chrisccoulsonyou're working late this evening seb128 ;)00:41
seb128chrisccoulson, yeah, alpha2 freeze is tomorrow so I prefer to push updates today if I can00:42
chrisccoulsonseb128 - are there any other updates you particularly want to get in A2?00:42
seb128chrisccoulson, no00:43
seb128those I'm doing now I don't especially care about getting those in a200:43
seb128that's just that once they are done I don't have to think about those00:43
seb128and can switch back to login speed and indicators00:43
seb128which are the things I want to work on00:43
seb128I'm doing gedit right now and I will be done00:44
seb128I will let other updates for those who are interested ;-)00:44
seb128the libxklavier, libgnomekbd updates have a soname change and some refactoring00:45
chrisccoulsonyeah, i need to look at login speed again too :)00:45
seb128so that will rather wait after alpha00:45
seb128gnome-keyring I'm not sure we want to update00:45
seb128I've sent an email to upstream about their plan for this cycle00:45
chrisccoulsonseb128 - yeah, i saw the announcement for that00:45
chrisccoulsonso, they've actually split it?00:45
chrisccoulsonso that's a new source package now?00:45
chrisccoulsondefinately no good for A2 ;)00:46
seb128libgnome-keyring is a different source00:46
seb128I'm not sure it's a good plan for lucid00:46
seb128they did quite some refactoring00:46
seb128like gnome-keyring uses a dbus api now00:46
seb128and the lib is only wrapping that for compatibility or something00:47
chrisccoulsonyeah, seems like the changes are quite heavy00:47
seb128robert_ancell, if you feel doing a break from gdm and doing a desktop update gnome-games is yours ;-)00:48
robert_ancellseb128, will do00:48
chrisccoulsoni hope it doesn't take me 3 hours to get to work tomorrow morning00:49
seb128did I already say that having the tetris game not named tetris is stupid? ;-)00:49
seb128chrisccoulson, did you figure what happened there?00:49
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i think it was just due to the ice. i didn't see any accidents, but none of the roads i drive on had been gritted00:50
chrisccoulsoni could have walked to work faster this morning00:50
chrisccoulsoni'll end up having to work over the weekend to make up time ;)00:50
seb128you should have worked in the car ;-)00:51
chrisccoulsonif i had a laptop, then that would be perfect :)00:51
robert_ancellseb128, hey, is there any plans to make a C# version of launchpad-integration?00:53
seb128not by me00:54
robert_ancellseb128, oh yes, the new game names are awful...00:54
seb128who did decide on those?00:54
robert_ancellseb128, not sure, I think it was the SOC people who rewrote them00:54
robert_ancellI think there's a trademark issue with Tetris but I'm never sure about that one00:55
seb128like somebody is going to sue you because you named the gnome game gnometris?00:55
seb128come on... ;-)00:56
seb128could you try to put some common sense to the other team member there00:56
seb128the tetris game should be *tris00:57
robert_ancellIANAL :)01:00
chrisccoulsonheh, i wonder how long it is before i start getting abusive comments on bug 42888401:09
ubottuLaunchpad bug 428884 in gnome-screensaver "gnome-screensaver-command --poke no longer inhibits screensaver" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/42888401:09
seb128chrisccoulson, oh, that didn't happen yet?01:11
* seb128 starts writting01:11
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i've just backed out the patch which fixes it in karmic, as it causes a regression01:11
chrisccoulsonand i have a real patch to fix it, but it depends on another bug in xorg being fixed first01:11
seb128right, I've been reading the ubuntu-x discussion01:12
seb128the didn't happen yet was a joke, but it's clearly too late for me to success at making one01:12
chrisccoulsonunfortunately, the xorg change would have a high regression potential, as the regression there was to fix weird races with idletime and DPMS blanking01:12
chrisccoulsonheh :)01:13
seb128yeah, the bug sucks01:13
seb128but it's only screensaver01:13
seb128a bit annoying but not end of the world01:13
chrisccoulsonyeah, it's quite annoying. and it only affects components that i don't use ;)01:13
seb128those users clearly have bad taste!01:14
chrisccoulsonthey all use VLC01:14
seb128it seems quite popular01:14
chrisccoulsonand it works perfectly ok in totem01:14
seb128ok, enough work for me for today01:20
seb128I know how the week is going to end if I start abusing too much01:20
seb128I will feel too tired and useless01:20
chrisccoulsonyeah, i think i might finish for the night soon as well01:22
seb128'night everybody01:23
seb128good night chrisccoulson01:24
seb128see you tomorrow01:24
chrisccoulsonnight seb12801:24
=== jono_ is now known as jono
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=== eeejay_away is now known as eeejay
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=== asac_ is now known as asac
baptistemmsalut pitti_07:57
baptistemmpitti: http://piware.de/workitems/desktop/lucid/versions.html -> 40408:03
pitti_baptistemm: I killed that by accident, and my server is down right now08:05
pitti_baptistemm: once it's back up I restore it08:05
baptistemmah okay, sorry to hear that08:05
chrisccoulsongood morning everyone08:43
pittihey chrisccoulson08:45
chrisccoulsonhey pitti, how are you?08:46
pittiRiddell: there's one WI for you for alpha-2 "kdm needs equivalent patches to gdm" (for https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-lucid-boot-experience); I assume this is the updated upstart conditions?08:46
pittichrisccoulson: c'est bon, arrived in Paris yesterday; doing sprint now08:46
chrisccoulsonpitti - excellent :)08:47
chrisccoulsondid you see the scrollback from yesterday?08:47
pittichrisccoulson: no, my server went down last nicht08:52
chrisccoulsonpitti - the recent gnome-screensaver SRU in karmic caused a regression, which 3 people reported separately yesterday08:53
chrisccoulsonso i had to roll back the change for now, as there seems to be no other way to fix the original bug :(08:54
pittichrisccoulson: ah, saw the -changes mail now; thanks08:57
pittichrisccoulson: it didn't move to -updates yet, right? so the regression was just in proposed08:58
chrisccoulsonpitti - yeah, it has been in -updates since december i think08:58
chrisccoulsoni'm slightly confused why we only started getting reports yesterday though08:58
pittioh, oops08:58
chrisccoulsonpitti - oh, not quite. it went in to -updates on 2/0108:59
pittichrisccoulson: so the new one should be copied to updates right now09:00
chrisccoulsonpitti - slangasek has already done that now i think09:00
pittiah, I see09:00
pittichrisccoulson: so 505789  still needs to be fixed in lucid?09:00
seb128good morning09:01
seb128lucid upgrade = fail today09:01
* seb128 is annoyed09:01
pittibonjour seb12809:01
seb128the mini got no screen after boot09:01
pittiseb128: what's wrong?09:01
seb128just what seems to be plymonth09:01
chrisccoulsonpitti - yeah, i wasn't too sure what to do about lucid. for karmic, i just rolled back the patch. for lucid, i have the real gnome-screensaver fix, but it doesn't work yet due to a xorg regression09:01
chrisccoulsonhey seb12809:01
seb128and I don't manage to open the grub2 menu09:01
seb128the laptop has no X cursor09:01
seb128nor compiz working09:01
seb128it's not handy to click somewhere when you don't see the pointer on screen09:02
seb128it's there I can move it it highlight things09:02
seb128but I can't see it09:02
chrisccoulsonpitti - ScottK mentioned last night about notifying the TB about the regression in karmic. i just send an e-mail to the mailing list right?09:02
pittichrisccoulson: it's not such a biggie, but thanks09:02
chrisccoulsonpitti - thanks09:03
* pitti -> offline for now, sprint going on09:08
seb128pitti, you guys better doesn't upgrade09:11
pittiseb128: ok, thanks for the warning09:11
baptistemmsalut chrisccoulson & seb12809:11
pittithere were a lot of X.org updates yesterday09:12
chrisccoulsonhey baptistemm09:12
hyperaircan someone verify if bug #492649 affects lucid?09:15
ubottuLaunchpad bug 492649 in gnome-power-manager "Laptop automatically suspends right after resume if power cable was disconnected before resuming" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/49264909:15
hyperairno actually come to think of it, it should affect lucid.09:17
RAOFhyperair: It definitely affects lucid.  Thanks for pointing that out; I'll subscribe :)09:40
hyperairRAOF: i've got a patch ready.09:41
hyperairRAOF: gimme a bit of time and i'll get it uploaded.09:41
hyperairi need to test it09:41
