[03:13] <cellofellow> how would I check out an svn repository into a subdirectory of my bazaar branch without any ill effects? I want to still pull changes from the svn if needed, and also have the svn be managed by bzr.
[03:22] <wgrant> cellofellow: Why not use a bzr-svn checkout?
[03:22] <wgrant> cellofellow: That way you have a bzr branch that can cooperate with the svn repo.
[03:24] <cellofellow> I just did that, and it seems to work ok.
[05:39] <fullermd> phoenixz: Hey.  Did you figure out what you needed?
[05:40] <phoenixz> Hi, yeah, more or less.. Im still toying a bit with it before I will transer all repos.. I need the different ideas of BZR to settle a bit..
[05:42] <fullermd> Absolutely.  Much fiddling preceeds real work   :)
[05:43] <phoenixz> Its not so diffuicult I suppose, its like... switching querty to dvorak.. :) it sucks!
[05:47] <fullermd> Did the mainline stuff make sense?  That's probably a pretty big mental departure.
[05:49] <phoenixz> It did actually, yes, its just something.. needs to sink in
[05:49] <phoenixz> I have 2-3 years of SVN / SVK stuff to squeeze out of my brains
[05:51] <fullermd> Well, don't squeeze it all out.  Otherwise we can't pressgang you into helping run the SVN User Reeducation Camps.
[05:52] <phoenixz> Heheheh, I doubt it will all sip away
[10:43] <BUGabundo> morning
[10:44] <BUGabundo> $ bzr pull .
[10:44] <BUGabundo> bzr: ERROR: Cannot lock LockDir(http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~exaile-devel/exaile/exaile-0.3.0/.bzr/branch/lock): Transport operation not possible: http does not support mkdir()
[10:44] <BUGabundo> can anyone elaborate on this?
[10:46] <lifeless> you probably have a checkout
[10:47] <lifeless> over http
[10:47] <lifeless> and you can't do mutating operations - push/pull/uncommit/commit to a checkout if you can't write to the master
[10:49] <BUGabundo> thanks lifeless
[10:49] <BUGabundo> so how can update my checkout?
[10:49] <luks> bzr update
[10:49] <luks> (very non-intuitively named command :P)
[10:49]  * BUGabundo tries
[10:53] <BUGabundo> Updated to revision 2567.
[10:53] <BUGabundo> seems to work :)
[10:53] <BUGabundo> thanks lifeless luks
[10:53] <lifeless> BUGabundo: the rule to remember is:
[10:53] <lifeless> if you use it like svn, *use it like svn*
[10:54] <BUGabundo> I don't :)
[10:54] <BUGabundo> bzr is my 1st cvs
[10:54] <lifeless> you do if you use 'checkout'
[10:54] <lifeless> its centralised-style workflow, which is all that svn does
[10:54] <BUGabundo> I mean, I don't use it like svn
[10:54] <lifeless> BUGabundo: I think you mean 'vcs', ''cvs'' is the name of a tool
[10:54] <BUGabundo> which one is better for single offline keeping?
[10:54] <luks> if it's your first vcs, you should read the manual
[10:54] <BUGabundo> bzr branch or checkout ?
[10:55] <BUGabundo> luks been using it for a while, read the man long ago. much has changed since bazaar started :)
[10:56] <luks> but not this
[10:56] <luks> http://doc.bazaar-vcs.org/bzr.2.0/en/user-reference/bzr_man.html#concepts
[10:58] <BUGabundo> which one is better for single offline keeping? bzr branch or checkout ?
[10:59] <BUGabundo> seems to be CO
[10:59] <BUGabundo> since I don't need the history :)
[10:59] <BUGabundo> specially lightweight CO
[10:59] <lifeless> lightweight CO is very slow over the network
[11:00] <BUGabundo> :(
[11:00]  * BUGabundo goes reading more
[11:02] <GaryvdM> Hi Luks
[11:03] <GaryvdM> luks: I generated quite a bit of bug mail. So you may have missed my response to bug 421039
[11:03] <GaryvdM> luks: Is that still a problem for you?
[11:04] <luks> GaryvdM: let me check
[11:06] <luks> GaryvdM: yes, the problem still exists in lp:qbzr
[11:06] <luks> the commit window is always above the diff window
[11:07] <GaryvdM> Luks: ok - I'll get hold of that other laptop, and try debug it.
[11:08] <GaryvdM> As I said, it dose not do it on my computer - And  I have an almost identical setup - so it is very weird.
