/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2009/12/17/#launchpad-dev.txt

* mwhudson nom nom nom00:17
=== mbarnett changed the topic of #launchpad-dev to: Launchpad Development Channel | Week 4 of 3.1.12 | PQM is closed; RC only (https://dev.launchpad.net/CurrentRolloutBlockers, RM: danilos) | https://dev.launchpad.net/ | Get the code: https://dev.launchpad.net/Getting | On-call review in #launchpad-reviews | Use http://paste.ubuntu.com/ for pastes
wgrantSo, the source format 3.0 code is there now. But do the Soyuz machines have the new dpkg, and are the buildds running lp-buildd 54?00:39
bigjools-afkwgrant: no and yes00:40
wgrantbigjools-afk: Argh and yay.00:40
bigjools-afkit will happen in due course then we can turn on the wotsit selection00:41
wgrantRight.00:41
bigjools-afkbedtime, g'night00:48
wgrantNight.00:48
thumpermwhudson: so... when are we going to flick the switch on the "never succeeded" svn branches?01:09
jmlmwhudson, where is your pyflakes branch that makes working with lazy imports not be terrible?01:31
jmlmwhudson, and would you like me to land it to trunk for you?01:31
mwhudsonthumper: i guess there's little harm in flicking the switch now01:33
mwhudsonthumper: we shouldn't mass retry them all01:33
thumpermwhudson: limit 5 each time?01:33
thumpermwhudson: how many where there?01:33
mwhudsonjml: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mwhudson/pyflakes/support-lazy-imports01:33
jmlmwhudson, thank you.01:34
mwhudsonjml: if you like; i've never proposed it as it seems very bzrlib specific01:34
thumperjml: want a quick chat now? or after you have lunch?01:34
jmlthumper, I just had lunch.01:34
jmlthumper, it's all I can do to prevent my parent's from serving it before breakfast.01:34
mwhudsonthumper: well, by flicking the switch i meant "update codeimport set rcstype = ..."01:34
jmls/'//01:34
thumpermwhudson: yeah, that's what I was thinking too01:35
thumpermwhudson: add a "limit 5" on the end of the query01:35
mwhudsonthumper: not sure off hand about how to retry them with straight sql01:35
mwhudsonthumper: most of the never-succeeded ones are marked FAILED, they won't be retried without intervention01:35
thumpermwhudson: set the status to reviewed01:35
thumpermwhudson: ah, bugger01:35
thumpermwhudson: the code adds the job when it becomes reviewed01:35
mwhudsonthumper: yeah01:36
thumpermwhudson: so direct editing of reviewed would be a 'bad idea'01:36
mwhudsoni think it's probably just "insert into codeimport where ..." but yeah01:36
mwhudson*into codeimportjob rather01:36
mwhudson"some care required"01:36
=== mwhudson_ is now known as mwhudson
jtvhi mwhudson!  you've been working on the recipe builds, right?03:02
spmjtv: howdy! no long no see!03:03
jtvspm: g'day!03:03
jtvspm: how's life?  drop bear attacks not too bad?03:03
jtvspm: I've been doing some traveling...  no mobile coverage most of the time, let alone internet.  feel like a different person03:04
spmheh03:04
mwhudsonjtv: i have, for my sins03:08
* jtv resists to urge to ask about those :)03:08
jtvmwhudson: I was wondering... how does one go about writing tests for that sort of thing?03:09
mwhudsonjtv: i don't really know, i haven't got to that point yet03:09
mwhudsonjtv: just bashing out the content class code and tests for same03:09
jtvmwhudson: in our case we separated the "set up an execution environment" work from the "build the payload" work, so I'm facing that part a bit earlier03:10
mwhudsonjtv: well, i guess the interface to between the build and the master is xml-rpc03:11
mwhudsonjtv: so you don't need to run the build inside a vm to be able to test that...03:12
jtvthe last time I did anything with xmlrpc it was to protect against a virus that exploited a PHP implementation... then told the inventor of xml that it was all his fault.03:13
jtvbut the principle sounds sensible :)03:13
jtvmwhudson: that's another part I couldn't figure out easily: where does the payload fit in?  I saw mention of a build() method on the slave, but couldn't quite match it up to an implementation03:14
mwhudsonjtv: what do you mean by payload?03:15
jtvthe actual work that we want to do on the slave03:15
