them [10:41] though at the moment you'd have to reopen the fifo each time, which isn't idedal [10:41] ideal [10:41] cjwatson: "more" built in than usplash_write? [10:42] something that doesn't involve spawning a process each time, yes [10:42] pitti, third, the libusb-based backend supports also some more general access, for example to allow printing and non-printing functions on an MF device to be done in parallel. [10:42] so basically usplash_write built into upstart that just keeps the connection open? [10:42] I wouldn't want to hack it in without consulting with Keybuk, obviously, but it was something I was thinking about while upstartifying usplash [10:43] Amaranth: probably more like usplash listening to upstart events, I think [10:43] we're pre upstart, arent we ? [10:44] ogra: casper is, yes [10:44] right [10:44] pitti: ah yeah, then usplash can just listen for starting events and show some text [10:44] ogra: sorry, my question about upstart prodding usplash occasionally was not directly related to your problem [10:44] yes, i thought so [10:45] usplash listening to upstart events would be a little tricky, since it starts before upstart - doable but tricky [10:45] and the main loop would need to be rewritten, though it needs rewritten anyway! [10:46] cjwatson/slangasek: new eucalyptus (0ubuntu11) uploaded to fix critical issues uncovered in daily CD testing. Please review/approve/respin if appropriate [10:46] Amaranth: even if it were done in upstart, can't keep the connection open the way usplash is at the moment [10:46] Amaranth: the comms protocol is a fifo not a socket [10:46] ah [10:48] but pitti's probably right, better the other way up [10:48] cjwatson: I just feel that coding usplash knowledge into upstart seems a bit wrong [10:48] pitti, what I would like to see as a CUPS USB backend would be one acting similar to the hp backend. Instead of simply giving up silently if a printer is grabbed by the usblp backend it should simply detach the printer and access it through libusb. This way one could leave the usblp kernel module loaded so that third-party backends can still use it. [10:49] tkamppeter: that would be nice indeed [10:51] pitti, one would need to have a look into the "hp" backend to see how it works and patch the CUPS USB backend, and also test on printers which are not from HP. [10:52] asac, what do i have to do to make NM like my NIC on my babbage board ? [10:53] asac, i can get it to work with ifconfig eth0 up and dhclient, NM doesnt see it at all though [10:56] pitti: how long does the live system boot take? Until we can display xsplash that is [10:57] ogra: ^ [10:57] on armel its 40-50sec [10:57] mat_t: I guess a magnitude of 30 seconds to a minute? [10:57] depending on the SD card i use up to 1.5min [10:59] pitti: 30 secs until xsplash? [10:59] I guess so [10:59] hmm [10:59] on a CD it's a similar magnitude, though [11:00] stuff needs to be loaded from CD, squashfs unpacked, casper configures some things, etc. [11:00] sabdfl was very clear on progress bars, since they're not really reliable... For most of the time you see it going from side to side anyway [11:00] and then it accelerates, decelerates, etc [11:00] by and large they will, unless we do some heavy changes (see above) [11:00] mat_t: could we make the logo pulsate instead? [11:00] ogra: ^ WDYT? [11:01] we already have the fading code anyway [11:01] pitti: we could (I mean, you probably could) :) [11:01] pitti: we could have it going fade in-out slighly [11:01] ++ on any kind of indication that the system doesnt hand [11:01] *hang [11:02] pitti: but only on live cd/installer, not in the real session [11:02] i dont care *what* we do but sitting in front of a white logo for a minute doesnt make me feel confident my system still boots [11:02] ogra: what driver is it using? [11:02] asac, a forwardported version of the FEC driver from 2.6.28 [11:02] mat_t: that can be arranged, yes [11:02] by calling usplash with --pulsate or so [11:02] asac, built into the kernel [11:03] ogra: 1 minute boot is annoying in any scenario :) [11:03] I'm fairly sure that casper runs early enough to be able to modify the usplash startup [11:03] it can send a command to usplash, at any rate [11:04] mat_t, well, its a special case for me, but the CD isnt much faster either [11:04] cjwatson: right, or that [11:04] or change stuff for the initramfs in its hooks? [11:04] mat_t: live CD boot is pretty much always slow no matter how you shake it [11:04] lifeless: bikeshed [11:04] cjwatson: uhm sure, was just saying it should clearly be possible [11:04] it can be done, yes :) [11:05] cjwatson: pitti: how about displaying some text info for live CD? [11:05] effectively we should indeed look into cleaning up casper and make it faster :) [11:05] mat_t: beware that we have a long-standing lack of translatability at this stage [11:05] mat_t: simple matter of sending an usplash command [11:05] mat_t: but no i18n [11:05] right [11:05] so while it's certainly possible you should be a bit careful about relying on it for everything [11:05] right [11:06] ogra: fundamentally you have to get several hundred megabytes of data off slow media, there's a limit [11:06] well, obviously you don't have to get *all* of it off, but a fair bit [11:06] fta, asac: what is the name of the ubuntu-chromium-daily PPA? how do I turn on verbose logs? [11:06] cjwatson, well, there is a lot of old cruft in casper [11:06] ok, let's go with pulsation then. I think it will provide a nice experience [11:06] actually, I was quite surprised about how fast the live system boots from an USB stick nowadays [11:07] sure, but cleaning it up isn't going to solve this problem really [11:07] cjwatson, only talking about all the hooks and scripts we have [11:07] heck, it's almost faster than booting my normal system from my slow HD.. [11:07] pitti, you have a fast usb key or something? it takes some minutes there [11:07] there is stuff we carry along since breezy/dapper that totally isnt needed anymore [11:07] * ogra plans a lucid spec for that [11:07] ogra: we could perhaps get rid of reconfiguring X; locale configuration is also pretty slow, but still necessary; most of it should be fairly harmless, though, like setting gconf keys and doing small file changes? [11:08] doko_: https://edge.launchpad.net/~chromium-daily/+archive/ppa [11:08] seb128: it's much faster than jaunty, anyway [11:08] most of the slow stuff is still needed, I think :-/ [11:08] doko_: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Chromium/Debug [11:08] asac: thanks! [11:09] http://code.google.com/p/chromium/wiki/LinuxDebugging [11:09] http://code.google.com/p/chromium/wiki/LinuxDebugging#Logging [11:09]