=== mac__v is now known as mac_v
thorwilso now we have a first submission in Incoming/Lucid: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Lucid/Kioo09:39
darkmatteryet no attachments. kinda makes it hard to critique09:40
darkmatternm... found it on gnome look... and... err... NO09:42
* mac_v wonders whats "glassy" about that ;p09:46
kwwiithorwil: hrm, I get a 503 error on that link09:46
mac_vkwwii: lol , it just worked a few mins ago... not its down ;)09:47
kwwiiwow, the whole wiki is down it seems09:47
thorwilkwwii: i just had an X crash. now that page doesn't load here09:47
darkmattermac_v: I'm still trying to think of a constructive criticism on that, because if I speak my mind I'll sound like an insensitive ahole :P09:48
thorwilkwwii: wasn't much to see there, anyway :)09:48
thorwildarkmatter: good job ;p09:49
mac_vdarkmatter: is there a way to change specific colors when the theme changes? like the blue color used for links in the "appearances" window?09:49
mac_vthe blue becomes hasrh when the background is dark :/09:50
darkmatterthorwil: you mean finding a screenie on gnome-look? wasn't hard. it's even more a 'sticks out like a sore thumb' entry than the usual content :P09:50
thorwildarkmatter: no, your formulation to mac_v09:51
darkmattermac_v: yeah, using symbolic colors and the appropriate widget. just a sec. I can't remember the name/class for the html links09:52
darkmattermac_v: http://pastebin.ca/1647610 put that after the initial cruft in the gtkrc (padding/color/etc)09:59
darkmattermac_v: I haven't tried yet, but it *should* be possible to do that in symbolic colors10:00
darkmattermac_v: like... say:  GnomeHRef::link_color¬†¬†= shade (.8, @selected_bg_color)   should work the same as it does for text label et al10:04
mac_vi tried this^ .. but didnt work :(10:05
darkmatterhmmm... odd.. maybe theres a change in the latest gtk.. hang on10:06
darkmatterahhh... they added in a menagerie of others. stupid app developers :P10:08
* mac_v curses devs... especially the OOo ones :/10:09
darkmattermac_v: http://pastebin.ca/164761910:11
kwwiisome apps even hard-code the link color ;)10:11
mac_vcrappy OOo guys decided to use the gtk entry text color for the status bar , but use the background color for the base :/10:11
darkmattermac_v: if it doesn't work with that rats nest, try wrapping it in a10:13
darkmatterstyle "yourlinksfsckingsuck"10:13
darkmatterclass "GtkWidget" style "gtkblows" type thing :P10:13
mac_vdarkmatter: .. the pastebin stuff works ... yeah10:13
mac_vdarkmatter: thanks... /me no more eye sore \o/10:14
darkmattermac_v: I think thats most of them, although I may have missed several billion useless widgets :P10:14
darkmatterand your welcome10:14
darkmattermac_v: I'll never understand why we need 70,000 widgets for hyperlinks /facepalm10:16
darkmatterI can understand a three states. normal/prelight/beentheredonethat, possibly even one set for widgets and one for html (like in yelp), but this pick-and-choose--your-widget-or-avoid-standardization-and-hardcode-your-own mentality is.. odd10:23
kwwiidarkmatter: don't forget keyboard selections and such10:26
darkmatterkwwii: opps, yeah. need to ass another thousand widgets :P10:27
darkmatterthat would have been a Freudian gtk comment xD10:27
thorwiljust wanted to ask for a how-to ass widgets10:28
darkmatterhmmm... I wonder if I should hack on na-tray.c tonight or wait until I'm more awake>10:48
=== wersdaluv is now known as wers
kwwiimac_v: seen bug #450398 yet?11:25
ubottuLaunchpad bug 450398 in indicator-applet "The "unread messages" appearance of the tray icon is not noticeable enough in Karmic" [Wishlist,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/45039811:25
mac_vkwwii: the proposed one is the new messages icon > http://launchpadlibrarian.net/32981203/comparing-icons.png11:28
mac_vkwwii: its just users are accustomed to the color changes they find it different11:28
kwwiimac_v: so maybe it would be best to make it green somehow?11:28
mac_v hmmm :/11:29
