[00:00] <EagleScreen> they say that it will be available in 4.4, nice new
[00:31] <JontheEchidna> \o/
[00:31] <shtylman> yuriy: thanks for pointing that out
[00:32] <shtylman> the last bullet is just a poor translation...but yes..I can see how cutoff text is a problem
[00:33] <shtylman> I suppose I will look into that for the next release
[00:33] <JontheEchidna> great job guys!
[00:33] <shtylman> the balance is that it also has to work on small screens
[00:40]  * JontheEchidna was in/traveling to/from Plimouth Plantation in Mass today
[00:41] <yuriy> great job JontheEchidna!
[00:41] <JontheEchidna> you too :)
[00:42] <JontheEchidna> userconfig would still be a pleasant "maybe some day" idea without your effort
[01:23] <JontheEchidna> no more bugs tonight, I should be partying!
[01:23] <JontheEchidna> fortunately there haven't been many reports. Most of those came during RC. More than I've ever seen anyway
[01:25]  * JontheEchidna hits the blogs
[01:26] <JontheEchidna> Wow, KDE was the focal point of computerworld's Ubuntu 9.10 article: http://www.computerworld.com.au/article/324380/ubuntu_9_10_karmic_koala_release_gives_kde_boost?fp=4&fpid=1968336438
[01:36] <JontheEchidna> Ha, we should have marketed this as trying to scare the competition, what with Halloweeen being in 2 days
[01:44] <MsMaco> huh?
[01:44] <MsMaco> halloween?
[01:45] <MsMaco> what do kde and halloween ahve in common?
[01:45] <JontheEchidna> the kubuntu release was two days from halloween, is all
[01:48] <yuriy> JontheEchidna: you still mispelled Plimoth Plantation!!
[01:48] <JontheEchidna> oops
[01:48] <JontheEchidna> have you been? It's quite neat
[01:49] <JontheEchidna> got to go on their Mayflower replica, even
[01:49] <yuriy> yeah i've been twice in 5th grade and middle school
[01:58] <JontheEchidna> cool
[03:24] <robinp_> is there likely to be a solid device browser within dolphin ?
[03:38] <MsMaco> js
[03:38] <MsMaco> oops
[07:04] <Mamarok> good morning :)
[07:05] <Mamarok> Sine I don't use Amarok with the Karmic packages, I wonder if there is a packaging problem, I have a guy with that error when he starts Amarok: "could not find requested component: mediadevices"
[07:39] <markey> http://www.techworld.com.au/article/324380/ubuntu_9_10_karmic_koala_release_gives_kde_boost
[07:39] <markey> :)
[07:55] <ulysses__> good morning
[08:55] <Mamarok> does Kopeta work with msn in Karmic?
[09:13] <ulysses__> Mamarok: it works
[09:34] <\sh> morning
[09:34] <\sh> Sput, awake? did you miss the train? ;)
[09:39] <Mamarok> can somebody have an eye on #kubuntu, please? I am hungry...
[10:07] <ghostcube> http://www.anhalter.net/tools/bofh/index.php   only for the ones doesnt know :D
[10:08] <ghostcube> i love this one
[10:10] <ulysses__> Choqok crashed just now
[10:49] <Mamarok> ulysses__: I use it since Jaunty and it never crashed on me
[10:49] <ulysses__> this was the first, but I can restart it
[10:50] <ulysses__> Ayatana is cooler than the "older" notifies
[11:06] <Mamarok> hm, new packages for the updater, were there problems?
[11:46] <Riddell> Mamarok: there's always problems to be fixed
[11:58] <Mamarok> ok, just so I can point people to it
[12:28] <Quintasan> hiho
[12:34] <ScottK> Are we still using kvkbd?  It's up for adoption in Debian: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=542799
[12:35] <Riddell> it's in our seeds, wasn't there a plasma replacement?
[12:36]  * ScottK recalls something about it.
[12:38] <JontheEchidna> plasma-widget-plasmaboard
[12:42] <Riddell> task for today: get down to inbox zero!
[13:06] <ScottK> dtchen: SinceI don't know if you read planet KDE, I thought I'd pass this on: http://colin.guthr.ie/2009/10/so-how-does-the-kde-pulseaudio-support-work-anyway/
[13:09] <Ramblurr> are the qt4 demos/examples not included in any qt package?
[13:10] <tsimpson> they are in qt4-demos afaik
[13:12] <JontheEchidna> ohmy, the disabling of apport va /etc/default/apport disables Dr. Konqi too :/
[13:12] <JontheEchidna> for app crash handling
[13:12] <apachelogger> hooray for patches
[13:12]  * apachelogger does the patch dance
[13:13] <JontheEchidna> that patch will fry for 10.04
[13:13] <apachelogger> how about: fry any patch for 10.04? :P
[13:13] <JontheEchidna> but as it stands, no dr. konqui by default for anybody unless they manually edit /etc/defaults/apport
[13:13] <JontheEchidna> worth an SRU?
