rickspencer3hi bryce__00:10
rickspencer3who else on the desktop team is up atm?00:11
bryce__ccheney maybe, although its evening for him now00:13
bryce__kenvandine too I think00:13
bryce__rickspencer3, whats up?00:13
rickspencer3just wondering what folks are up to00:14
rickspencer3iso testing?00:14
bryce__being flamed by xorg upstream because canonical doesn't have a 10 person X team00:14
bryce__heh, on the xorg-devel mailing list00:14
bryce__they're discussing about new plans for scheduling releases00:15
rickspencer3 /ignore00:15
rickspencer3bryce__, oh cool00:15
rickspencer3I should  subscribe00:15
bryce__there's an argument between keith and daniels about whether to do 3-month or 6-month release cycles, and daniels asked distros for input00:15
TheMusoA lot of key areas in Ubuntu only have 1 canonical person working on them.00:15
bryce__I posted an answer; the only reply to that has been some random upstream guy I've not heard of before saying that distros (by which I think he means Ubuntu) are getting a free lunch00:17
ccheneybryce__: hi saw my name00:24
ccheneyrickspencer3: on the iso.qa site?00:24
rickspencer3ccheney, you can join #ubuntu-release and see if anyone asks for help there00:26
rickspencer3also, you can triage bugs that have been logged regarding the testing, see if there are any serious issues, etc...00:26
rickspencer3and also iso.qa testing00:26
ccheneyrickspencer3: ok00:26
robert_ancellbryce__, could you have a quick look at the stack trace in bug 429322 - I think an X IO error is causing the problems.  If so, what is a good debugging technique to confirm that?00:27
ubottuLaunchpad bug 429322 in seahorse-plugins "seahorse-agent assert failure: ERROR:iop-profiles.c:606:IOP_generate_profiles: assertion failed: (obj && (obj->profile_list == NULL) && obj->orb)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/42932200:27
rickspencer3hi robert_ancell good morning00:28
robert_ancellrickspencer3, hey00:28
rickspencer3robert_ancell, welcome to your first ubuntu release!00:28
* robert_ancell wishes gconf was using something other than orbit already to make debugging easier...00:28
robert_ancellrickspencer3, yay!00:28
bryce__robert_ancell, looking00:29
rickspencer3robert_ancell, you may want to join #ubuntu-release in case anyone asks for help00:29
robert_ancellrickspencer3, ok00:29
bryce__robert_ancell, ok posted00:33
chrisccoulsonxtrace rocks:)00:34
robert_ancellbryce__, thanks00:35
rickspencer3kenvandine, can you help robbiew get his desktopcouch working? he's got the  upgrade need to delete that file thing00:45
rickspencer3kenvandine, just pointing to the documentation would be fine00:45
Amaranth#ubuntu-release-party is going nuts already01:05
ajmitchAmaranth: just randomly start banning people01:07
Amaranthajmitch: We got in trouble for that :/01:07
kenvandinerickspencer3, sure01:09
robbiewthanx kenvandine01:09
kenvandinekillall beam.smp desktopcouch-service01:09
kenvandinemv ~/.config/desktop-couch/desktop-couchdb.ini{,-old}01:09
kenvandinerm ~/cache/desktop-couch/desktop-couchdb.pid01:10
kenvandinethen do something that should start it again01:10
kenvandinelike start evolution or something01:10
Amaranththanks to rickspencer3 the release date is now the 30th :P01:10
rickspencer3dang it!01:11
kenvandinerobbiew, let me know if you have questions01:13
kenvandinei need to step away for a few01:13
kenvandine but will be back01:13
rickspencer3robert_ancell, bryce__ the U1 guys may need you to test a little something for them shortly01:52
robert_ancellrickspencer3, ok01:52
rickspencer3I told him to come ask you if needed anything01:53
kenvandinetedg, btw i did track down that critical i was looking for, thx for your tips01:55
kenvandinetedg, it just took a LOT of patience :/01:55
tedgkenvandine: Heh, I'm glad that you found it.  What was it?01:56
kenvandineindicator_manager was initialized before the event_manager was01:57
tedgAh, startup sucks :)01:57
kenvandineonly happened on startup :)01:57
kenvandineyeah... so painful to find :/01:58
tedgBTW, why is Gwibber not in the alt+tab list?01:58
kenvandineah... look at the preferences01:58
kenvandinethat isn't "hide taskbar entry"01:59
kenvandineit is in my alt-tab01:59
* kenvandine thinks it is time for tedg to do some python debugging... after all my time C debugging this week :)02:00
tedgHmm, playing with that fixed it... but not the first time I tried.02:02
tedgAnytime you write Python all you do is debug.  That is, until you have 100% code coverage, and then you can't change anything.02:03
jcastrokenvandine: just got another empathy crash02:21
JanC<CompactDstrxion> hmm running wubi from this iso. at the top it says 'You are about to install Ubuntu-9.10ubuntu1"03:59
JanC(from #ubuntu-release-party)03:59
mac__vmpt: could the libgnome change to not show icons be properly mentioned in the release notes? humanity is getting bugs about the panel menu... we've already got 3-4 bugs filed regarding that :(04:46
lifelessall dupes?04:49
mac__vlifeless: yeah , i'v duped them... but still thought it would be better to mention it in the release notes ;)04:53
=== bjf is now known as bjf-afk
=== mac__v is now known as mac_v
jcastrorobert_ancell: still awake and around?05:29
robert_ancelljcastro, yup05:29
jcastrorobert_ancell: if you could help test the fix for bug 462828 that would really help out05:30
ubottuLaunchpad bug 462828 in ubuntuone-client "Files are marked for deletion on server when syncdaemon is killed during sync" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/46282805:30
kenvandinehey guys05:30
robert_ancelljcastro, looking05:30
jcastrohi ken05:30
jcastrois the PPA with the updated packages05:31
robert_ancelljcastro, ok, anything in particular to test?05:36
jcastrorobert_ancell: going through the steps in the first comment in the bug would help05:36
robert_ancellhmm, I don't have a ubuntu one menu item...05:38
jcastrorobert_ancell: right now all the shipped clients are going to tell the user that there is a version mismatch05:38
jcastroso the idea is when they get this working and tested it'll be an immediate SRU05:38
kenvandinejcastro, mine is syncing05:39
kenvandinedownloading a bunch of stuff from you :)05:39
jcastroah, finally!05:39
kenvandinenow it's uploading some test data05:40
robert_ancelljcastro, I'm not getting any syncing occurring05:52
robert_ancellwell the tooltip says "updating files..." but clicking on it shows a greyed menu with "your files are up to date"05:54
robert_ancellone.ubuntu.com doesn't show any files05:54
jcastrook, let me see what's up05:54
kenvandinerobert_ancell, tail -f ~/.cache/ubuntuone/log/syncdaemon.log05:59
robert_ancell2009-10-29 16:59:27,622 - ubuntuone.SyncDaemon.Main - NOTE - ---- MARK (state: READING_WAITING_WITH_NETWORK_WITH_BOTHQ; queues: metadata: 12; content: 11; hash: 0, fsm-cache: hit=1287 miss=68) ----06:00
robert_ancellnot doing anything at the moment06:00
robert_ancelljcastro, I have to go - anything you want me to look at with U1?06:24
jcastrorobert_ancell: no I think ken and I can manage for a bit06:24
robert_ancelljcastro, np06:24
pittiGood morning07:03
al-maisanGood morning pitti07:03
kenvandinemorning pitti07:06
pittihey kenvandine; still awake?07:08
pittihey al-maisan, how are you?07:08
kenvandinehelping the u1 guys07:09
kenvandinewith this ugly bug, hear about it yet?07:09
pitti"this" bug..07:09
* pitti saw too many in the last days07:09
kenvandineu1 client bug07:12
al-maisanpitti: not too bad, thanks. How are things on your side?07:13
pittial-maisan: bit tired, but pretty good; looking forward to getting karmic out of the door :)07:13
al-maisanpitti: :)07:14
didrockshey pitti, kenvandine, al-maisan :)07:26
al-maisanhello didrocks :)07:26
kenvandinehey didrocks07:30
kenvandinepitti, bug 462828 FYI07:30
ubottuLaunchpad bug 462828 in ubuntuone-client "Files are marked for deletion on server when syncdaemon is killed during sync" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/46282807:30
kenvandinethat is what we are working on right now07:30
kenvandineso expect an SRU :)07:30
kenvandinepitti, also... not sure if this is SRU worthy but look at bug 45156807:31
ubottuLaunchpad bug 451568 in empathy "Empathy don't close with click on notification area icon" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/45156807:31
kenvandinei proposed a patch that restores the toggling behavior with the empathy status icon, if you are not using the indicator07:31
pittikenvandine: ^ I thought that was deliberate?07:31
pitti(not that many people like it, but still..)07:31
kenvandineit is... sort of07:31
