[00:00] <TheMuso`> rickspencer3: Whenever you're ready.
[00:00] <rickspencer3> TheMuso`, almost done updating the wiki
[00:03] <TheMuso`> ok
[00:04] <rickspencer3> TheMuso`, I updated the wiki
[00:04]  * rickspencer3 notices that robert_ancell is gone :(
[00:05] <TheMuso`> rickspencer3: ok
[00:07] <TheMuso`> Re audioo, theres no real change since last week, appart from the crack of the day alsa-driver packages being in the ubuntu-audio-dev PPA now, and a new bugfix snapshot of pulseaudio being in lucid, that was crimsun's call.
[00:07] <rickspencer3> TheMuso`, did that snapshot need coordination with the kernel at all?
[00:07] <TheMuso`> rickspencer3: No.,'
[00:08] <TheMuso`> rickspencer3: Just has bugfixes since 0.9.21 in it.
[00:08] <rickspencer3> ok
[00:08]  * robert_ancell rushes in
[00:08] <rickspencer3> hi robert_ancell
[00:08] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3, TheMuso, hi
[00:08] <rickspencer3> so, I put the wiki for the meeting today in teh wrong year :(
[00:09] <rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-01-19
[00:09] <rickspencer3> as bryyce just pointed out to me
[00:09] <robert_ancell> heh
[00:09] <bryyce> heya all
[00:09] <robert_ancell> bryyce, keeping the second y?
[00:09] <bryyce> robert_ancell, yyeah
[00:09] <robert_ancell> broken keyboard :)
[00:10]  * rickspencer3 fixes
[00:10] <bryyce> too busyy to sort it out
[00:10] <TheMuso> heh
[00:10] <crimsun> rickspencer3: I'm very, very conservative with userspace uploads that touch core audio components. For example, the actual upstream stable-queue branch only recently gained all the fixes we've carried.
[00:10]  * rickspencer3 drums fingers waiting for wiki to save
[00:11] <rickspencer3> thanks crimsun
[00:12] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell, so, if you look at the meeting minutes, you may find that you are mentioned there
[00:12] <rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-01-19
[00:12] <rickspencer3> :)
[00:12]  * robert_ancell reading...
[00:13]  * robert_ancell still wating to load...
[00:13]  * robert_ancell ...
[00:14] <robert_ancell> oh I see
[00:14] <rickspencer3> not exactly going fast today, is it?
[00:14] <robert_ancell> nope
[00:14] <bryyce> rickspencer3, in the past when we've had wiki be sluggish, there was something mdz or the IT team did which suddenly sped it up (dunno what)
[00:15] <bryyce> maybe restart the webserver or clear a cache or something.  might be worth inquiring about if it stays slow for a while
[00:15] <rickspencer3> anywho, robert_ancell, thoughts about dedicating a week to gnome-panel speed up?
[00:15] <rickspencer3> bryyce, ack, will do
[00:15] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3, fine by me
[00:15] <rickspencer3> great
[00:16] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I was going to suggest the week that we are sprinting
[00:17] <rickspencer3> ok, so let's see
[00:17] <robert_ancell> works for me
[00:18] <Nafai> btw, hopefully not too OT, but has anyone successfully installed the virtual box guest extensions in a Lucid guest on a Karmic host?
[00:18] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell, TheMuso looking over the wiki, I guess the only thing to call out is that I am pretty concerned about startup speed
[00:18] <Nafai> I'm getting compile errors when trying to install them :(
[00:19] <robert_ancell> right
[00:19] <bryyce> Nafai, we're in a meeting at the moment, and -desktop doesn't maintain vbox so another channel might be more appropriate for your question
[00:19] <rickspencer3> TheMuso, robert_ancell sorry the Eastern Edition was a bit disjointed
[00:19] <TheMuso> rickspencer3: np
[00:19] <rickspencer3> any comments, questions about the minutes?
[00:20] <TheMuso> Not from me.
[00:20] <Nafai> bryyce: sorry, thanks
[00:20] <robert_ancell> nope
[00:20] <rickspencer3> TheMuso, I assigned a bug to you last week, apparantly an accessability related script was failing at install time
[00:20] <rickspencer3> do you recall what happened to it?
[00:22] <TheMuso> rickspencer3: Yes, its taken care of, twas partly a packaging bug, and partly a python-central bug.
[00:23] <rickspencer3> thanks TheMuso
[00:23] <TheMuso> np
[00:23] <rickspencer3> that's it from me, unless you guys have other business?
[00:23] <TheMuso> no
[00:24] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell, any other business?
[00:24] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3, no
[00:25] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell, have you made gnome-panel go fast yet?
[00:25] <rickspencer3> j/k
[00:25] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3, no, I left that for you to do :)
[00:25] <rickspencer3> well, I keep making threats, but I think it knows they are empty threats
[00:25] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3, btw photobomb looks good
[00:25] <rickspencer3> as a manager, I don't have much more recourse
[00:26] <rickspencer3> photobomb :)
[00:26] <rickspencer3> have you tried it?
[00:26] <rickspencer3> I was quite surprised to see it actually worked on a computer that I didn't develop it on
[00:26] <rickspencer3> even the web cam
[00:26] <robert_ancell> not yet, I was thinking of integrating scanning support... And then I remembered a new years resolution to stop trying to do too many things at once :)
[00:27] <robert_ancell> have you integrated it into f-spot yet?
[00:27] <robert_ancell> oh, I took a Dell mini on my holidays and used F-Spot exclusively.  Not a great experience
[00:30] <rickspencer3> hmmm
[00:30] <rickspencer3> integrated *into* f-spot?
[00:30] <rickspencer3> hmm, I see it as a very different app
[00:31] <rickspencer3> it's just supposed to be for fun
[00:31] <robert_ancell> I mean, able to pull photos from your photo collection.  I guess they're not well enough tagged.
[00:31] <rickspencer3> my target audience is my 10 year old daughter
[00:31] <rickspencer3> oh
[00:31] <robert_ancell> It would be cool to "put in a photo of dad"
[00:31] <rickspencer3> hmmm
[00:32] <rickspencer3> so there is a tag database that you can just query?
[00:32] <rickspencer3> aren't the tags part of the photo header?
[00:32] <robert_ancell> I think it's all in an sqlite db
[00:33] <robert_ancell> like rhythmbox, you have tags in the mp3s and rhythmbox also contains a database of them
[00:33] <rickspencer3> I guess I could look for the database, and it's there, search that
[00:33] <rickspencer3> if it's not, I could just grovel through the images in Pictures
[00:33] <robert_ancell> I'm hoping they'd have an API but dunno
[00:34] <rickspencer3> well, if it's sql, there is always "SELECT * FROM "
[00:35] <kklimonda> hmm.. it sounds like an actual use case for tracker - I guess it's the first one ;)
[00:35] <rickspencer3> lol
[00:35] <rickspencer3> not really
[00:35] <rickspencer3> tbh, I think it works well to just look in the Pictures directory ;)
[00:36] <rickspencer3> what I really want is Gwibber integration
[00:36] <rickspencer3> I think photobomb really wants to get pictures from your feeds and to send them to FB (as well as your feeds)
[00:55] <hyperair> chrisccoulson: i think i've figured out why suspend/hibernate don't poke open the screensaver upon resuming.
[00:55] <chrisccoulson> hyperair - cool
[00:55] <chrisccoulson> what do you think the issue is?
[00:56] <chrisccoulson> it's difficult for me to investigate issues like that, as my machine doesn't resume :P
[00:56] <hyperair> chrisccoulson: the problem is that gpm removed any method of manually triggering a suspend/hibernate without the suspend key.
[00:56] <hyperair> hence everything connects directly to dkp
[00:56] <hyperair> gnome-do does, and so does indicator-session
[00:56] <chrisccoulson> ah yes, of course
[00:56] <hyperair> yeah, so it bypasses gpm completely
[00:57] <hyperair> i think what's needed is for gpm to reintroduce the interface.
[00:57] <chrisccoulson> g-p-m isn't going to reintroduce the interface. what we really need is to be able to hook on to suspend / resume events via devkit-power-gobject
[00:57] <hyperair> hmm
[00:57] <hyperair> i see.
[00:58] <hyperair> that makes sense.
[00:58] <chrisccoulson> then we can get rid of all these silly hooks everywhere to lock / unlock screensavers / keyrings etc
[00:58] <hyperair> yes, i agree.
[00:58] <chrisccoulson> gnome-screensaver could just listen for the events and lock / unlock as appropriate
[00:58] <hyperair> ah yes. you're very right.
[00:58] <chrisccoulson> thanks for spotting that though
[00:58] <hyperair> np
[00:58] <chrisccoulson> although it's not an easy one to fix unfortunately
[00:59] <hyperair> since i've dug through gpm code recently, it's only natural for me to continue poking around with easy-to-reach bugs
[00:59] <chrisccoulson> heh, thanks
[00:59] <hyperair> fix as many as possible while it stays fresh =p
[00:59] <hyperair> so i guess the issue has to be forwarded to dkp upstream?
[01:00] <hyperair> or has the issue been brought up before?
[01:00] <chrisccoulson> i've noticed that g-p-m has a mountain of bugs. it could really use some effort from someone to go through those, see which ones are still relevant and triage some of the untouched ones etc
[01:00] <hyperair> right
[01:00] <chrisccoulson> i think the issue has been bought up before, when we had to add a hook in gnome-session for locking the screensaver
[01:00] <hyperair> i was actually sifting through pm-utils bugs when i stumbled across a lot of these gpm ones though
[01:00] <chrisccoulson> and the session applet has similar code as well, which is just silly
[01:00] <hyperair> session applet?
[01:01] <chrisccoulson> the indicator-session menu
[01:01] <hyperair> ah
[01:01] <hyperair> indicator-session
[01:01] <hyperair> yeah, i saw
[01:10] <hyperair> chrisccoulson: could you file the bug upstream? i think you've a clearer idea about what needs to be done for dkp regarding the new signals.
[01:10] <chrisccoulson> hyperair - yeah, no problem.
[01:10] <hyperair> chrisccoulson: thanks.
[01:10] <chrisccoulson> i'll have to look at that in the morning though, as i'm going to bed shortly
[01:11] <rickspencer3> g'night chrisccoulson
[01:12] <hyperair> sure
[01:12] <hyperair> good night
[01:12] <chrisccoulson> 'night rickspencer and hyperair
[01:38]  * Nafai tries to figure out how to get this building in a pbuilder
[03:22] <Nafai> okay, got that working
[07:47] <didrocks> good morning
[08:26] <pitti> Good morning
[08:27] <didrocks> hey pitti
[08:36] <pitti> bonjour didrocks, how are you?
[08:37] <seb128_> hey there
[08:37] <pitti> bonjour seb128
[08:37] <didrocks> pitti: good, thanks, and you? :)
[08:37] <didrocks> salut seb128!
[08:37] <pitti> c'est bon
[08:38] <seb128> hey pitti didrocks!
