/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2009/12/01/#kubuntu-devel.txt

* ScottK hands dtchen http://www.spamcop.net/anonsignup.shtml00:41
=== blueyed_ is now known as blueyed
JontheEchidnaRiddell: typo on blog: "On bug triage we'll not use DrKonqi for upstream" <- should be apport00:57
dtchenor just remove the "'ll not " part00:58
JontheEchidnaor at least then the next sentence would make sense, and it would be in agreement with the current spec :P00:58
JontheEchidnaoh, that would work too00:58
JontheEchidnas/out/our in that same sentence01:00
=== jjesse_ is now known as jjesse
Lex79ScottK: spell checking doesn't work in 4.3.4 and I think in 4.3.3, I don't remember if worked before 4.3.301:06
ScottKLex79: It's working here with 4.3.2.01:19
ScottKSo this is a regression we'd need to deal with before 4.3.3/4 could go into karmic-updates.01:19
ScottKAlso, our updates policy is on the tech board agenda for tomorrow.  Will anyone be able to be there?01:23
* ScottK is a maybe.01:23
=== jtisme is now known as jtholmes
shtylmansomething for the blogs :) http://www.shtylman.com/archives/15403:25
ScottKshtylman: Why are you not on planet.ubuntu.com?03:38
shtylmanScottK: cause I don't always blog about ubuntu stuff03:51
ScottKshtylman: You can make a catagory for Ubuntu and only have that go to p.u.c.03:51
shtylmanand i probly don't blog enough in general :)03:51
shtylmaninteresting...didn't know that03:52
ScottKshtylman: See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PlanetUbuntu "Separating Your Content"03:53
shtylmanScottK: should I talk to someone about that? is it worth posting such stuff there?03:53
ScottKshtylman: The page I just linked you to tells everything you need to add yourself.03:53
ScottKshtylman: And yes, I think it is.03:53
shtylmank... I will look at that. Thanks03:54
ScottKNo problem.03:55
nixternalapachelogger: ok, I give up on rewriting khc....man that bad boy would take some engineering work just to make since of the shit it is already04:23
nixternalok, is there something needing packaging? my eyes are burning from c++ right now04:34
nixternalqt3toqt4 can make a mess of stuff04:34
nixternalholy shit!!! so, the wonderful backend to khc is....well....quite a bit of perl thanks to htdig, htsearch, and the meinproc scripts04:35
* nixternal faints04:35
ScottKnixternal: Is Qt 4.6.0 final out yet?04:36
ScottKnixternal: There's also the shared ontologies we'll need for 4.4.04:36
nixternalbah ontologies! i have read the nepomuk docs so much, that I am an ontologist :p04:38
* nixternal hopes ontologist doesn't mean some funky ass doctor for dinosaurs or something04:38
ScottKI think it's birds, not dinosaurs.04:39
ScottKnixternal: There's also an open ITP for the ontologies in Debian, so maybe there's something in their svn.04:39
nixternalQt 4.6 RC's yet04:43
ScottKThen I think shared ontologies and any other new crap we need for 4.4 is the highest priority.04:46
nixternal# DCMI liability, trademark/service mark, document use and  software licensing rules apply.04:49
nixternalwtf kind of licensing shit is that? that is in the ontologies .trig files04:49
ScottKnixternal: Where can I grab the whole file to look at?04:50
nixternalhttp://sourceforge.net/projects/oscaf/files/04:50
ScottKThanks.  Looking04:50
nixternalScottK: all of the subdirectories except for base/ are fine04:52
* ScottK didn't see it in tmo04:52
nixternalthe .trig files in base/ have a weird, non-dfsg copyright comment04:52
nixternalbase/ is the only place I saw it04:53
* ScottK tries again04:53
nixternal# All Rights Reserved.04:53
nixternal# W3C liability, trademark, document use and software licensing rules apply.04:53
nixternal# For more information see http://www.w3.org/TR/rdf-syntax-grammar/04:53
ScottKI read your comment backwards04:53
nixternalthere is another license deal in the rdfs.trig file04:53
