[13:54] <zul> gday
[13:55] <sommer> yo
[13:57] <jjohansen> morning
[14:00] <smoser> \o
[14:00] <ttx> o/
[14:00] <jjohansen> here
[14:01] <ttx> zul, soren: ?
[14:01] <zul> hello
[14:01] <ScottK> \o
[14:01] <ttx> Lots of absence today, let's get started
[14:02] <zul> must be the snow
[14:02] <ttx> #startmeeting
[14:02] <MootBot> Meeting started at 08:02. The chair is ttx.
[14:02] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[14:02] <ttx> Welcome to the server team meeting !
[14:02] <ttx> Agenda at: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting
[14:02] <ttx> [TOPIC] Scribe assignment
[14:02] <MootBot> New Topic:  Scribe assignment
[14:03] <ttx> This is about who should write the meeting minutes.
[14:03] <ttx> Our new beloved leader wants to:
[14:03] <ttx> * Share the burden
[14:03] <ttx> * Shared responsibility
[14:03] <ttx> * Visibility in the community
[14:04] <alexm> o/
[14:04] <ttx> so we'll rotate every week between the server team engineers so that everyone gets a chance
[14:04] <Daviey> \o
[14:04] <ttx> alphabetically
[14:04] <ttx> I'll start this week
[14:04] <zul> umm...alphabetically by irc nick right?
[14:04]  * soren is here now
[14:05] <ttx> zul: yes
[14:05] <Daviey> "gets a chance" = "gets lumbered"
[14:05] <zul> ttx: sweet ;)
[14:06] <ttx> Daviey: right :)
[14:06] <ttx> So next week is ... zul
[14:06] <zul> *sigh*
[14:06] <ttx> For refernce, the process is explained at:
[14:06]  * smoser plans on playing irc name musical chairs around hist turn
[14:06] <ttx> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/KnowledgeBase#Team%20policy
[14:06] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/KnowledgeBase#Team%20policy
[14:07] <ttx> zul: you'll need to get access to the ubuntuserver blog, mathiaz can help
[14:07] <zul> k
[14:07] <ttx> yeepee, let's move on.
[14:07] <ttx> (note: our beloved leader is not part of the rotation)
[14:08] <ttx> [TOPIC] Review ACTION points from previous meeting
[14:08] <MootBot> New Topic:  Review ACTION points from previous meeting
[14:08] <ttx> Only one action recorded:
[14:08] <ttx> ACTION:  jos to find out the best time for the meeting
[14:08] <ttx> jos says: "Server meeting time to stay the same for at least the next month or two"
[14:09] <zul> yay
[14:09] <ttx> [TOPIC] Check blueprint status and progress for the week
[14:09] <MootBot> New Topic:  Check blueprint status and progress for the week
[14:09] <ttx> If you're not bright green on the specs you're working on, please shout
[14:09] <ttx> http://piware.de/workitems/server/lucid-alpha2/report.html shows that we are somehow on track
[14:09] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://piware.de/workitems/server/lucid-alpha2/report.html shows that we are somehow on track
[14:09]  * Daviey checks specs
[14:10] <zul> landscape-refresh havent started yet
[14:10] <ttx> though moving 40 items from server to QA helped, obviously
[14:11] <ScottK> ttx: My mail integration spec still needs approval
[14:11]  * ScottK understands the desire for more use cases, but would like to get it marked approved.
[14:11] <ttx> ScottK: hah. I remember reviewing it, so it must wait on Jos now -- checking
[14:11] <ScottK> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/server-lucid-more-mail-integration
[14:12] <ttx> ok, actioning Jos on this one
[14:12] <ttx> [ACTION] jos to review/approve https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/server-lucid-more-mail-integration
[14:12] <MootBot> ACTION received:  jos to review/approve https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/server-lucid-more-mail-integration
[14:12] <ttx> everything else is non-blocked ?
[14:13] <ttx> sounds great.
[14:13] <ttx> [TOPIC] Alpha1 ISO testing
[14:13] <MootBot> New Topic:  Alpha1 ISO testing
[14:13] <ttx> Fresh out of the oven, the alpha1 ISOs are waiting for you
[14:14] <ttx> http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/build/ubuntuserver/all
[14:14] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/build/ubuntuserver/all
[14:14] <ttx> smoser: do we have blessed cloud images as well ?
[14:14] <smoser> there are lucid builds published
[14:14] <smoser> i will grab the ids' and get them onto iso tracker
[14:15] <soren> I'll be working on setting up automated tests of those over the next day or so.
[14:15] <smoser> http://uec-images.ubuntu.com/lucid/current/
[14:15] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://uec-images.ubuntu.com/lucid/current/
[14:15] <soren> "those" == the iso tests
[14:15] <ttx> [ACTION] smoser to push cloud dailies to ISO tracker asap
[14:15] <MootBot> ACTION received:  smoser to push cloud dailies to ISO tracker asap
[14:16] <ttx> I've already given the images a spin, they are reasonably usable
[14:16] <ttx> any question aboutthe ISo testing process ?
[14:17] <ttx> ...
[14:17] <ttx> alright then
[14:17] <ttx> [TOPIC] Assigned and to-be-assigned bugs
[14:17] <MootBot> New Topic:  Assigned and to-be-assigned bugs
[14:17] <ttx> http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/team-assigned/canonical-server-assigned-bug-tasks.html
[14:17] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/team-assigned/canonical-server-assigned-bug-tasks.html
[14:18] <ttx> Still a lot of bugs assigned to zul and kirkland, more than you should be actively working on
[14:18] <zul> ttx: yeah ill have to go through that list
[14:19] <zul> the ntp one is actually one I opened
[14:19] <ttx> ok. Nothing assigned to the team that needs assignment.
[14:19] <ttx> Any flags needing to be raised ?
[14:20] <ttx> On bug 460085, I'm still waiting for the Eucalyptus team to comment on the rampart memleak proposed patch
[14:20] <ttx> moving on...
[14:20]  * ttx feels very lonely :)
[14:20] <ttx> [TOPIC] Weekly Updates & Questions for the Kernel Team
[14:20] <MootBot> New Topic:  Weekly Updates & Questions for the Kernel Team
[14:21] <jjohansen> KSM has been turned on so you should see it in post A1 kernels
[14:21] <ttx> A new weekly topic, with our kernel team guest star
[14:21] <soren> jjohansen: Woo!
[14:21] <soren> jjohansen: Awesome.
[14:21] <ttx> jjohansen: it needs some userspace support, a little mouse told me
[14:21] <ttx> jjohansen: as in, new qemu-kvm
[14:22] <jjohansen> yes,
[14:22] <ttx> jjohansen: ok. kirkland is waiting for qemu-kvm 0.12 release, which should happen soon[tm]
[14:22] <jjohansen> user space has to use the madise system call to mark pages for sharing
[14:22] <soren> There's an RC of qemu-kvm 0.12 out, IIRC.