[08:51] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson
[08:51] <chrisccoulson> hey seb128, how are you?
[08:52] <seb128> good thank
[08:52] <seb128> how are you?
[08:52] <chrisccoulson> yeah, not too bad thanks. a little less tired today
[08:54] <seb128> good
[08:54] <pitti> chrisccoulson: still trouble sleeping?
[08:54] <pitti> chrisccoulson: good morning
[08:55] <chrisccoulson> hey pitti. i don't really have trouble sleeping - it's just that i normally stay up far too late ;)
[08:55] <chrisccoulson> i struggle getting to bed once i've started something
[08:57] <pitti> I guess everyone has that problem
[08:57] <seb128> I've it too for sure
[08:57] <pitti> if I try, my brain just keeps working :)
[08:58] <chrisccoulson> heh :)
[08:59] <chrisccoulson> pitti - do you know if devkit-power-gobject is likely to grow any signalling for suspend / resume events any time soon?
[09:00] <chrisccoulson> it seems we have to have hacks in lots of places at the moment to deal with things which should happen at suspend/resume
[09:00] <chrisccoulson> eg, locking the screensaver ;)
[09:00] <seb128> hey njpatel_
[09:04] <njpatel_> morning seb128
[09:06] <pitti> hey njpatel_, good morning
[09:07] <njpatel_> morning pitti
[09:07] <didrocks> hey njpatel_, chrisccoulson
[09:08] <chrisccoulson> hey didrocks
[09:09] <njpatel> didrocks, hey dude -- did you get an updated wncksync package yesterday?
[09:10] <didrocks> njpatel: I got an updated tarball yes, the package is near to be ready. I'll work on that this afternoon
[09:11] <njpatel> didrocks, awesome, thanks
[09:16] <seb128> njpatel, do we need the gnome-desktop patch which is in this source too btw?
[09:16] <rodrigo_> hmm, how do I copy a lucid package in the same ppa to karmic?
[09:16] <rodrigo_>  lp doesn't let me do that
[09:16] <seb128> rodrigo_, you can't, it's the other way around
[09:17] <rodrigo_> oh
[09:17] <seb128> you need to upload to karmic and copy to lucid
[09:17] <rodrigo_> grr
[09:17] <seb128> since lucid binaries will have newer depends, ie pick the new gtk etc
[09:17] <seb128> so you can't make sure it works on karmic
[09:17] <seb128> the other way around works
[09:17] <njpatel> seb128, Ideally, it would make the matching a bit better for those applications still using libgnome-desktop
[09:18] <rodrigo_> seb128, ok
[09:18] <seb128> njpatel, do you want to get that change in lucid?
[09:18] <seb128> njpatel, in which case could somebody open a bug in launchpad and GNOME for tracking?
[09:19] <njpatel> seb128, I think we do -- but I'll ask DBO to make sure
[09:19] <seb128> ok thanks
[09:19] <seb128> tseliot, hey
[09:20] <tseliot> hi seb128
[09:20] <seb128> tseliot, I didn't manage to test gdm without those changes
[09:20] <seb128> I can't get a working xorg without those
[09:20] <seb128> tseliot, but booting without splash workaround the issue
[09:21] <tseliot> seb128: ok, I'll look more into this issue then
[09:22] <seb128> it's a first boot thing only
[09:22] <seb128> ie if I restart gdm it works
[09:22] <seb128> and happens only when using plymouth
[09:22] <seb128> let me know if you need extra details
[09:22] <seb128> tseliot, thanks
[09:22] <tseliot> seb128: do you know what code is used in gdm for guest sessions and user switching?
[09:23] <seb128> no
[09:23] <seb128> but pitti might know better
[09:23] <tseliot> ok
[09:28] <seb128> tseliot, one thing I changed after comments on #ubuntu-x is to make gdm call initctl with the directory specified since it's not in the path and that leaded to an error
[09:29] <seb128> but that seems to not be enough to fix the issue there
[09:29] <baptistemm> hello & good morning
[09:29] <seb128> hey baptistemm
[09:30] <pitti> seb128: user switching and first time login are _mostly_ the same: it fires up an X server, launches a mini GNOME-session (gdm-simple-slave), and then runs the user session in that x server
[09:30] <pitti> sorry, tseliot  ^
[09:31] <pitti> tseliot: there is one important difference, however: on first start, gdm forces the X server to start on vt7 (to not race with getty), on subsequent starts X.org automatically picks the next free one
[09:31] <pitti> seb128: when X was acting up, could you confirm that it was indeed running on VT7? I think I once had a case where X was on VT1
[09:31] <seb128> it was
[09:32] <seb128> I get xorg running on vt7
[09:32] <seb128> and apparently the new server tries to open the same vt
[09:32] <pitti> ok
[09:32] <seb128> chrisccoulson got 2 xorgs on vt7
[09:32] <seb128> seems that there the second xorg fails and I get a text vt over xorg
[09:33] <chrisccoulson> heh, yeah, 2 xorgs on the same VT was pretty strange
[09:43] <tseliot> pitti: ok, thanks
[09:52] <didrocks> pitti, seb128: what do you think about the "let's user choose the default session on gdmsetup"? As most of user will have already been logged in once, they won't use that feature. I'm afraid of receving tons of bugs "selecting session on gdmsetup is not working" as we won't change ~/.dmrc
[09:53] <pitti> didrocks: it would be nice to get it into gdmsetup, but it's more like a bonus; you can always log out and set it in gdm itself
[09:54] <didrocks> pitti: don't you think user will confuse "default session when you haven't logged in one yet" (which is what gdmsetup does) and "my previous session in ~/.dmrc"?
[09:54] <pitti> ah, that's what you mean
[09:54] <pitti> but does that happen?
[09:54] <pitti> i. e. does it really write .dmrc if you didn't change anything?
[09:55] <pitti> (if so, we should fix that)
[09:55] <didrocks> hum, good point, not sure
[09:55] <didrocks> I'll make some tests
[09:55] <pitti> seb128: ah, on the dupe retracer crashing again, I see what it's complaining about
[09:55] <seb128> speaking of default session there is a bug about "using failsafe once should not mean it should became default"
[09:55] <didrocks> ok, so, this dialog will only be useful is the user doesn't change anything session related
[09:55] <seb128> if somebody wants to fix it... ;-)
[09:56] <seb128> pitti, ok
[09:56] <didrocks> seb128: I can have a look at the same time. what is the bug #.
[09:56] <didrocks> ?
[09:58] <mat_t> pitti: Hello
[09:58] <pitti> hey mat_t, how's it going?
[09:58] <mat_t> pitti: hey, not too bad, you?
[09:59] <pitti> I'm great, thanks
[09:59] <mat_t> good to hear :)
[09:59] <mat_t> pitti: will you have time for a very quick call this morning?
[10:00] <mat_t> pitti: got couple of questions re mp3 codecs installation process
[10:00]  * hyperair wonders what black magic was needed to get xorg running on vt1
[10:00] <pitti> mat_t: in something like an hour?
[10:00] <mat_t> pitti: sure, perfect!
[10:00] <seb128> you can ask on the channel too
[10:00] <seb128> I don't think pitti is the one who know most about that
[10:00] <seb128> without offense for you pitti ;-)
[10:00] <mat_t> seb128: :)
[10:01] <seb128> it''s rather a slomo mvo thing
[10:01] <pitti> seb128 is right
[10:01] <seb128> I can probably reply too
[10:01] <mat_t> seb128: I see - thanks :)
[10:02] <mat_t> seb128: basically, I'm now testing what happens when the user double-clicks on the mp3 file on a clean install of alpha 2
[10:02] <mat_t> seb128: or if they try to import the file into rhythmbox
[10:02] <mat_t> seb128: and I'm getting some strange errors, basically failing to install the codecs
[10:03] <seb128> didrocks, bug #509182
[10:03] <seb128> didrocks, ^ the bug number
[10:03] <seb128> mat_t, what error exactly?
[10:03] <seb128> mat_t, do you get the code install application triggering?
[10:03] <mat_t> seb128: hold on, let me paste you a screenshot
[10:04] <mat_t> seb128: first problem is that the file is being opened in Totem by default, rather than in Rhythmbox
[10:04] <seb128> that's not a problem nor a bug
[10:04] <seb128> totem is a play quickly once software
[10:05] <seb128> it's what you want to have a quick look to movie or song
[10:05] <seb128> rhythmbox is slow to start and will import the song
[10:05] <seb128> I don't want to import the song I downloaded usually, I click on those to see if it's good etc
[10:05] <seb128> and it if it is I move it to my music collection
[10:06] <didrocks> seb128: thanks
[10:06] <seb128> well we might disagree on that
[10:06] <seb128> but it's by design right now
[10:06] <mat_t> ok I see
[10:06] <mat_t> anyhow
[10:06] <mat_t> http://uploadpie.com/CYMvF
[10:06] <mat_t> seb128: ^
[10:07] <seb128> do you have universe enable?
[10:07] <seb128> we can't distribute those codecs for legal reasons
[10:07] <mat_t> seb128: It's a clean install of alpha 2
[10:07] <seb128> did you enable universe in the software sources?
[10:07] <mat_t> without any mods
[10:07] <seb128> is the box connected to internet?
[10:07] <seb128> did you get a sources update since install?
[10:07] <seb128> mvo, ^
[10:08] <mat_t> I'm getting the same error regardless whether it is connected or not
[10:08] <mvo> mat_t: hi, hm - could you please do me a favor and run "sudo apt-get update" and test it again?
[10:08] <mat_t> and I literally installed Ubuntu and run it, did not enable/disable anything
[10:09] <mat_t> mvo: sure
[10:09] <mvo> mat_t: I suspect the problem is that universe is enabled, but apt-get update was not run yet, the files are not on the livefs
[10:09] <mvo> mat_t: there is a bug open about this, it caused issues with software-center as well for karmic
[10:09] <mvo> mat_t: let me search for the bugnumber
[10:09] <mat_t> mvo: ok, cool
[10:09]  * mat_t runs apt-get update
[10:10] <seb128> I can confirm it finds things to install there
[10:10] <seb128> so the codec installer is not broken
[10:10] <seb128> it's likely an universe source issue
[10:12] <mat_t> mvo: seb128: ok, it works after running apt-get update
[10:13] <mvo> bug #105511
[10:14] <mvo> mat_t: could you still please file a bug -I think we need some code in the codec installer to notice this
[10:15] <mat_t> mvo: ok, will do
[10:15] <mat_t> mvo: what is the package I should file the bug against?
[10:16] <mvo> mat_t: please use gnome-codec-installer for now
[10:16] <mat_t> ok, thanks mvo!
[10:16] <mvo> mat_t: I will reassign if needed - and give me the bugnumber once its there so that I can put it on my radar
[10:16] <mat_t> sure
[10:16]  * mvo has a much smaller radar than say seb128
[10:16] <seb128> lol
[10:16] <mat_t> :)
[10:16]  * seb128 hugs mvo
[10:17] <mvo> :)
[10:17]  * mvo hugs seb128
[10:20] <mat_t> mvo: oops, gnome-codec-installer doesn't seem to exist...
