[07:31] <thekorn> good morning
[07:36] <^arky^> morning thekorn
[07:36] <thekorn> hey ^arky^
[07:52] <^arky^> micahg: I have subscribed ubuntu-main-sponsers to bug 491327
[07:53] <micahg> ^arky^: is that the normal procedure?
[07:53] <^arky^> no,
[07:53] <^arky^> but this is a critical bug
[07:53] <^arky^> since all gnome accessibility depends on this
[07:53] <^arky^> so I kinda of desperate ! :(
[07:54] <^arky^> micahg: can you suggest any better way of resolving this issue?
[07:54] <micahg> ^arky^: find the person who uploaded the last release and ping :)
[07:55] <micahg> ^arky^: asking in -motu was a good idea also
[07:55]  * micahg was just a little distracted
[07:55] <^arky^> try both !
[07:55] <^arky^> tried both, no luck!
[07:56] <micahg> ^arky^: themuso should be on later
[07:58] <^arky^> yeah, I posted him a message via lp
[07:58]  * ^arky^ hugs micahg 
[07:58] <^arky^> thank you !
[07:58] <micahg> ^arky^: he's in australia
[07:58] <micahg> I believe that's UTC+10
[07:59] <^arky^> Ah! thanks for the hint!
[07:59]  * ^arky^ is from UTC+530  
[07:59] <^arky^> off for lunch
[07:59]  * micahg is UTC-6
[08:00] <^arky^> where is that micahg ?
[08:00] <micahg> well, I'm in Chicago
[08:00] <^arky^> Ah!
[08:00] <^arky^> windy city
[10:14] <newbies> Hello
[10:15] <newbies> someone speak french please?
[10:17] <newbies> Hello
[10:17] <newbies> someone speak french please?
[10:19] <newbies> ok no .bye
[10:19] <micahg> newbies: try here #ubuntu-fr
[10:20] <newbies> micahg, ok thanks but I have a bug problem
[10:20] <micahg> newbies: i can help you with a bug problem, but I don't speak french :)
[10:21] <newbies> ok I try to write but I will not sure if you will understand me.
[10:22] <newbies> and I take long time to write.: )
[10:23] <micahg> newbies: let's start easy
[10:23] <micahg> what program
[10:23] <newbies> F-spot
[10:23] <newbies> I use ubuntu 9.10 my problem is when I start F-spot the software crash immediately
[10:24] <newbies> You have this type of problem eventually if you use f-spot?
[10:25] <micahg> newbies: do you have a file in /var/crash?
[10:26] <newbies> I think yes can you wait until I verify it thanks.
[10:27] <newbies> micahg, yes I have this folder
[10:27] <micahg> newbies: is there anything in there for fspot?
[10:27] <newbies> No nothing
[10:28] <micahg> newbies: well, right now we're waiting for a patch to be able to generate one time crash report
[10:28] <micahg> *reports
[10:29] <newbies> ok thanks
[10:36] <micahg> newbies: you can submit a crash report if you enable apport, start it, then disable it so you don't get bothered by every crash
[14:51] <nigel_nb> hey, can someone wishlist bug 492003
[15:42]  * hggdh kicks ubot4
[15:51] <hggdh> nigel_nb: why do you think it is a wish? Note that I am not against it, I just want to know your reasoning
[15:56] <nigel_nb> hggdh: sorry to be late, was away
[15:56] <hggdh> np
[15:57] <nigel_nb> my reasoning is that, it is a feature request
[15:57] <hggdh> :-) so far, yes, we agree. But is it a decent one? Does it make sense?
[15:58] <hggdh> what is the gain?
[15:58] <nigel_nb> hm, that I'm not sure
[15:58] <nigel_nb> refer him to brainstrom?
[15:58] <hggdh> no, I do not think it is needed to get to brainstrom
[15:59] <hggdh> it is just that one of the thing expected from us is to read and understand (and consider, and reason)
[15:59] <nigel_nb> so if its too trivial or unncessary, we can mark it as invalid?
[16:00] <hggdh> if it is unnecessary, we post our understanding of *why* it is unnecessary, and ask for comments from the reporter
[16:01] <hggdh> if it is trivial... it is more difficult. Triviality does not imply a bad request.