[11:08] <GaryvdM> luks: What version of qt and pyqt do you have installed?
[11:10] <luks> GaryvdM: PyQt 4.4.3 and Qt 4.4.0
[11:12] <GaryvdM> luks - Ah - I'm running Qt 4.5 - I'll try it with 4.4
[11:20] <GaryvdM> luks: Asking you this cause you did qconflicts - do you think bug bug 174509 is important?
[11:27] <luks> GaryvdM: I wrote qconflicts, but not for myself :)
[11:27] <luks> I don't really have an opinion on the bug
[11:29] <luks> I guess it's not 'important'
[11:29] <luks> maybe just a way to launch qconflicts from qcommit would do it
[12:53] <nyu> lifeless: you're the author of cia_baz.sh ? this script runs on the server, right?  Savannah admins seem a bit confused about it, and I don't know what to answer them
[21:05] <dash> Hmm. I am getting an interesting error
[21:06] <dash> 'bzr info' in my branch says 'bzr: ERROR: No repository present: "<branch url>"'
[21:06] <dash> pretty sure it never was in a repo, I branched it from a standalone branch on another machine
[21:07] <fullermd> Every branch always has a repo, otherwise there's no place to store revisions.
[21:07] <fullermd> Can you access that branch locally, wherever it is?
[21:07] <dash> oh, of course
[21:07] <dash> nope, bzr info says that locally, it's a file:/// url
[21:08] <fullermd> What's in .bzr/ ?
[21:08] <dash> Hmmmm
[21:08] <dash> there is indeed no repository directory
[21:08] <dash> what a curious turn of events!
[21:09] <dash> oh, there's checkout/
[21:09] <dash> anyway all i have is:
[21:09] <fullermd> 'bout the only way you'd ever get bzr to produce that would be if it were in a shared repo, and then moved out somehow.
[21:09] <dash> branch branch-format branch-lock checkout
[21:10] <jelmer> fullermd: fwiw, bzr-git now supports dwim revspecs :-)
[21:11] <fullermd> jelmer: So now all we need is bzr-nongit to do to  ;>
[21:23] <lifeless> nyu: I'm not the author
[21:24] <lifeless> nyu: but I'll do what I can to help
[21:24] <nyu> lifeless: thanks!
[21:25] <nyu> lifeless: the savannah admin said he thinks this script would have to be run in client side
[21:25] <nyu> is this correct?
[21:26] <lifeless> I don't know, I haven't seen it
[21:27] <nyu> uhm...  "Robert Collins contributed a client for Bazaar, using email delivery: cia_baz.sh."
[21:27] <lifeless> wow
[21:27] <nyu> that's you?
[21:27] <lifeless> must have been a long long time ago
[21:27] <lifeless> in a galaxy far far away ;)
[21:28] <nyu> http://cia.vc/doc/clients/ distinguishes between bazaar and bazaar-ng
[21:28] <nyu> I'm using bazaar-ng, right?
[21:28] <lifeless> yes
[21:28] <nyu> this page looks ancient
[21:28] <lifeless> cia_baz.sh is for 'baz' which was a fork of tla
[21:29] <nyu> cia_bzr.py instructions say "Copy this file to ~/.bazaar/plugins
[21:29] <nyu> "
[21:29] <nyu> looks like client side
[21:31] <lifeless> I've just dropped micah an email
[21:31] <lifeless> to update the page
[21:31] <lifeless> jelmer write the cia plugin for bzr
[21:31] <nyu> cia-clients - clients scripts for CIA commit notification on IRC
[21:31] <nyu> heh
[21:31] <nyu> it's even packaged
[21:32] <lifeless> as for client/server - all bzr plugins get installed in the same place; whether they work on servers or not depends on whether they need all history or only the most recent commit
[21:33] <lifeless> I'd expect the CIA plugin to work on a server - but savannah are not running a server at the moment
[21:33] <lifeless> (sftp:// isn't a server,its a file system :))
[21:35] <nyu> lifeless: ssh+bzr:// ?
[21:35] <lifeless> yes
[21:35] <lifeless> or bzr://
[21:35] <nyu> they run that too
[21:35] <lifeless> or http:// with a server configured
[21:35] <lifeless> nyu: then you should use bzr+ssh!
