[00:30] jml: testtools is in debian testing now [00:31] jml: and you might like lp:~lifeless/subunit/protocol === statik` is now known as statik [03:22] oh oh for someone to have a pre-imp call with [03:23] preferably jml [03:30] mwhudson: I cn do a quick one if you are desperate [03:31] lifeless: it's ok, i think [03:31] thanks though [03:31] lifeless: i don't guess you know if there's a method already to find all official source package branches for a distroseries? [03:32] easy enough to add, and i've looked in the obvious places so... [03:33] I don't know, no [04:04] soyuz is the mind killer === abentley1 is now known as abentley [04:50] bug 217644 [04:50] Bug #217644: ResultSet aggregates do not respect distinct option [04:51] mwhudson: that bug should be fixed in the version of Storm you're using. [04:51] jamesh: i can probably delete a bodge then, that's good [04:53] It now applies the aggregate to a subselect, so distinct, offset and limit all work. === Ursinha is now known as Ursinha-sprint [08:31] good morning [08:31] hi adeuring [08:31] hi noodles775_! [08:42] Good morning! [09:28] Morning [09:36] morning === Ursinha is now known as Ursinha-sprint === intellec` is now known as intellectronica [10:22] hey bigjools, what version of kde are you running? [10:22] Ursinha-sprint: 4.3 in Karmic [10:22] hm [10:22] 4.3.1 in fact [10:23] bigjools, I'm using 4.3 in jaunty, and almost no icons are showing in the system tray applet [10:23] 4.3.1 as well [10:23] do you have the same problem? [10:23] Ursinha-sprint: are you using intel gfx? (no I don't)( [10:23] hmm, don't think so, why? [10:23] it's buggy as hell in jaunty [10:23] oh [10:24] and I had some issues like that [10:24] Ursinha-sprint: check #kubuntu for help I guess [10:28] thanks bigjools [10:28] Ursinha-sprint: no prob - I do have other issues though, since 4.3 it hangs when logging out/shutdown etc :( [10:29] oh :( [10:29] bigjools, the only problem I have is with amarok vs. all the other stuff that needs sound [10:30] besides this one with the tray [10:31] Ursinha-sprint: oh yeah, I used to have that. apt-get purge pulseaudio fixes that ;) [10:31] bigjools, lol [10:31] everybody hates pulseaudio [10:31] * wgrant thwacks bigjools with the "there is no problem unless you have filed a bug" bat [10:31] yes, it's a pita most of the time [10:31] I can file bugs until I am blue in the face === mrevell changed the topic of #launchpad-dev to: This is Launchpad Development Channel | Week 0 of 3.1.10 | PQM is OPEN | https://dev.launchpad.net/ | Get the code: https://dev.launchpad.net/Getting | On-call review in #launchpad-reviews | Use http://paste.ubuntu.com/ for pastes | This channel is logged: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ [11:02] Morning, all. [11:04] howdy deryck [11:50] Hi jml, I'm having problems with devscripts.autoland. It's stopping utilities/ec2 from working because it requires a couple of libs that are not installed, launchpadlib and lazr.uri. [11:51] allenap, wow [11:51] allenap, I thought they were developer dependencies? [11:51] jml: I don't think so... I'll look... [11:51] allenap, karmic or jaunty? [11:52] jml: Jaunty. [11:54] allenap: If I pastebin you my short traceback from ec2, can you tell me if it's the same thing you're getting? [11:54] jml: No, they're not in any of the deps afaict. lazr.uri does not seem to be available for installation on my machine, without sorting out some PPAs. [11:54] mrevell: Sure. [11:54] allenap: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/286108/ [11:55] allenap, lazr.uri is in download-cache [11:55] allenap: from what you've said, I assume it is [11:55] mrevell: Yes, I think that's related. [11:55] allenap: cool, I'll hang onto your coat-tails... [11:55] jml: Yeah, but utilities/ec2 runs with the system python, not the buildout managed one. [11:55] allenap, oh right. [11:55] ffs. [11:56] allenap, I guess the right thing to do is make the imports conditional then. [11:56] jml: Yeah, I had some grief with a similar thing last week. [11:56] allenap, I'm 90% sure that when we switch to Python 2.5 this problem will go away. [11:56] jml: Yeah. I can so that if you're busy. [11:56] allenap, thanks. [11:57] allenap, I've actually got today off, so I'd much prefer it if you do it :) [11:57] jml: Yes, we can run everything with the buildout bin/py. [11:57] allenap, I can review the patch if you'd like