[01:43] <JontheEchidna> looks like kdepimlibs isn't in the kubuntu-dev package set
[02:04] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: I can look at it.
[02:04] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: Is it ready?
[02:11] <JontheEchidna> Yeah, I looked over it and it looks good.
[02:11] <JontheEchidna> ScottK: ^
[02:11] <ScottK> OK.  Grabbing.
[02:12] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: Looks like I want to pull from bzr, right?
[02:13] <JontheEchidna> yeah
[02:16] <ScottK> Uploaded.
[02:17] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: I'll have kdeplasma-addons sorted shortly.
[02:18] <maco> this kdeedu test build in pbuilder has been going for 3 hours
[02:18] <maco> is this normal?
[02:19] <ScottK> maco: Could be.  kdebase-workspace build time on the buildd's almost doubled 4.3 => 4.4.
[02:20] <maco> its at
[02:20] <maco> [ 98%] Generating index.cache.bz2
[02:20] <maco> cd ../doc/blinken && /usr/bin/meinproc4 --check --cache /tmp/buildd/kdeedu-4.3.80/obj-i486-linux-gnu/doc/blinken/index.cache.bz2 /tmp/buildd/kdeedu-4.3.80/doc/blinken/index.docbook
[02:20] <maco> when i tried this earlier today and finally had to kill it so i could turn off my laptop (no suspend), it was sitting at the same spot
[02:21] <JontheEchidna> That same issue has appeared with kdeutils
[02:22] <JontheEchidna> I believe eventually Quintasan just patched the docs from building
[02:25] <maco> hrm :-/
[02:38] <maco> JontheEchidna: do you mean he removed the -docs from the debian/control?
[02:39] <JontheEchidna> maco: He patched cmakelists.txt so that the docs wouldn't be built in the first place
[02:48] <ScottK> It's probably worth running it through strace or something at some point, but not tonight.
[02:48] <ScottK> ... to find out if it's stuck or just really slow.
[02:48] <maco> JontheEchidna: ok
[03:00] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: Fixed plasma-addons uploaded.
[03:01] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: I did pimlibs too.  What should I look at now?
[03:05] <JontheEchidna> I've not looked at anything further tonight; I'm actually in windows at the moment
[03:08] <maco> hrmm i cant figure out from the CMakeLists.txt what does the docs. there arent doc/ directories for the games and there isnt one doc/ directory they all share, and i dont even see anything other than normal code files and no mention of docs in the cmake :-/
[03:10] <ScottK> Wow, qt4-x11 built on sparc.
[03:10] <ScottK> We're no longer dead on ALL ports.
[03:17] <ScottK> Doing oxygen-icons (135mb tarball, yeah!)
[03:17] <DasKreech> Yeah I laughed at that
[03:18] <DasKreech> Oxygen is by far the lagest aspect of KDE
[03:33] <DasKreech> where aspect has the only definiiton of tarball
[03:34] <DasKreech> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Ninjas/PackagingLegend#preview
[03:34] <DasKreech> Can someone review for accuracy ?
[03:51] <ScottK> Doing kdegames
[03:52] <DasKreech> JontheEchidna: Just read your blog on bko Strange comments
[04:05] <ScottK> Next time anyone sees rgreening around, please remind him about bzr add.
[04:06] <ScottK> kdegames done
[04:06] <DasKreech> JontheEchidna: Nice and Andreas posts a few hours after you
[04:06] <DasKreech> ScottK: bzr add what?
[04:06] <ScottK> bzr add the new files in the packaging or the won't be there for the guy that reviews it.
[04:07] <DasKreech> ok
[04:10] <ScottK> Done kdesdk now.
[04:10] <ScottK> nixternal: You can join in uploading stuff, you know.
[04:18] <ScottK> sdk done.  Doing utils
[04:20] <ScottK> Meh.
[04:32] <ScottK> Utils done.  Webdev next.
[04:49] <ScottK> This is probably going to be the last one for tonight for me.
[04:50] <ScottK> maco: Getting close on edu?
[04:50] <maco> ScottK: i dont know how to tell it to skip docs :(
[04:51] <maco> ScottK: jon the enchilada mentioned Quintasan commenting out of the CMakelists.txt but theres nothing about docs in them and no doc-specific directories that i can find... :-/
[04:51] <ScottK> maco: look at kdeutils and see what he did there.
[04:51] <maco> ok
[04:52] <maco> umm...wait, look where for it?
[04:54] <ScottK> Archive
[04:54] <maco> oh its in lucid? ok
[04:55] <ScottK> Yep
[04:55] <ScottK> Source is anyway, none of this will build until we upload kde4libs.
[05:15] <ScottK> webdev uploaded.
[05:16] <ScottK> Riddell: Welcome back from vacation.  Please keep uploading (we're doing kde4libs last this time).  Status is https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Ninjas/Packaging
[05:18] <ScottK> Riddell: We still need a (afaik not yet finished) Qt4 patch for phonon and we had to disable kio_sftp pending libssh MIR (filed).
[05:19] <ScottK> Riddell: I warned slangasek at the release team meeting that things might get a little sporting for Alpha 1 and this KDE release.  Up until we upload kd4libs, there is the option to wait.
[05:20] <ScottK> Good night all.
[05:23] <DasKreech> Good night
[05:39] <Quintasan|Szel> maco: You'd be interested in CMakeList.txt in doc/ in kdeutls, at least comment out doc in top level CMakeList.txt
[05:39] <maco> Quintasan|Szel: im working on kdeedu. there is no doc/ directory :(
[05:39] <maco> hence my confusion
[05:40] <Quintasan|Szel> maco: and nothing in top level CMakeList.txt?
[05:40] <Quintasan|Szel> maco: try find . -name *.docbook :P
[05:40] <maco> Quintasan|Szel: wow i fail at reading
[05:41]  * maco headdesk
[05:41]  * Quintasan|Szel is heading school
[05:42] <Quintasan|Szel> this is most supid thing invented, additional maths at 7:10, right before normal lessons
[05:42] <Quintasan|Szel> I had to get up at six :/
[05:42] <maco> ewwwwww
[05:43] <Quintasan|Szel> I was like "lol three hours of sleep" few hours ago
[05:44] <Quintasan|Szel> well, anyways, what packages are left?
[05:44] <DasKreech> Quintasan|Szel: I think I had one better
[05:45] <DasKreech> we had a single 2 hour lecture as our only class 8:00 on Friday
[05:45] <DasKreech> after having no classes after 12:00 thursday
[05:46] <DasKreech> The class?
[05:46] <DasKreech> Pyschology
[05:46] <Quintasan|Szel> lol
[05:46] <DasKreech> I swear that was some kinda inside joke.
[05:47] <DasKreech> You really want us to turn up for the earliest class we have for the entire week on the last day of the week with no other classes or activites for the rest of the day for a non interactive lecture ?
[05:47] <DasKreech> Uh huh. Lets see how many people turn up for that.
[05:48] <Quintasan|Szel> awsome :P
[05:48] <Quintasan|Szel> awesome even
[05:50] <Quintasan|Szel> urgh and I'm at school :/
[05:52] <Quintasan|Szel> It would be nice if ivan responded to my mail
[05:52] <Quintasan|Szel> ScottK: the Lancelot dev was here?
[06:15] <Darkwing-Netbook> ScottK: Hows the update coming along?
[06:15] <DasKreech> He's asleep
[06:15] <Darkwing-Netbook> *mumbles*
[06:16] <Darkwing-Netbook> This whole no workspace thingie is a little crazy lol
[06:18] <DasKreech> :-)
[06:19] <Darkwing-Netbook> Keeps crashing on load. The thing I don't get is why when I log in, it will bring up the login dialog again and then it crashes
[06:19] <DasKreech> maco: Ping
[06:20] <maco> DasKreech: whats up?
[06:21] <DasKreech> maco: Do you know anything about bug reports marking a package as not a Genuine Ubuntu Package?
[06:21] <maco> DasKreech: yeah, means the package is from a PPA or pbuilder
[06:21] <maco> the "apt-cache policy" output wasnt approved
[06:22] <DasKreech> Right. Do the 4.3.4 packages currently have this status?
[06:24] <DasKreech> And if so is there a way to post bugs properly with that status?
[06:25] <maco> are they in a ppa? if so, then yes they do
[06:25] <maco> i think you have to go to launchpad and file in the web interface instead of using ubuntu-bug
[06:26] <maco> if you go to the package's actual page on the bugtracker, you can file bugs. its just if you try to file bugs right at /ubuntu/+bugs that itll yell at you
[06:28] <DasKreech> kk
[07:41]  * kb9vqf hates Qt4 with a passion
[07:41] <kb9vqf> On my high-uptime server, if I leave a user logged in for more than a day or two Qt4 apps won't start
[07:41] <DasKreech> at all?
