[00:07] feel free to remove -r when niko or another staffer says its okay, otherwise we're going to get flooded with exploit msgs [00:07] yes [00:24] KB1JWQ: would you like me to flag you so the bots will 'test' you? [00:24] Pici: Ah, is that the trick? [00:25] yes, they don't do it unless it detects that the person lost connection during an attack, or if we tell it otherweise. [00:48] hi [00:48] topyli, when is the ban on ljl going to be lifted, is it a 24-hour ban? [00:49] ryaxnbuntu, i don't know. i will discuss this with him [00:49] ryanakca: we don't discuss individuals bans with others [00:49] ryaxnbuntu [00:49] ryanakca, is in this channel too [00:49] damn nick completion [00:49] he follows me everywhere ;) [00:49] see ya [00:51] for the record, ljl and i had a pm about other things like operator stuff in general. not relevant here. he asked me to ban him on -ot and i refused. he threatened to make me. i then did [00:51] err, wut? [00:53] I have the distinct impression this this whole thing could and should have been handled better [00:53] yes. [00:53] What's happenned? [00:53] Why couldn't he simply /part? [01:00] perhaps you can try to remove +r, bot seems to be less agressive [01:56] breunig's still banned in #u right? [01:56] s/eu/ue/ [01:57] yep [02:00] Maybe that's a wiser choice? [02:04] mhm. [02:07] Anyone able to enlighten me (in PM?) about LjL? [02:13] FloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:13] FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:13] FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:22] FloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:22] FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:22] FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:24] Howdy davidboy, how can we help you? [02:24] FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:24] FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:26] There's somebody in #ubuntu that keep sending me files. I haven't opened any of them. [02:26] davidboy: Yeah, we unfortunately can't deal with them until they do it. You can safely ignore those requests though. [02:27] I... believe there's a command you can do to have your client ignore them completely. I'm not sure what it is though. [02:27] davidboy: It is a bit annoying, check out http://blog.freenode.net/2009/11/dcc-spam-and-how-to-handle-it/ [02:28] Thanks [02:30] FloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:30] FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:30] FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:30] what is the array (etc etc) and why does it cause an insta-kline [02:36] FloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:36] FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:37] FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [02:37] bazhang: the nicks sending the array stuff are also the ones sending the exploit [02:38] it's probably a bug :p [02:38] tsimpson, ah thanks, got those blocked so no idea they were being sent [02:40] test me [02:40] ircNuser: you have already been tested [02:40] you can join #ubuntu [02:40] thanks [02:41] I'll try now that I changed freenode to 8001 [02:43] ooh, actually they can't with the +r [02:49] ubottu: tell KiLaHuRtZ about nickspam [02:54] cybercafe's let you reboot their computers? Not over here they don't [02:57] ah she is from Taiwan. No way is that right. [03:15] FloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [03:15] FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [03:15] FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [03:19] Fun. [03:19] FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [03:19] FloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [03:20] THe bots are very noisy. [03:20] Can we set +r and /remove them? [03:21] I mean, seriously, this could go on for a while. [03:21] FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [03:22] i think they've learnt their lesson now [03:27] In ubottu, IdleOne said: tequila is One tequila, two tequila, three tequila, FLOOR! [03:28] ubottu: tell IdleOne about scope [04:02] Flannel: oh lawd. [04:03] MenZa: my trigger finger's getting awfully itchy [04:03] Flannel: I had an /ar prepped for Phrea in case he'd continued. [04:03] I've had bad experiences with Phrea in the channel so many times now [04:03] Mhmm [04:03] chowder is, as far as I can tell, new to the game, but his persistence (and baiting) is annoying me. [04:05] and that crossed my boundary. [04:06] I'm not even sure what word fits with those asterisks, but seriously? [04:07] agreed [04:07] sometimes I consider introducing martial law in that channel [04:13] MenZa: as enjoyable as a fantasy that may be, no :) [04:16] heheh [04:16] I kid, I kid. [04:20] you think it's save to -r now? [04:20] *safe [04:20] I wouldn't. [04:22] so I got kicked from the offtopic channel for having an opinion [04:22] its quite