jtvi.e. our own equivalent of "build the package"03:15
mwhudsonjtv: code or data?03:15
jtvoh, our "build" is a pure data thing03:15
jtvvery simple compared to the other stuff03:16
jtvcompared to the other forms of build, I mean03:16
mwhudsonjtv: so there are two ways you can get data onto a build machine03:17
mwhudson(currently)03:17
jtvI think we'll be wanting to add a third: check out a publicly available branch03:17
mwhudsonjtv: as an argument to an xmlrpc method, and a file from the librarian03:17
mwhudsonjtv: yes indeed03:17
jtvI think you're talking about the "cacheFileOnSlave" stuff, right?03:18
mwhudson(and ultimately, check out a non-public branch too)03:18
mwhudsonjtv: yeah03:18
jtvfor the files that aren't on the public librarian03:18
mwhudsonjtv: i think "cacheFileOnSlave" applies to the public librarian doesn't it?03:18
mwhudsonjtv: public librarian files are accessed by sha1sum, restricted librarian files by url which has credentials embedded in it03:19
jtvmwhudson: I could easily be wrong, but the buildfarmjobbehavior code I looked at said it was going to the trouble to deal with private files03:19
mwhudsonjtv: wgrant knows far more than me about this sort of thing btw :-)03:19
* wgrant looks.03:19
jtvI guess the Pacific side of the planet is the place to be for these things  :-)03:20
jtvhi wgrant!03:20
mwhudsonjtv: which code are you looking at?03:21
jtvmwhudson: I'm not looking at code now but IIRC there is one existing concrete implementation of IBuildFarmJobBehavior; it has a private method with a name like _cacheFilesOnSlave that does this stuff03:22
* wgrant tries to work out how this new split works.03:22
mwhudsonjtv: i haven't looked at this since the soyuz guys moved all the code around03:23
wgrantjtv: YOou mean BinaryPackageBuildBehaviour._cachePrivateSourceOnSlave?03:23
jtvwgrant: that's our baby03:24
jtvbut I don't care too much about this part anyway because what I need to do is pass the branch URL to the slave, then have the slave check out the branch03:24
mwhudsonjtv: in builder.py, i reckon self.slave.ensurepresent is calling some xmlrpc method03:25
jtvI see now that we've been talking at cross purposes03:25
wgrantmwhudson: It is.03:25
wgrantjtv: lib/canonical/buildd/slave.py, def ensurepresent03:26
wgrantEr, mwhudson ^^03:26
mwhudsonwgrant: right03:26
jtvahhhh, and all this time I was looking only in lib/lp/buildmaster and lib/lp/soyuz03:26
wgrantjtv: And you should stay there until you really have to leave.03:27
mwhudsonjtv: oh, you hadn't had the delight of lib/canonical/buildd yet?03:27
wgrantlp-buildd is *not* pretty.03:27
* mwhudson goes away until the screaming becomes loud enough to disturb him again03:27
* jtv looks worried and puzzled at the contrast between wgrant's and mwhudson's take03:27
mwhudsonjtv: basically, i guess we'll need to add an xmlrpc method "getbranch" or something03:28
wgrantmwhudson: But you're going to be using bzr-builder to grab the branches, aren't you?03:28
mwhudsonwgrant: *I* am i expect, yes03:29
jtvmwhudson: you've been adding slave-side stuff... have you been doing that by extending this part, or by adding new classes somewhere?03:29
wgrantSo it may prove better to just let the Translations code inside the builder take a branch path in extra_args, check it out itself.03:29
mwhudsonjtv: i haven't added slave side stuff yet03:29
jtvwhat's bzr-builder btw?03:30
mwhudsonjtv: wgrant has a point here03:30
jtvit rings a bell03:30
mwhudsonjtv: slave.py defines an abstract class BuildManager03:30
mwhudsonjtv: debian.py in the same directory defines a subclass DebianBuildManager03:30
jtvwgrant: that's what I had in mind, yes...  it'll mean some IS changes, but it's by far the "narrowest" channel I think03:31
mwhudsonjtv: we'll both be wanting to define new subclasses i think03:31
jtvah, buildmanager was that thing that sounded like it lived master-side but actually managed the build client-side?03:31
jtvI mean, slave-side?03:31
wgrantjtv: No, no.03:31
mwhudsonhee hee03:31
wgrantThere is buildmanager, and buildd-manager.03:31
wgrantAnd slave-scanner, and builddmaster.03:31
mwhudsonthere is buildd-manager an03:31
jtv"oh of course, how could I be so _stupid_?"  :-)03:32
