[00:09] <awardle> How do you run Xorg without xorg.conf?
[00:11] <BUGabundo> lol
[00:11] <BUGabundo> you create one?
[00:11] <jmarsden> The same way you run it without one.  It autodetects what it needs...
[00:12] <awardle> So should I tell the person just to remove their xorg.conf then?
[00:15] <jmarsden> awardle: Unless they have a system that needs one...
[00:16] <jmarsden> awardle: You have not given the channel enough context to really answer that question... what is wrong with the setup "the person" has right now?
[02:46] <LimCore> happy, less full of bugs, 2010 \o/
[03:25] <cyan-spam> hey all, trying to triage a bug here and i think i need someone more experienced to help me out :)
[03:42] <yofel> cyan-spam: if you need help please always post the bug number as 'bug XXX' so that we can help you
[03:42] <yofel> if you have a general question then just fire away, someone will answer when they see the question
[03:43] <yofel> and know the answer ;)
[03:43] <cyan-spam> yofel: ok, thanks. the bug is <https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/501744>. i tried my best when i got no response.
[03:43] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 501744 in ubuntu "crashed entire gui while in fullscreen" [Undecided,Incomplete]
[03:44] <yofel> cyan-spam: just bug 501744 is enough, we have a great bot in here ;)
[03:44] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 501744 in ubuntu "crashed entire gui while in fullscreen" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/501744
[03:44] <cyan-spam> yofel: well, it was easier to copy the URL for me. :) if you have a better response, please take over. not sure what the right procedure is here
[03:48] <yofel> hm, I'm not the best person to ask about when it comes to X related bugs...
[03:50] <yofel> someone else should look at this too, but IMHO you did the right thing so far
[03:54] <cyan-spam> thanks
[04:27] <cyan-spam> night all
[05:53] <\vish> could someone kick start/re-start the 5-a-day bot :(
[05:54] <\vish> bdmurray: ?
[11:11] <RoyK> hi all
[11:12] <RoyK> how long does it usually take from a bug is reported till it's fixed? weeks? months? #471163 puts a limit on the usability on this laptop...
[11:12] <nigel_nb> bug 471163
[11:12] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 471163 in linux "kernel 2.6.31-14 report error in eth9x module" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/471163
[11:13] <RoyK> I think I've reported the necessary stuff
[11:13] <RoyK> if not, please tell
[11:14] <nigel_nb> checking
[11:17] <nigel_nb> RoyK: what exactly is the issue?
[11:17] <nigel_nb> you cant use your wireless?
[11:18] <RoyK> nigel_nb: I get a kernel bug/crash and after that the wlan is dead
[11:18] <nigel_nb> okay, all required info is attached
[11:18] <nigel_nb> I'll mark it as confirmed
[11:18] <RoyK> thanks
[11:19] <nigel_nb> it was a one-time situation or happens every time?
[11:19] <RoyK> it happens every now and then
[11:19] <RoyK> it took for ever to upgrade to -16 - I had to go through 5-6 reboots to download it all
[11:22] <nigel_nb> RoyK: marked as confirmed
[11:24] <RoyK> danke
[12:34] <Yos> nigel_nb, ping
[12:34] <nigel_nb> Yos: yes
[12:35] <Yos> Hey, how is the best way to find a duplicate?
[12:35] <nigel_nb> Yos: google ;)
[12:35] <Yos> There is a report of a bug now that I know is a duplicate of a bug reported earlier
[12:36] <nigel_nb> it may or may not have been filed under proper package
[12:36] <nigel_nb> gimme current bug number
[12:37] <Yos> 502265
[12:37] <nigel_nb> bug 502265
[12:37] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 502265 in alsa-driver "audio muted on boot sometimes" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/502265
[12:37] <Yos> I changed the package to alsa
[12:37] <nigel_nb> Yos: good, now the audio team is subscribed
[12:38] <Yos> So I should just let them deal with it now?
[12:39] <nigel_nb> they would deal with it, but lets find the dup
[12:39] <nigel_nb> already daniel is overworked, we'll take some work off his head
[12:39] <nigel_nb> is it bug 453776
[12:39] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 453776 in ubuntu "volume muted after boot" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/453776
[12:44] <Yos> I found it YaY
[12:44] <Yos> 352732
[12:44] <yofel> bug 352732
[12:45] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 352732 in alsa-utils "[jaunty,karmic] Sound muted after boot" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/352732
[12:45] <Yos> Others were also reported as a duplicate of it
[12:46] <nigel_nb> ah
[12:48] <Yos> in google, I added 'site:launchpad.net' so that it only searched launchpad
[12:49] <nigel_nb> Yos: thats wat we all do
[12:49] <nigel_nb> launchpad search obviously kinda sucks
[12:49] <Yos> Like ubuntuforums
[12:50] <nigel_nb> I'm not that active on forums, I live on LP and IRC ;)
[12:50] <Yos> I'm still trying to find my way around on LP
[12:53] <Yos> Just another '?', when I report a duplicate, should I leave a comment telling the reporter that I have done so and direct them to the new location?
