[01:31] <yoasif> anyone around?
[01:39] <micahg> sure yoasif
[01:40] <yoasif> micahg, heya -- im not sure about this, but i'm running kile in gnome, and it doesn't use gtk widgets (in lucid) -- isn't it supposed to have gtk+ widgets if i change it in qt4config?
[01:40] <micahg> yoasif: try asking in #ubuntu+1
[01:43] <yoasif> micahg, sure -- but this is more of a kde app in gnome question -- any better place to ask that?
[01:43] <micahg> yoasif: no, that's the support channel
[01:43] <micahg> for lucid
[01:43] <yoasif> since it's the same version of kile that is in karmic
[01:44] <yoasif> sure micahg
[01:44] <micahg> yoasif: if you discover it's a bug, then you can come back and we'll triage it :)
[01:46] <yoasif> micahg, i'm not even sure it's a bug haha -- im getting someone in another channel telling me that kde apps don't necessarily use the qt4 theme
[01:46] <micahg> yoasif: well, I don't know anything about Lucid or how things have changed
[01:47] <micahg> yoasif: the people in #ubuntu+1 know Lucid, so that's why I suggested it
[01:48] <yoasif> yea
[03:14] <maco> bdmurray: i'm about to expire from bug control. can you renew me?
[03:14] <maco> thnx
[03:18] <micahg> maco: as a member of MOTU, you're automatically a member of bug control
[03:19] <maco> micahg: oooo right
[03:19] <maco> ok guess it doesnt matter if my direct membership expires then :)
[03:24] <hggdh> maco: I would expect a lot of direct membership to be overridden by group ones
[03:33] <micahg> hggdh: I think bdmurray is trying to whittle that down
[13:00] <bddebian> Boo
[13:22] <qense> is bug 229370 actually a bug, or is it more desired behaviour to prevent everything you (not) want and more from showing up in Places?
[13:22] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 229370 in nautilus "Regression: USB removable storage devices listed in fstab no longer show in "Computer" " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/229370
[14:32] <LimCore> Why are we confusing new users with stupid keymap question since 4 years(?) and counting?
[14:32] <LimCore> You are not the bug assignee nor the maintainer of ubiquity (Ubuntu), and therefore cannot edit this bug's status.
[14:32] <LimCore> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/428626
[14:32] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 428626 in ubiquity "Ubuntu installation asks stupid questions confusing new users. Like Dvorak." [Undecided,Invalid]
[14:34] <LimCore> should I make new bug, or how can I reopen this one.  The problem is that this question is confusing.  Solution:  write there a text informing to just use the default if not certain.  This is needed because new users have no idea what this questions means and what to do
[14:34] <LimCore> (The user does not know that the first option is ok to just leave it and continue with next step)
[15:33] <qense> chrisccoulson: Apologises for bug 488143. Shall I convert it to a nautilus bug nevertheless?
[15:33] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 488143 in nautilus ""Open with other application" requires full path of applications in path" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/488143
[15:34] <chrisccoulson> qense - i'm not sure. the screenshots there are from firefox, and that's a known issue with that dialog. you say that the nautilus dialog has a similar issue though?
[15:35] <chrisccoulson> (i can't check that yet, as i'm at work)
[15:35] <qense> yes, I could confirm that bug for Nautilus out of my own experience in the past; that was why I handled it like a Nautilus bug.
[15:36] <chrisccoulson> qense - the nautilus dialog looks something like this: http://lh4.ggpht.com/_DrjM_l2eDa8/SoTGj6msnyI/AAAAAAAATIU/MByky82WbHs/s512/screenshot%20004.png
[15:36] <chrisccoulson> is that the one you're referring too?
[15:36] <chrisccoulson> i didn't think that one had the same issue though
[15:36] <qense> ah, things must have changed since I last used it: double mistake from my side
[15:36] <chrisccoulson> qense - no worries :)
[15:37] <chrisccoulson> i'll re-assign that one to firefox for now
[15:37] <chrisccoulson> thanks
[15:37] <qense> thank you!
[15:56] <greg-g> chrisccoulson: what is up with that watermark on the screenshot?
[15:57] <chrisccoulson> greg-g - not sure, as the screenshot is not mine
[15:57] <greg-g> chrisccoulson: ah :)
[15:57] <chrisccoulson> i just picked a random screenshot from google ;)
[16:10] <ejat> did someone know how to remove / delete previous conversation in empathy ?
