[02:15] <N1XF0RC3> hi
[02:16] <N1XF0RC3> "apt-get build-dep ruby" [missing sources .list]
[02:16] <N1XF0RC3> any help
[02:18] <crimsun> sorry, what do you mean?
[02:18] <crimsun> what's the precise error received?
[02:18] <N1XF0RC3> Reading package lists... Done
[02:18] <N1XF0RC3> Building dependency tree
[02:18] <N1XF0RC3> Reading state information... Done
[02:18] <N1XF0RC3> E: You must put some 'source' URIs in your sources.list
[02:18] <crimsun> right, so you need deb-src lines
[02:19] <N1XF0RC3> ?
[02:19] <N1XF0RC3> i don't know what should i add in /etc/apt/sources.list
[02:19] <crimsun> if you're unfamiliar with the actual /etc/apt/sources.list, you should probably use System > Administration > Software Sources > Ubuntu Software > Source code
[02:20] <crimsun> meaning, tick the Source code checkbox
[02:20] <N1XF0RC3> i need  the repos and i will add it to sources list
[02:21] <N1XF0RC3> i have no X window
[02:21] <N1XF0RC3> it's VPS
[02:21] <crimsun> well, the ruby binary package is generated from the ruby-defaults source package, which is in main
[02:21] <crimsun> so you'll need a deb-src line for main at least
[02:22] <crimsun> i.e., same line that you have for deb http://[...] main  but deb-src instead of deb
[02:22] <N1XF0RC3> mmm
[02:22] <N1XF0RC3> one sec plz
[02:22] <crimsun> it should be commented in your /etc/apt/sources.list anyhow.
[02:24] <N1XF0RC3> my list like this now
[02:24] <N1XF0RC3> deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hardy main restricted universe
[02:24] <N1XF0RC3> deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hardy-updates main restricted universe
[02:24] <N1XF0RC3> deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hardy-security main restricted universe
[02:24] <N1XF0RC3> deb-src http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu
[02:24] <N1XF0RC3> ~
[02:24] <N1XF0RC3> tell me error in line 4
[02:24] <N1XF0RC3> wrong line
[02:27] <N1XF0RC3> u there
[02:29] <crimsun> you didn't copy correctly
[02:30] <crimsun> copy precisely the deb lines, but instead of prepending deb, use deb-src
[02:30] <crimsun> (also, please don't query me)
[02:30] <N1XF0RC3> sorry
[02:31] <N1XF0RC3> what wrong in this line "deb-src http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu"
[02:32] <crimsun> it is incomplete
[02:34] <N1XF0RC3> please tell me what missing
[02:35] <sbalneav> N1XF0RC3: What source are you trying to add a line for?  main?
[02:35] <sbalneav> N1XF0RC3: If so, you'd need:
[02:35] <sbalneav> deb-src http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hardy main
[02:36] <sbalneav> crimsun: Good news, I think I "repaired" my pulse problem.  libjack0 was installed.
[02:37] <sbalneav> When I removed that, pulse started behaving better
[02:38] <N1XF0RC3> am try apt-get build-dep ruby  and tell me sourses.list
[02:38] <N1XF0RC3> E: You must put some 'source' URIs in your sources.list
[02:39] <sbalneav> Well, unless you removed them at some point, the src url's should have been in there.
[02:39] <sbalneav> however, something like
[02:40] <sbalneav> deb-src http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ hardy main universe
[02:40] <sbalneav> should do what you want.
[02:41] <N1XF0RC3> okie
[02:41] <N1XF0RC3> E: Could not open file /var/lib/apt/lists/archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_hardy_main_source_Sources - open (2 No such file or directory)
[02:42] <N1XF0RC3> this is the error i got
[02:44] <sbalneav> Could you please paste the contents of your /etc/apt/sources.list file to the pastebin?
[02:44] <sbalneav> !pastebin
[02:46] <N1XF0RC3> !pastebin deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hardy main restricted universe
[02:46] <N1XF0RC3> deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hardy-updates main restricted universe
[02:46] <N1XF0RC3> deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hardy-security main restricted universe
[02:46] <N1XF0RC3> deb-src http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ hardy main univers
[02:47] <N1XF0RC3> http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/m4adb75a7
[02:47] <sbalneav> You've spelt universe wrong
[02:47] <sbalneav> last line
[02:48] <N1XF0RC3> :O
[02:50] <N1XF0RC3> http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/m69be8b18
[02:50] <N1XF0RC3> E: Could not open file /var/lib/apt/lists/archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_hardy_main_source_Sources - open (2 No such file or directory)
[02:51] <sbalneav> You're kidding me right?
[02:51] <N1XF0RC3> same  wrong error
[02:51] <sbalneav> because YOU'VE SPELT IT WRONG AGAIN
[02:52] <sbalneav> It's spelt right on the line above
[02:52] <N1XF0RC3> :O
[02:54] <N1XF0RC3> am gone kill my self
[02:54] <N1XF0RC3> http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/m4daf07c6
[02:55] <N1XF0RC3> same error *+*
[02:56] <N1XF0RC3> E: Could not open file /var/lib/apt/lists/archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_hardy_main_source_Sources - open (2 No such file or directory)
[02:56] <sbalneav> OK, after you make the change, how are you doing a sudo apt-get update?
[02:56] <N1XF0RC3> ;)
[02:56] <N1XF0RC3> i update
[02:56] <N1XF0RC3> and it's downloading now
[02:57] <N1XF0RC3> worked brother
[02:57] <N1XF0RC3> :)
[02:58] <N1XF0RC3> thank you
[02:58] <N1XF0RC3> (F)
[02:59] <N1XF0RC3> could i ask for one more thing
[02:59] <sbalneav> Of course
[02:59] <N1XF0RC3> :D
[02:59] <N1XF0RC3> E: Couldn't find package ruby-dev
[03:00] <sbalneav> It's correct
[03:00] <sbalneav> there is no ruby-dev package.
