[00:00] <joaopinto> nikolam, if the package name does not exist, LP does not make any magic about that
[00:01] <nikolam> I think people see launchpad as web application. Shouldn`t button on launchpad about filing a bug, do with starting some ubuntu-bug with GUI at user`s machine etc?
[00:01] <joaopinto> if you don't know what the package is, you need some help, which is not on LP, you can ask here for example
[00:01] <yuriy> nikolam: that would require installing/running extra software on the users machine
[00:02] <nikolam> yuriy, yes. it wopuld
[00:02] <lifeless> joaopinto: end users don't find that easy...
[00:02] <joaopinto> nikolam, how does that improve the bug reporting process ?
[00:02] <joaopinto> lifeless, bug reports are not expected to be easy, they are expected to be usable, both by end users and developers, an easy way to creat bugs with useless info does not help anybody
[00:03] <nikolam> joaopinto, users have feeling that launchpad bug reporting works instead of feeling that launchpad bug reporting have a bug of reporting bugs
[00:03] <lifeless> joaopinto: sure; I didn't say that that would be good. OTOH the forcing of ubuntu-bug experiment has mainly resulted in all the developers getting it turned off for them, because it was so annoying and limiting
[00:03] <nikolam> is is an application, launchpad, on web. and we just have disabled its button
[00:03] <joaopinto> nikolam, that is for users like you, which found a different behavior, and don't care about reading the page :)
[00:04] <joaopinto> nikolam, not really, they have just moved a feature that should not be commonly used, to a non common location
[00:04] <nikolam> joaopinto, that is right :) You have a point there, now multiply that with 95% of users, freshly conwerted from windows
[00:05] <nikolam> Ok, lets talk about location.
[00:05] <nikolam> Why that locatio with explanation is not on launchpad page itself.
[00:05] <joaopinto> nikolam, you mean those which click the File bug button, and change to windows 1 month later before providing any feedback on the bug report ?
[00:05] <joaopinto> nikolam, or those which file bugs because things don't work like in windows ?
[00:06] <nikolam> and that user have "feeling" everything is ok, it is still in the same user interface of launchpad , etc..
[00:06] <yuriy> nikolam: the first sentense of the wiki page states very clearly that it's not broken. if the person can't get that far, their report is not going to be very useful.
[00:06] <nikolam> joaopinto, that is exactly what i am talking about.. :)
[00:06] <yuriy> nikolam: and it wouldn't matter if it was on the same page or not
[00:07] <yuriy> nikolam: and how would one of these users end up on launchpad anyway?
[00:07] <nikolam> yuriy, I think it metters that information we would like them to see is located on launchpad.
[00:08] <joaopinto> nikolam, the wiki is very clear, if a user is not able to understand the wiki, is very unlikely that he will be able to provide usefull info on the bug report, we con't care about users origins, windows, or mac os x, we care about bug reporting quality
[00:08] <joaopinto> nikolam, what is your problem with the http redirect ?
[00:08] <joaopinto> why do you see it as a bug instead of reading the page ?
[00:08] <nikolam> joaopinto, user should not be redirected from launcpad to wiki.. uhh.
[00:08] <joaopinto> nikolam, why not ?
[00:08] <yuriy> nikolam: that is not what launchpad is for. launchpad is a developers' tool. information we would like users to see is on the help.ubuntu.com site
[00:08] <joaopinto> nikolam, uhh is not a good reason :)
[00:09] <nikolam> joaopinto, because user is redirected OFF the site .. OFF
[00:09] <nikolam> and lost in process
[00:09] <nikolam> and confused and hates to be forced to read
[00:09] <nikolam> every time he wants to DO
[00:10] <xteejx> right guys i'm off to bed, night all :)
[00:10] <nikolam> And user likes BUTTONS on application to work, including web application
[00:10] <joaopinto> nikolam, wait, a http redirect makes you lost ?
[00:10] <nikolam> joaopinto, not me, I got a bit of brain
[00:11] <joaopinto> nikolam, it does work, it presents a page describing what you need to file a bug
[00:11] <nikolam> but it made me think function is broken
[00:11] <nikolam> It would be best to move information from wiki to launchpad page
[00:11] <joaopinto> nikolam, so it did for me, before reading the wiki
[00:11] <nikolam> and to display that page
[00:12] <nikolam> and when he read the page, THEN he is presented with ButtonS where to go next
[00:12] <nikolam> All inside launchpad
[00:12] <nikolam> so we don`t lost him in wiki
[00:13] <nikolam> what do you think?
