huayrahei AliTabuger720:39
huayraand hei everyone else20:39
huayraAliTabuger7 and I are the "core" of the SpreadUbuntu project team20:39
huayraand now we have revamped the site's homepage once again20:39
huayraand want to make a How-To on the site20:40
AliTabuger7hey huayra20:40
huayracould any of you please have a look at the site and give us ideas?20:40
AliTabuger7who else is here?20:40
huayraI am to blog (Planet Ubuntu++) it tonight and use screenshots and stuff20:40
huayraAliTabuger7: I don't know, but it's ok to just start the session like that20:40
huayraThe site is here: http://spreadubuntu.neomenlo.org/20:41
huayrathanks in advance :)20:41
huayraok AliTabuger720:41
huayraour users need to know that we offer several things:20:41
huayra1. A site to share marketing material20:42
huayra2. Campaigns to promote guerrilla marketing20:42
huayra3. Localized versions of the site20:42
huayra4. Material classified in different categories20:42
huayra5. Localized material20:42
huayra6. Easy access through Launchpad integration20:42
huayraanything else AliTabuger7?20:43
AliTabuger7how to make and modify materials20:44
huayrayeah, I thought that was part of 120:45
huayrabut maybe we should clarify that you can get, make, translate and give/share material20:45
huayraAliTabuger7: showing all those steps should suffice, right?21:02
TakyojiHow many others are actually remotely involved in SpreadUbuntu by the way? :P21:20
TakyojiBecause honestly people, why do you visit this channel (not that I'm implying you not to) if nobody ever speaks up to help others that are actually trying to be proactive and cause a change in the Ubuntu community of resolving the issue with Ubuntu's lack of publicity?21:21
huayraAliTabuger7: that answer can be answered by checking the logs of meetings, uploaded materials (over 1GB) or maybe by checking code commits21:22
TakyojiIdling this channel isn't helping.21:22
huayraTakyoji: it will, eventually21:23
TakyojiPeople could start having discussion, present their work and ask for critique or ideas, or ask about ways to promote it to a person, or whatever.21:23
huayraI believe that it is worth to document our thinking in the open21:23
TakyojiI've been on this channel for months now and I feel like one of the very few that speak up21:23
huayrathis is a project of the marketing team21:23
huayrathis was agreed upon for a long time ago in this channel21:24
huayraI know. You are. I remember talking to you earlier21:24
AliTabuger7Most of the "remote involvement" seems to be people with artistic talents that run a blog21:24
AliTabuger7Although, pretty much everyone has a blog, so I guess that's not too surprising.21:25
huayralots of people are excited about ubuntu marketing but people do not know what to do21:26
huayraI have been following the fedora marketing team for motnhs now21:26
huayraand the gnome team too21:26
huayrathose people know what to do, how to organize21:27
huayraour marketing community is way too loosely defined to be effective21:27
huayraI hope the meeting next week makes it a bit more productive21:27
huayralast time it ended up in a core-team that has not done anything I have seen21:27
huayraeither as though process or action21:27
huayrajust like I predicted a year ago21:28
huayraso now AliTabuger7 and I have been working with this project. Because we put our work where our mouth is21:28
huayraand I am glad we have something real to show... but I wish our team was more organized and productive as a whole21:29
huayraanyway.. I better go do something productive instead of idling here ;)21:29
MadsRHHi. Does anyone know if Canonical has any Ubuntu promotion banners?21:39
MadsRHOr who I should talk to?21:40
FlannelMadsRH: Your LoCo team would be your best first point of contact21:42
MadsRHFlannel -> Thanks, but I'm asking on behalf of the Danish team regarding the 9.10 release party21:45
huayraMadsRH: I know of some banners, but those are for specific things (training)21:48
huayraYou surely know about the countdown banners21:49
TakyojiI suppose you'd have to get such custom printed locally.21:49
FlannelMadsRH: You need the banners themselves? or just the artwork?21:49