[13:14] <apachelogger> it is
[13:14] <Riddell> if I do killall -SEGV dolphin I get drkonqi
[13:14] <Riddell> what needs edited?
[13:14] <apachelogger> upstream will give us a beat if no way to comfortably retrace
[13:14] <apachelogger> Riddell: /etc/default/apport
[13:14] <apachelogger> I would suppose apport needs to be turned on
[13:14] <JontheEchidna> kubuntu_07_apport_by_default needs dropping
[13:14] <apachelogger> oh, that came out wrong
[13:14] <apachelogger> apport needs to be activated it seems
[13:15] <JontheEchidna> /etc/default/apport needs on, but apport-kde has to be uninstalled for it to work
[13:16] <Riddell> the only thing that patch does is disable drkonqi if apport-kde exists and /etc/default/apport has enabled=1
[13:16] <Riddell> I have enabled=0 (without editing anything) and thus drkonqi remains enabled
[13:16] <JontheEchidna> oh, hmm. it's working now
[13:17] <JontheEchidna> that's good
[13:17] <Riddell> if you disable it in /e/d/apport it won't take affect for apps which are already running or which are launched with kdeinit
[13:22] <ScottK> debfx: Fixed quassel backport is building now.
[13:29] <JontheEchidna> [09:29:17] <CIA-16> mart * r1042670 runtime/trunk/KDE/kdebase/ (5 files in 3 dirs): KNotificationItem->KStatusNotifierItem
[13:29] <JontheEchidna> \o/
[13:32]  * ScottK agateau will have a fun afternoon.
[13:32]  * ScottK ... thinks ... 
[13:34] <agateau> ScottK: I am already having a fun afternoon on #plasma :)
[13:34] <ScottK> Based on the kde-devel mail, I'm not suprised.
[13:34] <yuriy> JontheEchidna: i had a patch that would probably fix that but i never got to putting it in bzr
[13:35] <yuriy> JontheEchidna: bug 439758
[13:36] <yuriy> although no, i don't see why the old/current behavior would disable dr konqi
[13:38] <JontheEchidna> it doesn't, my mistake
[14:00] <yuriy> markey: good to see a positive article but it seems to say Canonical does all the work on Kubuntu
[14:00] <ScottK> Yeah.  I appreciated that Canonical wrote the Firefox installer
[14:01] <yuriy> that wasn't Riddell right?
[14:01] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger did that
[14:01] <ScottK> Yep.
[14:01] <JontheEchidna> like, all of it
[14:02] <apachelogger> hm
[14:02] <ScottK> BTW, apachelogger: If a fresh install is just finished and there's no local package cache, then installer thinks Firefox is already installed since (apparently) it assumes lack of something to install means it's done.
[14:02] <apachelogger> I am working on my application as kubuntu dev at canonical
[14:02] <apachelogger> so that the statement can become true :D
[14:03] <apachelogger> ScottK: yeah, I saw that
[14:03] <ScottK> You'll need a canoe then.
[14:03] <JontheEchidna> ScottK: no local cache also makes software-properties write bad sources.list files
[14:03] <apachelogger> ScottK: not sure what the most sensible solution to that would be
[14:03] <JontheEchidna> it seems to be causing a lot of issues
[14:03] <ScottK> The multi-media installer has the same problem.
[14:03] <apachelogger> hmmmm
[14:03] <apachelogger> how about running apt-get update in update-notifier-kde?
[14:03] <ScottK> What if there's no network?
[14:04] <apachelogger> then the command should fail as always
[14:04] <apachelogger> I actually wonder
[14:04] <apachelogger> why did we not have that issue before9.10?
[14:04] <ScottK> Dunno.
[14:04] <ScottK> I did more install testing for 9.10, so I don't know that it's actually new
[14:04] <apachelogger> something must have changed for sure :D
[14:05] <apachelogger> ScottK: I never triaged any bug report like that
[14:05] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: ?
[14:05] <JontheEchidna> I seem to remember people complaining before about not being able to apt-get install anything before apt-get updating
[14:05] <JontheEchidna> in #kubuntu
[14:06] <apachelogger> need to poke ubuntu doods how they address this
[14:06] <apachelogger> they sure must be affected as well
[14:06] <ScottK> apachelogger: Jockey is affected.
[14:07] <ScottK> The bug report referenced in known issues about jockey has some discussion I think
[14:07] <apachelogger> ScottK: gnome UI too?
[14:07] <ScottK> Yep
[14:07] <apachelogger> hm
[14:07] <ScottK> I reported it as a jockey-kde issue and pitti said it was general.  Read the bug.
[14:07] <apachelogger> well, for kfi it could just chain-execute install-package -u and install-package -i firefox
[14:08] <apachelogger> thus enforcing an update before install
[14:08] <apachelogger> though I think a global solution would make more sense
[14:08] <apachelogger> maybe we can get kpk's update checker to solve the issue?
[14:09] <ScottK> Sounds like the solution is dont' have software-properities write bad source files.