[00:13] <joaopinto> ok, I agree the same text on launchpad itself would have a better context
[00:13] <joaopinto> because there is no visual disruption
[00:13] <nikolam> thanks joaopinto
[00:13] <nikolam> and buttons etc
[00:13] <joaopinto> they probably did it ont he wiki, because the wiki is dynamic, unlike a X page on LP
[00:14] <joaopinto> an
[00:14] <joaopinto> but we are just talking about a page presentation, nothing more :)
[00:14] <joaopinto> ether it's white, or brown
[00:14] <joaopinto> wether
[00:14] <nikolam> an Maybe as the next step, remembering that user already read it and display to him only button to next step next times
[00:15] <yuriy> it's an information page helping you to do something in ubuntu, so it's on help.ubuntu.com. it really has little to do with launchpad actually
[00:15] <nikolam> so it isn`t forced to search through tons of text for one link for next step
[00:15] <joaopinto> nikolam, what next step ? the next step is not web based, it's a command
[00:16] <joaopinto> it's a word, it's name is "ubuntu-bug"
[00:16] <joaopinto> if you need manual bugs, the next step is your browser boomark for it
[00:16] <nikolam> joaopinto, maybe user could click on web page and start that commad?
[00:16] <nikolam> like user can install package when clicking on page
[00:16] <nikolam> and installing is commencing
[00:17] <joaopinto> nikolam, how does that help the bug reporting process ?
[00:18] <nikolam> bug get reported without assumption that user knows how to start a command
[00:18] <nikolam> is there an icon for bug reporting program
[00:18] <joaopinto> nikolam, your focus seems to be the user per si, not the bug report in which the user takes part
[00:19] <nikolam> yes joaopinto
[00:19] <joaopinto> nikolam, for most apps, there is a button "Report Problem"
[00:19] <joaopinto> on the app itself
[00:20] <nikolam> but we don`t have a icon , menu item as a program , for invoking bug reporting on user side
[00:20] <joaopinto> nikolam, right, but bug reporting is aboug managing bugs, end users are just a small part of that process, and you need to look at the big picture, not just at end users
[00:21] <nikolam> as i see it, users that are actually reporting bugs are very small subset of all users
[00:21] <joaopinto> you are concerned to help users reporting bugs, you are not concerned about users reporting bugs with the required info
[00:21] <nikolam> we neet to take care of them
[00:21] <nikolam> maybe we can do both things
[00:21] <joaopinto> nikolam, I don't agree, we have to many bugs reported by users which don't provide sufficient information for a proper triaging
[00:22] <joaopinto> nikolam, the previous process helped users, it didn't help on bug reporting quality
[00:22] <nikolam> idea of informing users what thery are requred to do is excellent. It is just needed to make it work more " nicely" to user
[00:23] <nikolam> "nice" look, "nice" way to force him to read it "nicely" force him to send bug report with all data
[00:23] <joaopinto> nikolam, you do understand that we have more bug reports that we can handle, and we are not talking aboug real/usefull/unique bugs, we are talking aboug bug reports in general ?
[00:24] <nikolam> oh. I understand.
[00:24] <nikolam> Maybe we can do something like this:
[00:24] <nikolam> Do effort to turn more bug reporters in bug solvers
[00:24] <joaopinto> and you still thing that we should let them file bug reports without a minimal set of skills to follow-up the bug ?
[00:25] <nikolam> joaopinto, I think that we shoud do just what you are saying
[00:25] <yuriy> nikolam: there IS an icon -- a menu item. in every program. please actually read the wiki page.
[00:25] <nikolam> to stop them from filing bug reports directly
[00:25] <nikolam> but to make the process more sophisticated with same results.
[00:26] <joaopinto> nikolam, sophistication = click this button to send a bug reprot ?
[00:26] <joaopinto> report
[00:26] <nikolam> yep thats it
[00:26] <nikolam> maybe even force them to answer some questions before reporting a bug etc
[00:27] <joaopinto> we have different definitions for sophistication, bug reporting is not a desktop app, it's a process
[00:27] <nikolam> And that idea of turning more users and reporters to active members
[00:28] <nikolam> i currently see it as an app. maybe i could change my mind..