[10:21] <seb128> install
[10:21] <mat_t> thx :)
[10:32] <mat_t> mvo: bug #510033
[10:33] <mvo> thanks mat_t
[10:33] <mat_t> np :)
[10:57] <tseliot> seb128: are you getting 2 xservers on the same vt too or was it only chrisccoulson?
[10:57] <seb128> only chrisccoulson
[10:58] <seb128> it looks like the second xserver fails to start there
[10:58] <seb128> so I get the text vt over xorg
[10:59] <tseliot> with a mouse cursor, right?
[10:59] <seb128> yes
[10:59] <tseliot> ok
[10:59] <seb128> I get the mouse cursors on all vts
[10:59] <seb128> ie switching to vt1, 2 etc
[10:59] <seb128> it's still there
[11:01] <tseliot> my guess is that nothing stopped X and gdm is saving the content of the vt and is using it as a background
[11:02] <tseliot> it should be possible to reproduce this only with -ati and -inteò
[11:02] <tseliot> intel
[11:03] <chrisccoulson> tseliot - this was from my machine last night: http://paste.ubuntu.com/359153/
[11:04] <chrisccoulson> i had bits of both users desktops on the same VT, with 2 working mouse cursors
[11:04] <chrisccoulson> it was really strange
[11:05] <seb128> tseliot, I'm using intel
[11:06] <tseliot> chrisccoulson: it's rather interesting to see that the first xserver was launched with -nr while the 2nd was launched with -bg
[11:06] <tseliot> seb128: yes, only -intel and -ati (are patched to) support that feature
[11:08] <chrisccoulson> tseliot - what is the significance of -nr and -bg?
[11:09] <tseliot> chrisccoulson: -bg specifies the background colour while -nr tells X not to have a background (i.e. not to wipe what's already in the framebuffer)
[11:10] <tseliot> with -nr we can save what we have on screen and make a nice transition in gdm
[11:10] <chrisccoulson> tseliot - ah, ok. thanks
[11:17] <tseliot> chrisccoulson: oh, wait, the 2nd X was launched with -br
[11:17] <tseliot> not bg
[11:27] <mat_t> mvo: can I ask you one more question?
[11:28] <seb128> tseliot, Xorg.1.log has some errors there
[11:28] <mat_t> mvo: do you know why this dialog is being displayed: http://uploadpie.com/lzdq4 ? Seems like an unnecessary step - another words, why would I *not* want to search for a plugin? :)
[11:28] <seb128> [drm] failed to set drm interface version
[11:28] <seb128> Failed to become DRM master
[11:29] <seb128> failed to get ressources: Bad file descriptor
[11:29] <seb128> Kernel modesetting setup failed
[11:29] <seb128> Screen(s) found, but none have a usable configuration
[11:29] <tseliot> seb128: can you upload the full log, please?
[11:33] <seb128> tseliot, will do that in a few minutes
[11:33] <tseliot> ok
[11:44] <seb128> tseliot, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/Xorg.1.log
[11:44] <tseliot> thanks
[11:45] <seb128> tseliot, sorry I had to run for lunch
[11:45] <tseliot> np
[11:45] <seb128> (very quick lunch today apparently)
[11:45] <tseliot> :-)
[11:46] <tseliot> seb128: just to be clear, does the log come from Chris' computer?
[11:47] <seb128> no, from mine
[11:47] <seb128> my mini10v
[11:47] <seb128> I don't get the double xorg issue there
[11:47] <seb128> I get "xorg seems to try to start but fails and I get a text vt instead"
[11:47] <tseliot> seb128: ok, so we're dealing with separate bugs
[11:47] <seb128> which is over vt7
[11:47] <seb128> likely
[11:48] <seb128> let me know if you want to debug this one later
[11:48] <seb128> I'm the mini as a testbox so I can easily get debug infos
[11:48] <tseliot> but if you get a cursor and you can move it I guess that maybe only the 2nd X is failing?
[11:52] <seb128> yes
[11:52] <seb128> my guess is that second x is failing
[11:52] <seb128> and the text vt goes over vt7
[11:52] <seb128> which has my running xorg
[11:52] <seb128> processes are still running
[11:53] <seb128> chrisccoulson get something similar but where the second xserver success to start
[11:53] <seb128> so we have 2 bugs at least
[11:53] <seb128> one being the second xserver failing there
[11:53] <seb128> and one being that the same vt is being used twice
[11:57]  * tseliot nods
[12:02] <chrisccoulson> hey tseliot - what does "-br" do then? (sorry, i had to disappear after your last comment - boss was hanging around)
[12:02] <tseliot> chrisccoulson: that's a good question. I'll look it up
[12:03] <chrisccoulson> tseliot - thanks. it's not something i particularly need to know - i was just curious :)
[12:03] <tseliot> chrisccoulson: I would like to know that, just in case it's some failure in calling -nr and -bg at the same time
[12:05] <seb128> -br makes a background color to be displayed rather than an xorg grid iirc
[12:05] <seb128> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm/+bug/19238
[12:11] <tseliot> seb128: and in what patch can I find that now? Or was it upstreamed?
[12:13] <seb128> daemon/gdm-server.c:        server->priv->command = g_strdup (X_SERVER " -br -verbose");
[12:13] <seb128> tseliot, ^ upstreamed
[12:15] <tseliot> seb128: ok, thanks
[12:20] <tseliot> chrisccoulson: did you boot with "splash" when you noticed that problem with two xservers?
[12:21] <tseliot> chrisccoulson: or maybe you didn't have plymouth installed?
[12:23] <chrisccoulson> tseliot - i booted with splash
[12:23] <chrisccoulson> i'm not sure if i have plymouth installed
[12:24] <tseliot> ok
[12:24] <chrisccoulson> tseliot - i can't check until i get home from work
[12:25] <tseliot> ok, np
[12:32]  * didrocks hates autohell :/
[12:46] <asac> didrocks: autotools are nice ;)
[12:47] <didrocks> asac: just had some hard time making my build failed. So, that's just an unfair judgement driven by being immediate frustration :)
[12:53] <mvo> mat_t: could you give me that link again? it seem like its not working for me
[12:56] <asac> hehe
[13:26] <pitti> seb128: I moved the WI tracker to people.c.c. now (see announcement), I'm re-using your launchpadlib checkout for gnome-versions
[13:26] <pitti> so, don't break it :)
[13:26] <seb128> pitti, ok :-)
[13:27] <seb128> didrocks, how do you lock the panel une config?
[13:28] <didrocks> seb128: a mandatory gconf key on /apps/panel/general/top_level_id_list
[13:28] <didrocks> toplevel*
[13:28] <seb128> hum ok
[13:29] <seb128> didrocks, thanks
[13:29] <didrocks> y/w :)
[14:26] <tedg> seb128: Good morning! :)
[14:26] <tedg> seb128: I merged in the logging branch to indicator-applet last night.
[14:26] <tedg> seb128: Could you try that on your netbook so we can perhaps see why those menus aren't showing up?
[14:28] <seb128> hey tedg
[14:28] <seb128> tedg, ok, it's indicator-applet only?
[14:29] <tedg> seb128: The source package, but it'll built the indicator-applet-session binary package as well.
[14:29] <tedg> seb128: Both have log files.
[14:29] <seb128> ok
[14:29] <seb128> I will try that in a few minutes
[14:29] <tedg> Great, thanks!
[14:33] <didrocks> seb128: wncksync pushd, you should be able to NEW it when you have time
[14:34] <seb128> didrocks, no, I'm in overflow today
[14:34] <didrocks> ok :)
[14:34] <seb128> trying to get a start at this gnome-panel profiling work and people pinging everywhere
[14:35] <seb128> pitti, ^ could you look at this NEW thing please?
[14:36] <didrocks> good luck :)
[14:36] <pitti> seb128: will do
[14:36] <seb128> pitti, thanks
[14:36] <pitti> seb128: just disconnect from IRC for a while
[14:36] <seb128> I should do that
[14:36] <seb128> this gnome-panel profiling is no fun and I don't progress with all the pings
[14:36] <seb128> tedg, applet-main.c:301: error: ‘INDICATOR_OBJECT_SIGNAL_ENTRY_MOVED’ undeclared (first use in this function)
[14:37] <pitti> /msg seb128 /quit
[14:37] <seb128> ;-)
[14:38] <tedg> seb128: Uhg, you'll need a new libindicator.  But since it doesn't have a version number yet I couldn't change the deps :(
[14:38] <pitti> didrocks: btw, gdmsetup is already a patch by itself, so feel free to just merge your's into that and update the upstream one
[14:38] <tedg> seb128: Sorry about that.
[14:38] <seb128> tedg, that's ok
[14:39] <didrocks> pitti: yes, but do you think I should merge 15_default_session.patch too?
[14:39] <pitti> bjf: hey
[14:40] <pitti> bjf: so which response "path" were you using for the audio symptom to get to the speaker test?
[14:40] <pitti> didrocks: oh, right, I'm confused
[14:40] <pitti> didrocks: nevermind me
[14:40] <pitti> didrocks: the gdmsetup and gdmsetup_defaultsession ones can be merged once default_session goes upstream
[14:41]  * pitti sighs at our gdm patch stack
[14:41] <didrocks> pitti: that was my plan, hoping the default session will be merged upstream :)
[14:41] <didrocks> right, that's frightening
[14:41] <pitti> didrocks: I hope gdmsetup will be, too; it might not be nice, but it's much better than nothing
[14:41] <didrocks> pitti: I read a blog post some days ago, let me search it
[14:42] <pitti> and if other distros really don't like it, they don't need to  ship it
[14:42] <didrocks> pitti: http://blogs.fedoraproject.org/wp/mclasen/2010/01/15/old-promises/
[14:43] <mclasen> yeah, I got the login options (somewhat) working last night
[14:44] <bjf> pitti, I had "Playback do3s not work, or is crackling" selected
[14:44] <pitti> bjf: hm, so did I
[14:44] <pitti> I press ok, say yes to the "have you checked that your sound system is plugged in, and turned on?" question
[14:44] <bjf> pitti, "Yes" to the "Hve you checked that your sound system is plugged in,"
[14:44] <pitti> then leave the default name of the affected sound card
[14:44] <bjf> pitti, same
[14:44] <pitti> and then it's done
[14:45] <bjf> pitti, the I get the speaker test
[14:45] <pitti> bjf: ah, perhaps it's because I have both an internal and an usb sound card (from the headset)
[14:45] <pitti> hm, no, that's not it
[14:45] <pitti> I still get the "which sound card" question
[14:46] <pitti> just without the headset now
[14:46] <bjf> pitti, could be, also I got the latest code from bzr before trying
[14:46] <bjf> pitti, not sure if there were any changes
[14:46] <pitti> bjf: so did I, latest from an hour ago
[14:46] <chrisccoulson> mclasen - that dialog looks sweet :)
[14:46] <pitti> ok, so seems it's something local then
[14:46] <bjf> pitti, same here
[14:47] <pitti> bjf: I'll debug it here then; thanks!