though. [11:57] jml: Sure, no worries. Thanks for being around on your day off :) [11:57] allenap, np. [11:57] allenap, you should install launchpadlib & lazr.uri btw [11:57] 'ec2 land' is sweet as. [11:58] jml: I'll try to make it so the command appears with a note that it won't work until those packages are installed. [11:58] jml: I look forward to trying it :) [11:58] good idea [12:00] The problem with recommending that people install the system package of lazr.uri is that it breaks launchpad dev [12:01] maxb: Ah, that's troubling. [12:01] It's the namespace package / setuptools / aaargh situation [12:02] maxb: I think I'm going to have a painful day today. [12:02] uhoh :-/ [12:03] But first, lunch. Never hack setuptools on an empty stomach. [12:03] good policy! [12:03] I would generalise that statement. === Ursinha-sprint is now known as Ursinha-afk [12:12] wgrant: Indeed. s/hack setuptools/.*/ [12:12] * gmb -> lunch [12:12] gmb: Not quite. [12:12] wgrant: Well, I suppose eating on an empty stomach is acceptable. [12:14] allenap: When you're back from your lunch, and the you've resolved the pain in your day, could you please share the analgesic with me? :) === mrevell is now known as mrevell-lunch === mrevell-lunch is now known as mrevell [13:13] mrevell: I'm working on it now :) [13:13] mrevell: I'll see if I can get a quick fix for you. [13:17] allenap: Hey, no rush beyond what you're doing already :) [13:24] maxb: You said that installing lazr.uri causes launchpad dev to break. Can you elaborate on that? === Ursinha-afk is now known as Ursinha-sprint [13:52] allenap: Hi [13:52] maxb: Hello again. [13:53] So the problem is that setuptools installs a *-nspkg.pth file which registers the toplevel lazr package with a __path__ pointing to the system directory [13:53] This defeats attempts to add any other lazr.* via PYTHONPATH [13:54] And then you have a bit of a conundrum. I haven't figured out how to solve it, or if it is soluble [13:54] maxb: Ah, that's grizzly. If it's installed via a deb then this won't be a problem, will it? Not that there's a lazr.uri deb easily available. [13:55] Yes, it is a problem, and there's lazr.something debs available in karmic, hence me noticing the problem [13:56] python-lazr-uri | 1.0-0ubuntu1 | karmic | all [14:28] hello [14:28] maxb: Thanks. [14:30] i from Cuba and need help with getting LP as explained in https://dev.launchpad.net/Getting, may can some of you helpme [14:30] ? [14:32] What do you need help with? [14:34] my internet connection is so poor that running rocketfuel-setup is not an option forme, i get the tar.gz from the page, but none wiki page explain what to do from there, also the tar.gz is a little outdate [14:36] can you give me links or something for getting LP running ? [14:38] jml: Can I call in that review please? https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~allenap/launchpad/packages-for-autoload-bug-443061/+merge/12867 [14:42] ybenitezf: i think you can use both. download the tarball (though i think it's pretty old) and use rocketfuel-setup to do the rest (bzr will be smart and not try to download revisions it already has) [14:43] ybenitezf: You should read https://dev.launchpad.net/Getting and the source of rocketfuel-setup [14:44] ybenitezf: anyway, you don't have any way of doing LP development without getting the complete branch, regardless of whether you do it with bzr or by getting a tarball. the first download will be quite bug, but after that you'll only need to update a few revisions every time, which is not so terrible even with a slow connection [14:46] i have tried that, but rocketfuel-setup (from tarball) complains about bzr version even when i have instaled version 2.0.x.x, i have been reading https://dev.launchpad.net/Getting all the weeked [14:47] You'll need to get a newer rocketfuel-setup. [14:47] yep [14:47] https://dev.launchpad.net/Getting tells you how [14:47] but when executed it fails downloading [14:48] You're not giving us enough detail about your problems to enable us to hep [14:48] *help [14:51] sorry [14:51] mine school use a proxy server, i have not direct internet connection, all that i need is an updated tar.gz like the one in https://dev.launchpad.net/Getting [14:51] can you help me with that [14:51] ? [14:52] No, because that's not actually what you need. [14:52] The size of the download should not actually be that different whether