[14:23] <jjohansen> I still have to go through and update the EC2 configs to be more like virtual
[14:23] <jjohansen> any config requests?
[14:23] <soren> Yes.
[14:23] <soren> smoser: You wanted to try to avoid having a ramdisk at all, right?
[14:24] <smoser> yes... well, some people do
[14:24] <smoser> :)
[14:24] <jjohansen> yeah we will look at that
[14:24] <smoser> on e2 we have ramdisk-less images for lucid. they work.
[14:24] <soren> I've heard requests from other places for a statically compiled compiled (no modules, everything built in).
[14:24] <jjohansen> we also want to evaluate Hz
[14:25] <soren> Err... statically compiled kernel, I mean, of course.
[14:25] <smoser> i think that -virtual kernel should support all/all-reasonable disk drivers for root devices as built in
[14:25] <jjohansen> right, I think reasonable is the key here
[14:25] <smoser> i realize that -virutal is only a subset of -server so that might cause some grief.
[14:26] <soren> virtual is the subset of server that does not deal with specific physical hardware.
[14:26] <smoser> i suppose opening a bug is the appropriate action.  i'll get one opened today.
[14:26] <smoser> soren, right, but it is a subset for modules. for the vmlinuz, its the same.
[14:26] <jjohansen> smoser: when you do subscribe me to it
[14:26] <soren> right.
[14:26] <smoser> so asking for additional stuff built in makes it bigger/affects othre things.
[14:26] <smoser> jjohansen, i'll do one better, and assign it to you :)
[14:27] <jjohansen> :)
[14:27] <ttx> Thanks John, and please come back next week for more work^H^H^H^Hfun with us !
[14:27] <jjohansen> that is the plan
[14:27] <ttx> anything else for our kernel friends ?
[14:28] <ttx> ok, let's move to...
[14:28] <ttx> [TOPIC] Development sponsorship
[14:28] <MootBot> New Topic:  Development sponsorship
[14:29] <ttx> So every server engineer with sponsorship capabilities should spend one hour a week sponsoring stuff
[14:29] <ttx> the easiest way to track that is to do it every week at a fixed time
[14:29] <ttx> and it's easy to combine it with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/CodeReviews
[14:29] <ttx> so far, we can see soren and me on that table
[14:30]  * dholbach hugs all sponsors :)
[14:30] <ttx> zul, kirkland, mathiaz: you should set an hour when you do code reviews and sponsoring stuff
[14:30] <ttx> our beloved leader says: "Server engineers to sign up"
[14:31] <zul> i do sponsorship and uploads for people but I dont have a set time
[14:31] <ttx> make a daniel happy, sign up :)
[14:31] <Daviey> Daniel is already too happy.
[14:31] <dholbach> :-)
[14:31] <ttx> zul: would it make sense for you to try to set a time ? that way you can do codereviews as well
[14:31] <dholbach> Daviey: WHAT?
[14:31] <dholbach> :)
[14:32] <ttx> Daviey: he can smile even more.
[14:32] <zul> ttx: sure
[14:32] <Daviey> \o/
[14:32] <Daviey> ttx: Is this sponsor + review?
[14:32] <ttx> Daviey: well, I use the same hour to do both.
[14:33] <ttx> (though I admittedly overflow)
[14:33] <ttx> smoser: you're exempted from this one, you need to acquire uploading powers first
[14:33] <zul> would this apply to only server related packages or anything since the list on dholbach's list is sparse for server related packages
[14:34] <ttx> zul: no. We should sponsor anything
[14:34] <zul> ttx: gotcha
[14:34] <smoser> ttx, yes. i do need to acquire such deity-powers
[14:34] <Daviey> hmm.. ttx surely you don't need upload powers to review? :)
[14:34]  * zul suggests smoser should become a motu in his copious spare time
[14:34] <ttx> Daviey: smoser hates you now
[14:35] <Daviey> hah
[14:35] <ttx> next up is...
[14:35] <ttx> [TOPIC] Developer communication
[14:35] <MootBot> New Topic:  Developer communication
[14:35] <smoser> its too bad, cause i actually enjoyed meeting daviey face to face but now i have to hate him :)
[14:35] <ttx> dholbach (again) updated the communication rules at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperCommunication
[14:36] <ttx> Please check them up
[14:36] <ttx> Communication is something easy to get wrong
[14:37] <ttx> dholbach: comments ?
[14:37] <ttx> I didn't see anything controversial in there
[14:37] <dholbach> ttx: the recent revisions of that page were a result from comments from our team mates
[14:37] <dholbach> so I tried to clarify what I could
[14:37] <dholbach> if you have more advice, feel free to add it
[14:38] <dholbach> that's all :)
[14:38] <ttx> rock on !
[14:38] <ttx> [TOPIC] Soren's QA project for Alpha2
[14:38] <MootBot> New Topic:  Soren's QA project for Alpha2
[14:38] <soren> Yay.
[14:38] <ttx> soren is exploring uncharted waters for us
[14:39] <ttx> could you introduce that ?
[14:39] <soren> So, until Alpha-2, I'm on the QA team, rather than the server team.
[14:39] <soren> I'm working on automating a lot of the testing we are (or rather should be) doing for servers.
[14:39] <ttx> soren: good, you are exampted from the scribe rotation until then.
[14:39] <soren> Whee!
[14:39] <soren> So far, I've enabled a few test suites in package builds.
[14:40] <soren> More of that to come.
[14:40] <ttx> (if my calculation is exact, you shouldn't miss your turn :)
[14:40] <soren> Also, I've set up kvm-autotest to do scripted, interactive testing.
[14:40] <ttx> soren: we still hope to get a server-oriented man in the QA team, he should followup on that work.
[14:40] <soren> Right now, I have a server install running on one of my servers. It waits for the screen to look a particular way, and then pretends to press keys and such to proceed with the installation.
[14:41] <soren> Right.
[14:41] <ScottK> ttx: Back on communication, I've not seen any announcement about the new Canonical server team lead.  Perhaps I missed it.
[14:41] <soren> I've defined my work so that I'll be setting up the frameworks.
[14:41] <zul> it was done last week at the meeting
[14:41] <soren> KVM-autotest, PPA builds of server packages (to check that they keep building and their test suites keep passing), etc., etc.
[14:41] <ttx> zul: according to the doc he should have done the introduction on MLs
[14:41] <soren> ...and then the new Server QA person can fill in the blanks (create "step files" for kvm-autotest, etc)
[14:42] <ttx> ScottK: I pointed that to him already.
