[00:26] <chrisccoulson> dear empathy, please will you go for longer than 30 minutes without crashing
[00:26] <bcurtiswx> chriscoulson: we all wish that
[00:26] <chrisccoulson> heh, it's practically unusable here ;)
[00:26] <bcurtiswx> empathy might need a hugday
[00:26] <chrisccoulson> i think so
[00:28] <chrisccoulson> i think i need to spend some time debugging the crashes i'm seeing
[00:29] <bcurtiswx> i wish i had that kind of time
[00:29] <chrisccoulson> so do i
[00:29] <bcurtiswx> lol
[00:30] <chrisccoulson> i could do with a few extra hours in the day, so i can spend 8 hours at work + 8 hours on ubuntu without feeling tired in the morning ;)
[00:32] <superm1> mac_v, cody wasn't too keen on the change for update-notifier based on how it affects xubuntu w/o using humanity by default.  i've pushed the icons into lp:~superm1/humanity/add-update-notifier-icon so that they can be kept directly in the humanity theme instead.  can you look at that branch?
[02:20] <ccheney> asac: is bug 67226 related to that bug you fixed in g-s-d(?) in jaunty?
[02:20] <ccheney> asac: did the fix fall out?
[02:21] <ccheney> asac: if i remember correctly there was still a race that would be sometimes hit and cause an issue with it not setting the values
 dear empathy, please will you go for longer than 30 minutes without crashing
[02:48] <JanC> heh, empathy runs for weeks if i want?
[05:27] <mac_v> superm1: hi... i'm not comfortable adding the icons to Humanity. 1: they dont fit the theme , the icons are styled differently from the rest of the panel icons and the colors are totally out of humanity's palate , adding them would lead to bugs asking for monochrome icons 2: the gconf change is not supported in Ubuntu , so i dont think adding those icons for users conveys the message of it being a *not* supported option. 3:changing the icon for
[05:27] <mac_v>  Mythbuntu sake affects Ubuntu as well , so i'd rather think Mythbuntu changes its default to not show the icon or use the current icon as is.
[05:34] <superm1> mac_v, ok. will have to look into using a different icon theme probably for mythbuntu then. thanks for looking
[05:36] <mac_v> superm1: thanks
[07:45] <pitti> Good morning
[07:46] <pitti> yuriy: should it call some QtSomething.quit() before exit()?
[08:26] <seb128> good morning there
[08:31] <pitti> hey seb128
[08:31] <seb128> hey pitti
[08:31] <pitti> seb128: ooh, great to see bug 438065 fixed *phew*
[08:32] <seb128> pitti, it was on my radar for a bit sorry that it took efforts from other people to figure what was going on
[08:33] <seb128> debian backported the change during our beta freeze I had planned to look at it after beta ... which is now ;-)
[08:35] <seb128> pitti, oh btw, did you write instructions to debug those sort of issues?
[08:35] <seb128> bug #444083
[08:36] <seb128> pitti, what would be useful? devkit-disks --dump call? udevsomething?
[08:36] <pitti> ah, still not yet, sorry
[08:37] <pitti> udevadm info --export-db when the device is plugged in
[08:37]  * seb128 asks on the bug
[08:37] <seb128> pitti, danke
[08:56] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, bug 440733 is wierd
[08:56] <chrisccoulson> DistroRelease: Ubuntu 9.10
[08:57] <chrisccoulson> ProcVersionSignature: Ubuntu 2.6.28-15.52-generic
[08:57] <chrisccoulson> i thought people would acually use the latest kernel package
[08:58] <pitti> chrisccoulson: at least it might explain a few problems :)
[08:58] <chrisccoulson> heh, perhaps apport should stop them from reporting it until they've upgraded ;)
[08:59] <pitti> unless it's a bug report about an upgrade failure :)
[08:59] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i suppose so ;)
[08:59] <pitti> or that the new kernel doesn't boot
[09:01] <chrisccoulson> yeah, it's pretty bad if that happens and you can't report it
[09:07] <Amaranth> maxb: I consider bug 82654 to be much more important as it is entirely to easy now to move a window to a position where you cannot move it back. We also have bug 221698 fixed though, as much as we can. If you try to move a window with alt-click or the window menu (alt-space, m) it will let you move it under the top panel. Everybody happy. :)
[09:14] <Amaranth> chrisccoulson: I see you got to see some of the fun I've been having with certain bug reporters :)
[09:16] <chrisccoulson> Amaranth - which one was that?
[09:16] <Amaranth> the clock shadow bug
[09:17] <chrisccoulson> ah yes
[09:17] <lool> mac_v: Hey
[09:17] <chrisccoulson> i wish people would check before re-opening reports ;)
[09:17] <mac_v> lool: hi... thanks for the update :) phew ...
[09:18] <lool> mac_v: You dup-ed three bugs against the humanity update bug and all three were wrong   :-/
[09:18] <lool> mac_v: the two bug from oliver are still an issue after the update
[09:18] <mac_v> lool: kindly read my last comment
[09:18] <lool> and the bug from matt is a dup of the ubuntuone bug
[09:18] <Amaranth> chrisccoulson: They did that too me for 3 of the bugs that upload fixed
[09:18] <Amaranth> a/too/to/
[09:19] <lool> mac_v: I actually asked oliver to file these bugs because the two use cases felt somewhat close to the system service use case
[09:19] <mac_v> lool: mat's bug was what the random icons bug was about initially[ubuntu one icons are used in color] , you changed the title later
[09:19] <mac_v> lool: oh ok
[09:19] <mac_v> but those will break apps :/
[09:19] <mac_v> lool: the icons will get displayed in the system menu
[09:20] <mac_v> greyscale icons*
[09:20] <lool> mac_v: Duping the bugs is not the proper way to close them though; I think in these cases we want input from the design team on whether these icons should be b&w too or not; but that's lucid material
[09:20] <mac_v> lool: ok... but they need to be marked as bugs in their packages too
[09:20] <mac_v> since nothing can be done from doing icons in Humanity alone
[09:21] <mac_v> the apps need patches too
[09:21] <lool> mac_v: I think the line is thin
[09:22] <mac_v> hmm ;)
[09:22] <lool> mac_v: humanity has gpm icons and icons
[09:22] <seb128> evolution takes ages to close there
[09:22] <lool> mac_v: But sure, it could be pushed to the apps
[09:22] <seb128> I blame the indicator code, it's spamming the session bus with updates while takes ages to close
[09:23] <chrisccoulson> heh, the indicator stuff spams the session bus continuously ;)
[09:23] <mac_v> lool: sure.. i dont mind unduping and doing icons... but the apps *will* need patches... so i'd rather wait for them... i didnt know you had asked Oliver to file bugs ;)
[09:23] <lool> mac_v: I mean I'm not the one who does the work of producing these icons; from my perspective though, I dont expect all individual apps to grow these icons
[09:23] <seb128> chrisccoulson, not really
[09:23] <chrisccoulson> it seems to here :/
[09:23] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I can't open the indicator applet while evolution is closing
[09:23] <seb128> chrisccoulson, the menu seems to get a refresh every second or so
[09:23] <seb128> so as soon I click on it it's closed
[09:23] <seb128> I don't get that issue while evolution is running
[09:24] <chrisccoulson> hmmmm
[09:24] <seb128> just when it's being closed
[09:24] <lool> mac_v: if you think the app needs to change instead, then you could reassing the bug to the apps' package; IMO it will be hard to track the bugs if we do it in this way, and the people who are likely to do the work are the humanity folks (ie you)
[09:25] <lool> mac_v: Perhaps you might want to consider starting a humanity-gnome-system-icons project for karmic+1?
[09:25] <lool> mac_v: Anyway, tenriely up to you; I think the decision of having an icon b&w or not should be the design team's and I just care that we dont close the bugs
[09:25] <mac_v> lool: surely you cant expect us to do icons for all the apps ;) ... i'd say undup them and add the concerned apps in the also affects , once the apps assign new labels for notification area , the icons can be done
[09:26] <lool> mac_v: I already unduped them
[09:26] <mac_v> lool: also... i'm not sure if humanity will be used for Lucid ;) .. kwwii is starting a new icons theme
[09:26] <mac_v> icon theme*
[09:26] <lool> mac_v: I dont expect you to do all apps; I had in mind that the official ubuntu desktop or official gnome apps which *also* have an icon in the notification-area which is *also* a system service need an icon
[09:27] <bigon> seb128: hi you try to upload empathy yesterday but it fails as it's a point release with new tarball
[09:27] <lool> mac_v: i dont know either
[09:27] <bigon> seb128: hi you try to upload empathy yesterday but it fails as it's a point release with new tarball
[09:27] <bigon> oups
[09:27] <lool> mac_v: I think vino and display-properties are good examples of things which are distributed as apps but kind of feel like system services
[09:27] <lool> mac_v: I mean, there's a screen icon in OSX to reconfigure your screen for instance
[09:28] <mac_v> lool: yeah , you are right , but as i said , the icons will get displayed in the system menu too
[09:28] <mac_v> that is not ideal
[09:28] <lool> mac_v: That's an interesting technical issue; I'm sure we can fix it
[09:28] <seb128> bigon, hey, oh thanks for noticing, I will reupload, I forgot to use the option to include the tarball since that was 1ubuntu1 version...
[09:29] <Amaranth> Please don't change tomboy's icon :)
[09:29] <lool> mac_v: We could patch apps to use two icons, one for n-a one for menu, or patch the panel to change the lookup path for n-a icons
[09:29] <Amaranth> the panel doesn't control that
[09:29] <mac_v> lool: exactly what i'v been trying to ask the devs to do... but no one is doing it :(
[09:29] <lool> mac_v: Anyway, this is all lucid stuff; do what you want with it
[09:30] <bigon> seb128: thx
[09:30] <mac_v> lool: bluetooth , for example... asac needs to be convinced
[09:30] <lool> mac_v: Well if you want to do that, you need to market your project and communicate visibly on it; I didn't see anything myself
[09:30] <lool> mac_v: For instance you could write a wiki page on the ubuntu wiki stating the problem
[09:30] <lool> Explaining the rationale for the change and the technical implementation details
[09:31] <lool> mac_v: That's what we usually do in blueprints
[09:31] <mac_v> lool: interesting.. i'd like to do more icons , but when humanity is not going to be used for Lucid... spending too much time on this is not ideal for me ;p ... i'd like the UX to confirm what their plans are.. or atleast that they would carry forward these icons into the new Lucid theme
[09:31] <lool> mac_v: There's no requirement that you do that as a blueprint, but it's the best way to do it
[09:32] <seb128> blueprint = paper work
[09:32] <lool> mac_v: Right; I cant help you there sadly
[09:32] <seb128> if you like doing paper work ;-)
[09:32] <lool> haha
[09:32] <lool> Well it's also a mean of getting things officially approved and tracked for release
[09:32]  * mac_v hates paperwork ;p
[09:32] <lool> If you ask me to do changes out of the blue, I need to be convinced
[09:32] <mac_v> lool: yes.. i'll talk to kwwii and mat
[09:33] <lool> If you ask me to implement changes in an approved blueprint, I kind of assume we want the changes
[09:33] <lool> And RMs have the power to nag me about it
[09:33] <mac_v> lool: bluetooth already has a patch > Bug #437162
[09:34] <mac_v> so that the greyscale icon isnt used in the menu
[09:37]  * mac_v bbl
[10:41] <mat_t> morning all!
[10:42] <mat_t> Any Mini 9 users around? Could anyone please help with bug #77010?
[11:00] <mat_t> pitti: morning!
[11:01] <mat_t> pitti: any ideas/suggestions regarding #77010?
[11:07] <pitti> hey mat_t; sorry, I don't
[11:07] <pitti> TheMuso: any idea what could cause a system beep on mini 9's, with snd_pcsp annd pcspkr blacklisted?
[11:09] <slomo> mvo: yay, the gnome-codec-install svn branch is finally correctly imported with all the translations :)
[11:15] <seb128> re
[11:15] <seb128> hum, no compiz on karmic on my i965 now
[11:16] <seb128> oh, no it's back, weird
[11:16] <seb128> session restart to try that
[11:21] <andreasn> mac_v, thanks for fixing #385903, I can now sleep again at nights
[11:22] <mac_v> :) which bug is that
[11:23] <mac_v> bug #385903
[11:23] <mac_v> andreasn: hehe ;)
[11:28] <seb128> ok, works now, that's weird
[11:28] <lool> mvo: So my comment on the software store screenshots yesterday?
[11:28] <seb128> I got xorg in software acceleration for one boot
[11:28] <lool> mvo: You dropped off before I got back to you, so I commented in the bug
[11:28] <mac_v> seb128: hi... any reason for the patch in Bug #44082 not yet being applied ... several claim it fixes the issue
[11:28] <lool> seb128: was it a reboot or just logout/login?