[03:01] <N1XF0RC3> deb http://packages.medibuntu.org/ karmic free non-free
[03:01] <N1XF0RC3> ?
[03:01] <sbalneav> there's a ruby1.8-dev and a ruby1.9-dev
[03:02] <sbalneav> You're on hardy, you shouldn't put karmic lines in your sources.list
[03:03] <N1XF0RC3> okie
[03:03] <sbalneav> What is it that you're actually trying to do?
[03:03] <N1XF0RC3> trying to install ruby and ruby gems
[03:04] <sbalneav> why not just "apt-get install ruby rubygems"?
[03:04] <sbalneav> they're both packages on hardy
[03:04] <N1XF0RC3> this is all package is dependencies
[03:05] <sbalneav> If you apt-get install ruby rubygems, all the package dependencies will be solved for you.
[03:06] <N1XF0RC3> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 19 not upgraded.
[03:07] <sbalneav> ok, have you done a dist-upgrade to handle the 19 not upgraded?
[03:07] <sbalneav> sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
[03:09] <N1XF0RC3> root@freeze:/pentest# sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
[03:09] <N1XF0RC3> Reading package lists... Done
[03:09] <N1XF0RC3> Building dependency tree
[03:09] <N1XF0RC3> Reading state information... Done
[03:09] <N1XF0RC3> Calculating upgrade... Done
[03:09] <N1XF0RC3> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
[03:09] <N1XF0RC3> :D
[03:09] <sbalneav> ok, so
[03:09] <sbalneav> dpkg -l | egrep
[03:09] <N1XF0RC3> dist-upgrad what mean
[03:09] <sbalneav> dpkg -l | egrep "ruby"
[03:10] <sbalneav> you may already have it installed
[03:10] <sbalneav> dist-upgrade will install packages that get added.  A normal upgrade wont uprade any package that needs new packages installed.
[03:11] <N1XF0RC3> yes installed
[03:12] <sbalneav> ok, so there you go.
[03:12] <sbalneav> ruby's installed.
[03:13] <N1XF0RC3> YES
[03:14] <N1XF0RC3> BUT I NEED REPOS FOR ruby-dev libpcap-dev
[03:14] <N1XF0RC3> where i can find  repos
[03:15] <sbalneav> Well, I already told you about ruby
[03:15] <sbalneav> there's a ruby1.8-dev and a ruby1.9-dev
[03:15] <sbalneav> which libpcap do you have installed?
[03:16] <sbalneav> dpkg -l | grep libpcap
[03:16] <sbalneav> You probably have 0.8
[03:16] <sbalneav> if so, you want:
[03:16] <sbalneav> libpcap0.8-dev
[03:16] <N1XF0RC3> ii  libpcap0.8                         0.9.8-2                                                    System interface for user-level packet capture
[03:16] <N1XF0RC3> them installed
[03:16] <sbalneav> ok, so you want libpcap0.8-dev
[03:17] <sbalneav> And as for ruby, it looks like the default's 1.8
[03:17] <sbalneav> so you'd need ruby1.8-dev
[03:18] <N1XF0RC3> yes
[03:18] <N1XF0RC3> coz  the one installed not for ruby
[03:19] <sbalneav> Sorry?  That didn't make any sense to me.
[03:19] <sbalneav> What do you mean?
[03:19] <N1XF0RC3> i will past u the output for ruby  packages
[03:20] <N1XF0RC3> http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/m477a20d3
[03:21] <sbalneav> Look at line 46
[03:21] <sbalneav> you've already got ruby1.8-dev installed
[03:22] <sbalneav> so, you have your ruby1.8-dev package you want.
[03:22] <N1XF0RC3> yes  bro
[03:22] <N1XF0RC3> :)
[03:23] <N1XF0RC3> don't hate me
[03:23] <N1XF0RC3> okie
[03:23] <sbalneav> so if you don't have libpcap0.8-dev, then just apt-get install libpcap0.8-dev
[03:23] <N1XF0RC3> ::)
[03:23] <N1XF0RC3> i did
[03:23] <N1XF0RC3> :D
[03:23] <sbalneav> ok, so you have what you want then.
[03:23] <N1XF0RC3> yes
[03:40] <sbalneav> crimsun: Anything new and exciting I should be watching for in the new rtkit?
[03:46] <crimsun> sbalneav: not really
[04:13] <dhillon-v10> HedgeMage, ping :)
[04:13] <dhillon-v10> crimsun, hey there :)
[04:13] <HedgeMage> dhillon-v10: semi-awake pong :)
[04:14] <dhillon-v10> HedgeMage, seems like you are tired, do you want to work on any of the bugs or we can work tomorrow
[04:15]  * dhillon-v10 gives HedgeMage a cup of coffee
[04:20] <N1XF0RC3> i need one without sugar
[04:20] <N1XF0RC3> :D
[04:20] <N1XF0RC3> plz
[04:20] <N1XF0RC3> :d
[04:20] <N1XF0RC3> i will make for u
[04:20] <N1XF0RC3> :P
[04:21] <N1XF0RC3> wb
[04:21] <N1XF0RC3> i have problem with subversion
[04:23] <sbalneav> N1XF0RC3: More info might be helpful
[04:23] <N1XF0RC3> http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/m1869df54
[04:23] <N1XF0RC3> full info
[04:29] <sbalneav> http://www.metasploit.com
[04:29] <sbalneav> This what you're trying to get working?
[04:30]  * dhillon-v10 gives N1XF0RC3 a coffee without sugar :)
[04:31] <N1XF0RC3> :d
[04:31] <N1XF0RC3> i wana it work
[04:31] <N1XF0RC3> with fast-track
[04:31] <sbalneav> Yeah, well, 2 things.