mac_vkwwii: i'm not sure why it needs to be green... the icon is clearly different from the "no new"...  it is recognizable when it changes so then why color is essential?11:30
mac_vkwwii: btw ,there was a bug filed even when the human theme used color ;p Bug #39226511:32
kwwiimac_v: teh question is whether the difference is enough to draw your eye11:32
ubottuLaunchpad bug 392265 in hundredpapercuts "Indicator-applet icon for "new message" is too visually similar too the default icon" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39226511:32
mac_vkwwii: the whole change to the notification area was to *not* draw attention unless there is something urgent to do , the users get notifications to notify new IM/messages11:34
kwwiimac_v: very good point...but what about emails?11:35
mac_vkwwii: emails are the new snail mail ;p   so there is nothing urgent about them11:36
kwwiimac_v: ok, I guess you're right11:38
mac_vkwwii: :) , i'm commenting on the bug with screenshots11:38
kwwiimac_v: excellent, thanks ;)11:39
kwwiioooh, just saw this: http://atkarus.bestfreewallpaper.net/atkarusdesigns/?p=1&nggpage=10&pageid=111:45
kwwiiand I wonder if we should put this on the wiki somewhere: http://ubuntuforums.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=84808&d=122104317111:48
kwwiithe icon library11:49
kwwiiworks pretty well, maybe someone would work on it to improve it ;)11:49
thorwilkwwii: a mention in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Documentation/Software ?11:51
* mac_v wonders if kwwii was hiding under a rock > https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-art/2009-September/011307.html11:52
mac_vaw.. thorwil too ... :(11:52
thorwilmac_v: no, i actually started to recall that there was something on the list11:53
mac_vyay , \o/ atleast someone reads the mail i send ;p11:53
thorwilshouldn't be floating around in a .zip11:54
thorwilmac_v: yeah, sometimes i forget to check who's sending before i start to read ;p11:54
kwwiimac_v: no, but I just saw it on my desktop and remembered that I wanted to do something about it :p11:55
* mac_v TODO : now has to find a new identity11:55
mac_vkwwii: do you have the link to the forum?11:55
kwwiithorwil: yeah, and perhaps a better place to put it at11:55
thorwilkwwii: how many objects are on your desktop? :)11:56
kwwiithorwil: a *lot*11:56
kwwiiand I have a very large monitor ;)11:56
mac_vkwwii: thorwil: it was a totally accidental find ;)  i helped the author for someother stuff about in ubuntu+1 and then i asked something about the human ethernet icon on the panel ,11:57
mac_vthe one i helped turned out to be the author of the icon-library ;p11:57
kwwiihas anyone played with epidermis before?11:59
thorwilis there any way to eliminate the gaps to the left of v. scrollbars (with murrine)?11:59
mac_vkwwii: you mean the real epidermis? o.0    or some software ?11:59
darkmatterthe epidermis is to ticklish to play with12:00
thorwil^ that's why really serious play requires you to get out of it!!12:00
thorwilit should be possible to transplant the new-wave scrollbars into the human theme, right?12:12
mac_vthorwil: yup12:15
darkmatterhttp://www.flickr.com/photos/jakubsteiner/4052840323/ <--- awesome12:30
thorwilhmm, strange things are happening with this transplant12:57
thorwilany suggestions why i get that stroke at the center of the scrollbar button? http://i34.tinypic.com/b9z4z.jpg13:17
thorwilnm, had to kick GtkScrollbar stuff out of murrine-default13:19
* mac_v wonders how thorwil is using the bright prelight of the newwave scrollbars ;p13:27
thorwilhow do i get rid of the window menu button?13:28
mac_vthorwil: from human?13:28
mac_vthorwil: you want it completely gone? or ...13:28
mac_vthorwil: it can be simpler if you replace this > /usr/share/themes/Human/metacity-1/menu.png and menu_over.png with a blank image13:30
thorwilsure, but i want that silly thing gone. no special area. i always use right-click on title.bar13:31
thorwili just outcommented anything refering to the menu button, but it is still drawn. i suspect something isn't right with switching themes13:38