[14:47] <bjf> pitti, np
[14:47] <pitti> didrocks: wncksync> lots of cruft in the diff.gz..
[14:48] <pitti> didrocks: that's because it's a bzr head snapshot, not really the 0.2.3 release, is it?
[14:48] <didrocks> pitti: I know, it's the same on notify-osd with bzr merge mode
[14:49] <didrocks> pitti: also, had to clean a proper licensing on wncksync examples too
[14:49] <pitti> didrocks: the diff.gz has COPYING.LGPL
[14:49] <pitti> that's very suspicious
[14:49] <didrocks> oh?
[14:49] <pitti> didrocks: and almost certainly wrong either way
[14:49] <didrocks> let me check
[14:49] <pitti> either something in the orig.tar.gz is under LGPL, then it must be in the orig.tar.gz
[14:49] <pitti> and if not, it's just cruft
[14:50] <pitti> didrocks: also, why does wncksyncdaemon explicitly depends on libwncksync0 (= ${binary:Version}) ? that should be covered by shlibs
[14:50] <pitti> (same with libwncksync-glib)
[14:50] <pitti> didrocks: and libwncksync-glib is missing a soname suffix
[14:50] <didrocks> oh, DBO didn't take the last changes from trunk njpatel did
[14:51] <pitti> what is DBO/
[14:51] <pitti> ?
[14:51] <seb128> who is
[14:51] <seb128> dxteam member
[14:51] <pitti> ah, thanks
[14:52] <didrocks> pitti: about the dep, let me check, but I was thinking it wasn't properly set. Trying without them
[14:52] <njpatel> didrocks, I think it's my fault, I forgot to push
[14:52] <pitti> didrocks: yep, orig.tar.gz missing COPYING.LGPL
[14:52] <njpatel> didrocks, I'll merge his work and make a new package, is that okay
[14:53] <pitti> a new upstream version tarball with all the code changes plus COPYING.LGPL would be nice
[14:53] <didrocks> njpatel: please, it will be 0.2.4?
[14:53] <didrocks> pitti: trying to fix the remaining stuff in the meanwhile
[14:53] <njpatel> didrocks, yep
[14:53] <pitti> didrocks: want a mail, or is above IRC enough?
[14:53] <didrocks> pitti: it's enough, thx
[14:54] <pitti> didrocks: ok, rejecting for now; please ping me if you have a new upload
[14:54] <didrocks> ok
[14:57] <didrocks> pitti, njpatel: wncksyncdaemon has no dep on library if I remove them explicitely. Is that intented? (the daemon use no symbol from the libs? http://paste.ubuntu.com/359568/)
[14:58] <njpatel> didrocks, yeah, the lib is a way to talk to the daemon
[14:58] <didrocks> and the lib should depends on the daemon? what happened if the lib is installed without the daemon?
[14:59] <njpatel> didrocks, https://edge.launchpad.net/wncksync/0.2/0.2.4 is the latest release, with both dbo's and my changes
[15:00] <njpatel> didrocks, the lib depends on the daemon, but the daemon can run without the lib
[15:00] <didrocks> njpatel: perfect, thanks, pull now and adds the dep on the daemon :)
[15:03] <didrocks> njpatel: libwncksync-glib should also depend on the daemon/the other lib/nothing?
[15:05] <dpm> hi pitti, I've noticed that the translations of .desktop files which contain X-GNOME-FullName entries are not shown in Lucid (they are correctly extracted, imported to and exported from LP, though). Any suggestions on which package should I file a bug against?
[15:05] <dpm> I've seen this in Evolution, Rhythmbox and Empathy
[15:06] <njpatel> didrocks, I think -glib should pull down both the lib and daemon
[15:07] <didrocks> njpatel: ok
[15:07] <seb128> dpm, there is already a bug about that I think
[15:07] <seb128> dpm, it's like glib
[15:07] <seb128> likely
[15:07] <didrocks> pitti: libgiowncksync.so soname is… libgiowncksync.so in http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html, it's writtent to reject such package :) what should I do?
[15:08] <pitti> didrocks: does that go into /usr/lib/ or  /usr/lib/gio/modules/ ?
[15:08] <seb128> didrocks, that's not a public library
[15:08] <pitti> didrocks: in the latter case, just install it into the daemon package
[15:09] <seb128> didrocks, library have libname.so.major.minor.revision
[15:09] <pitti> seb128: don't worry, I'll sort it out
[15:09] <seb128> pitti, thanks ;-)
[15:09] <didrocks> ok, and so, I just install it the daemon package, right?
[15:09] <seb128> so gnome-panel does load applets asynchonously
[15:09] <pitti> didrocks: correct
[15:09] <didrocks> ok, thanks
[15:09] <seb128> rickspencer3, pitti: ^ (gnome-panel comment)
[15:10] <seb128> I've changed it to load them synchronously just to see
[15:10] <seb128> * bonobo-activation: 0.3 second
[15:10] <seb128> * indicator-applet, session menu: 1.6 seconds
[15:10] <seb128> * clock applet: 0.8 second
[15:10] <seb128> * null applet?: 0.1 second
[15:10] <seb128> * notification area: 1 second (but busy 0.1 second?)
[15:10] <seb128> * indicator-applet: message: 1 second
[15:10] <dpm> ok, thanks seb128, I'll look for the bug and if there isn't, I'll file one
[15:10] <rickspencer3> seb128, where, what huh?
[15:10] <seb128> rickspencer3, well look on the charts, the applets start together
[15:10] <pitti> hey rickspencer3
[15:10] <seb128> not waiting for the previous to be done
[15:11] <seb128> dpm, that's a known issue
[15:11] <rickspencer3> seb128, you are saying that gnome panel is already loading applets appropriately?
[15:12] <seb128> yes
[15:12] <seb128> and I can't get oprofile or sysprof to give anything useful
[15:12] <seb128> I'm back to stracing with marks in the code to see where we spend time
[15:13] <seb128> the only thing useful I got from sysprof is that 10% time is icon loading
[15:25] <pitti> yay, got my +assignedbugs list below 40
[15:26] <pitti> seb128: so it already starts them all at the same time? so the charts are just misleading then
[15:26] <didrocks> pitti: lp:~didrocks/wncksync/packaging if you want to review by bzr
[15:26] <seb128> pitti, they are not
[15:27] <pitti> didrocks: ah, you're going to push that to lp:ubuntu/wncksync once it's through NEW, right?
[15:27] <seb128> pitti, I mean the charts are not misleading
[15:27] <pitti> seb128: ok
[15:27] <pitti> 16:09:38        seb128 | so gnome-panel does load applets asynchonously
[15:27] <pitti> I misinterpreted then
[15:27] <didrocks> pitti: right, but the source should exists first in ubuntu (I got a reject on dbusmodel yesterday before the source was NEWed)
[15:27] <pitti> didrocks: right
[15:28] <pitti> bzr: ERROR: Not a branch: "bzr+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/~didrocks/wncksync/packaging/
[15:28] <pitti> hmm
[15:28] <didrocks> pitti: hum? https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~didrocks/wncksync/packaging
[15:29] <seb128> pitti, to be clear it starts everything together, it doesn't wait for one to be done
[15:29] <pitti> hm, must've been a hickup; works now
[15:29] <seb128> pitti, the charts show that clearly
[15:32] <pitti> didrocks: no need for versioned provides/replaces/conflicts
[15:32] <pitti> didrocks: the old libwncksync-glib package should always go away, and there's no transitional package anyway (and shouldn't be)
[15:32] <didrocks> pitti: really? I was just following http://wiki.debian.org/Renaming_a_Package
[15:33] <pitti> didrocks: sure, but the versioning is only required if you have a transitional package
[15:33] <pitti> and in turn, a transitional pacakge is only needed for application-like packages which you might explicitly want to install
[15:33] <pitti> libraries should just disappear
[15:33] <didrocks> pitti: oh ok, for automatic removal of the transitional one
[15:33] <didrocks> understood
[15:33] <pitti> didrocks: a simple Conflicts:/Replaces: is enough (no Provides: necessary)
[15:34] <didrocks> changed
[15:34] <seb128> pitti, see http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/bootchart/seb128-laptop-lucid-20100119-6.png
[15:34] <pitti> seb128: blimey, 25 s readahead?
[15:35] <seb128> pitti, that's hdd not ssd
[15:35] <seb128> pitti, this one is from my laptop config
[15:35] <seb128> pitti, but just look at the applets start
[15:35] <seb128> they are almost all aligned
[15:35] <pitti> right, nicely aligned
[15:35] <seb128> that's stock lucid yesterday
[15:36] <pitti> wow, your panel uses almost no CPU
[15:36] <pitti> vino-server is in the stock configuration like that?
[15:36] <seb128> "stock as in not patched"
[15:36] <seb128> no, that's my user session ;-)
[15:36] <seb128> I meant I didn't tweak the panel code yet
[15:36] <pitti> *phew* :)
[15:37] <chrisccoulson> pitti - vino-server is conditionally started based on a gconf key (ie, if desktop sharing is enabled)
[15:37] <seb128> gnome-panel doesn't use that much cpu
[15:37] <seb128> the atom just really sucks
[15:37] <pitti> didrocks: if that's a new upstream release, why does it still have libgnome-desktop.patch and gio.patch?
[15:37] <seb128> my 2 years laptop does much better
[15:37] <pitti> didrocks: (and autogen.sh, m4/util.m4, etc.)
[15:37] <seb128> pitti, the build change which makes applet being showed as different bars also motivated activity there
[15:37] <seb128> motivated -> moved
[15:38] <pitti> ah, right
[15:38] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - perhaps having out-of-process applets is a better long-term solution? if they're all in the gnome-panel process, then they would be started sequentially wouldn't they?
[15:38] <didrocks> pitti: those are from trunk and bzr in merge mode integrate them in the diff
[15:39] <seb128> chrisccoulson, the change was made for memory usage win
[15:39] <pitti> didrocks: ah, I thought 0.2.4 was just released and thus should have everything
[15:39] <seb128> chrisccoulson, not sure that doesn't seem to do a real difference on my charts
[15:39] <pitti> didrocks: I suppose these just aren't shipped in the Makefile.am DIST
[15:39] <pitti> didrocks: nevermind
[15:39] <didrocks> pitti: it has everything, let me try to remove the merge mode in bzr
[15:39] <pitti> chrisccoulson: for the extra cost of a new exec() and linking, though? or are they just fork()ed?
[15:40] <pitti> didrocks: that's fine
[15:40] <pitti> didrocks: merge mode with upstream is fine
[15:40] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm not too sure how it all works with the panel yet
[15:40] <didrocks> pitti: but that adds some crufts in diff.gz, right?