wgrantbuildd-manager and slave-scanner are both instances of this 'builddmaster' concept.03:32
wgrantThey live on the master. There is only one of them.03:32
wgrantbuildmanager is part of lp-buildd, and lives on the slave.03:32
jtvlp-buildd?  I don't think I've been introduced to that one03:32
wgrantjtv: launchpad-buildd is the thing that lurks in lib/canonical/buildd03:33
mwhudsonjtv: the stuff in lib/canonical/buildd is turned into a debian package called launchpad-buildd (?) which is installed on the build machines03:33
jtvbut this _does_ sound like buildmanager is the one that sounds like it runs on the master but actually runs on the client, just like I said, no?03:33
wgrantIt's self-contained, except for tac-related stuff.03:33
mwhudsonjtv: yeah03:34
jtvtactical air command?03:34
jtvtype approval code?03:34
wgrantjtv: Nasty Twisted thing.03:34
mwhudsontwisted application configuration03:34
jtvthrust asymmetry compensation?03:34
wgrantAhh.03:34
mwhudsonwgrant: better than taps!03:34
wgrantmwhudson: Yeeeees.03:34
jtvcoffee's ready03:37
jtvcoming back from Laos with a few bags of the stuff was the perfect excuse to get a proper machine03:37
jtvhang on03:37
jtvahhh03:38
jtvwith that taken care of, back to that code :-)03:39
wgrantHow scheduled is this work?03:42
wgrant(ie. do we know what people will be doing in Wellington?)03:43
jtvwgrant: still a big unknown afaik03:43
mwhudsonwgrant: this is exactly what we'll be working on in wellington03:43
wgrantmwhudson: 'this' is a very big domain.03:43
mwhudsonwhat precisely we will do depends on what we get done between now and then i guess03:43
mwhudsonwgrant: well yes03:43
jtvwgrant: hence our different answers :)03:44
mwhudsonaiui, the plan is "find something to do.  do it"03:44
wgrantBut I guess it is closer than I had previously thought, what with Christmas in the way.03:44
jtvmwhudson: would "clean up l/c/buildd a bit" be a good point for the agenda there?03:45
mwhudsonone of the goals on the internal wiki page for the sprint is "# Hack on code like crazed bunnies "03:45
wgrantmwhudson: Heh.03:45
wgrantjtv: That code is normally hacked by infinity/lamont/whoeveritisnow03:45
wgrantBut I suspect a lot will need to be done in Wellington.03:45
jtvwhat ever happened to "everyone owns all code"?  :-)03:46
jtvgetting fresh, freshly-frustrated eyes on code is often what drives good cleanup03:46
wgrantjtv: This code primarily lives in a tree outside LP.03:46
wgrantOccasionally getting copied back in.03:46
wgrantAlthough that appears to have changed in the past few weeks :D03:46
* jtv hates hidden dependencies between projects03:47
mwhudsonjtv: part of it (i guess) is that this code has to run on architectures that launchpad probably doesn't run on03:48
mwhudsonlike hppa03:48
jtvfair enough, but does that mean that I'll have to go to this other source tree when I need to work on slave-side code?03:50
mwhudsoni don't think that's completely settled, but i'd lean to "yes"03:51
wgrantlamont was last week doing the latest lp-buildd changes in a normal Launchpad branch, so the days of the separate tree may be over.03:51
mwhudsoni think that more or less has to happen03:53
mwhudsonwow, the hotel we're staying in in wellington doesn't get very good reviews on tripadvisor03:58
mwhudson(but i think it'll be fine for us actually)03:58
jtvmwhudson: the cynic in me is tempted to say "maybe there's just 1 competing hotel and they like to review each other"03:59
mwhudsonjtv: new zealand is a small country, but there's more than one hotel in it's capital :-)03:59
mwhudsonor two03:59
jtvmwhudson: "oh you're from New Zealand?  Do you know Gerald?"04:00
wgrantI presume the sprint itself will be somewhere in the hotel too?04:00
jmlyou presume too much sir!04:00
* jml goes back to his box04:01
mwhudsonwgrant: yeah04:02
wgrantOh good, their website wants me to install QuickTime.04:03
mwhudsonthumper: did you want to talk today?  i guess it's getting late04:37
thumpermwhudson: I think tomorrow is better04:37
thumpermwhudson: I'm about to make hamburgers for dinner :)04:37
mwhudsonthumper: ok04:37
mwhudsonthumper: have fun :)04:38
jmlwuuu05:32
jmladsl205:32
