/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2009/10/07/#ubuntu-meeting.txt

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* robbiew waves to evand15:58
evandhallo15:58
* james_w waves15:58
mvohey15:58
* robbiew barely gets agenda out15:58
robbiewafter realizing the wiki is fubar'd15:59
robbiew#startmeeting16:00
MootBotMeeting started at 10:00. The chair is robbiew.16:00
MootBotCommands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]16:00
robbiewhttps://pastebin.canonical.com/23051/16:00
robbiewagenda ^16:00
cjwatsonhi16:00
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robbiewlet's get started...16:02
robbiew[TOPIC] Ubuntu 9.10 Deliverables16:02
MootBotNew Topic:  Ubuntu 9.10 Deliverables16:02
robbiewjames_w: so we're done with what we plan to do for Daily Builds and DD, right?16:02
robbiewstill waiting on LP to address "The Bug"?16:03
james_wyeah16:03
james_wI think that might be close to done16:03
james_wat the moment they are working on getting more disks for codehosting16:03
james_wso we have been asked to refrain from pushing up branches for new packages right now16:04
robbiewok...thanks for that info16:04
robbiewslangasek: around?16:04
robbiewliw: do you know if anything progressed with the DEP on Copyright Licensing?16:05
liwrobbiew, I have not seen any progress on DEP516:05
liw(Steve is welcome to kick me if I've missed it)16:06
__keybukDEP?16:06
mvoPEP16:06
mvowith a different spelling I guess16:06
cjwatsonhttp://dep.debian.net/deps/dep0/16:06
liwDEP = Debian Enhancement Proposal; http://dep.debian.net/ and http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5/16:06
MootBotLINK received:  http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep0/16:06
robbiewokay...well I guess we missed this one...again :/16:07
__keybukAh, not DEPendency then16:07
robbiewwe need to make progress on this in Lucid...possibly implementing before the DEP is accepted16:07
__keybukI bet whoever named that thought they were being cute ;)16:07
robbiewas OEM is dying from tracking this stuff by hand in a spreadsheet16:07
liw__keybuk, we didn't think we were being cute, I think :)16:08
mvoliw: is that your doing (the naming)?16:09
liwrobbiew, do you want me to dust off the API design I did long ago, and spend a day on writing up a prototype and a sample cli app for querying stuff? might help dislodge things if there's code available16:09
liwmvo, me and Dato and Zack16:09
robbiewliw: sure16:10
robbiewI'll take whatever I can get :D16:10
mvoliw: heh :) ok16:10
liwrobbiew, then I*ll do that before the end of the month :)16:10
cjwatsonliw: there's also code in lintian these days I think, which may be a useful basis16:10
robbiew[ACTION] liw to dust off the API design he did long ago, and spend a day on writing up a prototype and a sample cli app for querying stuff16:10
MootBotACTION received:  liw to dust off the API design he did long ago, and spend a day on writing up a prototype and a sample cli app for querying stuff16:10
cjwatsonor at any rate code in a bug report against lintian somewhere16:11
liwcjwatson, ok, I'll give that a look16:11
* robbiew got abused by lintian when doing his first package...whipped me into shape good :P16:11
robbiewcjwatson: I'm embarrassingly uninformed on the progress of archive reorg...my own fault16:12
robbiew:/16:12
cjwatsonI think we've finally managed to mostly complete the argument about how delegated upload teams should handle new memberships16:13
robbiewok16:13
cjwatsonI said yesterday that I'd give it a day for further comments; there have been some but I think they can probably be integrated16:13
cjwatsonthat means that by final we will pretty definitely have at least ubuntu-desktop, kubuntu, and mythbuntu reorg'ed16:14
robbiewnice16:14