[16:19] <qense> Is bug 229370 a real bug, or is it desired behaviour to hide certain /etc/fstab-entries in Nautilus' Places?
[16:19] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 229370 in nautilus "Regression: USB removable storage devices listed in fstab no longer show in "Computer" " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/229370
[16:23] <malev> Hi, I've been talking to the reporter from this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/497210  he shows really helpful, I really don't know if this is a bug or not, could some one give me a hand?
[16:23] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 497210 in nautilus "freezes indefinitely with busy cursor when viewing folder with many/large files" [Low,Incomplete]
[16:24] <qense> mac_v: regarding bug 390532: I'm not so sure if allowing to add an extra column to the ListView would solve this problem, especially since I recall a kernel change that (partially?) disabled updating the Accessed Date -- had something to do with ext4 and/or SSDs. What about the initial suggestion made by the reporter in the description?
[16:24] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 390532 in hundredpapercuts "Nautilus Icon view does not allow all the sort options available in List view" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/390532
[16:26] <qense> malev: that seems to be an issue in the thumbnail generator indeed, I would look up what is responsible for making sure the settings are adhered to and report it at the proper upstream if it hasn't already been reported there.
[16:27] <qense> malev: you could try to reproduce it yourself
[16:27] <qense> (reproduce the ignoring of the tumbnail generating settings)
[16:28] <malev> qense, but I don't have that problem, the thumbnails bound works really fine for me...
[16:29] <qense> malev: you could ask him what happens when he loads the directory on a clean user account (i.e. settings reset, anything that might obstruct the thumbnail generator settings deleted)
[16:30] <malev> qense, oks! excelent idea. thanks
[16:30] <qense> you're welcome :)
[16:30] <mac_v> qense: hi.. the bug doesnt really seem about adding an extra column... but rather that the sorting by date accessed isnt available in the right click unless the user searches for it in the preferences
[16:32] <mac_v> also , its the same behavior in "Icon view" too
[16:33] <qense> mac_v: iirc the reporter says that the files are sorted according to the rules of the directory right away, and not easy identifiable as new. He mentiones the way Windows does it, which he finds is better than the way Nautilus currently handles things: sorting the files right away and not marking them. He doesn't seem to be really providing a solution, though.
[16:33] <qense> true, adding it to Listview wouldn't solve it
[16:33] <qense> for IconView
[16:35] <qense> mac_v: however, the changes you made to the bug report do seem to indicate that you would like to solve it with ListView additions.
[16:38] <mac_v> qense: IMO , its the difference between date modified and date accessed which causes this different behavior... if you copy a file the date modified doesnt change... so the easiest "fix" would be to *also* display the 'Date accessed' in the arrange by submenu  , since even if the list view option is enabled , it doesnt get displayed now
[16:39] <mac_v> for the icon view
[16:39] <mac_v> and there seems no easy way to sort by "date accessed" in icon view
[16:39] <qense> mac_v: but I doubt that still gets set at all times, since iirc it as (partially?) disabled in the kernel due to ext4 and/or SSD issues a while ago.
[16:40] <qense> at least it wouldn't be a proper soluation that would work on all systems
[16:40] <mac_v> qense: oh... i'm not sure about the kernel changes
[16:40] <chrisccoulson> "date accessed" is an unreliable metric, as not all filesystems support it (although I might be wrong there), and it can be disabled on those which do by mounting with "noatime"
[16:41] <qense> And what does relatime do exactly?
[16:41] <qense> that is default now, irrc
[16:41] <qense> if I'm correct*
[16:41]  * mac_v checks
[16:41] <chrisccoulson> relatime only updates atime if the previous atime is older than mtime (modified time)
[16:42] <chrisccoulson> and that is the default mount option in ubuntu
[16:42] <qense> so it isn't reliable either, relatime only makes sure that atime isn't older than mtime
[16:42] <chrisccoulson> qense - yeah, that's right
[16:43] <mac_v> chrisccoulson: then how does list view solve this? or does it also give wrong results?
[16:43] <joaopinto> anyone familiar with getting the list of bugs for a specific project using launchpadlib ?