kenvandineit is deliberate for the indicator07:32
kenvandineand we share the same code as the status icon07:32
kenvandineso this just makes it toggle if you set the preference to not use the indicator07:32
kenvandinesimple change07:32
kenvandineideally we want to separate the behavior, so the icon can behave differently than the indicator07:32
kenvandinebut that was out of scope for karmic07:33
kenvandinewould make seb128 happy though, to be able to use both at the same time :)07:33
kenvandinethis should make people that aren't interested in the indicator happy07:33
pittikenvandine: at this point of the release I'm fine with it if you think it's important and it has a trivial patch07:34
kenvandineit is really trivial07:34
kenvandinechanges a 1 line patch into a 2 line patch :)07:35
kenvandinethat branch also has the latest EmpathyChat leak fixes and i fixed a glib critical07:35
kenvandinedebug logs are clean now :)07:35
pittihey didrocks, bonjour07:39
* pitti waves to baptistemm07:39
baptistemmsalut pitti07:39
kenvandinepitti, ok... debdiff for bug 46282807:40
ubottuLaunchpad bug 462828 in ubuntuone-client "Files are marked for deletion on server when syncdaemon is killed during sync" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/46282807:40
pittiback in 2007:40
baptistemmI'm pleased to now working in a company where I can run linux and specially ubuntu as my OS07:40
kenvandinepitti, ok i tested the debdiff, lintian complains about an old line in the changelog but other looks good07:54
kenvandinepitti, can you handle getting it uploaded?07:54
kenvandinewhenever that can be done07:54
* kenvandine assigned the bug to pitti :)07:55
kenvandinei need to get some sleep, the kids are going to wake me up in 2 hours :(07:55
pittikenvandine: yep, will do; sleep well!07:56
pittikenvandine: (answer later, low urgency): I think we should just include above empathy patch in the first upload; so I'll reject the current one from teh queue, you commit the new one to bzr, and I reupload?08:03
pittiI have a doctor appointment now, back in 2 hours08:13
seb128hello there08:28
mvohey seb12808:30
seb128hey mvo08:30
seb128how are you?08:30
mvobut the ppa machines just told me my test package will only get build in 13h08:31
mvothat makes me a bit unhappy08:31
Hobbseemvo: that can be fixed, if required08:31
mvoHobbsee: heh :) kdebindings is the one, that would be pretty sweet.08:32
* Hobbsee looks08:33
mvoHobbsee: its for a good course, verifiying the fix for bug #45947108:34
ubottuLaunchpad bug 459471 in kdebindings "[Karmic] update-manager-kde: conffile prompt/error during upgrade cause crash" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/45947108:34
seb128mvo, looking to kde issues now, you traitor!08:34
mvoseb128: the kdm login is non-black ;)08:35
Hobbseemvo: that's fine.  I'm just having extreme trouble navigating launchpad.  i'll get there08:35
seb128mvo, oh, and trolling now, wait for uds!08:35
Hobbseeoh, here we go08:35
seb128mvo, you can tweak gconf key to have better gdm too ;-)08:36
mvoseb128: :P08:36
mvoseb128: if only there was a application to set the background in gdm08:36
seb128start the day with a troll [checked]08:36
* mvo gets himself into serious trouble08:36
* seb128 goes to the next daily task, email reading08:36
didrockshehe, so easy :)08:37
seb128mvo, I don't know what you are talking about08:37
* mvo was kicked from #ubuntu-desktop (seb128)08:37
didrocks(good morning seb128 and mvo o/)08:37
seb128mvo, sudo -u gdm gnome-appearance-capplet? ;-)08:37
Hobbseemvo: there we go, they should build in a couple of minutes08:37
seb128lut didrocks08:37
mvomany thanks Hobbsee08:37
Hobbseemvo: you're welcome08:37
* mvo sends some virtual flowers08:37
mvohey didrocks08:38
seb128(hate hate spammers)08:38
didrocks984 people connected on forum.ubuntu-fr.org \o/08:39
* didrocks thinks we will have a new record today ;)08:39
seb128didrocks, what is the current record?08:44
didrocksapprox 1250 :)08:44
asacall going well ;)?08:45
didrockshey asac08:45
asachi didrocks08:45
seb128hey asac08:45
seb128yes, things same to be on track08:45
seb128seems rather08:46
asacmoin moin seb12808:46
seb128is lucid open yet or what? ;-)08:46
asacboring day ;) ... lets check #ubuntu-release-party ;)08:46
didrocksseb128: I know you are eager to upload 2.29.1 to lucid ;)08:53
seb128didrocks, no08:53
seb128I'm eager to start on reducing delta with debian ;-)08:54
seb128we will probably not start on 2.29 before uds08:54
didrocksyeah, merging time :-)08:54
TheMusoNot to mention infrastructure changes for accessibility, i.e at-spi over dbus. I want to get that in and working at least as much as possible, as early as possible.08:58
TheMusoSo I'll be interested in the 2.29 goings on.08:58
=== al-maisan_ is now known as al-maisan
mac_vseb128: hi... <offtopic question> how do you get the cloak for gimpnet? [gnome-hackers]09:01
seb128dunno what a cloak is09:01
baptistemmseb128, with a cloack nobody can see you ip09:02
seb128baptistemm, still doesn't tell me what a cloack is09:02
seb128I just use xchat-gnome to connect to IRC09:03
ikoniaseb128: join #freenode and ask09:03
baptistemmit is a service provided by IRC servers09:03
mac_vseb128: seems you dont use a cloak ;) > your are an ubuntu member , right so you can use the cloak > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcTeam/Cloaks09:03
seb128ikonia, I don't care about it but thanks09:03
ikoniaseb128: if you don't care - don't ask09:03
seb128ikonia, it's mac_v having questions09:03
seb128ikonia, I'm busy enough with other things and I've no interest in that09:04
mac_vikonia: actually i asked , but freenode staff didnt know either :(09:04
ikoniaseb128: ok09:04
ikoniamac_v: freenode staff do know what and how to get a cloak09:04
seb128mac_v, I don't know and I don't care ;-)09:04
mac_vikonia: dont how to get a cloak for gimpnet09:04
ikoniathat's nothing to do with this channel or this network - ask on gumpnet09:04
mac_vikonia: i cant find the support channel for gimpnet :(...09:05
ikoniaagain - not this channel or this network's issue, check their website09:05
mac_vikonia: yup , i know that ;) ... i was checking if seb128 had any info since he frequents gnome-hackers :)09:06
ikoniarespect to anyone who's contributing to gnome09:06
seb128I do but I don't feel any need to use a cloack so I never asked09:07
mac_vseb128: you know ? how do i get it? :)09:07
seb128mac_v, I do frequent #gnome-hackers I meant09:07
seb128mac_v, I guess you can try #sysadmin on their IRC09:08
mac_vseb128: oh... ok..thanks anyway09:08
huatsmorning everyone09:08
seb128lut huats09:09
huatssalut seb12809:10
baptistemmmac_v, gimpnet don't have any service like cloak or Nickserv09:12
baptistemmbut if you can convince the sysadmin to setup them, nice :)09:12
mac_vbaptistemm: oh... thats what i thought  :)   but recently i noticed that the few members where using a sort of cloak and thats got me thinking :D  , must be something from the IP services or something else then :)09:14
mac_vbaptistemm: also i couldnt find a support channel for gimpnet :(   the admins are hiding somewhere ;p09:15
seb128mac_v, they are on #sysadmin as just said before09:16
chrisccoulsonhello everyone09:17
seb128hey chrisccoulson09:17
mac_vseb128: darn it! i was trying sys-admin :/09:17
seb128how are you on this karmic day? ;-)09:17
mac_vseb128:  thanks :)09:17
chrisccoulsonhey seb128. i'm not too bad thanks. how are you?09:18
seb128I'm good thanks09:18
mvoNg: I remember you had issues with compiz and the "run terminal" keybinding in the past. is this fully working now in karmic?09:34
asacseb128: you have anything in queue for gtk+ SRU?09:36
asaci am going to prepare removing the debugging output for bug 40182309:37
ubottuLaunchpad bug 401823 in gtk+2.0 "(firefox:24993): Gdk-WARNING **: XID collision, trouble ahead - overeager XID caching" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/40182309:37
asaci got a user that said that .xsession-errors grow to 3GB in a few minutes09:37
asacthats worse than what i thought09:37
Ngmvo: wow good memory. I haven't used it for some time, but a quick test suggests it doesn't work at all. I can't really spare any time today for anything deeper though09:37
asacseb128: ok so if you have anything i shoudl review and take for this gtk upload let me know ;)09:37
seb128asac, I will find something, would be a shame to update gtk only to drop a warning09:38
mvoNg: sure, many thanks. I prepare a fix - I can image your are super-busy :)09:38
asacseb128: ok. ;)09:38
asaci will wait a bit then09:38
seb128asac, ok, there is nothing else that I can see we really need now so go for your change09:44