geserseb128: Hi, did you drop the dependency on xulrunner-dev for libgjs-dev on purpose in your last gjs upload? (http://launchpadlibrarian.net/36422377/gjs_0.4-3ubuntu1_0.4-3ubuntu2.diff.gz)09:49
seb128__geser, yes09:50
geserso the gjs.pc file is wrong on still relying on mozilla-js.pc? (see http://launchpadlibrarian.net/37757005/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-i386.gnome-shell_2.28.1~git20091125-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz)09:52
=== seb128__ is now known as seb128
geserPackage 'mozilla-js', required by '/usr/lib/pkgconfig/gjs-1.0.pc', not found09:52
seb128geser, I need to check on those but look what we did in karmic10:00
seb128geser, we did preload the .so10:00
seb128geser, I though Debian fixed that different but apparently not10:00
seb128I will add those back10:01
seb128pitti, thanks for fixing piware.de ;-)10:21
chrisccoulsonhyperair - g-p-m is in main btw (you've subscribed the wrong sponsors) ;)10:26
seb128speaking of which, does somebody plan to update that to 2.29?10:31
pittiseb128: heh10:32
pittiseb128: I'm grateful, too :)10:32
pittiso versions.html should work again now10:32
seb128it does10:33
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i'm working on the 2.29 update for g-p-m10:34
chrisccoulsonbut i've got to re-write the notify-osd patch, as the notification code has changed a lot10:35
seb128chrisccoulson, you rock as usual ;-)10:35
seb128oh :-(10:35
chrisccoulsonseb128 - the notification code is common with g-s-d now, so i was thinking of making the notify-osd patch common between the 2 packages now10:35
chrisccoulson(if i can)10:35
chrisccoulsonit should make maintenance a bit easier10:35
seb128that would be nice10:35
pittikenvandine, didrocks: FYI, I didn't find a bzr for ubuntu-netbook-default-settings; can we just agree to use lp:ubuntu/ubuntu-netbook-default-settings ? (I'm committing there now)10:39
seb128brb reboot with fixed xorg10:40
hyperairchrisccoulson: oh whoops.10:53
hyperairchrisccoulson: sorry, it was a reflex action.10:53
chrisccoulsonhyperair - no worries. i can unsubscribe u-u-s from the bug10:53
chrisccoulsoni'll take a look at your patch, and probably roll it in to the 2.29.x update and upload it all together10:54
hyperairsure, thanks =)10:54
hyperairif possible i'd like to get it SRU'd after that.10:54
hyperairseems like a pretty annoying issue that impacts a significant number of people10:55
chrisccoulsonyeah, the fix looks fairly trivial and it's a regression from jaunty too, so it would probably be a good candidate10:57
chrisccoulson(although, i cant make that decision anyway ;) )10:57
Riddellpitti: what a WI?10:57
pittiRiddell: http://macaroni.ubuntu.com/~pitti/workitems/canonical-desktop-team-lucid-alpha-2.html#jr10:57
hyperairchrisccoulson: okay, i'll just wait until you upload gpm then i'll start working on the sru bit =)10:58
seb128as usual, when you want to quickly reboot on a fixed system you get a fsck 15 minutes run11:10
pitti... and no esc key right now..11:10
seb128on the good side xorg is fixed after reinstall xorg-server-core11:10
Riddellpitti: do I get told when they get assigned to me?11:10
chrisccoulsoni can't remember the last time i saw a fsck on my box11:11
pittiRiddell: just on the WI overview, and of course on blueprint diffs11:11
chrisccoulsoni assume they always happen when my girlfriend powers it on :)11:11
Riddellpitti: possible communication problem there11:12
seb128on the mini fsck takes like 5 seconds11:13
seb128it's only 8G and it's ssd11:13
pittiRiddell: also, the previous WI tracker pages didn't have WIs for other teams, that made it harder11:13
pittiRiddell: apparently it doesn't cause kdm to break, so it's fine to move to a311:14
pittiRiddell: I guess it was just to start it earlier, for boot time optimization?11:14
Riddellpitti: how do we know it doesn't cause kdm to break?11:15
chrisccoulsonseb128 - if all my partitions are fsck'd in the same boot, it takes nearly 45 minutes ;)11:15
chrisccoulsonbut that is around 800GB of rotary disk11:16
pittiRiddell: well, you would have complained weeks ago if kdm was broken in lucid, I suppose?11:17
Riddellwe'll have to see from the daily CDs (if they've built)11:19
asacseb128: guess you have no idea how to run the testsuite of libplist? http://paste.ubuntu.com/355444/11:19
seb128asac, no I don't11:20
cassidyseb128, kenvandine: hi. I just released Empathy you should package this one instead of 2.29.5 which doesn't include any translation11:24
seb128cassidy, ok thanks11:25
seb128cassidy, you forget to put a verb in the codename ;-)11:30
chrisccoulsonseb128 - are you at the sprint this week as well?11:38
seb128chrisccoulson, not yet11:39
seb128chrisccoulson, but it's 2 hours of train for here so I will go there for 1 day or 211:39
chrisccoulsonseb128 - that's quite convenient then :)11:39
seb128yes ;-)11:39
cassidyseb128, http://encyclopediadramatica.com/I_accidentally_X :p11:40
seb128cassidy, ah, I was missing references ;-)11:40
* chrisccoulson is confused11:42
loolpitti: Hola, gnome-pilot ships /usr/share/applications/gpilotd-control-applet.desktop which has no X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain=gnome-pilot during build; that gets added afterwards by some pkg mangling magic; problem is that dh_md5sums records the md5 without the field12:11
loolpitti: How do you think the core issue is best solved?  By patching the gettext-domain in the .desktop file at build time?12:12
* lool lunch -- bbl &12:13
pittilool: that would work definitively, and should be the easiest way12:13
seb128hey Amaranth__12:37
seb128so lucid boots 1.5 second slower compared to previous week12:40
pittiitz hal fault12:41
pittiit starts again12:41
pittisomething triggers it12:41
seb128desktop didn't change much12:41
seb128that + plymouth12:41
=== MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch
pittiseb128: ISTR Keybuk said plymouth would cost a second or so12:48
seb128pitti, right, it does12:55
kenvandinecassidy, thx... will do13:33
rickspencer3tseliot, nice to all your "done" items today on desktop-lucid-xorg-proprietary-drivers13:49
tseliotrickspencer3:  :-)13:55
=== MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow
=== Kermiac is now known as Kermiac-sleep
tseliotrickspencer3: I won't be able to attend the meeting today (I'll be at the dentist). Just FYI14:05
rickspencer3tseliot, good luck14:05
rickspencer3hope it's not too painful14:05
tseliotheh, thanks14:05
seb128tedg, hey14:26
seb128tedg, I've some questions for you14:26
tedgseb128: Morning!14:26
seb128tedg, do you have time for questions now?14:27
seb128or do you want to deal with bug fixes first and talk later?14:27
* kenvandine wants tarballs14:27
seb128we don't need tarball, we can backport commits!14:27
tedgHeh, ask questions.  I'll try to make kenvandine's tarballs while we talk :)14:28
seb128tedg, ok, first is the fallback, how will it work?14:28
seb128you will have the same menu on a gtkstatusicon?14:28
seb128for something like nautilus, which has an icon right should we turn the appindicator use as a runtime thing or a buildtime one?14:29
tedgseb128: Yeah, it'll make a GtkStatusIcon with the same menu.14:29
seb128like if build with appindicator it will use it and fallback to the appindicator fallback way14:29
tedgseb128: It'll be runtime.14:29
tedgI think to get patches upstream we'll need build time checks.14:29
seb128your fallback will be14:29
seb128but it will be poor compared to upstream's way14:29
tedgBut, I'm not as concerned about build time checks :)14:29
seb128ok, I've a nautilus patch with build time change14:30
tedgSure, if they want to do something special, we'll support that too.14:30
seb128right now since you have no fallback it's indicator or nothing at runtime14:30
tedgThe idea is they can replace the fallback function with whatever they want.14:30
seb128ok, so 2 smalls questions14:30
tedgYes.  But I expect to land fallback this week (not in A2 but when the archive opens again)14:31
seb128- would you make the nautilus copy icon, which is a toggle right now, a toggle or a show entry?14:31
seb128ie the menu having show only and user can close the dialog to mask it14:31
seb128or should the menu use a toggle with a checkbox or something?14:31
tedgPersonally I prefer the "show" method.14:33
seb128ok, it's also easier to do14:33
tedgI think that the "X" in the corner of the window is more universal for "hide" ;)14:33
seb128well both work in the toggle case14:33
seb128next question14:33
seb128do you have tooltips in some way?14:34
seb128like the current icon indicate how much has been copied and how much remains14:34
seb128that's for nautilus14:34
tedgNo, we don't.14:34
seb128should that info be dropped?14:34