[14:09] <yuriy> I think i've seen something about this here before, but what am i missing:
[14:09] <apachelogger> ScottK: it only writes bad source files because no update was run before, as I understood?
[14:09] <yuriy> CMake Error at /usr/share/kde4/apps/cmake/modules/FindPhonon.cmake:19 (file): file Internal CMake error when trying to open file: /usr/include/phonon/phononnamespace.h for reading.
[14:10] <yuriy> I have libqt4-phonon-dev
[14:10] <ScottK> apachelogger: Right, but with no network an update may not be possible.  It should be smarter.
[14:15]  * yuriy wonders why kdevplatform needs phonon anyway
[14:18] <EagleScreen> wit no network an installation is neither possible
[14:19] <ScottK> EagleScreen: That's true, but currently it says it's already installed.
[14:19] <ScottK> It should know it's not installed and it can't be now.
[14:19] <EagleScreen> that sounds like a package-install bug
[14:21] <EagleScreen> what happens if in this conditions you try to install with apt or aptitude?
[14:21] <EagleScreen> saying there ins't package?
[14:21] <ScottK> Yes, it'll fail.
[14:22] <ScottK> It won't say you have the package already
[14:22] <EagleScreen> why package install do it?
[14:22] <EagleScreen> bug in package-install code? or in python-apt code?
[14:23] <ScottK> No idea.
[14:23] <EagleScreen> it seems install-package does not depend on python-apt
[14:24] <EagleScreen> it depends on gdebi-kde! is gdebi affected by this?
[14:25] <EagleScreen> can apt-cache be deleted by hand to test these cases?
[14:27] <apachelogger> EagleScreen: install-package -> gdebi-kde -> gdebi-core -> python-apt
[14:29] <dtchen> ScottK: I do [read Planet KDE], and we collaborate with Colin for debugging.
[14:30] <EagleScreen> found a bug in kpackagekit here
[14:48] <postkaart> hi
[14:48] <JontheEchidna> hello
[14:48] <postkaart> how can i help developping kubuntu?
[14:49] <Riddell> that all depends on what you're into
[14:49] <Riddell> coder, documenter, packager, bug triager, user support et al
[14:49] <postkaart> I have a base on Java and C#
[14:51] <postkaart> but i guess that's not usefull at all
[14:51] <Riddell> we tend to use python and C++ when coding, although that's not the majority of what we do
[14:51] <Riddell> postkaart: do you have karmic installed?
[14:51] <postkaart> C++ is rather complicated, python is what i'm starting with. most java projects for linux are rather standalone opensource projects
[14:52] <Riddell> postkaart: first step is to hang around in this chat room, so you've done the right thing already :)
[14:52] <postkaart> I just installed karmic on my laptop with no success: internet fails on me (wireless) so i'll rather try the old nm-applet
[14:53] <postkaart> or reinstall 9.04
[14:54] <Riddell> postkaart: wifi worked in 9.04 but not 9.10?
[14:55] <postkaart> yeah but laptop support has always been tricky anyways
[14:55] <postkaart> on school last year when using 8.10 it used to crash just trying to connect to wpa enterprise while just doing fine on WEP
[14:56] <postkaart> 9.04 jaunty fixed the cause, now it seems broken again somehow
[14:56] <postkaart> but don't dig too deep, i didn't yet study the case to figure out the problem
[14:57] <a|wen-dtu> postkaart: i had luck deleting all the wireless networks and starting from scratch ... seems networks created in 9.04 doesn't really work in 9.10
[14:59] <postkaart> a|wen-dtu: 9.04 crashed in september after updating (causing mouse issues) due need for a linux distro i quickly installed linux mint. Karmic install was from scratch.
[14:59] <Riddell> the upgrade script should delete the old network conf anyway
[14:59] <postkaart> can anyone tell me what actually changed in the networkmanager from 9.04 to 9.10?
[15:00] <Riddell> postkaart: it's a bit of a rewrite, and the GUI is entirely simplified (not a plasmoid)
[15:01] <a|wen-dtu> Riddell: ahh, cool ... probably updated to early for that
[15:01] <postkaart> Riddell: mentioned the plasmoid is gone: it actually looks like nm-applet from gnome now..
[15:07] <postkaart> as for developping what is preferred? python or c++. C++ sounds familiar as I already know C# though, i'll have to adjust to garbage collection and pointers and stuff like that.
[15:08] <tsimpson> can someone take a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdebase-workspace/+bug/464961 for me, plasma crashes when attempting to paste text with a hyperlink on the desktop and choosing "Notes"
[15:09] <tsimpson> KDE 4.3.2 on karmic
[15:09] <JontheEchidna> can you un-private it please?
