[01:04] <Hellow> Question: Will Ubuntu User Days in Spanish have the same topics as the main one, or a different set of topics?
[01:05] <cjohnston> Hellow: similar
[01:05] <DiegoTc> Hellow, some will be similar
[01:05] <DiegoTc> we were planning in making similar,but not so many speakers appear :(
[01:07] <Hellow> Heh, I'm composing a blog post.
[01:07] <Hellow> Next up: Sending in my introduction and outline.
[01:07] <Hellow> This is going to be a /fun/ week.
[01:08]  * DiegoTc remember he had to send emails about the USD
[01:08] <DiegoTc> :(
[01:13] <Hellow> Whee: http://hellow.posterous.com/ubuntu-user-days
[01:15] <DiegoTc> cjohnston, I want to ask you something
[01:15] <DiegoTc> in ubuntu-classroom there is a bot that saves the logs of each session?
[01:18] <cjohnston> appears as such
[01:19] <DiegoTc> what we have to do, to have the bot at #ubuntu-charlas do you know?
[01:25] <cjohnston> I will try to find out for you
[01:26] <DiegoTc> okay thanks
[01:45] <cjohnston> DiegoTc: still here?
[01:53] <DiegoTc> cjohnston, yes
[01:53] <cjohnston> DiegoTc: I have requested more info.. Will get back to you
[01:53] <cjohnston> g'nite
[01:53] <DiegoTc> okay
[01:54] <doctormo> pleia2: Hey there
[02:05] <cprofitt> need an opinion on a presentation background
[02:05] <cprofitt> http://i49.tinypic.com/2klnxk.jpg
[02:11] <pleia2> cprofitt: looks nice :)
[02:11] <pleia2> doctormo: hey
[02:11] <pleia2> ..but actually heading back to spend time with my mother (she's in town visiting)
[02:12] <doctormo> pleia2: thanks for approving my comment.
[02:13] <cprofitt> thanks pleia2
[02:13] <cprofitt> I will likely publish it CC
[02:21] <doctormo> cprofitt: Ah the question is, which CC :-D
[02:22] <cprofitt> there is no question there
[02:22] <cprofitt> By NC SA
[02:24] <doctormo> cprofitt: Non copyleft, what's it for?
[02:24] <cprofitt> ?
[02:24] <cprofitt> Non copyleft?
[02:24] <cprofitt> not sure I follow
[02:25] <doctormo> cprofitt: Copyleft is a term for a particlar kind of license terms similar to the GPL and was coined by Stallman.
[02:25] <cprofitt> I see... so how, then, is CC-BY-NC-SA not copyleft
[02:25] <doctormo> cprofitt: It's got NC on it, that makes it too restrictive for copyleft.
[02:26] <cprofitt> I see.
[02:26] <cprofitt> oh, well.
[02:26] <doctormo> Just incase we want to use it for presentations in learning or in loco stuff... can't commit it launchpad you see.
[02:26] <cprofitt> because they are commercial?
[02:27] <doctormo> cprofitt: No, because they forbid material that isn't copyleft or less.
[02:27] <cprofitt> link
[02:28] <cprofitt> odd... launchpad itself appears to be copyright...
[02:28] <doctormo> https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad-registry/+bug/174661
[02:29] <doctormo> cprofitt: Actually launchpad is copyrighted under a copyleft license... the AGPLv3
[02:29] <cprofitt> wow... and Launchpad logo is not copyleft either
[02:29] <cprofitt> it is BY-ND
[02:29] <doctormo> Quote: Just to be completely clear: none of the NC ("non-commercial") or ND ("no-derivatives") CC licenses are open-source. If a project wants to use those variants, they'll have to arrange proprietary hosting with us.
[02:29] <cprofitt> I guess Canonical violated its own terms...
[02:29] <doctormo> Ah well ND on a logo... what a surprise.
[02:29] <cprofitt> thus rendering them unenforceable
[02:29] <cprofitt> Ooops
[02:29] <doctormo> Canonical don't have to abide by community rules... see ubuntuone
[02:30] <cprofitt> guess Mark needs some better lawyers
[02:30] <cprofitt> they do have to abide by the rules of the 'device' they are using
[02:30] <cprofitt> same as Apple
[02:30] <doctormo> No, they own launchpad and I'm betting they have "a proprietary hosting agreement" with themselves.
[02:30] <cprofitt> thus one of the possible challenges to Apple's stupid EULA
[02:31] <cprofitt> all that and a bag of chips leaves it to a court to decide
[02:31] <doctormo> I've had a project kicked off launchpad because of NC, so I know.
[02:32] <doctormo> cprofitt: The problem with that argument is that in Apple's case they are selling devices where ownership changes hands and in this case it is a service agreement that Canonical to not have to enter for their own works.
[02:32] <cprofitt> https://help.launchpad.net/Legal/ProjectLicensing
[02:33] <cprofitt> not sure you are right doctormo
[02:33] <cprofitt> doctormo: in Apple's case they violated their own EULA
[02:33] <cprofitt> they distributed software (iTunes, Safari) with the same boiler player EULA as OS X
[02:33] <doctormo> It must not discriminate against persons, groups or against fields of endeavour. The licence of software hosted by Launchpad can not discriminate against anyone or any group of users and cannot restrict users from using the software for a particular field of endeavour - a business for example.