cjwatsonit's not perfect, but not too bad progress for the cycle16:14
robbiewyep...especially with the other "fun" we've had16:15
robbiewthanks16:15
robbiewthe last one is mine and slangasek's16:15
robbiewRelease coordination with debian...which is progressing....slowly...but progressing16:15
robbiewthinking we can coordinate around a set of core packages...toolchain, kernel, maybe X16:16
* robbiew needs to talk to doko about the python 2.6 "drama" in Debian16:17
robbiewfun :/16:17
robbiewmoving on16:17
robbiew[TOPIC] Boot (yay!)16:17
MootBotNew Topic:  Boot (yay!)16:17
doko__robbiew: didn't see any progress about GCC16:18
robbiewfirst of all, great work _keybuk....I think Karmic is shaping up quite nicely ;)16:18
__keybukQuite nicely16:18
__keybukIn the English sense16:18
robbiewheh16:18
liwcould you translate that?16:18
__keybukI spent the day debugging mount issues, and have new code ready to drop16:18
robbiewdoko_: ack...we should probably talk sometime this week16:19
__keybukNext week I look at I/O issues16:19
__keybukliw: English often mean "bad" when they say "quite good" and "good" when they say "not bad"16:20
__keybukAmericans mean the opposite16:24
robbiewyep16:24
robbiewanyway16:24
evandsilly Brits16:24
robbiewcjwatson: _keybuk: so I'd like to enable usplash at boot by default and find a way to hide the console messages16:24
__keybukSure16:24
cjwatsonwe talked about a timeout at one point, perhaps that's still feasible16:24
liwso... karmic is doing badly? or well? or there is no karmic and I'm hallucinating? or I should stop trying to pretend I know any English? *thoroughly confused now*16:24
robbiewI had the Qa team triage a bunch of bugs to get a listing of kernel messages...that we can possibly silence, if the kernel team can do it16:24
__keybukcjwatson has the ball on usplash16:24
__keybukliw: Awesome on SSD, pain on HDD16:24
cjwatson__keybuk: if you're OK with a timeout in principle, I can beat on that16:24
cjwatsonI just got sidetracked16:24
robbiewcjwatson: well, the only problem with a timeout is that people get confused...some see it, some don't...I've gotten tons of bugs on it16:24
robbiew"it" being where's usplash16:24
robbieweven on relatively fast booting machines16:24
cjwatsonright, but if X shows up within (say) three seconds will they care?16:24
cjwatsonI do see your point, just don't want to regress SSD boot time16:24
__keybukLet's just turn it on for karmic16:24
robbiewhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJ66Lnbztig</TT16:24
MootBotLINK received:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJ66Lnbztig</TT16:24
__keybukAnd work on better for lynx16:24
cjwatson__keybuk: ok, your call, will do16:24
robbiewwhat about the console messages?16:25
cjwatsonstarting usplash will hide nearly all of them, if it works properly16:25
cjwatsonmodulo shutdown16:25
robbiewcjwatson: well16:25
cjwatsonnearly> this is hand-waving to account for tty switches and stuff16:25
__keybuk_Oops16:25
robbiewnot really..there's a bit of a flicker16:25
robbiewI tried both ways16:25
cjwatsonoh, that16:26
__keybuk_Missed that bit16:26
cjwatsonrobbiew: I don't have an answer yet that I entirely like (though I know you suggested console=tty6 as a fallback), but I'll see what's possible; I'm sure it can be arranged somehow that at least we flicker to a black screen16:27
cjwatsonI don't think that at present we can get rid of the flicker entirely16:27
robbiewright16:28
__keybuk_console= is overridden by usplash no?16:28
robbiewI can re-test, but last time I just enabled Usplash...I still saw flashes of console messages16:28
__keybuk_usplash and X end up with messages on their VT anyway I think16:28
robbiewbefore usplash started I think16:29
cjwatsonKeybuk and I talked about various console handling issues, which are currently in my court to fix, e.g. cryptsetup's dodgy use of 'console owner'16:29