obvious that the op that kicked me was biased [04:22] chowder: You got kicked after you continued the discussion after being asked to stop. [04:22] chowder: There is no "let me get the last word in" provision [04:22] I was asked to stop talking about drugs [04:22] and I did [04:22] the rest was me merely pointing out the fascist attitude in the channel [04:23] chowder: I also mentioned that this channel was the place you should go if you take issue to the policies of the ubuntu channels. #ubuntu-offtopic is not the proper venue for that sort of discussion. [04:23] so "in a nutshell" I was kicked for having an opinion [04:23] Claiming "fascism" would be sufficient on its own. [04:24] tonyyarusso: well what else do you call the suppression of free expression with right-wing overtones? [04:24] chowder: We have guidelines for the channel, if you don't like following them, that's fine, you're free to disregard them in other channels. Not in ubuntu channels. [04:24] chowder: The suppression of free expression part is known as "moderation in keeping with community guidelines". [04:25] someone got scolded for even mentioning drugs [04:25] and he was talking about prescription meds! [04:25] When IRC ops come to your house and kill your family, *then* you can claim fascism, but anything before that belittles the tragedy of people who have sufferred such things. [04:25] don't you think that's a bit extreme? [04:26] Fascism is extreme - that's the point. [04:26] tonyyarusso: don't talk to me about opression my family fled a country ruled by a totalitarian dictator. You know nothing. [04:26] Well then you can go complain about fascism wrt to your home country, but not IRC channels. The latter is ridiculous. [04:27] here's the deal, there are rules in #ubuntu-offtopic. if you wish to use the channel we require you to abide by those rules, if you don't then you'll be removed from the channel [04:27] I'm in the US [04:27] call it whatever you want, it's how it is [04:27] tsimpson: where in the rules does it state that I can be kicked for having differing political views than the ops do? [04:28] because that's the gist of what happened [04:28] discussion about drugs is against the rules [04:28] like I said, I stopped talking about drugs [04:28] continuing on the same vein is still discussing it [04:28] the last bit that was merely satirizing "the rules" themselves [04:28] even if you think you can "technically" get away with it [04:29] here's what I wrote: brb, I'll clog my arteries with fattening foods and destroy my liver with alcohol because its socially acceptable and I have no mind of my own [04:29] the intent was clear [04:29] I never mentioned drugs [04:29] That's just mocking the concept of having rules, which indicates you have no intent on following them and don't belong in the channel in the first place. [04:30] tonyyarusso: no, I was mocking the attitude of the channel [04:30] also, you may want to think twice about what you think other people's political views are - you clearly have no idea. [04:31] or maybe you should learn not to feed trolls [04:32] Did he just call himself a troll? [04:32] yeah.. he did.. [04:32] fun. [04:33] and j ust skimmin gback through backlog... [04:33] He's got some issues [04:35] -unregged is a testament to how few people actually read the topic [04:40] @mark #ubuntu-ops chowder Trolling [04:40] The operation succeeded. [04:49] after a bit of friendly clarification, Flannel/Dominian/tonyyarusso, I can inform you that he sees trolling as a 'social experiment' :P [04:50] (I spoke to him in a query) [04:50] MenZa: Social experiment or not, it's still trolling. [04:50] Yes, yes [04:51] I also told him that that was never acceptable, but if he refrained, he would always be welcomed back. [04:51] yeah he has to watch it.. violating network policy is never a good thing.. let a lone the chanenl policy [04:51] indeed [04:52] it's worth pointing out that he took some criticism to ##unmentionable-channel-here, which sparked me querying him to clarify the reason (and the points made in here). [04:52] yah [04:53] doesn't bother me at all, but I still felt it was worth a bit of my time [04:55] after all, what are you doing being an op if you can't take criticism? [05:03] insane? [05:03] or was that rhetorical [05:20] Alright.... i have been blocked from #ubuntu, being sent to #ubuntu-read-topic Is there a way i can fix this. I have been in the #ubuntu channel multiple times before and now i am being block.... [05:21] KindOne: read the topic in there and follow the instructions [05:22] Tried the port 8001, did not work... and i have read the topic and been to the site [05:23] if you are on port 8001, then type "test me" in #ubuntu-read-topic [05:28] http://paste.ubuntu.com/327363/ jussi01 this is to May16 2009 [05:28] all those set on my birthday [05:30] bazhang: do you want to preform a manual dcc test on