seb128or made a menu label14:34
tedgI'm not sure on that one.  mpt do you have an opinion here? ^14:34
seb128tedg, ok thanks, I will do a first drop without it and we can improve later if needed14:36
mpttedg, is this a notification area item you're talking about? If so, which one?14:36
seb128mpt, the nautilus copy icon14:36
mptcopy icon?14:36
seb128mpt, right now the icon show copy details in a tooltip14:36
seb128try doing a copy which takes some time in nautilus14:37
seb128it will display a nautilus area icon which you can click on or mouseover to get details on how much is done and to do still there14:37
mpt"There is not enough space on the destination. Try to remove files to make space."14:37
mptah, I get a notification area element when emptying the Trash too14:39
mptbut it has no tooltip14:39
seb128mpt, the tooltip says something around the line "18000 items copied, 7500 to copy still"14:40
mptah, "1 file operation active"14:40
seb128hum, you are right14:41
seb128I was looking at the wrong lines14:41
mptOh, I see, the notification area item exists so you can get back the progress window if you close it14:41
mptI have a much more elegant solution to that14:41
mptMake the progress window minimizable but not closable14:42
seb128mpt, I would not call that elegant14:42
seb128mpt, is the way to keep stuff you don't care about cluttering your alt-tab and tasks14:42
seb128is -> it's14:42
mptThat way, (a) you eliminate any confusion about whether the close button cancels the task, and (b) you don't need the notification area item14:43
seb128again a small win for beginners traded for annoyances for all other users...14:43
mptMinimized windows already get sent to the back of the Alt Tab list14:43
milanbvI guess this kind of problem will be solved by the new Shell's message bar, in the future14:44
seb128well, wherever you put them it still means you have an extra item to cycle14:44
seb128and it's still tasklist noise14:44
mptI don't think it's a good solution to task list noise to move something from the task list to the notification area14:47
mptEspecially when most of the stuff in the notification area doesn't behave that way, while everything in the task list does14:48
mptThere are other ways we could reduce clutter in the task list, e.g. giving minimized windows less space than non-minimized ones.14:49
seb128it will still not be as good as what we have now, which is out of the user way14:50
seb128it might not be good from a design perspective but it's handy for users14:50
seb128it's a bit of a shame that better design mean less practical for users14:51
tedgmpt: But we don't have a better alt-tab system today.  So we need to design for Lucid, which has the same ol' stuff.14:53
mptseb128, that's coming perilously close to a false dichotomy :-)14:54
seb128mpt, I'm just saying that I would hate having that in the alt-tab list14:54
seb128it would only the risk that I go one item too far and cancel the hours of copy by error14:55
seb128I just want to copy to sit in a corner and goes on14:55
mptoh, I see what you mean!14:55
seb128I don't want it to be in my way and one click away for stopping the action by error14:55
mptThe Cancel button is focused by default in the window14:55
mptThat is quite silly.14:55
seb128there is no other button there14:55
seb128what else would you want to focus?14:55
rickspencer3kenvandine, whenever I try to use U1 on my lucid netbook I get a weird error condition14:56
seb128or you want a confirmation dialog?14:56
mptseb128, nothing. Have the Cancel button respond to Esc but not to Space or Enter.14:56
seb128well you could still esc with the wrong dialog focussed14:56
seb128not that is not a strong argument14:56
seb128but it adds risk of error to annoyance14:56
seb128I really don't want it on screen ;-)14:57
seb128anyway we have clearly different view on the topic14:57
kenvandinerickspencer3, ?14:57
seb128going back to what I was doing14:57
mptI think the number of people in the world who close Nautilus's move/copy window to make it less likely that they will cancel a move/copy after Alt Tabbing could be counted on two hands14:57
rickspencer3kenvandine, I get a cloud with /!\14:57
mptbut, I see your point14:57
rickspencer3and when I click on it it runs apport14:57
kenvandinethat means it isn't connected14:58
kenvandinerickspencer3, can we debug in a little bit?14:58
* kenvandine is trying to fix something :)14:58
=== robbiew_ is now known as robbiew
seb128mpt, right, the error point is lame, the alt-tab and tasklist clutter is not ;-)14:59
seb128speaking about design I upgraded a friend's box this weekend14:59
seb128one of the first thing he told me by im a bit later is "the notification bubble placement is buggy"14:59
mptNot surprised :-)15:00
seb128where do we stand for those in lucid?15:00
mptwe're trying three different placements15:00
seb128when will see those in distro?15:00
seb128would be nice to have something to get user feedback on early ;-)15:00
=== halflin__ is now known as halfline
vishrickspencer3: hi... in case you've missed it ... i'v submitted a svg 48px icon to fix Bug 48979515:06
ubottuLaunchpad bug 489795 in bughugger "[wishlist] Bug huggers icon scales terribly" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/48979515:06
rickspencer3vish nice15:10
rickspencer3hold on15:10
chrisccoulsonseb128 / mpt - is the nautilus progress dialog really necessary? or could the progress be shown in the drop-down menu attached to the indicator instead?15:19
seb128chrisccoulson: it's not really practical if you have several copies going and want a way to stop one15:20
chrisccoulsonyeah, thats true15:21
mptseb128, I don't know when we'll see them, that's up to dbarth and MacSlow. See <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotifyOSD#Outside%20the%20bubble> for details.15:21
seb128mpt, thanks15:22
mptchrisccoulson, I think the reverse -- use just the window, and get rid of the menu15:22
chrisccoulsonmpt - but that will leave my task list cluttered15:23
* vish just got a restart notification after kernel update... thought we got rid of those :(15:26
chrisccoulsonvish - the restart dialog?15:26
chrisccoulsonyou should still get those AFAIK...15:26
vishyeah , the restart dialogue....15:27
mptchrisccoulson, yes, but the status menu area (like the notification area before it) is not a secondary task list.15:27
vishchrisccoulson: but this is the first time i'm getting it on lucid... pitti said it was gone15:27
mptvish, we got rid of the notification area item, not the alerts. When we get time, we'll embed the alert into the updates window.15:27
chrisccoulsonmpt - can't the status menu area indicate the status of file transfers?15:28
chrisccoulsoni would argue that the status of a file transfer is not a task15:29
vishmpt: hmm.. weird.. in Lucid , this is the first time i'm getting it.. well i was happy it was gone ;) damn it :(15:29
mptchrisccoulson, it could, but the progress window can do that better (even when it's minimized). The use of progress windows doesn't really depend on what anyone's definition of a "task" is -- it's for anything that's taking a long time.15:32
mptchrisccoulson, in <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CustomStatusMenuDesignGuidelines> I've written "You do not need a custom status menu if: * You just want the program to take up a small space in the panel when minimized." If we made an exception for Nautilus, I don't know on what grounds we would make it, i.e. what we would say when app developers said "If Nautilus then why not my application too."15:33
chrisccoulsonmpt - thanks, i'll have a read of that15:34
jcastroseb128: do you know if jockey with app indicator is working yet in lucid? (Last I checked the Qt frontend broke or something?)16:06
seb128jcastro, kde still broken afaik16:06
seb128so jockey can't build16:06
jcastroseb128: I am assuming that would be fixed for a2?16:07
seb128jcastro, don't ask me about kde16:08
seb128ask Riddell16:08
jcastrowait, does the jockey kde frontend not build or the whole thing?16:08
seb128jcastro, both16:08
seb128jcastro, those are not separated sources16:09
seb128no kde build = no build16:09
jcastroJockey not working would be important for a2 though right?16:09
ccheneyalso no OOo for a2 so alt disk will be oversized :(16:12
rickspencer3ccheney, you mean no *new* OOo for a2, right?16:13
seb128jcastro, not working I guess, not using the new indicator not so16:14
rickspencer3seb128, jockey will work, correct? just won't have the new indicator UI?16:14
ccheneyyea no new non-oversized OOo for a216:14
seb128rickspencer3, afaik yes16:14
ccheneythe one i uploaded last week can't build due to the kde breakage16:15