[21:35] <lifeless> its much faster than sftp
[21:35] <nyu> https://savannah.gnu.org/support/index.php?107077
[21:36] <lifeless> ok good
[21:47] <nyu> the script now lives in /usr/share/pyshared/bzrlib/plugins/cia/__init__.py
[21:47] <nyu> as provided by cia-clients package
[21:48] <nyu> do I still have to copy it to ~/.bzr ?  this one looks like a system-wide plugin repository
[21:49] <nyu>     config = branch.get_config()
[21:49] <nyu>     project = config.get_user_option('cia_project')
[21:49] <nyu> uhm
[21:50] <nyu> my modest python skills tell me this is a setting I need to feed into bazaar somehow
[21:52] <lifeless> systemwide is fine
[21:52] <lifeless> and yes you need to get the cia_project option
[21:52] <lifeless> either in .bzr/branch/branch.conf
[21:52] <lifeless> or ~/.bazaar/locations.conf
[21:52] <lifeless> or ~/.bazaar/bazaar.conf
[21:52] <lifeless> bzr help configuration for an overview
[21:54] <nyu> thanks
[22:48] <syncrondi> Hey all - quick question= Does anyone know what the BZR_SSH environment variable should be set to on win ?
[22:48] <nyu> uhm any idea what I'm doing wrong?
[22:48] <nyu> rmh@thorin:/tmp$ bzr co bzr+ssh://robertmh@bzr.savannah.gnu.org/grub/branches/experimental/
[22:48] <nyu> No handlers could be found for logger "bzr"
[22:48] <nyu> bzr: ERROR: Repository KnitPackRepository('file:///tmp/experimental/.bzr/repository/') is not compatible with repository RemoteRepository(bzr+ssh://robertmh@bzr.savannah.gnu.org/grub/.bzr/)
[22:52] <GaryvdM> syncrondi: You probably just need to Pageant from Putty
[22:52] <GaryvdM> nyu: KnitPackRepository is a very old format.
[22:53] <syncrondi> GaryvdM: I've got that .. but I think I accidentally pointed my env var at plink instead
[22:53] <GaryvdM> syncrondi: then just set BZR_SSH=
[22:53] <nyu> GaryvdM: why would bzr want to use it?
[22:53] <nyu> I didn't tell it to
[22:54] <GaryvdM> nyu: what version of bzr do you have?
[22:54] <nyu> should I create a shared-repo locally?
[22:54] <nyu> 1.5
[22:54] <GaryvdM> nyu: That won't help (shared-repo)
[22:55] <GaryvdM> nyu: 1.5 should support packs - so if you run bzr upgrade on the branch it should work.
[22:56] <lifeless> hang on
[22:56] <lifeless> nyu: don't do that
[22:56] <lifeless> GaryvdM: _always_ gather more data before suggesting that
[22:56] <GaryvdM> nyu: bzr 2.0 is release - I would recommend using that.
[22:56] <GaryvdM> lifeless: sorry
[22:57] <lifeless> GaryvdM: you need to check that a) you won't break interop with the users community and b) that you're not going to be accidentically causing a rich-root transition
[22:57] <lifeless> nyu: bzr info -v nosmart+bzr+ssh://robertmh@bzr.savannah.gnu.org/grub/branches/experimental/
[22:57] <lifeless> nyu: that will tell use the actual format in use by grub
[22:58] <GaryvdM> lifeless: I meant that he should upgrade his local branch.
[22:59] <lifeless> GaryvdM: right, but its a shared repo
[22:59] <lifeless> GaryvdM: and if he has other projects in that repo
[22:59] <lifeless> GaryvdM: what will happen to them ? :)
[22:59] <GaryvdM> I c
[22:59] <lifeless> exactly, they will become incompatible with their upstreams
[22:59] <lifeless> its the downside of the waterfall transition that is 2a
[23:00] <nyu> lifeless: it's odd, I created everything myself using this version :-)
[23:00] <lifeless> nyu: did you run 'bzr init-repo' at some point ?
[23:00] <lifeless> nyu: is there anything in your local shared repo?
[23:01] <nyu> http://pastebin.com/d7c182b58
[23:01] <nyu> lifeless: am I supposed to have a local shared repo?
[23:01] <lifeless> nyu: you have one, or you would not have got that error
[23:01] <nyu> I don't think I have any, just a bunch of checkouts and branches
[23:01] <nyu> lifeless: but I'm in /tmp
[23:01] <lifeless> run 'bzr info' please
[23:02] <nyu> in /tmp?
[23:02] <lifeless> whereever your cwd was when you got that error
[23:02] <nyu> $ bzr info
[23:02] <nyu> bzr: ERROR: Not a branch: "/tmp/".