seb128I'm curious to know how that user trigger so many warnings though09:44
asacseb128: seems to just happen for some cases09:47
asacespecially when using flash in firefox09:47
asacnot easy to reproduce such a flush09:47
asacof error msgs09:48
rickspencer3tooo quiet09:50
rickspencer3seb128, pitti, asac good morning09:51
mptmac_v, I thought it already was in the release notes09:54
mpt(wiki.ubuntu.com is temporarily unavailable? ... first time I've ever seen that)09:55
davmor2mpt: they'll be preping for release09:56
asachi rick10:09
asachmm rick<tab>10:09
seb128same here10:09
seb128asac, will you have a look to the gnome-bluetooth updates to see if that's worth sru-ing?10:10
seb128we tend to sru some GNOME bug fixes updates usually10:10
seb128ie just sponsored totem's one from robert_ancell10:10
seb128be back in a bit I need to go you to get some food for lunch10:12
mptmac_v, <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KarmicKoala/HumanReleaseNotesv2#Simpler%20menus%20and%20buttons>10:13
mac_vmpt: ah ha... ;) the gnome-menu is not mentioned ... so users think that the humanity theme is incomplete and lacks those icons hence the icon is not displayed :(10:26
* mac_v hopes that might convince mpt to consider the icons back for all gnome-menu ;p10:27
mptmac_v, why should we special-case gnome-menu?10:31
mac_vmpt: the only reason is the all or none rule... either we remove all icon from that menu or keep icons for all... since if *some* are missing it looks like a bug , just like the context menus which only had icons for some items ...10:32
mptmac_v, all or none is not a rule10:32
mac_vnot a rule per-se but just looks odd!10:33
mptmac_v, and even if it was, none of the items in the System menu have icons10:33
mac_vmpt: what about the places menu?10:33
mac_vmpt: the system menu is part of the gnome-menu , so it seems broken10:34
mac_vmpt: its like removing the icons from only the  help menu while having icons in the file, edit, view10:35
mptmac_v, what about the Places menu?10:35
mptmac_v, I'm sorry, I don't know exactly what you mean by "the gnome-menu"10:36
mac_vgnome-menu== main menu10:36
mptmac_v, the one that's not used by default?10:36
mptThe one that starts with "Accessories" and ends with "System"?10:36
mac_vmpt: i was meaning the one used by default , yeah the accessories, places, system menu10:37
mptmac_v, Firefox similarly has icons in its History and Bookmarks menus but not in its other menus. Equal use of icons *across* menus is not a goal.10:37
mac_vmpt: the firefox issue is due the recent change ;) ... the bug was filed that the bookmarks were objects10:39
chrisccoulsonbut the menu items with icons in Firefox are grouped together aren't they, and not just scattered about like the Places menu?10:39
mac_vmpt: the places menu doesnt have icons for the "connect to server"  , "search files" and "recent documents"... only the 3 dont have icons10:39
chrisccoulsonthe current places menu is absolutely hideous10:39
mptmac_v, yes, I was giving Firefox as an example of doing it right.10:42
mac_vmpt: IMO, its not right... just consider a user moving from one menu to the next , when the menu behaves as a single unit [user can click on file and move down the rest without having to click again , or click accessories and change view to system]  , the menu must be treated as the same , now one drop down shows icon while the next doesnt , this is odd .. not a good design... :/10:44
asacseb128: yes. i have to rebase the patches we have to see what is left and if we need the SRU10:44
seb128asac, ok10:44
asacseb128: i am on vac starting tomorrow ... so will try to do that tonight10:44
seb128asac, no hurry that can wait10:44
asacbut last i looked the fixes didnt seem too differetn/important10:44
asacwe are pretty good set i think10:45
seb128asac, how much vac do you take?10:45
asacone week10:45
asacbasically 6 days ;)10:45
seb128ok, enjoy the well deserved break there!10:45
asacwork days10:45
asacyeah ... i certainly will - need a battery recharge ;)10:45
chrisccoulsondoes anyone know what happens if you can g_source_remove when there are events pending for that particular source? do the events still get dispatched after removing the source, or are they removed from the main loop?10:45
seb128I still have some 11 days to take but I take friday and will do a real end of year break10:45
asacchrisccoulson: they get cacnelled10:46
asacwell ... i am not sure what happens if you remove from a different thread10:46
asacbut if you remove them in the main thread, they wont get run anymore for sure10:46
chrisccoulsonasac - thanks. do you know if that behaviour has changed since hardy?10:46
mptmac_v, you're using "the menu" to mean "three separate menus". That's misleading.10:46
asacchrisccoulson: shouldnt have changed ... unless it was/is buggy in some way10:46
chrisccoulsonasac, thanks! my issue must be related to something else:(10:47
mac_vmpt: that is because the whole row behaves as a single unit ... either the menu must open only when that menu item is clicked[clicking the file opens only file and clicking history should open only history] or all need to behave/display similarly , whether having icons or not.10:47
mptmac_v, whether a menu item should have an icon depends on the item, not on what menu it's in. If a menu interleaves items that do and don't have icons, that's a sign that either (a) the wrong items have icons or (b) the menu should be rearranged.10:47
asacchrisccoulson: whats the problem?10:48
chrisccoulsonasac - i'm working on a pidgin SRU for hardy, to make it work with Yahoo again. i'm getting a crasher with the changes though, which seemed to be caused by an event being dispatched, after the source was removed from the main loop and some data free'd10:49
chrisccoulsoni can't tell you much more yet though, as i'm at work ;)10:49
chrisccoulsonand the patch is on my desktop at home :(10:49
mptmac_v, Nautilus's "File" > "Open With" submenu uses icons for most of its items. Do you think that means all the items in the "File" menu should have icons too?10:50
mac_vmpt: need to behave separately as in>  the notification area applets do not show the drop down menu of the applet beside them , so they behave independently10:50
asacchrisccoulson: usualyl those crashes happen when the callback target is finalized, but the source not properly removed10:51
asachow sure are you that the source is properly removed?10:51
chrisccoulsonasac - i'm not 100% sure yet. i ran out of time debugging it last night10:51
mac_vmpt: what you mention here is sane >  http://mail.gnome.org/archives/usability/2006-February/msg00000.html   "I think icons should either be used for every item in a section (between the end of a menu and a separator, or between two menu separators), or for none of them, because anything else looks messy."10:51
chrisccoulsonbut i'll carry on with it again later10:51
mptmac_v, yes, but there by "menu" I meant "menu", not "three separate menus".10:52
mac_vmpt: they dont behave separate :( .. they act just like a submenu system of the menubar10:53
mptmac_v, then that brings us back to my question about Nautilus's File menu.10:53
mac_vmpt: the file menu needs to arranged properly , where the icon options and the icon-less options10:54
mac_vare separated by the separator10:54
mptSo maybe "Connect to Server..." and the separator above it should swap places.10:55
mptSeparator below it, rather.10:55
mptOr maybe "Network" and the separator above it should swap places.10:56
mac_vmpt: might be saner , by still i dont see why the recent documents is not an object ;)10:56
mptmac_v, it would be if it was an actual folder you can open. (IIRC it was a real folder containing shortcuts in classic Mac OS, for example.)10:56
mac_vmpt: IMO , the logic that only objects can use the icons is flawed :( ... icons need to be used for items which can be recognized ... for , "search for files" a magnifying glass is a good representative  and can be a quick indication of what the item does11:00
mac_vmpt:  while we use icon for accessories and so on ...which are very ambiguous , what does a ruler and scissors , really convey ?  :/  not sure why the search doesnt need an icon11:04
mac_vprogramming = spade :/ , , does it mean anything if the user hasnt seen the icon along with the text !11:06
mptmac_v, "Search for Files..." is a borderline case. It is a standalone application, but people may not recognize (and probably should not need to know) that it is.11:06