[07:41] <kb9vqf> Nope, not at all
[07:41] <kb9vqf> X Error: BadWindow (invalid Window parameter) 3
[07:41] <kb9vqf> over and over...
[07:42] <kb9vqf> well, technically a variant of BadWindow
[07:42] <DasKreech> I was about to ask doesn't that error come up all the time?
[07:42] <kb9vqf> I dunno...here's a pastebin of mythfrontend: http://pastebin.com/d70c6820c
[07:43] <kb9vqf> Other Qt4 apps are similar
[07:43] <kb9vqf> this is under Karmic BTW
[07:44] <DasKreech> Hmm that's pretty bad.
[07:44] <DasKreech> Can't say I've seen that since KDE 4.1
[07:46] <kb9vqf> Well, Qt4 is doing something it shouldn't :)\
[07:46] <kb9vqf> I'll leave that up to the Qt4 folks here to decipher if anyone else sees it--I'll just stop using Qt4 apps ;0)
[07:47]  * kb9vqf goes to bed
[07:47] <DasKreech> #qt is open but not sure they are awake
[07:51] <DasKreech> I should too
[08:01] <ghostcube> ok i updated to Qt 4.6
[08:01] <ghostcube> printer-applet crash stoped
[08:01] <ghostcube> ;)
[08:01] <DasKreech> Grats
[08:01] <ghostcube> thx DasKreech :)
[09:15] <Riddell> morning
[09:16] <DasKreech> morning
[09:18] <amichair> Riddell: morning
[09:21] <amichair> Riddell: should I be poking now and then about the bugfix merges, or is it on the todo list and will not be forgotten?
[09:26] <Riddell> amichair: yeah keep poking
[09:27] <Riddell> I don't think I've heard back from mvo about the software-properties changes so I'll probably just go ahead and merge that
[09:31] <amichair> ok, thanks :-)
[09:37] <Riddell> why is kde4libs being uploaded last?
[09:38]  * jussi01 waves to Riddell
[09:38] <_StefanS_> Riddell: do you know about an issue with knetworkmanager giving segfaults on logouts ?
[09:38] <_StefanS_> Riddell: just wondering if I'm the only one experiencing it
[09:38] <Riddell> _StefanS_: I've not seen that
[09:39] <_StefanS_> Riddell: ok, it might be a local problem of mine then, probably my kde profile
[09:39] <Riddell> oh, ScottK wants everything to dep-wait on it
[09:40] <jussi01> Riddell: hope your holidays were refreahing :) and welcome back :)
[09:45]  * Riddell uploads kdebase, kdegraphics and kdepim-runtime
[09:46] <Riddell> not touching kdepim upstream says it's broken
[09:46] <Riddell> or kdebindings, I believe pykde needs some updating, <pokes Sime >
[09:50] <Riddell> hum, bzr on launchpad doesn't want to work, maybe I shaln't be uploading
[09:56] <Lex79> Riddell: I'm doing kdepim, I almost finished, so I should leave the package?
[09:58] <Riddell> Lex79: no carry on but we'll need to wait for upstream to tell us what patches it needs before uploading
[09:58] <Riddell> it might need patches to qt
[09:59] <Riddell> and/or itself
[10:00] <Lex79> Riddell: ok, sandsmark he said when he finished his patch for phonon he pokes me, I ask him every day :P
[10:09] <Lure> Riddell: kdepim issue is resolved - see e-mail from Allen Winter from tonight
[10:09] <Lure> Riddell: trunk patch is  r1059603
[10:09] <Lure> Riddell: 4.3 branch => r1059605
[10:11]  * Lure notices that it was sent to kdepim-users and not kde-packager's...
[10:13] <Riddell> does he say anything about qt?
[10:17] <apachelogger> Lure: so, I was talking to ScottK and he agreed that you should apply for per-package upload privledges to kubuntu-dev, then we would direct a recommendation to the developer membership board which then implements the permissions
[10:17] <Lure> Riddell: that it was behavioral change in qt 4.6 about expecting some rectangle to be initialized
[10:17] <Lure> http://lists.kde.org/?l=kdepim-users&m=126015050812564&w=2
[10:19] <Lure> Riddell: more background is actually here: http://mail.kde.org/pipermail/release-team/2009-December/003453.html
[10:19] <Lure> apachelogger: thanks
[10:19] <Lure> apachelogger: kubuntu-dev has regular meetings or is this done on kubuntu meetings?
[10:20] <apachelogger> Lure: seperate meetings organized as needed
[10:21] <apachelogger> Lure: I suppose you would follow https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/KubuntuDevelopers#Applying for kubuntu-dev membership
[10:21] <Lure> apachelogger: thanks, will do that
[10:22] <apachelogger> just focus on digikam and kipi-plugins in your application
[11:06] <Quintasan|Szel> How we are standing with packaging?
[11:17] <Riddell> decently
[11:30]  * Riddell uploads kde4libs
[11:33] <Riddell> wow, kubuntu_19_no_indent_kickoff_subtext.diff got merged?  that must have made seele's day
[11:34] <ScottK> Quintasan|Szel: I didn't hear from the lancelot dev, just went with soversion 0 because that's what it said in CMakeLists.txt.
[11:34] <ScottK> DarkwingDuck: Uploading's going along nicely.  Shouldn't be too long.
[11:55] <Lure> ScottK: did you have time to look into digikam/kipi-plugins backport request?
[11:55] <Lure>  bug 481851 and bug 481856
[12:06] <amichair> !info gnupg lucid
[12:09] <Mamarok> question about the qt4-multimedia package: is this that infamous Brisbane stuff?
[12:09] <Mamarok> (in the experimental PPA)
[12:12] <Riddell> yes
[12:13] <ghostcube> jussi01: normally i do try to solve the probs but iam lost in knetworkmanager so far :)
[12:20] <markey> hmm, I have a project (fetched from Git), it has a debian/ dir in it
[12:20] <markey> how to make a package of that?
[12:20] <markey> (sorry, forgot again...)
[12:20] <Riddell> markey: debuild
[12:20] <markey> thanks :)
[12:21] <markey> hmm
[12:21] <markey> I don't seem to have that
[12:21] <markey> ah
[12:21] <Riddell> apt-get install devscripts
[12:21] <markey> devscripts
[12:21] <markey> yes
[12:23] <markey> args, it started some "postfix" configuration tool
[12:23] <markey> no idea what info it wants from me
[12:23] <markey> is that important?
[12:24]  * markey shrugs
[12:24] <markey> got it
[12:26] <Riddell> I don't think that's important, one of the scripts in devscripts probably needs it but nothing I've used
[12:27] <markey> hmm btw, are there any known bugs with Karmic, regarding USB devices?
[12:27] <markey> my devices are randomly not found
[12:27] <markey> I think I heard some other guy has the same issue
[12:29] <markey> woops
[12:29] <markey> gpg: /tmp/debsign.IduhC84E/offlineimap_6.2.0.dsc: clearsign failed: secret key not available
[12:29] <markey> debsign: gpg error occurred!  Aborting....
[12:29] <markey> what now? :)
[12:29] <markey> needs a key?
[12:29] <markey> ah
[12:29] <markey> worked anyway
[12:29] <markey> got a .deb file
[12:29] <markey> great
[12:30] <markey> there we go :)
[12:30] <markey> worked nicely
[12:34] <Riddell> yeah that just means it isn't signed, which you only want if you're uploading to an archive anyway
[12:35] <Riddell> my USB devices work fine in karmic
[12:35] <Riddell> worth checking if hal sees them or not
[13:24] <rgreening> There's a new arora. I am packaging now for Lucid. Anyone care to be available to upload it?
[13:25] <rgreening> It will be required for Lucid as the current will ftbfs with qt 4.6
[13:26] <Riddell> rgreening: can do
[13:26] <rgreening> cool. ty Riddell. I see we do not have arora in our bzr.. should we add it?
[13:27] <Riddell> are we likely to have several people working on it at any one time?
[13:27] <Riddell> we do have packaging branches of most packages now if you feel the need but I don't think it's needed
[13:28] <rgreening> hmm... maybe not
[13:28] <rgreening> ok
[13:28] <rgreening> Im pretty much the arora king
[13:28] <rgreening> ha
[13:29] <rgreening> Riddell: I'll let you know as soon as it's built. I'll upload to my PPA so you can grab what you need.
[13:30] <rgreening> oh, actually, I'll upload to the ninja PPA to ensure it builds aghainst qt4.6 from there....
[13:45] <JontheEchidna> good morning all
[13:45] <rgreening> o/
[13:46] <Riddell> why it's the lovely JontheEchidna
[13:47] <rgreening> Riddell: arora is uploaded to ninjas PPA. I'll let you know when it builds for Lucid. What will we do for Karmic? Suggestions? I'd like to have it build against qt4.6, which means we leave it wherever we house backports for Karmic KDE...