[00:28] <nikolam> I think that trere is that "step" needed to turn user and reporter in one that actually do something about bugs
[00:29] <nikolam> I don`t see till now any path for a user to do such "step" forward. Maybe informations about requred skills exist somewhere..
[00:29] <joaopinto> nikolam, button's per si may improve usability, they don't improve the know-how, bug reporting & management, is about know-how, not about usability
[00:30] <yuriy> nikolam: a whole separate issue. how does anything you suggested provide this step?
[00:31] <nikolam> yuriy, i don`t see that step right now. Thats what i am suggesing
[00:31] <nikolam> joaopinto, any solutin that stays inside launchpad would be step forward
[00:32] <joaopinto> nikolam, but that's a completely different issue which is much harder to solve than improving bug quality
[00:32] <nikolam> buttons could for start just replace some links for start.
[00:32] <nikolam> joaopinto, that is right, separate issue
[00:33] <nikolam> some sort of pre-determined steps for user to push himself in some channel of contribution we need
[00:34] <nikolam> and organising teams
[00:34] <nikolam> It is much important to every even slightly contributing user is to be a part of some team
[00:35] <joaopinto> nikolam, users which are willing to contribute are already members of such teams
[00:35] <nikolam> first step is asking questions and reporting bug reports and from that to make them parts of groups that can do some tasks
[00:35] <nikolam> I failed to see some team listings etc.
[00:36] <nikolam> ok, that is a theme for thinking, anyway
[00:36] <joaopinto> nikolam, check the channel topic :)
[00:36] <nikolam> :)
[00:37] <nikolam> ok, joaopinto thanks for hearing me :) will come back when bug reporting page is integrated on launchpad :)
[00:37] <nikolam> to suggest some more :)
[00:37] <joaopinto> nikolam, suggestion, take some time to read first, then bring your suggestions and debate, your approach to the bug reporting change was to discuss it before reading :P
[00:37] <joaopinto> nikolam, bug reporting is integrated on launchpad, not as you would like, but it is integrated
[00:38] <nikolam> joaopinto, exactly, because 99% of users are doing just that :) after I read I can lost my perspective..
[00:38] <nikolam> :)
[00:39] <joaopinto> nikolam, ok, so I am sorry to tell that you are not a good candidate for bug reporting, because you are not willing to read a single wiki page to do a diagnostic for something that was changed
[00:39] <nikolam> joaopinto, ok, I am now ready to read. if you understand.
[00:40] <joaopinto> nikolam, I do understand your point, however I understand that you have not read the wiki, so I understand that you are not properly informed yet
[00:41] <joaopinto> and like we say here in my country, you have two eyes and two ears, and one month, which means, read/look more, listen more, and talk less :P
[00:41] <joaopinto> erm, one mouth
[00:42] <nikolam> joaopinto, i think i presented to you some sort of feelings that users might have facing new process of reporting. Hope it will help to us all.
[00:42] <nikolam> haha :)
[00:42] <nikolam> Ok, thats about that :)
[00:42] <joaopinto> nikolam, thanks for the feedback, it was quite positive, despite that lack of agreement ;)
[00:43] <nikolam> joaopinto, Oh we have agreement about not redirecting :)
[00:43] <nikolam> ok.
[00:43] <joaopinto> ok, that one I agree
[00:43] <nikolam> :)
[00:43] <nikolam> Will do for now.. :)
[00:44] <joaopinto> nikolam, file a bug report about it :P
[00:44] <nikolam> great, just after reading some manual.. :P
[00:44] <joaopinto> now i need to get some sleep
[00:44] <joaopinto> cya
[00:45] <nikolam> good night :)
[01:48] <dragon> the manpage for pamdice reads pamslice in its synopsis
[01:49] <dragon> wish i could report a bug, but am too busy for that
[01:49] <dragon> thanks in advance, whoever wants to take care of it
[02:50] <LordMetroid> Anyone else had problems with the ATI proprietary drivers?
[02:51] <swoody> LordMetroid, I think it may be easier asking who *hasn't* had issues :)
[02:51] <swoody> I hear lots of people have had problems with them
[02:51] <LordMetroid> After the restart I got a bad video mode and now I have no idea what to do
[02:52] <LordMetroid> I think I fixed it in the past somehow but I can't remember how
[02:53] <LordMetroid> Also I relied on the fallback option in grub, how I do that now when it instantly boots, is beyond my comprehension.
[02:53] <micahg> LordMetroid: karmic or Jaunty?