[12:56] <nigel_nb> Yos: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses
[12:56] <nigel_nb> Yos: Ideally, before you link as duplicate you need to give standard response for duplicate
[12:56] <nigel_nb> then mark as duplicate
[12:56] <Yos> oops, now I know
[12:57] <nigel_nb> Yos: but if you've already marked, dont add the comment because everyone else on the original bug would get a copy, would create unnecessary noise on mails
[12:57] <Yos> gotcha
[12:57] <Yos> Thanks again :)
[13:03] <nigel_nb> no problem :)
[18:39]  * WeatherGod waves
[18:41]  * nigel_nb waves back to WeatherGod
[18:41] <WeatherGod> good to be back
[18:41] <WeatherGod> gotta long backlog of bug reports to answer
[18:43] <nigel_nb> hehe
[18:43] <nigel_nb> me too back after some time today
[18:44] <WeatherGod> nigel_nb: have a good holiday?
[18:45] <nigel_nb> WeatherGod: not bad, I had work.  too much work actually
[18:45] <WeatherGod> ah
[18:46] <WeatherGod> anything interesting happen with Ubuntu in the past couple of weeks?
[18:47] <nigel_nb> nothing much
[18:49] <WeatherGod> oh, btw, to whoever did the update to the lp plugin for firefox, I really love the new feature of coloring the OP's replies
[18:50] <WeatherGod> it makes it easier to spot when someone else hijacks a bug report
[18:52] <nigel_nb> is there an lp plugin, i didn't know
[18:53] <WeatherGod> yeah... let me find the name
[18:54] <WeatherGod> nigel_nb: firefox-lp-improvements
[18:54] <WeatherGod> it is a PPA
[18:54] <nigel_nb> ah
[18:55] <WeatherGod> there is also firefox-launchpad-plugin, but I haven't noticed it doing anything, I don't think
[18:56] <WeatherGod> firefox-lp-improvements modifies your bug report pages so that you can see the karma of each user that replies
[18:57] <WeatherGod> which is really nice in determining the level of expertise someone has in their comments
[18:58] <WeatherGod> it also shows little icons for which projects they are involved in next to their username
[18:58] <WeatherGod> so you can see if another bug triager has already taken control of a report
[18:58] <WeatherGod> or a ubuntu developer...
[18:59] <nigel_nb> how do I install it?
[19:00] <WeatherGod> you go to it's PPA page and add its debsrc entries to your sources list
[19:00] <WeatherGod> then you can install the package
[19:00] <nigel_nb> lemme try out
[19:10] <SoftwareExplorer> I'm trying to submit a suspend / resume bug, and I am following the page at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingKernelSuspend. I get to the part where it says 'hash matches /build/buildd/linux-2.6.32/drivers/base/power/main.c:430', but I don't get any 'hash matches device i2c-9191' type of line. I am doing this on 10.04. What shoul I do/try next?
[19:13] <SoftwareExplorer> link to pastebin of dmesg.txt http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/350491/
[19:15] <WeatherGod> SoftwareExplorer: I am taking a look, give me a second to catch up
[19:16] <SoftwareExplorer> WeatherGod: Ok, thanks.
[19:22] <Yos> If you are unsure which package is causing the problem, a safe bet is the kernel, ''but make the bug title includes "suspend" or "hibernate"''  Ok, so how does one file a bug against 'The kernel'?
[19:23] <yofel> Yos: ubuntu-bug linux
[19:24] <WeatherGod> SoftwareExplorer: I would agree to file this one against the kernel...
[19:24] <Yos> ty yofel
[19:24] <WeatherGod> according to your dmesg output, it does not indicate any particular driver module to be the culprit
[19:25] <yofel> afaik almost all suspend/resume bugs are kernel issues
[19:25] <WeatherGod> oh, shoot
[19:25] <WeatherGod> SoftwareExplorer: your issue is Suspend/Resume from DISK, not RAM
[19:25] <WeatherGod> at least, that is what your dmesg says
[19:26] <Yos> yofel Too many matches. Please try to narrow your search.  I'm trying to assign a bug to the kernel ???
[19:27] <WeatherGod> Yos, yeah, that's annoying...