[11:29] <seb128> lool, reboot
[11:29] <seb128> mac_v, the patch is not trivial, could break other thing and has not been reviewed by somebody knowing the code
[11:30] <seb128> mac_v, I've been trying to get vuntz to review without success
[11:30] <mac_v> seb128: aw...  :(
[11:30] <seb128> "aw"?
[11:31] <mac_v> awwww... as in > sad *sigh*...
[11:31] <slomo> seb128: thanks for syncing all new gstreamer stuff :)
[11:31] <seb128> I think I will do a lunch break or I will start doing some not so nice comments about users whining all the time
[11:32] <seb128> slomo, you're welcome, about the decodebin changes for gst-plugins-base do you plan to apply those to debian? do you have an updated changeset I could apply?
[11:32] <seb128> slomo, the bug has a zillion patches it's not easy to track
[11:36] <slomo> seb128: the updated changeset are all non-obsolete patches in the bug (in the order that's written on them)
[11:36] <vuntz> mac_v: I looked at it and I still don't understand why this would fix it, so I'm a bit reluctant to commit it
[11:36] <slomo> seb128: i'll upload this the patches to experimental later today
[11:36] <seb128> slomo, thanks
[11:36] <vuntz> mac_v: (working on crashers at the moment, so, hrm, question of priority ;-))
[11:36] <mac_v> vuntz: sure no probs.... thanks :)
[12:07] <pitti> kenvandine: hm, when I click on a person's conversation in the indicator, empathy crashes now
[12:11] <chrisccoulson> pitti - that happens all the time for me too
[12:11] <chrisccoulson> it's not something new though :-/
[12:11] <pitti> but it worked for me before
[12:11] <pitti> well, it still crashed sometimes, but at least it often worked
[12:12] <chrisccoulson> pitti - it always crashes for me if the person and/or conversation window disappeared
[12:13] <chrisccoulson> it seems to also crash if ive already looked at the conversation window before clicking on the indicator
[12:13] <chrisccoulson> it crashes about every 20 minutes on my desktop ;)
[12:18] <davmor2> pitti: the crash I always get is with nick serve on irc.  It remains showing up in indicator applet if you click on it again it kills empathy
[12:19] <mac_v> chrisccoulson , pitti: Bug #271258 , probably we need to add it to the gspca module blacklists..
[12:19] <chrisccoulson> davmor2 - that situation consistently crashes it for me too
[12:19] <chrisccoulson> mac_v - quite possibly
[12:20] <chrisccoulson> i find a lot of entries remain in the indicator applet after you've clicked them, and when you click them again, it always crashes
[12:20] <mac_v> should it be sent upstream or somewhere?
[12:21] <chrisccoulson> probably why empathy crashes so often for me
[12:22] <seb128> mac_v, the indicator things are not upstream code but ted's and kenvandine's rather
[12:23] <mac_v> seb128: oh... i was mentioning upstream for the gspca... damn irc delays :/
[12:23] <seb128> oh ok
[12:24] <mvo> slomo: weeh, cool!
[12:24] <seb128> mvo, what is cool?
[12:24] <mvo> lool: yeah, I saw it, I'm not sure yet what to do, I guess best is to provide scrollbars/resize handling for unr
[12:24] <mvo> seb128: gnome-codec-install is imported into lp
[12:24] <seb128> ah ok, nice
[12:25] <seb128> mvo, speaking of which do you want to do the update? there is a new version in debian slomo said we should have
[12:26] <slomo> seb128, mvo: the "--transient-for" and "ignore other commandline parameters" part would be good to have
[12:27] <mvo> seb128: it looks like a simple update, I have a look
[12:27] <seb128> mvo, thanks
[12:27] <mvo> and if its in bzr imported it should be even more trivial ;)
[12:28] <slomo> mvo: but i won't use bzr to work on it :P but the svn->bzr import seems to run every 6 hours so that shouldn't be a problem
[12:28] <seb128> slomo, you like svn better than bzr?
[12:28] <seb128> weird ;-)
[12:28] <mvo> slomo: sure, no need to use bzr on your side, but I will use it :)
[12:30] <slomo> seb128: no, but i don't want to learn just another distributed version control system... i prefer git but i already have to use hg for other things, two should be enough ;)
[12:30] <slomo> seb128: svn isn't great but at least it's simple ;)
[12:30] <seb128> right
[12:31] <seb128> you can use bzr as svn though, bzr get, bzr commit, bzr push
[12:31] <seb128> but whatever everybody uses the tools he wants ;-)
[12:31] <Amaranth> seb128: or bzr checkout then bzr commit pushes for you
[12:31] <seb128> Amaranth, you don't always want to push every commit online
[12:31] <seb128> but right ;-)
[12:32] <mvo> bzr commit --local
[12:32] <mvo> ;)
[12:32]  * seb128 doesn't start this discussion
[12:32]  * mvo takes off his so-clever hat now
[12:32] <seb128> Amaranth, btw compiz crashing today, it had been a long time that didn't happen
[12:32] <Amaranth> seb128: but svn does so it's similar
[12:32] <Amaranth> seb128: I blame mvo
[12:32] <seb128> I blame your update
[12:32] <Amaranth> apport?
[12:33] <Amaranth> also what is crashing? there is still a somewhat common crash with alt-tab that isn't fixed because we only have new compiz and staticswicher is in plugin-main
[12:34]  * mvo just discovered bzr merge -i and he loves it
[12:35] <seb128> Amaranth, sec
[12:35] <seb128> #0  0x00d5a661 in switchTerminate (d=0x8f48168, action=0x9cc2874,
[12:35] <seb128>     state=CompActionStateTermKey, option=0xbfc566fc, nOption=4)
[12:35] <seb128>     at staticswitcher.c:759
[12:35] <seb128> #1  0x0806c487 in handleEvent ()
[12:36] <Amaranth> yep, that's it
[12:36] <Amaranth> new compiz-fusion-plugins-main snapshot will fix it
[12:37] <seb128> ok thanks
[12:37] <seb128> so you were right to blame it on mvo? ;-)
[12:38] <Amaranth> hehe
[12:38] <Amaranth> speaking of compiz being broken, it seems the ati drivers are reporting 2048 for max texture size but only supporting 1024 or 512 :/
[12:38] <Amaranth> so people are losing their wallpaper
[12:39] <mvo> Amaranth: hm? so core needs a new plugins-main?
[12:39] <Amaranth> mvo: it doesn't need it but it will fix that bug
[12:39] <Amaranth> mvo: that bug has been there for some time though
[12:40] <Amaranth> the core update fixed it in switcher but staticswitcher had the same bug
[12:41] <seb128> grrrr at apport-collect
[12:41] <seb128> 21 emails for one command run, come on
[12:42] <seb128> did we change anything recent which would clean things in tmp on upgrade?
[12:42] <seb128> I blame it on mvo's too
[12:43] <seb128> or could be a doko thing
[12:44] <seb128> mvo, bug #444252 is weird, have you seen that before?
[12:44] <seb128> installed started breaking on
[12:44] <seb128> "    names = os.listdir(path)
[12:44] <seb128> OSError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: '/tmp/gconf-BBrcKQ'""
[12:44] <seb128> which is weird since the gconf code didn't change in ages
[12:44] <seb128> we got 5 bugs in 7 hours about this now
[12:45] <mvo> seb128: some sort of race where a tmp reaper attacks?
[12:45] <mvo> seb128: I don't think I have seen that
[12:45] <mvo> Amaranth: aha, thanks. I will do a update of the remaining ones
[12:46] <mvo> seb128: no, I don't clean /tmp in u-m
[12:46] <seb128> mvo, ok, thanks
[12:46] <seb128> mvo, I think we will need to put it on the karmic radar if we continue getting bugs about it
[12:46] <mvo> seb128: how many do we have already?
[12:47] <seb128> mvo, 5 in 7 hours
[12:47] <seb128> 6
[12:47] <seb128> keeps counting, I'm looking at the recent upgrade bugs
[12:48] <mvo> hrm, bad
[12:48] <mvo> thanks
[12:49] <seb128> mvo, ok, we got 6 of those so far and that started 7 hours ago
[12:50] <mvo> interessting, I guess we should just check what got uploaded around this time
[12:50] <seb128> I didn't spot anything obvious
[12:50] <seb128> gconf didn't change for a month
[12:50] <seb128> and there has been no python* upgrade yesterday
[12:51] <james_w> hmm
[12:51] <james_w> I'm in the middle of an upgrade
[12:51] <james_w> ** (gnome-open:15119): WARNING **: Can not stat /tmp/orbit-jw2328
[12:51] <mvo> uh
[12:51] <mvo> sounds like the same issue
[12:51] <james_w> and my /tmp is all but empty
[12:51] <james_w> some rogue rm in a postinst?
[12:51] <asac> anyone running grub2?
[12:52] <seb128> asac, not me
[12:52] <asac> some bug reporter says he cannot select kernel there
[12:52] <asac> is there a magic key-combo or something?
[12:54] <Amaranth> asac: hold down shift
[12:54] <Amaranth> otherwise you don't get the menu and it just picks the most current one
[12:54] <asac> k
[12:54] <asac> thx
[12:55] <asac> i think some output telling the user that would be helpful ;)
[12:55] <mvo> james_w: i run a test upgrade now to check if I can see that too
[12:56] <Amaranth> asac: output telling the user that would defeat the purpose of doing it
[12:56] <asac> hmm
[12:56] <asac> k
[12:57] <mvo> seb128: hm, the gnome-codec-install merge is more difficult than I had hoped, looks like the svn import did something to the branch, I can not merge and everything is unhappy
[12:57] <mvo> seb128: I may have to blow away the old ~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-codec-install branch
[12:58] <seb128> ok
[12:59] <james_w> http://paste.ubuntu.com/286921/
[12:59] <james_w> ^ packages uploaded in the last 24 hours, any guesses?
[13:00] <Amaranth> How about packages uploaded in the last 24 hours that are getting updated or installed on your system?
[13:00] <Amaranth> Should cut half that list out, I hope
[13:01] <james_w> yeah yeah
[13:01] <seb128> I did try some "ls -l | grep 2009-10-06 | awk '{print $8}' | xargs grep rm"
[13:01] <seb128> in /var/lib/dpkg/info
[13:01] <seb128> but no luck so far
[13:03] <Amaranth> well /tmp goes away if you unmount it, perhaps something is doing that?
[13:03] <Amaranth> no, that wouldn't work, it would fail to unmount because there are files open
[13:04] <james_w> http://paste.ubuntu.com/286925/
[13:04] <james_w> sorted by publishing time
[13:04] <james_w> we're looking ~9 hours ago I think
[13:05] <seb128> asac, did you do any maintainer script tweaking yesterday in your uploads?
[13:05] <Amaranth> not compiz
[13:05] <mvo> my test-upgrade is at ~33% and /tmp is still going strong
[13:07] <james_w> http://paste.ubuntu.com/286929/
[13:07] <james_w> upgraded packages today
[13:10] <bigon> seb128: http://pastebin.be/21257 :(
[13:10] <seb128> bigon, yes, should be fixed now sorry for the spamming
[13:10] <seb128> bigon, ie check you mail again in a minute
[13:11] <asac> seb128: in gnome-main-menu?
[13:11] <asac> no
[13:11] <asac> afaik i idndt change anything
[13:11] <seb128> asac, no, in any of the nm uploads
[13:11] <asac> i cant remember doing that
[13:11] <asac> whats the problme?
[13:11] <james_w> http://paste.ubuntu.com/286936/
[13:11] <james_w> intersection
[13:12] <seb128> asac, we are looking for something uploaded this night which wipe tmp on upgrade and breaks those
[13:12] <asac> urgh
[13:12] <asac> no i dont do that i hope
[13:12] <bigon> seb128: ok no problem :)
[13:14] <Amaranth> only package in compiz that has a postinst is compiz-gnome which just runs gconf-schemas (same for prerm)
[13:16] <Amaranth> Does this only happen on upgrades from jaunty? I'm up-to-date and haven't had this problem
[13:16] <Amaranth> No I'm not, have "binutils locales os-prober pm-utils software-center" available for upgrade
[13:16] <asac> do we have a script to quickly gen debdiffs of latest upload for packages?
[13:16] <Amaranth> Perhaps that narrows it even further?