[15:40] <didrocks> (when merging with upstream release branch)
[15:41] <pitti> didrocks: that's not a biggie, I was just curious
[15:41] <pitti> being able to "bzr merge trunk" is good to have
[15:42] <didrocks> right, but we still have some additionnal files we don't want. I'll try to talk to james_w about that :)
[15:42] <pitti> didrocks: don't worry
[15:43] <pitti> didrocks: can you please push your latest dependency fix?
[15:43] <seb128> bah, an empty gnome-panel takes some 2 seconds to start...
[15:43] <pitti> that's something for robert to look into?
[15:43] <seb128> 10% is spent in loading libraries
[15:43] <didrocks> pitti: done
[15:44] <seb128> 10% spent registering to session
[15:44] <seb128> 10% spent reading icons
[15:44] <seb128> 10% spent read fonts
[15:44] <seb128> 10% spent reading translations
[15:48] <pitti> didrocks: seems bzr.lp.net doesn't like me today; still nothing new
[15:49] <didrocks> pitti: it really doesn't like you apparently, even the gui is updated https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~didrocks/wncksync/package :)
[15:49] <pitti> didrocks: no, I'm on r104, and so is the GUI
[15:50] <didrocks> pitti: hum? I see r105
[15:50] <didrocks> pitti: seems you have a proxy issue so :)
[15:50] <pitti> boggle
[15:50] <pitti> I don't have a proxy
[15:50] <didrocks> oups
[15:50] <didrocks> no, wrong like second time
[15:50] <pitti> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~didrocks/wncksync/packaging/changes
[15:50] <pitti> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~didrocks/wncksync/packaging
[15:50] <pitti> both show 104
[15:50] <didrocks> pitti: sorry, it's me, didn't used --remember last time
[15:51] <didrocks> pitti: should be ok now
[15:52] <pitti> didrocks: looks fine; please upload
[15:53] <didrocks> pitti: thanks, done :)
[15:53] <seb128> pitti, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/bootchart/seb-dellmini-lucid-20100120-6.png
[15:53] <seb128> pitti, ^ current mini desktop with gnome-panel loading things in a sync way
[15:54] <seb128> you can see the applets loaded being shifted
[15:54] <seb128> and by how much for each
[15:54] <seb128> I'm not sure why those are not colored
[15:54] <seb128> but I think it's a bootchart bug
[15:55] <seb128> hum, was rather an une type of gnome-panel config
[15:55] <seb128> or list of applets
[15:55] <seb128> but you get the idea
[15:57] <hyperair> pitti: bug #452411 has two verifications (both say it's fixed in the -proposed g-p-m)
[15:57] <pitti> hyperair: yep, saw them
[15:57] <hyperair> =)
[16:09] <didrocks> pitti: thanks for the review and NEWing :)
[16:11] <pitti> didrocks: my pleasure
[16:46] <seb128> $ ls -l /etc/fonts/conf.d | wc -l
[16:46] <seb128> 36
[16:46] <seb128> could we do something to reduce that?
[16:46] <seb128> it takes 0.2 seconds on the ssd disk from the mini to open and read all those
[16:46] <seb128> and 0.6 seconds on my desktop
[16:47] <seb128> I guess most of the time is not reading the few lines there but opening that number of iles
[16:47] <seb128> of files
[16:47] <seb128> pitti, asac: ^
[16:48] <asac> seb128: yes
[16:48] <asac> seb128: we just uploaded 2.8
[16:48] <asac> maybe thats better on its own
[16:48] <seb128> asac, does it has less config files?
[16:48] <asac> seb128: then we can go through that thing and dump a bunch more
[16:49] <asac> imo
[16:49] <seb128> good, thanks
[16:49] <asac> seb128: i dont think we dropped anything in this upload
[16:49] <asac> but we first wanted to merge and  then check for cleanup potential
[16:49] <asac> there are a bunch of duplicaed things in there. i would like to go the aggressive route and remove many
[16:49] <asac> and then readd if regressions are reported ;)
[16:50] <seb128> +1
[16:50] <asac> right. but please check if the upload itself improved it a bit
[16:50] <kees> asac: hi! did you see bug 507744 ?  I'd really like to get that into the distro packages.
[16:52] <ccheney> is there a way to quieten notifications of a person going online/offline, for just that one person, he seems to be flapping which is very annoying, but i don't want to disable notifications altogether
[16:53] <asac> kees: is it ok only for lucid?
[16:53] <ccheney> ah i think i found it "cancel presence notification" is it i am guessing
[16:53]  * ccheney didn't see that before
[16:53] <asac> kees: whats that build glitch about?
[16:54] <ccheney> hmm actually that item seems to claim it does the opposite of what i want
[16:59] <seb128> asac, I will but I doubt it, we tried 2.8 in december
[17:00] <seb128> asac, it didn't make a real difference by then
[17:01] <asac> k
[17:07] <kees> asac: yeah, it's tested on lucid (I don't want it for SRU)
[17:08] <kees> asac: something in the debian/rules file doesn't correctly pass CFLAGS, CXXFLAGS and/or LDFLAGS into the build, so using "hardening-includes" wasn't possible.  I fell back to using hardening-wrapper instead.
[17:08] <kees> asac: i.e. when I added hardening flags from "hardening-includes" to the CFLAGS, CXXFLAGS, and LDFLAGS in debian/rules, they did not reach all the pieces of the build.
[17:09] <asac> kees: what i am talking about is: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kees/xulrunner/xulrunner-1.9.1.head+lp507744/revision/524#debian/patches/fix-build-glitch.patch
[17:10] <kees> asac: oh! I have no idea.  it wouldn't build for me (even unmodified) without that fix.
[17:10]  * seb128 kicks xdg-utils
[17:10] <kees> it's like "make" didn't like the end-of-line-escape ("\") in the middle of a make macro
[17:10] <asac> kees: strange
[17:10] <kees> asac: yeah, very.  if it builds for you without it, cool.
[17:11] <asac> i mean ... that code is upstream code, so why would it stop working with hardening
[17:11] <asac> but i guess you have no idea ;)
[17:12] <kees> asac: no, it wasn't from the hardening.
[17:12] <kees> asac: a stock rebuild for me would fail there
[17:12] <asac> so besides that its just the DEB_: variable and the control?
[17:12] <kees> correct.
[17:13] <kees> the control to get the package installed, and the variable to enable its behavior.
[17:14] <kees> asac: I suspected that some element of the build changed between the last upload and my build.
[17:17] <asac> not sure. our dailies are still happy :)
[17:21] <seb128> xdg-utils postinst
[17:21] <seb128> mkdir /usr/local/share/icons 2>/dev/null || true
[17:21] <seb128> mkdir /usr/local/share/icons/hicolor 2>/dev/null || true
[17:21] <seb128> mkdir /usr/local/share/mime 2>/dev/null || true
[17:21] <seb128> bah
[17:21] <seb128> thanks to that gnome-panel does some 300 extra stat on start
[17:22]  * seb128 wonders why the debian maintainer did that
[17:22] <seb128> (ie stats for each icons subdir since the icon dir is there)
[17:25] <didrocks> oh :/
[17:25] <baptistemm> ouch
[17:25] <seb128> stats are very fast so that's not so much of an issue but still
[17:26] <didrocks> yeah, 300 stats don't make the desktop boot 0.5s later, but still, as you say…
[17:52] <seb128> pitti, did you upload your gnome-panel changes yet?
[17:53] <pitti> seb128: was about to (got dragged to dinner, sorry)
[17:53] <pitti> seb128: should I hold back?
[17:53] <seb128> pitti, I'm about to do a change
[17:53] <seb128> not sure if we want to sneak it in the same upload? or if I should -vversion both revisions?
[17:53] <pitti> seb128: ok, uncommitted my release commit
[17:53] <seb128> ok thanks
[17:54] <pitti> ... and pushed
[17:54] <seb128> pitti, I'm doing the "start things in one phase" change now
[17:54] <seb128> danke
[17:55] <seb128> no revision to pull, hum
[17:55] <seb128> does that has a delay usually?
[17:56] <pitti> seb128: pull --overwrite?
[17:56] <pitti> seb128: I just uncommitted a rev
[17:56] <pitti> not pushed a new one
[17:56] <pitti> sorry for the mess
[17:56] <pitti> I shuold perhaps first dput, then push the debcommit -r
[17:57] <seb128> pitti, worked, thanks
[17:59] <soren> Uncommitting a revision and pushing the branch will not remove it from other people's checkout when they do a pull.
[18:00] <seb128> --overwrite worked
[18:00]  * soren blinks
[18:02] <soren> bzr pull has an --overwrite option? Fascinating.
[18:03] <pitti> sure, just like push
[18:04] <Nafai> bzr is confusing :)
[18:09] <pitti> well, uncommitting is confusing
[18:14] <seb128> pitti, right, I think the tag didn't get uncommited, anyway that's a detail, commited, pushed and uploaded to lucid
[18:15] <pitti> seb128: fontconfig> it's actually surprising that the number of files matter; it should all be ureadaheaded, shouln't it?
[18:15] <seb128> it maybe doesn't
[18:15] <seb128> as said it takes 0.2 second on the ssd
[18:16] <seb128> and 0.6 seconds there
[18:16] <seb128> but it maybe would take the same time with 1 file
[18:18] <jcastro> rickspencer3: it just so happens that andrew starr-b uploaded shotwell this past week.
[18:18] <jcastro> rickspencer3: it's in NEW
[18:18] <rickspencer3> huh
[18:18] <jcastro> rickspencer3: and it so happens that him and another guy are maintaining it in debian as well
[18:18] <jcastro> so I'm going to link them up with the upstream guys.
[18:19] <rickspencer3> jcastro, in any case, why don't the yorba guys hang out here?
[18:19] <jcastro> I don't get the feeling they're an irc-type group.
[18:19] <rickspencer3> they'll get much farther faster that way
[18:19] <rickspencer3> well ...
[18:19] <jcastro> before he sent the mail I sent one about 15 minutes earlier inviting them to hang out here
[18:19] <rickspencer3> maybe you could help them with that
[18:19] <jcastro> indeed
[18:26] <rickspencer3> seb128, I'm looking at music store integration, and ran into this bug:
[18:26] <rickspencer3> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bugs/301875
[18:26] <rickspencer3> shall I re-open it?
[18:26] <rickspencer3> pedro_, ^^
[18:28] <pedro_> rickspencer3, looking for the master one, that's a duplicate
[18:28] <seb128> rickspencer3, it does if those are in your library
[18:29] <seb128> rickspencer3, it doesn't if they are not though
[18:29] <seb128> or something around those line
[18:29] <seb128> let pedro_ look for the bug
[18:29] <rickspencer3> seb128, do you consider that behavior desirable?
[18:30] <rickspencer3> yorba-jim, welcome!
[18:30] <pedro_> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=592546 <- that's the upstream bug
[18:30] <rickspencer3> he everyone, I assume yorba-jim is here to represent for shotwell!
[18:30] <yorba-jim> Yes indeedy!