[02:53] <LordMetroid> karmic
[02:54] <micahg> #ubuntu+1 should be able to get you going again
[03:07] <LordMetroid> Stupid, the properitary drivers shipped doesn't work with the latest kernel
[03:11] <micahg> LordMetroid: do you have the latest updated?
[03:13] <micahg> 8.660-0ubuntu1 says it fixes issues with the kernel
[03:20] <LordMetroid> hmm, then it shouldn't be that
[03:20] <LordMetroid> I tried deleting the generated xorg.conf but to no avail
[03:20] <LordMetroid> I ended up unintalling the driver
[03:20] <LordMetroid> Wonder what might be the fault
[03:20] <LordMetroid> I think that in Jaunty removing xorg.conf worked
[04:19] <sao3> hi, anybody could help?
[04:20] <sao3> can anybody tell me if https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/netbook-launcher/+bug/437590 can be marked as confirmed?
[04:20] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 437590 in netbook-launcher "Nothing happens when I select Files & Folders » Volumes » xx GB Filesystem" [Medium,Triaged]
[04:31] <CarlFK> this isn't stopping  Oct 12 21:52:11 dhcp227 gdm-binary[6958]: WARNING: GdmDisplay: display lasted 0.088082 seconds
[04:31] <CarlFK> it put over 19,000 in syslog
[04:32] <CarlFK> what package should I but?
[04:32] <CarlFK> bug?
[04:32] <lifeless> gdm
[04:32] <CarlFK> thanks
[04:35] <CarlFK> bug 431166
[04:35] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 431166 in gdm "karmic gdm restarts X infinitely when video driver fails to load" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/431166
[07:51] <jernst> hello, can someone using Evolution please try to reproduce https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=598159 and https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=598160 and comment on the bug so I know if it's Ubuntu specific?
[07:51] <ubot4> Gnome bug 598159 in Mailer "When writing a message, if selection doesn't contain beginning of the line, it's impossible to copy it using right click->copy because selection is lost" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
[07:57] <thekorn> hi jernst, I can confirm the first one in karmic, trying the 2nd one now
[07:58] <thekorn> jernst, do you have bugreports for this open in launchpad?
[08:00] <thekorn> jernst, sorry, cannot confirm the 2nd one, I've no account configured in evolution
[08:01] <jernst> thekorn: not yet, I wanted to be sure it was Ubuntu specific
[08:01] <jernst> I will report it now and let you know the bug numbers if you care to confirm the bug
[08:02] <thekorn> jernst, super
[08:47] <jernst> thekorn: Bug 450141
[08:47] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 450141 in evolution "When writing a message, if selection doesn't contain beginning of the line, it's impossible to copy it using right click->copy because selection is lost" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/450141
[08:47] <jernst> (and Bug 450138)
[08:47] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 450138 in evolution "Tabs are replaced by spaces" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/450138
[09:10] <seb128> jernst, did you file those bugs?
[09:13] <jernst> seb128: yes
[09:13] <seb128> jernst, the bug is with your config and not ubuntu specific
[09:13] <seb128> you probably activated the plain text option or something
[09:13] <jernst> seb128: how so ?
[09:14] <seb128> we have no code change that could lead to those issues and I don't get the issue there either
[09:14] <seb128> I don't know what option you played with, it just doesn't happen on a stock install
[09:14] <jernst> I had the bug reported by two different people I know and one person here that has an unconfigurer evolution could report the first one
[09:14] <seb128> works for me
[09:14] <seb128> and we have no code change
[09:14] <seb128> if there is a bug it's an upstream one
[09:15] <seb128> the fact that you found an upstream bug triager not having the issue doesn't make the issue an ubuntu specific one
[09:15] <seb128> I don't get those issue there
[09:15] <seb128> I could claim it's not an ubuntu one following the same logic ;-)
[09:15] <seb128> what sort of account do you use?
[09:16] <jernst> sure, that's why I wrote "seems" ;-)
[09:16] <seb128> exchange? imap? locla?