[04:31] <N1XF0RC3> and it  only work stable in ubuntu
[04:31] <dhillon-v10> N1XF0RC3, there aren't enough hours in a day
[04:31] <N1XF0RC3> lol
[04:31] <N1XF0RC3> i setup it
[04:31] <N1XF0RC3> with fast track
[04:31] <N1XF0RC3> but the sqllite3  was not working
[04:31] <N1XF0RC3> so i removed it
[04:31] <sbalneav> 1) This channel's to do with helping people with edubuntu, a distro for kids, and education in the classroom
[04:32] <sbalneav> So, you're off-topic for this channel.
[04:32] <N1XF0RC3> and try to rebuild everything agine
[04:32] <sbalneav> 2) I'm not going to help someone compile hacker tools.
[04:32] <N1XF0RC3> lol
[04:32] <N1XF0RC3> u better kick me
[04:32] <N1XF0RC3> am not hacker
[04:32] <N1XF0RC3> am try to be
[04:33] <N1XF0RC3> but it's up to u
[04:33] <N1XF0RC3> and i will fix it :)
[04:36] <N1XF0RC3> no coffe
[04:36] <N1XF0RC3> lol
[04:40] <N1XF0RC3> yum remove svn;yum update;yum install svn;init 0
[04:41] <dhillon-v10> HedgeMage, u there ?
[04:44] <HedgeMage> dhillon-v10: just got back...should I read scrollback?
[04:44] <HedgeMage> dhillon-v10: LF had a bad dream and woke up, I just made it back to the computer
[04:45] <HedgeMage> dhillon-v10: ahh, caught up, no I'm not going to try to attack the site tonight.  I need to handle this Drupal 7 bug then get to bed
[04:45] <dhillon-v10> HedgeMage, okay then, can I help with that bug
[05:00] <HedgeMage> dhillon-v10: It's a little over my head, I'm asking questions in #drupal-contribute now.  I get that node_access is repeating a query multiple times on node_load and it's a performance issue, but there are a few things in the patch I don't recognize.  If the patch author is awake, I'll get info from him, otherwise I'll give up and call it a night.  Thanks for offering though!
[05:01] <N1XF0RC3> :D
[05:02] <dhillon-v10> HedgeMage, okay :) I can't really help much unless I see the patch, but I know you can probably figure it out yourself :)
[05:03] <HedgeMage> dhillon-v10: it's http://drupal.org/node/353595 if you are interested
[05:18] <dhillon-v10> HedgeMage, okay this is better :)
[05:18] <HedgeMage> Much :)
[05:19] <HedgeMage> I'm glad I was able to help with that one, that kind of stuff *is* important, and I also need to get to know node_access better.  I know how to use it, but haven't coded with it in a while.
[05:19] <dhillon-v10> HedgeMage, did I show this to you before: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4MwTvtyrUQ
[05:19] <dhillon-v10> HedgeMage, oh okay :) I didn't quite understand what was happening besides a loop not stopping
[05:22] <HedgeMage> Thanks to catch I get it now.  Basically, when node_load is run (which brings up a node so you can display or change it or whatever), node_access (which controls who can see/edit/etc each node) was running the same query each time it checked a piece of info, instead of running the query once then checking everything it needed to check.  This patch made a little cache item that (staying within the same node_load so it's not caching long en
[05:23] <N1XF0RC3> lol cute video
[05:26] <dhillon-v10> HedgeMage, ahh I am actually reading this conversation right now with something similar happening on linux kernel, but it was regarding memory locks :)
[05:26] <N1XF0RC3> root@freeze:~/subversion-1.4.6# sudo apt-get install --reinstall libsvn1
[05:26] <N1XF0RC3>   subversion: Depends: libsvn1 (= 1.4.6dfsg1-2ubuntu1.1) but 1.5.1dfsg1-1ubuntu2clazzes5 is to be installed
[05:27] <dhillon-v10> N1XF0RC3, possible to work on this tomorrow, I am kind of busy with something else
[05:27] <N1XF0RC3> okid
[06:08] <sbalneav> Heading to bed.  Night all.
[06:08] <HedgeMage> goodnight, sbalneav
[06:08] <HedgeMage> sweet dreams
[06:09] <HedgeMage> I'll be doing the same soon
[14:19] <highvoltage> stgraber: If I did things right you should be able to get ops now in #edubuntu
[14:20] <highvoltage> also added UbuntuIrcCouncil on their request
[15:26] <sbalneav> Morning all
[15:26] <sbalneav> highvoltage: yeah, I was helping that N1XF0RC3 guy for a while out of the goodness of my heart
[15:27] <sbalneav> my spidey-sense started tingling when he wanted libpcap-dev
[15:27] <sbalneav> then he was having trouble doing an svn checkout on metasploit
[15:28] <sbalneav> that's when I told him I wasn't gonna help him anymore.
[15:47] <stgraber> highvoltage: seems to work
[16:02] <mhall119> for anyone who uses Facebook, we have a new character coming to Qimo: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Qimo-4-Kids/257643984532?ref=nf
[16:06] <highvoltage> sbalneav: metasploit?
[16:07] <highvoltage> stgraber: ok cool, I just finished dinner but I'd still like to try it on lxc
[16:07] <haurra> hi there, while I was upgrading one of the main server of a local network at a school, a teacher came and plug the machine out of the socket !!!
[16:07] <sbalneav> highvoltage: http://www.metasploit.com/
[16:07] <haurra> Now the system do not want to boot, in recovery mode I have only a minimum shell
[16:08] <haurra> However I can access a terminal in normal mode but the main partition / is mounted as read only
[16:08] <sbalneav> haurra: Power plug, you mean?