mac_vmpt: what does it being a standalone application really have to do with it having an icon? i meant it can be recognized easier , not that since it was a standalone app...   but anyways... the objects only have icons is not a good solution  :)  ambiguous objects end up having icons rather than the meaningful icons... which will end up making the icon removal even bad :(   the criterion needs to be rather are these useful indicators [i know its a11:11
mac_v bit ambiguous]11:11
mac_vbut anyways... ;)11:12
mptmac_v, the trouble there is that developers would have no idea when to stop, and we'd be right back where we were.11:12
seb128ie having a nice looking desktop? ;-)11:13
mpthaw haw11:13
seb128users seems really unhappy with the current system menu lack if icons11:13
mptUsers are always unhappy.11:13
mptThat's their job.11:14
mac_vnot really ;p11:14
fredpmvo: hi!  packagekit-gnome is proposed for gnome, and we (release team) meet on sunday to discuss new modules, seb128 told me you were the one who'd know best the ubuntu/.deb situation.11:14
seb128not true11:14
seb128there is lot of cases where some users complain or people don't like change11:14
seb128but the system menu change is perceived as a bug by a lot of users11:14
seb128including technical people who know about the icon change11:14
andreasnit seems like the happy people are always silent11:14
seb128andreasn, not really true either, on lot of bugs you have people from both side arguing11:15
asacwhat icon change is that?11:15
seb128I've not seen any user argue in favor of this one11:15
seb128asac, don't display icons in menus by default11:15
seb128and on buttons11:15
mac_vasac: the system menu lacking icons while the places and accessories have icon11:15
asacoh ... yeah11:16
asacfirefox still has icons ;)11:16
seb128that's like the 2 slot logic from notify-osd11:16
seb128dunno what is the design rational but users just don't get it11:16
asacfor 2 slot? ... i agree. i would rather like to see the normal notifications slide down getting replaced by the synchronous ones11:16
asacwith a cool animation ;)11:16
seb128I've to admit it just weird looking and not obvious why it's done this way and looks buggy11:16
asaci think the "normal" notifiations - which are more frequent - at least should get the top spot11:17
asace.g. flip it11:17
seb128especially if you don't use synchronous bubbles11:17
asacor do the sliding/anmination i described11:17
seb128ie desktop configs where people don't change volume with the keyboard11:17
asacthats what i say11:17
asacsynch are less frequent for sure11:17
asacand should get the lower space if we cannot animate and want fixed position11:18
seb128seems there is a real popular ppa undoing that change11:18
seb128shame that it leads to have lot of users using a non official version11:18
mac_vandreasn: mpt: i would agree that some icons are nonsensical , but having the icons for objects alone is bad .. ;)  would a new user even know what the firefox icon is? but wouldnt the same user recognize the arrow icons? the better thing to do is arrange the menu properly11:19
* mac_v hiles11:19
seb128I still hate the system menu not having icons too11:19
seb128much easier to spot the reboot action from an icon than parsing labels11:19
* mac_v rather hides11:19
seb128system menu -> session menu11:20
andreasnmpt: do you know any good articles/books on personality of applications? (if you get what I mean)11:20
seb128or whatever the corner menu is called11:20
mac_v +1 to seb12811:20
mptandreasn, not really. About Face has a discussion of "software posture"; is that what you mean?11:21
seb128I think that part of the issue is that designers don't get the user feedback or they always think people will be complaining and don't reconsider their changes11:21
andreasnmpt: maybe, I was thinking in what kind of tone a app speaks etc. Just curious about the subject11:22
andreasnmpt: I'll check out about face again11:22
mptandreasn, e.g. http://bradt.ca/archives/firefox-error-message-well-this-is-embarrassing/11:24
andreasnmpt: yes! exactly, stuff like that!11:25
mac_vasac: yeah whats with that ^ ?11:25
mptandreasn, the Windows and Apple interface guidelines both have sections on software tone. IIRC the Windows ones make a point of Vista onwards being a bit friendlier than earlier versions.11:26
andreasnah, I'll check that out.11:28
mvofredp: hello - right now packagekit-gnome does not support debconf questions. this is why we do not ship it by default and use a altnertive mechanism (aptdaemon). however this is now changing, so chances are good that for the next release debconf will be supported11:36
mvofredp: but without it, thats a showstoppper for us, it means that some (debian policy) confirm debs simply can not get installed11:37
fredpmvo: seb128 told me aptdaemon may be providing the same dbus interface, is it correct?11:38
mvofredp: aha, I see that you have found the right peope in packagekit already :)11:38
fredpmvo: hughsie told me dantti was working on this, right :)11:39
mvofredp: its not the same, the aptdaemon one uses a different approach (a simpler one). I have not looked in detail yet into the way PK wants to do it, I was too busy (and it only happend very recently)11:39
seb128mvo, there was no plan to have common dbus methods there to ie install something?11:41
mvoseb128: I certainly hope so11:42
seb128what desktop applications want to do usually is to install a deb11:42
seb128I was suggesting that GNOME should maybe agree on standard dbus apis and let distro decide on the backend11:42
mvothe good news is that it has become a technical problem now, in the past it was a policy decision (or precived as one) to not have questions during package install11:42
mvooh, that is what you mean11:42
seb128GNOME applications should only need the client side11:42
mvowell, that would make sense11:42
fredpit would sure be easy to approve pacakgekit-gnome, if we know it will work on ubuntu, talking to aptdaemon11:43
seb128what is packagekit-gnome doing exactly?11:44
fredpanyway with both this option and the current work on packagekit, things are looking good.11:44
seb128what GNOME needs imho is a set of apis apps can use to install something11:44
seb128not a package management tool or a backend11:44
seb128those are distro issues rather11:45
fredpseb128: I should check what's proposed exactly; mostly I believe it's proposed so that apps can request new pacakges11:45
fredp(for example file-roller can now request for the installation of unzip/etc.)11:45
seb128I think it would make sense to accept the client side11:45
seb128ie common client api to do installs11:45
seb128then distro will sort what replies to those calls11:45
seb128I would not accept a package management tool in GNOME though11:46
seb128especially if it's working correctly on rpm only11:46
fredpI'll talk with hughsie to know exactly what is proposed11:47
fredpiirc there are many things in packagekit-gnome, replacements for update-notifier, 'add/remove applications', etc.11:47
fredpand those things are already handled fine in ubuntu11:48
seb128fredp, right and those should not really go to GNOME since they are distribution specific tools11:58
asac... consider to join #ubuntu-release-party so we reach 1000 ;) ... we are at 99212:00
=== MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch
pittiasac: Madness!!12:08
pittiasac: I see 95712:08
kenvandinepitti, sure12:30
pittikenvandine: that was a really short night..12:31
kenvandineyeah... i have 3 kids :)12:31
kenvandinethey are up at 6am no matter what time i go to bed12:31
kenvandineso 2 hours will have to do :)12:31
seb128asac, 1000 was easy you need an another challenge now12:40
=== MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow
kenvandinehey rickspencer312:57
rickspencer3hi kenvandine12:57
rickspencer3what's the word on the street?12:57
kenvandinethe u1 bug is fixed12:57
* rickspencer3 is sitting across from silbs, atm :)12:58
kenvandineverified it myself :)12:58
rickspencer3thanks kenvandine12:58
kenvandinei also reproduced another bug they found in the process, and verified the fix12:58
rickspencer3kenvandine, good job this release12:58
kenvandinefixing this also uncovered 2 other bugs12:59
kenvandinenot nearly as severe12:59
kenvandineu1 is happily syncing my life now :)12:59
kenvandine2 physical computers and a VM all in sync :-p12:59
kenvandinepitti, pushed lp:~ubuntu-desktop/empathy/ubuntu13:02
* \sh hugs pitti and all others from canonical/ubuntu team 30 desktops already on ubuntu karmic, now I have to deal with 70 jaunty servers still...but this is again a nightshift :)13:04
kenvandine\sh, cool!13:04