nixternalthose schemas would be better served remotely imho, like xml, html, docbook, and kparts xml gui stuff is04:55
ScottKSome of this doesn't look good.04:59
nixternalthere, asked pusling since he did the ITP on it04:59
ScottKSInce KDE 4.4 depends on this, it's important to scream loudly and quickly if it's a problem.05:00
nixternal'All Rights Reserved' is non-dsfg last I remember05:00
ScottKWell if it's that and a license, that's generally interpreted as "All other rights reserved".05:01
ScottKnixternal: Some of http://dublincore.org/about/copyright/ is clearly non-free.05:02
ScottKIt doesn't appear that all of that directory falls under the CC stuff listed on that page and we'd still need a copy in that tarball in any case.05:02
nixternalRDF and XML schemas that are made available on the DCMI Web site (see http://dublincore/schemas/) are licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 License.05:04
nixternalthat is under copyright on their site05:04
ScottKYes, is everything in that directory RDF or XML schemas?05:05
nixternal.trig files are the schemas05:05
nixternalusually you never see these things, as they are hosted on a public server, and when you are using the schema, you just call it like you do with xml05:06
ScottKRight, but, for example, is dcterms.trig RDF?  It's not XML.05:06
nixternalrdf05:08
nixternalrdf:type05:08
nixternalthat gives it away, if it were xml, then it would be 'xml:type'05:08
nixternalif there were such a thing for xml of course05:08
ScottKSo they've even got the license in the tarball.05:09
ScottKThey just don't say what license applies to those files.05:09
ScottKIt's still reject material, but close.05:09
ScottKTime for me to call it a night. Good luck.05:12
nixternalhrmm, it seems the ontologies that aren't under base/ were in kdebase-runtime-data for <4.405:33
=== dendrobates is now known as dendro-afk
ghostcube=\08:32
ghostcubeups08:32
ghostcubeO/08:32
ghostcubehehe08:32
amichairghostcube: everything alright?08:32
ghostcubenah my keyboard has some probs :D mayxbe i should turn on a light before typing08:32
amichairmayxbe you should :-)08:33
ghostcubeoh yeah08:33
ghostcube:)08:33
amichairwhat is the deadline by which all bugs for LTS must be closed (and/or transferred upstream)?09:23
tsimpsonthere is no deadline for that, as such09:24
tsimpsonbugs can be fixed right up until release09:25
amichairisn't LTS supposed to be more stable than that?09:25
macono09:25
macoit just gets updates longer09:26
macothats all LTS means09:26
tsimpsonwhat's the point of an LTS if bugs can't be fixed? ;)09:26
amichairoh, I thought it meant there's an effort to make it more stable09:26
tsimpsonsure there is09:26
amichair(becaues u have to pay a longer price if not :-) )09:27
tsimpsonfixing bugs is part of that09:27
macodue to people whining about it not being stable enough with hardy.... yeah, we're syncing from Testing instead of Unstable this time, so everything gets TEN WHOLE DAYS more testing time before reaching ubuntu09:27
* maco giggle09:27
tsimpsonyou'll find fewer new "features" in an LTS, so "real bugs" get more attention09:28
macobut in all seriousness, the crazy unstable new features were put in 9.10 to get better testing before 10.0409:28
amichairand what about the timelord move-everything-to-upstream thing?09:29
macoits not move to upstream09:30
macoits dont-have-bugs-filed-in-lp-to-begin-with09:30
macoapport-kde being turned off for kde apps and just let DrKonqi handle it09:30
tsimpsonKDE bugs should really go to KDE09:30
amichairno initial cleanup phase? what about the existing 1700 open issues?09:31
macono idea09:31
tsimpsonif you want to review them, be my guest :)09:32
tsimpsonwe do need to look at them and upstream as necessary, but it's a man-power issue mostly09:32
amichairI actually thought of proposing a bug-week sprint or something... with a little concentrated effort, the list can be thinned down greatly09:33