[16:08] <haurra> I don't know what to do and all the work of the trainee is on this machine, I would greatly appreciate your help
[16:08] <haurra> sbalneav: yes sorry for my french
[16:08] <sbalneav> Yikes, not good.
[16:09] <haurra> pff, tell me about it
[16:09] <haurra> any good termninal user around ?
[16:09] <sbalneav> At this point, you'd be better off to restore the machine from backups, and start the upgrade again.
[16:09] <mhall119> highvoltage, I've got some new xsplash and gdm artwork coming in, so I'll be working on those packages soon
[16:10] <sbalneav> LTSP terminals, you mean?  A couple of us are ltsp developers
[16:10] <sbalneav> and users :)
[16:13] <alkisg> alexidoia, apart from the backup solution, which would be best, you may also have some luck by running `apt-get -f install` or `dpkg --configure -a`, followed by `apt-get dist-upgrade` in the recovery shell.
[16:13] <sbalneav> alkisg: might.
[16:14] <alexidoia> alkisg: of course, but /var is read only which seems to stuck dpk or apt
[16:14] <mhall119> does edubuntu use a custom GDM and XSplash theme?
[16:14] <sbalneav> Might have to remount /
[16:14] <sbalneav> mount -o remount /
[16:15] <highvoltage> mhall119: yay!
[16:15] <sbalneav> alexidoia: try mount -o remount,rw /
[16:15] <highvoltage> mhall119: not yet
[16:15] <alexidoia> sbalneav: ok
[16:16] <sbalneav> what does that give you?
[16:16] <sbalneav> Did it complain that the filesystem was corrupt on boot?
[16:19] <alexidoia> sbalneav: can't access any shell right now
[16:20] <sbalneav> Thought you said you had access to the shell?
[16:22] <alexidoia> mount : /lib/libblkid.so.1 : no version information available (require by mount)
[16:22] <alexidoia> sbalneav: ^^
[16:23] <sbalneav> yeah
[16:23] <sbalneav> you're hosed
[16:23] <alexidoia> so what are my options ?
[16:23] <sbalneav> None
[16:23] <sbalneav> restore from backup, and start over.
[16:24] <sbalneav> your disks in a mess
[16:24] <sbalneav> it's missing packages it needs in order to mount
[16:24] <sbalneav> but you can't add the packages unless you can mount the disk rw
[16:24] <sbalneav> chicken and egg
[16:25] <sbalneav> alexidoia: You have backups, yes?
[16:25] <alexidoia> no
[16:26] <alexidoia> I mean, the files yes, but not the system and its application*
[16:28] <sbalneav> ok then just do a reinstall from scratch, and restore the users files then
[16:29] <sbalneav> and invest in a UPS
[16:31] <alkisg> Noone thanks those who bear bad news... :D
[16:32] <ogra> bad news ?
[16:32] <alkisg> (06:23:32 μμ) alexidoia: so what are my options ?
[16:32] <alkisg> (06:23:39 μμ) sbalneav: None
[16:32] <ogra> he will do a reinstall and save the time for the upgrade :)
[16:32] <alkisg> Heh
[16:33] <alkisg> Well... We did a crash test on the fat clients plugin today
[16:33] <alkisg> Apart from some sound problems that were ALSO there on _thin_ clients, it worked like a charm
[16:34] <alkisg> A whole lab running off a server, full screen flash and everything, with no problems in CPU usage etc
[16:34] <sbalneav> alkisg: probably pissed at me for not being able to recover everything for him with one command :)
[16:35] <sbalneav> I am *CONSTANTLY* astounded at the number of people who do not have proper backups, and get absolutely indignant at you if you can't somehow sprinkle magic pixie dust on a borked system to make it work again.
[16:35] <alkisg> Hmmm you should take the "terminal masters" class in Hogwarts
[16:36] <sbalneav> The whole point of backups is that sometimes a machine gets borked so you CAN'T just sprinkle magic pixie dust on it. :)
[16:36] <crimsun> hmm, sound problems?
[16:36] <crimsun> BTW, the latest PA upload (1:0.9.22~0.9.21+stable-queue-32-g8478-0ubuntu1) finally resolves server- vs. client-side hangups
[16:37] <alkisg> crimsun: yes, but only on the thin/fat clients. With the live lucid cd they worked flawlessly
[16:37] <sbalneav> crimsun: Don't know wether you saw my message from yesterday, but libjack0 was installed on my box, and upon removing that, pulse started behaving much better.
[16:37] <crimsun> sbalneav: hmm, only libjack0? Was jackd also installed?
[16:38] <sbalneav> No, no jackd
[16:38] <sbalneav> just libjack
[16:38] <crimsun> hmm.
[16:38] <mhall119> highvoltage, do you have any artwork that can be used for the GDM and XSplash themes?
[16:39] <sbalneav> I could draw some stick figures :)
[16:40] <mhall119> xkcd-stype?
[16:41] <sbalneav> yeah, only not so good.
[16:42] <sbalneav> You know, maybe we should approach the digital blasphemy guy, see if he'd do a background for us.
[16:43] <sbalneav> www.digitalblasphemy.com
[16:43] <sbalneav> I've had a paid subscription with him for years.
[16:44] <highvoltage> mhall119: Mads Rosendahl is working on some artwork for us, I'll ping him and find out more or less how much time he'll need
[16:44] <highvoltage> mhall119: he did some nice things for other projects alread, like the ubuntu ldm artwork
[16:45] <mhall119> cool
[16:45] <sbalneav> ah, cool.
[16:45] <highvoltage> mhall119: the plan is to start with a real nice wallpaper and make the rest to work nicely with it (gtk theme, plymouth theme, xplash, etc)
[16:45] <alkisg> Hmmm very fine indeed... http://www.digitalblasphemy.com/freegallery.shtml
[16:45] <mhall119> plymouth?