kenvandinerickspencer3, i am very impressed with how great the ubuntuone team handled that bug13:04
kenvandinevery quickly identified it and got it under control13:05
\shoh and btw...ubuntu jaunty on hp blade servers == charming much better then windows 2003/2008 + hpiloagent rebooting the thing every 2 days13:05
kenvandineand they had the client fixed and tested in under 12 hours from initial report13:06
rickspencer3kenvandine, we <3 U1 team :)13:06
kenvandinethey rock!13:07
didrocksseb128: 1200 person on http://forum.ubuntu-fr.org/ :)13:07
didrockshey rickspencer313:07
didrockshi kenvandine ;)13:07
rickspencer3hi didrocks13:07
rickspencer3didrocks, congrats on a great release13:08
james_w'lut didrocks13:08
seb128didrocks, waouh ;-)13:08
seb128hey rickspencer313:08
james_wwe <3 didrocks too :-)13:08
didrocksrickspencer3: congrats too ;)13:08
* didrocks hugs james_w 13:08
rickspencer3you really rocked karmic13:08
\shis it possible to have telepathy do syncs to xmpp+u1 users, as replacement for xmpp bytestream proxy? or is this just a crazy idea?13:08
seb128rickspencer3, congrats on karmic and leading desktop troups to success ;-)13:08
rickspencer3seb128, :)13:08
* rickspencer3 wipes tear from eye13:08
* seb128 hugs rickspencer313:09
seb128rickspencer3, how is London? do you have parties every night? ;-)13:09
rickspencer3seb128, hardly13:10
rickspencer3working very hard, but almost done13:10
seb128today at least ?13:10
pitti\sh: yay13:10
pittihey rickspencer313:10
rickspencer3party is starting in kitchen, but I'm in a meeting with sabdfl ;)13:10
seb128oh ok, good luck then ;-)13:10
rickspencer3hi pitti ... thanks for your efforts last night/this morning13:10
pittimy pleasure13:10
\shpitti, would be a nice feature  when you are behind a proxy which doesn't let bytestream proxy through ;)13:10
pittikenvandine: empathy> thanks, will re-upload13:10
kenvandinepitti, thx13:11
\shpitti, and it could be a nice idea for viral marketing of u1 ;)13:11
rickspencer3bryce__, sabdfl extends kudos to you Amaranth rest of desktop team for Karmic X13:12
pittikenvandine: BTW, fixing changelog (merging into the previous one which just got rejected); and fixing version number (-0ubuntu1, not -1ubuntu1)13:16
seb128pitti, reject my empathy upload?13:16
kenvandineseb128, i updated that leak patch and added a fix for toggling from the status icon13:16
pittiseb128: yes, we want to do bug 451568 in the same upload, and kenvandine added some more fixes13:16
ubottuLaunchpad bug 451568 in empathy "Empathy don't close with click on notification area icon" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/45156813:16
seb128pitti, ah ok13:16
kenvandinethe togling only works though if you uncheck use indicators13:17
pittiseb128: faster that way13:17
seb128kenvandine, pitti: thanks13:17
kenvandineseb128, still can't use both :)13:17
seb128I usually do a new revision and dch -v the previous one13:17
kenvandinethat would require a fair bit of work13:17
kenvandinebut this was a one liner13:17
seb128kenvandine, that's good enough13:17
seb128I don't think people want to use both13:17
kenvandineseb128, i thought you did?13:17
seb128I just want to use the notification area icon13:17
seb128I don't see the point of the indicator13:18
seb128it's slower and make you not notice messages13:18
kenvandineseb128, out of curiosity, do you use evolution for mail?13:19
kenvandineso i have empathy, evolution, gwibber, and xchat-gnome in the indicator13:19
seb128but I do send&receive manually when I want to read emails13:19
kenvandineit is the place i keep an eye on for messaging stuff13:19
kenvandineit is my go-to place...13:19
chrisccoulsonkenvandine - does xchat-gnome have indicator support?13:20
kenvandinechrisccoulson, sort of :)13:20
seb128and the indicator monitors only inbox anyway13:20
seb128and I put everything in imap folders13:20
seb128so it's always count 013:20
kenvandinechrisccoulson, not packaged anywhere and doesn't work well13:20
kenvandineseb128, ah... true13:20
chrisccoulsonah, ok. i thought so.13:20
pittiuscan could not find the needed tarball.13:20
kenvandinei wish i could add mailboxes to monitor13:20
pittiseb128: ^ where did you get the empathy orig.tar.gz from?13:20
seb128pitti, http://download.gnome.org/sources/empathy/2.28/empathy-
chrisccoulsonkenvandine - are you planning to progress that? (i was thinking about adding indicator support a few days ago, but wasn't sure if anyone else was working on it)13:21
kenvandinechrisccoulson, i will fix it up13:21
pittiseb128: oh, watch has http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/sources/empathy/([0-9.]+)/empathy-(.*).tar.gz13:21
kenvandinesmerp wrote it originally13:21
seb128pitti, it's equivalent13:21
kenvandinebut it doesn't do much more than toggle13:21
chrisccoulsonkenvandine - cool!13:21
seb128pitti, http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/sources/empathy/2.28/empathy-
kenvandinechrisccoulson, i fixed it up to be a little more useful but never figured out how to make xchat-gnome change which channel/pm is displayed13:22
pittiseb128: hm, uscan fail then; anyway, thanks13:22
seb128pitti, you're welcome13:22
chrisccoulsonkenvandine - i'm not sure either. i've not had a look at the xchat-gnome source in any great detail yet13:22
seb128I tend to not let bzr-buildpackage download things since most GNOME packages are buggy and download the tarball twice13:22
chrisccoulsonso i need to think of something else to work on in lucid:)13:23
kenvandinechrisccoulson, plugins are pretty simple... but i don't see a function for changing the views13:23
seb128kenvandine, I might start using the indicator if xchat-gnome put things there13:23
kenvandineseb128, well maybe i should finish it :)13:23
seb128kenvandine, it just doesn't fit my im and email workflows13:23
seb128I want to know about im messages not to queue those13:23
seb128and I do decide when I read email based on when I'm not doing something13:23
seb128not based on when things arrive13:24
seb128I've always unread emails coming anyway13:24
seb128would it only be spams13:24
seb128so the indicator is useful for those13:24
pittiyeah; trying email into a synchronous medium is just madness13:24
kenvandineseb128, i'll clean it up13:24
kenvandinei might just need to include more headers from the frontend stuff to actually use the widgets directly13:25
kenvandinei can change channels that way13:25
kenvandinebut seems like something they should include in the plugin api13:25
seb128f-spot doesn't start in the guest session13:48
* seb128 boots a kvm iso for testing13:48
huatsdoes anyone has seen repports about  automount of usbsticks/hd that dont' automount after a jaunty -> karmic upgrade ?14:31
seb128huats, do you have gnome-volume-manager installed?14:40
seb128hum, new wave theme makes f-spot crash14:40
seb128who is maintaining those themes, seems nobody look at the bug list on launchpad14:40
huatsseb128, nope14:41
seb128huats, ok good, use ubuntu-bug it has magic to debug those14:41
seb128just "ubuntu-bug", select debug removable media issues14:42
* asac gone for some errands. will be back later (~2h)14:42
huatsseb128, done14:46
seb128huats, bug number?14:46
huatsseb128,  bug 46334714:47
ubottuLaunchpad bug 463347 in gvfs "Usb Media not automaticaly mounted" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/46334714:47
seb128is nautilus running?14:47
huatsit is14:47
seb128and the usb key is neither listed in nautilus computer, sidebar not places menu now?14:48
huatsseb128, nope14:49
seb128is it listed in gnome-disk-utility?14:50
seb128I think the apport bug filing magic is wrong there14:50
seb128it's a bug with the key not with gvfs14:50
seb128it has no type nor version14:51
huatsseb128,  it was working great with jaunty (with the same key)14:51
seb128ie seems your partition is not formated or something14:51
seb128empty type version14:51
huatsI have tested with 3 differents stuffs14:51
huats(keys or HD I mean)14:52
huatsI can send the debug infos with another one...14:52
seb128pitti, ^ any clue?14:52
seb128or chrisccoulson might know too14:52
seb128chrisccoulson, did you read about usb mounting not working for some users?14:53
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i've not noticed that14:53
seb128huats, dunno what is going on on your system then14:54
huatsthat is quite weird14:55
seb128is the key listed in usb-screator?14:55
seb128or gnome-disk-utility?14:56
huatsseb128, I don't have gnome-disk-utility14:56
huatsbut it is listed in gparted14:56
huatsnot seen in usb-creator14:57
huatsI am installing gnome-disk-utiliy14:57
huatsseb128, when you say gnome-disk-utility what binar do you mean ?14:58