amichairit looks like there's less than 10 issues opened every day, so bug maintenance barely sounds like a resource problem09:34
tsimpsonit's not just the number that's reported every day, it's updating/maintaining the bugs which are already there09:35
amichairwhat does that include? isn't it mostly about syncing with upstream bug reports?09:36
tsimpsondepends on the bug, but also getting more information also09:37
tsimpsonand determining if it is an upstream bug, or one we or debian introduced09:38
amichairso basically now the folks at kde will do that for us? how will kubuntu-specific bugs reach us?09:39
tsimpsonthey'll probably tell the reporter "this is an issue with kubuntu, report to them" or similar09:40
tsimpsonbut most of the bugs will be for KDE, rather than us09:40
amichairhopefully. otherwise, they'll just get lost in the process, and kubuntu quality will suffer09:40
tsimpsonthe only issue will be that the line numbers in the backtrace (if it's a good backtrace) will not always match their source09:41
tsimpsondue to patches09:41
* jussi01 wishes for more kde bugtracker <-> Launchpad integration09:43
macooh oh lp people showed magic at uds!09:44
macomozilla has this plugin installed so that their bugtracker info and comments can be pulled into lp and comments to their bts can be made from lp09:44
amichairmaco: ?09:44
amichairany chance of getting that to work with kde?09:46
amichairis anyone here familiar with the jocket/dbus code?10:00
amichairs/jocket/jockey/10:00
macoamichair: convince kde to install the plugin10:01
jussi01so who do we know from that part of KDE? seriously, it would make both our lives and theirs much easier.10:07
* jussi01 hugs Nightrose11:56
* Nightrose hugs jussi01 back even if he doesn't want to give her a pony11:56
Nightroseor let her skip dezember11:57
jussi01Nightrose: I event thought of changing this factoid for you :P11:59
jussi01!pony-#ubuntu-offtopic12:00
ubottuNo, you can't have a pony. Much less so when you're gord12:00
Nightrose:D12:00
apacheloggernixternal: yeah, khc is the ugly12:45
dpmMamarok, thanks for forwarding the e-mail on documentation translation to kubuntu-devel@13:29
rgreeningy6a, second that :P13:40
rgreenings/y6a/ya13:40
Mamarokdpm: you are welcome, I was just surprised it as not in there :)13:57
EagleScreenwhat thing run KDM during bootup in karmic? it is not in rc system!14:01
gastlyhello14:19
Lex79sebas: where is libattica tarball?14:35
sebasLex79: there is none, as far as I know14:40
sebasyou 'll have to grab it from kdesupport14:40
JontheEchidnaooh... does this mean ktown has 4.4 beta tars?14:41
Lex79good :)14:41
Lex79JontheEchidna: wake up ! :)14:42
JontheEchidnaI woke up an hour ago but I had to rebuild my local copy of konversation due to the qt 4.6 BIC crap14:44
Lex79I'm building 4.6 final release , I almost finished14:46
JontheEchidnanice14:46
yuriyI don't kno what this means, but I can be Kubuntu contact for MA team14:50
yuriy*Massachusetts14:50
ScottKIt means more work, but no extra pay.  Just like most promotions.14:54
ghostcube4.6 QT final o.O15:03
tsimpsons/QT/Qt/ :)15:05
rgreeningyay Qt 4.615:13
* apachelogger is wondering whats with ghostcube and quick time all the time :P15:13
mcascan anyone tell me where the kde sc 4.3.4 packages will be located?15:16
neversfeldemcas: normally bugfix releases of KDE should go to the updates ppa15:19
neversfelde"Updates for Kubuntu releases which are due to go to Ubuntu Updates. Mostly KDE point releases."15:19
mcasthx15:19
ghostcubeapachelogger: who cares about quicktime :D so i just use it for Qt15:24
ghostcubelöl15:24
apacheloggeryou use quick time for Qt?15:24
apacheloggernow that is all messed up15:24
ghostcubelol nah i use QT for Qt15:25
ghostcube:P15:25
ghostcubebut i try to use Qt from now on :)15:25
DaskreechHooray KDE 4.4 today!15:38
apacheloggerKDE SC 4.4!!!!15:40