[02:33] <cprofitt> it says it can only be loaded on an Apple branded hardware
[02:34] <cprofitt> yet it clearly is loaded on non-Apple branded hardware all the time
[02:34] <doctormo> cprofitt: There is a difference too in that Canonical are not in a business relationship with their users, the agreement is non binding on their end.
[02:34] <cprofitt> and Apple has failed to defend that copyright
[02:34] <cprofitt> I am not sure NC prohibits a person using the software in their business
[02:35] <cprofitt> ... though certainly it would prohibit them using my background in a presentation they charged for
[02:35] <doctormo> cprofitt: Of course it does, you can use it within the the business, but not as a part of your business.
[02:35] <cprofitt> I really have no desire to argue philosophical or legal items with you Doc
[02:35] <cprofitt> you, nor I, have any experience with the law directly
[02:36] <cprofitt> and our indirect experience is not enough to sway either of us
[02:36] <cprofitt> so it really only serves to cause a 'rift'
[02:36] <doctormo> cprofitt: For me it's not an argument, I'm simply explaining what I know to be the case, launchpad will reject CC-NC works.
[02:37] <cprofitt> based on what I have read... I am not sure that IS the case... and if it IS the case then there may be some folks that need to examine things...
[02:37] <doctormo> Why and how are non of my concerns, interesting mental puzzels, but not more.
[02:37] <cprofitt> though to be honest... it does not matter.
[02:37] <cprofitt> I am not going to submit my background for use on LP
[02:37] <doctormo> heh
[02:38] <doctormo> cprofitt: See for me it's quite simple, "Do I intent to re-license the work for profit" If no, NC is costly and shouldn't be used, if yes then NC can be used with caution.
[02:39] <cprofitt> If I intend to use for profit then I can just do that... I own the copyright
[02:39] <cprofitt> so... the question is if I want others to do so.
[02:39] <doctormo> In the cases of art and design, I have no desire to relicense for profit and to be honest if someone takes the work and makes money from it, I say good on them.
[02:40] <cprofitt> I certainly have no desire to let anyone profit from my art work...
[02:40] <cprofitt> unlike software I am not sure anyone would 'add value' to my artwork that would 'encourage' me to want to 'share' it
[02:40] <doctormo> Interesting isn't it, it's a socialist thing perhaps, give to the greater good what you can spare to let others profit from.
[02:40] <cprofitt> allowing for commerical works
[02:41] <cprofitt> not sure how the greater good is served by allowing someone to use artwork for profit
[02:43] <cprofitt> interesting to see the wiki is not copyleft either
[02:43] <doctormo> cprofitt: It's CC-BY-SA
[02:44] <cprofitt> no, sir it is not.
[02:44] <cprofitt> http://www.ubuntu.com/legal
[02:44] <cprofitt> read the first two paragraphs
[02:50] <doctormo> cprofitt: What has the license on www.ubuntu.com got to do with wiki.ubuntu.com? they're two different systems, authors and rationales.
[02:50] <cprofitt> doc... good question why don't you ask the developer or sysadmins at Canonical who linked them
[02:51] <cprofitt> window 11
[02:51] <cprofitt> I hit 'Legal' at the bottom of the page on the wiki and it takes me there
[02:52] <cprofitt> window 11
[02:53] <cprofitt> gotta remember the darn '/'
[02:58] <cprofitt> hey Vantrax
[02:58] <Vantrax> hi
[02:59] <cprofitt> what do you think of this presentation background - http://ftbeowulf.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/dr2.png
[03:08] <Vantrax> little heavy but good
[03:08] <Vantrax> id drop the opacity by half
[03:09] <cprofitt> its for a presentation on data recovery
[03:09] <cprofitt> opacity of which element?
[03:21] <Vantrax> the top section is ok
[03:21] <Vantrax> the lower half should all be lighter
[03:22] <cprofitt> K
[03:22] <cprofitt> I used white text... and readability seems fine...
[03:22] <cprofitt> for black I agree it would need to be darker
[03:22] <cprofitt> I mean lighter
[03:22] <cprofitt> lol
[03:40] <doctormo_> pleia2: I almost got the video done for the ground control project, but some last minute niggle killed those plans, so I'm hoping tomorrow will fair better.
[04:18] <pleia2> yay ground control video
[18:53] <Pendulum> cjohnston: have you heard from everyone with intros and outlines yet?
[18:58] <cprofitt> Pendulum: I added mine, but have not gotten any feedback yet
[19:00] <Pendulum> cprofitt: I think yours looks good :)
[19:00] <cprofitt> thanks.
[19:21] <starcraftman> Pendulum: just a note, I submitted my intro and outline. I also wrote my whole presentation and pastebinned. Will work on it some more before, but it's a good basic.
[19:21] <starcraftman> pastebin is on my outline page if ya want a preview.
[19:25] <Pendulum> starcraftman: I noticed, thank you :)
[19:25] <Pendulum> Outline looked good :)
[19:27] <starcraftman> Pendulum: np, your welcome. Now I'll get back to stripping my recently RIP pc, a sad day.
[22:33] <cjohnston> uggh.. Anyone seen nigel today?
[22:50] <Hellow> cjohnston, Not so far.
[22:56] <cjohnston> pleia2: ?
[23:31] <cprofitt_> so how many instructors have dropped?
[23:33] <doctormo> cprofitt_: dropped?