[13:48] <Lex79> hi JontheEchidna :)
[13:49] <Riddell> rgreening: it can go in experimental short term.  if we backports qt4.6 and kde 4.4 to karmic it can live alongside that
[13:50] <rgreening> will experimental have qt4.6? I believe Lex79 has started karmic backport of 4.4
[13:50] <Lex79> rgreening: qt 4.6 for karmic is already in staging
[13:51] <rgreening> :)
[13:51] <rgreening> cool
[13:51]  * txwikinger is tired of all those bugs all the time :(
[13:51] <txwikinger> Hi Riddell - Did you have a nice holiday?
[13:51] <rgreening> Lex79: I'll upload arora there shortly then...
[13:51] <Lex79> rgreening: ok
[13:51] <Riddell> txwikinger: lots of snow
[13:52] <rgreening> Lex79: in the backports, I am assuming we are reverting the boost back to 1.38 from 1.40... correct?
[13:52] <Lex79> rgreening: yes
[13:52] <JontheEchidna> We had snow here too. A good half meter.
[13:52] <rgreening> k. I'll try and give a hand today to backport...
[13:52] <rgreening> Did we finish the Lucid stuff?
[13:53] <ScottK> Lure: I did not.  I do think that we ought to have the crashes fixed in -updates.  Would it be possible to get patches for that too?
[13:53] <Lex79> rgreening: no, I have to finish kdepim and maco kdeedu
[13:55] <rgreening> ok... did bindings build after?
[13:56] <ScottK> Riddell: One thought I had on kde4libs: Agateau did his BIC change for the systray stuff after the beta was done.  Do we want to patch our kde4libs with that change so we don't need to worry about rebuilding stuff later?
[13:56] <Lex79> rgreening: we need to wait a fix for pykde4, doesn't want build
[13:56] <ScottK> rgreening: I believe we're doing to skip bindings.
[13:56] <Riddell> ScottK: hmm, I already uploaded
[13:56] <ScottK> Riddell: Never mind then.
[13:56] <rgreening> lol
[13:56] <ScottK> I should have thought of it yesterday
[13:56] <rgreening> bindings isn't in the PPA though
[13:57] <Lex79> I have this list-missing files for kdepim now http://pastebin.ca/1705550
[13:57] <ScottK> Riddell: Did you see we picked up sparc with qt4-x11 4.6.0?  So we aren't completely dead on ports (or course we'd pick the one that's unusable due to upstart).
[13:57] <Lex79> akonadi stuff is already in kdepim-runtime package
[13:58] <Lex79> and libmessageviewer* dunno where should go....
[13:58] <rgreening> Riddell: arora for Lucid should be good to go from PPA (of course need to update changelog to rm ~ppa2)
[13:59] <Riddell> ScottK: more importantly the timer is running on arm now
[13:59] <Riddell> Lex79: where does it come from?
[14:00] <ScottK> Riddell: Yes, although since that was a gcc bug, I'm not optimistic.
[14:00] <Riddell> rgreening: ok
[14:01] <Lex79> Riddell: kdepim, but I don't know where libmessageviewer* come from
[14:01] <txwikinger> Riddell: Hehe.. snow is starting here as well now.. I think rgreening got snowed in  ;)
[14:02] <rgreening> txwikinger: 38cm.. bah, that's nothing :P
[14:02] <rgreening> haha
[14:02] <txwikinger> well.. more than we had so far rgreening
[14:02] <ghostcube> Riddell: printer applet crash is not more after upgrading to 4.6 qt dont know if this was the solution but last update seems to fix this bug
[14:02] <rgreening> for sure
[14:03] <Riddell> rgreening: arora is due a merge from Debian, are you able to do that?
[14:05] <txwikinger> where does konqueror have the sessions saved / to be restored saved?
[14:06] <txwikinger> ah found it
[14:07] <rgreening> Riddell: I can look. I doubth there are any differences, as the upstream wants up to be as vanilla as possible and i have been :)
[14:07] <Lex79> Riddell: ok, found, libmessageviewer* is part of libkdepim4
[14:08] <txwikinger> too bad the bug and all the evidence is gone :D
[14:10] <txwikinger> Why is apachelogger questioning the existence of kubuntu?
[14:11] <Lex79> too drink
[14:11] <apachelogger> read the mail :P
[14:11]  * apachelogger knew the subject is too offensive -.0
[14:14] <txwikinger> apachelogger: I don't think the subject is too offensive, I just think it is phrase too harshly
[14:14] <txwikinger> phrased
[14:15]  * txwikinger would have rather said: What is the vision of Kubuntu for the next year
[14:15] <apachelogger> that is not what I asked for
[14:15] <txwikinger> Well.. if there is no vision you end up with your question
[14:16] <rgreening> Riddell: There are a couple of changes to merge from Debian (if that's what you meant)... I'll grab those an incorporate into my build...
[14:16] <rgreening> so, you can wait on upload of arora for a little bit...
[14:16] <apachelogger> otherway around, you cannot define a vision without knowing the reason of existance
[14:16] <apachelogger> eventually the vision is partially defined by it already
[14:16] <txwikinger> apachelogger: cognito ergo sum
[14:17] <apachelogger> say google is there to organize all the information of menkind
[14:17] <apachelogger> hence its long-term vision is to collect, organize and present all information it an get
[14:18] <txwikinger> apachelogger: that is its mission, not its vision
[14:18] <rgreening> hmm... nm Riddell, that would be a sync, which is not what you asked... go ahead and upload the arora.. I'll send our diff's to Debian (which is what you were asking) I bleive..
[14:18] <apachelogger> anyhow, the reason of existance originates in a problem
[14:19] <apachelogger> the problem being that information is unorganized and unusable and ugly and decentralized and whatnot
[14:19] <apachelogger> so what is the problem kubuntu originated from
[14:19]  * txwikinger rofls... now Kubuntu is a problem
[14:20] <JontheEchidna> kde svn 1059603
[14:20] <JontheEchidna> Lex79: ^
[14:20] <JontheEchidna> Fixes the KOrg crash with Qt 4.6
[14:21] <txwikinger> apachelogger: 1) Not everything that humanity does originates in solving a problem - you are too centred on Engineering
[14:21] <Lex79> uhm quassel crashes
[14:21] <apachelogger> so kubuntu is here because someone got drunk and thought it would be fun to prefix ubuntu with a k?
[14:21] <txwikinger> 2) The solution that Kubuntu provides is a KDE based debian-like system for end-users
[14:22] <apachelogger> so kubuntu provides a solution to no problem?
[14:22] <apachelogger> no wonder that doesnt work out
[14:22] <txwikinger> apachelogger: Well.. if you want to say it in that way.. Kubuntu is Riddell's fault :D
[14:22] <Lex79> JontheEchidna: ok I will add
[14:22] <JontheEchidna> thanks
[14:22] <apachelogger> txwikinger: that does not define the problem, does it?
[14:23] <txwikinger> what does not define the problem?
[14:23] <seele> Riddell: seriously? what's the commit note say?
[14:23] <txwikinger> and why do you need a problem?
[14:23] <apachelogger> txwikinger: kubuntu being Riddell's fault
[14:23] <apachelogger> txwikinger: there is a solution but no problem
[14:23] <apachelogger> the picture is incomplete
[14:23] <txwikinger> apachelogger: 2) The solution that Kubuntu provides is a KDE based debian-like system for end-users
[14:24] <tsimpson> txwikinger: but what makes it different from debian+kde?
[14:24] <apachelogger> that is not the question
[14:24] <apachelogger> why not do debian+kde
[14:24] <ScottK> apachelogger: My problem with the question is it's hard for me to answer it just in the context of Kubuntu.  For me, Kubuntu is at the interstection of Debian, KDE, and Ubuntu that makes it interesting.
[14:24] <txwikinger> debian does not have the same end-user focus tsimpson
[14:24] <txwikinger> why does Ubuntu exist? just take debian+gnome
[14:24] <ScottK> tsimpson: Non-ancient releases for one.
[14:24] <apachelogger> there you have a problem
[14:25] <apachelogger> problem uno: debian does ancient releases
[14:25] <apachelogger> solution: implement kubuntu
[14:25] <apachelogger> clearly that is not all, but one part of it
[14:25] <Lex79> ScottK, Riddell, JontheEchidna: <Lex79> sandsmark ! news ? :P
 no, the Qt build system still refuses to pick up the right include paths :>
[14:26] <ScottK> Urgh.
[14:26]  * txwikinger thinks students have far too much time to think about philosphical paradoxa
[14:26] <JontheEchidna> Lex79: I think that was the problem you were running in to with the pulse stuff
[14:26] <ScottK> Thanks for the update.
[14:26] <Lex79> JontheEchidna: yep
[14:26]  * txwikinger wonders if apacheloggercan find a solution to that problem
[14:26] <JontheEchidna> fun...