[14:42] <Daviey> Aww, give him a break - he's new :)
[14:43] <ttx> Shameless plug: http://webapps.ubuntu.com/employment/canonical_USQAE/
[14:43] <ttx> for anyone interested ion following on soren's steps
[14:43] <ttx> Any question for soren ?
[14:44] <ttx> [TOPIC] Weekly SRU review
[14:44] <MootBot> New Topic:  Weekly SRU review
[14:44] <ttx> zul: ^
[14:44] <zul> sue
[14:44] <zul> http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/ubuntu-server-team/fixedbugs.ubuntu-server.latest.html
[14:44] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/ubuntu-server-team/fixedbugs.ubuntu-server.latest.html
[14:44] <zul> anyone nominate an SRU from that list?
[14:45] <ttx> The eucalyptus things are not SRU-worthy
[14:45] <ttx> we already went through those
[14:45] <zul> ok then
[14:45] <zul> anyone else?
[14:45] <ttx> bug 461156 is already nominated and i the queue to karmic-proposed
[14:46] <ttx> waiting for SRU team processing
[14:46] <zul> there is nothing on the list of nominated bugs for hardy, dapper, intrepid,lucid and karmic
[14:46] <ttx> right.
[14:47] <zul> so next
[14:47] <zul> http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/ubuntu-server-team/acceptedbugs.ubuntu-server.latest.html
[14:47] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/ubuntu-server-team/acceptedbugs.ubuntu-server.latest.html
[14:47] <zul> the php and krb ones nominated last week i still have to get to
[14:48] <zul> is anyone else to test the racoon crashes on that list?
[14:48] <zul> anyone?
[14:49] <ttx> ...
[14:49] <zul> ok then moving on
[14:49] <zul> and there is nothing in the active code reviews either
[14:49] <ttx> ok, thanks zul
[14:49] <ttx> [TOPIC] Open Discussion
[14:49] <MootBot> New Topic:  Open Discussion
[14:50] <ttx> anyone / anything ?
[14:50]  * ScottK wonders if the server team will be rewriting all their Python stuff in Perl now?
[14:51] <ttx> ScottK: heh
[14:51] <Daviey> Can i remind everyone that submitting some server tips is helpful, rewarding and stops the kittens getting hurt.
[14:51] <ttx> ScottK: I don't intend to.
[14:51] <alexm> :D
[14:51] <zul> we are slowing converting jos to pyhton
[14:51] <ScottK> Excellent news.
[14:52] <Daviey> So everyone submit some tips pls :).. There will be metrics and a burn up chart. :)
[14:52] <Jeeves_> Can I ask some attention for a annoying mysql bug here?
[14:52]  * erichammond starts his 17th year with Perl soon.
[14:52] <Daviey> Jeeves_: ask in #ubuntu-server please
[14:52] <alexm> erichammond: ++
[14:52]  * ttx started his 16th year with Perl a few weeks ago
[14:53] <ttx> though I admit having left it out those last years
[14:53] <Daviey> * https://wiki.ubuntu.com/server-tips *  --- New version should hit lucid this week, so get them in :)
[14:53]  * alexm will make 10 on march
[14:53] <highvoltage> wow.
[14:54] <alexm> highvoltage: 10y with perl, not that i'm 10 :P
[14:54]  * erichammond can't subtract.  starting 18th year soon.
[14:54] <ttx> erichammond: substraction is the first skill you lose with age :P
[14:55] <zul> must be a perl bug
[14:55] <erichammond> heh.
[14:55]  * Daviey divides the topic by 0
[14:55] <ttx> zul: there are no bugs in perl, just features nobody understands
[14:55] <zul> lol
[14:55] <ttx> [TOPIC] Agree on next meeting date and time
[14:55] <MootBot> New Topic:  Agree on next meeting date and time
[14:55] <ttx> next week, same place, same time
[14:56] <ttx> ?
[14:56] <Daviey> sounds good.
[14:56] <ttx> Alright, thanks everyone
[14:56] <ttx> #endmeeting
[14:56] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 08:56.
[14:56] <highvoltage> alexm: yep I grokked :)
[14:56] <alexm> :)
[15:57]  * robbiew_ waves
[15:57] <ev> hiya
[15:58]  * robbiew forgot to change his nick an hour and a half ago :/
[15:59]  * robbiew also renames the Meeting wiki page to the RIGHT date :/
[15:59] <robbiew> geez
[16:00] <robbiew> #startmeeting
[16:00] <MootBot> Meeting started at 10:00. The chair is robbiew.
[16:00] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[16:00]  * lool o/
[16:00] <robbiew> [LINK]https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/Meetings/2009/1209
[16:00] <MootBot> LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/Meetings/2009/1209
[16:00] <robbiew> hey lool...ev
[16:00] <tremolux> hiya
[16:01] <robbiew> slangasek: mvo: james_w Keybuk: cjwatson: around?
[16:01]  * barry 
[16:01]  * slangasek waves
[16:02] <Keybuk> robbiew: no, not here ;)
[16:02] <robbiew> heh
[16:02] <cjwatson> hello
[16:02] <robbiew> [TOPIC] Outstanding actions from last meeting
[16:02] <MootBot> New Topic:  Outstanding actions from last meeting
[16:02] <mvo> hey
[16:02] <robbiew> Colin to see if -Wa,-mimplicit-it=thumb fixes qt4-x11 problems on armel, and if not punt to mobile team / #ubuntu-arm
[16:03] <ScottK> cjwatson appears to have perhaps actually fixed it.
[16:03] <ScottK> (action is definitely done)
[16:03] <robbiew> ;)
[16:03] <cjwatson> yeah, I got a full build on jocote
[16:03] <robbiew> thanks ScottK...and hello :)
[16:03] <ScottK> Hello
[16:03] <cjwatson> fixed by using the armv6 asm already in the qt4-x11 tree
[16:04]  * Keybuk resists any comments about -funroll-loops
[16:04] <james_w> hi
[16:04] <cjwatson> -Larry -Wall
[16:04] <robbiew> heh
[16:04] <cjwatson> (was always my favourite set of compiler options)
[16:05] <robbiew> [TOPIC] Alpha 1 Features
[16:05] <MootBot> New Topic:  Alpha 1 Features
[16:05] <robbiew> only see two
[16:05] <doko__> hi
[16:05] <robbiew> boot-experience work
[16:05] <robbiew> which is plymouth going into the archive
[16:05] <robbiew> and that's done
[16:05] <Keybuk> robbiew: that's retroactively changing the definition
[16:05] <Keybuk> that's cheating ;)
[16:05] <doko__> cjwatson: the work arounds shouldn't be needed anymore, -mimplicit-it=thumb is now passed by default
[16:05] <robbiew> it's good to be the king ;)
[16:05] <Keybuk> let's be honest and say that we got most of the way there, but didn't actually get it on the CD :)
[16:05] <cjwatson> plymouth's only in universe too ...