[13:17] <seb128> Amaranth, no, those are karmic to karmic upgrades and I didn't get the issue too
[13:17] <seb128> I'm trying to look at the packages in james_w's that I'm not using
[13:17] <seb128> could be a non standard package
[13:20] <james_w> oh, I took the intersection of binary packages and source packages
[13:20] <james_w> that's not going to work too well
[13:22] <asac> i am doing a full upgrade too atm. will see
[13:22] <mvo> james_w: hm, it seems to be not in the default install, I did a test upgrade and tmp seems to be fine, I will try one with the packages you listed next
[13:22] <asac> full == one week no karmic update
[13:23] <james_w> thanks mvo
[13:29] <seb128> libvirt has
[13:29] <seb128> "  * debian/libvirt-bin.cron.daily: added to clean out old profiles that are no
[13:29] <seb128>     longer associated with a virtual machine definition (LP: #438165)"
[13:29] <seb128> but I can't see anything obvious wrong there
[13:29] <seb128> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/33073545/libvirt_0.7.0-1ubuntu8_0.7.0-1ubuntu9.diff.gz
[13:29] <seb128> if somebody want to have a look
[13:29] <seb128> no, the find is in an another dir, probably not it
[13:30] <james_w> looking at diffs from the likely uploads doesn't show anything obvious
[13:36] <mvo> slomo: hm, what is the svn location of the upstream branch for gonme-codec-install ? did that move
[13:37] <Amaranth> hmm, if apport says a bug is a potential regression (it thinks it's a dupe of a fixed bug) it should still provide the trace :/
[13:44] <asac> james_w: are you sure that you didnt accidentially remove your /tmp/ by some other operation while you were upgrading? ;)
[13:45] <james_w> oh yeah, I ran "rm -rf /tmp/*" because I wanted to see what would happen!
[13:45] <asac> my laptop upgrade now finished (got 900m of archives)
[13:45] <asac> had no issue
[13:46] <seb128> asac, see bug #444252
[13:46] <asac> kk
[13:46] <asac> if there are dupes we can rule that out i guess
[13:46] <seb128> asac, either 8 users did that accidentally today or there is a bug somewhere
[13:47] <seb128> bigon, did you testbuild your empathy upgrade?
[13:48] <asac> seb128: bigon: can you bump lower version on libnm-* stuff to >= 0.8~a~git.20091005t192303 ?
[13:49] <seb128> asac, why? can't we just wait for your version to be published on buildds rather than use an artificial requirements breaking backports etc?
[13:49] <asac> would be helpful to ensure that we use the paddings we added to ABI in future updates
[13:49] <asac> seb128: its published
[13:49] <asac> seb128: its just not built on all archs
[13:50] <asac> seb128: nevermind. sparc has built now
[13:50] <seb128> cool
[13:50] <seb128> I like it better to not require versions which are not needed, make easier to do builds on non uptodate boxes for those who want
[13:50] <asac> well
[13:50] <asac> we added padding to ABI as i said ...
[13:51] <asac> so building against that is helping for future
[13:51] <asac> but its fine now ;) ... and the api parts used by empathy probably dont need it anyway
[13:51] <seb128> and we will rebuild empathy before karmic anyway
[13:51] <yuriy> pitti: no, nevermind, that's not the issue I think
[13:51] <seb128> GNOME 2.28.1 updates
[13:51] <james_w> I'm heading for dinner
[13:51] <james_w> found nothing so far
[13:52] <seb128> james_w, enjoy your dinner, I didn't find anything either
[13:52] <seb128> james_w, did you try grepping in maintainer scripts?
[13:52] <asac> feels a bit like its something in the auto generated debhelper stuff
[13:52] <james_w> a little
[13:53] <mvo> have fun james_w
[13:53] <james_w> I didn't narrow it down though
[13:56] <james_w> http://paste.ubuntu.com/286956/ for your grepping pleasure
[13:56] <seb128> pitti, hum, what info do you look for in http://launchpadlibrarian.net/33118022/output.txt?
[13:57] <seb128> james_w, cat thislist | xargs grep rm?
[13:57] <seb128> or tmp, or find
[13:57] <james_w> lots and lots
[13:57] <james_w> I'll look after eating
[13:57] <seb128> enjoy your dinner
[13:58] <james_w> % xargs grep rm < /tmp/scripts| wc -l
[13:58] <james_w> 1315
[13:58] <pitti> seb128: that's for a music player? I can't find one there
[13:58] <mvo> seb128: hm, I just had a X restart during a test dist-upgrade - might that be gdm?
[13:58] <seb128> pitti, that's the bug I pinged you about
[13:59] <seb128> mvo, no
[13:59] <pitti> seb128: I'd look for the vendor/product strings/ID and compare them against /lib/udev/rules.d/90-usb-media-players.rules
[13:59] <bigon> seb128: I tought I did
[13:59] <seb128> pitti, "Samsung YP-U3 (MTP) not recognized by Rhythmbox"
[13:59] <seb128> bigon, the libindicate patch doesn't apply
[13:59] <bigon> mmm
[13:59] <pitti> seb128: oh, there we go, it's an MTP device
[13:59] <seb128> pitti, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/444083
[14:00] <seb128> "the Player is recognized as Digicam, not as Audioplayer."
[14:00] <seb128> id-music-player bug?
[14:01] <pitti> seb128: right; we have 4e8:5119 as "Samsung Yepp YP-P3", but not this one
[14:01] <seb128> pitti, ok, cool, do you want me to do something out of reassigning to media-player-info?
[14:01] <pitti> seb128: right, it is; we also need to know its capabilities, like which formats can it record/play and whether it uses a particular subfolder for music (often MUSIC/ or so)
[14:02] <seb128> pitti, the user says it was working in jaunty, can't you get the datas from the old fdi files we used there?
[14:02] <pitti> seb128: bah, I should install the README file..
[14:02] <kenvandine> i should have really done this upgrade over night... gonna take forever to download 421M
[14:02] <seb128> hey kenvandine
[14:02] <kenvandine> at 23kB/s
[14:03] <kenvandine> hey, working on that empathy icon/indicator thing now :)
[14:03] <seb128> bigon, will you look at updating the libindicate change or should ask kenvandine if he can have a look?
[14:03] <pitti> seb128: oh, hang on
[14:03] <pitti> seb128: it's in /lib/udev/rules.d/45-libmtp8.rules
[14:03] <kenvandine> bigon, what's wrong with it?
[14:03] <seb128> kenvandine, 2.28.0.1 update, the patch needs to be updated
[14:03] <pitti> seb128: sorry, I never really understood that libmtp thing
[14:03] <kenvandine> i can take a look
[14:03] <pitti> seb128: so it seems that RB doesn't like those mtp devices any more?
[14:04] <seb128> pitti, well everything I know is on the bug
[14:04] <bigon> kenvandine: thx
[14:04] <seb128> let me grab the mtp device I got for testing some uds ago
[14:05] <seb128> kenvandine, the update is in bzr and I uploaded without test building but the patch fails to apply
[14:05] <seb128> kenvandine, will teach me to trust known contributors for upgrades ;-) anyway if you could fix the libindicate patch to apply
[14:05] <bigon> seb128: :o
[14:05] <pitti> seb128: right, was just going to ask
[14:05] <seb128> kenvandine, it should be easy, it seems a configure update and they got the "check the notification server capabilities" upstream too
[14:06] <pitti> seb128: woudl be interesting to know whether it still works with any mtp devic
[14:06] <pitti> e
[14:06] <huats> Hello everyone !
[14:06] <huats> pitti and seb128 o/
[14:06] <pitti> hey huats
[14:07] <huats> how are you guys ?
[14:08] <chrisccoulson> hey huats
[14:08] <huats> hello chrisccoulson
[14:09] <chrisccoulson> how are you?
[14:09] <huats> great !
[14:09] <huats> Very busy with my business
[14:09] <chrisccoulson> excellent:)
[14:09] <huats> but I won't complain :)
[14:09] <huats> you ?
[14:09] <chrisccoulson> did you say you were going to be a father soon?
[14:09] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm good thanks
[14:09] <seb128> lut huats
[14:09] <Laney> huats: commiserations on the CC result ;)
[14:10] <seb128> pitti, it's listed as a camera in gvfs
[14:10] <huats> Laney: commiserations ?
[14:10] <seb128> pitti, ie camera icon in the computer location, no rhythmbox launched when plugging it in
[14:11] <seb128> pitti, Volume(0): Samsung YP-U3
[14:12] <pitti> seb128: oh, you have such a thing as well?
[14:12] <seb128> pitti, yes, the key I got for testing is one
[14:12] <pitti> seb128: let's do a quick test
[14:12] <seb128> pitti, it's not listed in devkit-disks --dump
[14:12] <pitti> seb128: no, it's not a block device
[14:13] <seb128> right
[14:13] <joaopinto> OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: '/var/crash/_usr_lib_telepathy_telepathy-butterfly.1000.crash' <- should I file a bug report about this ?
[14:13] <pitti> seb128: please find your vendor/product in /lib/udev/rules.d/45-libmtp8.rules, add ENV{ID_MEDIA_PLAYER}="samsung-yepp_yp-p3" and replug the thing
[14:14] <pitti> seb128: this won't be very accurate, but let's see what RB makes of it
[14:14] <pitti> seb128: (warning: total shot into the dark; I don't know how RB handles MTP devices)
[14:14] <seb128> pitti, (it's not rb since gvfs displays it as a camera too)
[14:22] <mvo> slomo: is there anything that uses the --transient-for switch?
[14:23] <mvo> seb128: did you find anything else that looked high profile while looking at the upgrade reports?
[14:23] <seb128> mvo, no
[14:24] <mvo> seb128: thanks
[14:24] <seb128> mvo, you're welcome
[14:25] <mvo> I'm not sure about the codec installer merge at this point if nothing uses the new --transient-for switch
[14:25] <mvo> it looks all fine and the branch is ready
[14:25] <mvo> but still
[14:26] <seb128> mvo, we can as well wait for karmic+1 now
[14:29] <seb128> asac, nm not displayed bubbles to say you are connect to some access point, is that wanted?
[14:29] <seb128> ie bug or design choice?
[14:30] <asac> seb128: you might have a gconf setting that disables it
[14:30] <seb128> I didn't touch any gconf key
[14:30] <seb128> I go the bubble about being disconnect from access points though
[14:31] <slomo> mvo: yes, totem passes this to gstreamer, which passes --transient-for to the installer
[14:31] <slomo> mvo: without this, the installer window can get lost behind totem ;)
[14:31] <asac> seb128: to be sure, check gconftool-2 -R /apps/nm-applet ... if that is all false i will check the code
[14:31] <seb128> asac,
[14:31] <seb128> $ gconftool-2 -R /apps/nm-applet
[14:31] <seb128>  suppress-wireless-networks-available = true
[14:31] <seb128>  stamp = 1
[14:31] <seb128>  disable-disconnected-notifications = true
[14:31] <seb128>  disable-connected-notifications = true
[14:32] <asac> seb128: yes. so its a bug that you see the disconnected notifications ;)
[14:32] <seb128> asac, so the bug is that I get notified about disconnections
[14:32] <asac> yep
[14:32] <asac> ;)
[14:32] <mvo> slomo: ok, I think that is a good enough reason, I know what it does, I was just not sure if it is actually used :)
[14:32] <seb128> and why did I have those values?
[14:32] <asac> thats understandable because thats a dx patch we made for last cycle
[14:32] <seb128> I never edited those by hand
[14:32] <asac> seb128: in the past NM had bubbles with actions
[14:32] <asac> remember ;)?
[14:32] <seb128> yes
[14:32] <asac> at that time there was a "dont show again" button
[14:32] <asac> maybe we should reset them ;)
[14:32] <seb128> but in jaunty I was getting the "connected to access point <name>"
[14:33] <asac> now that i think about it
[14:33] <asac> but thats not easy afaik
[14:33] <seb128> I don't think I ever clicked "don't show again"
[14:33] <Keybuk> bratsche: please stop randomly assigning bugs to Upstart
[14:33] <asac> seb128: maybe it was a similar bug in jaunty. check if you get it with all those falase
[14:33] <asac> false
[14:33] <seb128> if I get what?
[14:33] <seb128> the bubbles?
[14:33] <bratsche> Keybuk: Okay.  What should I do with them?
[14:33] <asac> seb128: yes. for connected, disconnected
[14:34] <Keybuk> bratsche: I don't care, but they're not Upstart bugs
[14:34] <bratsche> Okay, fair enough.  I'll just start marking them Invalid.
[14:34] <asac> but i did that a few weeks ago on my other system and it worked ...
[14:34] <Keybuk> if you are getting bugs about messages on the console, file the bug on the package generating the message
[14:35] <seb128> asac,
[14:35] <asac> seb128: yep. so works for me on my laptop
[14:35] <seb128> $ cat %gconf.xml
[14:35] <seb128> <?xml version="1.0"?>

[14:35] <seb128> 	<entry name="stamp" mtime="1235057906" type="int" value="1"/>
[14:35] <seb128> 	<entry name="disable-connected-notifications" mtime="1232439430" type="bool" value="true"/>

[14:35] <seb128> asac, that's my user gconf
[14:35] <asac> urgh
[14:35] <bratsche> Keybuk: I don't know what that package is, so I'll just mark as Invalid.
[14:35] <asac> hmm
[14:35] <asac> schema problem?