[09:16] <jernst> imaps
[09:16] <seb128> ok, same here
[09:16] <jernst> I can try with an unconfigured evolution if you want
[09:16] <seb128> yes please
[09:17] <seb128> jernst, ok, in fact I get the selection bug
[09:17] <seb128> but not the spacing one
[09:18] <jernst> ok good, the selection bug was confirmed in this channel by someone else too. I will try to replicate the other one (but the I have to set up some account)
[09:25] <thekorn> jernst: thanks, just commented on the  bug
[09:26] <jernst> seb128: starting with an empty evolution profile, setting up a gmail account with the account wizard that comes when you open evolution the first time, I sent a message containing tab<tab>tab<tab><newline>space<space>space<space>
[09:27] <jernst> seb128: both lines appear different when writing the mail as expected, but when mail is sent both lines have single spaces between words in "Outbox", Gmail "Sent" folder and in the recipient's box
[09:28] <seb128> ok, I'm not confirming there
[09:28] <seb128> I send a mail
[09:28] <seb128> example<tab>example
[09:28] <seb128> example  example
[09:28] <seb128> right click on the receiving end and save it on disk
[09:28] <seb128> edit with $editor
[09:28] <seb128> and tab and space are as written in my original email
[09:29] <seb128> could be something with your server?
[09:29] <seb128> can you trying sending an email from an another email client?
[09:29] <jernst> I sent the same e-mail from another client on the same server (webmail) and it worked
[09:30] <seb128> ok, so I don't know
[09:30] <jernst> is the tab correctly rendered in your sent folder in Evolution ?
[09:30] <seb128> how is a tab supposed to be rendered?
[09:30] <seb128> tab is an arbitraty number of spaces
[09:30] <seb128> arbitrary
[09:32] <jernst> sure but that arbitrary number should be the same in the mail-compose window and in the mail-reading window. And mails sent from the webmail have tabs rendered as more than one space
[09:33] <jernst> (I did your "save as" test and /\t finds no occurrences in vim)
[09:34] <seb128> it uses 3 spaces for a tab there
[09:34] <seb128> which is a weird value
[09:34] <seb128> but that's constant in the composer, sent folder and receiving one
[09:35] <jernst> then I don't know why you can't reproduce this issue ;-)
[09:36] <jernst> NB: using the same evolution profile in 2.26 doesn't show the problem
[09:36] <seb128> let's see if somebody else get the issue
[09:36] <seb128> hggdh, ^ have you seen any similar bug before?
[09:36] <jernst> seb128: tabs are four spaces in my 2.26
[09:39] <hggdh> seb128: I will try it, but I do not remember anything like that
[09:41] <seb128> hggdh, thanks
[09:43] <hggdh> seb128: cannot reproduce the tab/spaces one
[09:44] <seb128> hggdh, thanks
[09:44] <jernst> hggdh: seb128: thanks for your tests... don't know what to try next though
[09:44] <seb128> jernst, could me you smtp server? do you use the same one
[09:45] <jernst> what locales are you using ?
[09:45] <seb128> jernst, could me you smtp server? do you use the same one when you try an another client
[09:45] <seb128> here fr_FR.UTF-8
[09:45] <jernst> seb128: tried with two different smtp servers and mails are wrong in the outbox already (before being handled by smtp)
[09:45] <hggdh> here en_US.UTF-8
[09:46] <jernst> hggdh: do you have tab = 3 spaces like seb128 or 4 spaces (like me in 2.26) ?
[09:46] <seb128> jernst, do you use 2.26 for all those bugs?
[09:47] <jernst> selection bug is present in 2.26 and 2.28. tab bug only in 2.28 (works fine in 2.26)
[09:47] <seb128> how many tabs do you have in 2.28?
[09:47] <seb128> spaces for a tab rather
[09:48] <jernst> one
[09:48] <hggdh> jernst: 4 spaces
[09:50] <jernst> tried with LC_ALL=fr_FR.UTF8 still one space after sending mail...
[09:51] <jernst> it works in html mail though (but looking at the source, tab = "&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; " in this case)
[09:52] <jernst> I will try with yesterday's daily-live
[09:52] <seb128> the issue started recently?
[09:52] <jernst> I don't see how it could matter, but I'm using 64bit version, what about you ?
[09:53] <jernst> seb128: I noticed it recently because my patches to the linux usb ids database were refused
[09:53] <jernst> (the bot expects patches in the mail body and tabs are used in usb.ids)
[09:53] <thekorn> jernst: I can confirm this bug too (plain text) tabs are converted to spaces
[09:53] <hggdh> jernst: I am also running 64bits
[09:54] <jernst> thekorn: to space_s_ or to spac_e_ ?