[16:06] <robbiew> true
[16:06] <cjwatson> doko__: we didn't need implicit-it in the end
[16:06] <Keybuk> (because Keybuk's eyes exploded last week)
[16:06] <robbiew> and removes ubuntu-desktop if installed
[16:06] <cjwatson> doko__: that was a red herring
[16:06] <Shezif> Is that the meeting about the new alpha?
[16:06] <doko__> your majesty, may I still call you robbiew ;p
[16:06] <robbiew> heh
[16:06] <cjwatson> Shezif: this is the foundations team meeting
[16:06] <Shezif> cjwatson,  OK thanks
[16:07] <cjwatson> Shezif: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/Meetings/2009/1209
[16:07] <robbiew> Keybuk: as I understand it though..it will be pushed post alpha1 freeze...right? ;)
[16:07] <robbiew> so updates will pull it in
[16:07] <Keybuk> robbiew: yes
[16:08] <robbiew> great
[16:08]  * robbiew nees his story straight, in case certain people ask ;)
[16:09] <robbiew> cjwatson: ubiquity-auto-upgrade is done....I assume
[16:09]  * robbiew didn't know about it...or forgot about it
[16:09]  * Keybuk wonders whether he can legitimately claim to have tested the CD image for automatic partitioning
[16:10] <ev> lol
[16:10] <cjwatson> robbiew: yes, if you boot a current desktop install you'll see an "Update this installer" button
[16:11] <cjwatson> Mark asked for that around the karmic release, so I decided to dust off the work that had already been done :)
[16:16] <barry> mvo: probably call between mpt, mvo, sinzui at the least.  i'm happy to sit in too
[16:16] <robbiew> mvo: +1
[16:16] <robbiew> +100 :)
[16:16] <mvo> ok, I will arrange something
[16:16]  * mvo assumes he can use robbiew conf code?
[16:16] <barry> mvo: thanks
[16:16] <robbiew> mvo: hmm
[16:16] <robbiew> depends when the call is ;)
[16:16] <cjwatson> you can use mine, if robbiew's is busy
[16:16] <mvo> thanks
[16:16] <cjwatson> /msg me for the pin
[16:16] <robbiew> mvo: with my new duties...that's probably better
[16:16] <robbiew> ;)
[16:16] <mvo> right
[16:16] <robbiew> mvo: thanks
[16:17] <robbiew> ev: what's going on with the spec for foundations-lucid-installer-design-improvements
[16:17] <robbiew> I see some TODOs..and some notes at the bottom of the spec
[16:18] <ev> robbiew: I talked to Ivanka and Michael about that this morning.  I need to send Michael an email about creating that mock up.
[16:18] <robbiew> okay...well she's the approver now
[16:18] <robbiew> so I'm fine with that :)
[16:18] <ev> cool
[16:19] <robbiew> the last one, foundations-lucid-dropping-sun-java6, will be approved today
[16:19] <robbiew> doko__ has agreed to maintain it in partner :)
[16:20] <robbiew> [TOPIC] Sponsorship Queue
[16:20] <MootBot> New Topic:  Sponsorship Queue
[16:20]  * mvo hides from this item
[16:20]  * doko__ hides behind mvo
[16:20] <mvo> lol
[16:20]  * ev burrows underneath the both of them
[16:20] <tremolux> haha
[16:21]  * slangasek flaunts his single sponsored package from last week
[16:21]  * cjwatson looks at the overview - I think we all have to hide
[16:21] <robbiew> heh.  dholbach needs everyone to step up here
[16:21]  * dholbach hugs all sponsors
[16:21] <cjwatson> I think I need to switch my usual day to something that isn't Tuesday; I run into milestone freezes too often
[16:22]  * mvo merged some branches but is not sure that counts
[16:22] <cjwatson> merging contributed branches *ought* to count
[16:22] <james_w> definitely
[16:22] <robbiew> for just one hour a week...you too can help a poor, defenseless developer contribute to Ubuntu :**(
[16:22] <dholbach> yes, that'd be nice - I agree
[16:23] <robbiew> I really don't think that's much to ask...even for Keybuk (ahem)
[16:24] <ev> was the issue that slangasek raised about having to sit in a channel ever resolved?
[16:24] <robbiew> dholbach: ^^
[16:24] <robbiew> do they actually have to sit in the ubuntu-reviewers channel during that hour also?
[16:25] <robbiew> as I can see how that would distract from the actual reviewing :/
[16:25] <dholbach> I like sitting on a channel a lot, because 1) people can learn from your review and you can have discussion
[16:25] <dholbach> 2) people are going to ask you to review something that was overlooked for a longer while (because everybody picks what they like best)
[16:25] <dholbach> there's probably more reasons :)
[16:25] <dholbach> but very often, there's not too much activity
[16:26] <dholbach> in the channel
[16:26] <robbiew> and again...it's only 1 hour a week!
[16:26] <cjwatson> mm, the few times I've been there, it was much less interesting than the #ubuntu-classroom session we did
[16:26] <dholbach> right :)
[16:26] <cjwatson> but then again that meant it was very little work
[16:26] <dholbach> cjwatson: we should announce the channel some more, that'd probably help
[16:27] <Keybuk> robbiew: it's never only an hour a week
[16:27] <Keybuk> and I envy a developer who has a free hour every week
[16:27] <robbiew> I'm saying that's all you are REQUIRED to do
[16:27] <slangasek> robbiew: but I thought the 1 hour a week was supposed to be spent on sponsorship, which I don't think is the same thing as reviewing changes on the IRC channel...?
[16:27] <slangasek> "announce the channel some more" - so that'll be even less of the time spent on actual sponsorship
[16:28]  * cjwatson doesn't really see the essential difference between sponsorship and review
[16:28] <slangasek> only that the one hour a week we've committed to is split between the two :)
[16:28] <dholbach> if nobody asks you anything in the channel, you can just review a couple of bugs/patches and you're done
[16:29] <barry> btw, on launchpad, every developer spends a full day doing nothing but reviews of other people's branches.  it's the only way we'd ever get anything landed.  at first it seemed excessive but it /greatly/ increased overall team velocity (measured by #of branches landed, #of bugs closed per cycle)
[16:29] <cjwatson> slangasek: to me, sponsorship *is* review (well, coupled with upload, but that's trivial)
[16:30] <cjwatson> the point of requiring all developers on staff to spend an hour a week on it wasn't just to mechanically reduce the size of the sponsorship queue, it was to make sure everyone did some review work
[16:31] <dholbach> I'm sure all the new contributors really appreciate your good work on this!