mac_vthorwil: i dont think it is removable by theme ... have you searched the gconf?13:39
mac_vthorwil: /apps/metacity/general/button_layout13:40
thorwilmac_v: if including or excluding stuff and moving everything around isn't possible, then i have to wonder why this xml file is so damn huge13:41
mac_vthorwil: change it to > :minimize,maximize,close13:41
mac_vthorwil: the ':' is needed if you want it on the right side13:42
thorwiljust read some documentation that says that the menu button must be specified :/13:45
thorwilmac_v: thanks!13:45
mac_vthorwil: hmm? didnt the removal of the "menu" from the gconf not work? it WFM13:46
thorwilmac_v: i want to see how other themes are meant to look whenever i switch back13:47
thorwilmac_v: so i went with the blank image solution you proposed :)13:48
mac_vlol ;p13:48
mac_vkwwii: the theme you were looking for > http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=130412513:57
mac_vthe wiki submission^13:58
thorwilseems like ardchoille doesn't quite understand wiki attachments14:01
kwwiimac_v: very nice...I am sure we can just go with that as-is14:08
* mac_v wonders if kwwii is high on pan meds ;p14:09
SiDiEMERGENCY: does anyone know where i can find cool Free fonts please?14:46
raozuzuhttp://www.dafont.com/ is this useful?14:56
kwwiia font emergency? sounds flaky to me15:04
andreasnSiDi: mizmo blogged about some free fonts http://mairin.wordpress.com/2009/10/28/unpackaged-open-font-of-the-week-bola/15:08
andreasnsee related posts too15:08
SiDiraozuzu: unfortunately 99% of dafont is not Free15:11
SiDiand i visited mairin's blog immediately too, w/out finding something I liked15:11
SiDibut apparently i found something ok, thanks to ochosi15:12
SiDikwwii: i didnt know i'd have to do the release artwork15:12
raozuzuI'm sorry SiDi :P15:12
SiDiit looks like we forgot the countdown banners and just noticed, you see15:12
kwwiiguess you can leave out the countdown banners now15:14
SiDioh, really? :D15:14
thorwilhow about negative countdown banners?15:36
kwwii"you missed the release by 17 days!"15:42
kwwiiI updated the wiki to point to the Lucid pages, if I missed something please let me know15:49
kwwiican anyone confirm bug #422511 ?15:52
ubottuLaunchpad bug 422511 in gtk+2.0 "problem with new scrollbar in Human theme - GtkRange::trough-border set to 2" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/42251115:52
kwwiibut just the lower part of it15:52
kwwiishould probably be another bug15:52
mac_vlol SiDi  , isnt xubuntu releasing today?15:54
SiDimac_v: meant to15:55
SiDifucking 6 months release cycle.. x_x15:55
kwwiiSiDi: is there anything we can do to help?15:55
mac_vSiDi welcome to the big brother program ;p ,15:56
SiDikwwii: if you have a font that would look good, and that is not ubuntu title, i'd love you :d15:56
SiDi(that image is from ochosi)15:56
mac_vSiDi:  the "karmic kola" text? or the "xubuntu"15:57
kwwiiSiDi: http://imjustcreative.com/sorts-mill-goudy-free-open-source-font-for-download/2009/09/05/15:57
SiDimac_v: the xubuntu text15:58
SiDikwwii: hm that may work out good :)15:58
kwwiitroy pointed that one out to me15:59
SiDifinally it isnt so sexy ;D16:05
kwwiiit doesn't fit well with the Karmic Koala so large/light16:07
kwwiimaybe put the xubuntu 9.10 on top of it instead of next to it16:07
kwwiior make Karmic Koala smaller16:08
mac_vSiDi: isnt "karmic koala" just a code name and not supposed to be used when released?16:08
mac_vkwwii: ^16:08
kwwiimac_v: xubuntu and co have a lot more freedom to do what they want ;)16:09
mac_v ;)16:09
mac_vSiDi: 3 different fonts on the same page doesnt seem nice :( ... you could use the same font from the "xubuntu 9.10" , in the "out .... dnload now" but smaller16:11
SiDikwwii: fortunately, cause we also have a lot more stuff to do per person ;P16:13
mac_vknome: the source for the wallpaper pls :)16:14
kwwiiSiDi: trust me, I know the feeling ;)16:14
ochosihi everyone, i'm wondering how to use a vfb-font in gimp?16:14