ScottKApparenatly Daskreech didn't get the memo15:42
Daskreechno I was talking about the release of the new community15:44
* Daskreech flees15:44
apacheloggernu community :D15:58
apacheloggerthem KDE people cant get any fancier15:58
Tm_Tapachelogger: except more fluff into hats15:59
apacheloggermore fluff is always possible15:59
JontheEchidnalibattica is a nice, quick compile16:01
Tm_TI'm still bit confused what it is used for16:01
=== dendro-afk is now known as dendrobates
=== dendrobates is now known as dendro-afk
JontheEchidnahttp://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/libattica <- revu please16:32
JontheEchidnawhoops, forgot to delete the homepage link from the package I ripped the packaging from16:33
ScottKJontheEchidna: Short description should follow "libattica0 is a ...."  Current phrasing is a bit awkward (for both binaries)16:41
=== yofel_ is now known as yofel
ScottKJontheEchidna: Why not use the dh7 short rules and build --with-kde and drop CDBS?16:43
JontheEchidnaall the reasons I had seem to not make sense now, lol16:45
JontheEchidna"libattica0 is a library for..." <- like that?16:46
ScottKYeah.  Pretty much.16:47
Lex79KDE 4.3.4 is ready in kubuntu-ppa/staging16:49
Daskreechhttp://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/112210/index.html16:52
ghostcubeLex79: wohooo16:54
ghostcubewill dl it later16:54
Lex79;)16:54
ghostcube:)16:55
Quintasanyay packaging!17:00
QuintasanScottK: Does the archive reorg means I should apply for Kubuntu Dev rather than MOTU?17:01
ScottKQuintasan: Probably.17:01
jjesseis there a good link explaining the archive reorg?  just trying to stay up to date17:03
JontheEchidnaScottK: were those the only problems with the package? (I've corrected both of them with the latest upload)17:04
QuintasanJontheEchidna: hmm forgot to ask, did you upload recorditnow?17:04
JontheEchidnaQuintasan: yeah. It's sitting in new queue17:04
ScottKJontheEchidna: Sorry.  Got distracted.17:04
QuintasanJontheEchidna: Thanks!17:05
JontheEchidnaQuintasan: no prob17:05
ScottKJontheEchidna: Since it's LGPL 2 or later, it's slightly better to link to the unversioned LGPL in common licenses.17:08
ScottKJontheEchidna: I: libattica source: binary-control-field-duplicates-source field "section" in package libattica017:10
JontheEchidnahmm. I gave the libattica source package the section of libs and then gave libattica0 the section of libs17:11
JontheEchidnathat means i don't have to give libattica0 a section?17:11
=== steveire_ is now known as steveire
ScottKJontheEchidna: Exactly.  It's inherited from the source, so you only need to specify if it's different.17:12
JontheEchidnacool beans17:15
ScottKI'm building it now.  Need to run off for a bit.17:15
Quintasan!package lucid python-kde417:19
ubottuError: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)17:19
Quintasan!package python-kde417:19
Quintasan:/17:19
Quintasan!package kdebindings17:19
Daskreechquestion does Kubuntu maintain the Qt packages ?17:19
DaskreechIsn't Qt part of the freedesktopspec ?17:20
claydohDaskreech: nice run down memory lane :) surprising how the (non)issues in that sort of article *still* come up in rants a year later17:20
DaskreechYeah I was looking at it and going Wow I remember when people thought these were valid issues17:21
DaskreechPeople still say they are but I really don't know what they base it on17:21
Daskreechwell perhaps Konqueror using dolphinpart17:21
DaskreechOther than that17:21
Tm_T!info python-kde417:27
ubottupython-kde4 (source: kdebindings): Python bindings for the KDE 4 libraries. In component main, is optional. Version 4:4.3.2-0ubuntu4.1 (karmic), package size 2492 kB, installed size 19484 kB17:27
Tm_TQuintasan: see (:17:27
Tm_T!bot > Quintasan17:27
ubottuQuintasan, please see my private message17:27
QuintasanTm_T: thanks17:30
Tm_Tnp (:17:38
DaskreechWhy is KDE good for Govt?17:45