[15:09] <Riddell> postkaart: it depends on the project, most of our original development is in python, we sometimes patch other bits in c++
[15:09] <Riddell> postkaart: but most of what we do is packaging and fixing packages
[15:10] <JontheEchidna> better :)
[15:10] <tsimpson> :)
[15:10] <postkaart> Riddell: I figured, but nevertheless I'd like to help developping :)
[15:10] <yuriy> postkaart: you can start by fixing the qyoto package and then you can use C# ;)
[15:10] <tsimpson> I've tried it a few times, and always crashes
[15:10] <JontheEchidna> tsimpson: crashes here too
[15:11] <JontheEchidna> but not if I drag the text to the desktop
[15:11] <JontheEchidna> only middle-click crashes
[15:12] <yuriy> any ideas on the FindPhonon problem ^^?
[15:12] <postkaart> yuriy: seems quite complicated still thanks for the tip. I'm still in college, i'm not that advanced^^
[15:13]  * Riddell notes that 4.3.3 is due to appear sometime today
[15:13] <JontheEchidna> yuriy: reinstall kdelibs5-dev, I believe
[15:13] <yuriy> actually that particular packaging bug is quite simple and could be a good start if you want to get into packaging. but sounds like you want to code
[15:13] <tsimpson> JontheEchidna: crashes when I choose "Web Browser" too, so it's not just Notes
[15:13] <Riddell> postkaart: so if you want to help with packaging KDE 4.3.3 that'll be happening soon
[15:13] <JontheEchidna> kde bug 202420
[15:13] <yuriy> postkaart: so maybe you can help JontheEchidna and apachelogger c++ify our python utilities
[15:14] <tsimpson> ooh, I didn't see that one
[15:15] <postkaart> yuriy: i'll give it a go soon after this weekend (if it's still not fixed) as I'll be gone for the weekend.
[15:15] <yuriy> JontheEchidna: nope still no /usr/include/phonon. why is it looking there and not the qt one? i assume this actually works since otherwise no packages would ever get built
[15:15] <postkaart> yuriy: could you rephrase that please?
[15:15] <JontheEchidna> yuriy: might have to install the libqt4-phonon-dev too
[15:15] <yuriy> JontheEchidna: already have it
[15:16] <yuriy> tried reinstalling too
[15:16] <JontheEchidna> *reinstall
[15:16] <JontheEchidna> oh
[15:17] <yuriy> postkaart: various things like jockey and update-notifier are currently in python and some would like to see them rewritten in C++ so they'll take up less memory
[15:17] <tsimpson> I've linked kde bug #196416 to the report
[15:17] <_Sime> yuriy: are you sure that is why update-notifier takes so much memory?
[15:18] <JontheEchidna> yuriy: jockey is probably less feasible, unless we want to make our own c++ backend
[15:18]  * tsimpson would kike to see update-notifier-kde written in C++
[15:18] <yuriy> JontheEchidna: yeah i don't remember what the other thing was off the top of my head
[15:18] <JontheEchidna> printer-applet
[15:18] <yuriy> that needs a backend too
[15:18] <JontheEchidna> _Sime: a similar app in c++ took around 4 times less RAM (Kapplication that makes notifications)
[15:19] <JontheEchidna> at idle, doing nothing
[15:19] <_Sime> JontheEchidna: I must warn you that it is rather hard to measure memory, esp. with heaps of shared libs etc.
[15:20] <JontheEchidna> it showed up as sitting at 10 MB of unshared memory at idle
[15:20] <JontheEchidna> (update-notifier-kde did)
[15:21] <JontheEchidna> then we reduced overhead of the C++ port further by making it into a kded module: https://code.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/kubuntu-notification-helper/trunk
[15:21] <postkaart> _Sime: I agree, but still an increase of 3 times can't be ignored?
[15:23] <_Sime> postkaart: the question isn't "does 3x matter". The question is "is it worth spending the developer effort on an optimisation which may bring ram use from 1% of sys mem to 0.3% of sys mem?"
[15:24] <tsimpson> for an app that is supposed to be constantly running, yes
[15:24] <tsimpson> it effectively takes ram off the system from login
[15:24] <JontheEchidna> especially if we have multiple python notification-oriented apps running. Then 10 MB becomes 20 or 30
[15:25] <JontheEchidna> then you take 6% of a low-end computer's ram --at idle-- for notifications that are rarely seen
[15:25] <yuriy> might also speed up login
[15:25] <tsimpson> and when there seems to be no way to quit it unless there are notifications in the sys-tray...
[15:27] <postkaart> _Sime: yes you are correct actually, effort should be taken into consideration as well the percentage of ram used is determined by the system running it.
[15:28] <postkaart> and we're not expecting a 8 year old pc to be still running 9.10 do we?
[15:28]  * JontheEchidna has a 6 year old PC that is running 9.10
[15:29] <JontheEchidna> killall python has been one of my first commands on a fresh boot for a while now
[15:29] <_Sime> JontheEchidna: but you don't have multiple  python notification-oriented apps running.
[15:29] <JontheEchidna> update-notifier-kde, jockey, printer-applet-kde
[15:29] <_Sime> JontheEchidna: why optimise so early? There are surely other more important features to do first.
[15:30] <JontheEchidna> I actually did most of the work during a freeze week when I had nothing else to do
[15:31] <JontheEchidna> not too much effort expended on my part
[15:32] <_Sime> maybe. But the C++ will still need to maintained. And you might not be around for ever.