[14:35] <Keybuk> bratsche: if you like
[14:36] <seb128> asac,
[14:36] <seb128>       <key>/schemas/apps/nm-applet/disable-connected-notifications</key>
[14:36] <seb128>       <type>bool</type>
[14:36] <seb128>       <default>TRUE</default>
[14:36] <seb128> asac, in /usr/share/gconf/schemas/nm-applet.schemas
[14:37] <seb128> asac, what is the intend? should those be on or off on new installs?
[14:37] <asac> ON
[14:37] <asac> except the "wireless available" one
[14:37] <seb128> so your schemas value is wrong?
[14:38] <seb128> or this gconf key doesn't do what I think?
[14:38] <asac> the schema is probably wrong. not sure where its produced atm
[14:38] <seb128> asac, what do you mean?
[14:39] <seb128> asac, it's nm-applet.schemas.in in network-manager-applet-0.8~a~git.20091002t194214.8515a07 source
[14:39] <asac> heh. i was on wrong branch ;)
[14:39] <asac> so seems there was no schema in 0.7 ;)
[14:40] <seb128> bratsche, what bug number?
[14:40] <bratsche> For what?
[14:41] <bratsche> Oh, the boot messages?
[14:41] <seb128> bratsche, the bug you don't know where to assign
[14:41] <bratsche> I'm not sure.. there were a couple yesterday that I didn't know about so I mistakenly assigned to upstart.
[14:42] <bratsche> If I get more (and I'm sure I will) I'll ask you.
[14:42] <seb128> ok thanks
[14:42] <bratsche> Since jono's blog post I get all kinds of random stuff filed against xsplash.
[14:42] <seb128> welcome to distro world
[14:42] <bratsche> :)
[14:43] <asac> seb128: subscribed you to bug 444561
[14:43] <seb128> asac, thanks
[14:43] <seb128> hey rickspencer3
[14:44] <rickspencer3> hi seb128
[14:44] <seb128> asac, there is only 3 keys in this schemas so it should be easy to review ;-)
[14:44] <asac> seb128: read the bug ;)
[14:44] <asac> i didnt say its a "big" review ;)
[14:44] <seb128> lol, right
[14:44] <seb128> doh
[14:45] <seb128> we are flooded by this tmp upgrade issue
[14:45] <asac> seb128: maybe we get a dupe with just a hand ful of packages?
[14:45] <seb128> asac, I will look through those
[14:46] <asac> so if those dupes started yesterday i think we can safely say it was an upload from yesterday. maybe intersecting that with the upgrade logs will help spot the package (if not done already)
[14:46] <seb128> we tried to intersect with james_w
[14:47] <seb128> there was like one hundred package updates yesterday
[14:47] <asac> ok didnt know you tried to interset with the uploads.
[14:47] <chrisccoulson> i havent updated since yesterday. if you havent figurered out whats causing it by the time i get home, i could update each package separately to see if it happens ;)
[14:47] <asac> then we need to intersect the logs of all dupes
[14:50] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - this is in one of the logs: http://paste.ubuntu.com/286992/
[14:50] <chrisccoulson> suspect?
[14:50] <seb128> oh
[14:51] <chrisccoulson> that was on 4/10 though :-/
[14:51] <seb128> chrisccoulson, not it I would say, sun-java6 didn't change for over a month now
[14:52] <james_w> any progress?
[14:54] <seb128> james_w, no but I'm running out of idea and got sidetracked in other things
[15:04] <and471> mvo:hello
[15:05] <and471> mvo: can I ask you a question about distutils?
[15:06] <mvo> and471: sure
[15:06] <yavuzselman> hallo
[15:07] <mvo> james_w: no progress from me neither
[15:07] <and471> mvo: I have a data directory within that is a themes directory
[15:08] <and471> mvo: I am trying the copy all the files and folders in that themes drectory to share/themes
[15:08] <and471> mvo: however distutils only works with files (as far as I am aware)
[15:08] <mvo> and471: i think there is no great way, glob.glob will help
[15:08] <and471> mvo: ok
[15:09] <and471> mvo: someone recommended using os.walk, would this help
[15:09] <mvo> you will have to build the list dynamically AFAICS
[15:09] <mvo> yes
[15:09] <and471> mvo: yeah
[15:09] <mvo> os.walk should be fine, its easy to use too
[15:09] <and471> mvo: ok I shall experiment with that then :-)
[15:09] <and471> mvo: thanks
[15:10] <mvo> good luck
[15:10] <and471> mvo: see ya
[15:22] <mvo> seb128: so it was gdm afterall that did the restart (at least that is my current theory) ... but only when doing a upgrade via aptdeamon (or from the commandline). its still a dangerous thing to restart gdm if no DISPLAY is set because it might be a upgrade in the console with users still being logged in
[15:23] <seb128> mvo, ok, I don't know about that, could be in the upstart script? I've no clue how those work
[15:23] <dobey> oh
[15:23] <mvo> seb128: I think its in the gdm.prerm
[15:23] <dobey> mac_v, lool: so humanity 0.4.1-0ubuntu1 includes the ubuntuone icons too then?
[15:24] <mvo> seb128: I will have a look later and maybe add some workaround code in aptdaemon, just wanted to mention it for now
[15:24] <seb128> mvo, what in the prerm exactly?
[15:24] <mac_v> dobey: yup
[15:24] <mvo> seb128: line 52
[15:25] <mac_v> dobey: only the ones you gave me
[15:25] <mvo> seb128: the if echo $DISPLAY|grep $hostname bit
[15:25] <dobey> ok
[15:25] <mat_t> tseliot: hi, do you know when your fix for the cursor flicker will go into Karmic?
[15:25] <mvo> and my /tmp survied a dist-upgrade, hrm hrm
[15:26] <seb128> mvo, hum ok
[15:26] <kenvandine> seb128, empathy indicator patch updated and pushed
[15:26] <mvo> seb128: I file a bug and work on it later
[15:26] <seb128> kenvandine, mvo: thanks
[15:28] <lool> dobey: lool@bee ~ 1002 % dpkg -L humanity-icon-theme|grep ubuntuone|ubuntu-paste
[15:28] <lool> http://paste.ubuntu.com/287015/
[15:28] <tseliot> mat_t: I already have a debdiff for that which either bryce or someone else should upload when they can (I'm not a core-dev)
[15:28] <lool> dobey: So yes
[15:28] <lool> dobey: Not sure if it's enough or the latest versions
[15:29] <dobey> lool: well, it could use more sizes and all that jazz, but should be good
[15:30] <lool> dobey: Will you sort out the open ubuntuone bug?
[15:30] <lool> dobey: If it needs to be marked as a dup or something
[15:33] <dobey> lool: which bug? #434886 ?
[15:34] <seb128> mac_v, do you have an opinion on bug #444574?
[15:37] <lool> dobey: yeah
[15:37] <lool> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntuone-client/+bug/434886
[15:37] <james_w> "rm -f" doesn't imply "-r" does it?
[15:38] <dobey> lool: i still need to make a release of ubuntuone-client which includes the necessary fixes there
[15:38] <seb128> james_w, no
[15:38] <dobey> lool: so yeah, i'm taking care of the rest of it
[15:38] <seb128> james_w, you got tmp totally wiped, ie no directory there?
[15:39] <james_w> I can't see anything in any maintainer scripts of the packages that I upgraded that were also uploaded in the last 24 hours
[15:39] <james_w> when I looked I had /tmp/orbit-jw2328
[15:39] <mac_v> seb128: hmm... tough call ;) ... i prefer the icon there. we have a messaging icon [i-a] , so why shouldnt rhythmbox exist too?[music menu] it does show the status of the player. [either player is playing song or paused] ...i'm biased... not sure maybe mpt can decide
[15:39] <james_w> so it's not clear if /tmp was removed, but I suspect either rm -r /tmp or rm -r /tmp/*
[15:41] <mpt> mac_v, agreed -- it would be nice if it opened the menu on primary click (like the messaging menu does), but that's not a freeze-break-worthy problem
[15:41] <mac_v> seb128: ^
[15:42] <lool> dobey: k
[15:42] <seb128> mac_v, mpt: ok thanks
[15:42] <lool> james_w: ouch
[15:43] <seb128> lool, see bug #444252
[15:43] <seb128> lool, if you have any clue how to track that one...
[15:43] <james_w> so, I didn't get any failures
[15:44] <james_w> seb128: do all GNOME packages call something that will want that gconf socket?
[15:44] <seb128> james_w, any having a schemas to register yes
[15:44] <james_w> so in my case it was probably a later installed package
[15:44] <james_w> or a trigger
[15:45]  * Ng wonders if he could persuade someone to go for a one-line patch to libgtk-vnc-1.0-0 :)
[15:46] <seb128> Ng, try soren?
[15:46] <Ng> soren: buddy!:D
[15:47] <james_w> hmm, no, GNOME was upgraded early in the run, so that doesn't help too much
[15:49] <mat_t> tseliot: ok, thx - I understand they have that in their pipeline already
[15:50] <lool> the upgrade in the bug is rather large
[15:50] <lool> do we have a smaller set of packages reproducing the issue?
[15:50] <seb128> lool, yeah, we got lot of changes yesterday ...
[15:51] <seb128> lool, you can look to the duplicates too
[15:53] <mpt> gnargh
[15:53] <mpt> Silly Empathy and its invisible conversations
[15:54] <lool> seb128, james_w: This is a quite high profile bug; we should consider escalating it
[15:54] <kenvandine> seb128: that string change for switch user is pushed, can you sponsor bug 444494?
[15:54] <lool> Since we're post beta
[15:54] <seb128> lool, I tried mentioning it on #ubuntu-devel several times without success
[15:54] <james_w> seb128: are duplicates still flooding in?
[15:55] <lool> seb128, james_w: What do you gyes think?
[15:55] <james_w> lool: escalating where?
[15:55] <lool> james_w: As in crisis process
[15:55] <lool> TB people etc.
[15:55] <lool> Just as a SRU regression
[15:55] <seb128> james_w, there is not flooding quickly but we keep getting bugs
[15:56] <seb128> lool, ask mdz what he things?
[15:56] <seb128> thinks
[15:56] <james_w> yeah, just what I was going to say
[15:58] <soren> Ng: Eh?
[15:58] <lool> seb128: I dont think it hurts to poke TB people though; I think I'll do that now
[15:58] <Ng> soren: could I interest you in bug #444604 and the oneline patch upstream just committed for it? :)
[15:59] <lool> slangasek, Riddell, Hobbsee, pitti, mdz, Keybuk, cjwatson, kees, jdstrand, lool, pgraner, davidm, cody-somerville, jdong: Hi; we have a serious upgrade issue post-beta; LP #444252 it seems a package upgrade clears /tmp, potentially erasing open user data; there are a bunch of dups; is this escalation worthy?
[16:00] <soren> Ng: Sure, just assign it to me.
[16:00] <Ng> soren: sweet, ta :)
[16:00] <lool> slangasek, Riddell, Hobbsee, pitti, mdz, Keybuk, cjwatson, kees, jdstrand, lool, pgraner, davidm, cody-somerville, jdong: seb128 and james_w know more about the bug
[16:01] <lool> seb128, james_w: I'm on a call for some minutes; hopefully not too long; I can drop off if needed
[16:01] <Riddell> since the upgrade tool is in /tmp that seems like it could cause problems for  the upgrade too
[16:01] <seb128> lool, try on the channel where most of those people are?
[16:02] <lool> Urgh I thought I was on devel
[16:06] <pitti> lool: ouch
[16:06] <pitti> thanks for the heads-up
[16:11] <mac_v> dobey: hast humanity been updated for you? it was done yesterday. if you are seeing the humanity-icon-theme 0.4.1  , the icons are there. the lp bug# was not listed in the changelog :/
[16:22] <dobey> mac_v: right. i already confirmed with lool. thanks :)
[16:33] <mac_v> mpt: why is this being done? :/ > Bug #428509 , do IM bubbles have to be blocked when watching movies :/  cant the IM block be done only when using OOo apps ?
[16:35] <mpt> mac_v, sabdfl asked for that, I don't remember exactly why
[16:36] <mpt> mac_v, I think it was because we couldn't trust applications to inhibit screensaver or not reliably (our previous guide)
[16:36] <mac_v> mpt: the presentations are a valid concern! but why for movies... this new feature has already caused me a lot of grief :/
[16:37] <mac_v> if there is not enough time to fix such issues properly , why are they even been done!
[16:38]  * mac_v goes hunting notify-osd source
[16:41]  * jpds thinks it a good idea to block notify-osd for movies.
[16:42]  * mac_v realizes jpds  might not be working away from home ;p
[17:06]  * ccheney upgrades his box to karmic beta finally, for some reason jaunty isn't working properly for him anymore with intel 53xx wifi
[17:11] <asac> ccheney: are you running backport-modules?
[17:12] <asac> ccheney: what are the symptoms?
[17:15] <seb128> tedg, hey
[17:15] <seb128> tedg, what code gets the launcher titles again?