[16:45] <mhall119> is that going to be used in Lucid?
[16:45] <crimsun> it's already there
[16:45] <highvoltage> mhall119, sbalneav: modifying something like this for edubuntu might be nice I think: http://www.webupd8.org/2010/01/ubuntu-lucid-plymouth-theme-idea-space.html
[16:46] <mhall119> so, is Usplash out then?
[16:46] <crimsun> (and wreaking havoc for some setups)
[16:46] <crimsun> yes
[16:46] <highvoltage> crimsun: indeed :)
[16:46] <mhall119> it only works with kernel mode switching right?
[16:46] <highvoltage> mhall119: yes
[16:46] <sbalneav> alkisg: he does all the art himself, and it's all digitally done.  I love "space" type backgrounds, and he does really nice ones.
[16:46] <crimsun> pretty much, and then only in certain cases
[16:46] <mhall119> which is just some intel and ati cards isn't it?
[16:46] <crimsun> for instance, if you use enciphered lvm /, you're currently screwed
[16:47] <highvoltage> mhall119: I believe it works with nuvou (sp?) drivers as well now
[16:47] <crimsun> (you'll see the prompt on KMS-enabled but your key presses are never processed; on non-KMS-enabled you don't see anything /and/ your keypresses aren't processed)
[16:47] <mhall119> are those stable yet?
[16:47] <mhall119> fun
[16:48] <highvoltage> sbalneav: those digitalblasphemy artwork is nice, but they're not released under a license we can use are they?
[16:49] <highvoltage> mhall119: it's supposed to make it in for lucid, I believe it's usable and fairly stable although not on par feature-wise with the non-free driver
[16:49] <sbalneav> highvoltage: No, they aren't, but that doesn't mean we can't approach him and see if he WOULD be willing to do something for us under a license we can use.
[16:49] <highvoltage> sbalneav: nice thinking
[16:49] <sbalneav> I'm thinking if he could do a desktop with a library scene, or a classroom scene, or something.
[16:50] <sbalneav> If he'd be willing to do it for <$300 I'd be willing to fund that.
[16:50] <sbalneav> I know he does commissions.
[16:50] <crimsun> I'd chip in, too
[16:50] <sbalneav> I'm just throwing it out there, not trying to take anything away from Mads
[16:50] <crimsun> (if there's an e-mail discussion, please Cc me)
[16:51] <highvoltage> sbalneav: so let's do commissionjs, tell him he gets 70% of each Edubuntu CD we sell :)
[16:51] <sbalneav> bwahahaha
[16:51] <sbalneav> right, 70% of what's left over after we've been paid :)
[16:51] <highvoltage> sbalneav: we told Mads that we might approach other artists, and that even if he makes something really nice we'd use something nicer if it comes along
[16:52] <highvoltage> sbalneav: and it wouldn't hurt having more stuff for future desings, although, it might be a bit sucky if you pay for something and Mads' artwork ends up being used
[16:52] <sbalneav> What's the will and pleasure of edubuntu-(council|devs|chchannel) I can send off an email this morning.
[16:52] <highvoltage> sbalneav: I say just go for it
[16:52] <sbalneav> Oh, I don't mind, we could just put it on the disk anyway
[16:53] <sbalneav> ok, I'll send him an email.
[16:53] <highvoltage> sbalneav: indeed, and use it for one of the art-packs
[16:53] <sbalneav> sure
[16:54] <sbalneav> It'll make Ahmuck happy: we'll have SOMETHING unique about edubuntu :)
[16:54] <sbalneav> ok, I'll send an email, and cc edubuntu-devs
[16:57] <highvoltage> awesome
[17:03] <mhall119> http://www.qimo4kids.com/post/A-look-at-whats-coming-in-Qimo-20.aspx
[17:10] <sbalneav> mhall119: I saw both edubuntu and quimo got a mention in Linux Journal recently
[17:11] <mhall119> sbalneav, yeah, I bought 3 copies of it :)
[17:13] <sbalneav> mhall119: Well done!
[17:13] <mhall119> you guys too
[17:13] <sbalneav> Do you start with ubuntu, and add some of our stuf, and some of your own, or do you start with edubuntu as the base?
[17:14] <mhall119> I start with Xubuntu
[17:14] <sbalneav> and, is there anything that we can do to make it easier for your effort?
[17:14] <mhall119> so it's got the XFCE dependencies already, and not all of the Gnome ones
[17:14] <mhall119> well, once I have packages, highvoltage has already volunteered to help me get them into Universe
[17:15] <mhall119> I've read a how-to on customizing GDM and XSplash, so I think I'm good there
[17:15] <mhall119> so my biggest task is making an XFCE session for Qimo that saves it's setting somewhere different from the stock XFCE session
[17:16] <mhall119> I will probably need help making the alternate install CD, because I've never done that before
[17:16] <sbalneav> mhall119: If you think the xfce stuff needs some programming, and need a hand, let me know.
[17:17] <mhall119> thanks
[17:17] <mhall119> I was told it shouldn't, that all the XFCE programs should respect the $XDG_ variables for where to store settings
[17:17] <mhall119> and I got most of them working on 9.04
[17:18] <mhall119> my only problem was XFConf, which I think they were changing or removing in 9.10/10.04 anywya
[17:30] <sbalneav> wow, wasn't expecting something this fast...
[17:30] <sbalneav> Thanks for writing Scott.  To be honest I don't usually accept
[17:30] <sbalneav> commissions but if the project is interesting enough and I can work on
[17:30] <sbalneav> it without compromising my wallpaper creations then I would consider
[17:30] <sbalneav> it.  What exactly did you have in mind?
[17:31] <sbalneav> What do we want to ask for?