[15:32] <_Sime> that is a cost as well.
[15:33] <yuriy> _Sime: it seems to me we've had more trouble with maintaining PyQt stuff than anything C++ (e.g. that has-to-be-a-KMainWindow bug that's still around)
[15:33] <JontheEchidna> the code is quite modular and clean. certainly cleaner than what we wrote for update-notifier-kde
[15:33] <apachelogger> _Sime: the current cpp code is about 5 billion times more maintainable than what we had in python
[15:34] <apachelogger> getting the python thingy in shape would have equaled a rewrite anyway :D
[15:35] <postkaart> is update-notifier-kde written in oo?
[15:35] <postkaart> (i don't know anything about python so sorry for this.)
[15:35] <tsimpson> oo?
[15:35] <postkaart> Object-Oriented
[15:35] <tsimpson> ah, OOP..
[15:35] <tsimpson> yes
[15:36] <tsimpson> python is an object-orientated language
[15:36] <alteroo> Riddell: hi
[15:36] <postkaart> tsimpson: thanks. maybe i should look up some examples to see what python is all about.
[15:37] <tsimpson> it's not too difficult to learn, and it has a huge standard library
[15:37] <alteroo> postkaart: It's about the Full Monty!
[15:37] <alteroo> jussi01: Don't look now
[15:38] <JontheEchidna> python has its uses, I just don't think that tray notifications are its niche exactly
[15:38] <_Sime> my congrats to the openoffice-kde people. It looks good once you turn off the GUI scaling (which screws everything up)
[15:38] <alteroo> _Sime: Where is the GUI scaling?
[15:38] <JontheEchidna> ya, the OpenOffice intergration is sweet
[15:39] <_Sime> alteroo: some obscure option in the OO prefs.
[15:39] <yuriy> thanks _Sime!  shtylman^
[15:39] <_Sime> alteroo: under "View"
[15:39]  * _Sime wishes the someone would fix the GTK file dialog in FF.
[15:40] <postkaart> :)
[15:40] <alteroo> Didn't Suse patch it to use KDE dialogs and Buttons?
[15:40] <postkaart> I'm off, cya guys later.
[15:41] <Riddell> hi alteroo
[15:41] <JontheEchidna> at least the dialogs
[15:41] <alteroo> Riddell: Reporting
[15:41] <alteroo> Riddell: What this about updating the Webstie now?
[15:42] <Riddell> alteroo: what's what about updating the website?
[15:43] <alteroo> Riddell: You asked yesterday if I would update the website for the errors I noticed
[15:43] <_Sime> has anyone tried gnash lately?
[15:43] <Riddell> alteroo: oh, you had a different nick?
[15:43] <alteroo> Yes
[15:43] <alteroo> Jad
[15:43] <alteroo> _Sime: Set scaling to 0% instead of 100% ?
[15:43] <_Sime> alteroo: just use 100%.
[15:44] <_Sime> alteroo: I had 80% in there for some reason.
[15:44] <alteroo> It still looks funy
[15:44] <alteroo> The bottom half of all the checkboxes are cut off
[15:45] <_Sime> I had that problem, scaling fixed it.
[15:46] <alteroo> Hmmok let me try 80 % :)
[15:46] <Riddell> alteroo: if you would be able to update the FAQ that would be great, I can give you the current text if you want to edit it
[15:47] <Riddell> alteroo: http://people.canonical.com/~jriddell/tmp/faq
[15:47] <alteroo> Riddell: sure. email ?
[15:47] <Riddell> alteroo: that file there ^^
[15:47] <alteroo> ok Looking at it
[15:48]  * alteroo hugs kio :)
[15:49] <Riddell> ah, it's DasKreech.  well why didn't you say so
[15:49] <DasKreech> I was busy sorry
[15:49] <DasKreech> Installing Koala for a business
[15:50] <DasKreech> and the stupid intel driver was segfaulting the kernel
[15:51] <DasKreech> Glanced at the website and noticed that it was a bit out of date and dropped by to see if anyone had noticed it
[15:51] <DasKreech> Since I'm editing it anyone have anythign else they would like tosee in the FAQ?
[15:56] <DasKreech> Riddell: Any Release notes to link to?
[15:59] <Riddell> DasKreech: http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/910 has the known problems
[15:59] <DasKreech> Riddell: Thanks.
[16:00] <DasKreech> I noticed there are no Release notes/changelog linked from the main site
[16:01] <Riddell> http://www.kubuntu.org/news/9.10-release links to it
[16:04] <DasKreech> There is a KDE 3 Karmic Koala ! :-)
[16:04] <Riddell> it just won't go away
[16:04] <Riddell> probably something to put in the FAQ that
[16:05] <DasKreech> Ok I'll make an addition for that
[16:14] <ScottK> Speaking of which, Riddell, if kb9vqf has ported the KDE 3 KNM to NM 0.8, then isn't there some svn somewhere that should get the fixes?