[16:01] <nigel_nb> this sounds unnecessary doesnt it?
[16:01] <hggdh> the point is the triager is expected to explain why an action is being taken
[16:02] <hggdh> no, not really. I am unsure on what gain there would be to pop up a notification that downloads are in progress, since notifications are shown for a brief period
[16:02] <nigel_nb> i.e., why it is being elevated to wish list?
[16:03] <hggdh> yes, why you think it is a wish. You can also put your thoughts on possible issues. Remember, a maintainer will eventually get to the bug, and will wonder why an action was taken
[16:04] <nigel_nb> so I'll first ask the reasoning behind why this feature is needed..
[16:04] <hggdh> rule of thumb: *any* change of status or importance should be commented
[16:04] <nigel_nb> in other words, dont click the yellow thingie and change the status or important
[16:04] <nigel_nb> *importance
[16:05] <hggdh> YES!
[16:05] <hggdh> this is A Bad Thing To Do
[16:05] <nigel_nb> I always click on the triangle and change, so the change can be commented and I can subscribe
[16:05] <hggdh> even if later on we find ourselves to be wrong
[16:06] <hggdh> (being wrong is no big deal)
[16:06] <nigel_nb> okay :)
[16:06] <nigel_nb> after all, we're all human eh?
[16:06] <hggdh> that's the idea, indeed
[16:06] <hggdh> even I am wrong. Rarely, of course ;-)
[16:07] <nigel_nb> hehe
[16:07] <nigel_nb> so, in this case, I'll ask him for more information and reasoning
[16:08] <nigel_nb> but, I want you to just check out wat I'm gonna put in so that it doesn't offend the other preson
[16:13] <nigel_nb> hggdh: how about this "Thank you for your bug report.  All updates will be notified for a few moments always.  Please clarify further why the check boxes are necessary.  Thanks in Advance." ?
[16:14] <hggdh> nigel_nb: sounds good -- and mark it incomplete
[16:15] <nigel_nb> yep :)
[16:15] <nigel_nb> hggdh: how much time do you think I'd take before applying for control?
[16:16] <hggdh> a bit more, a bit more... guess less than 1 month
[16:17] <nigel_nb> thats promising
[16:17] <hggdh> and you will not need to apply, I will recommend you when I think you are ready
[16:17] <nigel_nb> I was thinking of a time-frame like 6 months to a year
[16:17] <hggdh> well,, we *can* wait one year, if you feel better ;-)
[16:17] <nigel_nb> no thanks :P
[16:17] <hggdh> :-)
[16:18] <nigel_nb> i'm off to work now
[16:18] <nigel_nb> catch you later on... didn't do my 5-a-day thanks to lp being down
[16:18] <hggdh> k
[17:44] <deuxpi> Hi everyone! I have a bug that needs a sponsor or review.
[17:45] <deuxpi> After subscribing MOTU what should I do?
[17:47] <hggdh> deuxpi: can you give us the bug #?
[17:47] <deuxpi> Sure: LP:418176
[17:47] <hggdh> bug 418176
[17:48] <hggdh> bloody ubot4
[17:48] <deuxpi> It's a regression because the package changed name
[17:48] <deuxpi> "gw6c crashes with buffer overflow on start"
[17:50] <Pici> bug #100000
[17:51] <hggdh> just asked on -irc about ubot4
[17:54] <hggdh> deuxpi: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Sponsorship/SponsorsQueue documents the process
[17:55] <hggdh> and I like your nick ;-)
[17:55] <deuxpi> hggdh: Ok thanks, will read
[17:56] <deuxpi> hggdh: it's a nickname I got at the university. happens it was not used a lot on the internet
[17:56] <hggdh> bienvenu, then :-)
[17:57] <jpds> bug #41231
[18:03] <deuxpi> Good, debdiff uploaded and Status set to Confirmed.
[18:04] <hggdh> thank you for helping, deuxpi
[18:05] <deuxpi> It doesn't count, I fixed it before ;)
[18:05] <hggdh> still... thank you!
[18:06] <hggdh> pedro_: is there a way to *propose* (not add) members to the mentorship group?