mwhudsonjml: feel the bits!05:42
mwhudson"DownStream Connection Speed 9829 kbps"05:43
jmlmwhudson, heh05:52
mwhudsoni think i'm on adsl2, but on the other hand i'm also in new zealand05:52
jmlmwhudson, speedtest says 17.5 Mbps05:53
mwhudsonjml: that's pretty fast05:53
jml0.83 up.05:53
jmlmwhudson, I may be the only person on this exchange with adsl205:53
jmlmwhudson, given that the town has 1,700 people.05:54
wgrantWhich ISP was crazy enough to put an ADSL2 DSLAM down there?05:55
spminternode probably05:55
jmlyep05:56
spmdespite being in canberra, I support the fact that they put dslams in remote SA towns. big +1 from me.05:56
jmlspm, SA?05:56
wgrantTAS, wasn't it?05:56
spmSouth Aust05:56
jmlspm, I'm in even _southier_ Australia05:56
spmjml: I know, but they really focus on SA - in particular. for a small company, that's impressive05:57
jmlspm, oh, right.05:57
spmheh. was funny at one event Simon was talking, one of their network ops was seeing all sorts of funky stuff from telstra. just before T went to full ADSL1. was like random testing of lines and stuff.05:59
jmlin some ways, I'm glad the government didn't split telstra up before privatizing06:00
jmlevery story needs a bad guy.06:00
spm:-)06:01
jmlabentley, with ampoule jobs, what happens if a process dies due to an unexpected error?07:15
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bigjoolsmwhudson: around?10:06
bigjoolsor thumper?10:06
maxbI think bug 316192 has regressed, should I reopen it or file a new one?10:35
mupBug #316192: bzrlib.plugin.load_plugins() loads system plugins even for non-system bzrlib <Bazaar:Fix Released by vila> <Launchpad Bazaar Integration:Fix Released by thumper> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/316192>10:35
maxbI got test failures because LP's 2.1b3 bzr egg doesn't like my bzr-gtk (from .deb) or bzr-rebase (in ~/.bazaar/plugins/)10:35
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=== salgado-afk is now known as salgado
adiroibanhi. I'm having some problems with xpath trying to get the row (tr) element hosting a link. I'm using //table[@id='languagestats']/descendant::a[text()='French']/parent::td/parent::tr11:32
adiroibanbut it's not getting the right row11:32
BjornTmaxb: opening a new bug is usually best. it's easier to keep track of things that way. there's value in seeing that this issue was fixed once before.11:57
maxbI wondered. OK.11:57
leonardrjames_w, i'd like to talk to you about your lazr.restfulclient branch14:19
leonardrhttps://code.edge.launchpad.net/~james-w/lazr.restfulclient/fix-caching/+merge/1563514:19
james_whi leonardr14:19
leonardrthe branch itself looks fine, but i think the process is broken, because it hasn't been landed for a week14:19
leonardrand i only noticed it because jml was complaining about a launchpadlib backlog14:20
leonardrso: what did you expect would happen after the branch was approved?14:20
james_wah, I can't land it, so abel said that he would14:20
leonardraha14:20
james_wit obviously slipped his mind14:20
james_wor got rejected or something14:21
leonardrit wouldn't have been rejected, it's not pqm-managed14:21
james_wthis was on IRC, so it's not recorded in the MP14:21
leonardrall right. the simplest way to solve the problem would be for me to monitor the review list and push branches that are stuck in the process14:22
=== Guest18577 is now known as joey
KLondenbergHi all .14:44
KLondenbergShort question: I'm currently trying to get my private copy auf Launchpad working, including Codehosting and so on. Everything except codehosting seems to work fine. But when I try to push to a lp://dev/  repository, the repository gets created in the root folder (/) of the server launchpad is running on. It fails, even, if this is not done with root rights (for obvious reasons). Any clue...14:46
KLondenberg...what might be wrong, or where I should start looking into ?14:46
KLondenbergApart from that, pushes to that repository don't get picked up by the webapp, even if I "make sync_branches"14:47
sinzuiChex: Can you merge lp:~sinzui/launchpad/spam-eggs-bug-495250 on staging? We want to verify this branch for a CP to hinder spammers14:55