[16:43] <chrisccoulson> mac_v - not sure, as i haven't read the whole scrollback yet ;)
[16:43] <chrisccoulson> so i only have half the conversation
[16:43] <chrisccoulson> and i'm just about to finish work now
[16:43] <qense> mac_v: Like you said, ListView doesn't support atime, so it hasn't got a problem with it.
[16:45] <mac_v> hmm...
[16:45] <qense> but aren't the files copied or moved to a directory already selected by default?
[16:45] <qense> That would seem the most logical option to me
[16:46] <qense> (to do that, if it isn't already being done)
[16:46] <qense> I wouldn't go with not sorting new files, it would be ugly
[16:47] <qense> mac_v: I can't confirm the bug, actually. Files I copied or moved are selected afterwards.
[16:48] <mac_v> qense: the files are selected , but dont display at the end of the list
[16:48] <qense> is that what we want? Would breaking the sorting really be helpful?
[16:49] <mac_v> qense: in windows , when new file is added to a folder the user can get the file displayed at the end and this probably helps in folders such as downloads or other folders where user constantly adds new files
[16:50] <mac_v> easier to recognize when the file was added...
[16:50]  * mac_v but got used to the alphabetical order , so doesnt make a difference for me :)
[16:50] <qense> you want a permanent sorting method so you can sort a directory on "newly added files"?
[16:50] <qense> 'want'*
[16:51] <qense> I'm not sure if we can provide that
[16:51] <qense> we could, but not without a lot of overhead
[16:53] <mac_v> qense: if the sort by date accessed works with List view , why should it not work [I didnt understand the problem why icon view alone cant sort it like so]
[16:53] <qense> mac_v: it would be deceptive to add it since it's not reliable
[16:53] <mac_v> hmm...
[16:53] <qense> it might even not be changed when you copy a file to a directory
[16:54] <qense> or probably: it probably won't be changed
[16:54] <mac_v> qense: not sure , what to do then.. maybe we can let the nautilus devs comment on it then?
[16:55] <qense> well, the way you put it it's more a feature request -- at least, if you leave atime and a ListView column for the value out of it -- requesting a way of sorting files on "added to directory"
[16:55] <qense> and I'm not so sure if would be easy to create such a thing
[16:55] <qense> we could let Nautilus create a database to keep track of this, but that would be too much overhead in my eyes
[16:56] <mac_v> qense: it *does* change when you copy a file... [i havent been able to notice any irregularities yet... ]
[16:56] <qense> it does?
[16:56] <mac_v> yup
[16:56] <qense> reliably?
[16:56] <qense> on most systems?
[16:57] <mac_v> qense: i havent noticed any problems on ext4..
[16:57] <qense> Could you check in /ets/fstab if you're using relatime, or something different?
[16:59] <mac_v> qense: my fstab , from Lucid > http://paste.ubuntu.com/344180/  its the default and i havent edited anything other than assigning the partitions during install
[17:00] <qense> no relatime in there, but iirc it's the default anyway
[17:03] <mac_v> yeah , i think so too , vaguely recall "relatime" being in the fstabs earlier than jaunty
[17:04] <qense> For sorting a directory on "new to this directory" I would suggest to direct the reporter (our yourself ;)) to Brainstorma and/or the mailists and mark the bug as Invalid because newly copied/moved files are selected. Do you agree? It is a bit too much for a bug report and it's not really a regression.
[17:07] <mac_v> qense: IMO , it isnt a feature request *if* date accessed is reliable... it seems a basic feature not being available for icon view... but you can triage the bug accordingly as you feel fit :)
[17:08] <mac_v> qense: also , the best judge for the bug would be nautilus devs who probably have a reason for not exposing the option
[17:08] <mac_v> or maybe they just forgot ;)
[17:09] <qense> mac_v: you're right: for further enhancement we could direct the reporter to Brainstorm and the mailists, but we could use the bug report as a bug asking for atime to be allowed as a sorting value
[17:09] <qense> and report it upstream, of course
[17:10] <qense> interesting read about atime: http://kerneltrap.org/node/14148
[17:10] <mac_v> qense: first we can report it upstream or maybe we could ping someone on #nautilus ?
[17:10] <qense> I would file a bug, we would be more likely to get a response from the right dev
[17:11] <mac_v> qense: great, thanks :)
[17:13] <qense> mac_v: I'll triage the bug as I said, if that's alright with you. Thanks for your input!