it's by tarball or bzr. [14:52] ahh [14:53] there is a problem with that, with the tar.gz i can use a download manager, running rocketfuel-setup can fail and i have to start all over again [14:54] i'm a poor connection man, ;-) [14:54] Do you have the tar.gz already? [14:54] yes the old one [14:57] Then just run "bzr pull" in it, and let it download all the updates [14:57] ok [14:57] i will try again [14:58] see you later maxb, thanks for your help [15:02] I think we should remove herb's tarball (and possibly replace it) [15:03] For one, it's of db-devel not devel. For another, it's layed out as a standalone branch, not a shared repository [15:03] And if we're optimizing for download size, there's no need for it to contain a working tree either [15:08] bigjools, can i ask you a question about ppas? [15:09] leonardr: go for it [15:09] bigjools: is it possible to delete one of your ppas? [15:09] i'm working on https://answers.launchpad.net/soyuz/+question/84542 as part of chr [15:09] leonardr: no, the best we can do is to disable them [15:09] leonardr: assign to LOSAs [15:09] ok, thanks [15:09] np [15:19] maxb, i have untar the tar.gz and run "bzr pull" from ~/launchpad/lp-branches/db-devel but fails with an error: bzr: ERROR: Not a branch: "/home/archives/rocketfuel/wiki/db-devel/" [15:19] oh [15:20] just for asking, anyone can facilitate launchpad.tag.gz update [15:21] leonardr: There's a slight edge case. If a PPA has had no uploads ever, it can be deleted === stub1 is now known as stub [15:23] leonardr: https://answers.edge.launchpad.net/soyuz/+question/79720 <-- question where I asked for one of my PPAs to be deleted and cprov explained things [15:23] maxb, thanks === jtatum` is now known as jtatum [15:25] ybenitezf: bzr pull --remember lp:~launchpad-pqm/launchpad/devel [15:25] Also, rename the db-devel directory to devel [15:26] maxb: ok [15:29] maxb: run that from devel it self or from parent dir ? [15:29] From inside devel [15:30] maxb: I'm at it, seems to be taking time [15:32] Hrm, we *really* need to remove or update that tarball. A modern bzr version packs the repository down from 219MB to 150MB [15:36] Hmm. he left. Anyway, it downloaded 25484KB for me [15:55] hi barry :) [15:55] Ursinha-sprint: hi! [15:55] barry, you are running karmic, right? [15:55] Ursinha-sprint: nothin' but! :) [15:55] barry, brave man! [15:56] I'm trying to have one instance of lp running on karmic but no success [15:56] Ursinha-sprint: or... crazy! :) [15:56] it complains the lack of something.loom [15:56] lol [15:57] Ursinha-sprint: hmm. i haven't seen that. do you have the full traceback or error? note that this karmic was not an upgrade, it was a fresh install [15:57] barry, hmm, I don't have it here now, only in my eeepc [15:57] that was a fresh install with alpha 5 and I've been updating that since then [15:58] Ursinha-sprint: dang. yes, that's basically what i did too. it definitely works (though i haven't tried building anything today yet) [16:01] abentley: ping [16:01] henninge: pong [16:02] abentley: Hi, there still seems to be a problem with the job system. [16:02] henninge: What is the problem? [16:03] abentley: Even with thumper's latest patch, we still have jobs stuck in "running". [16:03] abentley: https://pastebin.canonical.com/22916/ [16:04] abentley: I can relate the rosetta-branches cases (job_type=3) to OOPSes in the script. [16:04] henninge: Is the database reaper tearing down the DB connection in those cases? [16:05] abentley: I don't know. How would I be able to tell? [16:05] henninge: It would show in the oops and the log. [16:07] henninge: Can you point me at an example oops? === deryck is now known as deryck[lunch] === matsubara is now known as matsubara-lunch === Ursinha is now known as Ursinha-afk === sinzui1 is now known as sinzui === deryck[lunch] is now known as deryck === beuno is now known as beuno-lunch === matsubara-lunch is now known as matsubara [18:22] night all! === beuno-lunch is now known as beuno [18:37] abentley, hi [18:46] rockstar: hi [18:48] abentley, chat? [18:48] sure [19:03] barry: ping [19:03] sinzui: pong [19:04] barry: I am hacking on announcement headings and titles. Look at https://edge.launchpad.net/launchpad-project/+announcement/3450 [19:05] barry: ^ Do I need to add a Heirarcy to set the traversed objects for the page title? There are no breadcrumbs [19:05] sinzui: if there are no