[14:26] <Lex79> JontheEchidna: that's the problem, patching Qt build system
[14:26] <ScottK> apachelogger: Another factor is the Ubuntu approach to community that is very different than in Debian.
[14:27] <apachelogger> different in what ways, and what makes it superior to the debian way
[14:27]  * txwikinger does not know any debian LoCos
[14:27] <JontheEchidna> Ubuntu is less RTFM
[14:27] <Riddell> rgreening: what changes exist in the arora packaging since we last merged, and can we include those?
[14:27] <apachelogger> txwikinger: there is no paradox in attaching a problem to a solution and a solution to a problem
[14:28] <apachelogger> one cannot exist without the other obviously
[14:28] <JontheEchidna> More collaborative, in some ways too.
[14:28] <txwikinger> apachelogger: Well.. it is a little bit like the chicken and the egg
[14:28] <apachelogger> of course it is
[14:28] <txwikinger> and as I said before.... humanity is not solely problem-centric
[14:28] <apachelogger> but since we have a good idea of what the solution looks like, we can try to reproduce the problem
[14:29] <apachelogger> txwikinger: you yourself also said that kubuntu solves something :P
[14:29] <txwikinger> Well apachelogger - and I am very content with that
[14:30]  * Riddell uploads 4.3.4 kde-l10n to updates PPA
[14:30] <txwikinger> Kubuntu solved txwikinger's problem of finding a good distro that he is happy to use
[14:30] <txwikinger> apachelogger: case closed :p
[14:30] <ScottK> apachelogger: Ubuntu approach is more collaborative in many ways (and not just CoC).  For example if I want to make a change that touches a bunch of packages, I get a spec approved and then just do it.  In Debian I'd have to go convince every maintainer.
[14:30] <apachelogger> txwikinger: finding a good distro is not a problem :P
[14:30] <apachelogger> indeed it is more of a solution path
[14:31] <nixternal> ScottK: I forgot how to upload stuff :p
[14:31] <apachelogger> you find that all distros suck because of A and B and C, hence you search for a godo distro, finding kubuntu
[14:31] <ScottK> nixternal: I'm not suprised.
[14:31] <apachelogger> problem - path - solution
[14:31]  * txwikinger thinks we need to start at the beginning and define the term "problem"
[14:31] <nixternal> ScottK: telnet right? or is it ftp?
[14:31] <nixternal> :p
[14:32] <txwikinger> nixternal: Well.. too long on the bicycle? Sucked all the oxygen out of your brain?
[14:32] <apachelogger> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Problem
[14:32]  * txwikinger finds that Wikipedia does not satisfy a truly academic standard and needs at least another relevant reference apachelogger
[14:34] <apachelogger> txwikinger: http://scholar.google.com knock yourself out
[14:34] <apachelogger> ScottK: there, you could write that :)
[14:34] <txwikinger> well.. not sure that scholar.google.com has a higher standard than wikipedia
[14:36] <apachelogger> oh well
[14:36]  * txwikinger is going to paint a painting and afterwoods ponders what problem that painting has solved
[14:36] <apachelogger> how does one put that
[14:36] <apachelogger> google scholar is an index
[14:36] <txwikinger> s/afterwoods/afterwards/
[14:36] <apachelogger> wikipedia is a encyclopedia
[14:36] <apachelogger> a bit of a difference
[14:37] <txwikinger> apachelogger: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophical_problems
[14:37] <apachelogger> sensible paper would be appreciated :P
[14:38] <txwikinger> apachelogger has a philosophical problem in the existence of Kubuntu... let's start refine the problem
[14:39]  * apachelogger is wondering how it became his problem, but oh well..
[14:40] <txwikinger> apachelogger: Well I think you are the only one who has raised it :D
[14:41]  * txwikinger is in a good mood today and has fun pulling apachelogger's leg
[14:43] <rgreening> Riddell: no debian changes... just ubuntu ones... my mistake
[14:45] <rgreening> Riddell: let me review the patches again... wait on upload.
[14:46] <Riddell> rgreening: there are changes in debian
[14:47] <rgreening> hmm...https://merges.ubuntu.com/a/arora/arora_0.10.1-1ubuntu1.patch
[14:47] <rgreening> looks like only ubuntu stuff
[14:47] <Riddell> rgreening: there's the changelog if nothing else :)
[14:48] <Riddell> rgreening: I presume patches 01 04 and 05 come from upstream?  has 06 been sent upstream?
[14:49] <rgreening> Riddell: yeah, Im going to review these.. give me a few
[14:50] <rgreening> Riddell: you added 06.. did you send to upstream?
[14:50] <Riddell> don't think I did
[14:51] <rgreening> hehe. I'll talk to upstream about it
[14:53] <Lex79> JontheEchidna: I pushed kdepim to bzr with fix for korg crash, I have to go now.
[14:53] <JontheEchidna> thanks
[14:55] <Riddell> rgreening: ok I'll merge in Debian's changelog and upload
[14:56] <rgreening> Riddell: wait till I review the patches again...
[14:56] <rgreening> give me a few more minutes...
[14:57] <rgreening> Riddell: patch 01 looks like it nevewr got applied upstream in release 0.10.2
[14:57] <rgreening> which is odd
[14:59] <Riddell> does upstream have a trunk?
[14:59] <rgreening> yeah, Im wondering if the 0.10.2 release is just a fix for the FTBFS on qt 4.6
[15:00] <rgreening> but icefox isnt around
[15:01] <Riddell> the sources have a small diff so I'd expect it is
[15:02] <ScottK> apachelogger: The bots in #kubuntu-bugs are confused.  Do you have the power to kill one?
[15:04] <rgreening> Riddell: yeah, apparantly looking at trunk and the 0.10.2 release, they are significantly different. Im guessing icefox released 0.10.2 as a pure bugfix to the one issue... FTBFS against qt4.6, so go ahead and upload 0.10.2 as provided.
[15:04] <ScottK> tsimpson or jussi01: Help.  Bots out of control in #kubuntu-bugs.
[15:07] <Quintasan> I go to school - it's dark outside, I come back - it's dark outside too :D
[15:10] <rgreening> Riddell: confirmation here.. http://arorabrowser.blogspo
[15:12] <apachelogger> Quintasan: I always loved that
[15:13] <Riddell> rgreening: so I'm good to upload with the changelog updated?
[15:13] <rgreening> yep
[15:13] <rgreening> :)
[15:14] <rgreening> and we get some real qt 4.6 goodness in this version.
[15:18] <Riddell> uploaded
[15:18] <Quintasan> yay, we're done ?
[15:20] <Riddell> we're done with arora
[15:20] <Quintasan> oh :P
[15:20] <Riddell> I wonder how the beta is compiling
[15:20] <Riddell> qt failed on arm
[15:20] <Riddell> :(
[15:21] <ScottK> kdelibs is done
[15:21] <Riddell> nice
[15:21] <ScottK> ~half and hour until the next wave can start to build.
[15:23] <ScottK> Riddell: Qt4 failure on arm is different.  It's not an ICE anymore, so this is good news.
[15:25] <rgreening> uploaded arora for Karmic to staging.
[15:26] <EagleScreen> cool
[15:27] <JontheEchidna> kde4libs is actaully building on powerpc
[15:27] <JontheEchidna> er, sparc
[15:28] <JontheEchidna> both end in 'c' ;-)
[15:28] <markey> hmm
[15:28]  * markey would love to have a NEON style build of KDE SC 4.4
[15:28] <markey> that would rock
[15:28] <markey> nicely sandboxed
[15:28] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: Yep.  Qt4 actually built on sparc this time.
[15:28] <markey> normal upgrade is too risky here currently
[15:28] <Riddell> ScottK: that's the same build failure I've seen before
[15:28] <ScottK> markey: I think Quintasan|Szel was working on ressurecting it.
[15:28] <markey> oh great :)
[15:29] <markey> NEON was damn nice
[15:30] <ScottK> Riddell: That's different than the RC one (it was an ICE).  cjwatson proposed a workaround last week that didn't work with the ICE, so I've asked him about trying it again.
[15:31] <Quintasan> ScottK: just use Quintasan, I have highlight on |Szel when I'm on phone :P
[15:32] <Quintasan> oh autocomplete prefers Szel then :P
[15:32] <ScottK> Quintasan: OK.  That one comes up first in Quassel's tab completion.
[15:32] <ScottK> Yep
[15:32] <markey> Quintasan: do have a rough ETA for this? :)
[15:33] <Quintasan> markey: not really an ETA since apachelogger commited some chages yesterday and we were working on 4.4
[15:33] <markey> ah ok
[15:33] <Quintasan> but I'm starting sync with upstream now
[15:34] <markey> hmm
[15:34] <Quintasan> if no problems occur it should be ready tomorrow
[15:34] <markey> shuttleworth should pay some more Kubuntu devs
[15:34] <Quintasan> He'd better sponsor me to go to UDS next year :P
[15:34] <markey> e.g. apachelogger and you ;)
[15:34] <markey> that would be well invested money
[15:34] <apachelogger> markey: you could tell him right now :P
[15:34] <markey> I'm too shy
[15:35] <markey> :>
[15:35] <apachelogger> sabdfl: ^
[15:35] <Quintasan> lol
[15:35] <ScottK> markey: I suspect Kubuntu needs to give more commercial value first.