[17:16] <seb128> tedg, I wrote a small text program and textdomain() doesn't break the translation there, I need to do extra debugging for the indicator
[17:17] <tedg> seb128: Hmm, that's odd.
[17:18] <ccheney> asac: it won't let me connect to a wpa2 ap, it used to work
[17:18] <tedg> seb128: We're looking at that now.
[17:18] <ccheney> asac: i can connect to a different unencrypted ap fine, it might be the encrypted ap is dying, but not really sure
[17:18] <seb128> tedg, and is there any way to run the code which get the title on a command line for easier debugging?
[17:19] <asac> ccheney: so are you using linux-backport-modules?
[17:19] <ccheney> asac: i don't think i am running any of the backports, just jaunty updates
[17:19] <tedg> seb128: Uhm, I wrote that last night :)  There is a dbusmenu branch with dbusmenu-dumper that you can run to dump everything.
[17:19] <asac> ccheney: ok. then its probably not on ubunztu side.
[17:19] <asac> (i would hope)
[17:19] <seb128> tedg, what process is responsible to get those titles?
[17:19] <ccheney> asac: ok, i'll see how it does when just booting the live cd for karmic, if that works it might be a driver issue, otherwise my AP is dying
[17:20] <ccheney> or at least needs a new firmware i suppose, heh
[17:20] <LaserJock> kenvandine or tedg: around?
[17:20] <tedg> seb128: indicator-messages-service
[17:21] <seb128> tedg, thanks
[17:21] <tedg> LaserJock: Yes.
[17:21] <LaserJock> tedg: I'm confused about what you were saying regarding my "empathy get's automatically started" bug
[17:22] <LaserJock> so I'm supposed to mark myself as offline, even though I'm online, in order to use pidgin but not have empathy start up when I get a message?
[17:22] <tedg> LaserJock: Well, you have choices :)  You can disable all your Empathy accounts and then nothing will get started there.  That sounds like what you want.
[17:23] <LaserJock> but I use empathy sometimes too
[17:24] <LaserJock> so the jist here is that indicator-applet-session only runs empathy?
[17:24] <LaserJock> this all seems like spaghetti
[17:25] <LaserJock> I don't know what function controls what, and there are no options or documentation that I can find
[17:25] <tedg> LaserJock: Setting your status in the indicator-session will try to set it in Empathy and Pidgin if they're available to set.  Empathy always reports it's available because of dbus-service stuff.  So it will always work there setting your status in Telepathy.
[17:26] <lifeless> pitti: around?
[17:26] <lifeless> pitti: we're looking for the location of the desktop translations in lang packs
[17:27] <LaserJock> tedg: ok, so if I mark myself as offline to get rid of empathy opening up is it going to change my pidgin status?
[17:27] <tedg> LaserJock: If you do it in the session menu, yes.  But if you do it in Empathy, no.
[17:27] <LaserJock> yikes, confusing
[17:28] <LaserJock> so basically I need to enable and disable accounts in empathy to get pidgin to work as expected
[17:29] <davmor2> LaserJock: can you not just open empathy and set it to be offline
[17:29] <LaserJock> davmor2: but I'm online
[17:30] <davmor2> LaserJock: but the service isn't which is what your setting
[17:30] <LaserJock> davmor2: sorry, misread
[17:30] <rickspencer3> team meeting time!
[17:30] <LaserJock> davmor2: I don't know, I don't regularly start 2 IM clients
[17:30] <pitti> hi lifeless
[17:30] <pitti> lifeless: what in particular?
[17:31] <pitti> lifeless: -> #u-devel, meeting here
[17:31] <ArneGoetje> hi all
[17:31] <rickspencer3> ArneGoetje, asac, bryce, ccheney, kenvandine, pedro_, pitti, Riddell, tkamppeter
[17:31] <pedro_> hello!
[17:31] <Riddell> afternoon
[17:31] <rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-10-06
[17:31] <tkamppeter> hi
[17:31] <rickspencer3> all ... please excuse my lack of organization regarding last weeks meeting
[17:32] <rickspencer3> I am feeling much better this week, though, so should be more on top of things
[17:32] <bryce> morning!
[17:32] <rickspencer3> bryce, welcome back
[17:32] <bryce> thanks
[17:32] <rickspencer3> today I'd like to:
[17:32] <rickspencer3> 1. review targeted bug list
[17:33] <rickspencer3> 2. quick update on status of listed areas
[17:33] <rickspencer3>  
[17:33] <rickspencer3> does anyone have anything to add to the agenda?
[17:33]  * kenvandine waves
[17:33]  * awe waves too
[17:33] <rickspencer3> hi kenvandine, is that waving hello, or waving that you want to add to the agenda?
[17:33]  * asac waves
[17:33] <rickspencer3> hehe
[17:34] <kenvandine> hello :)
[17:34] <rickspencer3> let's start with the usual
[17:34] <rickspencer3> partner update .. kenvandine?
[17:34] <kenvandine> sure
[17:34] <kenvandine> pretty typical, but the delta is getting much smaller
[17:35] <kenvandine> u1 will need a couple packages uploaded this week
[17:35] <kenvandine> couchdb with minimal change/risk and desktopcouch
[17:35] <kenvandine> which fixes syncing desktops
[17:36] <kenvandine> u1 client, we are discussing removing the u1 prefs launcher
[17:36] <kenvandine> which was just added, you can still get to it via the apps menu launcher
[17:36] <kenvandine> and everyone agrees we need to improve the workflow for lucid
[17:36] <rickspencer3> "discussing"?
[17:36] <kenvandine> rickspencer3, that bug i subscribed you too
[17:37] <ccheney> asac: whatever is going on it works as soon as i boot up the karmic beta live cd
[17:37] <kenvandine> i think everyone is in agreement
[17:37] <kenvandine> will followup today to make sure it is happening
[17:37] <rickspencer3> kenvandine, ok, please do
[17:37] <rickspencer3> pitti is dialed into this change afaik
[17:37]  * ccheney is here now, sorry for being late was beating on his wifi
[17:37] <asac> ccheney: ok thanks. lets talk after meeting
[17:37] <rickspencer3> and I think it's right
[17:37] <kenvandine> dx releases this thursday as usual, a couple things to note
[17:37] <kenvandine> the string change for the session applet
[17:38] <kenvandine> switch user instead of New session
[17:38] <kenvandine> and we dropped the user list for karmic
[17:38] <kenvandine> pushing it to lucid
[17:38] <rickspencer3> I *think* I alerted everyone and did everything properly for translations and docs
[17:38] <kenvandine> yeah, thx
[17:38] <kenvandine> that is all i have
[17:38] <rickspencer3> kenvandine, thanks
[17:38] <rickspencer3> Riddell, kubuntu status?
[17:39] <ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: dpm and I will forward it to the translators
[17:39] <Riddell> kubuntu update:
[17:39] <rickspencer3> ArneGoetje, thank you
[17:39] <pitti> kenvandine: some empathy/indicator crash fixes on the list? it's pretty unnerving right now..
[17:39] <Riddell>  * KDE 4.3.2 and Qt 4.5.3 in the archive, our final bugfix update before release
[17:39] <Riddell>  * KDM/ksmserver hangs on logout, we have a workaround though incase we don't find the root cause
[17:39] <Riddell>  * KPackageKit fixed, missing dependency at fault
[17:39] <Riddell>  * some kcontrol translations broken, problem diagnosed, rosetta people have been poked
[17:39] <Riddell>  * microblog broken, still to investigate
[17:39] <Riddell>  * "tech-preview" warning to be added to kubuntu netbook ubiquity, should be easy though
[17:39] <Riddell>  * hardy -> karmic upgrade now in dist upgrade tool, adept needs patched in hardy-updates to make it work
[17:40] <Riddell> that's me
[17:40] <kenvandine> pitti, i am going through those today
[17:40] <rickspencer3> Riddell, thanks
[17:40] <rickspencer3> pitti, kenvandine are those crashes targeted? if not, should they be?
[17:40] <pedro_> kenvandine, i've assigned some of those to you yesterday, need to re look into empathy today as well i'll let you know if i encounter some serious bug there
[17:40] <kenvandine> rickspencer3, i will make sure they are
[17:41] <pitti> Riddell: kdm hang on logout> so that wasn't the -intel fix that we had recently?
[17:41] <Riddell> pitti: no  I think it's unrelated, that caused a crash
[17:41] <pitti> ah, right
[17:42] <rickspencer3> well, why would anyone want to log out of Kubuntu?
[17:42] <Riddell> can't say I ever do
[17:42] <rickspencer3> there is no better place to be ;)
[17:42] <rickspencer3> Riddell, is there any help anyone can give you to find the root cause of that?
[17:43] <Riddell> rickspencer3: someone with non-intel could check to see if they  have the same issue
[17:43] <rickspencer3> ok
[17:43] <rickspencer3> that seems like someone in the community could do that
[17:43] <awe> Riddell, I do...
[17:43] <rickspencer3> I would, but I have intel ;)
[17:43] <awe> ...I'm doing a Kubuntu Beta install now and can check
[17:43] <Riddell> awe: great
[17:43] <rickspencer3> yeah!
[17:44] <rickspencer3> ok, I'd like to briefly discuss targeted bugs now
[17:44] <asac> all targetted bugs are mine ;)
[17:44] <rickspencer3> lol
[17:44] <pitti> asac fix them all, let's have dinner
[17:44] <asac> one thing scares me a bit: bug 427734
[17:44] <rickspencer3> and I noticed seb128 bailed just in time
[17:45] <asac> will get a new image now. hope i can produce that on usb stick too.
[17:45] <rickspencer3> ok
[17:46] <rickspencer3> all, I notice the distribution of targeted/High bugs is far from equitable
[17:46] <asac> the rest looks still ok. i am untargetting the XID bug now
[17:46] <rickspencer3> are folks working on bugs that aren't targeted that could be helping with bugs that are?
[17:46] <pitti> asac: the XID is not a kitten killer after all?
[17:46]  * asac usually does not target non-high bugs
[17:46] <rickspencer3> or are there bugs that should be targeted that aren't?
[17:46] <asac> pitti: i did not get any hint that its a problem.
[17:47] <rickspencer3> asac, right ... your bug list is obviously full
[17:47] <rickspencer3> but I want to make sure that:
[17:47] <rickspencer3> 1. everyone has a full queue of important work
[17:47] <rickspencer3> 2. we are load balancing as best we can
[17:47] <rickspencer3> thoughts?
[17:47] <pitti> bug 438561 looks serious and is worth targetting IMHO
[17:48] <rickspencer3> pitti, should it be high?
[17:48] <rickspencer3> and can you assign to robert_ancell?
[17:48] <pitti> and bug 381116  is a serious issue for your mental health if your wife keeps complaining during a video evening :-)
[17:48] <rickspencer3> hmmm
[17:49] <pitti> oh, the first one is targetted already, sorry
[17:49] <rickspencer3> ok, maybe not that one
[17:49] <asac> pitti: i saw windows media player not inhibiting that on vista even recently ;)
[17:49] <rickspencer3> ok ... I'll follow up individually with bugs lists
[17:49] <awe> asac: you have a vista machine?  ;)
[17:49]  * rickspencer3 makes not to self: don't discuss bug lists as a group
[17:50] <pitti> rickspencer3: done
[17:50] <rickspencer3> ok, now I'd like to bang through and get a quick update on the status of various areas
[17:50] <rickspencer3> what are the current issues, if any
[17:50] <rickspencer3> what may change before the 15th
[17:50] <rickspencer3> bryce, can you please comment on xorg?
[17:51] <pitti> the totem bug seems easy at first sight, just renamed d-bus interface
[17:51] <bryce> Still coming up to speed on current status, thanks owed to tseliot for maintaining X this last month.
[17:51] <bryce> There are a few bugs to focus on, thankfully not a huge list.
[17:51] <bryce> It appears several important X merges planned to go for beta didn't make it in time.
[17:51] <bryce> I don't know if there's going to be time to cherrypick all the individual bug fixes from those
[17:51] <rickspencer3> bryce, can we cherry pick *none* and call xorg done for Karmic?
[17:51]  * Amaranth cries
[17:51] <rickspencer3> live with the bugs we have without introducing new worse ones?
[17:51] <rickspencer3> Amaranth, are their specific patches that compiz needs?
[17:52] <rickspencer3> pitti, thoughts?
[17:52] <Amaranth> No but my system needs some of those changes in order to use KMS without blinding me :)
[17:52] <pitti> rickspencer3: well, technically we can, but why not use the remaining two weeks to test/cherrypick at least major bugs?
[17:52] <rickspencer3> Amaranth, do you know the specific patches?
[17:52] <pitti> tseliot prepared a nice list
[17:53] <rickspencer3> pitti, right, but I never saw a reply to his list
[17:53] <bryce> with the current mesa, et al KMS on -ati seems still a bit too buggy to enable it
[17:53] <Amaranth> Oh, and if you don't use KMS on intel all clutter apps are broken due to GLX_SGI_video_sync being broken but I don't think I ever filed a bug for that...