breadcrumbs, then i don't think you need a hierarchy just for the page title. [19:06] sinzui: but in this case why is there not breadcrumbs? [19:06] barry: I do not think a breadcrumb is need (yet) because I want to see [19:06] Launchpad Registry >> Annoucement: I did something cool [19:06] barry: That is what I am asking you. I do not know why there ar no breadcrumbs in any context [19:06] sinzui: right, that's what i think i'd like to see too [19:06] sinzui: ah [19:07] sinzui: so the default hierarchy probably should work for you. i wonder why it's not [19:07] sinzui: isn't launchpad-project the root context? [19:08] It is [19:08] hmm [19:09] barry: is canonical url used in hierarchy? I ask because series and milestone do not have a hierarchy, but their canonical URL define the parent object [19:10] sinzui: not directly. Hierarchy looks for an IBreadcrumb for each object that has been traversed in the request. it's built from those [19:11] sinzui: perhaps put a break point in Hierarchy lib/canonical/launchpad/browser/launchpad.py and see if def items() gets hit? [19:11] Thus we have no traversed objects...because launchpad-suite is not in being shown [19:11] sinzui: it could be a problem with the template, or perhaps there's a custom +hierarchy adapter? [19:11] ahh [19:11] * sinzui looks [19:12] no [19:13] * barry is not sure what "no" means [19:14] I do not see anything suppressing the breadcrumbs [19:14] There is no Hierarchy or Breadcrumb adapter. [19:15] sinzui: you said above there are no traversed objects. do you mean that request.traversed_objects is empty when you hit Hierarchy.objects() ? [19:15] barry: I assume there are not because I cannot explain why there are no breadcrumbs [19:16] sinzui: best thing to do is put a breakpoint in Hierarchy.items() and see what happens [19:16] barry: I started looking at this when I saw the team membership pages were also missing breadcrumbs. That bug mentions both Hierarchy and Breadcrumb, but if neither of these are the case, we have a much harder problem to fix these. [19:18] sinzui: bug number? [19:18] barry: bug 429663, you filed it [19:18] Bug #429663: ~team/+invitation/team does not have breadcrumbs [19:20] ah yes, looks like you have the same problem. this is a more general problem for which we do not yet have a fix [19:21] hmm [19:21] Well Hierarchy is seeing the Project, Announcement, and View in the correct order [19:22] When I solve this, I think I will take the team bug too [19:24] sinzui: hopefully there will be a generic fix for this [19:24] barry: I see I misunderstood the direction the breadcrumbs are made [19:24] barry: project has one, announcement does not. Since there is only one, we are not showing any [19:25] sinzui: right [19:25] * barry -> otp [19:27] * rockstar lunches [19:31] hrmm [19:31] what does "Nominated for Trunk by <$user> (approve/decline)" mean on a bug? [19:33] barry: Answer is simple, though the rule is not clear. We need to register TitleBreadcrumb for every object that uses .title. [19:35] dobey: It means you are asking a series driver/release manager to commit to fixing a bug during the development of that series [19:35] sinzui: so in other words, it makes absolutely no sense at all, since "trunk" should always be in development :) [19:36] dobey: Yep! If you use milestones to target bugs, the bug will wrong be associated to a series. I never use this feature. I would like to remove it [19:37] s/wrong/wrongly/ [19:37] sinzui: yeah, i've never even seen it before until today, when someone who hasn't ever even commented on the bug, decided to nominate it for trunk [20:14] bac: sorry about that, ready to continue? [20:15] sinzui: can we do a generic fallback for TitleBreadcrumb? [20:16] no. I think the fallback is to DisplayNameBreadcrumb. I saw thast everything that has a .title also has TitleBreadcrumb in zcml [20:17] sinzui: i'm just worried that if we have a lot of views using title, that's a lot of extra zcml hacking too [20:18] title is rare compared to displayname. [20:18] sinzui: right [20:18] Title is arguably bogus because in most cases we construct it [20:19] sinzui: agreed. sounds like a plan [20:19] for announcement, headline is actually title [20:19] hmm [20:19] oh [20:20] barry: maybe announcement is wrong because it does not have a displayname. just a headline presented as a title [20:21] sinzui: what if you added a @property for displayname