[23:02] <lifeless> ok
[23:02] <lifeless> and /tmp/experimental was an empty dir ?
[23:03] <nyu> I removed it, then tried a checkout and got the error
[23:03] <lifeless> ok
[23:03] <lifeless> what bzr version? this could be a bug..
[23:03] <nyu> 1.5 (from debian lenny)
[23:03] <syncrondi> GaryvdM: I cleared BZR_SSH, but I now I get the error saying that it isn't set. I set it to pageant.exe but it didn't like that either
[23:04] <lifeless> nyu: so, I /really/ recommend you upgrade and use bzr 2a
[23:04] <lifeless> it will be a lot faster, and I suspect that you have indeed found a bug in checkout
[23:05] <nyu> I see
[23:05] <GaryvdM> syncrondi: sorry - I checked the docs - You need set BZR_SSH=paramiko
[23:05] <syncrondi> ah
[23:05] <lifeless> nyu: sorry, the version is 2.0.0, the format name is 2a
[23:06] <GaryvdM> syncrondi: see bzr help env-variables
[23:06] <lifeless> nyu: you don't need to use the 2a format
[23:06] <lifeless> but the 2.0.0 client is more than a year newer
[23:06] <syncrondi> GaryvdM: In my frustration with the command line verison, I installed the full package for win because I've had that running before.. I'll take a look at that doc
[23:07] <nyu> lifeless: will that switch to a new format?  I don't want to block access to 1.x users
[23:07] <lifeless> only if you tell it to
[23:07] <nyu> ok
[23:07] <lifeless> [or run 'bzr init' or 'bzr init-repo' somewhere - those commands create new projects]
[23:08] <syncrondi> GaryvdM: So it appears that I can use plink?
[23:08] <nyu> to create a local shared repo, I should use "bzr init-repo --rich-root-pack" just like i did on the server?
[23:08] <GaryvdM> syncrondi: Ok - I've never used it myself.
[23:09] <lifeless> nyu: yes
[23:09] <syncrondi> GaryvdM: oh, ok. I just saw that it has plink listed in the doc
[23:09] <nyu> ok
[23:13] <nyu> oh, in the shared repo the problem doesn't happen anymore
[23:13] <syncrondi> Well, instead of doing C:\plink.exe I set it to just 'plink' and its progressed a bit ( I think ). Now it says bzr: ERROR: [Error 2] The system cannot find the file specified
[23:13] <syncrondi> Any ideas on that?
[23:14] <syncrondi> I'm using bzr branch bzr+ssh://syncrondi@myhost.com:port/path/
[23:14] <nyu> I have a local tree which is used for the bazaar mirror (pulls from subversion and pushes to bzr).  should I move this into the shared repo as well?
[23:15] <lifeless> nyu: sure
[23:15] <nyu> do I need to re-create it?
[23:15]  * lifeless shrugs
[23:16] <nyu> I can live with that, it's just 30min ;-)
[23:19] <GaryvdM> nyu: you can bzr branch form the old bzr standalone branch into the shared-repo, insted of branching from svn
[23:19] <GaryvdM> nyu - That should be quicker.
[23:19] <GaryvdM> *from
[23:20] <GaryvdM> syncrondi: check My Documents\.bzr.log - That should give you more info.
[23:21] <nyu> GaryvdM: well, in fact it's a checkout rather than a standalone branch
[23:21] <nyu> which now that I think, seems a bit odd
[23:21] <GaryvdM> A heavywight checkout, or a lightweight checkout?
[23:22] <nyu> default is heavy, right?
[23:22] <GaryvdM> yes
[23:22] <nyu> then heavyweight.  sounds better now
[23:22] <GaryvdM> If heavy - it will be the faster from the local bzr branch
[23:22] <GaryvdM> * checkout
[23:23] <nyu> but if I branch that checkout, it's not a checkout anymore, right?
[23:23] <GaryvdM> nyu: I think - a heavyweight checkout == bound branch
[23:23] <GaryvdM> so you can bzr branch
[23:24] <GaryvdM> and then bzr bind svn+....