[18:30] <rickspencer3> pedro_, for the music store integration, I think this needs to be fixed on Ubuntu
[18:31] <rickspencer3> yorba-jim, this is where the ubuntu desktop developers hang out and collaborate
[18:31] <yorba-jim> Great, happy to be here
[18:31] <pitti> njpatel, didrocks: what would it take to move the wcksyncdaemon block from the end of the desktop start to the very beginning? (when not much else is happening just yet)
[18:31] <rickspencer3> so if you guys want to contribute shotwell to the Ubuntu desktop, this is a good place to be, and get to know folks
[18:32] <yorba-jim> great, we'll make more of a habit of signing in
[18:32] <seb128> hey yorba-jim
[18:32] <njpatel> pitti, it's a dbus service, so a dbus-send call?
[18:32] <seb128> what is shotwell?
[18:32] <yorba-jim> hello seb128
[18:32] <pitti> njpatel: right; I'll play around with that tomorrow morning
[18:33] <yorba-jim> Shotwell is a new photo organizer for GNOME.  http://yorba.org/shotwell
[18:33] <seb128> rickspencer3, I don't consider it desirable behaviour but default player is totem so it's not a real issue usually
[18:33] <pitti> njpatel: it's triggered through libwncksync, and that's triggered by the mutter plugin, right?
[18:33] <seb128> rickspencer3, since you will not get rhythmbox by clicking on things
[18:33] <Nafai> yorba-jim: looks nice.  do you like vala?
[18:33] <adam_dingle> hey rickspencer3, are you going to be at FOSDEM?  would be nice to catch up in person
[18:34] <jcastro> hi yorba folks!
[18:34] <pedro_> bug https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=524920 ; might be related too
[18:34] <jcastro> seb128: shotwell .4.2 is in NEW last I checked
[18:34] <yorba-jim> I'm a big fan of Vala.  I wrote an article about it for the GNOME Journal, I'm hoping it'll be in the next ish
[18:34] <pedro_> rickspencer3, will re open the one you found on lp, we don't seem to be tracking the upstream one
[18:34] <rickspencer3> ok
[18:34] <Nafai> yorba-jim: cool
[18:34] <rickspencer3> with music store integration, we need to be  much more mindful of how we handle this
[18:34] <Nafai> it seems interesting, for sure
[18:34] <seb128> rickspencer3, isn't the music store in rhythmbox?
[18:35] <rickspencer3> we *do not want* people buying music and then not being able to play it without jumping through hoops
[18:35] <seb128> rickspencer3, like you access it from the rhythmbox ui and not nautilus?
[18:35] <rickspencer3> seb128, right, so you download an MP3 before you have the codecs installed
[18:35] <seb128> rickspencer3, well ideally it should be like jamendo right now no?
[18:35] <yorba-jim> Nafai: It's really coming along, we're quite pleased with how it's helping us
[18:35] <seb128> rickspencer3, if you download from rhythmbox it's imported in your library and will play
[18:36] <njpatel> pitti, right
[18:36] <seb128> rickspencer3, this bug is an issue only for songs which are not in your library
[18:36] <seb128> rickspencer3, not saying it would not be nice to fix though
[18:38] <rickspencer3> seb128, hmm
[18:38] <rickspencer3> good point that
[18:38] <rickspencer3> if you bought it, it will be in your library
[18:38] <rickspencer3> and Rhythm Box does open, it just doesn't paly
[18:39]  * rickspencer3 notes seb128 is always right ;)
[18:39] <seb128> lol
[18:39]  * pitti waves good night, Taekwondo time
[18:39] <seb128> 'night pitti
[18:39] <seb128> rickspencer3, it does play there
[18:39] <adam_dingle> by the way, at Yorba we've recently been talking about doing some Rhythmbox work
[18:40] <rickspencer3> 'night pitti
[18:40] <rickspencer3> pitti, awesome work btw
[18:40] <rickspencer3> great day
[18:40] <adam_dingle> A major weakness of Rhythmbox is that it can't sync easily to ipods or other music players.  we'd like to change that
[18:40] <Nafai> That is one advantage of Banshee, but I remember it wasn't fine grained enough, it was all or nothing
[18:41] <dobey> rbox works fine with my ipod, but admittedly it is an "ipod color" and i only used it with itunes like once
[18:41] <dobey> ... many years ago
[18:42] <seb128> adam_dingle, the sync work has been done as a SoC project this summer
[18:42] <seb128> it needs to go to trunk still though
[18:42] <seb128> adam_dingle, you might be able to start from there or help them maybe?
[18:45] <didrocks> pitti: sorry, was having my dinner. I can work on that with the dx team tomorrow
[18:45] <yorba-jim> seb128, (adam stepped away) how far along is it?
[18:45] <seb128> yorba-jim, I don't know, the #rhythmbox guys said the code was quite ok
[18:46] <seb128> only a matter of cleaning a bit and making it apply to trunk
[18:46] <yorba-jim> I think we'd be interested in looking at it
[18:47] <yorba-jim> getting an idea of where it's at and how much farther it needs to go
[18:48] <seb128> yorba-jim, that would be great
[18:48] <jjardon> hello :)
[18:48] <seb128> yorba-jim, talk to teuf or moch on irc.gnome.org #rhythmbox
[18:49] <seb128> yorba-jim, they are upstream and know about the details
[18:49] <yorba-jim> got it -- thanks for the ptr
[18:49] <seb128> np
[18:49] <yorba-jim> you don't have a bug # pointing to the patch, do you?
[18:51] <jjardon> seb128, evolution-couchdb doesn't depend on libbonobo, libbonoboui, libgnome, libgnomeui, libgnomecanvas, libgnomevfs . Do you want I fille a bug?
[18:52] <seb128> jjardon, should it depends on all of those?
[18:53] <seb128> yorba-jim, let me look but I think it's rather in git somewhere
[18:53] <jjardon> seb128, no, no depends but they are listed as package dependencies
[18:53] <yorba-jim> seb128: np -- we'll talk to teuf or moch and get the details
[18:54] <seb128> jjardon, you can open a bug yes
[18:56] <didrocks> jjardon: assign it to me, I'll do the cleanage the same time I'll do it for anjuta (if you don't mind, seb128 ;))
[18:56] <seb128> didrocks, go for it
[18:56] <jjardon> didrocks, will do
[18:56] <jjardon> (thanks :))
[18:57] <didrocks> jjardon: thank you for notifying us :)
[19:20] <adam_dingle> seb128, i'm back now.  thanks a lot for the rhythmbox info.  i'd be very interested to check out the syncing patch
[19:33] <jcastro> seb128: do we have a page that documents how to do the launchpad integration into apps, etc.? I am putting together a page of things that upstreams might be interested in incorporating in their applications
[19:35] <jjardon> didrocks, I've filled a couple of bugs, hope you dont mind ;)
[19:36] <didrocks> jjardon: no, it's perfect! Tomorrow will be cleanage day  ;)
[19:36] <didrocks> and removing deprecrated libraries is always great!
[19:36] <didrocks> deprecated*
[19:38] <jjardon> yeah :). There are a lot of packages that not depends on libbonobo (try aptitude remove libbonobo2-0), Do you prefer a bug againgt libbonobo or one bug per package?
[19:39] <jjardon> didrocks, mmm, maybe is better one bug per package
[19:39] <jjardon> other question about bzr
[19:39] <didrocks> jjardon: you open a bug and attach mutiples package on it
[19:41] <jjardon> most gnome packages don't have a lp:<package> repo or point to the deprecated svn repo, would be great change all to git (at least the official modules)
[19:42] <jjardon> didrocks, so, waht about file a bug agains libbonobo with a list of packages that dont depend on it anymore?
[19:43] <didrocks> jjardon: no no, open a bug on a first packages, saying that libbonobo is no more used by the package
[19:44] <didrocks> jjardon: then, click on "also affect distribution, ubuntu, and select another package"
[19:44] <didrocks> this will add bug tasks
[19:44] <jjardon> didrocks, ok
[19:44] <didrocks> jjardon: there are two vcs. Bzr-Vcs is for ubuntu and if there aren't anyone, it will find into the right directly (lp:ubuntu/package by default)
[19:44] <didrocks> jjardon: for upstream svn repo, yes, it will be great to point them to git
[19:45] <didrocks> jjardon: maybe pointing the right svn repo is something to do in Debian first (and open bug in Debian bts)
[19:50] <seb128> jjardon, no need to open a bug for those
[19:50] <seb128> jjardon, lot are transitional depends
[19:50] <seb128> ie libbonobo is used by libgnomepanel-applet
[19:50] <seb128> which is used by all applets
[19:51] <jjardon> I know, but IMHO, the dependecy should be in libgnomepanel, not in gnome-applets
[19:52] <didrocks> jjardon: for all the bug you opened, you first checked that those depends are removed upstream, right?
[19:52] <jjardon> didrocks, of course
[19:53] <jjardon> didrocks, You can take a look to the upstream status here: http://www.gnome.org/~fpeters/299.html
[19:54] <didrocks> jjardon: oh yes, fpeters' page. Long time didn't look at it. Thanks :)
[19:58] <jjardon> yeah, fpeters rocks! :)
[19:58] <didrocks> right :)
[20:01] <seb128> jjardon, depends sometime are transitional ones
[20:01] <seb128> jjardon, like the rhythmbox one
[20:01] <seb128> jjardon, rhythmbox doesn't use libglade but gnome-media do and trigger it there
[20:02] <seb128> you need to understand those before opening a zillion bugs which are due to a library
[20:02] <jjardon> seb128, gnome-media doesn't depend on libglade anymore :)
[20:02] <jjardon> only evolution (because you use 2.28) depends on libglade
[20:07] <didrocks> we'll keep evolution 2.28 for lucid IIRC
[20:07] <seb128> right
[20:07] <seb128> jjardon, it does in current tarball and that was an example
[20:07] <seb128> jjardon, ie the bug on rhythmbox was not a rhythmbox bug
[20:08] <seb128> so make sure all those bugs are not due to some library
[20:08] <seb128> in which case the library is buggy
[20:08] <seb128> and not all the things have the depends
[20:10] <seb128> jjardon, like in the libbonobo case it's mostly due to gnome-panel and libapplet there
[20:59] <jjardon> webkit yelp is used in lucid, is this intentional?
[21:00] <jjardon> 2.30 is still gecko and there has never been a release from the webkit branch
[21:41] <rickspencer3> TheMuso, are you online yet?
[21:51] <seb128> re
[21:57] <strycore_> Since you're talking about Rhythmbox, I'd like to bring up an idea I had some time ago.
[21:58] <chrisccoulson> hey seb128
[21:58] <seb128> hello chrisccoulson
[21:58] <chrisccoulson> how are you?
[21:59] <strycore_> I think it would be wonderful if every music player (Rhythmbox, Exaile, Amarok, Banshee, ...) had a common database for storing the music collection
[21:59] <TheMuso> rickspencer3: certainly am.
[21:59] <TheMuso> Been online going through mail/RSS since 21:20 UTC.
[21:59] <rickspencer3> heh
[21:59] <seb128> chrisccoulson, good, you?