[16:20] <Riddell> ScottK: I don't remember, it was mostly developed in novell's secret cave I think
[16:20] <ScottK> Riddell: OK.  We removed it, right?
[16:22] <Riddell> it's not in our archives
[16:22] <Riddell> it might be worth notifying kde-packager incase there are other distros using it
[16:22] <Riddell> kb9vqf: want me to do that?
[16:42] <DasKreech> Riddell: Take out Dapper?
[16:44] <Riddell> DasKreech: yes
[16:44] <Riddell> and hardy
[16:44] <Riddell> hi nookie^, I got a few comments about how pretty the banner is
[16:54] <nookie^> Riddell: im glad to hear that =))
[16:54] <nookie^> even thow it could be made alot better but it will be better next time i'll promess =)
[17:00] <DasKreech> Riddell: RIght click -> actions -> Edit as Root is going to come back in Dolphin ?
[17:05] <kb9vqf> Riddell, ScottK: The updated source is only in the PPA
[17:05] <kb9vqf> I would really like to apply my patches to mainline SVN, but haven't had the time yet
[17:06] <kb9vqf> If someone wants to extract the source from the PPA and put it into SVN, I would really appreciate it!
[17:27] <ScottK> DasKreech: I don't think so (edit as root).  If you want that, install Krusader.
[17:27] <ScottK> Who knows with policykit coming to KDE 4.4 though
[17:33] <DasKreech> ScottK: So I'll take it out of the FAQ then
[17:34] <DasKreech> kb9vqf: We are putting your work in the Kubuntu FAQ. Anything you want to say?
[17:34] <DasKreech> Does the KDE Site have any statement of Freedom?
[17:35] <ghostcube> hola karmic update 1,9 gigs :D
[17:38] <ScottK> DasKreech: The first words on http://kde.org/ are "Be free"
[17:44] <DasKreech> ScottK: Yes I know that I"m trying to highlight what that means :)
[17:44] <ghostcube> feel free sounds better or ?
[17:44] <DasKreech> ghostcube: SOunds like a harrasment suit :)
[17:45] <kb9vqf> DasKreech: That KDE3 will be maintained/developed for a long, long time? :)
[17:45]  * kb9vqf doesn't really know *what* to say
[17:46] <DasKreech> kb9vqf: I'm working that into it
[17:46] <ghostcube> i shoudlnt always install every app i never use again before i take update :D
[17:47] <ghostcube> would reduce my download rofl
[17:47] <kb9vqf> ghostcube: check for old Kernel versions
[17:47] <kb9vqf> easy way: dpkg -l | grep 2.6. | grep image
[17:47] <ghostcube> nah i doing update to karmic i have 1,9 gig to donwnload
[17:47] <ScottK> If you still want KDE3, there is a community maintained Kubuntu remix available ...
[17:47] <ghostcube> i think cause i have to many installed
[17:47] <ScottK> DasKreech: ^^
[17:49] <DasKreech> http://paste.ubuntu.com/305240/
[17:49] <DasKreech> REview please
[17:51] <kb9vqf> Grammar on "I miss KDE3 Why did it go away?" should be "I miss KDE3; why did it go away?" or "I miss KDE3--Why did it go away?"
[17:51] <JontheEchidna> either of the alternatives are acceptable, though I do like the first alternative
[17:52] <DasKreech> kb9vqf: Thanks
[17:52] <kb9vqf> There should also be a period after "KDE3 Remix for Kubuntu</a>" ;)
[17:52] <kb9vqf> Otherwise, good work!
[17:55] <DasKreech> http://paste.ubuntu.com/305243/
[17:55] <DasKreech> Any thing else people think should be mentioned in the FAQ?
[17:56] <DasKreech> There is a bit in there about gutsy I'm not sure if thats valuable to stay in there
[17:56]  * kb9vqf would guess it should be removed
[17:57] <Mamarok> Gutsy has reached it's EOL already IIRC
[17:57] <kb9vqf> Gutsy is not an LTS, so I think Mamarok is correct
[17:57] <DasKreech> Yeah I've taken out other references
[17:57] <DasKreech> !gutsy
[17:58] <DasKreech> !cookie
[17:58] <Mamarok> and Hardy was never LTS for Kubuntu neither
[17:58] <DasKreech> !hardy
[17:58] <Mamarok> only the Ubuntu parts
[17:58] <DasKreech> I still don't know what that means
[17:59] <Mamarok> well, kernel updates and such, but all things KDE not
[17:59] <DasKreech> But the gutsy section says that removing that file is not needed in Gutsy does that mean from Gutsy onwards?
[17:59] <Mamarok> which is normal, since Hardy was still KDE 3.5.10
[17:59] <DasKreech> I"m not sure about teh validity of that whole section
[17:59]  * Mamarok checks
[18:00] <DasKreech> Mamarok: Right but the servers are still up the files are still there peopel can keep using htem as long the hardy servers are up so it's kinda a strange statement I think
[18:00] <DasKreech> Does any of those Konqueror commands make sense now ?