[16:31] <Keybuk> an hour a week, over a release cycle, basically turns out as a week of that release cycle
[16:31] <Keybuk> three hours a week on meetings, takes another three weeks of the release cycle away
[16:31] <slangasek> I guess my fear is that the things people will ask for review of in the channel aren't the same things that have been nominated as ready for sponsorship; review work is important and good, but are we going to put the sponsorship queue in worse shape as a result of this shift in focus
[16:31] <Keybuk> we lose every fourth week to freezes and CD testing
[16:32] <Keybuk> it takes me two hours a day (10 hours a week) to go through my bugs folder
[16:32] <dholbach> Keybuk: I personally think the hour is totally worth it, because it's the only way we get new contributors and new ubuntu developers that can help out themselves
[16:32] <robbiew> exactly
[16:32] <Keybuk> (that's another 6-7 weeks of the release cycle)
[16:32] <dholbach> I really don't understand why it's a topic of discussion. It's important that we get more people on board. :)
[16:33] <Keybuk> dholbach: in which case, I'd like to point out that I already spend an hour a week on giving people upload access directly <g>
[16:33] <cjwatson> it's a prisoner's dilemma
[16:33] <cjwatson> we all collectively benefit from *other people* doing review and helping out new contributors
[16:34] <dholbach> Keybuk: talk to me about it
[16:34] <cjwatson> this only works if a good number of people don't defect, though :)
[16:34] <robbiew> right
[16:35] <robbiew> and the argument that "I could use that time for better things" doesn't work....I could skip all my 1-to-1 meetings and use it for "better things", but they are important part of being a manager
[16:35] <cjwatson> personally, I find review easier than doing new feature work, and therefore I use time that I would otherwise be spending being relatively unproductive while my brain gets into gear
[16:35] <cjwatson> where was that study that said that the average engineer only actually managed a couple of hours of productive work a day?
[16:36] <cjwatson> I don't think anyone's suggesting taking away from the hyper-productive time in your best hours
[16:36] <cjwatson> but, I dunno, if you don't have some slack elsewhere then you're a lot more efficient and consistently productive than I am
[16:37] <robbiew> okay..moving on
[16:37] <dholbach> thanks robbiew
[16:37]  * robbiew skips business from activity reports...cause he's only seen 2
[16:37] <robbiew> ahem
[16:37] <robbiew> [TOPIC] AOB
[16:37] <MootBot> New Topic:  AOB
[16:38] <robbiew> 2010 conference attendance
[16:38] <robbiew> make sure to get that info back to randa
[16:38] <robbiew> I'm assuming she will create the standard wiki page listing all the conferences and attendees
[16:39] <robbiew> then we can add/remove if anything changes along the way
[16:39] <Keybuk> was there any particular limit on the number of conferences?
[16:39] <Keybuk> upper or lower?
[16:40] <lool> One conference per two hours of sponsoring
[16:40] <ev> lol
[16:40] <lool> :-P
[16:40] <robbiew> heh
[16:40] <ScottK> robbiew: gcc4.4 is now default in Debian Unstable, so you can probably mark that off on the Debian coordination spec.
[16:40] <robbiew> ScottK: sweet! thanks for the update
[16:40] <cjwatson> activity *cough*
[16:40] <ScottK> ?
[16:40] <robbiew> Keybuk: I don't think there is an upper
[16:41] <robbiew> I'd say 2 a year should be the lower limit
[16:41]  * lool notes he will be afk tonight until Friday -- will be helping with booth at ARM Symposium event, need to be in Paris tonight
[16:42] <robbiew> [TOPIC] Meeting structure changes
[16:42] <MootBot> New Topic:  Meeting structure changes
[16:43] <robbiew> with me covering for mdz...I cannot chair anymore
[16:43] <robbiew> I was wondering if we should share the load on this
[16:43] <robbiew> similar to other teams
[16:44] <ev> fine by me
[16:45] <robbiew> the question is how often should it rotate?
[16:45] <Keybuk> why not rotate the chair weekly?
[16:45] <robbiew> that's fine by mee
[16:45] <robbiew> and me
[16:46] <cjwatson> makes sense
[16:46] <robbiew> works for me
[16:46]  * robbiew will let hughhalf know
[16:47] <robbiew> the 2nd thing is whether or not we should add a lightning round
[16:47] <robbiew> where everyone is expected to "talk" for about 3min
[16:47] <robbiew> on what they are doing and where they need help
[16:48] <mvo> hm, isn't that covered by activity reports?
[16:48] <mvo> I mean, when people write them ;)
[16:48]  * mvo forgot his one this week
[16:48] <robbiew> exactly
[16:48] <robbiew> and when the manager pulls them together and sends them out :/
[16:48] <barry> +1.  it would be interesting an informative, and ime there's very often been someone with a relevant topic i'd never considered.
[16:49] <cjwatson> I like lightning rounds because they ensure I can't sleep through the meeting. Main problem with activity reports is that, well, I must say I read them with a pretty severe delay when they're in mail. Maybe that's just me
[16:49] <cjwatson> (and I do get them in my inbox by means of wiki subscription, but it's somehow rather less engaging)
[16:49] <robbiew> btw, it's assumed that the chair will also send out the team summary ;)
[16:50] <lool> I like having them in the agenda wiki page, I can glance at them while the meeting is starting
[16:50] <barry> robbiew: it doesn't even have to be 3 minutes.  a 2 sentence paste can be really useful!
[16:50] <robbiew> yeah
[16:50] <robbiew> good point
[16:50] <ev> for what it's worth, I like the idea
[16:50] <robbiew> and much faster ;)
[16:51] <robbiew> ev: it's worth a lot!
[16:51] <cjwatson> 3 minutes * team is half the meeting, so yes, shorter would be better

[16:51] <lool> we can throw everything into the channel in parallel
[16:51] <cjwatson> we actually used to do this in distro team meetings but then the team got too big and it became really unwieldy
[16:51] <cjwatson> full circle ...
[16:51] <robbiew> not sure if I like parallel
[16:51] <barry> cjwatson: same in launchpad.  we do 15m sub-team standup phone calls now
[16:52] <barry> (where subteam <= 5 people)
[16:52]  * robbiew will update the MeetingTemplate to include the 2 sentence paste lighting round
[16:53] <robbiew> [TOPIC] Good News
[16:53] <MootBot> New Topic:  Good News
[16:53] <robbiew> how sad....none to speak of
[16:53] <robbiew> lol
[16:54]  * robbiew doesn't have to run this meeting for 6months! whoohoo
[16:54] <robbiew> :P
[16:54] <mvo> heh :)
[16:54] <cjwatson> my first actual proper scheduled spec will be completed right after a1
[16:54] <ScottK> cjwatson teaching qt4-x11 to build on armv6 is definetly good news.