[18:07] <pedro_> hggdh, don't think so, lp only offers the option to add not to propose :-(
[18:07] <hggdh> yeah, I was thinking about the current queue
[18:10] <jpds> bug #41231
[18:11] <jpds> OK, so you work in /msg but not in channel.
[19:12] <yoasif> anyone have any ideas on diagnosing this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/492057 i can't even get a backtrace because it freezes Xorg when I try to
[19:14] <hggdh> heh. Already on Lucid
[19:14] <hggdh> yoasif: apport does not trigger?
[19:15] <yoasif> hggdh: nope
[19:15] <hggdh> and it is enabled, correct?
[19:15] <micahg> hggdh: I saw pitti say yesterday that apport wasn't enabled on lucid yet
[19:15] <micahg> by default
[19:15] <yoasif> hggdh: yes, it triggers for other things
[19:16] <yoasif> i have it enabled in the conf file, so it is enabled
[19:16] <yoasif> it wasnt working before, but i reenabled update manager and it works fine now
[19:16] <hggdh> yoasif: then it is a rather diffcult thing to debug...
[19:17] <yoasif> hggdh: heh, sadly it's a real bug too :/
[19:17] <micahg> I thought there was a new system to catch x crashes
[19:17] <hggdh> it may well be initial incompatibility while Lucid is being set up
[19:17] <yoasif> yea
[19:17] <micahg> I saw a post on the devel list about it
[19:17] <yoasif> i don't really /need/ it too much since im using gnome do
[19:17] <hggdh> hold on
[19:20] <hggdh> no, it did not pan out -- seb had published a new gnome-panel, but the changes should not affect this
[19:20] <yoasif> heh
[19:20] <yoasif> also... havent filed a report yet
[19:20] <yoasif> but resume from suspend is acting kinda wonky after upgrade to lucid
[19:20] <yoasif> machine comes back from suspend
[19:20] <yoasif> but screen is blank
[19:21] <yoasif> i can enter a password, hit enter -- nothing happens
[19:21] <hggdh> there we go again on resume issues... :-(
[19:21] <yoasif> swich to vt1, back to vt7, everything works
[19:21] <hggdh> oh, interesting
[19:22] <hggdh> yes, open a bug, and describe what you do
[19:22] <hggdh> but, for the gnome-panel, perhaps you can discuss at -desktop
[19:22] <hggdh> jeez, I hate windows...
[19:22] <yoasif> the channel?
[19:22] <hggdh> (mean Microsoft Windows)
[19:23] <yoasif> no, #ubuntu-desktop?
[19:23] <hggdh> yoasif: also -- and perhaps this is why apport is still disabled on Lucid -- it may be too early in the cycle for bugs
[19:23] <hggdh> yes
[19:24] <yoasif> ouch :(
[19:24] <hggdh> things *usually* break at this point in time
[19:24] <yoasif> lol...
[19:24] <yoasif> this is true
[19:24] <yoasif> well, ill file the kernel bug
[19:24] <yoasif> suspend worked great in karmic, which was awesome :)
[19:28] <hggdh> heh
[19:29] <hggdh> this is why I usually run +1 in a VM that early in the cycle
[19:29] <yoasif> VMs are boring :p
[19:30] <hggdh> but safer. I *need* my laptop ;-)
[19:32] <yoasif> hehe
[19:32] <yoasif> i have a desktop for backup
[19:32] <yoasif> although i should grab a karmic livecd asap
[19:32] <yoasif> so i can restore my machine if bad shit starts happening
[19:32] <yoasif> i ran karmic as +1 for the whole cycle... no significant issues that required reinstallation
[19:33] <yoasif> this is an upgraded jaunty install
[19:54] <bdmurray> mac_v: could you use a package instead of just opening "ubuntu" bug tasks for one hundred paper cuts things?