that returned the title? or is that too ugly of a hack? :) [20:21] I am doing that now :) [20:21] barry: yes [20:21] sinzui: excellent :) [20:21] bac: calling [20:34] EdwinGrubbs: ping [20:39] EdwinGrubbs: unping [20:59] mwhudson, when you're around, ping. [20:59] rockstar: hello [21:00] mwhudson, morning. [21:00] mwhudson, so I'm working on getting the branch upgrade job stuff working with the upgrade-out-of-the-way concept. [21:01] rockstar: oh right [21:01] mwhudson, abentley says that we'll be doing the upgrades on crowberry, which is fine. However, I'm not sure how where to sprout the branch that needs to be updated. [21:02] mwhudson, I'm wondering if we have a helper function to figure that out yet. [21:02] rockstar: tempfile.mkdtemp() ? [21:02] rockstar: I'd be inclined to mkdtemp. [21:02] rockstar: or am i misunderstanding? [21:03] mwhudson, abentley, I thought we saw something where it was leaking file references in a reviewers meeting recently. [21:03] mwhudson, rockstar: I suppose a confounding factor is that we'd like to do it on the same partition. [21:03] abentley: yeah, that's true [21:03] rockstar: Not mkdtemp. [21:04] abentley, after looking at the docs, I must have been confusing temp dirs and temp files. [21:04] abentley, does it really need to be done on the same partition? [21:05] rockstar: It doesn't have to be done on the same partition, but if it's not, it's more expensive to rename into place because the rename is actually copy & delete. [21:06] abentley, yeah, I guess you're right. [21:06] rockstar: And that also leaves a larger window for race conditions. [21:06] rockstar: If you create it in .bzr/new, nothing bad will happen. === jamalta is now known as jamalta-afk [21:25] beuno: Here is an example of a custom scrollbar that the yui slider could be styled to look like: http://wave.google.com/help/wave/images/ss2.gif [21:26] EdwinGrubbs, that may work better === Ursinha-afk is now known as Ursinha [21:33] rockstar, sure :) [21:34] Ursinha, hm, it looks like I can branch that url. [21:43] rockstar, stupid doubt: if I change something in the lp branch, by pushing code to it, will it be mirrored to the original place? [21:45] Ursinha, no, in fact, I don't think you can push to a mirrored branch. [21:45] rockstar, well, I'm not able to branch his branch, get: [21:45] bzr: ERROR: Server sent an unexpected error: ('error', "An attempt to access a url outside the server jail was made: 'chroot-182925242704:///'.") [21:46] mwhudson, ^^ [21:46] rockstar: ah :) [21:46] Ursinha, are you branching from lp? [21:46] rockstar, Ursinha: i think that error means a badly configured bzr+http server [21:47] mwhudson, :) [21:47] :) [21:47] rockstar: bzr info nosmart+http://bzr.malept.com/bazaar-overlay/ works [21:47] rockstar, nope, I'm trying to branch from the original branch [21:47] of course :) [21:47] Ursinha, ah, okay. So not-our-problem problem. Those are my favorite kind. [21:47] rockstar, bad boy [21:48] Ursinha, so my initial assumption was correct, and it's a problem with the source. [21:48] but what mwhudson, being able to do a bzr info shows what? [21:48] *what mwhudson said [21:48] Ursinha: it's a problem with the smart server on their end [21:50] mwhudson, is that a way to workaround it, besides asking the user to fix his server? [21:50] Ursinha: well i guess bzr could fall back to the dumb protocol, but basically no [21:51] hm [21:51] maybe we need a better error message in the branch page? [21:51] it's not formatted very nicely i guess [21:51] this message makes everyone think that the problem will be fixed for itself [21:52] or that nothing needs to be done [21:52] well, unless you're the one running the server, there isn't much that can be done [21:52] mwhudson, I mean, the message says that [21:53] maybe we should show the error just like it's done with the imports? [21:53] that would be better, yes [21:53] mwhudson, well, I'll file a bug then [21:53] because there's no error saying that the main server is off or with problems [21:53] it's just "updating" hehe :-) [21:53] rsalveti, I think it should be better if displayed like when we have import errors [21:53] Ursinha: cool :-) [21:54] it has a message saying that it failed and the log [21:54] s [21:54] Ursinha: yep, because the current message let me think that this was a problem with launchpad itself [21:54] rsalveti, maybe you should contact the owner and