knomemac_v, it's in xubuntu wiki16:15
* mac_v now wondering where the xubuntu wiki is ;p16:16
* mac_v searches 16:16
mac_vknome:  the png is the main source file? or ...16:19
knomeno actually16:19
mac_vknome: i found the wiki and it has only the png :(16:19
knomeatm i'm in a bus16:20
mac_vknome: sure , no hurry...16:20
kwwiioh boy, here we go...the old "I am in a bus" excuse :P16:20
SiDi[17:23] <knome> my battery dies in a sec16:22
knome |16:23
knomesee you in 30min16:24
* kwwii wanders off to get dinner17:14
bluedragonHi all. I am new to this Ubuntu. But would love to contribute. Can Someone tell me how to post the artwork and where :) Thanks19:02
thorwilbluedragon: first you must learn the virtue of patience, young grasshopper19:32
SiDia grasshopper, where?19:37
thorwilSiDi: hungry?19:41
thorwil4 "themes" by this ardchoille guy now in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Lucid19:45
thorwilhow to curb someone's enthusiasm without looking like a bad guy? ;}19:46
SiDii hadnt seen 4 ugly themes in a row for a while.19:53
SiDi^something like that, thorwil, should work well.19:53
SiDii would be glad to commit myself to that task but i appeared to have unsubscribed from every ubuntu mailing list.19:54
thorwilSiDi: nothing on the list about these submissions19:54
SiDiomg, all the icons are gone19:55
SiDinow you have to read text :/19:56
SiDion the screenshots there19:56
thorwilhilarious: http://blog.uninstall.it/2009/10/29/designing-good-user-interfaces-0/20:00
SiDihow very well argumented this is.20:05
mac_vSiDi: the icons can be reverted ;)20:44
mac_vthorwil: your "fan" danny , mentioned the ppa bisigli more than the community themes :(20:45
SiDimac_v: we kept them in xub ;D20:45
mac_vSiDi: /me still cursing mpt ;p ... even today was trying to change his mind ;)20:46
thorwilmac_v: picrillo(sp?)? what the heck is "ppa bisigli"?20:46
mac_vthorwil: oh > Bisigi Project ;)20:47
mac_vin the eye candy section20:48
thorwilmac_v: ah, i rememeber some of those20:48
mac_vthorwil: he was on the release party channel spreading the word about his blog ;p ...20:49
* mac_v whould have preferred if he had used the community themes screenshots rather than the bisigi themes :)20:49
thorwilmac_v: he likes my scrollbar concept. that's all there is regarding a connection ;)20:50
mac_vthorwil: lol!... was that all! i thought when you said " he is a fan" there was more ;)20:50
mac_vthorwil: could you update the video for the scrollbar? [you mentioned it was improved , ]20:51
thorwilmac_v: it was enough. bringing it up on brainstorm, as feature request, and i think ubuntu-devel-discuss plus at least one other list20:52
thorwilmac_v: first i would have to fix the script20:52
thorwilmac_v: maybe i do that, to at least have a working vertical version and get a few people at UDS to try it. even though it surely isn't lucid stuff :)20:54
mac_vthorwil: yeah , the UDS is a good place , didrocks , mvo and a few others were totally into it , so if you could polish  maybe for gnome 3? ;)20:55
mac_vthorwil: you could use kwwii to arm twist mpt too ;p20:56
thorwilmac_v: should i know didrocks or mvo?20:56
mac_vthorwil: mvo is the main dev of synaptic/software store and does some compiz updates too20:57
thorwilmac_v: ah, that's why you had the idea to have it in the store, first20:58
mac_vyup ;)20:58
SiDiscrollbar stuff?20:58
thorwilSiDi: if you have text and/or images that don't fit within a window, one solution is to show only part of it. then you can offer a so called scrollbar to change what part of the whole is shown21:00
SiDithorwil: you're a genius.21:02
thorwilSiDi: don't you know this one? http://thorwil.wordpress.com/2008/05/09/popup-scrollbar-concept-demo/21:04
SiDi`Laptopi didnt, actually21:05
SiDi`Laptopi wonder if it would still be as fast to go to the very bottom of a page21:06
ckontrosThat's still awesome.21:06
SiDi`LaptopWell, im not sure :P ideally when i click on somewhere outside of the bar i'd like the middle ofthe bar to go there, and the text to be scrolled at that place21:07