[21:59] <rickspencer3> TheMuso, I thought it was earlier there for some reason
[22:00] <strycore_> Stored in a folder like ~/.music_library or .local/share/music_library and with a standardized database schema
[22:00] <strycore_> Tell me what you think about this
[22:01] <RAOF> strycore: Yes, that sounds nice; but it's not really in our domain.  Also, if you were to do that, Tracker is what would you would use.
[22:02] <strycore> Yes tracker could be a good way to index music files
[22:02] <RAOF> strycore: Feel free to bring it up on the respective projects' mailing lists, but I can't see us doing that unilaterally.
[22:04] <strycore> Well, there should be an authority behind this kind of project, maybe the freedesktop.org people
[22:04] <seb128> that has already been discussed I think
[22:05] <seb128> it's a priority for none of those project though
[22:05] <dobey> strycore: when i get around to upgrading my server, i'm just going to move all my music and movies over to my file server, and export them with upnp/dlna sharing, which pretty much does exactly what any ideal solution should
[22:05] <strycore> oh cool , do you have a link where I could read about it ?
[22:05] <seb128> no
[22:05] <seb128> you are just not the first one to have the idea over years
[22:05] <seb128> it has been discussed and argued a zillion time on lists, IRC and other ways I guess
[22:05] <dobey> freedesktop.org is not an authority, it is a communications forum
[22:06] <strycore> I guess I'm not, like dobey says upnp is a step in that direction
[22:07] <dobey> it's a hard problem
[22:07] <dobey> like, why do we have so many music players in the first place? :)
[22:07] <dobey> and why are they all basically just a bad file manager UI with buttons to play/pause music, and navigate
[22:09] <strycore> true, but they still have good features
[22:10] <dobey> none of them have the features i want :)
[22:11] <strycore> which are ?
[22:11] <seb128> jjardon, your gdm bug is not a bug...
[22:11] <seb128> didrocks, ^ I closed it
[22:12] <dobey> smart playlists that are actually smart
[22:17] <seb128> bratsche, hey
[22:17] <seb128> bratsche, I know you are busy but do you think you would have time to look at a gtk theme related crash before lucid?
[22:17] <seb128> bratsche, it's bug #411941
[22:18]  * bratsche clicks
[22:18] <seb128> bratsche, it seems to happen with any theme using the pixmap engine
[22:19] <seb128> bratsche, and only on empty f-spot collection
[22:19] <bratsche> Huh, interesting.  Sure, I'll take a look at it.
[22:19] <seb128> bratsche, I guess something in the rendering of the empty grid triggers it
[22:19] <seb128> bratsche, thanks!
[22:19] <seb128> bratsche, the theme seems popular so quite some users get the issue
[22:25] <bratsche> seb128: Do you know if this is on Karmic or Lucid, or does it matter?
[22:26] <seb128> bratsche, it was on jaunty and karmic
[22:26] <seb128> let me try on lucid
[22:26] <bratsche> Cool.
[22:26] <seb128> I've not tried recently
[22:26] <bratsche> I'm on Karmic now, so I'll try here.  Thanks.
[22:26] <seb128> ok good
[22:26] <seb128> I'm sure it's there on karmic
[22:26] <seb128> I talked to upstream around karmic time it was assigned on f-spot by then
[22:26] <seb128> and they said it's a gtk issue
[22:27] <seb128> it has somewhat been stucked there since
[22:27] <seb128> thanks!
[22:27] <seb128> robert_ancell, hey
[22:27] <robert_ancell> seb128, hey
[22:27] <seb128> robert_ancell, how are you?
[22:28]  * robert_ancell is at the talk "The Elephant in the Room: Microsoft and Free Software"
[22:28] <robert_ancell> seb128, good, feeling very rushed at the conference
[22:28] <seb128> oh?
[22:28] <robert_ancell> so little time to see everything, find time to hack on things :)
[22:29] <seb128> hehe
[22:29] <chrisccoulson> there's an elephant in the room? :)
[22:29] <seb128> robert_ancell, did you say that gnome-panel was loading applets in a sync way?
[22:29] <robert_ancell> the room is full enough that you couldn't fit any elephants!!
[22:30] <robert_ancell> seb128, yes, it loads the external binaries sequentially - I'm hoping you can spawn them all at once and then lay them out sequentially
[22:31] <seb128> robert_ancell, are you sure? where did you see that?
[22:31] <seb128> robert_ancell, it's using the async bonobo api and charts seem to indicate they all start in a short time
[22:32] <seb128> or are loaded together rather
[22:32] <robert_ancell> seb128, I thought I was sure, the logs seemed to show that occurring.
[22:33] <seb128> in the strace log I get lot of "activating OAFIID:..."
[22:33] <seb128> then some other tasks
[22:33] <seb128> then the callback for those coming back and being done in async way
[22:33] <robert_ancell> yes, all the activatings are spread out in time
[22:35] <robert_ancell> I get 300ms delay between the first block of activating and the second block
[22:35] <seb128> what do you call block?
[22:35] <seb128> I get like
[22:35] <seb128> panel_applet_frame_load(applet_1)
[22:35] <seb128> panel_applet_frame_load(applet_2)
[22:35] <seb128> panel_applet_frame_load(applet_3)
[22:35] <seb128> ...
[22:35] <robert_ancell> I think it was because they get loaded in the idle loop but the main loop gets stuck laying them out
[22:35] <seb128> panel_applet_frame_activated(1)
[22:35] <seb128> panel_applet_frame_activated(2)
[22:35] <seb128> panel_applet_frame_activated(1) done
[22:35] <seb128> panel_applet_frame_activated(3)
[22:36] <seb128> panel_applet_frame_activated(3) done
[22:36] <robert_ancell> yes, that was it
[22:36] <seb128> panel_applet_frame_activated(3) done
[22:36] <seb128> well that seems async to me
[22:36] <seb128> it starts all the callbacks
[22:36] <seb128> and they get triggered and finish in random order
[22:36] <robert_ancell> so they get _queued_ to be loaded but they don't all get triggered at the same time.  And the last ones (indicator applet etc) seem to take the longest so they should start at gnome-panel start
[22:37] <bratsche> Wow, I really dislike f-spot.
[22:37] <seb128> bratsche, lol
[22:37] <seb128> bratsche, why?
[22:37] <robert_ancell> bratsche, +1
[22:37] <seb128> bratsche, code wise or the software?
[22:37] <seb128> robert_ancell, not sure how you conclude that
[22:37] <robert_ancell> I was saying to rickspencer3 how I used it over Christmas exclusively and it is a real pain
[22:37] <bratsche> I just meant the application itself.  I haven't looked at its code in a long time, but last time I did I remember not liking it either.
[22:38] <seb128> robert_ancell, you probably have a better understanding that mine though ;-)
[22:38] <seb128> f-spot rocks for what I do
[22:38] <seb128> which is "watching all my photos without opening a zillion directories to find where the photos are on disk"
[22:38] <robert_ancell> seb128, I don't have a deep understanding but the first step of triggering the applets should not be done in an idle loop - they should all be triggered first and then the results processed in the idle loop
[22:38] <seb128> I just move the slider until I see the event I want
[22:38] <bratsche> But right now I wasn't able to reproduce the crasher yet, so I thought maybe I need some photos imported into it.. and I click import and I have nfc what it's doing, I think it's importing shit but the app is totally frozen and I occasionally see crazy Mono stack traces in the terminal.
[22:39] <bratsche> I didn't even give it a directory to import, it just started importing stuff and going crazy.
[22:39] <seb128> bratsche, set new wave and run f-spot, maybe try to change between view mode
[22:39] <robert_ancell> f-spot...
[22:39] <seb128> like edit and browse
[22:39] <robert_ancell> doesn't give any feedback when pressing keys
[22:39] <robert_ancell> randomly slows down all the time
[22:40] <bratsche> robert_ancell: Dude.. let's start a new photo management app for Ubuntu sometime. :)
[22:40] <robert_ancell> can get into ui states where it is not obvious how to return to the previous state
[22:40] <seb128> it's buggy
[22:40] <seb128> but I like the concept
[22:40] <robert_ancell> bratsche, :)
[22:40] <robert_ancell> and everyone I have seen using it (including me) spends ages trying to find the button for the feature they want
[22:40] <bratsche> I think I found a different crasher in it now. :)
[22:40] <seb128> robert_ancell, I'm not sure I follow you there cf idle looping
[22:41] <seb128> robert_ancell, setting the bonobo async call is quick
[22:41] <robert_ancell> seb128, what the logs were saying to me was:
[22:42] <robert_ancell> idle callback: start applet 1
[22:42] <robert_ancell> idle callback: start applet 2
[22:42] <robert_ancell> idle callback: start applet 3
[22:42] <bratsche> I'm on New Wave.. how do I change the view mode?
[22:42] <robert_ancell> applet 1 comes back, start layout out things in GTK+
[22:42] <robert_ancell> cont...
[22:42] <robert_ancell> cont...
[22:42] <robert_ancell> cont...
[22:42] <robert_ancell> idle callback: start applet 4
[22:42] <seb128> bratsche, icons in the toolbar
[22:42] <seb128> bratsche, next to the rotate buttons
[22:42] <seb128> bratsche, you have edit or something
[22:42] <robert_ancell> i.e. we are as slow as the time when the last applet starts and when it finishes
[22:43] <robert_ancell> it should be:
[22:43] <robert_ancell> start all applets
[22:43] <bratsche> Yeah.. I'm switching between edit and browse.
[22:43] <bratsche> No crasher so far.
[22:43] <robert_ancell> idle callback: handle result from applet 1
[22:43] <bratsche> I'll keep playing with it.
[22:43] <seb128> you are sure it's an empty config?
[22:43] <robert_ancell> idle callback: handle result from applet 2
[22:43] <robert_ancell> etc
[22:44] <seb128> robert_ancell, you clearly understand than code better than me ;-)
[22:44] <seb128> I've just been setting the markers today
[22:44] <seb128> stracing and reading some logs
[22:44] <seb128> I'm not sure how the gtk+ layouting is done
[22:44] <seb128> I've seen that it sets the async bonobo calls
[22:44] <robert_ancell> seb128, I'm a bit worried how hard it will be to fix.  But if I have an exclusive week to fix it I'm more hopeful
[22:45] <seb128> those come back in random order
[22:45] <seb128> but they call a callback function then
[22:45] <seb128> which is what seems to take time
[22:45] <seb128> it takes some 0.2 to 0.8 seconds each
[22:46] <seb128> ie panel_applet_frame_activated()
[22:46] <robert_ancell> yes but the calls are not made at the same time - they are called when the idle loop is not busy (it may be on your system they all manage to get called at the same time)
[22:46] <seb128> which seems to be all the bonobo and corba talks with the applet
[22:46] <seb128> well you can't do 2 things at the same time
[22:46] <seb128> if one callback is using the cpu it's normal than you can't get a second one running no?
[22:47] <robert_ancell> yes but the issue is there is one main loop - because GTK+ is using it should not stop bonobo
[22:48] <seb128> how do you do that?