ask him to fix that [21:54] or host it in lp itself [21:54] I just noticed that it's using a mirror now that rockstar showed the external link [21:54] because it's bzr, no need to do that :) [21:55] Ursinha: yep, to fix the branch, yes [21:57] in fact there's already a bug, it seems [21:57] bug 376229 [21:57] Bug #376229: broken mirrored branches display " Launchpad is processing new changes to this branch and will be available in a few minutes. Reload to see the changes." message [21:58] Ursinha: oh, i had't scrolled down that far [21:58] :) [21:59] :) [21:59] thanks mwhudson and rockstar [21:59] much appreciated :) === Ursinha is now known as Ursinha-afk [22:21] mwhudson: well, good news, though it makes me a bit nervous :-P . My bin/py script (a faux interpreter that can do most of the important interpreter tricks), generated from my zc.buildout branch, runs ``time ./bin/py -c ''``, um, about twice as fast as python24 on my system. So, assuming it does everything we need, that may help a lot. [22:21] gary_poster: ah, cool [22:23] gary_poster: twice as fast as python2.4 -c pass or bin/py from trunk? [22:23] mwhudson: how important is this? If I'm right that this works fine, and this puts codehosting back to the previous level of performance is this CP-worthy, for instance? [22:23] twice as fast as python 2.4 [22:23] site.py sure does do an awful lot of weird stuff :-) [22:23] heh, true [22:24] gary_poster: i'm slightly inclined against the cherrypick [22:24] noone has actually complained, we've just looked a bit bad :) [22:24] mwhudson: ok. that means it's more easy going for me. :-) [22:24] mwhudson: but I'll get this in and ping you in case you want to run some tests [22:25] gary_poster: yeah, very interested to see this land [22:25] cool [22:42] barry: hey, just so you know, I'm in the process of changing bin/py from a shell script with PYTHONPATH hack to a Python script (with its own fun ;-) ). So if you have not landed the mailman buildman change, then we should coordinate, in case my change messes up your plans. [22:42] ...this reminds me that I may need to change _pythonpath.py ... [22:42] but anyway, feel free to talk [22:43] gary_poster: it should be landed now. sounds interesting though :) why do you think you'll need to change _pythonpath.py? [22:48] barry: ok, cool. If make builds and tests pass then I'll be happy. :-) I'll maybe want to change _pythonpath to make it more careful, the way I had to change the buildout-generated scripts, to handle namespace packages and so on. [22:48] Handling dist-installation-style namespace packages and normal-installation packages in the same namespace require some excessively careful dances. :-/ [22:48] requires [22:48] :/ [22:48] barry: I was reading about Py 2.6.3 fun. :-( [22:48] gary_poster: you probably want to run bin/test --layer=MailmanLayer even though the tests are not entirely stable [22:49] and setuptools [22:49] gary_poster: it's what makes open source so rewarding :) [22:49] barry: ah! ok will do thank you [22:49] barry: lol :-) :-/ [22:56] This is new. The test suite just opened up the help manual for gnome terminal when the test failed. [22:56] * sinzui hopes this is not a karmic freature [22:56] sinzui: ouch. which test? [22:56] xx-announcements [22:58] sinzui: of course it doesn't fail for me, but i've never seen that (and i've seen lots of test failures on karmic :) [22:59] barry: My change to remove an ancient page_title broke more than I anticipated. I suspect a view was shared by several templates. [23:09] mwhudson: oh, bah. :-/ I had clunked my change. I was testing an earlier version that didn't do all the necessary dances. With the completely new mechanism, doing the proper dance as I currently understand the steps, we're back to one-order-of-magnitude-ish slower. So, my change will fix some problems, but it is not faster. [23:09] OTOH, it also is not (even) slower, so that's at least something, from my perspective. If the codehosting could use a significantly smaller subset of packages than the whole thing Launchpad needs, we could experiment with a callable just for that purpose...but a pre-forking process would be the better solution long-term anyway I suspect. [23:09] * gary_poster runs to dinner [23:09] good night all [23:10] gary_poster: ah well [23:10] gary_poster: bye for now [23:10] bye [23:11] sinzui: :( === matsubara_ is now known as matsubara-afk