robbiewI'll re-test and post another crappy youtube video if I see anything16:29
cjwatsonthose are blocking some more sensible handling in usplash16:29
cjwatson__keybuk: we should probably undo that old workaround in which usplash doesn't switch away from its own vt on normal shutdown16:30
cjwatsonthen it wouldn't matter what was on usplash's vt, as long as we got the ordering right16:30
__keybuk_Yes16:30
cjwatson(and we could VT_RELDISP it too ...)16:31
* robbiew leaves it in the MORE than capable hands of _keybuk and cjwatson16:31
__keybuk_Don't know that one16:31
cjwatsontty8 is still allocated when usplash exits, so X's first vt is 7, and then if you use fast user switching you end up on vt 916:31
cjwatsonand then 10, 11, etc.16:31
cjwatsonit's a bit bizarre16:31
__keybuk_Ahh16:32
__keybuk_Yes, agree16:32
robbiewok..we can probably move on16:33
robbiew[TOPIC] RC Bugs16:33
MootBotNew Topic:  RC Bugs16:33
robbiewanyone got bugs they need help with...or just want to raise?16:33
* mvo got a bunch but will do his best to fix them in time16:33
__keybuk_I have lots of those, but in my usual style I only milestoned them once I knew how to fix them16:33
mvoI could do with some help on update-manager bug triage, liw is already a good help, if he can just continue that would be great16:34
liwcomputer-janitor has a couple of crashes within the Python interpreter that I can't make any progress on16:34
cjwatsonI've been trying to beat on build failures, which are normally sort of implicitly RC16:34
cjwatsonespecially cranking through http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~wgrant/rebuild-ftbfs-test/test-rebuild-20090909-karmic.html, now that wgrant has pointed out to me that once there's a newer version in karmic a row disappears out of the main four tables at the top, so it's possible to mostly avoid duplicating work16:34
liwbug #420307 and bug #435580 specifically (please hit me on the head with the cluebat of obviousness)16:35
ubottuLaunchpad bug 420307 in computer-janitor "computer-janitor-gtk crashed with SIGSEGV in gdk_window_set_geometry_hints()" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/42030716:35
ubottuLaunchpad bug 435580 in computer-janitor "computer-janitor-gtk crashed with SIGSEGV in realloc()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/43558016:35
mvoI also need prioritizing a RT ticket (#35783) so that we get screenshots.ubuntu.com for release16:35
robbiewmvo: ack16:35
cjwatsonthe number left in main is manageable, but universe (I know) is intimidatingly large16:35
mvorobbiew: many thanks16:35
robbiew[ACTION] robbiew to prioritize  RT ticket (#35783)16:35
MootBotACTION received:  robbiew to prioritize  RT ticket (#35783)16:35
cjwatsonif you have experience in some weird language or other, then hacking on anything in that list written in $language would be good - it often involves slightly weird skills16:36
mvorobbiew: the important part is screenshots.u.c (the ticket contains another request as well)16:36
james_wI can have a stab at some ftbfs16:36
evandI'm seeing sporadic reports of webkit vomiting all over GTK, causing ubiquity to crash in the slideshow16:36
robbiewmvo: noted16:36
mvo Igot some crashes in software-center too that look like webkit, but its a small number so far16:37
mvobut the html/JS in software-store is not that complicated :)16:37
evandand very odd issues around the install over top of another linux OS code setting the default uid to 0 (which we've patched over, but I'm trying to find the root cause of)16:37
* robbiew starts to regret asking about RC bugs...prefers the bliss of ignorance :P16:37
mvolol@robbiew16:37
__keybuk_robbiew: It's a good thing, shows that your team is16:38
__keybuk_on top of them16:38
robbiewtrue16:38