Chexsinzui: sure, hang on14:59
Chexupdown is down15:00
Chexerf misfire15:00
intellectronicaandrea-bs: ok, i know why you're getting the cofiguration conflicts15:03
andrea-bsintellectronica, great15:03
intellectronicaandrea-bs: in line 159, you allow everything in ISpecification15:03
intellectronicaandrea-bs: then in line 188 you try to require permissions for newMessage and setCommentVisibility15:04
intellectronicaandrea-bs: zope doesn't like that. you can't override attribute configuration, it has to be given only once, and a catch-all allow for an interface counts as all its attributes already configured15:05
intellectronicait's a PITA!15:05
intellectronicaandrea-bs: the obvious (and somewhat unpleasant) solution is to change the allow declaration to use attribute names instead of the interface, and include only those attributes that you really want to allow15:07
intellectronicaandrea-bs: let me see if there's a better solution i can think of, but it may be that you simply have to do the above15:07
intellectronicaandrea-bs: as you can see, that's how we do it for IBug too15:09
Chexsinzui: the staging tree already has a bunch of stuff cowboyed in, won't let me pull in your branch.. should I do a revert and try again?15:09
=== salgado is now known as salgado-lunch
sinzuiChex: Yes, I think staging should be reverted since we released code15:10
andrea-bsintellectronica, thanks. I'm allowing all ISpecification's attributes (except newMessage & friends) by hand. I think this will require some time :)15:11
intellectronicaandrea-bs: i know. it's no fun. sorry :(15:13
=== jamalta_ is now known as jamalta
leonardrjames_w: sorry, i have more questions about https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~james-w/lazr.restfulclient/fix-caching/+merge/1563515:18
leonardri'm trying to see how difficult it would be to write a test for the branch15:18
leonardrand whether it will really help you15:19
leonardrwhat named operation are you calling that's not being cached, that you think should be cached?15:19
james_wI saw it with lots of things15:19
james_wdistro_series.getSourcePackage for instance15:19
leonardrwere these all named operations that returned specific objects?15:20
leonardrrather than collections?15:20
leonardrand when you made the change locally, did you see that the cache was actually being used?15:21
leonardri wouldn't expect it to be used because right now launchpad doesn't serve caching directives15:21
james_wmaybe that's the cause then15:22
james_wwhile looking in to it I discovered that it wasn't actually the lack of caching that was the limiting factor in the script15:22
james_wso I eyeballed the bug and submitted the change before moving on to fix the other issue15:23
james_wit's not just caching though15:23
leonardrall right15:23
leonardri'm going to land the branch because it makes sense and will help us in the future15:23
james_whttplib skips all the stuff it normally does on GET15:23
leonardrbut i don't expect it to improve performance immediately, if it only affects named operations15:23
leonardractually there might be a way to test it regardless...15:25
UrsinhaChex, gary_poster, rockstar, bigjools, danilos, sinzui, allenap: production meeting in 28 mins @ #launchpad-meeting15:33
bigjoolsUrsinha: al-maisan is covering for me today15:33
* al-maisan waves15:33
Chexsinzui: sorry for the delay, all set now with that lp branch on staging15:33
Ursinhaoi, thanks bigjools and hi al-maisan :)15:34
Ursinhas/oi/ok/15:34
al-maisanhellau Ursinha :)15:34
Ursinhastub, Chex, gary_poster, rockstar, al-maisan, danilos, sinzui, allenap: production meeting in 5 mins @ #launchpad-meeting15:55
Ursinhastub, Chex, gary_poster, rockstar, al-maisan, danilos, sinzui, allenap: production meeting now @ #launchpad-meeting16:01
sinzuibac: danilo: I think the webkit CSS problem is related to: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/343618/16:02
=== salgado-lunch is now known as salgado
sinzuibac: danilo: We can put some of these rules back, but we should not use ids16:03
sinzuibac: danilos: The first  rule and the second rule in the removed CSS are the most likely causes.16:07