DaskreechOr I suppose why is Kubuntu good for Govt17:46
ScottKJontheEchidna: build-dep on debhelper needs to be at least 7.0.50 to use --with.17:47
ScottKDaskreech: I bet Tonio_ knows how to answer that.17:47
nixternalScottK: the packaging for shared-desktop-ontologies couldn't be any easier with the whole '%: dh $@'...just want some feedback pertaining to the licensing and waiting to see what Debian does17:48
ScottKnixternal: Excellent.17:48
JontheEchidnanixternal: oh.. you were working on shared-desktop-ontologies?17:48
ScottKnixternal: We need to have it say in the tarball what the license is.17:48
nixternalJontheEchidna: just looked at it....the licensing is bogus in it17:48
ScottKnixternal: I'd accept a repacked tarball that added a copy of the web page that explains it (I think)17:49
JontheEchidnayeah, it's a weird "either CC-By or BSD"17:49
ScottKThose aren't the problem.17:49
Tonio_ScottK, Daskreech ? :)17:49
nixternalJontheEchidna: no, there are some license headers in base/ that say 'All Rights Reserved'17:49
JontheEchidnaah, yeah17:49
JontheEchidnayou can't exactly reserve all rights like that17:49
Tonio_Daskreech: I can respond to this indeed, at least why I consider kde a better choice than gnome on that point17:50
nixternalbut if you go to the website like the headers say and look, then those files are both BSD and CC-By-SA17:50
Tonio_Daskreech: feel free to ask :) the response might be long, so better go with e-mail for this17:50
JontheEchidnaHere's what I had for debian/copyright: http://paste.ubuntu.com/332482/17:50
JontheEchidnaI hadn't really gotten to the actual packaging yet17:51
JontheEchidnahttp://bugs.debian.org/44802817:51
JontheEchidnaer17:51
JontheEchidnahttp://bugs.debian.org/55802817:51
ScottKJontheEchidna: libattica0: non-dev-pkg-with-shlib-symlink usr/lib/libattica.so.0.1.0 usr/lib/libattica.so17:52
ScottKA symbols file would be nice.17:52
JontheEchidnaWhat are symbols files for/how do I make one?17:52
nixternalScottK: instead of repacking the tarball couldn't we add the info for now to the copyright file, that way there syncs will be easier with Debian when they get theirs out?17:54
nixternalor add an extra LICENSE.base.trig or something under debian/?17:55
ScottKnixternal: No.  The upstream licensing information needs to be complete in the upstream tarball.17:55
nixternalwell that sucks17:55
ScottKHowever you could repack it with a ~repack version so the debian one would be higher17:55
nixternaltrue17:56
* Quintasan|Szel wonders why ssh doesnt work for him17:56
nixternalnow, what to call that file, LICENSE.base.trig work for you?17:56
ScottKSure.  Be sure to explain where you got the file and why it's there17:57
ScottKJontheEchidna: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/stefanlsd/dpkg-gensymbols17:57
JontheEchidnathanks17:57
ScottKThat's all I have.17:58
Quintasan|SzelJontheEchidna: gah, I forgot to add myself to wiki, mind adding me as Dep-wait for kdeplasma-addons and kdenetwork?17:59
JontheEchidnaQuintasan|Szel: sure17:59
Quintasan|Szeluploading kdegames will be a pita :/17:59
Quintasan|SzelJontheEchidna: thanks17:59
* ScottK is off for several hours now.18:02
DaskreechTonio_: skreech2@gmail.com18:04
DaskreechTonio_: Unless you want to go -offtopic18:05
Tonio_Daskreech: I get the email :)18:06
DaskreechTonio_: Ok As long as you didn't have a canned response sitting waiting for this inquiry :-D18:09
rgreeningQuintasan|Szel: why will games be a pita?18:09
Daskreech./convincegovt.sh | mail18:09
Tonio_Daskreech: nah ;)18:10
Tonio_Daskreech: this'll be my opinion18:10
DaskreechOpinions are as welcome as patches18:11
Quintasan|Szelrgreening: 60 mbs on my connection will take at least 1 hour18:12
Quintasan|Szelupload ofc18:12
nixternalScottK: actually, there needs to be 2 extra licenses added...the rdf*.trig are W3C licensed18:13
nixternalThis folder contains external ontologies that are not developed by the OSCAF project18:13