jcastrodid the new indicator ui break the kde bits or was that something else?16:15
rickspencer3ccheney, so there will be some OOo, right, just not the latest one you uploaded?16:15
ccheneyrickspencer3: yea the previous one is still there, shouldn't be any problems since it couldn't build on any arch16:15
ccheneyso no problem with any vs all being built16:16
seb128jcastro, I think it's something in the kde stack16:16
rickspencer3jcastro, go ahead and ask Riddell16:16
jcastroI was about to, heh16:16
* Riddell awaits being asked16:16
jcastroRiddell: any idea?16:16
Riddelljockey is waiting on kdebindings which is waiting on sip which hasn't been released16:17
RiddellI could do a sip snapshot but it's binary incompatible and I don't know if there are more binary incompatible changes due before he releases, I'll need to ask upstream16:17
jcastrook so post-a2?16:18
Riddellwe're in freeze, so yes16:19
jcastrocool, thanks!16:20
rickspencer3team meeting time16:30
kenvandinejcastro, i uploaded the karmic packages to the indicator-core-ppa16:30
kenvandineto match lucid again16:30
rickspencer3ArneGoetje, bryyce, ccheney, didrocks, kenvandine, pitti16:31
rickspencer3wonder who I am forgetting16:31
rickspencer3hi seb12816:31
seb128hey rickspencer3!16:31
* kenvandine hugs seb12816:31
rickspencer3btw, I just confirmation of your accomedations for tomorrow night, so you are committed ;)16:31
* seb128 hugs kenvandine16:31
seb128rickspencer3, excellent16:31
rickspencer3ok, I am sensing that a2 is coming together, but there is still a bit of stress and folks are working hard16:32
rickspencer3so I will strive to keep the meeting short16:32
rickspencer3unfortunately, there are a lot of important topics though :)16:32
rickspencer3so, any other business?16:33
rickspencer3so randa was oof, which provides me the prefect cover story ...16:33
rickspencer3I did not *totally* forget to follow up on conference list16:33
rickspencer3oof = out of office16:33
rickspencer3don't ask me why it's not ooo16:34
rickspencer3it just isn't, pitti16:34
rickspencer3kenvandine, partner update?16:34
kenvandineOLS: has no packages for a2, but we are starting to get things that will land in a3 into a ppa16:34
kenvandineit isn't ready for wide spread testing, but the music store is coming together16:35
kenvandinethe rb plugin and the u1 widget set is in a ppa now16:35
kenvandineDX: all their packages are uploaded for a216:35
kenvandinewell, minus the one seb128 is sponsoring for me :)16:35
seb128(just uploaded your indicator-me update)16:36
rickspencer3kenvandine, why the OLS ppa? why not just straight into Ubuntu?16:36
kenvandinerickspencer3, wouldn't be good16:36
pitti(getting a little late..., so don't break it :) )16:36
seb128kenvandine, check emails!16:36
kenvandinethe store lets you buy, but it doesn't actually download16:36
seb128(it's uploaded)16:36
kenvandineso we don't want people doing that16:36
rickspencer3sounds like a good business to me16:36
seb128I can see that making users unhappy16:36
kenvandineit will land in lucid when it is safe :)16:36
rickspencer3but I guess customer sat suffers16:36
kenvandinethat is it for now16:36
rickspencer3kenvandine, any prediction when status updates from Me Menu will land?16:37
kenvandinei haven't heard anything16:37
* kenvandine makes a note to chase people about that16:37
rickspencer3please let tedg know that I would like to see that asap!16:37
* rickspencer3 whip cracking noises16:37
seb128any clue when we will get notify-osd changes for lucid? do we still need the debug on?16:37
kenvandineseb128, i'll check16:38
seb128it's not nice looking and I don't feel it being useful16:38
kenvandinei agree16:38
pittiI'm fine with hte priority debug16:38
rickspencer3ACTION: kenvandine to get eta on status updtae from me menu16:38
pittibut not the red lines16:38
pittinot that I'd see any bug with their help16:38
rickspencer3ACTION: kenvandine to get eta on turning off debugging for notifications16:38
rickspencer3thanks kenvandine16:38
seb128turning debug off trivial, turning lines need changing code16:38
rickspencer3waste of time, imo16:39
rickspencer3just turn it off when we have the necessary data16:39
rickspencer3moving on?16:39
seb128just stop using that mode when we think we got the feedback we wanted16:39
rickspencer3Riddell, Kubuntu update?16:39
rickspencer3ccheney, mozilla update?16:40
ccheneystill working on libsoup ran into a weird issue with a few functions but expect to get it resolved today16:41
ccheneywas a bit delayed due to needing to upload OOo last week, then found it didn't build due to kde issues16:41
Riddellmesa issues16:42
rickspencer3Riddell, nice save16:42
ccheneyOOo 3.2.0 rc2 also comes out this week so once the mesa issues are resolved hopefully i can get that in as well16:42
pittireinstalling xorg-server-core helped me16:42
* ccheney hugs Riddell :)16:42
seb128pitti, that's probably not the same issue16:43
seb128pitti, the libglx issue is a race between alternative updates and unpack16:43
seb128pitti, that should not have effect on buildds16:43
rickspencer3ccheney, so after libsoup, are there other libraries to hack these functions onto?16:43
pittioh, builds16:43
RiddellKubuntu update:16:44
Riddell-4.4 RC 1 is in, delayed due to mesa breakage but mostly compiled now16:44
ccheneyrickspencer3: yes need to fix webkit and epiphany as well, i think they won't be as much trouble though16:44
rickspencer3ccheney, thanks Riddell ga16:44
Riddell-alpha 2 candidate images going through early smoketesting16:44
Riddell-unknown whether KDM will start due to plymouth in alpha 2 (disappointing lack of communication here)16:44
Riddell-discovered that the mobile folks have a project called ubuntu mobile which will use KDE and plasma, talking with developers16:44
Riddell-kdebindings is blocking jockey.  kdebindings is being blocked by upstream SIP which needs a new release.16:44
Riddell-kubuntu-notifications-helper waiting on MIR16:44
Riddell-virtuoso (for nepomuk semantic desktop) waiting on MIR security review16:44
Riddell-firefox KDE integration apparantly needs patches split up else mozilla won't accept them (but suse managed?)16:44
rickspencer3"don't know if KDM will start"?16:45
rickspencer3what;'s the work around, uninstall plymouth?16:45
pittivirtuoso> I saw your followup, if you disabled all the network bits it sounds a lot less scary16:45
Riddellrickspencer3: can't uninstall from a live CD, we may need to do a KDM upload which stops plymouth as a quickish alpha 2 workaround16:46
pittikdm> plymouth disables itself on any VT change; I don't think it's specific to a particular *dm16:46
pittigdm doesn't know about plymouth at all16:46
pittibut well, in theeeeeory..16:46
Riddellthen maybe it won't be a problem16:46
rickspencer3let's see16:46
RiddellI have an ISO image to try now after the meeting16:46
rickspencer3keep us posted16:47
rickspencer3I'll get an audio update from TheMuso in the Eastern edition16:47
rickspencer3so, next16:47
rickspencer3there's this didrocks person who joined the team?16:48
rickspencer3anyone heard of him before?16:48
seb128welcome didrocks!16:48
didrocksI love the ? ;)16:48
* didrocks waves16:48
* pitti pokes him in the ribs16:48
bryyceheya didrocks, welcome aboard!16:48
ccheneyhi :)16:48
seb128pitti, double the poke from me while you are at it ;-)16:48
didrocksthanks a lot ;-)16:48
pittiseb128: done16:48
didrocksseb128: he is really doing it!!!16:48
seb128pitti, thanks!16:48
seb128didrocks, I know ;-)16:49
* seb128 hugs pitti16:49
pittiwe're knitting together UNE NextGen here16:49
* seb128 joins tomorrow16:49
kenvandinewelcome didrocks!16:49
didrocksthanks kenvandine :)16:49
seb128how is rickspencer3's french working in Paris btw?16:49
rickspencer3okay, so je ne parles pas france16:50
didrocksseb128: he is improving a LOT :)16:50
rickspencer3so, staffing is really hot for us right now16:50
rickspencer3so, besides welcoming didrocks, we have:16:50
rickspencer31. two more positions like didrock's (UNE focus/Desktop generalists)16:51
rickspencer3I have some interviews set up next week, but more referals welcome16:51
rickspencer32. replace asac16:51
* rickspencer3 sniff16:51
ccheneyasac: clone yourself stat :)16:52
rickspencer3there is a promising candidate in the pipeline, so stay tuned16:52
rickspencer3right, we'd need to hire like five people to "replace asac"16:52
rickspencer3also, we have some contractor positions that are shorter term16:52
rickspencer32 are to work on ayatana integrations, that is patch apps to make them work with ayatana desktop assets16:53
rickspencer3and 1 to work with asac and chris on mozilla backport nuttiness16:53
rickspencer3I think asac has someone in mind for that one16:53