huatssince I do have the package installed14:58
seb128system, admin, disk utility14:58
huatsseb128, it is seen14:59
seb128and you can mount it using mount?14:59
huats(the binary is named Palimpsest)14:59
seb128it is listed in fstab too?15:00
huatsfstab ? not15:00
huatsnor the mtab15:00
huatsI can mount it using mount15:00
seb128and mount /dev/sdb1 /media/something?15:00
chrisccoulsondoes it show a valid filesystem type in palimpsest?15:00
seb128so I don't know why it's not working15:01
seb128chrisccoulson, bug #46334715:01
ubottuLaunchpad bug 463347 in gvfs "Usb Media not automaticaly mounted" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/46334715:01
seb128chrisccoulson, the devicekit-disks log has no type nor version15:01
seb128like there was no fs known15:01
seb128which is weird15:01
huatsthere is a fs since I have data on it that I can access :)15:01
huats(using mount)15:01
huatschrisccoulson, actually palimptest do not detect the fs type I think15:03
chrisccoulsondk-disks gets the fs type from the ID_FS_TYPE attribute for the device15:04
chrisccoulsonso if that is missing, then it's an issue with whatever detects the filesystem type15:05
chrisccoulsonand i can't remember what does that ;)15:05
mvo_seb128: should I take #464428 or are you on it already?15:09
mvo_bug  #46442815:09
chrisccoulsonindeed, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/34601725/UdevMonitorLog.txt shows that attribute is missing15:09
ubottuError: Launchpad bug 464428 could not be found15:09
mvo_bug 46332815:10
ubottuLaunchpad bug 463328 in gst-plugins-bad0.10 "package gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad (not installed) failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/lib/gstreamer-0.10/libgstautoconvert.so', which is also in package gstreamer0.10-plugins-good 0:0.10.16-1ubuntu3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/46332815:10
huatschrisccoulson, so what can I do to help ?15:10
chrisccoulsonnot sure yet, i'm trying to figure that out:)15:10
chrisccoulsonbut i'm at work and i have to keep hiding pidgin when my boss walks nearby;)15:10
huatschrisccoulson, sure15:10
huatsdon't take any risks :)15:11
chrisccoulsonhuats - it's a slow day today anyway;)15:14
chrisccoulsonwell, it is for me anyway!15:14
pittihuats: did you file a bug about it? (sorry, I was buried reading bugs)15:14
pittihuats: oh, 463347, nevermind15:14
pittihuats: I'll follow up in the bug, let's keep the discussion there15:15
huatspitti, sure !15:15
huatsthanks guys !15:15
pittibut first, congrats everyone for karmic!!15:15
* pitti celebrates15:15
chrisccoulsoni just saw the announcement \o/15:15
pitti#u-r-p is pure madness15:15
* pitti goes to process SRUs15:16
chrisccoulsoni need to leave work and party!15:16
seb128mvo_, you can look at it thanks15:26
Laneyseb128: how do you want to do/version this SRU?15:26
Laneycan't sync for it, right?15:26
chrisccoulsonhey seb128 - i'm going to prepare a gnome-desktop SRU later15:27
chrisccoulsondo we want to SRU the gsd-locate-pointer issue we discussed yesterday?15:27
seb128Laney, no we can't15:27
seb128Laney, we can fake sync with karmic-proposed target15:27
seb128chrisccoulson, thanks for gnome-desktop, not sure about g-s-d15:28
pedro_folks, just ping me if you need anything to be verified quickly on the SRU side15:28
seb128chrisccoulson, seems something we can maybe combine with other pending changes if there is any15:28
pedro_i'll be taking a look into those anyways15:28
seb128pedro_, thanks!15:28
seb128pitti, congrats to you too ;-)15:28
chrisccoulsonseb128 - no worries, i'll work on the gnome-desktop update later15:28
pedro_seb128, my pleasure ;-)15:28
pedro_and congrats for a rocking release guys!15:28
pedro_so much nice comments on twitter/identi.ca/etc15:29
seb128pitti and chrisccoulson: you guys did rocking work with new devicekits etc changes in karmic btw thanks again15:29
* Laney is seeding like crazy15:29
chrisccoulsonseb128 / pitti - thanks for sponsoring all my work too:)15:29
hggdhseb128: the dbus errors in evolution seem to be caused by glib2/gconf calls, not directly by evo. It may be due to evo being heavily threaded15:30
hggdhmcrha has told me he has just seen similar bug reports in fedora15:30
seb128hggdh, how did you figure that? all those all duplicates?15:31
hggdhseb128: most of the calls involving dbus were driven from glib/gconf calls15:31
seb128hggdh, read the upstream chan discussion now15:31
hggdhI am not sure how I can classify them all as dups (code path changes radically, sometimes), but this *may* need some serialisation in evo15:32
pedro_mm so they might be all dups of a bug i've sent a few weeks ago there15:33
* pedro_ looks15:33
seb128pitti, do you know who is responsive for gnome-themes-ubuntu?15:34
* hggdh has just been preempted asking for the bug# by migthy pedro_15:34
pittiseb128: ubuntu artwork team, by and large (hi kwwii!)15:34
seb128pitti, do you know who is responsive for gnome-themes-ubuntu, seems nobody is very active on launchpad bugs there?15:34
seb128pitti, ok thanks15:34
seb128pitti, new wave makes f-spot crash on start15:34
pedro_hggdh, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=59301715:35
ubottuGnome bug 593017 in Misc. "evolution-data-server-2.28 crashed with SIGSEGV" [Critical,Unconfirmed]15:35
seb128pitti, speaking about f-spot it doesn't start in the guest session either, is there a way to desactivate the apparmor profile there to see if that's the issue?15:35
dobeyjames_w: hey. around?15:35
james_wdobey: yes15:35
hggdhpedro_: thank you15:36
pedro_hggdh, that's the gconf-over-dbus according to mbarnes15:36
pedro_hggdh, you're welcome15:36
hggdhyeah. This is going to be bad for us :-(15:36
seb128it's going to be an issue for any distro15:37
dobeyjames_w: hey. i understand that the source package branches stuff has a few different ways it works. is there any documentation on those differences?15:37
james_wdobey: /usr/share/doc/bzr-builddeb/15:37
pedro_we just got the bug first...15:37
dobeyjames_w: thanks15:37
james_wdobey: file:///usr/share/doc/bzr-builddeb/user_manual even15:37
hggdhit is indeed, but we tend to be at the bleeding edge15:37
seb128well we just ship 2.28 there15:38
seb128not e-d-s over dbus yet which is 2.2915:38
seb128in any case I wonder if that creates real user issues15:39
hggdhyes. But gconf now uses dbus15:39
seb128out of apport triggering15:39
seb128gconf uses dbus for years15:39
hggdhthen something radically changed in evo 2.2815:40
seb128I think something changed in evo yes15:40
seb128gconf didn't change a lot recently15:40
seb128the dbus version is there since hardy15:40
tgpraveen1in ubuntu karmic, networkmanager seems to be having problem with policykit15:43
tgpraveen1or something each time i have to connect i need to enter my password so that Nm can access the keyring for that15:43
tgpraveen1connection's password15:43
tgpraveen1and many times the dialog asking for password itself doesnt appear and thats why Nm is not able to make a successful connection and i dont get any indication of error also15:43
cassidyhey guys; congrats for the release!15:45
seb128hey cassidy, thanks15:45
seb128cassidy, empathy accepted as candidate update with libindicator issue fixed btw15:45
seb128should make everybody happy15:45
tgpraveen1great work everybody. superb release . thanks a lot!15:46
seb128tgpraveen1, your password issue is on ubuntu or unr?15:46
hggdhhum. I will have another look at the threadStackTraces for e-d-s again.15:47
* hggdh got an idea (probably wrong, but what the hell)15:47
cassidyseb128, \o/15:47
seb128ok, asac might know then15:48
seb128I've seen a similar bug about unr but none on ubuntu15:48
Laneyseb128: bug 46340415:49
ubottuLaunchpad bug 463404 in f-spot "New upstream release 0.6.14" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/46340415:49
tgpraveen1k. have pinged him about it on #nm. and btw many times the problems of policykit and networkmanager appear while setting up a new connection. ie the connection is setup and then it cant connect as it doesnt get access to keyring or something but it never asks me for entering password itself.15:49
seb128Laney, thanks15:50
tgpraveen1btw is it supposed to ask for system passsword at all coz it didnt  in jaunty?15:50
pittiseb128: yes, use sudo aa-complain gdm-guest-session15:50
seb128I got none of my machines asking for system password there15:50
pittiseb128: you can also check dmesg and see if you have violations there15:50