SiDi`Laptopfor very fast scrolling. :P21:07
thorwilSiDi`Laptop: middle click. for both gtk scrollbars and my demo21:08
SiDi`Laptopthorwil, you're my hero.21:08
thorwilheh, thanks21:08
* SiDi`Laptop has been using a PC for 13 years now.21:08
thorwilah, so you're at least 13 years old!21:09
SiDi`Laptopno, i'm 4 years old21:12
SiDi`Laptopand i love contradictions21:12
thorwilyeah, i hate them, too21:12
thorwilnow i will log on!21:13
SiDi`LaptopI think I had a bad influence over thorwil.21:15
SiDi`Laptopyeah, i'm so eager to see this happen.21:18
* ckontros wonders if latest GIMP SVN looks like this?21:31
* kwwii is back21:32
kwwiiwe just had our last practice before the halloween gig21:33
kwwiinice touch...we have a make-up artist to do our costumes21:33
kwwiicosts a bit, but it's a nice touch, I think21:33
ckontrosTake pics! :)21:34
ckontrosSiDi: https://launchpad.net/~matthaeus123/+archive/mrw-gimp-svn21:34
kwwiickontros: we are a) making a video, b) making a dat recording and b) have a photographer ;)21:35
ckontrosAwesome. :)21:36
kwwiithe club holds 400+ people, and we are hoping to fill it21:36
ckontroskwwii: Filming the whole set?21:36
kwwiickontros: yeah, a friend has a professional film camera (DV) so we are going to set it up and record the whole thing21:37
kwwiijust for fun...if we really wanted to do anything with we'd need several camera men21:38
kwwiibut in a club you need a good camera/lense and we only have one of those21:38
ckontroskwwii: Still awesome for something to put out there. I have many single-cam bootlegs I love. :)21:38
kwwiithe good thing is that this camera is really high quality, it has been used to make TV shows and such21:39
kwwiiactually, the lense costs almost as much as the camera21:39
ckontrosAlways the way. :)21:39
kwwiiyeah, it should be interesting to see myself hoping around like an idiot after the fact :p21:39
ckontrosShow it to yer kid!!21:40
ckontrosOr he's already a roadie? :P21:40
kwwiihe is not allowed in the clubs we play in21:43
kwwiilegally in germany, before 16 you cannot stay out that late21:43
kwwiihe just turned 1221:43
kwwiilast friday, actually21:44
kwwiiunfortunately, we aren't the kind of band that plays in the afternoon21:44
ckontrosShow him the vid then. :)21:45
kwwiiwow, I just installed the whole (old) studio theme with epidermis21:46
kwwiinifty stuff21:46
kwwiia theme setting app which does kinda "mega-themes" if you will21:48
kwwiigoogle for it21:48
kwwiiit is on launchpad21:48
* ckontros does as he's told21:48
kwwiigood boy21:48
ckontroskwwii: Try that PPA I posted to play with GIMP 2.7.121:49
* kwwii ready back21:49
kwwiickontros: cool beans, will do21:50
ckontroskwwii: I got the page up for epidermis. Will tinker with later. Now the fam needs me.21:52
kwwiibe carefull, though..it can easily change everything in your system21:53
kwwiiart-wise, I maen21:53
ckontrosSure. I'm still rockin' your butterfly wall. :)21:53
kwwiihehe, one of the neatest things about that pic, is that it is as-taken...no edits or such21:55
ckontrosWorks real nice with dashua's Hanzo.21:55
kwwiihrm, I installed the gimp stuff but I don't see a difference21:57
ckontroskwwii: Yeah. Nothing dramatic yet. I might build from source if there's new code for the new UI.21:58
ckontrosIn any event, it's latest GIMP. :)21:59
ckontrosHmm... gimp.org looks down.21:59
ckontrosOk. Family time.22:01
ckontroskwwii: In GIMP, "Windows->Single-window mode"22:02
kwwiicool, I'll try that22:03
kwwiisee you22:03
ckontrosNot like the screenshots from my other post but, different.22:03
zniavreit's quite nice this single mode22:04
zniavre"thumbail" are easy to use22:04
MadsRHjoin #ubuntu-bugs22:06
MadsRHoops :-)22:06
kwwiiMadsRH: no!22:06
ckontrosHmm... Doesn't remember tool windows. (layers and such)22:09
ckontrosYeah. That's a PITA.22:10
ckontrosYep. Even with a fresh ~/.gimp-* folder.22:12
kwwiihrm, on jaunty I am still not getting the improvements22:21
kwwiialthough the ppa is installed22:21

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