nixternalbut are necessary as basis for others.18:13
nixternalglad I didn't look at the README last night...how I missed that one is beyond me18:14
=== rmblr is now known as ramblurr
JontheEchidna[12:32:49] <notmart> dimsuz: and beware there is another bic change in qhash since the rc so gigantic total rebuild again, yay :p18:16
JontheEchidnadammit18:17
JontheEchidnaI mean, damn. No warning this time, even.18:17
rgreeningQuintasan|Szel: but I have kdegames18:17
rgreeningso Quintasan|Szel needn't worry about uploading it :)18:18
Quintasan|Szelrgreening: oh, nice :D18:18
rgreening:)18:19
* rgreening haz fast interwebz18:19
rgreening100Mbps dedicated18:19
Quintasan|Szel:)18:20
SputJontheEchidna: I think dimsuz screwed up18:23
Sputthere was no bic18:23
Sput<notmart> wait, i had a slightly older one than the rc18:24
Sput<notmart> whooops :)18:24
Sputhe got it wrong :)18:24
Sputprolly using kde-qt 4.6-stable-patched18:24
JontheEchidnaoh, whew18:25
=== manny__ is now known as mannyv
=== rafael_ is now known as rafasmart
DaskreechGreat19:43
Daskreech How do I edit a PDF?19:43
Daskreech I need to delete some pages19:43
BlizzzDaskreech: split it with pdftk und put the correct pages together (also with pdftk)19:44
Daskreechthanks19:44
Blizzzyw19:44
DaskreechWow that's a fat little app19:45
Blizzzyeah :)19:46
txwikingerI think pdfsam can do something like that too19:46
Riddellpdfedit works, shame about the UI19:46
* nixternal kicks our old ass packagekit packages19:47
Daskreechnixternal kicks Old people19:47
Daskreechwhere packages act as a people representative19:47
nixternalI would never kick ScottK ;)19:47
Quintasan|SzelLex79: how's Qt?19:52
Lex79built on amd6419:53
Quintasan|SzelLex79: thanks, will get to building asap19:54
mcasrgreening: ping20:00
rgreeningpong mcas20:04
mcashi rgreening20:05
mcasi saw that you rebuild the filesharing module20:05
mcascan i help you with this?20:05
DaskreechBlizzz: Worked wonderfully thanks20:07
BlizzzDaskreech: my pleasure20:07
rgreeningmcas: feel free to look at the spec and offer up suggestions if you like...20:09
rgreeningmcas: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/kubuntu-lucid-file-sharing and https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Specs/LucidFileSharing20:09
rgreeningmcas: I have a few of the details worked out, as you will see from reading...20:10
mcasok i'll look at it and see what i can add20:11
rgreeningcool20:13
mcasdo you have a link for me how i can build an development enviroment?20:13
rgreeningmcas: hmm... well for the kde stuff it's a few setps20:24
rgreeningmcas: I'd start with installing the normal build stuff (like build-essential, etc...)20:24
Riddellsudo apt-get build-dep kdebase20:25
rgreeningthen you need to apt-get source the packages involved and you also want to install the build deps20:25
rgreeningya, what Riddell said20:25
mcasok i'll try that20:32
mcasi have to go, i try the build stuff tomorrow20:47
mcasthx for the hints so far20:47
mcasbye20:47
Riddellsudo apt-get build-dep kdebase20:55
Blizzzis kde 4.3.4 news being published this night (~central europe)? since, kubuntu-de.org would publish a german version as soon, but i am kinda tired and gotta get to work tomorrow :)22:05
DaskreechBlizzz: Probably not grab some rest22:19
BlizzzDaskreech: alright, ty!22:20
DaskreechRiddell: When the 4.3.4 announcement goes live please e-mail Blizzz at the same time. Thanks!22:21
Blizzz:)22:21
Blizzzso, gn822:31
Riddellta da kubuntu.org/news/kde-4.3.423:16
RiddellLex79: ^^23:16
RiddellDarkwingDuck: are you able to test that?23:18
Riddelleveryone hug Lex79!23:19
txwikingerRiddell: test the ppa?23:22
Lex79Riddell: thank you :)23:25
ulysses__hungarian version of kde 4.3.4 announcement is ready!23:49
nixternaloh, if only there were a KSideBar class23:57

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