rickspencer3the 2 ayatana ones I don't think we have anyone firm yet, but I hope to by eow16:53
* rickspencer3 wipes sweat from brow16:53
rickspencer3any questions about staffing?16:53
ccheneyare the postings up on ubuntu.com?16:54
rickspencer3ccheney, not the contractor ones16:54
ccheneyer yea i meant the permanent ones16:54
rickspencer3but the UNE/desktop ones, and the 20% of asac one16:54
rickspencer3please refer good folks16:55
rickspencer3and if you are a good folk, please feel free to ping me16:55
rickspencer3ok, moving on from staffing16:55
rickspencer3bryyce, any chance you could provide a quick xorg update?16:55
rickspencer3btw, nice change bryyce16:56
bryycepretty much all the main X.org merges are in place now.  A few drivers still need updates (e.g. wacom)16:56
bryycerickspencer3, ??16:56
rickspencer3bryce = bryyce16:56
pittiwhat was the reason for the extra y?16:56
bryyceah yes, I've become my evil clone16:56
bryycepitti, someone snagged 'bryce' when I wasn't looking16:57
rickspencer3by duplicating a y chromosone, prerhaps?16:57
pittiit's almost as confusing as having random numbers tailing your nick16:57
* pitti ducks16:57
* rickspencer3 grrrr16:57
bryyceheh, guess no one reads star wars novels ;-)16:57
rickspencer3anyway, xorg ...16:57
bryyceanyway, so with the mesa merge finally in place, we've implemented the blueprint to move mesa to an alternatives system16:57
bryycewhich I think a few people have noticed16:57
didrocksnot at all… *hum*16:58
rickspencer3bryyce, *all* done?16:58
bryycepitti was right about the difficulty of doing alternative systems, but hopefully the issues are teething pains that will get ironed out16:58
pittibryyce: wait until you'll get the bug reports from real-world upgrades :-/16:58
* pitti crosses fingers16:58
seb128hate alternatives16:59
rickspencer3great news16:59
pittibut I guess they can be treated with some more force, to keep them in automatic mode16:59
rickspencer3well ... I just want users with nvidia and ati to have a working Ubuntu17:00
rickspencer3thanks bryyce (and tseliot) good job17:00
bryyceI hope it does work out for the best; if we run into major issues it's still in the cards that we could revert it before release, but I really hope we don't need to17:00
bryycerickspencer3, thanks, I think that covers it.17:00
rickspencer3thank you bryyce17:01
rickspencer3ok, next topic is performance reviews17:01
rickspencer3these are due in the system by the end of the month17:01
rickspencer3please budget 30 - 90 minutes on your objectives17:01
seb128reviews? did we just do those?17:01
seb128oh, objectives17:01
rickspencer3(it's objectives, not reviews that are due, sorry)17:02
seb128right, sorry I got confused17:02
rickspencer3feel free to send me a draft in email, but expect to discuss at least briefly with me on the phone next week17:02
rickspencer3think about what you want to write in your next review, and think of some objectives that will help wtih that17:02
rickspencer3don't over-analyze!17:03
rickspencer3any questions about objectives?17:03
rickspencer3pitti, release status?17:04
pittifirst of all, congrats to everyone, we got a2 almost done17:04
pittiwith the new WI tracker the reports uncovered a few WIs which previously fell through the cracks17:04
pittimostly because they were WIs assigned to us which were under the umbrella of a different team17:05
pittiI'd like to go through them quickly to see whether they are already done, or should be postoned17:05
pittiBTW, does everyone know that you can append #yourlaunchpadlogin to see your personal WI list?17:05
pittie. g. http://macaroni.ubuntu.com/~pitti/workitems/canonical-desktop-team-lucid-alpha-2.html#jr17:05
pittirick-rickspencer3 todo desktop-lucid-desktop-cloud Low support multiple types in cdimage scripts (make-web-indices ...)17:06
pittiis that actually relevant?17:06
pittiI thought the cloud stuff was by and large working17:06
rickspencer3I think that should be for smoser17:06
rickspencer3pitti, first approximation is done17:06
pittiit doesn't sound a2 critical to me, but then I don't really know what this WI is about in the first place17:06
pittiok, will reassign that one then17:06
pittiken-vandine todo dx-lucid-gtk-improvements High integrate patches in the gtk package17:07
rickspencer3put it into a3 for now, and I'll close it out if it is done or not relevant17:07
pittikenvandine: was that the ARGB stuff or client-side deco?17:07
pittirickspencer3: ack17:07
kenvandinewhich isn't ready17:07
pittikenvandine: aren't these done?17:07
kenvandinecauses problems still17:07
pittikenvandine: would you mind to postpone this then?17:07
rickspencer3this is the csd bug?17:07
* kenvandine does it17:07
kenvandinerickspencer3, csd is getting nixed for lucid17:08
kenvandinebut argb is still causing some problems17:08
kenvandinebratsche, has been fixing apps for us, and i think we are close to having the core stuff working17:08
rickspencer3sounds good17:08
pittijr todo foundations-lucid-boot-experience Essential kdm needs equivalent patches to gdm17:08
kenvandinebut not ready to subject the masses17:08
pittiRiddell and I talked about this already, but for the record17:08
pittiI think this means "start kdm earlier to optimize boot speed"17:09
rickspencer3if it's not ready for the masses soon, it won't be ready in Lucid17:09
pittii. e. take the gdm upstart start condition into kdm's upstart17:09
kenvandinepitti, can you change the milestone on dx-lucid-gtk-improvements? i can't17:09
Riddellthat's not about plymouth?17:09
pittiRiddell: I don't think it's a2 critical at all, and I don't think we should squeeze it into a2 at this point; OK?17:09
pittikenvandine: to a3?17:09
pittiRiddell: haven't read details, I don't think it's related to plymouth; gdm/kdm don't need to know about plymouth17:10
pittikenvandine: we don't need to; just move that item to the lucid-alpha-3 section17:10
Riddellpitti: do we know who created the work item?  then we could find out what it means17:10
pittikenvandine: I can move the entire spec for clarity, though17:10
kenvandinepitti, that is what we should do, imho17:11
pittikenvandine: done both17:11
pittiRiddell: I suppose Keybuk, he's the drafter17:11
Riddellpitti: well whatever it is, it's not happening for alpha 217:12
pittiRiddell: as long as kdm starts up, I think it's fine; I'll just move it to a317:12
RiddellI'll poke keybuk and work out what he means17:12
RiddellKDM does seem to start up fine17:12
pittiRiddell: done17:12
pittibryceharrington todo desktop-lucid-xorg-triaging-diagnosis High Create python class that provides access to relevant data from the log file17:13
pittiRiddell: thanks17:13
pittibryyce: this is totally separate from the distro of course, and Apport only just started to work at all with the new kernel17:13
bryycepitti, it's not going into the release, so I'm leaving it to work on over the next day or two17:13
pittibryyce: I just wondered whether you actually want to work on that this week, or whether it's better suited for a317:13
pittidepending on your other mesa/bug triaging/testing workload17:14
pittiit seems worthwhile to do early, for more efficient bug triaging (I guess?)17:14
rickspencer3all done pitti?17:14
bryycepitti, give me one more day to work on it17:14
pittithat was it, just wanted to collect the WI stragglers17:14
rickspencer3thanks for tracking all of those work items for the milestone17:14
bryyceif it's not done by tomorrow we can postpone it, but it's a simple task, I'd like to score it for a217:14
pittibryyce: it's not top prio, don't worry17:15
rickspencer3note that for a3, I would like us to do whatever it takes to get under the trend line each week before the release meeting17:15
pittithanks everyone17:15
rickspencer3so if we need to cut stuff, do it weekly and be prepared to discuss that in the release meeting17:15
bryyce"do it weekly"?17:16
rickspencer3bryyce, right, each week, if we are above the trend line, we address that17:16
rickspencer3this time we did it all at once at the end of the release17:16
rickspencer3we'll see how it works17:16
rickspencer3any other business?17:16
bryycerickspencer3, question on task quantity for a3?17:17
rickspencer3bryyce, go ahead17:17
pittitseliot's stuff landed today and already cut a huge dent in it17:17
bryyceoh, just seems number wise there's more tasks ahead of us than behind us, wondered if we intended to balance that out17:17
rickspencer3oh man, I thought we were going for 60, and there's 84!17:17
bryycepitti, ah good17:18
* rickspencer3 fumes17:18
pittiwe probably need to postpone a few startup speed one17:18
pittiand replace them with hacks in the OEM image17:18
rickspencer3I'll let it be for now, and look through later17:18