[16:54] <cjwatson> (foundations-lucid-uec-installer-enhancement)
[16:54] <cjwatson> we're slightly ahead of the line on http://piware.de/workitems/foundations/lucid/report.html, let's keep it that way
[16:55] <cjwatson> oh, speaking of which, if any of the 'nobody' items there interest you, please grab them
[16:55] <Keybuk> Boot Performance GOOD NEWS
[16:55] <cjwatson> we'll need to farm them all out eventually
[16:55] <Keybuk> X hit its budget today
[16:55] <cjwatson> Keybuk: ooh
[16:55] <robbiew> python2.6 may actually exist in Debian this month!
[16:55]  * mvo merged the apt netrc support stuff into the ubuntu branch
[16:55] <robbiew> lol
[16:55] <robbiew> Keybuk: \o/
[16:55] <ScottK> robbiew: On Python we do have the first round of Python Policy patches out for public comment.  No great controversy so far.
[16:55] <robbiew> yep...saw that
[16:56] <slangasek> good news: as soon as the SRU is processed/done, server users can rely on loopback being up before hitting rc2
[16:56] <ev> cody is testing the extended layout branch for the GTK+ guys, so there may be hope of it landing for 2.20 after all
[16:56] <barry> ScottK: link?
[16:56] <mvo> ev: ohhh, that is really good news
[16:57] <ScottK> barry: http://lists.debian.org/debian-python/2009/12/msg00009.html
[16:57] <barry> ScottK: thanks
[16:58] <robbiew> first step python2.6 in debian....next step world peace!
[16:58]  * barry should really get on debian-python

[16:58] <robbiew> barry: debian-devel is where all the "fun" is
[16:58] <robbiew> heh
[16:58] <slangasek> yes, so subscribe to debian-python instead
[16:58] <robbiew> lmao
[16:58] <robbiew> exactly!
[16:58] <mvo> ev: can you /msg me the relevant branch  please?
[16:58] <barry> :)
[16:58] <ev> sure thing
[16:59] <robbiew> #endmeeting
[16:59] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 10:59.
[16:59] <robbiew> thanks all!!!
[16:59] <james_w> thanks
[16:59]  * marjo waves
[17:00] <marjo> #startmeeting QA Team
[17:00] <MootBot> Meeting started at 11:00. The chair is marjo.
[17:00] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[17:00] <marjo> Agenda
[17:00]  * mvo waves
[17:00] <bdmurray> hi
[17:00]  * fagan waves
[17:00] <marjo> # Welcome to Soren Hansen
[17:00] <marjo> # SRU testing -- sbeattie (Steve Beattie)
[17:00] <marjo> # Bugday highlights -- pedro
[17:00] <marjo> #
[17:00] <marjo> Alpha 1 loco-contacts feedback on Testing/LoCos -- Grantbow
[17:00] <marjo> # Upgrade testing -- fagan
[17:00] <marjo> # Bleeding edge team -- fagan
[17:00] <marjo> #
[17:00] <marjo> Ubuntu QA Website -- schwuk
[17:00]  * fader_ waves
[17:00] <marjo> [TOPIC] Welcome to Soren Hansen
[17:00] <MootBot> New Topic:  Welcome to Soren Hansen
[17:01] <marjo> folks, please welcome Soren to the QA team!
[17:01] <sbeattie> soren: welcome!
[17:01] <pedro_> welcome soren :-)
[17:01] <fagan> Welcome
[17:01] <fader_> soren: Howdy!
[17:02] <davmor2> hello
[17:02] <marjo> he'll be working with us on automated server testing
[17:02] <marjo> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/qa-lucid-automated-server-testing
[17:04] <marjo> [TOPIC] SRU testing -- sbeattie (Steve Beattie)
[17:04] <MootBot> New Topic:  SRU testing -- sbeattie (Steve Beattie)
[17:04] <sbeattie> SRU Activity report for the past week (since 2009-12-02):
[17:04] <sbeattie> * karmic: 14 new packages in -proposed (apport, compiz, eucalyptus, evolution-indicator, gdm, glib2.0, linux-firmware-nonfree, motion, python2.6, rhythmbox, ruby1.8, trac-git, ubiquity, xfburn) and 5 packages pushed to -updates (devicekit-disks, nautilus, seahorse-plugins, ubiquity, xf86-input-evtouch)
[17:04] <sbeattie> * jaunty, intrepid, hardy, dapper: no non-security update activity this week
[17:04] <soren> o/
[17:04] <sbeattie> Thanks to Philip Guyton, dm, Sam Chau, Jonathan Marsden, totty, Franck Al Yamine Cohendet, Bryan McLellan, Ethan Puzarne, Nico Isenbeck, Haggai Eran, Jan Mynarik, mickel-one, jpuxan, southworth69, defunctzombie, Saïvann Carignan, Daniel Harvey, Patrick, and Morten Frisch for testing proposed packages this week.
[17:04] <sbeattie>  
[17:05] <soren> (sorry about being late, I had a family situation I needed to attend to, but I'm here now)
[17:05] <sbeattie> We have an upcoming 8.04.4 point release coming up at the end of january, so assistance in clearing out some of the few hardy SRUs would be greatly appreciated.
[17:05] <pedro_> any update that needs more attention?
[17:05] <fagan> soren: you only missed your welcome :)
[17:06] <davmor2> sbeattie: I'll throw a bit of time at it for you
[17:06] <soren> fagan: Yeah, saw the scrollback :)
[17:06] <sbeattie> davmor2: awesome, thanks!
[17:06] <pedro_> m bug 444979 is standing in the queue for a few weeks
[17:08] <sbeattie> yep, be nice toc lear that one out.
[17:08] <sbeattie> That's all I have on the SRU front.
[17:08] <marjo> thx sbeattie!
[17:08] <marjo> [TOPIC] Bugday highlights -- pedro
[17:08] <MootBot> New Topic:  Bugday highlights -- pedro
[17:09] <pedro_> Previous week we had a bug day based on Ubuntu Translations as suggested by qense on an email to the BugSquad ml
[17:09] <pedro_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/20091203
[17:10] <pedro_> thanks to dpm, micahg, qense, WeatherGod, nperry and to kamusin for organize it
[17:10]  * fagan volunteered to do the next one
[17:11] <pedro_> Tomorrow we're running one based on Compiz as requested by the maintainer a few weeks ago
[17:11] <pedro_> so if you're using compiz head to : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/20091210
[17:11] <pedro_> the amazing kamusin helped a lot to organize the bug day so big kudos to him
[17:12] <marjo> thx kamusin!
