[21:20] <darkmatter> coz_: I have made a decent notification area on a 32 pixel panel http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/4842/screenshotet.png ;)
[22:08] <coz_> darkmatter,  hey guy  ...sorry  I  just woke up .... been battling a bloody nose
[22:10] <darkmatter> coz_: thats ok an: that sucks. I hate bloody noses
[22:10] <coz_> darkmatter,  oh man this was my first bloddy nose ever.. it just wouldnt stop
[22:10] <darkmatter> :/
[22:11] <Equiet> Nice Christmas discussion topic. :)
[22:11] <coz_> :)
[22:11] <darkmatter> :P
[22:14] <darkmatter> coz_: the customization of the icons is coming along nicely, but the status directories will be huge. basically anything that lives in the tray (gnome power manager, xrandr, etc) needs custom status in the theme. I'm also doing custom themes for filezilla and the like, mainly out of concern for consistent tray na-tray icons
[22:15] <coz_> darkmatter,   very very cool :)
[22:16] <coz_> darkmatter,  lately all I have done is another theme for cairo-dock
[22:16] <darkmatter> coz_: 16x16 icons, 6-8 pix of padding (because they need additional size coverage for some at 22 and 24)
[22:17] <darkmatter> coz_: well.. I'm almost done with the rebuild of the sonar gtk. then I attack gilouche with a fierce rewrite :P
[22:17] <coz_> darkmatter,  cool... of course  I want to try it :)
[22:18] <coz_> soneone needs to create a front end gui theme creator  ... :)
[22:21] <darkmatter> coz_: I actual discussed that a few weeks ago. I have a rather elaborate idea of how it could/should work. and basically it should be ide like
[22:22] <darkmatter> it should actually build the theme for you. store revisions (including pixmaps) with a diff-;ike approach, etc
[22:22] <coz_> darkmatter,  that would be nice ... many people have asked ... including myself... for a nice gtk theme creator.... most people dont like dealing with the gtkrc
[22:22] <darkmatter> aye
[22:25] <darkmatter> coz_: lol.. like me. I'm one of these 'masters' (at least they keep telling me that) but I freaking LOATH gtk :P
[22:25] <coz_> :)
[22:27] <Equiet> Is something like this in brainstorm?
[22:30] <coz_> Equiet,  mm  I havent checked
[22:32] <darkmatter> coz_: like the work I've done thus far on sonar (I'll be starting the pixmapping later). by any standard it should be 5ish minutes of work. but because you have to manually edit a 1000+ line gtkrc it takes forever
[22:32] <coz_> darkmatter,  that is the reason I have not tackled anything recently.... I rely on you so far :)
[22:33] <coz_> darkmatter,  I have had many ask about this but  unfortunately not much is out there
[22:36] <coz_> darkmatter,  when beryl introduced Emerald theme manager.... may people questioned why there wasnt something similiar for gtk.... I dont blame them.... a theme  editor ...in my opinion ..is long overdue
[22:36] <darkmatter> coz_: but anyway. I'll be porting gilouche from clearlooks to murrine ar part of its rebirth. both gilouche and sonar will have fully pixmapped panels as well
[22:37] <coz_> cool
[22:37] <darkmatter> coz_: indeed
[22:38] <darkmatter> coz_: I always liked gilouche snce it was introduced in sle 10, but gah... clearlooks is my most hated adversary ;D
[22:39] <darkmatter> and the easiest way to give a modern look/feel is a hybrid theme. lets me avoid a 4mb gtkrc for the pixbuf engine :P
[22:40] <darkmatter> so murrine and picbuf where required
[22:40] <coz_> darkmatter, gilouche always attracted me as well
[22:40] <darkmatter> I'm attempting to keep pixmap usage down to tranparent images as much as possible to retain recolorable theming
[22:41] <darkmatter> sonar is the exception, since many elements are black regardless of coloration, I can skip the transparencies
[22:45] <darkmatter> coz_: I'll be basing the panel for gilouche loosely on the oldish revision I had done http://www.flickr.com/photos/92826085@N00/2094407785/sizes/o/in/set-72157603406043713/ but a bit more 'modern'
[22:45] <darkmatter> since jimmac already loves the previous work :D
[22:46] <coz_> darkmatter,  oooo so clean :)
[22:46] <Equiet> Wow, very nice.
[22:47] <darkmatter> coz_: jimmac was browsing my flickr and saw the old WIP on gilouche. nothing feels better than having on of the big-wigs of gnomes art paying you a compliment xD
[22:47] <coz_> darkmatter,  for sure :)
[22:50] <coz_> darkmatter,  well that last image... shows off the subtleness of your ideas.... it is quite beautiful
[22:50] <darkmatter> coz_: ty
[22:52] <coz_> darkmatter, you know that I love dark themes as well.... but the same holds true for light or dark... too often the work required for subtle nuances in color and line seem to be lacking   as well as a solid colour sense  that many seem to ignore... but I have always trusted all of that in your stuff
[22:53] <coz_> mmm did that sound too  "groupie" like ?? lol
[22:54] <darkmatter> hehe
[22:57] <darkmatter> coz_: yeah. I've played around with various style, but I've always leaned towards clean/subtle with more realistic shadows/lighting and a distinct lack of glass. it just feels 'right' imho. there's too much 'web 2.0y-ness' and 'zomg! mac!!!' in theming these days
[22:57] <darkmatter> pretty much everything you see is exceptionally plain or grossly overdone to the point of being insulting
[23:00] <darkmatter> there are exceptions that are tastefully done. but they are definitely not the norm
[23:01] <coz_> darkmatter,  I agree....most seem rushed or  "finalized" with the concept.... too often the wrong values   ...clashing colours.... bad font colors especially seem to pop up far too often
[23:02] <darkmatter> aye
[23:04] <coz_> darkmatter,  this tells me there is much desire to contribute to the pool of themes already out there... but that, also,  there are many who just dont get  what  refinement means
[23:06] <coz_> darkmatter,  I have seen some themes that I cannot reasonably understand what the hell they were thinking  when they came up with the idea!
[23:06] <coz_> :)
[23:07] <coz_> ^^  that goes   well beyond  "too each their own"  or  "subjective"
[23:07] <darkmatter> coz_: indeed. everyone wants to contribute in some way (not just art), but most lack skill and/or taste. sadly it is a universal golden rule ;)
[23:08] <coz_> darkmatter,  I agree... I will never understand our species  lol
[23:09] <darkmatter> coz_: and it's not limited to foss. take a look at vistas default theme. the thing was an atrocity. &'s is a sizable improvement, but is still 'shoddy' im a lot of ways
[23:09] <darkmatter> like, too much contrast/boldness in certain elements that doesn't fit with the overall fell
[23:09] <darkmatter> etc
[23:09] <darkmatter> 7's*
[23:10] <coz_> darkmatter,   understood :)
[23:16] <coz_> ok I have to break here.... I have not slept in 2 days and its already christmas eve.... I might be back later though... I just need to rest abit :)