[15:35]  * ScottK waves to agateau.
[15:35] <apachelogger> ScottK: chicken-egg
[15:35] <apachelogger> yet again
[15:35] <Quintasan> we'd better hack ubuntu.com to point to kubuntu.org
[15:35] <ScottK> apachelogger: It's a problem.
[15:35] <Quintasan> :P
[15:36]  * agateau waves back at ScottK
[15:36] <markey> if my predictions are right (I love playing the hobby analyst), KDE is gonna take off big time anyway
[15:36] <markey> because of the widespread usage of Qt, etc
[15:36] <ScottK> markey: I hope so.
[15:36] <markey> Nokia and all
[15:36] <markey> so...
[15:36] <markey> I wouldn't invest in GTK at this point :)
[15:36] <markey> but then, I'm not the rich dude
[15:36] <Quintasan> >GTK
[15:36] <Quintasan> :|
[15:36] <ScottK> Of course agateau is paid to do KDE stuff that we benifit from, so that's an increased investment.
[15:36] <apachelogger> markey: you are rich in love
[15:36]  * apachelogger hugs markey
[15:36] <markey> awwww
[15:37]  * markey rehugs apachelogger
[15:37] <Quintasan> lol :D
[15:37]  * ScottK reminds agateau that today is his day for BIC changes in kdelibs.
[15:37] <Quintasan> damn I forgot
[15:37] <ScottK> ;-)
[15:38] <agateau> ScottK: I am all set! :)
[15:38] <Quintasan> who should I poke to give me some feedback on my MOTU application?
[15:38] <ScottK> agateau: Seriously, congratulations on getting that in.
[15:38] <Quintasan> or I shouldn't apply for MOTU after the archive reorg?
[15:38] <ScottK> Quintasan: Do you want to be MOTU or kubuntu-dev?
[15:39]  * apachelogger would really say motu
[15:40] <markey> it could be funny to make a blog about "10 IT Predictions For The Future", and then, looking at it again in two years or so
[15:40] <markey> seeing how much you got right
[15:40] <apachelogger> indeed
[15:40] <Quintasan> apachelogger, ScottK: kubuntu-dev is higher than MOTU?
[15:40] <markey> I have some interesting predictions collected already
[15:40] <apachelogger> though I think that is what any major mainstream news site does anyway :P
[15:40] <apachelogger> guess and spread rumours, see what becomes true :D
[15:41] <Quintasan> and then profit on page views if you were right :P
[15:41] <ScottK> Quintasan: Different.  MOTU lets you upload all of Universe.  Kubuntu-dev lets you upload Kubuntu (Main).
[15:41] <Quintasan> ScottK: MOTU then
[15:42] <ScottK> OK.
[15:42] <ScottK> Quintasan: Give me a link.
[15:42] <Quintasan> ScottK: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/MichalZajac/MOTUApplication
[15:42] <Quintasan> I probably need to write something more
[15:43] <markey> thinking a bit further, Canonical could also sponsor Amarok a bit ;)
[15:43] <markey> I think we wouldn't mind
[15:44] <markey> wanted a new Porsche anyway
[15:44] <markey> old one got dusty and all
[15:44] <Quintasan> :D
[15:45] <Quintasan> Mark's probably sitting there and shaking his head in disbelief ;P
[15:46] <ScottK> Nah, this is pretty mild.
[15:46] <ScottK> Ask nixternal about it.
[15:46] <rgreening> hehe... no stepchild remarks, so we are peachy :)
[15:47]  * apachelogger nods
[15:47] <rgreening> I think agateau has help displace that old thought
[15:47] <rgreening> :)
[15:47] <rgreening> yay for agateau... he deserves a raise :P
[15:47] <apachelogger> nah nah, it has just become less easy to find examples :P
[15:48] <apachelogger> I am sure nixternal can still can up with some :D
[15:48] <agateau> rgreening: hehe :)
[15:48] <Quintasan> :D
[15:48] <apachelogger> int checkFileReadable(char *file)
[15:49] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: did you look at gluon after?
[15:49] <apachelogger> I think implementing that function is more work than just doing what it is supposed to do
[15:49] <apachelogger> not to mention the additional writing -.-
[15:50] <ghostcube> ewhm is the Qt 4.6 in ppa backports or staging
[15:50] <maco> can you comment things out in debian/*.install ?
[15:50] <Quintasan> apachelogger: do we want a package for gluon?
[15:50] <apachelogger> if only I knew what gluon is
[15:50] <apachelogger> maco: #yes
[15:51] <rgreening> ghostcube: we are working on karmic backports but first in staging... which we will copy to backports when ready... (if that makes sense)
[15:51] <maco> apachelogger: great thanks
[15:51] <maco> apachelogger: game engine or something from the website
[15:51] <apachelogger> yw
[15:51] <ghostcube> rgreening: hmm i thought so too but the staging ppa on LP doesnt show the packages i updated yesterday
[15:51] <ghostcube> ahhh no the new "cool" lp look
[15:51] <ghostcube> -_-
[15:51] <apachelogger> mhhh fancy icon
[15:51] <rgreening> lol
[15:51] <apachelogger> <3 gluon
[15:52] <ScottK> Quintasan: Endorsed.
[15:52] <Quintasan> ScottK: thanks
[15:52] <Quintasan> hey I can also poke JontheEchidna and apachelogger
[15:52] <JontheEchidna> rgreening: was planning on it, but then X decided to die on me... I'm in Windows at the moment
[15:53] <rgreening> X(
[15:53] <apachelogger> Quintasan: no dont be silly ... no endorsement from me until gluon is in the archives :P
[15:53] <rgreening> ghostcube: did you use this to upload... dput ppa:kubuntu-ppa/staging <source.changes>
[15:53] <Quintasan> lol
[15:53] <Quintasan> brb :P
[15:54] <apachelogger> that is if there is a release at all
[15:54] <rgreening> ghostcube: for ppa: https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ppa/+archive/staging
[15:54] <ghostcube> nah i havent uploaded to ppa i cant do so i just searched some packages i dled last nicht and installed to a friends pc
[15:54] <apachelogger> code in git looks pretty moving
[15:54] <ghostcube> :)
[15:54] <ghostcube> rgreening: thx
[15:54] <rgreening> ghostcube: and don't forget to ~karmic1 them in the changelog :)
[15:55] <ghostcube> :)
[15:55] <apachelogger> Quintasan: given the WIP nature a ppa might be more suited, or you could talk to upstream what they prefer
[15:55] <rgreening> heres the current uploads for karmic in staging filtered.. ghostcube: https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ppa/+archive/staging?field.series_filter=karmic
[15:56] <Quintasan> apachelogger: let me first get stuff in a package then I will annoy upstream :P
[15:56] <ghostcube> \O/ found it
[15:56] <ghostcube> :D
[15:56] <apachelogger> Quintasan: why not do that at the same time :P
[15:56] <apachelogger> since you need to wait for a testbuild
[15:57]  * Quintasan is too lazy to search for contact info now
[15:57] <Quintasan> It can wait :P
[15:57] <apachelogger> you need to find contact infor for copyright file anyway:P
[15:57] <Quintasan> hurr
[15:57] <Quintasan> :S
[15:58] <Quintasan> bug #666
[15:58] <Quintasan> :D
[15:58] <Lure> ScottK: does it really make sense to do SRU for single fix for beta version if RC/final is available? I think SRU rules should bend here a bit
[15:59] <Lure> and we should never ship beta SW again
[15:59] <ScottK> Lure: You'd need to take that up with someone in ubuntu-sru.  I don't think -backports is a substitute for fixing crashers in an SRU.
[16:00] <Lure> ScottK: I do not see it as substitute, but rather a measure until we get it into -updates
[16:00] <apachelogger> Lure: just not make the backport claim to fix the crashes
[16:00] <Lure> ScottK: and we do not want first rc and then final in -updates
[16:00] <apachelogger> but only once it enters updates
[16:00] <ScottK> Lure: OK.  Let me look at the bugs.
[16:01] <Quintasan> apachelogger: the package should be libgluon rather than gluon?
[16:01] <apachelogger> depends on what it contains really :P
[16:01] <apachelogger> Quintasan: from looking at the youtub video I suppose you need libgluon0, libgluon-dev and gluon-kcm
[16:02] <apachelogger> at the very least that is, possibly more
[16:02] <ScottK> Quintasan: You should also talk to Debian KDE people on #debian-qt-kde (OFTC) if you have doubts about naming.