[22:48] <seb128> robert_ancell, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/bootchart/seb128-laptop-lucid-20100119-6.png btw
[22:49] <seb128> see the applets at the bottom of this one
[22:49] <robert_ancell> I'll put some example code in a pastebin...
[22:49] <seb128> robert_ancell, sorry to bother you with that ;-)
[22:49] <imachine> hello
[22:49] <seb128> robert_ancell, enjoy the conference, we can talk about that later
[22:49] <seb128> robert_ancell, or send me an email with the example later if you want
[22:50] <seb128> robert_ancell, I will let that issue for you to deal with I think since it seems you get a week to help us there
[22:50] <robert_ancell> ok
[22:50] <seb128> robert_ancell, I will try to profile the different applets meanwhile
[22:50] <seb128> see if there work we could spare
[22:50] <robert_ancell> yes, I haven't done any work there
[22:50] <seb128> especially in the menu and clock ones
[22:51] <robert_ancell> (and I'm assuming we can't easily recoup any bonobo/corba overhead)
[22:51] <imachine> question about encrypted folders, anyone can help? I logged on to my freshly installed 9.10 @ i386 (original, 9.10 pressed cd obtained by mail from canonical) that previously I have setup encrypted home dirs on.
[22:51] <seb128> imachine, hey, try #ubuntu
[22:51] <seb128> bratsche, did you manage to get it crashing?
[22:51] <seb128> bratsche, I can have a look now if you want
[22:51] <robert_ancell> I was also looking at not showing the panel until the widgets are laid out because it is drawing them while loading which is a waste of time
[22:52] <seb128> it does some widget side requesting a lot
[22:52] <seb128> widget size requesting
[22:52] <seb128> would be nice to do that once only when things are loaded indeed
[22:52] <bratsche> seb128: Nope, it doesn't want to crash for me. :(
[22:52] <imachine> afterwards, two windows popped up, upon first login - one briefly about setting up password for the encrypted home dir, with two buttons - next and launch action now. I chose next, whcih led me to another type of this info-questionnare-window which told me I had no language support installed. I disregarded it as I knew it from before. To my memory, the windows came back.
[22:52] <bratsche> Wait, why did I write a frowny face there?  That should be good news!
[22:52] <robert_ancell> I tried to stop that but it didn't work
[22:53] <imachine> to My dismay however, the windows did no come back.
[22:53] <imachine> and now some of my settings do not save.
[22:53] <imachine> this is clearly a bug imho,
[22:53] <seb128> bratsche, set new wave
[22:53] <imachine> and seb128 yes, I did try #ubuntu  ;)
[22:53] <bratsche> seb128: I did, I'm running New Wave right now.
[22:53] <seb128> bratsche, f-spot -b /tmp/dir
[22:53] <imachine> seb128, one 'ikonia' told me to check out #ubuntu-desktop ;)
[22:53] <seb128> bratsche, cancel the import dialog
[22:53] <imachine> so here I am
[22:53] <seb128> bratsche, click on edit in the toolbar
[22:53] <imachine> I want to help solve the problem, more initially, I'd like to know more about the schema on which these windows pop up by.
[22:53] <seb128> bratsche, click back on browse
[22:54] <imachine> then, maybe I could run them manually.
[22:54] <seb128> bratsche, it should crash
[22:54] <seb128> imachine, try #ubuntu
[22:54] <bratsche> seb128: Nope.
[22:54] <imachine> and set up the said password, or so, which I guess seems crucial for having an encrypted home dir.
[22:54] <seb128> bratsche, stop using your hacked gtk version where all bugs are fixed ;-)
[22:54] <bratsche> seb128: I just tried on both my Karmic and Lucid machines, and it didn't crash on either one.
[22:54] <bratsche> haha
[22:54] <seb128> it did crash twice in a row there
[22:54] <bratsche> wtf.
[22:55] <seb128> every time
[22:55] <seb128> edit image get you a broken image icon?
[22:55] <bratsche> Yes.
[22:55] <seb128> and going back to browse?
[22:56] <bratsche> Yeah, and then I'm back at an empty photo browser.
[22:56] <robert_ancell> seb128, here is my gnome-panel log btw: http://imagebin.ca/view/SM2Z2c7.html
[22:57] <robert_ancell> notice the delay between activating the WorkspaceSwitcherApplet and MultiloadApplet
[22:57] <robert_ancell> ok, back to the conference :)
[22:57] <seb128> robert_ancell, right I get that too I was wondering why
[22:57] <seb128> robert_ancell, it's like loading 3 applets
[22:57] <seb128> and then sitting there
[22:57] <seb128> and then loading a new bunch
[22:57] <seb128> bratsche, try with a guest session maybe?
[22:57] <robert_ancell> yeah, it's the starvation issue I was trying to describe.  I'll try and email it in more of a coherent way later
[22:58] <seb128> bratsche, or gconftool-2 --recursive-unset /app/-f-spot
[22:58] <seb128> robert_ancell, thanks, enjoy!
[22:59] <seb128> bratsche, try f-spot -b /tmp -p /tmp
[23:00] <seb128> bratsche, it's weird reading my irc log from upstream they got it to crash every time too on different distro
[23:00] <seb128> bratsche, you did set the new wave gtk theme right? not an icon theme...? ;-)
[23:01] <bratsche> No, it's the whole theme.. changed my WM theme and my gtk theme.
[23:01] <bratsche> From the Appearances preferences dialog.
[23:01] <seb128> ok dunno why it works for you then
[23:01] <seb128> you don't unset csw or something?
[23:01] <seb128> or have an hacked environment in some way?
[23:02] <seb128> bratsche, GDK_NATIVE_WINDOWS=1 workaorund it
[23:02] <bratsche> This machine has normal packages setup.. I keep all my hacked up gtk stuff in /opt and only use it when I change LD_LIBRARY_PATH manually on the command line.
[23:02] <bratsche> seb128: Oh, that fixes it?
[23:02] <seb128> bratsche, yes
[23:02] <bratsche> Logging in as my test user on my other machine.
[23:03] <seb128> bratsche, you are sure you don't have the variable set from some previous testing? ;-)
[23:03] <bratsche> I just logged in as my test user on my Lucid machine and it's working for me there too, I swear!
[23:04] <seb128> unbelievable
[23:04] <bratsche> Either f-spot loves me way more than I love f-spot, or I'm doing something wrong to reproduce this.
[23:04] <seb128> unset GDK_NATIVE_WINDOWS
[23:04] <seb128> LC_ALL=C f-spot -b /tmp
[23:04] <bratsche> I'm setting New Wave theme, starting f-spot on the command line, switching to edit image, switching back to browse.
[23:05] <bratsche> I'm getting some warning from f-spot about GdkPixbufLoader..
[23:05] <bratsche> (/usr/lib/f-spot/f-spot.exe:31450): GdkPixbuf-WARNING **: GdkPixbufLoader finalized without calling gdk_pixbuf_loader_close() - this is not allowed. You must explicitly end the data stream to the loader before dropping the last reference.
[23:05] <seb128> that's "normal"
[23:05] <seb128> thanks for trying
[23:05] <bratsche> Sorry dude. :/
[23:06] <seb128> that's ok
[23:06] <seb128> I don't know why it doesn't happen to you
[23:06] <seb128> it crashes every time there ;-)
[23:06] <seb128> and same for upstream guys when they tried
[23:06] <seb128> some being on opensuse
[23:06] <seb128> you could maybe try with your opt gtk :-)
[23:06] <seb128> who knows ;-)
[23:06] <seb128> The error was 'BadAlloc (insufficient resources for operation)'.
[23:06] <seb128>   (Details: serial 9279 error_code 11 request_code 53 minor_code 0)
[23:07] <bratsche> Now that is really bugging me though. :)
[23:08] <seb128> chrisccoulson, ^ does it crash for you?
[23:08] <seb128> bratsche, me too! ;-)
[23:09] <bratsche> seb128: Are you and your team going to be in Portland?
[23:09] <seb128> yes
[23:09] <seb128> you?
[23:09] <bratsche> Yeah
[23:09] <bratsche> Cool
[23:09] <seb128> nice ;-)
[23:10] <bratsche> I want to see this crasher. :)
[23:10] <seb128> lol
[23:10] <seb128> get a livecd
[23:11] <seb128> or kvm to boot an iso
[23:11] <bratsche> Oh yeah, good call.  I'm sure I have one laying around somewhere.
[23:11] <seb128> I'm sure you have some debug variable set in your environment or something ;-)
[23:11] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - it doesn't seem to crash here either
[23:12] <bratsche> woot!
[23:12]  * bratsche hi5's chrisccoulson
[23:12] <chrisccoulson> i'm just running f-spot -b /tmp with the new wave theme
[23:12] <chrisccoulson> bratsche - what arch are you using?
[23:12] <chrisccoulson> just in case that matters;)
[23:13] <seb128> chrisccoulson, switch between browse and edit
[23:13] <seb128> using the toolbar
[23:13] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - still no crashes
[23:13] <seb128> you have an empty collection right?
[23:13] <bratsche> The French Conspiracy.. except this is the conspiracy against the French.  Or, against one of them. ;)
[23:14] <seb128> lol
[23:14] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'm running with "-b /tmp", so it comes up with no pictures
[23:14] <seb128> bah
[23:14] <seb128> that's how f-spot pays me back to say I quite like it!
[23:15] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - i can make it crash in virtualbox though
[23:15] <bratsche> I just tried in vmware and still no luck.
[23:16] <chrisccoulson> my virtualbox install is a different architecture though
[23:16] <bratsche> What is it?
[23:16] <chrisccoulson> bratsche - my virtualbox install is i386, and my desktop is amd64
[23:16] <bratsche> I think everything here is amd64, or whatever the proper name is for that now.
[23:16] <bratsche> Hmm.. interesting. :)
[23:16] <chrisccoulson> bratsche - there we go then :)
[23:17] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - you're using i386 arent you?
[23:17] <seb128> yes
[23:17] <bratsche> If seb128 is on 32-bit then I'll install a 32-bit Karmic in vmware later and look into this there.
[23:18] <bratsche> I need to finish up some other stuff first though.
[23:18] <seb128> bratsche, don't give you that much trouble only for that
[23:18] <seb128> bratsche, let me ping alex about it tomorrow now that I know it happens only on csw
[23:18] <seb128> he's quite responsive to my csw crash pings usually ;-)
[23:18] <bratsche> Okay, cool.
[23:19] <seb128> you can probably try to boot an i386 iso or cd on an amd64 box too btw
[23:20] <bratsche> Yeah, I'm downloading an iso now.
[23:20] <seb128> you don't have one of those CD we have at all uds, sprints, etc? ;-)
[23:20] <bratsche> Probably, but I have no idea where I put them!
[23:21] <seb128> hum
[23:21] <seb128> all the dups are on i386 too
[23:22] <seb128> weird, I didn't think that a csw issue would be arch dependant
[23:22] <bratsche> Me either.