KindOne? the bots won't do it while in emergency mode [05:30] because of the continuing netsplit [05:31] tsimpson, send him a dcc in that channel ? [05:31] just in /msg [05:31] test me [05:32] just offered him something via dcc [05:33] its at 0% [05:33] bazhang: you need to make sure it's IP and port 0 [05:33] *both 0 [05:34] alright... it failed.... [05:35] tsimpson, they were all on 0 [05:35] KindOne: you seem to have passed [05:36] bazhang: can you remove the forward then please? [05:37] KindOne, you are in [05:37] alright, thanks, im in the #ubuntu channel now [05:39] will this issue happen again though ? [05:39] are you on port 8001 ? [05:40] yes [05:41] then it won't happen again [05:41] just stick to port 8001 [05:41] alright thanks === vorian_ is now known as vorian [06:35] Sorry tonyyarusso, we're definitely aware of it though. [06:37] Pricey: good to know, but I was pretty sure you must be by now :P [07:55] Anyone know what's up with WilliamBuell and Hekos? [08:01] good morning === dholbach_ is now known as dholbach [08:19] Flannel: what you mean? [08:19] They were having a little spat, and I was asking for a cliffnotes version of the backlog, but I skimmed it. [08:20] ok [08:20] Flannel: what I know is williambuell is bit new in irc and linux, and has/had broken system so might be bit edgy [08:20] Yeah, Hekos was being rude and standoffish [08:21] oh that's not nice [08:21] No, and I regret not checking in on the channel for so long, as something ought to have been done about ten minutes before I saw anything. [08:44] * MenZa hugs Flannel [08:45] Flannel: which channel this was? [08:45] Tm_T: -ot [08:46] u-ot ok [10:02] oh dear lord [10:02] what on earth... [10:02] What? [10:03] Flannel: -ot [10:14] * Flannel grumbles at Hekos. [10:28] Bacta: How can we help you? [10:28] Any news on my bans? [10:30] Hm, I can't find your bans [10:30] Bacta, they are still in place. [10:36] Bacta, its less than a day since you last checked, nothing has changed. [10:36] I guess I'll have to stick to #ubuntu-vn then [10:36] And get technical help for all my problems in broken Vietnamese [10:40] Bacta: hello [10:40] Bacta: is there not a NewZeland Loco ? [10:40] Hello ikonia [10:40] Did you just come here? [10:40] just woke up yes [10:40] holy hell there is [10:40] i never noticed [10:40] (I mean woke up on IRC, not woke up) [10:41] It sucks having to wake up twice in one day doesn't it [10:41] Bacta: as I said yesterday in pm to you, we are discussing ways to move your ban's forward [10:41] #ubuntu-nz [10:41] Yep, am in there now [10:42] Bacta: as I said, you've not been forgot about we are trying to resolve this with you [10:47] Bacta: we'll get back to you as soon as a way forward has been found, but feel please feel free to ask for an update [10:47] Sure [10:47] thank you [10:47] ok [11:33] #ubuntu-advanced is being claimed by roronoa and dijmen as being a support channel. [11:34] never heard of such channel [11:37] friendishan aka roronoa and dijmen just made it up on a lark, less than five minutes ago [11:38] hmmm, I don't like this [11:38] it was registered by someone, but it's not official [11:38] it's not a channel we use or plan to use anyway [11:39] I'm in their trying to explain, but they won't listen. Am going to depart now. [11:39] err there [11:40] jussi01: ^ [11:41] bazhang: exactly. so it will become official soon. [11:41] official by who? [11:41] check out: /msg chanserv info #ubuntu-advanced [11:41] he thinks because it's already registered we plan to use it [11:41] ;) [11:41] heh [11:42] can't you set mlock +m ;) [11:42] haha [11:42] and +if #ubuntu while you're at it [11:42] or ##unavailable [11:49] let's create and promote #ubuntu-advanced [11:49] for what? [11:50] for advanced support because there are too many users with too many easy questions that flood #ubuntu [11:50] dijmen: this splitting of #ubuntu has been discussed many times [11:51] and what are some of the main conclusions? [11:51] not to do it. [11:51] it's splitting community, time and resources, not worth it [11:52] one more channel people should know and use and... there's channels more than enough already [11:52] bazhang: oh, you're here too. I didn't see you. I hope you're not talking this like I'm trying to push it without your agreement. [11:52] dijmen: heh, you can't push this (: [11:52] dijmen, not my decision. Just informing you. [11:53] I can "try to push", as I said :) [11:53] bazhang: I see [11:53] no. [11:53] dijmen: see also bug #392799 [11:53] Launchpad bug 392799 in ubuntu-community "#ubuntu too noisy to be useful" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/392799 [11:53] dijmen, as I said in that channel, don't advertise other channels in #ubuntu [11:54] bazhang: I got that. I meant "try to push" *here* (#ubuntu-ops) this time. [11:55] this bug reflects my report very well [11:55] dijmen: you can't push this, it's not