[16:02] <Lure> ScottK, apachelogger: I will try to talk with someone from -sru about options of having final in -updates
[16:03] <ScottK> Lure: I need the backports bugs to say that you've tested that it builds, installs, and runs on Karmic.
[16:03] <Lure> ScottK: will add - I am running the tests for whole day now
[16:03] <ScottK> Lure: OK.  Ping me after you've added.
[16:03] <Lure> ScottK: and there are other users currently using my ppa
[16:04] <EagleSn> will you put Qt 4.6 for karmic in Updates PPA?
[16:04] <ScottK> Lure: I don't doubt it works fine, I just need it to say that in the bug.
[16:04] <Lure> ScottK: I know
[16:04] <ScottK> EagleSn: Backports PPA
[16:04] <EagleSn> oh, yes, it is logical
[16:06] <Lure> ScottK: have added comments about tests - thanks for looking at this
[16:06] <markey> how to make a package sticky again? I forget, once again...
[16:07] <ScottK> Lure: Looking
[16:07] <markey> googling gives me results about sticky notes
[16:08] <apachelogger> s/sticky/pin
[16:08] <markey> aaaah
[16:08] <markey> right
[16:08]  * markey googles
[16:08] <apachelogger> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PinningHowto#Apt/Dpkg
[16:08] <apachelogger> markey: ^
[16:08] <markey> thx dude :)
[16:08] <apachelogger> yw
[16:10] <ScottK> Riddell: Bug #481856 and Bug #481851 are acked by ubuntu-backporters now.  Would you please don your archive-admin hat and do the backports.
[16:12] <Lure> ScottK: thanks
[16:12] <Riddell> ok (shortly)
[16:16] <JontheEchidna> Quintasan: feedback'd. Good luck
[16:18] <Quintasan> JontheEchidna: thanks
[16:20] <Quintasan> Riddell: mind giving some feedback on my MOTU application? https://wiki.kubuntu.org/MichalZajac/MOTUApplication
[16:26] <Riddell> Quintasan: maybe link to some uploads that have you in the chanelog?
[16:28] <Quintasan> sounds good
[16:31] <Quintasan> satan is after me
[16:31] <nixternal> jeesh, only 10:30 and I am starving
[16:31] <Quintasan> Need to get 66.6MB/169MB :/
[16:32] <Lex79> someone is working on kdeartwork? it's ftbs in ninja ppa and neversfelde is on vacation this week
[16:34] <ScottK> Probably not then.
[16:35] <Lex79> Ok I can do
[16:36] <ScottK> maco: Did edu ever get done?
[16:37] <maco> ScottK: i *think* this build should work. pbuilder's still running
[16:37] <ScottK> maco: Great.  Thanks.
[16:37] <maco> where do i shove it when done?
[16:37] <maco> is it the ~kubuntu-ninjas ppa?
[16:38] <maco> cuz i dont think im in that team
[16:38] <maco> (guessing by wiki page name)
[16:38] <ScottK> maco: Push it to kubuntu-ppa staging PPA
[16:38] <maco> do i have access to that?
[16:40]  * ScottK looks
[16:41] <ScottK> Actually, maco: Just push it to your PPA and I'll grab it from there.
[16:41] <maco> ok
[16:41] <ScottK> You can make your PPA depend on that one.
[17:01] <Quintasan> oh shi :/
[17:01] <maco> shi?
[17:02] <maco> why?
[17:02] <Quintasan> shit
[17:02] <maco> i figured :P
[17:02] <maco> asking why?
[17:02] <Quintasan> anyone with fast upload speed? uploading nightly will be a PITA with mine
[17:02] <Quintasan> 150 mb with average of 20kb/s :/
[17:03] <Quintasan> and that's only libs T_T
[17:03] <ScottK> Anyone want to fix Qt4 on armel?
 ScottK: the assembler output indicates that the problem is in explicit asm on line 361 of src/corelib/arch/qatomic_arm.h
 ScottK: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ARM/Thumb2 has advice for dealing with those
[17:03] <ScottK> ^^^ say's it's doable by someone with enough knowledge.
[17:04] <ScottK> (i.e. not me)
[17:04] <Quintasan> sorry no assembler knowledge :/
[17:04] <maco> ive never done arm assembly, but its sposed to be not too different from mips as they're both risc...
[17:05] <ScottK> Sounds like an excellent learning experience then.
[17:05]  * Quintasan tries to understand what maco said
[17:05] <maco> Quintasan: i know assembly for a similar architecture
[17:05]  * Quintasan bows towards maco
[17:06] <Quintasan> assembly @_@
[17:06]  * rgreening hasn't touched assembly in like 18+yrs
[17:06] <rgreening> and even then, it was a PDP-11... haha
[17:06] <Quintasan> assembly is just like talking with cpu one on one?
[17:06] <ghostcube> :D
[17:06] <ghostcube> pdp 11 lol
[17:06] <ghostcube> long time no see
[17:06] <ghostcube> :D
[17:06] <maco> Quintasan: well you still get to use ascii instead of binary
[17:06] <Quintasan> too bad :P
[17:07]  * Quintasan imagined assembly as feeding the computer with 0 's and 1's at first
[17:08] <maco> nah, the assembler converts the assembly from ascii to 0s and 1s
[17:08] <ScottK> maco: cjwatson came up with something else to try.
[17:08] <maco> the way i was taught to write compilers (and i think the way gcc works) is that you compile from your high level language to assembly and then hand it off to the assembler
[17:08] <Quintasan> NOW I know that, I used to think like this, seemed like black magic or something
[17:08] <maco> ah ok
[17:09] <maco> Quintasan: in the 70s you could flip little switches to talk to your personal computer in octal!
[17:09] <maco> ScottK: is this in #ubuntu-devel or in pm?
[17:09] <ScottK> maco: u-d
[17:09] <Quintasan> hmm I need to build an regexp :/
[17:09] <Riddell> Quintasan: I have a computer in the back room here with good bandwidth, but it isn't always turned on
[17:11] <Quintasan> Riddell: Now there is one more problem, those files need to be signed by someone :P
[17:11]  * Quintasan doesn't feel like uploading his key somewhere :P
[17:11] <Riddell> there are ways to do remote signing
[17:12] <ScottK> Quintasan: Make a dedicated key for the purpose.
[17:13] <Quintasan> sounds good, Riddell, I would need to run the project-neon script from there since it would be faster than uploading diff's patches etc.
[17:22] <Quintasan> apachelogger: finished gluon, uploading to my ppa, I demand endorsment now! :P
[17:26] <rgreening> maco, are you a kubuntu-member yet? If so, you should ask to become a ninja :)
[17:27]  * rgreening thinks Riddell would approve that :)
[17:27] <maco> rgreening: yes i am
[17:27] <maco> rgreening: just cuz we united to freak you out during Doctor Who: The Water on Mars...
[17:27] <rgreening> :)
[17:28] <rgreening> no, because you know the answer to the right question!
[17:28] <maco> ninjas isnt something that takes >1 person to approve?
[17:29] <maco> i thought *everything* took a half dozen people to approve
[17:29] <Quintasan> I approve, this should be enough ;)
[17:29] <rgreening> maco: well, if you package kde, and want to help with each release, I think it's a no brainer.. you are a member and know packaging and are packaging kdeedu... seems to me to be a foregone conclusion... +10 from me .. there...
[17:30] <rgreening> :P
[17:30] <Quintasan> kubotu: order cookies for maco
[17:30]  * kubotu slides a whole bunch of world's finest cookies down the bar to maco.
[17:30]  * Quintasan pokes apachelogger
[17:30] <maco> ooooo! cookies!
[17:30]  * Riddell gets the hint and adds maco to ~kubuntu-ninjas
[17:31] <maco> haha
[17:31] <maco> thanks
[17:31] <rgreening> \o/
[17:31] <Riddell> if rgreening bats his eyelids at me I'll do practically anything
[17:31] <rgreening> see maco, not so difficult
[17:31]  * rgreening bats eyelids
[17:32] <rgreening> show us yer sporin
[17:32] <rgreening> :)
[17:32]  * rgreening is bad
[17:33] <Quintasan> apachelogger needs to be poked many times before he wakes up
[17:33] <rgreening> ty Riddell, now maco, you can upload kdeedu to ~kubuntu-ninjas
[17:33]  * Quintasan pokes apachelogger with a stick
[17:33] <rgreening> Riddell: maco will need perms for batcave too at some point...
[17:34] <maco> the kubuntu team seems to have extra layers of indirection just to confuse newbies like me
[17:34] <maco> or at least extra code words
[17:34] <Quintasan> anyways
[17:34] <Quintasan> apachelogger: check my ppa for gluon, three hours to start building :P
[17:35] <rgreening> ninjas and batcave and timelord, we have an affinity for bad tv!