[23:25] <syncrondi> GaryvdM: Thanks for the tip. I'm looking there now, but nothing appears obvious to me. I see this as the last line before the error:
[23:25] <syncrondi>   File "C:\Python26\lib\subprocess.py", line 830, in _execute_child
[23:25] <syncrondi>     startupinfo)
[23:25] <syncrondi> WindowsError: [Error 2] The system cannot find the file specified
[23:26] <GaryvdM> syncrondi: please put the last section of the file in http://pastebin.org/
[23:26] <nyu> GaryvdM: ah, ok
[23:28] <lifeless> nyu: if you branch the checkout,t he new branch is a branch
[23:28] <lifeless> nyu: it doesn't alter the checkout to branch *from* it
[23:29] <nyu> lifeless: but I want a checkout as result
[23:29] <nyu> it seems that "bzr bind" turned it into one, as GaryvdM said
[23:29] <nyu> but it still remembers the local dir it originated from as "parent branch"
[23:30] <nyu> can I make it forget that?
[23:30] <GaryvdM> nyu: if you do bzr pull svn+... --remember, it will change the parent branch
[23:30] <GaryvdM> nyu: or edit branch.conf
[23:31] <lifeless> nyu: then just make a checkout
[23:31] <lifeless> nyu: I suggest just doing what you wanted
[23:32] <syncrondi> GaryvdM: http://pastie.org/668389.txt?key=cqmpumyv5bm1lglmhidj7w
[23:32] <lifeless> ignore all the hints about speed, they add confusion and complexity
[23:33] <nyu> ok
[23:34] <nyu> so I rm -rf trunk, and check it out again
[23:34] <nyu> when removing stuff from a shared-repo, do I need to tell bzr to remove it, or may I do that by hand?
[23:34] <lifeless> just delete it
[23:34] <lifeless> the backing database will keep the revisions
[23:34] <lifeless> we don't currently have a gc command
[23:35] <GaryvdM> syncrondi: I'm sorry - I don't know how to solve that . Maybe someone else can help you.
[23:35] <nyu> ok here we go
[23:35] <nyu> checkout in 1s!!
[23:35] <syncrondi> Thanks GaryvdM
[23:36] <syncrondi> Would you recommmend perhaps uninstalling everything and reinstalling the standalone?
[23:36] <lifeless> no
[23:36] <lifeless> its trying to run a process
[23:36] <lifeless> run with BZR_PDB=1
[23:37] <lifeless> when the error happens you will be put into a debugger and be able to confirm the program its trying to find
[23:40] <syncrondi> lifeless: Ok, I'm not familiar with how to run with BZR_PDB=1
[23:41] <syncrondi> Did a google, but nothing substantial came up; any hints? :)
[23:41] <lifeless> BZR_PDB=1 bzr ....
[23:41] <lifeless> oh, you're on windows
[23:41] <lifeless> set BZR_PDB=
[23:41] <lifeless> set BZR_PDB=1
[23:41] <lifeless> bzr ...
[23:43] <syncrondi> > c:\python26\lib\subprocess.py(830)_execute_child()
[23:43] <syncrondi> -> startupinfo)
[23:43] <syncrondi> (Pdb)
[23:43] <lifeless> locals()
[23:44] <syncrondi> locals() ?
[23:44] <lifeless> type that in
[23:44] <lifeless> hit enter
[23:44] <lifeless> show the result
[23:46] <syncrondi> http://pastie.org/668398
[23:46] <lifeless> its trying to run plink
[23:46] <lifeless> is plink on your path ?
[23:47] <nyu> if I commit in "trunk" (whose parent branch is in svn), is my commit pushed to svn as well?
[23:48] <nyu> or should I use svn for commits as usual
[23:48] <GaryvdM> nyu: In a hw checkout - it will push to trunk when you commit
[23:49] <GaryvdM> sorry - will push to svn when you commit
[23:49] <nyu> ah, great
[23:49] <GaryvdM> nyu: with just a branch - it will push only when you do bzr push
[23:49] <nyu> and I take it that if I branch trunk foo, then commit in foo, then push in foo, it also goes to svn?
[23:50] <nyu> (trunk is a bzr checkout of svn)
[23:50] <lifeless> push foo trunk
[23:50] <lifeless> yes, that will go to svn as well
[23:50] <lifeless> however!
[23:50] <lifeless> because of svn limitations I would not do that
[23:50] <lifeless> cd trunk
[23:50] <lifeless> bzr merge ../foo
[23:51] <lifeless> bzr commit
[23:51] <lifeless> will behave better
[23:51] <nyu> you wouldn't use bzr to commit to svn, or you wouldn't use branches?
[23:51] <nyu> ah I see
[23:51] <nyu> then I just do it in that tree
[23:55] <syncrondi> lifeless: Wow, I think that fixed it!
[23:55] <syncrondi> I figured C: was in my path but I had to add it