[19:27] <Yos> Is it just 'ubuntu
[19:27] <yofel> Yos: a) which bug? b) what are you searching for
[19:27] <Yos> one sec
[19:27] <SoftwareExplorer> WeatherGod: Ok. I started the suspend with sync; echo 1 > /sys/power/pm_trace; pm-suspend, Is that a hibernate command?
[19:27] <Yos> bug 502376
[19:27] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 502376 in ubuntu "Toshiba Tecra doesn't resume from suspend" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/502376
[19:28] <yofel> Yos: put 'linux' into the package field
[19:28] <Yos> ok
[19:28] <yofel> thats the name of the kernel package
[19:28] <yofel> *source-package
[19:29] <WeatherGod> SoftwareExplorer: are you having trouble with suspend-to-disk or suspend-to-memory?
[19:30] <SoftwareExplorer> WeatherGod: Both, IIRC, but I was going to start with suspend to ram first
[19:30] <Yos> ty yofel now can they use apport-collect to provide the missing information ?
[19:31] <WeatherGod> SoftwareExplorer: if you are  having trouble with both, then I would do the tests for suspend-to-disk first
[19:31] <WeatherGod> suspend-to-ram is trickier to diagnose
[19:31] <yofel> Yos: yes, just 'apport-collect 502376' will do the trick here
[19:32] <Yos> Thanks :)
[19:32] <SoftwareExplorer> WeatherGod: OK. I guess I'll have to read up on how to do that. Thanks.
[19:34] <WeatherGod> SoftwareExplorer: np
[19:35] <yofel> Yos: also, since this reporter seems new here, you might consider posting the 'package assignment' stock response so that the reporter can learn about choosing the right package himself next time
[19:36] <Yos> Cool, will do
[19:37] <yofel> Yos: ideally you should always post a short explenation if you change anything on a bug reporrt
[19:37] <yofel> *report
[19:37] <yofel> so that the people following the bug understand why
[19:38] <yofel> Yos: tried the ffx-lp-improvements? with it you have most stock responses only a click away on a report
[19:39] <Yos> Is that from the ML ?
[19:39] <yofel> hm?
[19:40] <nigel_nb> yofel: how do u put in the stock reponses while using lp improvements?
[19:40] <yofel> Yos: there is a firefox extension package with a few scripts that make triaging bugs easier
[19:40] <WeatherGod> Yos: it is from the PPA for firefox-lp-improvements
[19:40] <Yos> Is that from the mailing list ?
[19:41] <Yos> Ah, ok
[19:41] <yofel> Yos: the link to the ppa is on the top of the responses page
[19:41] <yofel> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses
[19:42] <Yos> I got it, thanks
[19:43] <yofel> nigel_nb: when you click on the arrow beside the package name on a bug and the menu to change the bug detail open up, then you'll have the responses titles shown below the comment box
[19:43] <nigel_nb> yofel: ah, saw it now! I've been copying and pasting for months bah!!
[19:43] <yofel> you can modify them and add your own if you need
[19:43] <yofel> nigel_nb: hehe, me too before I found them
[19:43] <nigel_nb> way too cool :)
[19:45] <yofel> *sigh*
[19:46] <yofel> the kernel stock response is still out of date
[19:46] <Yos> yofel, I can't find that "'package assignment' stock response"
[19:47] <nigel_nb> Yos: just look properly
[19:47] <nigel_nb> its in 2 lines
[19:47] <yofel> nigel_nb: the line depends on how large the ffx window is :P
[19:48] <nigel_nb> yofel: I assumed he did search with ctrl f, so the only way to miss it if its 2 lines
[19:48] <yofel> Yos: but nigel_nb is right, it's in the extension package and on the responses page (its called 'bugs without a package' there)
[19:49] <yofel> nigel_nb: ah true
[19:49] <nigel_nb> ;)
[19:49] <Yos> Ah yes, bugs without a package was the closest I could find
[19:50] <nigel_nb> yofel: the more I triage bugs, the more I think like of the possibilities a normal person would do
[19:50] <WeatherGod> how true
[19:58] <crimsun> guys/gals, "volume muted on boot" is *not* alsa-driver. Please stop mis-triaging it.
[19:58] <crimsun> it's alsa-utils; it's fixed in Lucid
[19:58] <nigel_nb> crimsun: oops, thanks for the alert
[19:58] <nigel_nb> what happened to the other nick btw?
[19:59] <crimsun> what do you mean?