[17:35]  * Quintasan is heading to books
[17:35]  * maco throws things at rgreening
[17:35] <maco> Doctor Who is NOT bad tv!
[17:35] <rgreening> lol
[17:35] <rgreening> low budget?
[17:35] <Lex79> ScottK: kdeartwork build fine in pbuilder and not in ppa :(
[17:35] <maco> not the new series
[17:35] <rgreening> no budget?
[17:35] <rgreening> :)
[17:36] <ScottK> Lex79: In ~kubuntu-ninjas?
[17:36] <Lex79> ScottK: yeah
[17:36]  * rgreening is a fan of the series ... but it fits my style of humor, which most do not get..
[17:36] <JontheEchidna> ugh, forgot to push the libssh-dev dependency removal to kdebase-runtime in bzr
[17:36]  * JontheEchidna boots in to linux to fix
[17:36] <Lex79> lol
[17:38] <ScottK> rgreening: There's a lot about you that most do not get.
[17:38] <maco> rgreening: i <3 10th doctor, because there's so much intellectualism and curiosity in his seasons (yay RTD?) like "happy primes! what? dont they teach recreational mathematics anymore?" and "what happens when you put two identical sonic devices against each other? ... lets find out!"
[17:38] <ScottK> Lex79: So remove debian/tmp/usr/share/kde4/services/ScreenSavers/lockward.desktop from the install file and try again.
[17:38] <Lex79> ok
[17:40] <rgreening> ScottK: true.
[17:40] <rgreening> :P
[17:40]  * rgreening is ok with that
[17:41] <rgreening> maco: haha
[17:48]  * jussi01 sighs heavily....
[17:48] <jussi01> something is borked :/
[17:49] <jussi01> I have 3 different tv cards, none of them work. drivers load, but scanning... nothing... :/
[17:50]  * rgreening wonders how jussi01 watches 3 tv at once
[17:51] <ScottK> Riddell: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdebase-runtime/4:4.3.80-0ubuntu1/+build/1383352 - Jon the Taco's dropping of libssh-dev didn't make it into the archive either...
[17:51] <jussi01> rgreening: "I have 3 tv cards"... not "I watch 3 tv cards at once"....
[17:51] <rgreening> :>
[17:52] <rgreening> I hope they aren't via USB.. could be that bad port you have . hah
[17:52] <jussi01> rgreening: they are, but different pc...
[17:52] <Riddell> ScottK: it's not in bzr
[17:53] <rgreening> my friend just fried his gf PC with the same issue. Bad USB port killed the PWS
[17:53] <txwikinger> rgreening: that is called multi-tasking
[17:53] <ScottK> Riddell: I know he said something about disabling kio-sftp.  I don't know what he had to do for that.
[17:53] <ScottK> ENOTIME for me to look at it, $WORK meeting in 6 minuts.
[17:59] <JontheEchidna> Ok, so now the kubuntu partition is totally trashed :s
[17:59] <JontheEchidna> oh well, my fault
[17:59] <Riddell> !
[17:59]  * JontheEchidna downloads daily lucid iso
[18:02] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: kdebase-runtime still depends on libssh-dev in the archive.
[18:05] <JontheEchidna> yes, I forgot to push my last changes to bzr. But now I can't even get a tty on linux :(
[18:06] <Quintasan|Szel> poor JontheEchidna
[18:07] <JontheEchidna> I do believe that the root of my troubles are my computer dying during a pbuild that consumed all RAM/swap
[18:08] <JontheEchidna> so I think / got corrupted when I turned it off
[18:08] <Lex79> :(
[18:09] <JontheEchidna> lucily /home is on its own partition
[18:09] <nixternal> JontheEchidna: that happened to me a week or so ago
[18:09] <nixternal> which was somewhat of a blessing, as I have wanted to reformat/reinstall my machine since dapper :)
[18:10] <rgreening> Lex79, JontheEchidna: for the backports, are we backporting everything in the ninja PPA (eigen2, etc)
[18:11]  * JontheEchidna remembers when he was a noob and a package failing to install meant reinstalling
[18:11] <JontheEchidna> now I break the package management system on a regular basis testing :P
[18:14] <JontheEchidna> rgreening: pretty much
[18:15] <dantti> apachelogger: today I'm releasing a new KPK which will call the script with "DESKTOP=kde" env vars...
[18:15] <Lex79> rgreening: yes, but you have to grab debian/ dirs from updates PPA and not from ninja or bzr, JontheEchidna right?
[18:18] <JontheEchidna> In the past we've done it from bzr
[18:18] <JontheEchidna> we're just don't take the packaging from bzr when we are backporting things for -updates since we want the changes to be as minimal as possible
[18:20] <Lex79> JontheEchidna: in bzr there are also the merges, do we want that ?
[18:21] <JontheEchidna> yeah
[18:21] <JontheEchidna> it makes the final upgrades to ubuntu+1 easier
[18:22] <Lex79> ok, much easy then
[18:24] <rgreening> yeah....
[18:24] <rgreening> so, Lex79, JontheEchidna: I assume we also need soprano backported?
[18:24] <Lex79> rgreening: done
[18:24] <Lex79> in staging
[18:25] <rgreening> cool
[18:25] <rgreening> awesome
[18:25] <Lex79> phonon-backends too
[18:25] <rgreening> Lex79: eigen2 and libattica next?
[18:26] <Quintasan|Szel> I told ya, Lex79 is faster than my quadcore CPU
[18:26] <Lex79> no for now
[18:26] <Quintasan|Szel> :p
[18:26] <rgreening> ok, Lex79. let me know when you are ready to start on the kde stack... I can probably start helping...
[18:26] <Lex79> Quintasan|Szel: quadcore overclocked in my brain :P
[18:26] <Quintasan|Szel> you think of something - Lex has already done it :P
[18:27] <Lex79> rgreening: ok
[18:30] <Quintasan|Szel> coffee == my best friend
[18:34] <debfx> Riddell: is it ok if I put a copy of the firefox icon into the kmozillahelper package as it shouldn't depend on firefox and the icons of the firefox -branding packages have different names?
[18:34] <Riddell> debfx: no that won't get in the archive I'm afraid
[18:38] <debfx> Riddell: so kubuntu-firefox-installer is an excpetion to that rule? :)
[18:39] <Riddell> that shouldn't have a copy?  I rejected it from the New queue because it did on the first upload
[18:40] <ScottK> Speaking of which, Riddell: kdegraphics is in binary New.
[18:41] <Riddell> kdegraphics does like its unstable ABIs
[18:42] <Lex79> rgreening: can you do kdebase* ? I'm doing kdelibs
[18:42] <debfx> well it includes a firefox icon and says it's "MPL-1.1 or GPL-2 or LGPL-2.1"
[18:43] <ScottK> The problem isn't copyright, it's trademark, IIRC.
[18:43] <Riddell> hum
[18:44] <Riddell> ScottK: naw, the problem is copyright
[18:44] <ScottK> Oh.
[18:44] <Riddell> they use copyright restrictions when they should use trademark restrictions
[18:47] <Riddell> "Use proper Mozilla Firefox icon" says changelog
[18:47] <Riddell> apachelogger: was there some magic exception made for that?
[18:50] <debfx> Riddell: bug #457228 contains an explanation
[18:52] <Riddell> mm
[18:52] <Riddell> debian/copyright should be updated to reflect that
[18:53] <maco> building deb still failed :(
[18:59] <maco> i have no idea what im doing wrong now: http://paste.ubuntu.com/336739/
[19:05] <binarylooks> anybody knows the command to get a dbus list of messages that are possible?
[19:05] <debfx> but even if I include the firefox icon it won't match if the user installed the abrowser branding ...
[19:09] <tsimpson> binarylooks: use qdbus
[19:09] <ScottK> maco: I'd look around and see if that file is to be found in another location.
[19:10] <maco> ScottK: so login to pbuilder and manually build the deb (i forget how to do this, but dan told me what to say to debian/rules once) and then poke around a bit once it fails?
[19:10] <binarylooks> tsimpson: thanks, now I remember ;-)
[19:11] <ScottK> maco: Something like that.  Or use apachelogger's pbuilder hooks so that when the build fails it logs in automatically.
[19:11] <maco> ooo magic
[19:12] <Lex79> ScottK: can I delete the lucid packages from staging ppa or we still need?
[19:12] <ScottK> Lex79: Wait until they build in the archive.  kde4libs and pimlibs can go if you need space.
[19:13] <Lex79> ok
[19:22] <nixternal> so everything that was in kubuntu-ppa/backports is now in kubuntu-ppa/ppa I take it?
[19:23] <nixternal> so much stuff has changed around here that I think I may be no longer useful :(
[19:27] <smarter> http://cms.web.cern.ch/cms/Resources/Website/Media/Images/FirstCollisionPhotos/highres/0912208_37.jpg << KDE4(Fedora) running on a laptop at CERN showing some of the first "real" collisions in the LHC :)
[19:29] <Quintasan> :D
[19:36] <Daskreech> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Ninjas/PackagingLegend#preview
[19:36] <Daskreech> Can someone look at that for accuracy?