[17:53] <Amaranth> rickspencer3: The ones that add Backlight support
[17:53] <pitti> bryce: I don't think we should strive for enabling KMS on ATI for karmic
[17:53] <rickspencer3> so ...
[17:53] <Amaranth> rickspencer3: I think it needs one commit from the kernel module and one from the intel driver to match it
[17:53] <Amaranth> Will dig more
[17:53] <asac> ati works good here ;) ... please dont break that ;)
[17:54] <rickspencer3> 1. will apply xorg patches in priority order that don't risk regressions too much
[17:54] <rickspencer3> 2. will not strive for KMS for ait
[17:54] <rickspencer3> pitti, what's the cut off date for #1?
[17:54] <pitti> focussing on the pinpointed ones where we have bug reports and can ask for feedback
[17:54] <rickspencer3> right, so how much time do we have for that?
[17:55] <bryce> KMS on -ati was one of the major X changes planned for karmic; certain people will be unhappy if we are not delivering that.  But I agree I'd rather wait until it provided benefit, rather than introduced regressions
[17:55] <rickspencer3> I'd like a deadline that includes enough time to intelligently and calmly back out changes that cause new problems
[17:55] <pitti> rickspencer3: October 15th, I'd say
[17:55] <rickspencer3> ok
[17:55] <pitti> but this is why I just want cherrypicks, no major new versions
[17:55] <Amaranth> Oh man, I'm going to have build my own kernel
[17:55] <rickspencer3> bryce, could this be an edgers project?
[17:55] <pitti> since it's easy to revert a cherrypick, but hard to downgrade a new version
[17:55] <pitti> bryce: ^ ok for you?
[17:55] <rickspencer3> ati with KMS that is?
[17:55] <bryce> rickspencer3, it already has been an xorg-edgers project
[17:56] <rickspencer3> ok
[17:56] <rickspencer3> thanks bryce
[17:56] <rickspencer3> moving on ...
[17:56] <Amaranth> Anyone have a link to tseliot's list of changes?
[17:56] <bryce> rickspencer3, problem is people have not been giving testing feedback on it
[17:56] <rickspencer3> seb128, gnome?
[17:56] <seb128> what about it?
[17:56] <rickspencer3> any major problems or changes coming up?
[17:57] <pitti> going well, I'd say, just gdm needs more love
[17:57] <rickspencer3> "no" is an acceptable answer
[17:57] <seb128> nothing major GNOME is string, api, abi etc frozen
[17:57] <seb128> GNOME 2.18.1 due in 2 weeks though
[17:57]  * rickspencer3 adds gdm to list
[17:57] <pitti> seb128: that gets tight
[17:57] <pitti> but traditionally we included it
[17:57] <seb128> pitti, as it does every cycle since warty...
[17:57] <rickspencer3> right
[17:57] <pitti> seb128: come on, let's have our biannual ritual!
[17:57] <seb128> we have almost always had the same margin basically
[17:58] <seb128> ;-)
[17:58] <pitti> s/bi/semi/ actually
[17:58] <rickspencer3> ok, we should strive to clear the decks so seb128 and robert_ancell can focus 100% on working with gnome community to do those updates
[17:58] <pitti> one major thing is that langpacks are currently pretty broken
[17:59] <rickspencer3> pitti, I thought this was a simple matter of disk space and would be resolved thusly?
[17:59] <pitti> rickspencer3: and our little community GNOME army :)
[17:59] <rickspencer3> making more space
[17:59] <seb128> right, would be nice to get it fixed quickly so translators can test and see what needs to be done
[17:59] <pitti> rickspencer3: right, but I can't really "do" that myself, just keep begging people
[17:59] <pitti> nothing to discuss, just mentioning
[17:59] <rickspencer3> pitti, well, we can start deleting stuff
[17:59] <pitti> apt-get install doubledisk
[17:59] <rickspencer3> hehe
[18:00] <ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: pitti != root
[18:00] <rickspencer3> pitti, do we have a list of space hogs?
[18:00] <pitti> rickspencer3: sent by mail
[18:00] <seb128> how do we stand space wise now?
[18:00] <seb128> how many language packs do we have on CD?
[18:00] <pitti> as I said, I just wanted to mention it, so that everyone knows if a bug appears
[18:00] <rickspencer3> pitti, ok, I'll follow up
[18:00] <rickspencer3> moving on ...
[18:00] <rickspencer3> ccheney, OOo?
[18:00] <pitti> seb128: space is pretty ok; disk is full, and French is on the CD
[18:00] <seb128> pitti, ok ;-)
[18:01] <rickspencer3> oui
[18:01] <ccheney> rickspencer3: seems pretty good except for the kde integration, i need to ping roman again to see the current status
[18:01] <rickspencer3> bon
[18:01] <pitti> and don't anyone dare to propose something new on the CD now :)
[18:01] <ccheney> rickspencer3: i'll be doing another upload next week to get more bug fixes in, etc
[18:01] <pitti> seb128: en es xh pt de fr bn
[18:01] <rickspencer3> ccheney, can you help roman with the KDE parts?
[18:01] <Riddell> it's deep qt integration issues
[18:02] <Riddell> as a user I havn't actually  noticed any problems
[18:02] <Riddell> but  some people have
[18:02] <rickspencer3> hmmm
[18:02] <rickspencer3> ccheney, your bug list doesn't look too bad
[18:02]  * ccheney doesn't know enough about qt to fix it himself
[18:02] <rickspencer3> are there other bugs in Ubuntu that you can help with?
[18:02] <ccheney> also have moblin2 work on the oem side, but should be able to get enough time to do the OOo stuff
[18:03] <rickspencer3> right, I forgot about OEM stuff
[18:03] <rickspencer3> :)
[18:03] <ccheney> np :)
[18:03] <rickspencer3> ok, so final OOo uplaod expected next week?
[18:03] <ccheney> yes
[18:03] <rickspencer3> moving on ...
[18:03] <rickspencer3> asac Mozilla?
[18:04] <rickspencer3> anything other than what is reflected on your assigned bugs list?
[18:04] <asac> Mozilla:
[18:04] <asac> * cherry-pick/backport for XError on startup bug (waiting final upstream input)
[18:04] <asac> * fix ubufox on CD
[18:04] <asac>  * update plugin database (online, no freeze relevant)
[18:04] <asac>  * except lots of uploads next weeks by mozillateam doing the extension finalization (KarmicExtensionReview) - thats universe
[18:04] <rickspencer3> ok
[18:04] <asac> thats basically what is outstanding for mozilla on my side
[18:04] <rickspencer3> sweet
[18:04] <asac> NetworkManager:
[18:05] <asac> * we are close to what we will release ... please do serious testing of modems again ;)
[18:05] <asac>  * will blog about getting feedback for modems
[18:05] <asac>  * TODO: work with upstream on bugs; tag a RC before the 15th and get that in
[18:06] <rickspencer3> ok
[18:06] <asac> so yes. last update round will be shortly before the freeze unless upstream goes mad and does risky stuff (which we discussed shouldnt happen)
[18:06] <rickspencer3> asac, your attention to detail and organization is much appreciated
[18:06]  * pitti makes note to test 3g stick again
[18:06] <rickspencer3> lots of awesome progress in Karmic
[18:06] <rickspencer3> thanks to awe as well for participating this cycle!
[18:06] <pitti> asac: today a new disabled bluetooth icon appeared on my panel; will that go away again?
[18:07] <rickspencer3> I'm seeing some good reviews of the new NM UI
[18:07] <asac> also some more Universe stuff:
[18:07] <asac> * gnash and connman update to latest
[18:07] <asac> thats it
[18:07] <asac> and of course fixing bugs and low hanging fruits i spot
[18:07] <asac> while reading bugmail etc.
[18:07] <rickspencer3> asac, don't forget to sleep?
[18:07] <rickspencer3> aside from testing NM, anything else that you might be able to offload on someone?
[18:08] <asac> great ;)
[18:08] <asac> that makes me really happy
[18:08] <asac> pitti: i fixed killswitch support
[18:08] <asac> so that might be what you are seeing
[18:08] <asac> pitti: you should be able to turn on/off bluetooth again
[18:08] <asac> pitti: or are you asking something else?
[18:08] <pitti> asac: there is no BT device right now
[18:08] <pitti> it shouldn't be displayed unless I have an adapter, like in beta/jaunty/earlier
[18:08] <pitti> anyway, let's discuss this offline
[18:08] <pitti> seems it wasn't a deliberate change then
[18:09] <pitti> rickspencer3: oh, for your OMGkarmic list, I still need to port screen-resolution-extra to the new policykit
[18:09] <pitti> it's currently broken
[18:09] <asac> rickspencer3: unlikely. my work area is too special. tony helps already on NM bugs though
[18:09] <rickspencer3> OMG!
[18:09] <pitti> which means that ATI users can't configure multihead properly
[18:09] <asac> pitti: is that the last consumer of old polkit?
[18:09] <pitti> second-last
[18:09] <pitti> the last one is checkbox
[18:09] <asac> but its safe?
[18:10] <pitti> but we could leave that as it is and just use the old PK
[18:10] <asac> ok. if we can get that out of main that might be worth some risk
[18:10] <pitti> unlike screen-resolution, checkbox doesn't need the gnome frontend
[18:10] <pitti> the porting is safe, yes
[18:10] <pitti> well, it can hardly get any worse, it doesn't work at all right now :)
[18:10] <rickspencer3> pitti, any action for me there?
[18:10] <asac> ok. so whatever doesnt work is probably safe to touch ;)
[18:10] <pitti> rickspencer3: no, but I thought you were compiling a list
[18:10] <rickspencer3> or just letting me know why you won't be sleeping until October 29th?
[18:11] <rickspencer3> pitti, yes, I was j/k
[18:11] <pitti> hehe
[18:11] <rickspencer3> thanks
[18:11] <rickspencer3> ok, the rest of the items we'll cover in Eastern edition
[18:11] <rickspencer3> any other business?
[18:11] <tkamppeter> I am concerned about bug 443026, bug 419143, and bug 439384, these are all bad interferences between PDF output of evince and the CUPS filter chain (and also PS/PDF printers). As most other apps print correctly it is probably an evince or GTK problem.
[18:12] <Riddell> I'd like to update shared-mime-info if that's ok
[18:12] <pedro_> rickspencer3, could you ask to Luke to review the bugs we talked at previous meetings regarding pulseaudio? there's no feedback there yet
[18:12] <pedro_> rickspencer3, i can send you the list of bugs again if needed
[18:13] <rickspencer3> ok, so let's do this one at time
[18:13] <rickspencer3> tkamppeter, is there some assistance we can provide?
[18:13] <asac> rickspencer3: if you could ask luke to take a look at my bug 440540 that would be precious. maybe its just me, but if its more widely spread on lenovo X61 then we probably would want to fix this.
[18:13] <seb128> Riddell, there is a newer version?
[18:13] <asac> basically i can only use my laptop with volume turned off
[18:14] <seb128> Riddell, oh right, I looked some days ago and was about to ask hadess if he planned to roll a new tarball
[18:14] <seb128> Riddell, go for it
[18:14] <Riddell> will do
[18:14] <tkamppeter> pitti, seb128, I was full of hope that the evince printing problems will stop when the switchover to PDF output was done, but now it produces PDF which crashes Ghostscript (see bug 443026) makes PDF printers hanging (also bug 443026) and interferes badly with CUPS filters.
[18:15] <tkamppeter> It must mainly be found out what the problem with evince's PDF is.
[18:15] <pitti> tkamppeter: if we can't fix that properly in time, could we switch evince back to postscript as a remedy?
[18:16] <pitti> it worked in jaunty, so we could still at least compare their output and see what changes and do an upstream bug report at elast
[18:16] <tkamppeter> The printer hang is an out-of-memory occuring in the printer, so the PDF seems to hog a lot of memory.
[18:17] <tkamppeter> pitti, the PDF switchover was not only done in favor of the PDF workflow but also to fix several problems which the PostScript of evince caused.
[18:17] <tkamppeter> pitti, so we must be careful when we make a decision.
[18:18] <pitti> right
[18:18] <pitti> tkamppeter: but perhaps we can bisect the evince changes in karmic to find out what broke it
[18:18] <tkamppeter> pitti, Perhaps evince could somehow recognize that the input is PDF and then simply pass the PDF through and not re-render it.
[18:18] <pitti> but again, too specific for meeting, let's discuss that off-line
[18:18] <rickspencer3> ok
[18:18] <rickspencer3> thanks
[18:19] <tkamppeter> Should the bugs get targetted or raised?
[18:19] <rickspencer3> I've asked pedro to assign pulse bugs directly to TheMuso
[18:20] <rickspencer3> tkamppeter, yes, they should be targeted, we can always untarget later, but if you are worried we should raise the profile
[18:20] <rickspencer3> ok, any other business?