[18:01] <DasKreech> That's a horribly structured sentence
[18:01] <Mamarok> DasKreech: well, the Kubuntu devs clearly stated that there is no support for Kubuntu in Hardy beyond the 18 months life
[18:02] <Mamarok> so in #kubuntu we do not support Hardy anymore and send people over to #ubuntu for system related stuff if they insist
[18:02] <DasKreech> Mamarok: I know that
[18:06] <DasKreech> can someone review http://www.kubuntu.org/faq#defaultkonq and let me know what should change?
[18:06] <DasKreech> Hmm I"ll add the release notes in the what's new section
[18:14] <DasKreech> Riddell: Ping
[18:20] <markey> hmm, can I safely get rid of PulseAudio?
[18:20] <markey> it's causing stuttering here
[18:20] <markey> and I have no need for it
[18:20] <Mamarok> you should be able to, normally
[18:21] <markey> Mamarok: last time I tried, I could not access my soundcard at all
[18:21] <markey> we'll see
[18:21] <markey> in the meantime I wish Poettering all the best. including herpes, ebola, and the pest
[18:21] <DasKreech> I don't have it installed
[18:22] <Mamarok> DasKreech: markey's soundcard dindn't work anymore on Karmic without Pulse...
[18:22] <DasKreech> Ouch
[18:22] <markey> maybe that's fixed now, lemme try
[18:22] <DasKreech> This video card won't work with the kernel
[18:22] <DasKreech> Cest la vie
[18:23] <markey> seems to work again :)
[18:23] <markey> goodbye PA, nice meeting you. send poettering greetings
[18:23] <Mamarok> markey: a good kick in the.... :)
[18:24] <markey> many people have issues with germans. after meeting poettering, I can see why that is :)
[18:24] <markey> giving us all a bad rep
[18:28] <Mamarok> DasKreech: please, no shouting, there is alredy too much noise in #k without it
[18:29] <DasKreech> Mamarok: Sorry :)
[18:29] <Mamarok> you know the rules
[18:35]  * DasKreech hugs Mamarok. See you later
[18:55] <DasKreech> Anyone knows about the Kubuntu Konqueror changes ?
[19:08] <yuriy> are there any anymore?
[19:09] <DasKreech> I don't think so I just need to know which ones are valid for the FAQ
[19:18] <ScottK> The Gutsy thing can go away, it was only relevant to KDE3.
[19:18] <ScottK> DasKreech: ^^
[19:19] <DasKreech> ScottK: as in the sentence before where it says Gutsy ?
[19:19] <DasKreech> So everythign before sudo cp
[19:20] <ScottK> DasKreech: Yeah, the one that starts "To get back to the default KDE profiles: ..."
[19:20] <ScottK> The Dolphin Tar and Zip one can go away too.
[19:21] <DasKreech> ScottK: Drat I just put that one in :-)
[19:21] <ScottK> Let me check for sure.
[19:21]  * ScottK consults the source
[19:23] <ScottK> DasKreech: Confirmed.  It can go.
[19:23] <ScottK> DasKreech: Can we say that we are a sibling of Ubuntu, not a derivative.
[19:24] <DasKreech> I don't know that's not my call
[19:25] <DasKreech> I don't have a problem with that other than we are more like a derivative than a sibling
[19:25] <ScottK> Mint is a derivative.
[19:25] <ScottK> We co-develop with Ubuntu, so derivative isn't really correct.
[19:25] <ScottK> Riddell: ^^^ What say you?
[19:26] <ScottK> Sure, we may be the younger sibling that gets beat up all the time, but we're still family
[19:28] <DasKreech> :-)
[20:32] <kittu> hey guys
[20:33] <kittu> this is kittu... jsut here to check if i can help u guys in Kubuntu
[20:35] <ScottK> kittu: We can always use help.  What are you interested in.
[20:36] <kittu> i am java developer..looks like that is not a required skill here
[20:36] <kittu> i have lil bit of web devlopment skills
[20:36] <kittu> i can help u guys im cleaning the kubuntu weh site
[20:36] <kittu> ^web
[20:37] <ScottK> kittu: We can use help on that.
[20:37] <kittu> cool
[20:37] <ScottK> kittu: ryanakca is our web master.  You should talk to him about what needs doing.
[20:37] <kittu> sure... 'll do that
[20:40] <kittu> do we guys use any CMS(like joomla, drupal) for our website?
[20:41] <ScottK> We do, but I don't remember what it is.
[20:42] <kittu> hmm..ok.
[20:48] <DasKreech> Drupal I think
[20:50] <DasKreech> Riddell: http://paste.ubuntu.com/305369/ you can decide on if the phrase derivative should be changed to sibling
[20:50] <DasKreech> kittu: Have you looked at the site?
[20:51] <kittu> yeah
[20:51] <kittu> its drupal based
[20:52] <DasKreech> Yes but I mean do you have any comments on it or the content?