[19:42] <Quintasan> Daskreech: sounds good :)
[19:44] <ScottK> Turns out automatically coming back out of depwait is broken on soyuz now, so we get to manually retry everything anyway.
[19:44] <Daskreech> Quintasan: Sweet I'm going to flesh it out and put links to the packaging guide
[19:45] <Daskreech> so Everyone interested in the next Beta we can point them to the Ninja packaging wiki page so they can follow the progress and also get a little tut on how to package :)
[19:45] <Daskreech>  might encourage one ortwo more to help out
[19:45] <Daskreech> YOu mena you only have 4 packages left? Hmm welll maybe I'll try do one and see if that helps speed thigns up
[20:21] <rgreening> Lex79: I rave to run for a couple of hours, but if it isn't done by the tme I get back I can start on it...
[20:42] <Quintasan> I'm off, need to learn and do homework :)
[20:42] <ScottK> On the off chance anyone can remember KDE3, suggestions appreciated: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/klamav/0.46-3/+build/1350855/+files/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-i386.klamav_0.46-3_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[20:49] <Quintasan> rgreening, Riddell: Do you have anything you could add to Endorsements to my MOTU application? If you do please adding, if not feedback(what I can add there etc.) is welcome -> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/MichalZajac/MOTUApplication
[20:49]  * Quintasan pokes apachelogger with a longer stick
[20:49] <Quintasan> Don't think I forgot ;P
[20:50] <ScottK> Riddell: workspace is in Binary New.
[20:50] <Quintasan> s/adding/add
[20:50] <Quintasan> well I'm really off since I will get some bad marks for not doing home work
[20:52] <ScottK> Quintasan: Tell them you were busy changing the world for the better.  I'm sure you'll get a break.
[21:06] <apachelogger> Quintasan: if only I knew what to write, since I cant really remember working with you in recent times :S
[21:07] <apachelogger> makes endorsing a bit difficult
[21:07] <Daskreech> rgreening: ScottK had a message for you. Did you get it?
[21:08] <ScottK> apachelogger: Any chance you could look at kdebase-runtime.  Need ilbssh-dev dropped from build-depends and maybe some other stuff.  John the Taco may have but it in bzr.  We're getting to where we need that one fixed and I'm ENOTIME.
[21:08] <ScottK> Daskreech: Not that I'm aware of.  It's probably just as well.
[21:09] <Daskreech> the Bzr add thing ?
[21:12] <ScottK> Oh.  I read that backwards.
[21:12] <ScottK> Apparently not.
[21:12] <ScottK> Thanks for the reminder.
[21:16] <apachelogger> Riddell: see associated bug report, pitti stated that this is covered by the exception made for the icon in the firefox, I suppose that is since it excepts the icon not the package ;)
[21:17] <apachelogger> though I apparently forgot to update the copyright file
[21:23] <nixternal> can we remove sun-java stuff from kubuntu-restricted-extras?
[21:25] <apachelogger> ScottK: only libssh seems to be in universe
[21:25] <apachelogger> uploaded and pushed
[21:25] <ScottK> apachelogger: That's why it needs dropped for now (waiting for MIR approval)
[21:25] <ScottK> apachelogger: Thanks.
[21:39]  * ScottK tries to compose a suitably CoC complian reply to Dotan Cohen on kubuntu-devel and fails.
[21:39] <ScottK> complian/compliant
[22:03] <JontheEchidna> doh! I accidentally downloaded the karmic daily iso
[22:04] <Daskreech> There is a karmic daily?
[22:04] <JontheEchidna> apparently: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu/daily-live/current/
[22:05] <JontheEchidna> looks like the last one is 2 days before release
[22:07] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: This is a sign not to run Lucid yet and get actual productive work done.
[22:10] <Nightrose> -*- ScottK tries to compose a suitably CoC complian reply to Dotan Cohen on kubuntu-devel and fails.
[22:10] <Nightrose> i just had the same problem on the kde user list
[22:11] <ScottK> ;-)
[22:11] <ScottK> No CoC there though, is there?
[22:11] <Nightrose> http://www.kde.org/code-of-conduct/
[22:11] <Nightrose> i even helped write it...
[22:11]  * Nightrose slaps self
[22:11] <Nightrose> ;-)
[22:14] <Nightrose> hmmm looking at it it needs adjusting to the rebranding
[22:14] <Nightrose> narf
[22:14] <JontheEchidna> ScottK: too late :x
[22:15] <JontheEchidna> http://paste.ubuntu.com/336852/ if nobody gets to that by the time I have a dev env set up I'll do that
[22:16]  * ScottK wonders how edu is going for maco?
[22:17] <ScottK> Lex79: Still workingon artwork?
[22:17]  * maco stabs
[22:17] <maco> im about to head to class
[22:18] <txwikinger> ScottK: Don't bother to reply.. it is apachelogger
[22:18] <txwikinger> 's problem now :D
[22:21] <Lex79> ScottK: it's ftbs only on i386 in ninja ppa
[22:21] <ScottK> Progress then.
[22:22] <JontheEchidna> artwork is notorious for building differently in a main-only pbuilder and the buildds
[22:23] <Lex79> JontheEchidna: do you know why?
[22:23] <JontheEchidna> I've not figured that one out
[22:28] <Lex79> kdepim still needs upload
[22:35] <ScottK> Riddell: kdegames is in Binary New.
[22:37] <ScottK> Quintasan: How is kdenetwork supposed to build with libortp-dev in Universe?  Is there a MIR?
[22:37]  * JontheEchidna fixes kdepimlibs upgrade error
[22:38] <JontheEchidna> grr, need build-deps. Will upload after dinner
[22:43] <Lex79> I finished to uploading all packages to staging, missing for now edu and artwork
[22:57] <JontheEchidna> found a kde4libs upgrade error on an upgrade from karmic, uploading a fix
[23:08] <Lex79> maybe it was not a bad thing that you downloaded karmic instead lucid :)
[23:08] <debfx> why doesn't libqt4-dev depend on libx11-dev anymore?
[23:08] <JontheEchidna> oh, so that's what happened...
[23:09] <JontheEchidna> maybe it was dropped (accidentally?) during the merge?
[23:09] <Lex79> ahhhhhhhhh !!!
[23:10] <Lex79> I have to check
[23:12] <ScottK> Lex79: Did you see the Qt4 armel discussion on #ubuntu-devel just now?
[23:12] <Lex79> looking now
[23:13] <debfx> a dependency on libx11-dev would be useful as cmake's FindQt4 fails without it
[23:14] <JontheEchidna> kubuntu-dev's can't upload kde4libs at the moment
[23:15] <JontheEchidna> or kdepimlibs
[23:25] <Lex79> JontheEchidna: Riddell removed some deps for libqt4-dev in this revision: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/qt/ubuntu/revision/32
[23:25] <Lex79> he said in commit  "we shouldn't need those now"
[23:25] <JontheEchidna> I guess we do if FindQt4 fails without it
[23:26] <Lex79> yeah we do
[23:32] <JontheEchidna> a kubuntu-dev can't upload qt4-x11 either v.v
[23:34] <Riddell> I was hoping we could match debian with those
[23:35] <Riddell> they were added when debian used the experimental minimal linking stuff while we didn't
[23:38] <ScottK> Riddell and JontheEchidna: There's a good chance cjwatson's work on armel may yield us a building Qt4 tomorrow, can that one wait a day?
[23:44] <ScottK> Someone please summon the ghost of claydoh so we can get him to work on release notes for Alpha 1.
[23:44] <nixternal> jeesh, I was typing 'debuild -ns' and going nuts on why it wasn't working...damn 's'! debuild -nc!!!
[23:45] <nixternal> has anyone packaged KDevelop 4.0 beta6 and kdevplatform and stuff?
[23:46] <JontheEchidna> yeah, it's in lucid
[23:47] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: What needs uploading?
[23:48] <nixternal> JontheEchidna: what good is it doing there? it needs to be in karmic too :)
[23:48] <JontheEchidna> ScottK: kdepimlibs and kde4libs from bzr
[23:48] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: OK.  Looking.
[23:54] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: pimlibs uploaded.
[23:55] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: There's a large number of changes in the symbols file for kde4libs from what's in the archive.  Which is correct?
[23:55] <JontheEchidna> changes in the symbol files?
[23:56] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: Grab the source from the archive and then diff the debian dir from what's in bzr.
[23:56]  * JontheEchidna just pulled from bzr and edited debian/control
[23:57] <ScottK> No doubt, but it needs to get sorted.  I have to go cook dinner here in a few minutes.
[23:57] <JontheEchidna> Lex79: any knowledge on^?