[17:32] <sbalneav> I'm thinking something like either a classroom/teacher's desk type picture
[17:32] <sbalneav> or the inside of a nice old library with stacks of books.
[17:32] <sbalneav> highvoltage
[17:32] <sbalneav> crimsun:
[17:32] <sbalneav> stgraber:
[17:32] <sbalneav> other ideas?
[17:34] <ogra> nekkid puppies !
[17:35] <sbalneav> ogra!!!
[17:35] <ogra> :)
[17:35] <HedgeMage> hey, ogra :)
[17:35] <sbalneav> HedgeMage: ideas?
[17:35] <ogra> sbalneav, i would go with something more abstract
[17:36] <ogra> sbalneav, if he is an artist, just give him a raw direction and let him do some examples
[17:37] <sbalneav> ogra: Well, I think that's what Mad's going to do
[17:37] <HedgeMage> sbalneav: Hmmm...have you ever seen Disney's version of The Sword In the Stone?
[17:37] <sbalneav> years ago
[17:38] <sbalneav> All I remember is the scrawny kid pulling the sword out of the stone
[17:38] <sbalneav> rests's a blurr.
[17:38] <HedgeMage> sbalneav: There's a scene wher Merlin packs up all of his stuff by casting a spell and it all lines up nicely and floats toward his little suitcase, shrinking as it goes, then it all fits in.
[17:38] <HedgeMage> sbalneav: It would be cool to have a classroom full of school stuff sucked into a computer like that.
[17:39] <ogra> i.e. i'd go with some floating chars, formulas probably some sketches of animals or flowers etc
[17:39]  * HedgeMage sings "Hockity-pockity-wockity-whack, odds and ends and brick-a-brack, shrink in size, very small, we've got to leave enough room for all..."
[17:39] <sbalneav> Ah, so have a stream of things like chalk erasers, desks, books, teachers apple, protractors, etc, being sucked into the computer
[17:39] <HedgeMage> yep
[17:40] <ogra> sounds intresting
[17:40]  * HedgeMage is easily entertained
[17:40] <ogra> mind you, dont make it to distracting though
[18:00] <highvoltage> sbalneav: not so sure about the classroom idea. I guess I'd like something spacy instead, but that's just me
[18:01] <highvoltage> HedgeMage: that sounds very americanny-folky :)
[18:05] <HedgeMage> highvoltage: is that a good thing or a bad thing?
[18:05] <HedgeMage> :P
[18:05] <HedgeMage> It would be nice, come to think of it, if we had some things that appealed to older students.
[18:06] <highvoltage> HedgeMage: no idea :)
[18:06] <HedgeMage> I have a tendency to just think about the little ones because that's what I have at home, buta lot of edubuntu art is already geared toward them.
[18:06] <sbalneav> what, grade 11, 12, and low uni?
[18:06] <HedgeMage> Something like that :)
[18:08] <sbalneav> Hmm, that would be something more "library-ey" I'd think.  He does some neat architechture things.  A Library with rows of books that sort of fades off into infinity might be neat.
[18:10] <sbalneav> Would people be interested in that?  A sort of "Infinte Library" theme?
[18:11] <HedgeMage> I'm up for anything
[18:11] <HedgeMage> I'm no artist so I never really know how things would look until I see them.
[18:17] <highvoltage> I just blogged aboot our wiki hug day: http://jonathancarter.co.za/2010/01/18/edubuntu-wiki-hug-day/
[18:17] <highvoltage> Feel free to do the same ;)
[19:01] <stgraber> highvoltage: can I steal your edubuntu wiki image ?
[19:08] <dgroos> Good Afternoon All
[19:10] <highvoltage> stgraber: of course!
[19:10] <dgroos> sbalneav: Just saw your list-serve email--I'll kick in as well.
[19:10] <highvoltage> stgraber: I already stole it from myself for another website ;)
[19:17] <sbalneav> dgroos: I'm hoping he'll do it for free, but we'll see :)
[19:18] <dgroos> For sure.
[19:27] <alkisg> ogra, could you direct me on where to look for the "don't put ldm translations to langpacks" problem?
[19:35] <alkisg> stgraber, would you know anything about it? Here's what ogra has said:
[19:35] <alkisg> (12:03:06 μμ) ogra: alkisg, i'm asking for years now to remove LDM locales from the langpackas and leave it in the package, so the existing locale-gen plugin generates the translations on the fly
[19:35] <alkisg> (12:03:06 μμ) ogra: iirc the code needed in the ldm packaging was even added at some point, check with stgraber, probably it was accidentially dropped or so
[19:35] <alkisg> (12:04:52 μμ) ogra: there are some runes you can add to debian/rules so the messages stay in the package
[19:35] <alkisg> (12:06:46 μμ) ogra: a locale-gen el run (which is what the plugin should do if nobody changed my code) should then generate the translations on the fly
[19:40] <alkisg> Hmmm I found some info here: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UbuntuDevelopment/Internationalisation/Packaging
[19:50] <alkisg> One way would be to blacklist it in pkgbinarymangler: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/lucid/pkgbinarymangler/lucid/annotate/head%3A/striptranslations.blacklist
[19:54] <alkisg> ldm (2:2.0.13-0ubuntu2) intrepid; urgency=low
[19:54] <alkisg>   * add export NO_PKG_MANGLE=1 to debian/rules to prevent stripping of the translations, thin clients should not have to have full langpacks installed due to space reasons.
[19:54] <alkisg>  -- Oliver Grawert <ogra@ubuntu.com>  Mon, 13 Oct 2008 01:03:47 +0200
[20:23] <stgraber> alkisg: what I'm a bit worried about that NO_PKG_MANGLE is that it might also prevert the -dbgsym packages from being created
[20:33] <sbalneav> Prevent or Pervert? :)
[20:34] <sbalneav> Or perhaps, prevent perversion?