[19:55] <mac_v> bdmurray: yeah , the stuff I'm sure of , I assign the package right away , some which i'm not sure I assign it just to Ubunutu
[19:55] <mac_v> :(
[19:55] <bdmurray> mac_v: bug 488478 and bug 388400 seemed pretty straight forward to me
[19:56] <mac_v> bdmurray: the problem , is the papercut bugs are sometimes getting too vague in the description and rather than describing the problem , they just say , we want this fixed , so i wasnt sure
[19:56] <bdmurray> both of those bug reports mentioned the package name in them
[19:56] <mac_v> bdmurray: hmm , maybe i missed them , will make sure the next time :)
[20:01] <mac_v> bdmurray: bug 488478 started to look more like a couchbd / evolution / OOo bug to me ...  the bug title and description was updated after i assigned to Ubuntu
[20:13] <mbeierl> is there a bug reported for karmic bash completion not working for java -cp ../path style?  I've searched and cannot find one.
[20:21] <mbeierl> Filed as https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bash-completion/+bug/492611 thanks!
[20:56] <nigel_nb> hggdh: ping
[20:57] <hggdh> yes?
[20:57] <nigel_nb> bug 492136
[20:57] <nigel_nb> I reported it upstream and upstream says its a pulse audio bug
[20:57] <nigel_nb> whats the procedure now?
[20:57] <nigel_nb> what happened to the bot? grr
[20:58] <hggdh> let me look at it
[20:58] <nigel_nb> here's the link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/empathy/+bug/492136
[20:58] <hggdh> the bot is right now very discreet -- you have to /msg ubot4 <whatever> and it will answer you directly
[20:58] <nigel_nb> why? :( the other way was better
[20:59] <nigel_nb> something to beat the lonliness :P
[20:59] <hggdh> they are looking at it
[20:59] <hggdh> ok. Back to the bug
[20:59] <hggdh> yes, indeed, seems a PA issue
[21:00] <hggdh> (or related to PA)
[21:00] <hggdh> so... right now -- reset the package to PA, and tell the reporter we need a stacktrace
[21:00] <hggdh> so they need to enable apport, get the ST, and open a *new* bug via apport
[21:01] <hggdh> and ask them to report back in this bug with the new bug #. Then we close this one, and follow up on the new
[21:02] <hggdh> crashes without a backtrace are not really useful, genereally
[21:02] <hggdh> (unless you can repeat it)
[21:03] <hggdh> and I still hate Microsoft Windows. Mainly Vista
[21:05] <nigel_nb> sorry, browser got stuck
[21:05] <nigel_nb> did u say somethin earlier?
[21:05] <kklimonda> hggdh: isn't hate a too strong word? ;)
[21:06] <hggdh> kklimonda: not for Vista. I am ashamed to say I am Ms-certified
[21:06] <kklimonda> hggdh: I really liked Vista SP1 ;)
[21:06] <hggdh> heh
[21:06] <hggdh> my wife's laptop barfed on a FS error. chkdsk /f corrects it, and the FS immediately forgets it has been fixed
[21:07] <hggdh> so the only way to boot is via system repair, and never gets out of it
[21:07] <nigel_nb> hggdh: I missed whatever happened after I said about lonliness
[21:07] <hggdh> but... kudos for knoppix
[21:07] <kklimonda> hggdh: interesting bug
[21:08] <hggdh> nigel_nb: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/334742/
[21:08] <nigel_nb> hggdh: thanks
[21:08] <hggdh> yes indeed, kklimonda. Were it to be my system, I would play with it. But my wife is really not happy
[21:09] <hggdh> so... boot on knoppix, save all Gbytes that need to be saved, restore to factory setting, apply some 6 hours of patches, boot knoppix, recover the Gbytes of data
[21:10] <hggdh> and, of course, chkdsk /b -- which takes just about 1 hour
[21:12] <joaopinto> hggdh, you are likely to have bad sectors, scrap the disk :P
[21:13] <hggdh> joaopinto: I know... but cannot, right now. I do not know where I saved the Dell recovery CD
[21:13] <hggdh> so I am stuck
[21:14] <hggdh> but the chkdsk /b should update the bad blocks table
[21:14] <joaopinto> hggdh, except if the badblocks are located on the FS metadata
[21:15] <hggdh> then I am screwed. I do not think so, though, given that thefsck checks the metadata, and did not barf
[21:44] <WeatherGod> hiya, could someone mark bug 486993 as triaged.  I don't know if it is enough info, but there are plenty of log info that should help the kernel people
[21:49] <micahg> jpds: is ubot broke?