seb128pitti, [13729.983870] type=1503 audit(1256823893.303:72): operation="file_mmap" pid=4115 parent=4077 profile="/usr/share/gdm/guest-session/Xsession" requested_mask="mrw::" denied_mask="m::" fsuid=102 ouid=102 name="/dev/shm/mono.4115"15:51
hggdhhey pedro_, I see you now have bugsquad-assignement powers at b.g.o! Cool!15:51
pedro_hggdh, yeah just 10 dollars15:51
seb128pitti, there is lot of complains in fact in a guest session15:51
pittiseb128: that makes sense15:51
seb128pitti, /etc/compizconfig/config too15:52
pedro_hggdh, oh going to UDS this time?15:52
hggdhpedro_: if they are American dollars, it was really cheap ;-)15:52
pedro_hggdh, you're a local right?15:52
pittiseb128: it wants to mmap those? hm15:52
hggdhpedro_: yes, I will be there, and yes, I am a local15:52
pedro_hggdh, *awesome*15:52
seb128pitti, it's using sqlite, not sure if that makes a difference there15:52
pittiseb128: ah, that would mmap, yes15:52
pittiseb128: can you please open a bug and assign to me? should be trivial to fix, I'll prepare an SRU15:53
pittibut not today any more15:53
pittiI'll meet with my wife at the fair, time for a quiet evening15:53
seb128pitti, no hurry, will do, thanks15:53
pittiseb128: and then, off you go as well :)15:53
seb128right, swimming pool tonight and then non computer evening15:53
seb128and 3 days weekend15:53
pittiah, enjoy15:53
seb128I'm taking a vac day tomorrow again15:53
pittiI'll do a quiet day tomorrow, working on some pet projects15:54
james_wseb128: enjoy, you deserve it15:54
seb128james_w, thanks ;-)15:54
=== robbiew is now known as robbiew-afk
mac_vseb128: actually user filed the bug #463345 in empathy , because in indicator applet Bug 450398 was rejected ;) ,also was rejected in Humanity ;p ... so he later filed the 463345 in empathy ;)16:01
ubottuLaunchpad bug 463345 in indicator-applet "Unread messages icon in indicator applet too discreet" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/46334516:02
ubottuLaunchpad bug 450398 in indicator-applet "The "unread messages" appearance of the tray icon is not noticeable enough in Karmic" [Wishlist,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/45039816:02
seb128mac_v, still not an empathy issue ;-)16:06
mac_vyup :)16:06
=== halfline_ is now known as halfline
seb128Laney, uploaded, needs to be approved now which will probably not be before tomorrow or next week16:45
hggdhis the dbus library thread-safe?16:46
seb128Keybuk, ^16:46
Laneyseb128: OK no hurry, thanks for looking at it16:47
seb128Laney, thank you for doing the update ;-)16:47
Laneywas a boring upstream update really16:47
seb128boring bug fixes is what we want in stable updates ;-)16:47
seb128no new cracks16:47
Laneyyep :)16:48
seb128mvo_, still there?16:58
seb128mvo_, is there a way to add an usb key as cdrom source on hardy?16:58
=== MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|capoeira
asactgpraveen1: what kind of connection is that?17:18
tgpraveen13g modem17:19
tgpraveen1usb modem17:19
tgpraveen1which is supported ootb17:19
asactgpraveen1: "available to all users" ... or normal?17:19
tgpraveen1cuurently at normal17:19
tgpraveen1though earlier17:19
tgpraveen1with available to all it was still giving same problems17:19
asacthere seem to be issues with secrets + available to all users17:21
asacfor some ppp things17:21
asactgpraveen1: but lets continue in #nm ... see you are there too ;)17:21
chrisccoulsonhmmm, whats with the "capabilities mismatch" with ubuntu one?17:43
chrisccoulsoni just saw that after signing in for the first time today17:43
jcastrochrisccoulson: it's in the release notes, you need to update17:47
chrisccoulsonjcastro - thanks:)17:47
chrisccoulsonheh, the archive is painfully slow17:58
Laney443, not bad18:00
chrisccoulsoni can't connect to the main archive now18:01
chrisccoulsonand i'm trying to find a mirror that's not out of date ;)18:01
chrisccoulsonright, time for more pidgin debugging18:18
pittiyay, lucid exists in LP18:24
mac_vpitti: when will lucid alpha1 be available?18:30
pittimac_v: hm, something like 4 weeks perhaps, not sure18:31
mac_vo.0 4weeks with no crashes ... /me sad18:31
chrisccoulsonare you all looking forward to UDS now?18:31
chrisccoulsonit will be quiet here for a couple of weeks!18:34
chrisccoulsoni might have to do some work in the daytime :(18:34
=== asac_ is now known as asac
kklimondachrisccoulson, what is your daytime job that you can spend so much time here? :)19:31
=== MacSlow|capoeira is now known as MacSlow
chrisccoulsonhey kklimonda - sorry, i went for dinner21:00
chrisccoulsoni'm an electronics engineer in the day21:00
chrisccoulsonbut i hate it ;)21:00
chrisccoulsonso i spend all day on here instead!"21:00
chrisccoulsonyes! weekend! :)21:12
mac_vdobey: hey , when could i expect the update of the fdo page regarding the delete and remove icons? I'd like to file a bug in the apps , regarding that ;)21:16
mac_vif i file them now , probably the devs would just say the fdo page isnt clear :(21:17
dobeymac_v: even when i fix the spec, the page itself won't get updated automatically. what's currently there isn't what's currently in trunk i don't think :-/21:17
mac_vdobey: hmm , weird :( ... just out of curiosity why is that it wont update?  or is there anyplace i could point that this is the right spec?21:19
dobeymac_v: you could point at the docbook file in git i guess21:20
mac_vdobey: great... :) the gnome-theme git?21:20
dobeymac_v: it doesn't update automatically because it's a script that gets run, that has config that points at specific revisions/tags to pull the docbook to generate the different versions21:20
dobeymac_v: no21:21
dobeymac_v: http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xdg/default-icon-theme/tree/spec/icon-naming-spec.xml21:21
mac_vdobey: awesome , thanks , so once that gets updated ... /me will go on bug rampage ;)21:23
dobeymac_v: can you please file a bug for that against the iocn-naming-spec project on launchpad?21:23
mac_vdobey: sure... will do21:24
dobeyand now, i gotta go do some other stuff :)21:25
kklimondabtw any idea how can I hide partition from gvfs? I have two partitions on my android sdcard and both are mounted and detected by media players as android phones :)21:37
chrisccoulsonhmmm, not sure21:39
chrisccoulsonare they appearing as removable storage devices? or as media devices?21:39
kklimondachrisccoulson, how to check it?21:41
chrisccoulsonthe output of gvfs-mount -li will give a clue21:41
kklimondabrb, I'll load gnome :)21:41
chrisccoulsonif you see 'GProxyVolumeMonitorGdu' next to the device, then it's just a removable drive21:43
chrisccoulsonif you see 'GProxyVolumeMonitorGPhoto' or something similar, then it's a media device21:43
kklimondabtw, 9.10 is almost unusable on 512ram - at least in my case :/21:43
chrisccoulsonhmmm, i've been using it for some testing in a 512MB VM, and it seems to be ok21:44
chrisccoulsonso it's being picked up and mounted as removable storage?21:45
chrisccoulsonbut media players detect it as something else?21:45
kklimondachrisccoulson, when you launch Firefox, some terminals, Evolution, rhythmbox it starts to swap.. and my disk is slow21:45
chrisccoulsonah, Firefox is pretty heavy anyway21:45
chrisccoulsoni struggle with Firefox with 2GB of RAM21:46
chrisccoulsonespecially when there are 2 user sessions open, and both sessions have a Firefox instance running21:46
chrisccoulsonthe machine is unusable then ;)21:46
kklimondachrisccoulson, rhythmbox detects both mounted partitions as "1.4 GB Filesystem" and "535 MB Filesystem", Banshee displays them both as "HTC Dream Android" or something - can't check it right now21:47
chrisccoulsonhmmm, that's wierd then. i don't know what banshee uses to get the info21:48
kklimondachrisccoulson, it's not a default setup21:48
chrisccoulsonbanshee might still be getting the info from HAL21:48
kklimondachrisccoulson, that's why I don't want to report bugs, just somehow hide the smaller one from gvfs/players21:49
chrisccoulsonwhereas rhythmbox is talking to UDEV instead21:49
chrisccoulsonthat will probably cause some inconsistency21:49
kklimondachrisccoulson, I'm not sure if it's inconsistency - both players detects both partitions and handles them as if they are both for media - the smaller one is for applications, it's not an official android feature so I guess no one cared to test it out21:50
chrisccoulsonhmmmm. i've got an android phone here - should probably try it out21:51
chrisccoulsonif i can find it!21:51
kklimondachrisccoulson, you would need an cyanogenmod or another apps2sd modification21:51
kklimondachrisccoulson, it's a bug in a way that whatever you copy to the smaller partition won't show on a phone. At the same time it may be a case of not supported user modification ;)21:52