[19:59] <nigel_nb> I mean dtchen
[19:59] <WeatherGod> nigel_nb: dtchen and crimsun are two different people
[19:59] <yofel> bdmurray: the kernel bug response in the firefox extension is out of date, can you do something about it? (or tell me who I have to call)
[19:59] <nigel_nb> WeatherGod: huh?
[19:59] <crimsun> oh, probably because I don't care to /nick every reconnect
[20:00] <WeatherGod> aren't they?
[20:00] <crimsun> uh, no.
[20:00] <nigel_nb> hahaha
[20:00] <WeatherGod> oh
[20:00] <nigel_nb> crimsun: oh okay :)
[20:00] <crimsun> I've been 'crimsun' on many, many irc networks since '94
[20:00] <WeatherGod> because, I could have sworn I carried on a conversation with both nicks at the same time once
[20:00]  * yofel didn't know that either :D
[20:01] <WeatherGod> as a matter of fact, I distinctly remember crimsun asking dtchen where he was going to eat
[20:02] <nigel_nb> that was maco
[20:02] <nigel_nb> not crimsun
[20:02] <WeatherGod> oh, right
[20:02]  * WeatherGod needs to get internal RAM checked
[20:03] <WeatherGod> crimsun: feel up to look at a system bell issue again?
[20:04] <nigel_nb> I'm off to bed, night folks :)
[20:04] <WeatherGod> the guys have really advanced on it and even has a possible patch
[20:04] <WeatherGod> goodnight
[20:04] <WeatherGod> it is bug 486154
[20:04] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 486154 in metacity "System beep broken in Karmic despite heroic efforts to fix it" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/486154
[20:05] <WeatherGod> the two people in it seem to be pretty exhaustive, but it is way over my head
[20:05] <crimsun> I'll look at it sometime later, so, no not right this moment
[20:05] <WeatherGod> ok, just thought I give you a heads-up on it
[20:10] <crimsun> also, if you see 9.10 sound bugs where the codec in use is a VIA something or another, please ask the original reporter to install linux-backports-modules-alsa-karmic-generic
[20:10] <crimsun> e.g.,  Mixer name   : 'VIA VT1708B 8-Ch'
[20:13] <WeatherGod> will do
[20:17] <crimsun> (that's directed toward all triagers, really :-)
[20:23] <WeatherGod> crimsun, it is ok to file "no sound" bugs that are due to slmodemd against the sl-modem package?
[20:23] <crimsun> no
[20:23] <crimsun> those are pulseaudio bugs
[20:23] <WeatherGod> oh, ok, I will fix that
[20:24] <crimsun> LP: #394500, #450222
[20:24] <WeatherGod> should I mark it as a dupe of one of those?
[20:24] <crimsun> yes
[20:30] <WeatherGod> crimsun, if the fix has been released  a few months ago, why is it still an issue?
[20:32] <crimsun> because it's fixed in *lucid*
[20:32] <crimsun> the patch is pretty big for karmic, so I don't plan to SRU it
[20:33] <WeatherGod> ok
[20:33] <crimsun> if they really, really want it, I just refer people to the ubuntu-audio-dev PPA in which I've backported it
[20:33] <crimsun> but, I do note that it is a PPA, so it's unsupported. It could eat kittens.
[20:34] <WeatherGod> actually, it looks like the one reporter is saying that he re-installed alsa with the hda-intel option
[20:35] <crimsun> most people commenting in those bugs are just shooting in the dark
[20:35] <WeatherGod> and that his only remaining issue is that he can not change the volume except through alsamixer
[20:35] <crimsun> you'll see that everywhere on LP; people just spraying utterly irrelevant comments all over sound bug reports
[20:36] <WeatherGod> well, yeah, I kinda figured that
[20:36] <WeatherGod> maybe he is leaving out some important info
[21:48] <rev42> i have a JMicron USA Technology Corp. JM20337 Hi-Speed USB to SATA & PATA Combo Bridge device that regularly just disconnects the harddrive and hangs with an led lit and this bug has been around since a year or so.. and now i look at launchpad just to see that bug reportin goonly leads to.. an information page.. wtf?
[21:54] <rev42> some of the things dmesg shows:    scsi 54:0:0:0: [sde] Result: hostbyte=DID_NO_CONNECT driverbyte=DRIVER_OK,SUGGEST_OK      end_request: I/O error, dev sde, sector 5664652            usb 2-1: new high speed USB device using ehci_hcd and address 82       usb 2-1: device descriptor read/64, error -71
[21:56] <WeatherGod> rev42, which bug report?
[21:58] <rev42> no bug report
[21:59] <WeatherGod> oh, were  you trying to file a bug report?
[21:59] <rev42> maybe...