[09:55] <thekorn> jernst: that's funny, when I save a mail as draft, one tab is replaced by one space, when I send and recieve a mail, one tab is converted to 4 spaces
[09:58] <jernst> thekorn: when saving as draft I see also the one space but that's because evolution saves drafts as both text and html I think and the html version contains four spaces which, in html, is rendered as a single space (that's another bug I guess)
 one day we will get rid of gtkhtml...
[10:00] <jernst> :-D
 one day we will get rid of evolution ;)
[10:01] <hggdh> LOL
[10:01] <seb128> one day we will get rid of computers
[10:01] <hggdh> well, there is always claws-mail -- which is what I use when my Evo bellies up
[10:01] <thekorn> right, this will save us alot of pain
[10:09] <jernst> text version of drafts are saved with 4 spaces
 lesson to self: do not start gnome-session if you are running xfce :-(
[10:16] <seb128> jernst, tab use is not consistent there, they are displayed as 8 spaces on start of a line, then 3, then 8 if I press tab twice
[10:16] <seb128> but cat -T shows ^I for each tab use in the message
[10:21] <hggdh> I confirm the ^I on the raw message (in the Sent folder)
[10:22] <hggdh> and the email I sent as a test is shown with tab on another MUA
[10:22] <jernst> what a mess ;-)
[10:23] <jernst> I've got to go now, but I will try again from the livecd and let you know. Thanks for your tests by the way !
[10:23] <hggdh> well, it is clear that evo (probably in gtkhtml) paints tabs as spaces
[10:24] <jernst> hggdh: I have no problem with that, but the fact that it "sends" spaces (in my case only one space) instead of \t is an issue
[10:25] <hggdh> jernst: I understand, but I could not confirm; I also have -- at least right now -- no idea *why* this happens for you
[10:25] <hggdh> and not for me, or Seb
[10:27] <jernst> hggdh: yeah I understand, I'll try to reproduce it on a fresh karmic install with the same locale as one of you and let you know if I find out why you cannot reproduce it. Any idea when gtkhtml will be replaced ?
[10:35] <seb128> jernst, not any time soon for editing
[10:35] <seb128> there was some talk about using webkit for rendering though
[10:35] <thekorn> should be easy to see if it is bug in gtkhtml
[10:36] <seb128> gtkhtml has a standalone test editor you can build to try things
[10:39] <thekorn> ok, I can confirm this 'tab' appears as 'space' bug by running this code: http://paste.ubuntu.com/292241/
[10:40] <thekorn> so it is a bug in gtkhtml
[10:41] <seb128> how do you see the difference between a space and a tab?
[10:42] <seb128> thekorn, and gtkhtml2 is not used by evolution, gtkhtml2 != gtkhtml3 (I know it's confusing)
[10:42] <thekorn> hehe, ok
[12:52] <ttx> pedro_: ping
[12:53] <pedro_> hello ttx
[12:53] <ttx> pedro_: I was wondering about the server bug day we have been talking about
[12:53] <ttx> pedro_: istr we planned it for... today ?
[12:54] <pedro_> ttx, yeap just sent an email, didn't had the time to create everything on the weekend i'm on it now
[12:54] <pedro_> ttx, tomorrow so we have time to announce it to the community
[12:54] <pedro_> ttx, sorry about that
[12:54] <ttx> pedro_: ah ok. sure
[12:54] <ttx> We'll announce it on the server team meeting as well
[12:54] <pedro_> ttx, i'm creating bug lists with regression-potential bugs so we can have some help from the community reviewing those
[12:55] <ttx> pedro_: try to send your email before 1500 UTC so that we can pick it up as reference during the meeting
[12:55] <pedro_> ttx, will do
[12:55] <ttx> pedro_: thx !
[12:55] <pedro_> my pleasure ;-)
[14:54] <bddebian> Boo
[14:55] <ubuntu__> Wirek
[14:56] <ubuntu__> Hello
[14:57] <ubuntu__> hello
[15:00] <ubuntu__> jest tu ktoś? Chcę zgłosic błąd, a nikogo nie ma :(
[15:14] <ttx> pedro_: sounds good
[15:15] <pedro_> ttx, awesome, will announce it then, thanks :-)
[15:31] <Gp> hi
[15:32] <Gp> i ma getting Invalid execution envioroment at grub
[15:33] <mrand> Howdy Gp: User support (not related to triage) is in #ubuntu
[15:33] <Gp> pl help me
[16:23] <CarlFK> (09:52:49 AM) bwh: CarlFK: You seem to have found a compiler bug - gdb 7.0 is a major new release so the bug may well be there
[16:23] <CarlFK> should I report that on lp ubuntu?