[17:12] <pedro_> fagan yeah i know, i'll contact you so we can start working on it :-)
[17:12] <fagan> pedro_: cool
[17:12] <pedro_> so any help will be more than welcome
[17:13] <pedro_> and again if you have *any* ideas of which could be the next target please drop it into the wiki page
[17:13] <pedro_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/Planning
[17:13] <fagan> pedro_: Ill add pitivi to the list because it needs some love
[17:13] <pedro_> fagan, go for it :-)
[17:13] <pedro_> that's all from here marjo
[17:14] <marjo> thx pedro_
[17:14] <pedro_> my pleasure
[17:14] <marjo> [TOPIC] Alpha 1 loco-contacts feedback on Testing/LoCos -- Grantbow
[17:14] <MootBot> New Topic:  Alpha 1 loco-contacts feedback on Testing/LoCos -- Grantbow
[17:14] <Grantbow> Greetings
[17:14] <Grantbow> How has the response been so far?
[17:14] <marjo> welcome Grant!
[17:15] <ara> Grantbow, have you contacted any member from your loco?
[17:16] <Grantbow> I did forward the email to my loco mail list.
[17:16] <Grantbow> Several people sounded interested.
[17:17] <Grantbow> I've fetched the lucid-desktop-i386.iso with zsync ready to participate myself as well.
[17:17] <Grantbow> I'm hoping folks from the loco-contacts mail list step up and participate as well.
[17:17] <Grantbow> I had a meeting with Scott Ritchie yesterday talking about wiki page improvements.
[17:18] <Grantbow> What do you all think of the email and wiki page?
[17:18] <kamusin> ;)
[17:18] <fader_> Grantbow: Awesome... getting the word out is a huge help :D
[17:18] <ara> Grantbow, I think it gets to the point :)
[17:18] <ara> Grantbow, what did Scott tell you in the meeting?
[17:18] <fagan> maybe we should announce something on the qa blog?
[17:19] <Grantbow> ara: he mentioned other types of testing including SRU that we can add as starting points of contributors.
[17:20] <ara> Grantbow, nice :)
[17:20] <sbeattie> Grantbow: agreed.
[17:20] <Grantbow> he also provided me with some group history since he's been active with Testing for awhile now.
[17:21] <Grantbow> More than I have at least.
[17:21] <Grantbow> I guess that's all unless there are any further suggestions or questions.
[17:21] <ara> Thanks Grantbow!
[17:22] <marjo> Thx Grantbow
[17:22] <marjo> [TOPIC] Upgrade testing -- fagan
[17:22] <MootBot> New Topic:  Upgrade testing -- fagan
[17:22] <fagan> I just wanted to ask a quick question
[17:23] <fagan> Should we be doing upgrade testing tomorrow
[17:23] <fagan> Is there any major issues that need to be tested yet?
[17:24] <fader_> My guess is that it's never too early to start upgrade testing and reporting bugs
[17:24] <ara> fagan, I think that we can concentrate in getting good coverage on installations. If we have time, upgrade testing is always welcome
[17:24] <Grantbow> sounds like a good thing to test for an LTS
[17:25] <fagan> Cool so ill try an upgrade from hardy tomorrow and see if there are any major problems
[17:25] <marjo> fagan: the answer is yes
[17:25] <fagan> Cool
[17:25] <ara> our aim is always obtaining as much coverage as possible in the tracker, and that includes upgrades
[17:25] <sbeattie> fagan: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-lucid-lts-upgrades covers some of the work items mvo will be fixing related to upgrades.
[17:26] <sbeattie> fagan: the most recent item that I saw marked as done was the 'ensure linux-restricted-modules-common is removed' item
[17:26] <ara> fagan, if you encounter any issue, mvo is always happy to help
[17:26] <Grantbow> sbeattie: thanks for the link
[17:26] <ara> are you, mvo? ;-)
[17:26] <marjo> mvo: any comments re: upgrade testing for Alpha1?
[17:26] <ara> [LINK] https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-lucid-lts-upgrades
[17:26] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-lucid-lts-upgrades
[17:26] <fader_> I believe mvo is away ATM
[17:26] <marjo> fader_ ack
[17:27] <fagan> Well ill give him a ping later and see what his views on it are
[17:27] <marjo> fagan: anything else on this?
[17:27] <fagan> nope
[17:27] <fagan> marjo: go ahead
[17:27] <marjo> [TOPIC] Bleeding edge team -- fagan
[17:27] <MootBot> New Topic:  Bleeding edge team -- fagan
[17:27] <fagan> I found a team on launchpad called the bleeding edge team
[17:28] <fagan> There isnt too much activity but I think it can be revived
[17:28] <fagan> Ill fish out a link
[17:28] <fagan> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-bleedingedge
[17:28] <ara> [LINK] https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-bleedingedge
[17:28] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-bleedingedge
[17:29] <ara> mmm, sounds good
[17:29] <fagan> It has a ppa so what I think we can do is maybe get people to add stuff they need testing but shouldnt be put into the archive yet
[17:29] <ara> fagan, have you talked to the owner of the team?
[17:30] <ara> fagan, to know the possible reasons for its low success?
[17:30] <fagan> nope not yet I wanted to see what the rest of you think
[17:30] <fagan> ara: lack of activity
[17:30] <ara> fagan, I think the problem is that upstreams willing to do that, already have their own ppa
[17:30] <fagan> If we get word about I think it could be a useful outlet
[17:31] <fagan> hmmmm good point
[17:31] <ara> fagan, it could be better to find out which upstreams have ubuntu ppas and document that in the wiki
[17:31] <ara> fagan, i.e. mozilla has one for thunderbird & firefox: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozilla-daily/+archive/ppa
[17:31] <fagan> Yep that sounds good
[17:31] <Grantbow> ara: +1
[17:32] <ara> we could document them under wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Upstream
[17:32] <ScottK> That one is run by Ubuntu, not by upstream.
[17:32] <ara> ScottK, mmm, OK, but that's daily mozilla code, isn't it?
[17:33] <ara> ScottK, so bugs there, can be useful to upstream
[17:33] <ScottK> It is, but I don't think upstream has anything to do with it directly.
[17:33] <ScottK> I read "which upstreams have ..." as meaning upstream developers running a PPA.
[17:34] <ara> yes, let rephrase that into: "upstream ppa run by upstream or ubuntu maintainers"
[17:34] <ara> because, in the end, that's what the bleeding edge was about, wasn't it?