[20:53] <kittu> it looks very basic
[20:53] <kittu> we can improve a lot
[20:54] <kittu> am more of a joomla guy.. let me install drupal on PC and play around
[20:54]  * DasKreech laughs. Ok what improvements :)
[20:54] <ScottK> kittu: Also we need a sub-site to showcase our new Netbook edition.
[20:54] <ScottK> That's an entire new project.
[20:55] <kittu> cool..
[20:55] <kittu> i can take that :)
[20:55] <DasKreech> That needs a subsite?
[20:55] <ScottK> DasKreech: Something we can use for marketing Kubuntu Netbook.
[20:56] <kittu> regd improvements : it looks like first website developed in college
[20:56] <ScottK> kittu: What we have now is https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Netbook
[20:56] <kittu> Kubuntu deserves better  than that :)
[20:56] <ScottK> kittu: If you google Kubuntu Netbook a bit you'll see there are videos on youtube and such.
[20:56] <ScottK> It'd be nice to be able to really showcase this new platform.
[20:57] <kittu> i have Kubuntu on my netbook..
[20:57] <ScottK> The netbook edition?
[20:57] <kittu> yes
[20:57] <ScottK> How do you find it?
[20:58] <DasKreech> kittu: Ok do a mockup and lets see it :)
[20:58] <kittu> its great.. can't just compete wit ubuntu yet..
[20:58] <kittu> sure DasKreech
[20:59] <ScottK> kittu: It's a start.  OK.  I need to run.  I'd like to discuss what you might help us with that could really show it off.
[20:59] <kittu> sure
[21:00] <ScottK> kittu: Please consider the use case of an OEM that is considering what OS to pre-install on their next netbook and we want them to see this site and want it.
[21:00] <kittu> hmm.. sure
[21:01] <ScottK> Great.  That's something we really need.
[21:01]  * ScottK runs off to drive kid #3 to ballet class.
[21:06] <_Sime> is there a tool for comparing apt's file/package database with the files on disk?
[21:22] <Quintasan> I see we have two sessions in OpenWeek :)
[21:42] <JontheEchidna> The "kdewallet has opened a wallet" Notification is so redundant. You already have a popup window asking for your password
[21:42] <JontheEchidna> plus it uses the term "kdewallet"
[21:44] <anpu> Hello, i was sent here to ask for some special problem i have after upgrading from 9.04 to 9.10
[21:45] <anpu> after upgrade (which had some errors), I dont see desktop, firefox and some other stuff on starting, send me to os login screen
[21:46] <anpu> and also while loading os, there should be 5 icons, i have only 3: hdd, settings and kmenu one
[21:46] <anpu> this is my xsession-errors http://pastebin.com/f1e3713dd
[21:47] <anpu> sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get install kubuntu-desktop && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade passed with no changes, like all is ok
[21:47] <anpu> anyone have idea wth is going on? :-)
[21:48] <DaSkreecH> JontheEchidna: But redundancy is wonderful :)
[21:49] <Quintasan> anpu: did you try moving or deleting .kde dir?
[21:49] <Quintasan> anpu: it will reset your settings but migh help
[21:50] <anpu> no i didnt yet, i ll do right now
[21:50] <DaSkreecH> anpu: rename it
[21:50] <DaSkreecH> dont' delete it
[21:50] <DaSkreecH> I see you have kontact and all your mail is inside .kde
[21:51] <anpu> oki i renamed to .kde_old
[21:51] <anpu> going to restart :)
[21:52] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: I'd file a bug on b.k.o
[21:55] <milovan> ok it did a trick
[21:55] <Quintasan> anpu: works?
[21:55] <anpu> at least on starting other programs, it doesnt redirect me to login
[21:56] <anpu> well, yeah, loaded all 5 icons and all seems ok, though still one program reporting crash
[21:57] <anpu> tried to send report but need to login to launchpad
[21:57] <anpu> anyway, thanks both Quintasan and DaSkreecH for help :)
[21:58] <Quintasan> anpu: you're welcome :)
[21:58] <Quintasan> hmm did that guy that wanted to help with documentation got here?
[21:58] <anpu> I just need to accept I m not lucky with upgrading ^^
[21:58] <Quintasan> You're not the only one :P
[21:59] <Quintasan> for me, each kde update == lol delete .kde
[21:59] <anpu> hehe
[21:59] <Quintasan> except for the minor ones :D
[21:59] <anpu> at least you knew the trick, i was always reinstalling all and loosing data :s
[22:00] <anpu> though now this time i made one /home partition :)
[22:00] <anpu> well, wont bother you much, thanks and bye ! :)
[22:01] <Quintasan> woah, that reminds me to install Konversation
[22:02] <JontheEchidna> that reminds me, Konversation 1.2 final needs a backport to 9.04
[22:02] <Quintasan> :D
[22:23] <ghostcube> ok update went fine
[22:23] <ghostcube> :)
[22:23] <ghostcube> good work guys
[22:46] <ScottK> Wonderful.  Another qt4-x11 security update on the way ....