[16:24] <CarlFK> bt http://dev.personnelware.com/carl/a/dvs.txt         result = DWARF-2 expression error: DW_OP_reg operations must be used either alone or in conjuction with DW_OP_piece.
[16:52] <mrand> CarlFK: If you have done an update and are sure that you have the latest, and if that has not already been reported as a bug (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdb), then yes, please open a ticket.  I assume the ubuntu-bug command should work... give it a try:  "ubuntu-bug gdb"
[16:52] <CarlFK> that's what I was looking for... thanks
[16:52] <mrand> Cool.  Thanks for helping!
[17:43] <Kmos> could someone make Bug 424965 public?
[17:43] <ubot4> Kmos: Bug 424965 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/424965 is private
[17:49] <bdmurray> Kmos: done
[17:51] <xteejx> Evening all
[17:52] <Kmos> bdmurray: thank you
[17:52] <xteejx> Can anyone help with bug 294480 please, I think it may be cdrecord causing a problem, but not sure how to read the log files, can someone take a quick peek for me please? :)
[17:52] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 294480 in linux "A problem in burning cd's in Ubuntu 8.10, brasero and k3b both produce almost the same error." [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/294480
[17:53] <xteejx> I know I need to change description, but was going to do that when I knew where the problem was
[18:29] <mahfouz> sometimes my karmic fails to show my usb
[18:29] <mahfouz> it's just not mounted
[18:29] <mahfouz> is this bug known
[18:33] <mahfouz1> how can I get a trace or something if my flash drive is not mounted?
[18:34] <mrand> Howdy mahfouz, per /topic : User support (not related to triage) is in #ubuntu
[18:35] <mahfouz1> well, I'm not asking for support, I'm reporting a bug
[18:36] <mrand> This channel isn't really about reporting bugs.  It's about pushing existing bugs around (triaging).
[18:36] <bdmurray> mrand: I think getting high quality bugs is a useful thing
[18:36] <bdmurray> mahfouz1: please try 'ubuntu-bug storage'
[18:36] <mahfouz1> aha, ok
[18:37] <mahfouz1> see, i wouldn't even have known what to file it against
[18:37] <bdmurray> ubuntu-bug storage will run through some tests to help determine the right package
[18:37] <mahfouz1> yeah, i'm doing that right now
[18:37] <mahfouz1> thx
[18:38] <mrand> bdmurray: absolutely!
[18:38] <bdmurray> so helping people report bugs is in the scope of this channel
[18:39] <mrand> Understood.  Thanks.
[18:42] <xteejx> definitely! any helpful bug report is a good bug report hehe :)
[18:42] <xteejx> on a triaging note, would someone have a look at bug 294480 please?
[18:42] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 294480 in linux "A problem in burning cd's in Ubuntu 8.10, brasero and k3b both produce almost the same error." [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/294480
[18:43] <xteejx> bdmurray, mrand: ^^ ? sorry if you're busy guys
[18:53] <xteejx> whats that "assignment of mentor" from bug control lists?
[19:00] <pedro_> xteejx, that's the bugsquad mentorship program
[19:01] <pedro_> xteejx, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Specs/SpecialisationWithinBugcontrol
[19:01] <pedro_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/Mentors
[19:24] <xteejx> pedro_: sorry was afk, didnt realise ubuntu had a mentorship program :)
[19:27] <xteejx> is there anyone here?
[19:28] <kklimonda> sure
[19:30] <xteejx> kklimonda, are you triaging at the mo?
[19:30] <xteejx> i just need a hand with a bug
[19:31] <kklimonda> with 294480?
[19:31] <xteejx> yeah
[19:33] <kklimonda> (still reading bug)
[19:34] <xteejx> kklimonda, its a long one lol
[19:43] <kklimonda> xteejx, the question is what's the real problem. Are all files burned fine for sure? If so why is the checksum different - does it mean that some "unimportant" metadata was incorrectly burned? If so why - was it faulty medium or maybe a combination of a low quality medium and burner itself..