[22:01] <WeatherGod> well, I would suggest doing so
[22:01] <bdmurray> yofel: if I knew what was wrong with it I could do something about it ;-)
[22:01] <rev42> so how does one report a bug these days?
[22:01] <WeatherGod> please read the How to Submit Bug Reports page
[22:02] <rev42> did so
[22:02] <WeatherGod> and you clicked on the link, didn't you?
[22:03] <yofel> bdmurray: ok
[22:05] <rev42> why should i use apport when i don't want a stupid tool to 'gather' things it's not supposed to send out in my oppinion?
[22:06] <WeatherGod> you don't have to... give me a second to find the right link
[22:07] <jmarsden> rev42: Because doing things that way may help get your bug fixed?  But if you don't want to, you don't have to, read that page again more carefully.  https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs#Filing%20bugs%20at%20Launchpad.net
[22:09] <WeatherGod> jmarsden: thanks for the link... you beat me to it
[22:10] <WeatherGod> I really need to update my bookmarks
[22:13] <rev42> what is the package for external usb disk controller failure?
[22:15] <WeatherGod> hmmm, someone can correct me if I am wrong, but I am gonna vote that this is a device-kit issue
[22:18] <jmarsden> rev42: Now do you see why allowing apport to help you choose the correct package for your report, and what info might be relevant, could be a good idea?
[22:19] <jmarsden> It has a whole set of questions regarding handling external storage devices built into it... run apport-bug to start the questions...
[22:20] <rev42> jmarsden: maybe some day. i feel discriminated as a professional bugzilla coder and professional bug filer..
[22:21] <jmarsden> rev42: As a professional bug filer, then, you would alreado know what package to file against, you don't need the help apport provides... so why did you need to ask the question here? :)
[22:21] <rev42> the world is big. not everything has to do with ubuntu
[22:22] <jmarsden> Right, so use the provided tools to avoid having to remember lots of details, let the software remember them for you...
[22:22] <jmarsden> Either that, or *do* remember all the details.  The choice is yours :)
[22:23] <WeatherGod> rev42: the world is big... that's why I come here to work with people that have different experiences and specialties
[22:23] <rev42> never mind. the time until someone fixes this.. will take too long anyways. i can't run fsck every 30 minutes for the next months.
[22:24] <WeatherGod> but, then that deprives us of a fix
[22:24] <WeatherGod> at least submit some information so that it can be examined
[22:25] <jmarsden> rev42: Some bugs are fixed in a day or two, if they have full information in the bug report so they can easily be reproduced...
[22:26] <jmarsden> I just helped test a proposed fix to spamassasin for a bug that emerged yesterday and the fix is already in the -proposed repos and headed for -updates.  Just as an example.
[22:27] <WeatherGod> rev42, by coming here, you actually do improve your chances of a bug getting fixed by coming here and raising awareness
[22:27] <WeatherGod> a bug like yours is quite serious as it can cause data corruption
[22:31] <WeatherGod> crimsun, are you still around?
[22:34] <rev42> well, to make it more tangible which device is failing: http://www.sharkoon.com/html/produkte/docking_stations/drive_link/index_en.html?id=11
[22:35] <WeatherGod> interesting... never seen one of those before
[22:36] <rev42> it work's fine with IDE drives. fails for SATA.
[22:36] <WeatherGod> interesting observation
[22:37] <WeatherGod> have you tried it with any other OS?
[22:37] <rev42> no
[22:38] <WeatherGod> would be interesting to see if there is a hardware issue with the SATA side
[22:57] <SoftwareExplorer> Ok, I have a question about an mpx bug I found. With two cursors, on a gnome application but not a qt3 one, both cursors are the same type (i-shape for text, double arrow for adustment, etc), with the type determined by the last cursor that moved. What package should I file this bug against?
[23:09] <SoftwareExplorer> also, this bug does not occur on a qt4 application
[23:14] <WeatherGod> softwareexplorer: I don't know, but maybe gtk?
[23:14] <WeatherGod> does it happen only for that one program, or what?
[23:15] <SoftwareExplorer> WeatherGod: Pretty much any gtk application. I thought it was a problem every program had until I tried a kde application
[23:15] <WeatherGod> ok, then this is likely a compiz, metacity or gtk issue
[23:18] <SoftwareExplorer> Well, we can rule out compiz. With compiz, you can hardly see the other cursor, so I'm using metacity. I got the kde application to work under metacity, so I guess I'll file it under gtk. Are there any special tags for mpx - related problems?
[23:19] <WeatherGod> dunno
[23:19] <SoftwareExplorer> Ok. Thanks.
[23:20] <WeatherGod> np