danilossinzui, the only thing that was not old CSS but what I introduced as a bug fix 2 months back was #maincontent { clear: both; }, and that's the first thing I'd add back16:07
danilossinzui, margin-right: -25% probably helped with other issues people are seeing16:08
bacdanilos: i'm confused about the CSS problem.  for me it is only appearing on staging not edge.  is that consistent with what others are seeing?16:36
danilosbac, not that I know, it appears on everything now that we've rolled it out16:36
bacdanilos:  very odd.  on my webkit browser edge looks fine16:37
danilosbac, what is it that you are seeing? is main content indented for the logo width?16:37
bacdanilos: no.  on a team page the portlets that should be top right are bottom left, below the map.16:38
danilosbac, right, so that's one part of the problem... if you reduce the font size, does the main content get indented (i.e. floats around the top-left logo)16:39
bacno16:39
danilosbac, see bug #49351816:40
mupBug #493518: Side portlet moved again below the main content on wide-screen displays (1920x1200) <Launchpad Foundations:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/493518>16:40
danilosbac, ok, so you are being bitten by only part of the bug :)16:41
danilosbac, I am bitten by both parts, and first one is that I get https://devpad.canonical.com/~danilo/screenshots/css-issues.png16:44
bacdanilos: i've added a comment and two screenshots to that bug16:46
danilosbac, cool, thanks16:46
bacdanilos: note that i'm seeing the portlets on the bottom LEFT, not the same as emmet's screenshot where they are just pushed down16:46
danilosbac, right, everybody else sees them at bottom right, so it's interesting to note16:48
salgadoBjornT, around?17:22
salgadobac, is that on staging?17:23
salgadobac, staging's currently broken; we need to 'make clean' there17:24
salgadombarnett, can you revert pending merges on staging and do a 'make clean' there?17:24
mbarnettsalgado: sure17:27
=== fjlacoste is now known as flacoste
sinzuisalgado: mbarnett: We need to QA my spam branch on staging. It is a CP/reroll candidate. When can we remerge my branch?17:43
mbarnettsinzui: ok, it sounds like thre is some contention over staging...17:46
mbarnettsalgado: things have been reverted and the appserver restarted.17:46
salgadombarnett, thanks!17:46
mbarnettsinzui: whenever is fine by me, it just depends on what is going on with other devs on staging17:47
sinzuisalgado: are you testing anything on staging?17:48
salgadosinzui, not anymore17:48
al-maisanIs there a need to declare on the LP API the return type of a method that returns a string?17:48
sinzuimbarnett: can you merge this branch into staging and restart it: lp:~sinzui/launchpad/spam-eggs-bug-49525017:49
mbarnettsinzui: i believe salgado is currently running some tests.  is that true salgado?17:49
salgadombarnett, nope, I'm finished17:50
mbarnettsalgado: ok, great.  thanks17:50
mbarnettsinzui: ok, give me a few (on a phone call), then i will merge that in for you17:50
EdwinGrubbssinzui: ping18:39
sinzuiHi EdwinGrubbs18:42
EdwinGrubbssinzui: I have a new idea for solving the addMember() status confusion. Salgado had added a True/False return value just for the REST API, but it would be better to return the actual status. Then, the UI can do the right thing no matter what the model decides to do.18:44
sinzuiEdwinGrubbs: That is a great idea. I agree we should do it18:44
bacsalgado: great, the problem i saw on staging is gone18:54
bacdanilos:18:55
bacdanilos: ^^18:55
danilosbac, thanks19:06
marssinzui, ping19:46
mwhudsonbigjools: here now...19:46
bigjoolsmwhudson: I am not :)19:47
mwhudsonbigjools: congrats19:47
bigjoolsI just wanted to catch up about how you're doing19:47
bigjoolsbut it's late, I'm tired, and fed up with 12+ hour days19:47
mwhudsonbigjools: i finally got something reviewable yesterday, thudding my way along i guess19:50
sinzuihi mars19:52
bigjoolsmwhudson: \o/19:57
=== salgado is now known as salgado-afk
EsatYuceWho knows about GPG key?22:15
thumperEsatYuce: many people who have stopped working for the day23:43
EsatYucethumper, : but i haven't done23:43

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