[21:49] <hggdh> yes it is
[21:49] <hggdh> but you can get to it by /msg ubot4
[21:51] <etali> hggdh Do you really need the recovery CD? Could you borrow / burn a Windows CD and just use the serial number provided with the PC? (Hopefully your sticker is in a better state than the one on my laptop, which I forgot to write down, and has now been smudged into oblivion)
[21:52] <hggdh> etali: I *could* but it is usual for Dell (and other manufacturers) to add in special drivers
[21:53] <WeatherGod> yeah, Dell is especially bad for that
[21:53] <etali> •hggdh• Ah, good point. We got away with a spare CD for a Packard Bell, but don't know anyone that owns Dells
[21:53] <hggdh> heh I own some 5 of them, all different hardware
[21:54] <hggdh> WeatherGod: bug marked as triaged
[21:54] <WeatherGod> thanks!
[22:06] <WeatherGod> huh, this is weird... looking through old update-manager bugs...
[22:06] <WeatherGod> found one with 403 Forbidden errors
[22:06] <WeatherGod> usually I find 404 errors, but not 403
[22:07] <WeatherGod> is it still possible this 403 can be the result of overloaded servers?
[22:32] <hggdh> doubtful
[22:33] <hggdh> but I do not know how the mirrors are updated
[22:34] <WeatherGod> ok
[22:34] <WeatherGod> well, I have also come across a third category of failures during the upgrade for Karmic
[22:35] <WeatherGod> it appears that it is possible for a user to start an upgrade process using a mirror that has yet to receive the files
[22:39] <WeatherGod> hggdh, do you thing bug 462899 can be marked as triaged?
[22:39] <WeatherGod> s/thing/thing/
[22:39] <WeatherGod> grrr
[22:40] <WeatherGod> s/thing/think/
[22:43] <WeatherGod> heh, looks like us.archive.ubuntu.com isn't working for jaunty releases...
[22:47] <WeatherGod> correction...
[22:47] <jmarsden> WeatherGod: What makes you say that?  http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main is still there...
[22:47] <WeatherGod> looks like Trranslation-en_US.bz2 package is missing
[22:47] <WeatherGod> Translation-en_US.bz2
[22:47] <jmarsden> Trranslation?  Maybe Translation (just one "r") would be found?
[22:48] <WeatherGod> sorry, my keyboard is a bit sticky
[22:49] <WeatherGod> the other -en  packages are there
[22:49] <jmarsden> In what directory were you expecting to find this file?  Do you have a URL to it on another mirror?
[22:49] <WeatherGod> look at bug 462041
[22:50] <jmarsden> If you say that as bug #462021  you give us a link :)
[22:50] <WeatherGod> the bot is broken
[22:50] <jmarsden> Or not... OK!
[22:50] <WeatherGod> you can do /msg ubot4
[22:51] <jmarsden> WeatherGod: This bug shows "connection refused" msgs... not a missing file.
[22:52] <WeatherGod> yeah, but click them now
[22:52] <WeatherGod> and another user reporter said he was experiencing issues for over two weeks
[22:52] <WeatherGod> and that was two weeks ago
[22:52] <jmarsden> Wait, are you working on that bug, or on a new bug about one file you just discovered... I'm confused :)
[22:53] <WeatherGod> I am trying to diagnose the problem, yes
[22:53] <jmarsden> http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/jaunty/main/i18n/   shows me all the expected files, I think...
[22:54] <jmarsden> Is that the location you are referring to?
[22:54] <WeatherGod> and notice what is missing
[22:54] <jmarsden> It has en_GB but not en_US.
[22:55] <WeatherGod> exactly!
[22:55] <WeatherGod> I gotta go catch a bus
[22:55] <WeatherGod> I might be on later
[22:58] <BUGabundo> bRoas
[23:31] <dragon> There's no way in the latest installer to select none of the "Other options" once you hit F6.
[23:31] <dragon> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BootOptions#Changing the CD's Default Boot Options
[23:31] <dragon> ...