[18:20] <rickspencer3> going once ...
[18:20] <rickspencer3> okay, thanks all!
[18:21]  * rickspencer3 tap tap, is thing on?
[18:21] <kenvandine> :)
[18:21] <pitti> thanks everyone
[18:21] <pedro_> thanks
[18:21]  * pitti cd kitchen && make dinner
[18:21] <ArneGoetje> thanks
[18:21] <tkamppeter> thanks
[18:21]  * pedro_ -> lunch
[18:22]  * ArneGoetje -> dinner
[18:22]  * Amaranth -> lunch too
[18:22] <seb128> thanks
[18:22]  * bryce -> banging head on table
[18:22] <and471> mvo: I fixed the problem with setup.py :-) using os.walk()
[18:22] <Amaranth> bryce: Make sure you miss the keyboard
[18:26] <asac> thanks!
[18:26]  * asac almost out
[18:33] <Amaranth> found someone actually having a problem with compiz being a shell script that does checks and then loads compiz.real
[18:34] <Amaranth> the checks take almost 5 seconds on his system then compiz doesn't have enough time to load before gnome-appearance-properties decides it failed and loads metacity again
[18:34] <Riddell> rickspencer3: did you get my activity report?  it's not on the meeting agenda
[18:35] <dobey> Amaranth: i wonder if that's part of the problem on my desktop
[18:36] <Amaranth> dobey: Do you run your desktop from a slow USB flash stick? :)
[18:36] <dobey> Amaranth: no
[18:36] <Amaranth> it only takes 0.5 seconds on my system
[18:36] <dobey> but i can't seem to get compiz to work :(
[18:36] <Amaranth> obviously it'll take longer at login with all the IO going on but we don't bail after 8 seconds either
[18:37] <Amaranth> dobey: With this particular problem you'd see compiz starting (title bars go away) then metacity would come back and it would say you can't enable
[18:37] <Amaranth> dobey: CM_DRY=yes compiz
[18:37] <dobey> Amaranth: well that's what i see when i click on "full effects" in the appearance properties :)
[18:38] <Amaranth> dobey: ok, time CM_DRY=yes compiz
[18:38] <jono> kenvandine, what was the EMPATHY command again?
[18:38] <Amaranth> hopefully you haven't already ran it since then it'll all be in cache :)
[18:39] <kenvandine> jono, one sec
[18:39] <dobey> Amaranth: i will in a bit, i just started an update... that has 310 packages :-/
[18:39] <Amaranth> yeah, it'll fail during dist-upgrade for the same reason
[18:39] <Amaranth> too much IO
[18:39] <kenvandine> jono, EMPATHY_LOGFILE=/tmp/empathy.log EMPATHY_DEBUG=all NICE_DEBUG=all empathy
[18:40] <dobey> i'll update, reboot, then try
[18:40] <jono> kenvandine, called and it immediately disconnected
[18:40] <kenvandine> jono, my fault
[18:41] <kenvandine> i was restarting :)
[18:41] <jono> ahhh
[18:41] <jono> kenvandine, all set?
[18:41] <kenvandine> yeah
[18:41] <jono> kenvandine, and disconnected
[18:42] <jono> kenvandine, send you the log?
[18:42] <kenvandine> jono, no... hang on
[18:42] <jono> ok
[18:42] <kenvandine> still my fault
[18:42] <jono> np
[18:42] <kenvandine> i am running in gdb :)
[18:42] <jono> hehe
[18:42] <jono> I am gonna restart so I get a new log
[18:42] <jono> all set
[18:42] <kenvandine> ok
[18:43] <jono> and disconnected
[18:43] <kenvandine> you got disconnected already?
[18:43] <kenvandine> jono, ok, send that log please
[18:43] <jono> ok
[18:43] <kenvandine> thx
[18:44] <rickspencer3> Riddell, got it, yes
[18:44] <rickspencer3> thanks
[18:44] <jono> on its way
[18:53] <chrisccoulson> pah, my hard drive has started whining now
[18:53] <chrisccoulson> maybe it really is ready to die
[18:53] <Amaranth> heh
[18:54] <Amaranth> Right after that discussion of it with you my old laptop starting showing the failure warning
[18:54] <chrisccoulson> it's time for me to start shopping for new hardware
[18:54] <Amaranth> Did a full test, it died
[18:54] <chrisccoulson> eek
[18:55] <chrisccoulson> i'm not getting any other smart warnings though, other than the reallocated sector count
[18:55] <chrisccoulson> although i'm not sure which of the 3 disks is making the noise yet
[19:01] <kenvandine> jono, you still around?
[19:04] <jono> kenvandine, yep
[19:06] <kenvandine> jono, ok, so your problem is upnp is failing
[19:06] <kenvandine> it isn't punching through your router
[19:06] <jono> kenvandine, interesting
[19:07] <kenvandine> do you have more than one router by chance?
[19:07] <jono> the router is a stock config
[19:07] <jono> kenvandine, I don't but in a few hours I am heading to a coffee shop, I can test there
[19:07] <kenvandine> like a wireless access point that is capable of being a router?
[19:07] <kenvandine> that was my problem :)
[19:07] <jono> kenvandine, exactly
[19:08] <jono> kenvandine, unpnp is enabled on the router too
[19:09] <kenvandine> jono, exactly what? single router or an extra access point?
[19:09] <jono> kenvandine, it is a single router for our home
[19:09] <kenvandine> assuming the coffee shop has upnp enable
[19:09] <kenvandine> +d
[19:09] <kenvandine> ok
[19:09] <kenvandine> i had a wireless router i was using as just an access point, it was causing havoc on my home network
[19:10] <jono> Belkinright
[19:10] <kenvandine> i moved it around a bit so it is now the router and all is good
[19:10] <jono> kenvandine, let me try and hop on my neighbours open network
[19:10] <jono> one sec
[19:10] <kenvandine> ok
[19:12] <kenvandine> jono, make sure you run it the same way
[19:13] <jono> kenvandine, no luck
[19:13] <jono> kenvandine, is this something you can fix or is this a "go and buy a new router solution"
[19:13] <kenvandine> oh, can't connect?
[19:13] <jono> ?
[19:13] <kenvandine> well... or a firmware update on your router
[19:13] <kenvandine> etc
[19:13] <kenvandine> what model router is it?
[19:13] <jono> kenvandine, will do
[19:14] <jono> couldnt connect to the neighbours net
[19:14] <jono> let me try once more, I have moved positions
[19:14] <kenvandine> ok
[19:14] <jono> oh I cant
[19:14] <jono> Belkin F5D9231-4v1(01)	
[19:14] <jono> will try to do a firmware update
[19:14] <jono> one sec
[19:20] <jcastro> kenvandine: ok so can you and/or tedg explain what is supposed to happen with the m-i
[19:21] <jcastro> because it's infuriating to have my IM client keep launching itself
[19:22] <tedg> jcastro: Your IM client isn't launching itself.
[19:22] <LaserJock> jcastro: I think you're supposed to set yourself as "offline" in the m-i-s
[19:23] <tedg> jcastro: The session menu sets your IM state.
[19:23] <jcastro> is that the dropdown that says "Loading.." all the time?
[19:23] <tedg> jcastro: Whether or not you've got Empathy open or not.
[19:23] <tedg> jcastro: Well, there shouldn't be anything like that...
[19:24] <LaserJock> tedg: so that's where the session menu is only tied to empathy?
[19:24] <LaserJock> or it should do the same for pidgin as well
[19:24]  * LaserJock is still a tad confused
[19:24] <jcastro> I am totally confused here too
[19:24] <tedg> LaserJock: No, the session menu is tied to MissionControl 5, MissionControl 4 and Pidgin.
[19:25] <LaserJock> I have no idea what MissionControl is, is that related to empathy?
[19:25] <tedg> Kind of, it's related to Telepathy.  Empathy uses Telepathy.
[19:25] <jcastro> tedg: ok so am I supposed to use the dropdown in the main empathy UI?
[19:25] <LaserJock> ok, I just opened empathy and played with the -session applet
[19:26] <tedg> jcastro: Sure, if you want.
[19:26] <LaserJock> normally I just use it for restarting the computer
[19:26] <tedg> LaserJock: So if you want want to have accounts setup in Empathy, just go in there and disable the accounts.
[19:26] <jcastro> ok so if that little talk bubble is black on my panel does that mean I am signed in?
[19:27] <LaserJock> I think that's signed out
[19:27] <tedg> jcastro: I'm not sure about the icons. But you can look at the "Set Status" submenu for a "key" of them.
[19:27] <LaserJock> ok, so I guess I understand what my issue was before a bit more
[19:28] <LaserJock> so empathy is on, even when there's no UI
[19:28] <LaserJock> more-or-less
[19:28] <jcastro> ok so even if I don't see my IM window I am still signed in?
[19:28] <LaserJock> so then when I have pidgin open and I get a message, "something related to empathy" knows about it
[19:28] <LaserJock> jcastro: right, that's what's confusing me
[19:36] <jcastro> tedg: Did I miss the part in the UDS session where this was discussed?
[19:36] <jcastro> I can't even answer incoming calls without having to go to the m-i thing
[19:44] <LaserJock> jcastro: what happens if you remove the applet?
[19:44] <LaserJock> that's something I've been curious about
[19:44] <LaserJock> say the m-i and m-i-session applets are removed from the panel, does that affect usability at all?
[19:46] <seb128> dinner time bbl
[19:51] <tedg> LaserJock: Yes, you shouldn't do that ;)
[19:51] <tedg> jcastro: I'd guess that you did.  We worked around this before because Empathy wasn't the default client.  But now it is.
[19:52] <tedg> Anyway, I need to log out to test a stupid, stupid, icon change.
[19:57] <jono> kenvandine, all set
[19:57] <jono> want to call me?
[19:57] <kenvandine> ok
[19:57] <kenvandine> yes
[19:58] <jono> disconnected
[19:58] <jono> ok one sec
[19:59] <jono> gonna log on and call you now, kenvandine
[19:59] <kenvandine> ok
[19:59] <jono> oops
[19:59] <jono> hang on
[20:00] <jono> sending the log
[20:00] <kenvandine> ok
[20:00] <jono> on its way
[20:01] <kenvandine> now let me call you, restart again
[20:01] <jono> all set
[20:01] <jono> disconnected
[20:01] <jono> send the log?
[20:01] <kenvandine> yup
[20:01]  * kenvandine will compare
[20:01] <kenvandine> thx
[20:02] <jono> on its way
[20:02] <jono> cool, let me know when you want to test next
[20:02] <jono> if I am not the phone, I am always available
[20:02] <jono> I *really* want to help make this work :)
[20:02] <jono> speaking of which, gonna run back home now ready for my call with Mark
[20:02] <jono> thanks kenvandine
[20:03] <kenvandine> jono, of interest... UPnP is working now
[20:03] <jono> kenvandine, in the coffee shop?
[20:03] <kenvandine> yeah
[20:03] <jono> or on my network?
[20:03] <jono> ahh
[20:03] <kenvandine> the log you just sent
[20:03] <jono> interesting
[20:03] <kenvandine> so different results
[20:03] <kenvandine> but still a problem
[20:04] <kenvandine> also
[20:04] <kenvandine> i could hear a little audio of you at the coffee shop :)
[20:04] <jono> cool :)
[20:04]  * kenvandine looks more
[20:04] <jono> so it seems it connecting and then dropping, maybe the connection is ok then and Empathy is dropping it
[20:04] <jono> anyway, must run home
[20:04] <jono> back in a few
[20:37] <ccheney> ugh downloading anything from ubuntu.com is slow :-\
[20:37]  * ccheney is trying to get the updated moblin image but it is only going ~ 50kB/s
[21:14] <seb128> re
[21:14] <seb128> lool, why did you close the icon theme task on bug #443311?
[21:20] <lool> seb128: mac_v told me he wanted icons in the apps' packages
[21:20] <lool> seb128: BTW thanks for the telepathy-glib update
[21:20] <seb128> mac_v, ^ no way
[21:20] <seb128> having binary diff in applications is quite some extra work to maintain for no win
[21:21] <lool> seb128: We had a conversation about this recently, today or yesterday; I dont have a strong preference for where to handle them, but would it be up to me I'd do it in humanity because the people actually working on the icons are going to be humanity people
[21:22] <seb128> I'm not going to take any icon as ubuntu diff in software I maintained
[21:22] <seb128> ie if they don't want to do that in the icon themes I'm just closing the tasks
[21:22] <chrisccoulson> it needs a change in g-s-d and the theme doesn't it (to change the icon name)?