seb128we will never reach login speed if we start postponing things now17:19
* pitti isn't proposing to postpone it now17:19
rickspencer3ok, let me talk to bryyce off line17:20
rickspencer3seems you may be a tad overbooked bryyce?17:20
bryycecould be17:20
rickspencer3if so, we'll talk and fix that17:20
rickspencer3kenvandine, maybe also17:21
rickspencer3thanks bryyce17:21
* kenvandine will look17:21
rickspencer3any other business?17:21
bryycealthough a lot look like smallish tasks so maybe I can burn through them quick17:21
bryycerickspencer3, thanks17:21
=== thunderstruck is now known as gnomefreak
seb128well I'm concerned about the login speed17:22
seb128but that's not a meeting thing17:22
seb128and nothing new17:22
pittiseb128: did you happen to hear from robert? does he have time to work on the panel, or should we find a plan B?17:22
seb128plan B17:23
seb128I talked to him yesterday17:23
pittiseb128: also, WDYT about landing the "start all in parallel" changes after a2?17:23
seb128he should really be doing oem work now17:23
seb128he's behind on that apparently17:23
seb128spent too much time on desktop work17:23
pittiok; I thought that was OEM work through the backdoor17:23
seb128well he has to do gdm things for now17:23
rickspencer3is the meeting over?17:23
seb128pitti, let's discuss that tomorrow17:24
seb128the "all in parallel"17:24
pittiseb128: right17:24
seb128it doesn't really win anything17:24
seb128or not a lot17:24
seb128it trades some white space for some cpu bound limitation on the chart17:24
rickspencer3ok, all done17:24
seb128rickspencer3, thanks17:24
* rickspencer3 taps gavel17:24
pittithanks all17:25
seb128pitti, we don't really have a plan b for gnome-panel being slow there...17:25
pittiseb128: chop applets, fonts, etc.?17:27
pittiseb128: (for the OEM image, together with metacity)17:27
pittibut I think that still requires the change to start everything at once17:27
seb128pitti, we trying the chop applets and got asked to revert the change17:27
pittiif gnome-panel starts 5 seconds in, we can't win17:27
pittiseb128: right, for ubuntu desktop; but I think we just have to for the OEM image17:27
bryycepitti, my brain is addled (not enough coffee/sleep); you mentioned implementing json support for the task tool but I can't locate the details.  Where is the json report again?17:27
pittior use UNE17:28
pittibryyce: same dir; http://macaroni.ubuntu.com/~pitti/workitems/  *.json17:28
pittibryyce: brain> well, you stayed up veeery long..17:28
seb128pitti, chopping fonts...do we want speed in cost of dropping support for class of users?17:28
seb128I don't think it's a fair trade for anybody17:28
pittiseb128: well, we can't have the cake and eat it too..; I'm all ears for better ideas17:29
seb128pitti, anyway let's discuss that directly tomorrow17:29
* pitti hugs seb12817:29
pittiseb128: I have a mini 10 ssd in front of me now, too17:29
* seb128 hugs pitti17:29
seb128I plan to bring mine17:29
pittiso I can both test boot speed as well as finally reproduce all those b43 jockey bugs17:29
* pitti does a boot chart of current UNE with the crack PPA17:30
seb128hey chrisccoulson17:42
seb128back from work already?17:42
chrisccoulsonhey seb128, yeah, i just arrived back17:42
chrisccoulsonxchat is being weird here, it's not showing new messages in the chatwindow. it's only showing whitespace until i try to highlight the invisible text :-/17:43
chrisccoulsonbrb, i try and close and re-open it17:43
chrisccoulsonthats better17:44
seb128chrisccoulson: wb17:45
rickspencer3chrisccoulson that weird xchat thing happened to me as well17:45
chrisccoulsonit's working properly now. i'm not sure why it happened17:46
rickspencer3I found just restoring and maximizing it again work to fix it17:46
chrisccoulsonrickspencer3 - does it happen to you often?17:46
rickspencer3chrisccoulson used to, don't really recall if/when it stopped17:46
rickspencer3it was a lucid thing, for sure17:46
chrisccoulsonrickspencer3 - that's the first time i've noticed it before17:47
chrisccoulsonin fact, i just backported the lucid version to my karmic box a couple of days ago17:47
chrisccoulsonthere's a bit of a coincidence there ;)17:47
chrisccoulsonhey seb128 - have you had a good day?17:47
seb128I did patch nautilus to use the new libindicator17:48
seb128the patch is almost ready for upload now17:48
chrisccoulsonawesome :)17:49
milanbvseb128: about Bug 39385417:50
ubottuLaunchpad bug 393854 in gdm "Update PAM policy to allow password-less logins set up via users-admin" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/39385417:50
milanbvdo you agree with vorlon?17:51
seb128I've no strong opinion either way17:51
milanbvI think we should really sort out the status of password-less accounts in Ubuntu17:51
seb128I'm not a pam guy in any mean17:51
milanbvbecause ATM there's no GUI for that anyway17:51
milanbv(neither am I :D )17:52
seb128I'm not even sure we should allow password-less accoutns17:52
milanbvjust talking about design ideas17:52
seb128that's a receipt for a security disaster17:52
milanbvyeah, I'm reluctant to allow plain password-less accounts17:52
milanbvthat's why to mitigate the problem I implemented that password-free login17:52
milanbvwhich is pretty good security-wise IMO17:53
seb128how is that different from what we have with autologin?17:53
milanbvquite the same, except that you can have several users on the box17:53
milanbvthat's why I find it not so stupid to have too17:54
seb128it's still poor user experience since you will have to type a password to unlock your keyring17:54
milanbvyeah, that doesn't solve the more general problem with keyrings17:54
milanbvjust like autologin and password-less account17:54
milanbvI guess seahorse should detect these cases and not encrypt the keyring, but that's another story17:55
seb128not sure we should makes easier for users to ignore security17:55
seb128that's something that might bite them back17:55
milanbvjust trying to find a reasonable solution, half-way17:56
milanbvhow could I get more attention about that feature?17:57
milanbvat least I like a decision to be taken17:57
seb128could you try to ping slangasek on #ubuntu-devel?17:57
seb128when he's around17:57
milanbvI'll try17:57
seb128I don't really care either way17:57
milanbvif he's the guy responsible for that17:57
seb128but I don't want to be the one deciding or uploading that change17:57
seb128I think nobody cares enough or want to step for it17:57
milanbvI've seen that ;-)17:58
seb128but slangasek had some opinion on the topic17:58
seb128and he commented on the bug17:58
kenvandineseb128, so what is nautilus using the indicator for?17:58
milanbvmy concern is just that many users are doing it the hacky way17:58
milanbvI'll grab him, thanks17:58
seb128so it be easier to come to something which works for both of you on IRC17:58
seb128kenvandine, displaying the copy dialog or not17:59
kenvandineah, cool17:59
kenvandineseb128, by the way empathy is ready, but crashes with adium themes17:59
kenvandinei am investigating18:00
kenvandinecassidy, have you guys seen that yet? i haven't seen a bug report yet18:00
* kenvandine will debug more after lunch18:00
seb128kenvandine, ok, probably good to delay to thursday now anyway18:01
kenvandinewe have time18:01
seb128kenvandine, since new versions are not alpĥa blockers18:01
kenvandinei am going to tackle some papercuts in empathy too18:01
* kenvandine goes to eat18:02
keeshrm, can someone unmoderate my ubuntu-desktop ml post please?18:24
pedro_kees, done18:26
keespedro_: thanks!18:26
chrisccoulsonkees - i'm slightly confused about your mail. you want nautilus to show a warning when trying to open a file which has the execute bit set?18:32
keeschrisccoulson: doesn't have it set.18:35
keescurrently, nautilus pops "Untrusted application launcher" dialog and offers to run it anyway.18:35
chrisccoulsonah, ok, so you want to change that dialog?18:35
keesright.  just curious about the language for it.18:36
chrisccoulsonkees - so you want to move the option to launch anyway?18:38
keeschrisccoulson: right; I've already got that.  I'm curious about the language for the error message itself.18:38
kees(what I'd actually prefer is maybe opening the file in the editor or something)18:38
chrisccoulsonyeah, i'm probably not the best person to ask about the wording of the dialog, but opening the file in a text editor might be ok18:39
chrisccoulsonmpt may have a better idea how to improve the wording though18:39
=== seb128_ is now known as seb128
chrisccoulsoni can't wait to get my new DSL connection19:13
chrisccoulsonmy current connection is so slow at the moment19:13