[23:32] <dragon> My question - is that a bug?
[23:32] <dragon> A known bug?
[23:32] <dragon> Worthy of being filed?
[23:34] <jmarsden> dragon: What happens if you press F6 and then Escape?
[23:34] <dragon> jmarsden: the first option, acpi=off, is selected.
[23:35] <jmarsden> That probably is a (minor) UI bug, then.  Can you work around it by selecting that item again, so it deselects?
[23:36] <dragon> jmarsden: I couldn't.
[23:36] <jmarsden> Then it sounds like a bug, so file it if you want :)
[23:37] <dragon> jmarsden: if you hit F4 or F5, defaults are Normal and None. F6 has acpi=off as default, and I don't know if that was intentional.  https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BootOptions
[23:38] <jmarsden> dragon: Seems illogical, so let's call it a bug.
[23:39] <dragon> jmarsden: ok cool. What package would it fall under?
[23:39] <jmarsden> dragon: ubiquity, I would think... that's the Ubuntu installer, as far as I now
[23:40] <jmarsden> *know
[23:40] <dragon> jmarsden: the installer that show up at boot time - is that ubiquity? I thought that menu launched ubiquity.
[23:42] <dragon> I'll make it ubiquity and let them decide.
[23:42] <jmarsden> Sounds reasonable :)
[23:42] <dragon> uh, now this is annoying
[23:43] <dragon> clicking on Report a bug link in launchpad takes me to a wiki page
[23:43] <dragon> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+filebug
[23:43] <dragon> positive
[23:43] <mrand> dragon: could you file it with the command ubuntu-bug <package>  I'm wondering if the package should be gfxboot
[23:45] <dragon> mrand: I'm not using the system involved, so I didn't want the local info to be uploaded in the bug report.
[23:45] <dragon> also, gfxboot package is described as "This package is needed to create the graphical boot logos for gfxboot"
[23:46] <mrand> dragon: I found that gfxboot-theme-ubuntu 0.5.2 was where F6 was added
[23:46] <mrand> dragon: as for filing the bug, most of the way down that wiki page, it gives a hint how to file the bug directly.
[23:47] <dragon> mrand: got it
[23:48] <mrand> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gfxboot/+filebug
[23:48] <mrand> may get you there as well.
[23:48] <mrand> Thanks for the bug report, dragon!
[23:48] <dragon> mrand: no problem. It's my duty after all.
[23:48] <mrand> dragon: ooops, hold on.
[23:48] <mrand> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gfxboot/+bug/47703
[23:50] <dragon> old bug
[23:50] <dragon> unfixed
[23:50] <mrand> yeah :-(
[23:50] <dragon> but there's no text box now
[23:50] <mrand> I suppose you could put a quick note that it is still present in Karmic.
[23:51] <dragon> mrand: That'd be easier. I'm unable to file a new bug any way, due to an unresponsive server.
[23:51] <dragon> (Error ID: OOPS-1434B3391)
[23:51] <mrand> dragon: that's strange.... someone else earlier this week reported the same thing.
[23:52] <mrand> could it be a proxy or related problem?
[23:52] <dragon> I'm a part of launchpad beta testers, and the error page mentioned that as a possible cause of the problem
[23:52] <dragon> "Our edge server has a lower timeout threshold than launchpad.net, so we can catch those before they hit a wider audience. As a member of the Launchpad Beta Testers team, you're more likely to experience them. If this is blocking your work, you can disable redirection."
[23:52] <dragon> But the "disable redirection" button did me no good.
[23:52] <mrand> right.  I don't think that's it.
[23:53] <dragon> They've recorded it any way.
[23:53] <mrand> bah.  It shouldn't be this hard to get tickets opened from users that want to open them!
[23:53] <mrand> Thanks for the thought though, and your efforts.
[23:55] <dragon> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gfxboot/+bug/47703/comments/4
[23:56] <dragon> Hope that helps improve Ubuntu.
[23:56] <mrand> Every little bit helps.
[23:59] <dragon> I forgot to mention karmic, but that should be apparent from the date of my comment.
[23:59] <dragon> Would it help if I hit "Nominate for release" or something?