[21:22] <seb128> having binary diff is ridiculous
[21:22] <lool> well there's also the patch part of things, but that's something else
[21:23] <lool> seb128: Perhaps mac_v is flexible here; let me grab the logs
[21:24] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm fine having the code change to use the "icon-theme-something" naming
[21:24] <lool> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/287264/
[21:24] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - thinking about it, i don't even think we need to do that
[21:24] <seb128> gtk will fallbach to "icon-theme"
[21:25] <chrisccoulson> i don't think "gsd-xrandr" is used anywhere else
[21:25] <lool> seb128: reading it again, I think mac_v had the code change in mind and I read that as he wanting to have apps carry the icons
[21:25] <lool> 10:25 < mac_v> lool: surely you cant expect us to do icons for all the apps ;) ... i'd say undup them and add the concerned apps in the also affects , once the apps assign new labels for notification area , the icons can be done
[21:25] <seb128> chrisccoulson, there is several of those bugs, in the vino case the same icon is used for the menu entry
[21:26] <lool> seb128: Do you know who takes care of Dust?
[21:26] <seb128> lool, no, I guess the design team too
[21:26] <lool> Ok, that's who I assigned  :-)
[21:26] <lool> seb128: let me reopen humanity-i-t tasks
[21:27] <seb128> lool, thanks
[21:30] <seb128> kenvandine, your gpm overshoot change is buggy
[21:31] <seb128> kenvandine, it triggers only once and ignore next events
[21:38] <jono> kenvandine, all set
[21:39] <kenvandine> jono, ok... one sec
[21:39] <kenvandine> seb128, that was from MacSlow
[21:39] <seb128> MacSlow, $$
[21:39] <seb128> MacSlow, ^
[21:39] <jono> kwwii, btw, any chance you can give gdm rounded corners?
[21:39] <kenvandine> jono, add this to the front of that command line GST_DEBUG=*:3
[21:40] <jono> kenvandine, and audio call you?
[21:40] <kenvandine> yup
[21:41] <MacSlow> seb128, I found out about this too... just today when I played around with brightness
[21:41] <MacSlow> kenvandine, seb128: volume-mute also doesn't trigger the needed notification
[21:41] <MacSlow> kenvandine, seb128: so I've to revisit both patches again :(
[21:41] <kenvandine> ok
[21:45] <kwwii> jono: the theme itself defines rounded corners, but the windows used don't ;(
[21:45] <chrisccoulson> MacSlow - what is volume-mute meant to do? (it seems to be working here)
[21:45] <kwwii> jono: that, like everything else, comes back to the fact that we never got around to working on the gdm code ;(
[21:46] <MacSlow> chrisccoulson, oh... hm... maybe it's a hardware issue then
[21:46] <seb128> works there too
[21:47] <MacSlow> chrisccoulson, it should show the volume-notification throbbing with a dark overlay
[21:47] <chrisccoulson> MacSlow - the mute button shows the volume-notification with a muted symbol. I only get the throbbing if i try to adjust the volume below zero
[21:48] <MacSlow> chrisccoulson, seb128: not working on my ThinkPad X61t here :/
[21:48] <MacSlow> chrisccoulson, ah... sure correct
[21:48] <seb128> I don't get the overshoot effect but I get the notification with the icon
[21:48] <MacSlow> chrisccoulson, seb128: throbbing should _not_ happen on volume-mute of course
[21:48] <MacSlow> my bad
[21:48] <seb128> ok
[21:49] <seb128> so works there
[21:49] <chrisccoulson> MacSlow - i had to rewrite your patch some time ago to work with the pulseaudio volume control, so I hope it still works as intended ;)
[21:49] <pitti> seb128: do you still use autologin?
[21:49] <seb128> pitti, yes
[21:49] <MacSlow> kenvandine, seb128, chrisccoulson: ok... at least I don't need to touch g-s-d again
[21:49] <pitti> seb128: do you get a g-screensaver lock when closing the lid? (bug 428115)
[21:50] <seb128> pitti, I don't use suspend on lid close, do I need to to try that bug?
[21:50] <pitti> (not easy to test for me, autologin doesn't work with ecryptfs, and kvm has no lid I could close)
[21:50] <MacSlow> chrisccoulson, well g-s-d seems to work with notify-osd as intended
[21:50] <pitti> seb128: I suppose; it's not urgent, so please don't interrupt any work
[21:50] <chrisccoulson> MacSlow - that's good then!
[21:50] <seb128> would it work from a guest session?
[21:50] <MacSlow> chrisccoulson, guess some driver-support is missing on my laptop
[21:50] <pitti> seb128: no, guest has no password
[21:50] <chrisccoulson> possibly
[21:50] <MacSlow> chrisccoulson, volume-mute doesn't trigger anything here
[21:51] <chrisccoulson> i thought there was going to be a release of libnotify some time ago that cached server properties
[21:51] <chrisccoulson> it would be nice to have that rather than querying capabilities on every key press
[21:55] <seb128> re
[21:55] <seb128> pitti, works there
[21:55] <seb128> I just tried with my test user
[21:55] <kenvandine> jono, GST_DEBUG=*SCHED*:5,*CAPS*:4,*PAD*:5  EMPATHY_LOGFILE=/tmp/empathy.log EMPATHY_DEBUG=all NICE_DEBUG=all empathy
[21:55] <pitti> seb128: thanks muchly
[21:55] <pitti> seb128: so back to square one, unreproducible :-(
[21:55] <seb128> pitti, you're welcome
[21:55] <seb128> pitti, ask the user to run gpm --verbose?
[21:56] <pitti> ah, good idea
[22:06] <seb128> pitti, the gconf gettext patch seems to not be working :-(
[22:11] <jono> kenvandine, one sec
[22:11] <jono> kenvandine, sorry was on the phone
[22:11] <jono> still there?
[22:12] <mclasen> seb128: we have a working one in F12...
[22:12] <kenvandine> np
[22:12] <kenvandine> jono, yeah... call me please
[22:12] <jono> one sec
[22:12] <jono> connecting...
[22:13] <jono> and...boom!
[22:13] <kenvandine> ok, send that log please
[22:13] <jono> core dumped
[22:13] <kenvandine> :)
[22:13] <jono> one sec
[22:13] <jono> on its way
[22:14] <jono> kwwii, no worries, was just a small cosmetic idea
[22:15] <jono> also, I don't get a startup sound, where should I file the bug?
[22:16] <seb128> mclasen, using the version on https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=568845?
[22:17] <mclasen> seb128: I think that should be our current patches, yes
[22:17] <seb128> mclasen, thanks
[22:17] <jono> kenvandine, log should be with you
[22:17] <kenvandine> jono, libgstfarsight0.10-0
[22:17] <mclasen> the thing thats blocking any further progress there is intltool support
[22:17] <kenvandine> i need that version too please
[22:18] <seb128> dobey, ^ any chance you would look at that gconf intltool thing when you have some free slots?
[22:19] <pitti> good night everyone
[22:19] <seb128> 'night pitti
[22:20] <jono> kenvandine, 0.0.15-1ubuntu
[22:20] <kenvandine> thx
[22:20] <seb128> jono, you want to dpkg -l | grep name to avoid truncating versions
[22:20] <jono> oops
[22:21] <jono> kenvandine, 0.0.15-1ubuntu1
[22:21] <jono> thanks seb128 :-)
[22:21] <seb128> you're welcome ;-)
[22:21] <seb128> brb
[22:29] <jono> kenvandine, I need to go grab some lunch before I pass out
[22:30] <jono> will be back soon if you want to test some more
[22:30] <kenvandine> later
[22:46] <kwwii> http://sinecera.de/gdm-screenshot.png <- gdm with new icons, colors, etc
[22:46] <kwwii> the last change, next to the default wallpaper
[22:47] <kwwii> sorry, I've been sick the last couple of days
[22:47] <kwwii> just woke up and thought I should post this before I get back to work tomorrow
[22:47] <TheMuso> pitti: Do we know when the beep occurred? If anything, it was likely during a shutdown/reboot sequence.
[22:48] <kwwii> pitti: does it not bother you that it says Germany and not German? Seemed kinda funky to me
[23:03] <pietrubens> hiyall
[23:04] <jono> kenvandine, back if you want to test anything else
[23:11] <chrisccoulson> wow, i'm running out of things to do now!
[23:14] <TheMuso> chrisccoulson: A free software developer never runs out of things to do.
[23:14] <chrisccoulson> heh ;)
[23:14] <chrisccoulson> i'm sure i could find something to do
[23:21] <seb128> chrisccoulson, karmic bug list in the topic ;-)
[23:24] <seb128> robert_ancell, hey, starting early today?
[23:25] <robert_ancell> seb128, no, daylight savings kicked in on monday so I just look earlier :)
[23:25] <seb128> oh ok
[23:25] <seb128> robert_ancell, how busy are you?
[23:26] <Amaranth> d'oh
[23:26] <Amaranth> first "papercut" for my stepdad using karmic beta
[23:26] <Amaranth> right after installing he didn't have internet and once he got it software-center apparently had no data
[23:26] <robert_ancell> seb128, reasonably, looking at gdm issues at the moment
[23:26] <Amaranth> had to get him to go into software sources and change a setting so it would offer to reload
[23:27] <seb128> robert_ancell, do you want extra bugs to look at or do you think you have enough for the day?
[23:27] <robert_ancell> seb128, tell me about them - it's better I know of more rather than get lucky and run out of work and have to look for good candidates
[23:27] <seb128> robert_ancell, bug #443133
[23:28] <seb128> robert_ancell, it's 02_xml-gettext-domain.patch in gconf to use gettext to fetch translations
[23:28] <seb128> I tried the fedora version on bugzilla too without luck
[23:28] <seb128> I've tried to strace the server and client and nothing opens gedit.mo in the example
[23:29] <robert_ancell> seb128, ok, will look at
[23:29] <seb128> robert_ancell, thanks
[23:29] <seb128> robert_ancell, testcase is basically: install language-pack-gnome-ja-base, LC_ALL=ja_JP.UTF-8 LANG=ja_JP.UTF-8 gconftool --get /apps/gedit-2/preferences/encodings/auto_detected
[23:30] <seb128> robert_ancell, msgunfmt /usr/share/locale-langpack/ja/LC_MESSAGES/gedit.mo shows it's translated
[23:31] <robert_ancell> weird
[23:31] <seb128> I mean the translated is available
[23:31] <seb128> translation
[23:31] <seb128> msgid "[UTF-8,CURRENT,ISO-8859-15,UTF-16]"
[23:31] <seb128> msgstr ""
[23:31] <seb128> "[UTF-8,CURRENT,CP932,SHIFT_JIS,ISO-2022-JP,EUC-JP-MS,EUC-JP,ISO-8859-15,UTF-"
[23:31] <seb128> "16]"
[23:32] <seb128> and /usr/share/gconf/schemas/gedit.schemas has a gettext_domain
[23:46] <chrisccoulson> hey seb128 - i'll take a look at the karmic bug list in a minute ;)
[23:54] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell, TheMuso hi gentlemen
[23:54] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hey rick
[23:54] <rickspencer3> for some reason my calendar said the Easter Edition started 54 minutes ago
[23:54] <rickspencer3> did the time change?
[23:54] <seb128> tedg, why did you block screen locking when autologin is used?
[23:54] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3, we just went through daylight savings
[23:54] <rickspencer3> aah
[23:55] <tedg> seb128: I'm holding people up from leaving, but it is basically because that group of folks tend to be those who would get locked out of their machine if it locked :)
[23:55] <tedg> seb128: It also removes lock screen from the live CD install.
[23:55] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3, is this time good for you or shall we move it back one hour?
[23:55] <rickspencer3> this is fine
[23:55] <seb128> tedg, hum? I use autologin but I do lock screen on conferences, etc
[23:56] <seb128> tedg, bug #428115 seems to have some confused users too
[23:56] <tedg> seb128: Yes, so it should have a way to be over ridden -- but we didn't have time to do a UI for that after freezes.
[23:56] <tedg> seb128: Planned for Lucid.
[23:56] <seb128> hum
[23:56] <seb128> tedg, I would argue that no locking on suspend is a security issue
[23:57] <seb128> and I'm not sure I understand the rational
[23:57] <tedg> seb128: I would argue that autologin is a security issue :)
[23:57] <tedg> seb128: You can't argue security when it can be worked around by hitting the power button.
[23:57] <seb128> why having autologin on should imply you can't lock screen?
[23:57] <seb128> well let's say I don't understand the logic
[23:58] <seb128> I use autologin because it's handy but I still want to lock the box sometimes
[23:58] <seb128> ie at conf while going up to get a coffee
[23:58] <tedg> seb128: bug 438936
[23:58] <seb128> would it be only to not have people looking to my screen
[23:59] <TheMuso> rickspencer3: hey
[23:59] <rickspencer3> seb128, couldn't you use the screen saver for that?
[23:59] <rickspencer3> until this is fixed correctly in Lucid?
[23:59] <seb128> rickspencer3, that's what screen locking is, screensaver
[23:59] <rickspencer3> but couldn't you invoke the screen saver directly
[23:59] <seb128> I don't get why we need to stop locking in the first place in karmic