[17:34] <mac_v> qense: hasnt bug been fixed? Bug #58205 , there is already a format in the context menu
[17:34] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 58205 in nautilus "Should provide Right-Click->Format..." [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/58205
[17:36] <qense> mac_v: let me check
[17:37] <qense> mac_v: yes it is! thanks for mentioning
[17:37] <mac_v> ;)
[17:39] <qense> mac_v: btw, why aren't you a member of bugcontrol yet? You're doing so much work, you would probably be granted membership very fast.
[17:40] <mac_v> qense: hmm , never thought of applying... i should someday :) hopefully soon...
[17:40] <qense> yes you should!
[18:31] <qense> pitti: do you think that bug 229370 could be related to bug 463347 or maybe bug 469837? I reckon it probably is somewhere in devicekit-disks, but I'm not sure if it is a duplicate of an already reported bug.
[18:31] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 229370 in nautilus "Regression: USB removable storage devices listed in fstab no longer show in "Computer" " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/229370
[18:31] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 463347 in udev "devices not detected -- too many open files" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/463347
[18:31] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 469837 in devicekit-disks "[Karmic] Internal drives don't always show up in Nautilus/Places menu" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/469837
[18:32] <qense> I do find many ancient bug reports with similar symptoms as bug 229370, but they were fixed in GNOME 2.14. :S
[18:32] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 229370 in nautilus "Regression: USB removable storage devices listed in fstab no longer show in "Computer" " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/229370
[18:33] <qense> oops
[18:33] <qense> was talking in #ubuntu-bugs all the time, pitti's not here
[18:39] <Hellow> *clap*
[19:05] <maxb> Does anyone know if there is a bug for mysterious i915 graphics issues in lucid? Screen going blank for no discernible reason?
[19:18] <joumetal> maxb: bug 494062 maybe
[19:18] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 494062 in linux "i915: KMS disabled when vga16fb is loaded with Lucid Kernel 2.6.32-7.10" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/494062
[21:38] <MTecknology> where is the plugin for firefox with responses for bugs?
[21:39] <yofel_> MTecknology: https://edge.launchpad.net/~gm-dev-launchpad/+archive/ppa
[21:40] <MTecknology> thanks
[21:49] <MTecknology> yofel: this doesn't seem to want to work for mw...
[21:49] <MTecknology> me*
[21:49] <MTecknology> I see [+edit+] and [+reload+]; but nothing that I can use..
[21:49] <yofel> yeah, just noticed right now too that I can only use my self-defined responses
[21:49] <yofel> bdmurray: ?
[21:50] <MTecknology> bdmurray: fixitfixitfixit..... fixit
[21:51] <micahg> MTecknology: did you restart FF?
[21:52] <MTecknology> micahg: ya
[21:52] <micahg> hmmm
[21:54] <MTecknology> I need to run errands - bbl
[21:59] <yofel> micahg: I see all my self-defined responses + edit and reload. Pressing reload says 'standard replies reloaded' but still doesn't display them
[22:00] <micahg> yofel: idk, wfm in ff3.6b5
[22:00] <yofel> ffx3.5.6 - lucid
[22:01] <yofel> err...
[22:01] <yofel> looking at my ~/.mozilla/firefox/<profile>/prefs.js
[22:01] <micahg> yofel: you can always try a new profile
[22:03] <yofel> ALL response items exept self-defined ones are labeled as 'Use Storage Symptom'
[22:03] <micahg> yofel: try a new profile
[22:03] <yofel> and most responses were overwritten with the storage response text o.O
[22:03] <micahg> firefox -ProfileManager
[22:04] <micahg> yofel: maybe one of your extensions isn't playing nice
[22:04] <yofel> yeah, could be
[22:05] <yofel> I'll try a new profile in a while, have to finish something first
[22:05] <micahg> yofel: if you see the defaults in a new profile, you know it's one of your extensions or a problem with your profile
[23:04] <yofel> no luck, new profile doesn't improve anything and Namoroka refuses to work (it uses 100% CPU and the window contents don't get refreshed)
[23:05] <micahg> yofel: what extensions do you have installed at the OS level
[23:05] <micahg> ?
[23:05] <yofel> mom
[23:08] <micahg> ?
[23:11] <yofel> only lp-improvements and ubufox
[23:11] <yofel> let's try to disable the plugins...
[23:14] <yofel> nope, doesn't help either
[23:15] <MTecknology> I see you're still having the same issue