james_wwow, you get a shot of Colin's head when you look at any of the build records of any of these failures. That was a little unexpected16:39
cjwatsonftbfs> gwt, jetty6, jinja2 are slightly beyond me16:39
robbiewlol16:39
cjwatsonjames_w: yeah, not perhaps entirely desirable ;-)16:39
doko__cjwatson: looking at jjinja16:40
cjwatsondoko__: thanks16:40
cjwatsonevand: webkit> I forwarded one bug about that upstream16:40
cjwatsonbug 43441316:40
ubottuLaunchpad bug 434413 in pywebkitgtk "Dragging from the installer Webkit widget crashes Ubiquity" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/43441316:40
evandah, awesome.  Thanks16:40
__keybuk_We so need a ddtt tag16:40
mvoevand: I had the same and added some magic to the html to disallow dragging (as a workaorund)16:41
evandmvo: ah, cool.  I'll cherry pick that from you then.16:42
robbiew[TOPIC] Good News16:42
MootBotNew Topic:  Good News16:43
robbiewany of that?16:43
robbiewlol16:43
liwhey, that wasn't on the agenda, now I'm unprepared16:43
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robbiewheh16:44
robbiewwow...nothing...how depressing :P16:44
robbiewcool16:44
__keybukI keep meaning to make a dacia-sandero package for this section just to get a laugh from one other person16:44
liwwait16:44
liwI have one16:44
james_whah16:44
mvoI got RTL languages fully (well, hopefully) working in software-center16:45
liwwe have very little snow in Finland so far, and I have managed to find my bright light lamp16:45
mvoif someone actually uses a rtl language, I would appreciate feedback :)16:45
robbiewmvo: cool16:45
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robbiewliw: lol..okay...I guess that counts :D16:45
liwrobbiew, you were so desperate :)16:45
robbiewindeed16:45
__keybukmvo: I'm sure slangasek speaks reverse polish16:45
robbiew#endmeeting16:45
MootBotMeeting finished at 10:45.16:45
robbiewthanks all16:46
robbiew__keybuk: good one16:46
liwmuchas gracies16:46
mvo__keybuk: haha16:46
evandlol16:46
mvothanks16:46
james_wthanks all16:46
* mvo runs to do some errands16:47
arahello :)18:01
bdmurrayhi18:01
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pedro_hola18:01
aramarjo is traveling to lexington today and he asked me to be the chair of the meeting18:02
araso, here we are18:02
ara#startmeeting18:02
MootBotMeeting started at 12:02. The chair is ara.18:02
MootBotCommands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]18:02
ara[TOPIC] SRU testing -- sbeattie (Steve Beattie)18:02
MootBotNew Topic:  SRU testing -- sbeattie (Steve Beattie)18:02
arasbeattie, can you give us a summary, please?18:02
davmor2hello18:03
sbeattieYep, this week was a bit slow on the SRU front.18:03
sbeattieSRU Activity for the past week (since 2009-09-30):18:03
sbeattie * Jaunty: 3 new packages in -proposed (landscape-client, tzdata, zsync) and 2 pushed to -updates (kadu, tzdata)18:03
sbeattie * Intrepid: 3 new packages in -proposed (landscape-client, tzdata, zsync) and 1 pushed to -updates18:03
sbeattie (tzdata)18:03
sbeattie* Hardy: 4 new packages in -proposed (apt-cacher, debian-installer, tzdata, zsync) and 2 pushed to -updates (linux, tzdata)18:03
sbeattie* Dapper: 1 new package in -proposed (langpack-locales) and also pushed to -updates.18:04
sbeattieThanks to Storm, A. Karl Kornel, and Artur Rona for testing SRUs this week.18:04
sbeattieAs always, assistance in testing SRUs is greatly appreciated.18:04
sbeattieThat's all I have for SRUs.18:04
araOK, thanks sbeattie :)18:05
ara[TOPIC] - Bugday highlights -- pedro_18:05
MootBotNew Topic:  - Bugday highlights -- pedro_18:05
pedro_Not a lot to share this week, we didn't organize a bug day last week (-ETOOMUCHTODO)18:05
pedro_and i was about to run one this week for the confirmed without package bugs18:06