kklimonda(well, it will show on a phone if you use terminal or some 3rd party file browser - just not in media player)21:53
* chrisccoulson shouldn't leave his phone on display in his car21:53
chrisccoulsonok, thats confusing21:55
kklimondaI've written too much ;)21:55
chrisccoulsoni plug in my phone, and i get a nautilus window AND rhythmbox opens21:55
kklimondainteresting :)21:56
chrisccoulsonoh, that might just be because i already had rhythmbox open21:56
kklimondachrisccoulson, I think I got 2 dialogs whenever I connected my phone - one for photos and other for music21:57
kklimonda(the ones that ask me what to do)21:57
chrisccoulsonhmmmm, that's a bit wierd21:58
kklimondaI can't check if it's still the case because I've marked to not show them anymore21:58
kklimondano idea where can I unmark this option ;)21:58
chrisccoulsonhmmm "x_content_types: x-content/image-dcf x-content/audio-player"22:03
chrisccoulsonso nautilus just decides it will do the actions for photos and music player at the same time22:03
chrisccoulsoni don't know if that is expected behaviour22:03
kklimondachrisccoulson, where can I change the default actions btw?22:05
kklimondaI can't find it anywhere22:05
chrisccoulsonit's hidden away in a really obvious and intuitive location....22:05
chrisccoulsonit's in Nautilus - Edit -> Preferences, and then the Media tab22:06
chrisccoulsonlots of users already complain about that ;)22:06
chrisccoulsonooh dear, where did everyone go?22:06
kklimondachrisccoulson, oh right, now that I know what application is responsible for it it's indeed obvious :)22:06
chrisccoulsonit's not obvious to a lot of people though22:06
chrisccoulsonpfft, i don't want an icon that looks like an ipod for my android phone22:07
chrisccoulsoni want an icon that looks like my phone22:07
chrisccoulsonmac_v ^^ :P22:08
kklimondachrisccoulson, it's the kind of preference I look for in System->Preferences22:08
kklimondaand not in application's settings22:08
chrisccoulsonkklimonda - there is an icon in the preferences menu, but it's hidden by default22:08
chrisccoulson"File Management"22:09
kklimondaoh, yummy - nautilus actually displays 3 dialogs for me when I connect the android. The 3rd one is from my custom partition..22:09
chrisccoulsonbut that's not very helpful either ;)22:09
chrisccoulsonah, if there are multiple partitions, then that's normal anyway22:09
chrisccoulsoni'm not sure of any other way around that really22:09
kklimondahow does nautilus decide that the partition is from music player?22:10
mac_vchrisccoulson: hmmm? i didnt understand... which icon? is being used? gvfs dumped a crap load of new stuff and probably davidz only knows all the icon names :(22:10
chrisccoulsonmac_v - it's the "multimedia-player" icon22:11
chrisccoulsoni was joking btw ;)22:11
chrisccoulsoni don't mind an icon that looks a bit like an ipod really22:11
mac_v ;)22:11
* bryce__ changes all of chrisccoulson's icons into ipods randomly22:12
chrisccoulsonkklimonda - the media gets a x-content-type attribute, which nautilus uses22:12
chrisccoulsonbryce__ - thanks:)22:12
mac_vbut seriously the gvfs guys changed the icon names according to their wishes , now several is as was earlier :(22:12
kklimondachrisccoulson, as I thought - any chance I could override it by some dot-file ?22:12
mac_v*is NOT as was earlier :(22:12
kklimonda.not-a-media-player or something ;)22:12
chrisccoulsonkklimonda - not sure. i'm trying to work out where the x-content-type attributes come from22:13
kklimondabtw, I really like the new folder names for mounted partitions22:14
chrisccoulsonusing UUID's?22:14
chrisccoulsonso do i, but some users already complained about that22:14
chrisccoulsonthey want disk-1, disk-2 etc...22:14
kklimondanothing like trying to guess what does CB08-D42C mean ;)22:14
chrisccoulsonusing UUID's gives some persistence though22:14
kklimondaIt's better if disk has no label imo22:14
chrisccoulsonkklimonda - the content type comes from shared-mime-info then22:21
chrisccoulsonalthough, i sort of expected that anyway, but i wanted to work out how it gets from there to nautilus ;)22:21
kklimondaalways the curious one ;)22:21
chrisccoulsontime to change my VM's to lucid now:)22:25
chrisccoulsonhmmm, bug 46384522:28
ubottuLaunchpad bug 463845 in ubuntuone-client "UbuntuOne is an embarassing load of crap" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/46384522:29
chrisccoulsonsome users aren't very polite22:29
bryce__chrisccoulson, that's an understatement22:31
chrisccoulsonin general, or just this particular case?22:32
kklimondachrisccoulson, frankly I don't like the way Evolution is integrated with Ubuntu One (Evolution being the only application using ubuntu one I know about)22:34
chrisccoulsonkklimonda - its only for contact sync though isn't it?22:34
chrisccoulsonand it's "opt-in" too22:35
chrisccoulsontomboy has u1 integration too22:35
chrisccoulsoni don't need the contact sync in evolution, because i sync them all with google instead22:35
kklimondachrisccoulson, but it creates yet another contact book..22:35
chrisccoulsonwhere i can access them on my android phone:)22:35
kklimondayes, so am I22:36
chrisccoulsonso i just don't use the u1 contact sync stuff22:36
chrisccoulsoni will probably use it to sync notes, if i eventually buy myself a netbook22:36
kklimondachrisccoulson, then you are left with tomboy sync.. who uses tomboy anyway? ;)22:36
chrisccoulsoni use tomboy ;)22:36
kklimondareally? I've tried few times and found it too bloated to be a sticky notes replacement and not working as a full-time note taking software :)22:37
kklimondabut maybe that's just me22:37
chrisccoulsonit's useful for noting down random thoughts at 3am when i'm debugging stuff, before my brain shrivels up due to lack of sleep22:37
kklimondachrisccoulson, the problem I personally have with U1 right now is that it's not as integrated with Ubuntu as I'd like it to be22:38
chrisccoulsonyeah, it's still early days though22:38
chrisccoulsoni'm sure more stuff will use it eventually:)22:39
kklimondaand for some reason I don't like whole couchdb which is weird because I have never really used it ;)22:39
chrisccoulsonyeah, that stuff's all magic to me. i don't understand how it works or what it does yet ;)22:39
chrisccoulsonand i don't use things that i don't understand22:39
kklimondacommand line arguments for launching it that show up in ps aux are scarry though22:40
chrisccoulsonlol, yeah, just noticed that ;)22:40
chrisccoulsonbbl, need to go and watch some TV :)22:41
kklimondaTV is overrated ;)22:41
TheMusorobert_ancell: Do you ahve any pending SRUs that will need uploading today? I am specifically thinking of brasero.22:52
robert_ancellTheMuso, looking..22:53
robert_ancellTheMuso, brasero and bug 456269 (clutter-gtk)22:54
ubottuLaunchpad bug 456269 in clutter-gtk "Unlike libclutter, libclutter-gtk does not include gobject introspection data" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/45626922:54
TheMusoFor brasero, all that needs to be done is the bug has to be fixed up for the SRU, the bzr repo needs a slight tweak, and it can be re-uploaded.22:54
robert_ancellTheMuso, what needs changing?23:02
TheMusorobert_ancell: The justification of the SRU and regression potential. Unless the GNOME packages are done differently and I am not aware of it.23:03
robert_ancellTheMuso, I think in general the GNOME stable updates don't need a lot of description.  I'll ping seb128 and pitti to check23:06
robert_ancellTheMuso, the release seems very quiet - do you know of any major problems?  Do you know if U1 got fixed ok?23:07
TheMusorobert_ancell: The ubuntu one fixes are in proposed now I believe. There were a lot of acceptances into the proposed repo after we released, according to karmic-changes.23:08
TheMusorobert_ancell: I saw totem was also uploaded, so I'll check to see how that bug looks.23:20
robert_ancellTheMuso, ok23:20
TheMusorobert_ancell: Refer to bug #463102 for what has to be done as an example.23:20
ubottuLaunchpad bug 463102 in totem "Update to 2.28.2" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/46310223:20
robert_ancellTheMuso, ok, will do23:21
ftacould someone please have a look at bug 460710?23:35
ubottuLaunchpad bug 460710 in evolution "Evolution hangs when double-clicking on attachment" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/46071023:35
robert_ancellTheMuso, debdiff attached23:42
TheMusorobert_ancell: ok thanks will take a look in a bit.23:53

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