[19:44] <mrand> xteejx: Had a few spare moments.... https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=591959
[19:44] <ubot4> Gnome bug 591959 in general "Checksum computation broken on files >4GB" [Normal,Needinfo]
[19:45] <mrand> xteejx: possible dup: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/367037
[19:45] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 367037 in ubuntu "Error while burning - some files may be corrupted on the disc" [Undecided,New]
[19:45] <xteejx> see...i don't understand the log files well, i don't know if it is the medium, burner, or if they were trying to burn >4GB doesn't seem to be that
[19:46] <xteejx> im guessing its a seriously bad batch, as he says rewritables work fine
[19:46] <kklimonda> well, he has mentioned that he got this error when he has burned mp3 files..
[19:47] <xteejx> thats true, could be a naming issue, but wouldn't things like that show in the logs?
[19:47] <mrand> While bad media is certainly possible, there are so many reports I'm suspect of the checksum function.
[19:48] <xteejx> i had failed checksum before on bad media, and they were lightscribe dvd+r's - quite a few it was only the odd 1 or 2 from a spindle of 50 that worked
[19:49] <Michalxo> hello all.. just a quick question.. is being done something with my bug report 1 already month old? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-power-manager/+bug/429249
[19:49] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 429249 in gnome-power-manager "[Karmic] keyboard locked/freezed unable to type anything" [Undecided,New]
[19:51] <xteejx> "Burning failed probably due to overburning the cd."
[19:52] <micahg> Michalxo: havarmic?e you updated to the latest packages in k
[19:54] <Michalxo> yes yes
[19:54] <kklimonda> xteejx, it only shows up in the single log
[19:55] <micahg> Michalxo: I think this is a dupe of another bug
[19:55] <xteejx> hmm
[19:56] <micahg> I had that issue on amd64 with Jaunty
[19:57] <micahg> oh, it seems to be multiple issues
[19:58] <Michalxo> micahg, duplicate of ... can you link me to it?
[20:03] <micahg> Michalxo: idk, there are a lot of bugs in the linux package for similar issues I think
[20:03] <Michalxo> ow..
[20:04] <micahg> Michalxo: I would suggest hoping in #ubuntu-kernel and see if they have a master bug for this
[20:06] <lordmetroid> Dudes, there is no question dialog asking if I should overwrite a file or not...
[20:07] <Michalxo> thank you micahg :-)
[20:07] <lordmetroid> At least when I drag and drop a file from file-roller to a folder
[20:07] <lordmetroid> Where does this bug go?
[20:08] <micahg> lordmetroid: to another folder in file-roller?
[20:08] <lordmetroid> No from file-roller to a folder in my home directory
[20:09] <lordmetroid> A previous file existed and it simple overwrote it without question(at least I think it overwrote it as the date and size changed)
[20:09] <micahg> lordmetroid: where do you see the file?
[20:09] <micahg> or rather folder?
[20:09] <micahg> on the desktop?  Nautilus?
[20:10] <lordmetroid> It is /home/Desktop
[20:10] <lordmetroid> But also /home/Desktop/folder
[20:10] <lordmetroid> Both
[20:10] <lordmetroid> No wait, nautilus
[20:11] <micahg> lordmetroid: ubuntu-bug nautilus
[20:11] <lordmetroid> Okay, after testing the desktop it also does so if I drag and drop files to the desktop
[20:14] <micahg> lordmetroid: which version of Ubuntu?
[20:14] <lordmetroid> Karmic Beta
[20:14] <micahg> ok, yeah, please file in nautilus
[20:23] <dmj727> asac: I have a bug fix for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-pptp/+bug/371402
[20:23] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 371402 in network-manager-pptp "vpn fails to connect when server requires only 128 bit encryption" [Medium,Triaged]
[20:27] <dmj727> I really hope that it can be incorporated into Karmic, since it probably will affect hundreds of user just at the University of Illinois.
[20:48] <dmj727> bdmurray: Is regression potential a just a standard addition, or do you see anything particularly off?
[20:55] <bdmurray> dmj727: I'm not sure I really understand your question.
[22:07] <dmj727> bdmurray: Sorry, I didn't realize what regression potential tag meant.
[22:09] <bdmurray> dmj727: okay its documented at wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Tags
[22:11] <dmj727> yeah, getting bug 371402 fixed for Karmic is important to me, and I thought you were tagging my fix as having a potential for regression.
[22:11] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 371402 in network-manager-pptp "vpn fails to connect when server requires only 128 bit encryption" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/371402
[22:13] <dmj727> Glad to see it's on the list!