pedro_but.. the ubuntu wiki is kind of br0ken , it doesn't allow you to create a new page18:06
pedro_so i might skip the bug day for this week if that's not fixed soon18:06
davmor2pedro_: you forgot the tm after Br0ken18:06
pedro_*sigh*18:06
pedro_heh18:07
arapedro_, well, there will be time to run bug days when karmic goes out :D18:07
pedro_that's so true ;-)18:07
arapedro_, a "duplicates" one18:07
araok, so, last item on the agenda18:07
ara[TOPIC] Karmic Beta numbers - ara18:08
MootBotNew Topic:  Karmic Beta numbers - ara18:08
araOK, so we had Karmic Beta last week and I am glad to share that we reached 98.9% coverage!!18:08
davmor2ara: 100% honest18:08
pedro_\o/!18:08
araThanks a lot to everybody that helped testing18:09
arado you guys have any concerns from the testing phase for beta? things that can be improved for RC?18:10
arado you also think Karmic is going to be a great Ubuntu release?18:10
fader_I'd say Karmic is going to rock but I don't want to jinx it :D18:10
davmor2I think karmic will be the release that produces the most bug reports18:10
bdmurraythe best evar18:10
sbeattieI had... quirky behavior from a karmic host testing karmic guests, such that I wasn't sure whether issues I saw were problems with the images or issues with virtualbox.18:11
davmor2But I think the features that have gone in will mean that lucid will be friggin' awesome18:11
arasbeattie, I had the same problem18:12
arasbeattie, I tried kvm but it is very slow for me18:12
fader_sbeattie, ara: what sort of issues?  I didn't see anything unusual with kvm18:12
arafader_, UTC hw clock, mainly18:13
sbeattiefader_: kvm on my amd cpu host was significantly slower than virtualbox on the same host for some unknown reason.18:13
arasbeattie, same for me18:13
fader_Interesting... I'll have to install virtualbox and compare behavior18:13
fader_(and speed)18:13
arafader_, it would be nice to have a kvm session during the QA track at UDS ;-)18:14
sbeattieI had issues where I rebooted a karmic guest, got no X, then powered down the guest, booted it back up, and then X in the guest came up fine.18:14
sbeattie(on virtualbox)18:14
davmor2there was a kvm track just not in qa it was very interesting though18:14
arasbeattie, the respawning issue?18:14
fader_ara: I could happily participate as a user but I'm no kvm wizard :)18:14
davmor2ara: beg kirkland18:14
aradavmor2, I was at that one. I was thinking more on a hands on tutorial18:15
sbeattieara: no, this was different, IIRC. Post a jaunty->karmic upgrade.18:15
arafader_, ^18:15
kirklandara: davmor2: sure, guys, i'll be happy to do one18:15
kirklandguys/gals18:15
kirkland:-)18:15
arakirkland, nice :)18:15
fader_\o/18:15
kirklandfwiw, i have one scheduled for OpenWeek18:15
arakirkland, good to know!18:16
davmor2kirkland: You Rock Dude18:16
araok, any other topics?18:17
davmor2We might have a working wubi tomorrow which would be nice :)18:18
aradavmor2, no kidding?18:18
fader_davmor2: Excellent!18:18
davmor2the only thing maybe stopping it at the minute is installer issues that are in the ubiquity install.  So fingers crassed everyone18:19
davmor2crossed even18:19
* cr3 crasses fingers18:19
araok, anything else?18:20
araok, let's wrap up18:21
ara#endmeeting18:21
MootBotMeeting finished at 12:21.18:21
arathanks everyone for attending the meeting18:21
fader_Thanks all18:21
davmor2thanks18:21
pedro_thanks!18:21
sbeattiewoo, thanks!18:21
davmor2sbeattie: that's harsh only thanking woo18:22
araI would post the logs and summary whenever the wiki is fixed...18:22
davmor2I'm assuming that someone has reported it's breakage?18:23
aras/would/will18:23
sbeattieara: thanks for doing that, BTW. That reminds me that I should backfill in the SRU data entries.18:23
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