[17:35] <fagan> yep
[17:35] <moustafa> Question: What about packages that don't have a ppa?  Wouldn't the Bleeding Edge team be a good place to put those?
[17:35] <fagan> moustafa: you could just make a ppa for the user
[17:35] <fagan> it would be just as easy
[17:36] <fagan> moustafa: like this https://launchpad.net/~shanepatrickfagan/+archive/ppa
[17:36] <marjo> fagan: do we really want to do that?
[17:37] <marjo> seems to complicate matters, no?
[17:37] <fagan> hmmm
[17:37] <fagan> A little it maybe good to have a central location
[17:38] <moustafa> fagan: I thought that's why the bleeding edge team was being proposed for "reanimation": To have a centralized location for upstream packages
[17:38] <fagan> Yep
[17:38] <ara> I think that it is a bit complicated to maintain
[17:39] <fagan> I agree
[17:39] <moustafa> ara: wouldn't there be a way to (and I hope this will make sense) redirect certain PPAs to the Bleeding Edge team?
[17:39] <ara> moustafa, ?
[17:40] <fagan> so maybe the wiki would be a good idea and let the developers decide where to put the packages
[17:40] <davmor2> to be honest I think the team dissipated due to the amount of daily-ppas
[17:40] <moustafa> Basically: Members of the BE team who have their own PPAs could get their packages mirrored by the BE PPA, which would give a centralized location
[17:40] <moustafa> Or maybe that's something Launchpad can't do
[17:41] <fagan> moustafa: I dont think launchpad can do that
[17:41] <moustafa> In which point a wiki would be the easiest answer for now
[17:41] <ara> moustafa, but, is having a central location a good thing? for me, i.e., having both firefox and thunderbird in the daily mozilla ppa is already too much, as I only want thunderbird. If, by error, I update all my system with that ppa enabled.... I have firefox daily ppa installed, which I don't want
[17:42] <ara> and that's only two packages
[17:42] <moustafa> ara: Good point
[17:42] <fagan> So how about just the wiki them
[17:42] <fagan> *then
[17:42] <marjo> fagan: may i suggest you investigate further and come back with a firm proposal to the team next week?
[17:42] <moustafa> Wiki does sound like the sanest suggestion
[17:42] <fagan> marjo: Cool
[17:43] <marjo> based on discussions and ideas presented today?
[17:43] <fagan> Yep
[17:43] <marjo> thx for rediscovering that team; looks interesting
[17:43] <marjo> [TOPIC] Ubuntu QA Website -- schwuk
[17:43] <MootBot> New Topic:  Ubuntu QA Website -- schwuk
[17:44] <marjo> http://qa.ubuntu.com/
[17:44] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://qa.ubuntu.com/
[17:44] <schwuk> 2 items here
[17:44] <davmor2> mailing list :)
[17:44] <schwuk> 1) the QA website has been updated with a link to mailing list as discussed last week
[17:45] <schwuk> 2) can people check the content/links on the site and ensure they are still relevant/valid
[17:45] <marjo> davmor2: ?
[17:45] <soren> I probably have some new stuff for it next week-ish.
[17:45] <davmor2> marjo: it's added
[17:45] <marjo> davmor2: ack
[17:46] <ara> schwuk, can you please change the mago link to point to http://mago.ubuntu.com, please?
[17:46] <fagan> off topic are we getting rid of http://hwdb.ubuntu.com/ ?
[17:47] <schwuk> There is a LP project for the site for branches/bugs etc. http://launchpad.net/ubuntu-qa-homepage
[17:47] <schwuk> ara: will do
[17:47] <davmor2> schwuk: looks good dude I will track the links
[17:47] <ara> schwuk, also, Desktop Automation should point also to the mago site
[17:47] <ara> schwuk, thanks
[17:49] <fagan> Any more items on the agenda?
[17:50] <Grantbow> does wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam link to qa.ubuntu.com?
[17:50] <fagan> looks like it doesnt
[17:50] <fagan> nice catch Grantbow
[17:51] <schwuk> +1
[17:52] <fagan> So back to my previous question are we killing off hwdb.ubuntu.com because it doesnt contain any useful info?
[17:53] <cr3> fagan: I've sent a request to the IS team about this, let me pull up their answer
[17:53] <fagan> cr3: cool
[17:54] <cr3> fagan: there appears to be 20 new requests still being submitted to that page every day
[17:54] <marjo> schwuk: thx
[17:54] <Grantbow> interesting indicator
[17:54] <cr3> this is strange because the client for this has been deprecated since before hardy
[17:54] <fagan> but how can you get any info from there?
[17:55] <fagan> cr3: it kinda looks like spam at least the most recent few
[17:55] <cr3> fagan: good catch
[17:55] <cr3> ideally, it would be nice to provide a redirect for that url in case anyone happens to have it bookmarked
[17:55] <marjo> folks: time check - 4 minutes
[17:55] <cr3> what would you guys think of redirecting to http://webapps.ubuntu.com/certification?
[17:56] <fagan> cr3: +1
[17:56] <fader_> cr3: I like that.  I was going to ask about the client degrading gracefully but if it's been deprecated that long...
[17:56] <schwuk> ara: those changes you requested are live
[17:56] <fader_> Maybe a 10s redirect with an 'update your bookmarks' text?
[17:56] <schwuk> cr3: hwdb != certification
[17:56] <ara> schwuk, nice :)
[17:56] <marjo> fagan, cr3: can we continue topic to next meeting?
[17:56] <marjo> schwuk: +1
[17:56] <cr3> marjo: sure, not urgent
[17:57] <ara> schwuk, thanks!
[17:57] <marjo> folks, before we end, want to share Lucid QA Team chart with you
[17:57] <marjo> http://piware.de/workitems/qa/lucid/report.html
[17:57] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://piware.de/workitems/qa/lucid/report.html
[17:58] <marjo> status is looking good early in the release
[17:58] <schwuk> It would be better pointed to a wiki page explaining the system tool and how to use it.
[17:58] <marjo> please update your work items as you finish them so that we get an accurate status on a daily basis
[17:59] <marjo> ok let's end on time
[17:59] <fagan> good meeting all
[17:59] <marjo> thx everyone for another productive and interesting meeting!
[17:59] <schwuk> Thanks marjo!
[17:59] <soren> o/
[17:59] <Grantbow> thank you Marjo
[17:59] <marjo> #endmeeting
[17:59] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 11:59.
[18:00] <fader_> Thanks all
[18:01] <ara> thanks
[18:01] <czajkowski> schwuk: hey!
[18:51] <mvo> marjo: no further comments, upgrade testing for alpha1 is good but not super important at this point (sorry for the delay, I was at dinner)