TakyojiAnd I don't think anyone has something made as for a big banner21:49
Takyojior at least posted such21:49
TakyojiI can check21:49
TakyojiThere's mostly promotional posters rather than banners to my awareness21:50
Takyojior are you saying like a banner for a website or something?21:50
huayrathere's Takyoji: http://spreadubuntu.neomenlo.org/en/material/poster/highway-freedom21:50
MadsRHOh, I'm talking about huge real life banners ;-) http://www.discountprint.dk/udstillingssystemer_display.26.40.0.html21:52
TakyojiThat's what I was thinking21:52
FlannelMadsRH: I've got artwork for one, its rather spartan, but that's generally what you want anyway.21:53
MadsRHFlannel -> Cool, is there a preivew?21:54
FlannelMadsRH: Yeah, let me find a photo21:56
FlannelMadsRH: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=40045456&id=1512931&l=fec53bc03021:57
MadsRHFlannel -> that _is_ basic, but just perfect :-)21:58
MadsRHFlannel -> .SVG source?21:58
FlannelMadsRH: Let me wrangle up the svg.  I haven't put it up on SU (along with a bunch of other things) because I haven't had a chance to sit down and figure out licensing.21:58
huayraFlannel: maybe we can figure it out now?21:59
huayraI have figured out that we just might as well let people put things up with the license they want21:59
huayraor double license it with what you wnat and CC-BY-SA21:59
Flannelhuayra: yeah, I just don't know what I want21:59
huayraAliTabuger7: any thoughts?21:59
huayraok, just take your time Flannel :) And load up the material when you feel you have landed22:00
Flannelhuayra: I was thinking that "categories" should probably be "tags" instead.  People can tag stuff with whatever, and that'll make it easier for things that don't fit neatly into stuff.22:00
AliTabuger7website bannars?22:00
huayratrue.. and make a tag cloud22:00
huayraAliTabuger7: licenses22:00
Flannelhuayra: I have no idea if the drupal stuff you're using would support that though22:00
huayraFlannel: it would. Drupal and tags are very good friends22:01
Flannelhuayra: but that way I can tag something "flier" "poster" etc etc instead of having to pick one of the four categories (you'll also get more fidelity out of unknown)22:01
huayraam I worn AliTabuger7?22:01
huayraFlannel: true22:01
huayraAliTabuger7: we nee dot put that into a bug. I will fill one right now22:01
huayraFlannel: would you like to havce the double license or the license you want?22:02
AliTabuger7You can put whatever license you want on it, but the only one we have to choose from is CC-BY-SA, or specifying your own, where you could do a double license22:02
huayraFlannel: would you like to have the double license or the license you want only?22:02
huayrayou could always go WTFPL ;) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WTFPL22:03
huayraI am filling those bugs22:04
Flannelhuayra: yeah, that's the side I'm leaning towards.  I really dislike the fact that there's not a CC-SA license22:05
huayraFlannel: Honestly I want to empower users of SpreadUbuntu. CC-BY-SA seems like the most viable choice, but adding the option of double licensing seems reasonable22:07
huayraanything else will be complicated22:08
Flannelhuayra: Yeah, I just don't like the forced attribution.  Especially without a resolution to that attribution question on -contacts a few weeks ago22:08
huayraI remember that thread22:08
huayraIt's truly a difficult issue22:08
huayraThe other day when taking the bus I realized that public Domain really is the only possible solution... but I havenæt had a change to discuss that with anyone22:09
FlannelWell, I don't know why there's no CC-SA license.22:10
huayraAliTabuger7: any thoughts on Public Domain licensing?22:11
Flannelhuayra: Well, allowing a freeform-ish licensing means you don't have to worry about changing the code when it changes.22:12
Flannelbut, there are arguments against public domain... I just don't recall them.  I apparently have a bad licensing memory.22:13
huayraI have one22:13
huayraI don't think you can apply it to material that uses trademarks (i.e. Ubuntu)22:14
huayrathat's why I landed on CC-BY-SA22:14