[20:35] <sbalneav> Post perversion prevention, practically pandemic!
[20:37] <sbalneav> Petunia, promulgating propriety, practiced perversion prevention perennially.
[20:38] <sbalneav> I need help.
[20:49] <stgraber> *prevent ;)
[20:49] <stgraber> sbalneav: everything ok ? :)
[20:50]  * alkisg gives up on this and goes on to try something easier... :D
[20:50] <stgraber> alkisg: did you implement that process kill one-liner I pasted you the other day ?
[20:50] <alkisg> stgraber: no, I thought it would be better if we prevented the daemons from starting at the first place,
[20:51] <stgraber> I told highvoltage about it this morning as something we may want to include in ltsp-build-client and ltsp-update-image
[20:51] <alkisg> and also I wasn't quite sure that I would do it correctly :)
[20:51] <stgraber> alkisg: sure, but that'd still be useful to catch things that we can't prevent from starting.
[20:52] <alkisg> I agree, both killing and umount -l would be good as failovers
[20:52] <stgraber> alkisg: it'd be better if they never start but in the unlikely case where they do, it'd be better if we kill them rather than having mksquashfs fail
[20:52] <alkisg> Also `mksquashfs --exclude /proc` or something like that
[20:52] <alkisg> stgraber: I can try that tomorrow, but I'd like to tackle it all together,
[20:53] <alkisg> so I'd like your opinion on the "changing the path" idea..
[20:53] <stgraber> alkisg: that kill line will make sure that umount will work, so umount -l and -e /proc shouldn't be required at all (and the real thing I don't want is leftover process, umount -l and -e /proc don't prevent that from happening)
[20:53] <alkisg> (i.e. provide start/stop/reload etc wrappers as part of our .deb)
[20:55] <alkisg> Hmm how brutal is that? If you're ok with just killing and no wrappers, I'm ok too :)
[20:55] <alkisg> Or I could see if dpkg-divert works without side  effects...
[20:56] <stgraber> I'd go with wrapper where possible + kill for leftovers
[20:57] <alkisg> OK. It'll be better if we shipped those wrappers, and not created them on the fly
[20:57] <alkisg> The sysadmin could also use them, in the same sense he uses LTSP_HANDLE_DAEMONS now
[20:58] <alkisg> chroot $ROOT PATH=wrappers_dir:$PATH command
[20:58] <stgraber> alkisg: I guess the idea of doing that in the LTSP plugins was that it'd be applied before any daemon starts
[20:59] <alkisg> Yes, what I said above was just for the sysadmin wanting to install more programs afterwards
[20:59] <stgraber> alkisg: remember than LTSP itself ships daemons and you can't predict in which order packages will be installed
[20:59] <alkisg> stgraber: 000-daemon-handling would change the path to include the wrappers dir first
[21:00] <stgraber> alkisg: you'd need those wrappers to be installed before you can set PATH to point to them
[21:00] <stgraber> alkisg: remember that you need these to be installed BEFORE we install ltsp-client-core ;)
[21:00] <alkisg> stgraber: ok, but no daemons are started in EARLY_PACKAGES afaik
[21:00] <stgraber> really ?
[21:01] <alkisg> And we could even do that before EARLY_PACKAGES
[21:01] <alkisg> I think so. I only had problems with leftover processes when I used the fat client plugin, and that only installed stuff after EARLY_PACKAGES
[21:02] <stgraber> then "OK. It'll be better if we shipped those wrappers, and not created them on the fly" is wrong before as you can't ship them with the ltsp-client-core package, you need to write them on the fly from a ltsp-build-client plugin
[21:02] <alkisg> In a normal, thin chroot, I don't think any daemons are started (I mean new, upstart daemons - but maybe that'll change in the future?)
[21:02] <alkisg> stgraber: OK. Where is a good place to put them? /var/lib/ltsp? /tmp? (I don't really like tmp...)
[21:09] <sbalneav> stgraber: losing my mind is all :)
[22:03] <alkisg> stgraber: would you mind if I filed a bug in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pkgbinarymangler/+bugs and asked them to put ldm in striptranslations.blacklist (or, if we could safely use NO_PKG_MANGLE instead, without worrying about dbgsym packages not being created)?
[22:24] <stgraber> alkisg: is that the same list ltsp is already on ?
[22:24] <alkisg> stgraber: no, only a few packages are there: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/lucid/pkgbinarymangler/lucid/annotate/head%3A/striptranslations.blacklist
[22:25] <stgraber> right, anyway translatable strings for ltsp are mostly on the server side I guess
[22:26] <stgraber> quickly looking through ltsp-trunk, all of them seem to be in ldm-trunk actually
[22:26] <stgraber> I can do the change myself, no need to open a bug
[22:26] <stgraber> (at least I think so ;))
[22:30] <stgraber> alkisg: done
[22:30] <alkisg> Yey! :)
[22:30]  * stgraber hopes he understood how that thing works correctly ;)
[22:31]  * alkisg can't wait for a new ltsp uploading :D
[22:31] <stgraber> there was a bzr branch, so I did the change there + updated changelog and pushed. Only weird thing is that it's only one of 3 branches with the same content (though it's the one referenced in the package) ;)
[22:32] <stgraber> alkisg: still waiting for the whole Fat client thing to be tested and rock solid and nbd-proxy to be fixed.
[22:32] <stgraber> alkisg: there's also some good optimization work going on that I want to be in.
[22:32] <stgraber> alkisg: the plan is to release 5.1.99 this week and probably have 5.2 release at some point next week or the week after
[22:33] <alkisg> stgraber: I've done a lot of testing with the fat client script, is there anything else to test?