gonna happen, atleast not this time until there's really big reasons [11:55] Tm_T: there's even a german version of #ubuntu, so I thought my proposal would be very acceptable [11:57] dijmen: the are many different local channels [11:58] dijmen: However an advanced/basic segmentation is very hard to implement, and we have decided not to do so at this time. [11:58] jussi01: yes, this is my point, and no #ubuntu-advanced, which would be useful [11:58] jussi01: why is it hard? (just asking) [11:59] dijmen: it is much beeter for advanced issues to be dealt with either in #ubuntu or in the channel for the actual app in question. [11:59] dijmen: well lets start at the basics: how do you define advanced? [12:00] (theres a lot more to it than that, but lets start there) [12:01] jussi01: your question is not a good approach, so I can understand why it's hard to implement. advanced can be defined subjectively, which will create some polarization between the two channels. in addition, I guess it's very easy to say "try #ubuntu". [12:01] dijmen: also, if you really want to talk to us about this issue, please go and read that bug. After you have done that, then we can continue a discussion. [12:01] and "try #ubuntu-advanced" [12:01] dijmen: easy to helper, or easy for the person who is looking for help? and is not familiar with IRC ? [12:02] at least it's much easier than forcing a newbie-izing interpretation on most of my questions [12:02] Tm_T: people not familiar with IRC will never know about the existence of this channel [12:03] dijmen: and they don't have advanced questions then? [12:03] jussi01: OK, I'm reading it [12:03] "all my questions are advanced" :) [12:04] Tm_T: lol, how can a newbie have advanced questions? [12:04] Tm_T: it's not the question that decides what's advanced and what's not! [12:04] Tm_T: this is chat, not specifications database [12:05] definitions are user-centric, not data-centered [12:05] dijmen: please go and read the bug and the comments therein, after you have done so, we can entertain a discussion with you. [12:05] Tm_T: plus, as bazhang says! [12:07] So what you're saying is you want a channel for all the smarter folks to hang out and help enough other so they don't have to deal with #ubuntu anymore [12:07] s/enough other/each other/ [12:07] * Amaranth just woke up [12:07] whenever there is an "advanced" button or tab in an user interface, every user instantly becomes "advanced" [12:07] I was kidding btw. [12:07] Amaranth: give him a chance to read the bug please [12:08] and lets not all jump in and overwhelm him ;) [12:08] jussi01: you should have visited my channel when we were still two members. like this you got the wrong first impression. [12:08] topyli: I didn't know about this tendency [12:09] i would call it "topyli's law" but there already is a topyli's law about something else :) [12:09] hehe [12:09] topyli: law #2 then [12:10] dijmen, it's only half-serious really [12:10] or was it #543 [12:10] 'try a different app' is #1 [12:10] yeah [12:10] "when a user asks for help with $app on an irc channel, another user will immediately suggest switching to $another_app" [12:11] Amaranth: it's not about being smart, it's about having different methods. just like some germans prefer to use a german language channel. [12:12] topyli: that's only in ubuntu and other open source distributions. in windows it's "reinstall windows". [12:12] dijmen: As you can see, we have put a great deal of thought into this, and we'd appreciate you read those thoughts and then come back to us - or even better, record your ideas on the bug. I get notified everytime someoneadds to it, and I read every comment. [12:13] jussi01: thank you [12:13] dijmen: But the only people I can ever imagine being in #ubuntu-advanced are the exact people we would want helping in #ubuntu [12:13] Which is mentioned somewhere in that bug report, iirc [12:13] Amaranth: well, that's a good point [12:13] Amaranth: so there are practical reasons [12:14] I can understand that [12:14] I, at least, never worry about splitting the community but rather splitting the available helpers [12:14] If I'm in #ubuntu and you're in #ubuntu-overflow1 I'm not going to see you asking for help with compiz [12:15] So you'll eventually end up with people channel hopping through all the support channels asking for help just like they hop through all the non-support channels doing it now [12:16] Amaranth: makes sense to me. however, I'd still give it a three months' try [12:16] #python did (mentioned in that bug as a success story for some reason) but they changed back to a single channel due to these problems [12:17] sometimes testing surprises us. especially as "-advanced" is not just "yet another ubuntu channel". [12:17] The real problem is IRC doesn't scale but people are too impatient to use the forums [12:18] I wonder why it doesn't scale [12:18] you python