huayraI would like to discuss that with people that know a fair bit about this22:14
huayraI think I'm going to blog on this now22:14
FlannelYeah, there's something where if you do public domain something, it ends up hurting you down the road in ways you never thought or something.22:15
Takyojisuch as in what regards?22:16
FlannelOh, you *can* license CC-SA without the BY22:16
TakyojiHaven't heard of that22:17
FlannelTakyoji: I don't remember.  If I did, I'd be less confused.22:17
FlannelTakyoji: quoth wikipedia: Of the eleven valid licenses, the five that lack the "by" clause have been phased out because 98% of licensors requested Attribution, though they do remain available for reference on the website.22:17
TakyojiIf someone took your work, and lawsuit trolled you or something, perhaps.22:17
TakyojiOoo, didn't know of that22:17
TakyojiBecause I don't mind if people don't cite me most of the time22:18
FlannelTakyoji: I think it's that in some countries you can't legally release something into the public domain?  have to wait for it to time-out?22:19
TakyojiYou would use Creative Commons Zero license22:20
TakyojiThat license defines what public domain means in countries where "public domain" isn't defined22:20
TakyojiI believe Creative Commons Zero was for resolving that issue22:30
TakyojiThough I'm not it deep aptitude of Creative Commons Zero specifically22:31
FlannelCC-BY-SA requires you to include the license itself (or a URI to the license) to works you perform publically.22:35
FlannelHow does that even work?22:35
Flannel"I'm going to sing a song, but first, let me rattle off this URL for you!"22:36
TakyojiSeen the documentary "Rip! A Remix Manifesto", "Good Copy, Bad Copy", or "Steal This Film" at all?22:37
AliTabuger7I think you cannot do a public domain license for ubuntu materials because the ubuntu logo itself is not public domain22:56
TakyojiYou have to cite the logo and colors as being trademarked, but everything else would be possible to have as public domain23:03
TakyojiActually, Creative Commons Zero implies that trademarks can still apply23:03
Takyojiso that would resolve that issue I believe23:03
TakyojiSection 4: http://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/zero/1.0/legalcode23:05
TakyojiAlthough I could be interpreting it wrong23:05
Takyojiand it would be just the same case as if you used CC-BY-SA or any derivatives of that license.23:06
TakyojiSo basically implying the ownership of the logo on the material, along with that it's not sponsored or endorsed by Canonical, would be appropriate to pretty much have any license.23:07
huayrainteresting discussion... Maybe going CC-SA should solve some of the issue23:13
TakyojiI was just using CC-BY-SA as an example, rather than in specific23:14
Flannelhuayra: apparently CC-SA is a "dead" liencese, due to lack of interest.23:14
TakyojiDoesn't mean it can't be used though.23:15
TakyojiCC0 is supposedly barely used23:15
huayratrue, phased out but still can be used+23:15
FlannelCertainly not.23:15
FlannelAnother option would be to strip out Ubuntu logos from everywhere, and license the item CC0 and then have an easy way to reintegrate the logo!23:16
Flannel(no, I'm not really serious... although...)23:17
Takyojibecause otherwise there's no license you could apply to work that contains the Ubuntu logo23:20
TakyojiTo simply say: is the Ubuntu logo under a Creative Commons license? No. Thus why is it possible to publish work under any other license than the trademark policy? This is what I'm trying to imply23:25
Takyojihence why I refute the thought of "we are unable to make it public domain because the ubuntu logos are not public domain"23:26
FlannelTakyoji: No, I don't believe it's under a CC license23:26
FlannelIts use is approved for community use provided the logo usage guidelines (don't mangle it) are met.23:27
Flanneland it's not commercial23:27
TakyojiSidenote: apparently when you have screenshots of open source applications, the screenshot supposedly have to have the same license as the open source application (as it's considered a 'remix' of it, if I remember reading correctly)23:28

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