[22:33] <stgraber> alkisg: so I don't want to release 5.1.99 too early as it's going to be the last release before 5.2 ;)
[22:33] <stgraber> alkisg: I'm still waiting for feedback from highvoltage and I want to test it on Lucid + ltsp-cluster at the office too.
[22:33] <alkisg> stgraber: hmmm if you could upload a recent version to your ppa, I could tell some interested teachers to put it to their sources and test...
[22:34] <stgraber> alkisg: isn't this morning's recent enough ? ;)
[22:34]  * alkisg looks :)
[22:34] <stgraber> upstream is at 1531 and I have 1526 in the PPA
[22:35] <stgraber> so you have all changes except these done today
[22:36] <stgraber> uploading a new snapshot
[22:38] <alkisg> stgraber: yup, please do, #1527 was a nasty bug :(
[22:41] <highvoltage> stgraber: yeah since my lxc didn't start up I just moved to easier work :)
[22:41] <highvoltage> stgraber: but I'll do it on a 'real' machine or VM tomorrow
[22:42]  * alkisg and his team tested the fat client script in a lab with about 10 PCs with different hardware this morning
[22:43] <alkisg> Apart from some sound issues all went well
[22:43] <alkisg> Those sound issues were also there with Lucid thin clients, but not with Karmic thin clients
[22:43] <alkisg> So it might be upstart related, or kernel related...?
[22:44] <highvoltage> or pulse related?
[22:46] <alkisg> Could be... the main thing is that 10 clients booted with an 11 Gb virtual disk image in less than 1 minute.
[22:46] <alkisg> So I'm pretty sure that fat clients will be a big success in Lucid.
[22:47] <stgraber> highvoltage: great, thanks. I'll try to make LXC work with lucid this week, that's part of a spec I'm supposed to implement ;)
[22:47] <highvoltage> stgraber: awesome.
[22:48] <stgraber> alkisg: I had a few pulse issues here recently, I have to revert to a previous version (on my laptop, not on LTSP). Haven't had the time to look at it in detail so no bug report filed yet.
[22:49] <alkisg> Ah, nice, that would explain why sound worked on only half of the machines.
[23:03] <mhall119> does LTSP benefit at all from the new same page merging in the kernel?
[23:03] <mhall119> or does shared libraries get you all of that already
[23:04] <stgraber> shared libraries give us that already
[23:07] <alkisg> I'm writing a set of ltsp-build-client plugins related to the fat client plugin, for use in Greek schools. Some of those might be useful to others, so I'll list the more generic ones here, in case someone would like to see them upstream:
[23:07] <alkisg> (1) if italc is installed on the chroot, copy italc keys from the server, (2) if a parameter "passwordless_root_ssh" is specified, install openssh to the chroot and setup the keys,
[23:07] <alkisg> (3) an "install all server langpacks to the chroot" plugin, (4) a "configure_gnome_proxy" on the clients if squid is installed on the server,
[23:07] <alkisg> (5) and "add-apt-repository" plugin, (6) a "use current user's password for the chroot root's password" plugin
[23:10]  * stgraber is glad he's using bcfg2/puppet for that kind of stuff ;) Makes it extremely easy to have the same experience on regular desktop and fat clients
[23:15]  * alkisg cannot even understand what bcfg2 does, by reading its description... "Bcfg2 has been designed from the ground up to support gentle reconciliation between the specification and current client states."
[23:16] <stgraber> basically you define all your package lists, configuration, services, ... using templates, then run bcfg2 on the computer or in the chroot and it'll get its compiled configuration from the server
[23:17] <alkisg> Oooh that sounds cool
[23:17] <stgraber> then parse it and does everything described there. So usually, installing packages, copying files from a server, making sure all files are the rights ones and weren't modified, install services, ...
[23:17] <stgraber> I basically never do a apt-get install or edit a file on a server directly now
[23:17] <stgraber> all I do is do the change in a bzr branch and wait an hour for it to automatically get applied on all servers
[23:18] <alkisg> So I could use it to ship configuration templates to other schools here?
[23:18] <stgraber> (that's how I can maintain 80 Ubuntu installs only on my home LAN, lot of VMs ;))
[23:18] <alkisg> Damn my TODO list keeps getting longer! :( :D
[23:18] <alkisg> Ty stgraber
[23:19] <stgraber> alkisg: yeah, you could have one central server, storing all the package lists, list of actions (basically shell scripts), custom configuration files, ...
[23:19] <stgraber> and then have all servers use that and update every hour
[23:19] <stgraber> so if you do a change, it gets deployed in the hour to all servers
[23:19] <alkisg> Wow...
[23:20] <stgraber> Did you really thing I managed our 50 application servers cluster by doing some SSH ? ;)
[23:20] <stgraber> anyway, if you want to take a look, I'd suggest puppet, it's currently better maintained and has a lot more tutorials and examples than Bcfg2
[23:23] <alkisg> I've used clusterssh for a while, and it was really handy for 12 terminals. Sure, it had nothing to do with configuration replication, but I really liked editing 12 files simulaneously or doing 12 apt-get updates... :)
[23:23]  * alkisg googles for puppet...
[23:24] <stgraber> http://reductivelabs.com/trac/puppet/ (in case Google in Greece isn't returning it as the first result, it used to be hard to find though now it's the first result on Google english)
[23:24] <stgraber> probably something to do with Google itself using it for their desktops ;)
[23:24] <alkisg> I found it, but it wasn't on the first page
[23:26] <stgraber> clusterssh/dsh are great tools for debugging (checking log files and that kind of stuff on a lot of machines), though I had to write my own script as they tend to have issues opening 5000 ssh connections at the same time ;)
[23:28] <alkisg> Don't complain, that amounts to about 200 pixels per PC... almost a whole square cm :)
[23:28] <stgraber> ;)