example is quite convincing [12:19] (I'm still not sure it works for 1000+ member channels. too large channels are meant to be split.) [12:20] Well there is some risk that we'll destroy #ubuntu [12:20] of 800 remaining newbies and quasi-newbies, they will always know the answer to each other's questions :) [12:20] and it's actually usually not much busier then it was back when we had 500 people [12:20] Amaranth: I agree. I feel proud too that it's so big :) [12:21] It's just that everyone idles there and the people active tend to come and go in shifts [12:21] I didn't notice that [12:22] IMHO we need to be funneling people to loco (support) channels for support, not "advanced" or "newbie" etc. [12:22] Perhaps [12:22] jussi01: why loco? [12:22] jussi01: indeed, many times people need help with their native language as they struggle with english [12:22] Although most of the loco channels seem to be like specialized versions of this channel plus offtopic, rather than a place for support [12:22] disagree [12:23] bazhang: to what? [12:23] And just because I'm in the US doesn't mean someone in France can't help me or get help from me :) [12:23] #ubuntu-tw / #ubuntu-cn are terrible support channels [12:23] bazhang: hmmm, that doesn't mean others are [12:24] bazhang: and how they're bad? [12:24] Tm_T, true [12:24] Amaranth: sure, but using the language you're familiar with does help (: [12:24] Tm_T, more like botwar channels [12:25] bazhang: that has to be dealt with then somehow [12:26] next time I agree to take ops in a loco , I will ask for concessions [12:27] for example finnish channels are reasonably good for support [12:27] well, as 80% of core ops are Finnish, no surprise :) [12:28] bazhang: yeah, #ubuntu is lovely finnish loco channel (;) [12:28] hehe [12:28] this is because torvalds (the creator of the linux kernel, and implicitly of ubuntu) is finnish [12:28] dijmen: no, not really [12:29] dijmen: there's plenty of other linux channels that are not friendly at all, or helpful [12:29] it's more of Ubuntu community and CoC [12:29] and few active ones pushing it [12:43] dijmen, when you ssh to irssi on your linux server and chat, it's the ultimate finnish experience .) [12:44] topyli: using gsm-network? [12:45] yeah, through your nokia phone [12:51] Amaranth: just got back. My vision is that the locos take an active role in doing support and helping users on IRC, as they do IRL. This doesnt mean #ubuntu would disappear, but would be like a melting pot of all of them. [13:09] brb [13:56] FloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [13:56] FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [13:56] FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [13:56] bots attack again [13:57] yes [14:14] FloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [14:14] FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [14:14] FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [14:14] again ???? [14:19] yes, perhaps time for a +r ... [14:31] seems to have stopped now [14:53] a little yes [14:53] shhh [14:58] * genii makes another pot of coffee [15:06] * ikonia has just been promoted to DNS god after implimenting the most over complex DNS system on the planet [15:10] * genii makes a golden statue of ikonia and sacrifices old Blade servers to it [15:13] warrented [15:48] genii: what a waste of good iron [15:49] MS-Maco. The new product from Microsoft. [15:50] ooo [15:50] oh shush you [15:50] X broke [15:51] ughhh another attack [15:51] ahhh gentoo, not us [15:52] Pici: never said "thanks" for the heavy lifting you did during UDS IRC discussions. so ... "thanks!" [15:55] check out the muscle man ! [15:56] what lifting? [15:56] his brain [15:56] mneptok: :) [15:56] lifting brains... [15:57] he's got a big brain to lift you know [15:57] check out his python skills [15:57] Fetch me a brain igor! [15:57] yes master.............. [15:57] hehe, i just realised that i read igor as eye gor now [16:00] ... its from young Frankenstein :( [16:30] ok X didnt break. kdm broke. [16:30] (its my fault, of course) [16:30] (copying /etc from an amd64 system to an i386 system is apparently a bad idea) [16:31] maco: I broke kdm a couple weeks ago trying to get it to do fingerprint auth, locked myself out pretty badly [16:40] aww [16:47] uberspaced called the ops in #ubuntu (ban i-hate-freenode) [16:49] genii: ive stumped Riddell [16:49] i guess that counts for something [16:50] FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [16:50] FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [16:50] FloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [16:50] FloodBot4 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [16:52] FloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit) [16:55] And so it begins again. [16:59] dinda called the ops in #ubuntu-women () [17:01] looks like trudell is banevading [17:01] again? [17:01]