seb128chrisccoulson: do you change your provider or just what option you take there?19:32
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i've changed my provider19:32
chrisccoulsoni got a migration code from my current provider today, and passed that to my new one, so hopefully i'll have no down-time19:33
chrisccoulsonand hopefully it will be faster and a bit more reliable!19:33
bryycepitti, I've implemented a plugin to gtg that will import work items into it20:20
kenvandinebryyce, excellent20:38
jcastrokenvandine: does -shell work for you? I get some gobject introspection package conflict20:41
kenvandinehaven't looked at it in a while20:41
RAOFjcastro: Looks like it's still broken by the different gobject introspection names.20:44
RAOFIIRC we have different package names to Debian in that area?20:45
jcastrono idea20:48
bryycekenvandine, do you use gtg?20:52
kenvandinenot yet, i have been considering it20:53
kenvandinesegphault raves about it20:53
bryycekenvandine, yeah I first heard of it a couple months ago, but just started really using it in earnest about a week ago20:56
bryycekenvandine, my todo list was just getting too big to manage via emacs ;-)20:56
bryyceI really like it's tagging functionality; makes it easy to categorize tasks.20:57
bryyceI've hacked in a few features to make it better for me20:57
bryyceI added an export thingee to put your prior week's completed tasks into gedit in moinmoin format, to make it easy to paste my canonical status20:58
kenvandinenice :)20:58
bryyceand I added a "defer to tomorrow" which sadly I find *really* useful20:58
bryyceit lacks prioritization, and I'm still looking for an acceptable way to access the tasks from multiple machines20:59
jcastrobryyce: there's a couch backend that just works for me21:00
bryycejcastro, ah been meaning to investigate that21:00
jcastrobryyce: also, where can I get that moin exporter?21:00
jcastrobryyce: you have to pull from bzr, but it just works. It's going to be in their next release21:00
bryycejcastro, did you have to pull that from a branch?21:01
jcastroit's in lp somewhere, it's segphault's branch21:01
jcastrobryyce: getting on a call now, I can catch up with you about it after21:01
bryyceok, yeah I've seen that one.  I need to figure out how to merge several non-mainline branches together21:01
bryycejcastro, http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/drupal/gtg-status-report21:01
jcastrowow dude, that is ... legend21:02
tedgkenvandine: Did indicator-me get into distro?21:19
bcurtiswxpitti: do you know why bug #503895 is inaccessible to bug control?  bug #503656 has it as a dup21:20
ubottuBug 503895 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/503895 is private21:20
ubottuLaunchpad bug 503656 in computer-janitor "computer-janitor-gtk crashed with KeyError in create_column()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/50365621:20
kenvandinetedg, up :)21:21
pittibryyce: sweet! so the current json dump is sufficient for you?21:22
rickspencer3pitti, are you here to join the Eastern Edition meeting?21:23
pittirickspencer3: not in particular, just spending an hour on mail/some small hacking before going to sleep21:23
pittibut I can lurk21:23
pittibcurtiswx: hm, apparently only accessible to apport, hang on21:23
bcurtiswxpitti: ok :D21:23
* TheMuso waves21:26
pittibcurtiswx: ah, so the reporter apparently removed the needs-duplicate-check and manually duped before the retracer could get to it21:26
pittibcurtiswx: there's no extra description or interesting stuff there, so I think it's okay to just leave it private21:26
bryycepitti, it works21:26
pittihey TheMuso, how are you?21:27
bcurtiswxpitti: ok.  Thank you21:27
bcurtiswxpitti: can you move its dup to 503727 then plz?21:29
TheMusopitti: Well thanks. I hope the sprint is going well?21:29
bryycepitti, later on I'll probably get some other scripts/tools to provide tasks via json, and at that point I might have some changes to suggest, but this format is good for now.  we can call it version 121:30
bcurtiswxhey seb12821:31
pittibcurtiswx: done21:31
seb128hi bcurtiswx21:31
seb128pitti, still online?21:32
bcurtiswxpitti: thx again21:32
pittiTheMuso: yeah, got the new UNE bits packaged and tested today21:32
pittiseb128: s/still/again/ :)21:32
seb128pitti, shouldn't you be enjoying some french dinner now? ;-)21:32
pittiseb128: we just had pizza and parfait caramel21:32
seb128pitti, not very typical but sounds great ;-)21:33
pittiseb128: can we find a nice place with Fondue tomorrow?21:33
* pitti demands French food at least for one night :)21:34
didrocksseb128: not my fault, tonight \o/21:34
seb128pitti, don't ask mle21:34
didrocksI know a place with Fondue, a little bit away from the meeting place thoughD21:34
seb128ask didrocks or lool or some local ;-)21:34
seb128+1 from me but I don't know restaurants in paris21:35
seb128I would be happy to join though21:35
* pitti yays at http://git.gnome.org/browse/gdm/commit/?id=978596dcd5cbca22f6dc94669219b23f1626cf4f21:35
pittianother of our patches accepted21:35
seb128hey didrocks21:35
seb128pitti, rock on21:35
didrockshey seb128 ;)21:36
seb128didrocks, not playing wii sport with pitti today? ;-)à21:39
pittididrocks: oh, do you usually?21:39
didrockspitti: not that much… I was proposing a wii contest to seb128 tomorrow night, but as he won't sleep at home, can be difficult :)21:40
didrocksseb128: so, the answer is no :)  I'm reading some specs right night to catch up with everyone :)21:41
seb128didrocks, you live that far from the hotel? ;-)21:42
didrocksseb128: not really far, but it tooks something like 25 minutes21:42
didrocksand at night, you have less transportation, so…21:43
seb128that's your excuse to avoid confrontation? :-p21:43
didrocksoh, let's handle it tomorrow night though :p21:43
seb128let's see what we do tomorrow21:43
didrocksI'm not afraid, now that you loose to vuntz ;)21:43
seb128be careful you probation time is not over yet ;-)21:44
seb128or trial period21:44
seb128or whatever english people call that ;-)21:44
didrocksoh, threatening me, I can say that I've lost on purpose tomorrow so ;)21:45
seb128you can always say that you wanted to be nice to guest...21:45
seb128that's why I let vuntz win at uds!21:45
didrocksheh ;)21:46
vuntzseb128: tss21:47
vuntzseb128: we can do another match whenever you want21:47
chrisccoulsonyou all have a wii?21:48
seb128apparently yes21:48
seb128vuntz, even if I've not been drinking a bit before? ;-)21:48
pittiI played wii only once, for 2 minutes, while being intoxicated at the UDS closing party21:48
kenvandineseb128, did you review xchat-indicator?21:48
kenvandinepitti, hehe... :)21:49
seb128pitti, that's when I lost to vuntz!21:49
seb128and "how" too21:49
seb128vuntz, doesn't drink21:49
seb128that's nor a fair game ;-)21:49
chrisccoulsonpitti - i bought my girlfriend a wii, but we never get a chance to play on it21:49
chrisccoulsonit just sits in the lounge gathering dust21:49
seb128chrisccoulson: she will not let you...?21:49
seb128oh, "we"21:50
seb128not that geeky? ;-)21:50
chrisccoulsonbut it seems like it would be a good entertainment tool when we have visitors21:50
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i bought it for her, but she never plays on it21:50
seb128right, wii is funny when played with other people21:50
chrisccoulsonand i never find the time :(21:50
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i played golf a couple of times on it ;)21:51
kenvandinegolf and bowling are my favorites actually21:51
seb128I played tennis until being good enough to win21:51
seb128then it became quite boring21:51
kenvandineoh and the hula hoop in wii fit... everyone looks so nuts playing that21:52
seb128still funny in multi player though21:52
seb128seems that the new wii sport has some fun games too21:52
chrisccoulsonkenvandine - i tried that once, but never got the hang of it ;)21:53
seb128like playing with swords21:53
chrisccoulsonit seems like i really need to play on it more21:53
seb128you need to debug ubuntu bugs rather ;-)21:53
* seb128 runs21:53
seb128I will have to start working otherwise!21:53
chrisccoulsonseb128 - sounds good to me ;)21:53
chrisccoulsonyou'll have less time for the wii ;)21:56
didrocksseb128: I have the new wii sport one. Didn't try it yet21:56
chrisccoulsonhey didrocks21:57
didrockshey chrisccoulson o/21:57
chrisccoulsonhow are you?21:57
didrocksvery fine, thank you :) And you, out of traffic jams today?21:57
chrisccoulsondidrocks - yeah, thankfully. i've got lots of time to make up at work this week now21:58
rickspencer3bryyce, is there, or should there be, a bug report concerning the mesa weirdness from earlier today?21:59
didrockschrisccoulson: oh, so bad :/21:59
bryycerickspencer3, yep we got 3 bug reports which I've duped together and assigned to alberto, set as critical21:59
bryyceI'll doublecheck that it's milestoned as well22:00
rickspencer3thanks bryyce, if you get me the bug # I can stick it in the meeting noets22:01
rickspencer3TheMuso, hi, I'm just polishing up the wiki from the team meeting22:01
rickspencer3I'll ping you when I'm done22:01
rickspencer3TheMuso, last thing is adding in your activity report ;)22:02
bryycerickspencer3, sure one sec, lp is a tad slow22:02
bryycerickspencer3, aha https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/50624722:02
ubottuLaunchpad bug 506247 in xorg "Compositing cannot be re-enabled after upgrade" [Critical,Fix released]22:02
rickspencer3TheMuso, done:22:03
TheMusorickspencer3: Right, I did send that to you22:03
rickspencer3TheMuso, yeah, I just need to paste it in22:03
rickspencer3done now22:03
* TheMuso is back in karmic... lucid giving me too many headaches this morning.22:03
rickspencer3or note, seems wiki is slow to save22:04
rickspencer3TheMuso, mesa problems?22:04
rickspencer3like: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/50624722:04
ubottuLaunchpad bug 506247 in xorg "Compositing cannot be re-enabled after upgrade" [Critical,Fix released]22:04
TheMusorickspencer3: No, random resets.22:04
* TheMuso currently using the xorg nv driver with no xorg.conf.22:04
TheMusobut system randomly reboots, and can't find anything in logs to be able to point to the problem.22:05
rickspencer3well ... rough day for Ubuntu today22:05
* TheMuso will re-install lucid to see if that may mysteriously help.22:05
rickspencer3TheMuso, no robert_ancel, huh?22:06
rickspencer3just you for the eastern edition?22:06
TheMusorickspencer3: I don't know.22:06
rickspencer3kinda lonely22:06
TheMusoSOunds like it.22:06
bryycehey I'll join eastern edition22:06
seb128I can too22:06
rickspencer3hi bryyce22:06
rickspencer3well, I wasn't going to repeat it all, since I actually have the wiki udpated22:07
TheMusoWell I guess the only thing really is the audio update.22:07
rickspencer3but I was hoping that perhaps TheMuso could provide a bit of an audio update22:07
seb128I'm interested in that22:07
seb128I need to open a bug about my laptop playing no sound when docked22:07
* rickspencer3 looks at meeting notes to see if something needs to be highlighted for TheMuso22:07
seb128or when booted docked22:07
TheMusoStill trawling through bugs to attend to any that we have missed. Common bugs are users with hda problems that are usually fixed by installing newer alsa backported modules in karmic, or newer alsa driver snapshots from the audio PPA.22:08
seb128some days it works, I think it's when I boot first and dock it then22:08
rickspencer3TheMuso, have specific versions of specific packages been determined between you and brad?22:08
TheMusoOne real bug that we need to look into is users having problems with 5.1 audio output and pulse. This is in karmic, but I need to test to see whether lucid is also affected.22:09
rickspencer3TheMuso, if you get a sec to pull out some bug numbers, that would be helpful for the wiki22:10
TheMusorickspencer3: Actually crimsun did a bit of alsa updating during the break, so userspace wise, things have been moved onto 1.0.22. Kernel is staying the same however, o version wise, things are as follows: alsa-kernel, 1.0.21, userspace 1.0.22 for lib and plugins only. Pulse 0.9.21, may be updated if newer releases are bugfix only.22:10
TheMusorickspencer3: Right, I only really started trawling yesterday, so need to go back and dig them up.22:10
rickspencer3thanks TheMuso22:10
rickspencer3so those version numbers, those are final targets for Lucid, unless there is a no feature/only bug fix Pulse update, you will pull taht in?22:11
TheMusorickspencer3: Yes, crimsun may have other ideas, but at this point, thats the way it will be.22:11
TheMusorickspencer3: Oh hang on, I wil get that 5.1 audio issue bug number, hang on a sec.22:12
rickspencer3Thanks TheMuso22:12
TheMuso...and another one I think is biting some users, is pulse using a lot of memory.22:12
TheMusoAgain not sure if its fixed inlucid.22:12
* TheMuso gets that too.22:12
TheMuso5.1 audio bug number: 44584922:12
TheMusobug 44584922:13
ubottuLaunchpad bug 445849 in pulseaudio "Highpitched Rattling like Sound with 5.1 Surround Configuration on Karmic Koala" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/44584922:13
TheMusoand bug 424655 for memory issues22:13
ubottuLaunchpad bug 424655 in udev "using module-udev-detect leaks memory" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/42465522:13
crimsun445849 is a combined pa + linux issue22:14
crimsun424655 is a pa issue22:14
crimsun424655 has a workaround of using module-detect instead of module-udev-detect; the inotify handles aren't being freed properly22:15
crimsun(have to run back to another meeting now, sorry)22:15
pitticrimsun: oh, you tracked down the leak? great job!22:17
pittikenvandine: is https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/couchdb-glib/0-5-3-release/+merge/17022 on your plate or do you need help with it? (not "now", just in general; we're in freeze anyway)22:17
rickspencer3TheMuso, thanks for the update22:18
rickspencer3would be great to have that again next week22:18
rickspencer3TheMuso, I'm too tired (am in Europe atm)22:21
rickspencer3I'll update the wiki with the Eastern Edition info tomorrow22:22
ccheneyyipee we finally determined the cause of the weird upgrade failure with OOo22:22
TheMusorickspencer3: np no hurry22:22
* pitti waves goodnight22:22
didrockshave a good night :)22:23
seb128'night pitti22:23
rickspencer3'night all22:24
seb128hey robert_ancell22:25
seb128you waited for rick to leave? ;-)à22:25
robert_ancellseb128, hey22:25
robert_ancellI had upgrade problems... black screen on boot22:25
seb128you guys crossed by less than a minute22:25
seb128libglx borkage I guess22:25
seb128reinstall xserver-xorg-core to workaround it22:26
robert_ancellah, dist-upgrade fixed it :)22:26
seb128ok, or do another update which will reinstall it ;-)22:26
seb128you missed your meeting btw22:26
robert_ancellI didn't have a lot to add though22:26
seb128right, I was going to say22:27
seb128coming back from vac and being oem22:27
seb128not a lot of desktopish work to discuss there ;-)22:27
seb128at least not milestoned work items etc ;-)22:27
robert_ancellyup :)22:28
didrockshey robert_ancell22:29
robert_ancelldidrocks, hey22:29
seb128didrocks, still there?22:29
seb128didrocks, I though you would be training to the wii by now22:30
seb128in case ;-)22:30
didrocksseb128: heh, no, still reading some specs for tomorrow :)22:30
robert_ancellseb128, now rickspencer3 is avoiding me!!22:46
robert_ancellseb128, did you look at https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=602994? (PYTHON_LOCALMODLIBS)22:47
ubottuGnome bug 602994 in general "Don't use PYTHON_LOCALMODLIBS in configure" [Normal,Unconfirmed]22:47
seb128robert_ancell, no, did you email or ping me about that before?22:51
seb128looked now22:51
seb128those variables has never meant to be used this way, it's fine on old versions too22:51
robert_ancellseb128, email, must be in the spam bin :)22:51
seb128sorry about that22:52
robert_ancellI thought so... just wanted to check22:52
seb128I hate spammers22:52
robert_ancellyay versions is back!22:52
seb128I get hundred of spams a day22:52
cjhibernate is busted for me22:52
cjany general suggestons on how to fix it?22:52
seb128try #ubuntu22:52
cjor maybe some debugging tips? :)22:52
cjseb128: okay.22:52
robert_ancellseb128, you working in paris at the moment?22:53
seb128robert_ancell, no, but tomorrow22:53
seb128I was not officially part of that sprint22:53
* cj hopes he didn't interrupt another dev team meeting22:53
seb128but that's less than 2 hours away from there22:53
seb128I take a train tomorrow morning to join them22:53
seb128cj, no that's fine22:54
robert_ancellseb128, lucky europeans :)22:54
seb128robert_ancell, ;-)22:54
seb128robert_ancell, you go to lca?22:54
robert_ancellyes, next week22:54
robert_ancellshould be good, haven't been before but it's very highly rated22:54
seb128right, I've not been there before but I read comments about it22:55
seb128you well tell us how it is really ;-)22:55
robert_ancellbeer every night, err, I mean insightful discussion regarding linux22:57
seb128sounds like GUADEC ;-)22:58
didrocksok, going to bed now, it's time, see you tomorrow seb128, have a nice day robert_ancell!23:00
seb128'night didrocks23:00
robert_ancelldidrocks, night23:01
=== robbiew is now known as robbiew_

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