[04:18] <james_w> is it possible for a project group to have bug tasks etc. as well as just being a link between projects?
[04:19] <cody-somerville> james_w, no.
[04:19] <james_w> damn
[04:20] <james_w> thanks Cody
[06:16] <doctormo> If I get an Error 500, Internal Server Error from launchpad lib, should I report it as an error?
[06:17] <tsimpson> if it's reproducible
[06:17] <wgrant> It should have been recorded anyway.
[06:17] <wgrant> What were you doing?
[06:21] <doctormo> wgrant: Accessing an opened branch object from a gtk main, when it was opened inside of a thread.
[06:24] <doctormo> Where would it be recorded btw?
[06:24] <spm> doctormo: 'oops' system
[06:25] <doctormo> Oh right, on the server side. duh I should know that.
[06:25] <spm> :-)
[06:26] <wgrant> It shouldn't cause an OOPS, but you know that the launchpadlib cache isn't threadsafe, right?
[06:27] <doctormo> wgrant: Yup, I fixed the error my side, just a general question about uniformative errors and reporting them as bugs.
[06:28] <spm> doctormo: my 2c; better to report and give any extra info; than not. the oops can always be attached to what info you provide.
[06:32] <wgrant> doctormo: A 500 is always a Launchpad bug.
[06:32] <wgrant> It's a crash.
[06:35] <doctormo> https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/513116
[06:36] <wgrant> doctormo: Can you turn on httplib's debug mode, and get the OOPS ID from the headers?
[06:38] <doctormo> You guys are using httplib 1 not 2 right?
[06:38] <doctormo> otherwise you'll have to show me how to do that.
[06:38] <wgrant> httplib2, I think.
[06:40] <wgrant> import httplib2; httplib2.debug = 1
[07:23] <wolfgang00> not sure if my last message went through. i apologize for my ignorance but i just started using launchpad and bazaar. is there anyway to make a branch private so that only team members can browse the code? i have some sensitive material that i want to restrict access to.
[07:30] <doctormo> wolfgang00: I think only Canonical has that ability and maybe third parties who pay Canonical for private services.
[07:30] <doctormo> wolfgang00: What's the name of the project?
[07:30] <wolfgang00> yardbutlerstore
[07:30] <wolfgang00> im removing the files that have sensitive info but i would have prefered to have them on launchpad and just restrict visisbility. i guess its not a big deal though
[07:31] <persia> wolfgang00: You can try asking a question against launchpad.  I've seen it happen before, but believe there is a commercial arrangement involved.
[07:31] <doctormo> wolfgang00: Having private files is counter to the open source way and basically goes against what launchpad is for. (public access to development)
[07:32] <doctormo> wolfgang00: But as persia said, the commercial arrangement path offers a way around that.
[07:32] <persia> And as doctormo said, it doesn't make sense for open-source stuff :)
[07:33] <wolfgang00> i understand but it keeps you from having any files with sensitive information up for your team. even the ability to restrict visibility on a per file basis would be nice.
[07:33] <doctormo> wolfgang00: I take it that you have passwords or some such in code?
[07:33] <wolfgang00> yup
[07:35] <doctormo> wolfgang00: It's _REALLY_ not a good idea to commit passwords to source code repositories. I know I did that once and had to change all my passwords to loads of accounts.
[07:35] <doctormo> wolfgang00: Basically someone friendly logged into my google account and sent me an email to my own email account as a polite reminder not to commit my google password to source code ;-)
[07:35] <persia> It's usually not a good idea to hardcode authentication tokens anyway.
[07:36] <persia> Just have the source get it from some config file, and not clobber the config file on install.
[07:36] <wolfgang00> usually not... but things arent always  done in the most practical manner :)
[07:36] <persia> That way you can change the source, and not worry about the authentication tokens.
[07:36] <doctormo> wolfgang00: In this case (I imagen an sql server password for testing or devel)
[07:36] <doctormo> wolfgang00: You should organise a way of getting a test serivce set up locally for all resources. If you can.
[07:36] <wolfgang00> one last question. how do i remove files from launchpad. i did a bzr remove --keep on the files i dont want up but after i do a push they are still there
[07:37] <doctormo> wolfgang00: Remove forever? delete the branch _may_ do it.
[07:37] <persia> If you want to destroy the history, you need to create a branch that doesn't include that history, and then push --overwrite
[07:37] <doctormo> wolfgang00: But a bzr delete will just delete the file in that revision.
[07:37] <doctormo> persia: I'll have to remember that one :-) thanks.
[07:38] <persia> doctormo: Of course, in this case, all the passwords should be changed anyway, as they have already been compromised.
[07:38] <persia> But it's a handy way to paper over one's mistakes :)
[07:39] <wolfgang00> ive already changed them all as soon as i noticed what i did
[07:39] <doctormo> persia: Yea, at least now all of my online accounts have different passwords from each other thanks to that mistake.
[07:52] <wolfgang00> thanks for all your help
[09:13] <doctormo> Is edge down at all? I've started getting oauth errors saying 503 Service Unavailable.
[09:14] <wgrant> doctormo: Everything is read-only for maintenance.
[09:14] <doctormo> wgrant: That explains it, although I was trying to do a demonstration video, when does it come back?
[09:15] <wgrant> doctormo: Judging by the topic, not for another couple of hours.
[09:15] <wgrant> It's rather long this time :(
[09:15] <doctormo> I'm going to start calling groundcontrol "rather bad luck"
[09:15] <doctormo> this is the 19th video where something has gone wrong ;-)
[09:16] <lifeless> 2.5 hour ETA fwiw - see #topic
[09:18] <doctormo> thanks lifeless
[09:27] <Peng> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/497595 OOPSes for me, e.g. OOPS-1488F5415.
[09:28] <Peng> Also OOPS-1488M1026.
[09:29] <wgrant> That's odd. It doesn't OOPS for me.
[09:29] <mneptok> wgrant: buy it dinner and compliment its wardrobe first.
[09:31] <bialix> hi, I have question/idea: sourceforge.net supports redirect from sf.net domain, which is very handy; lp.net will be nice to have for launchpad. Then people can talk about lp projects URLs using such short names
[09:31] <bialix> it appears for me when I've prepared my talk, and want to mention some lp projects
[09:31] <mrooney> bialix: it seems like someone would need to purchase lp.net for that to happen :)
[09:32] <bialix> yes, I think so
[09:32] <mneptok> and speak to Kevin Buck
[09:32] <Peng> mneptok: Hah, like I'd ever do that. Maybe wgrant did buy it dinner and compliment its wardrobe.
[09:32] <Peng> When LP is read-only, does the OOPS database work? :D
[09:33] <wgrant> I hate to think how much LP.net would end up costing.
[09:33] <mneptok> a lot. musicians tend not to be rich, and tend to want to be.
[09:34] <bialix> interesting. perhaps I said something stupid. sorry for the noise.
[09:35] <mneptok> bialix: if you ever find a human that has not said something stupid, please let me know
[09:36] <bialix> ok
[09:36] <mneptok> bialix: and it's not a stupid idea, just probably unworkable since the domain is already owned and in use
[09:36] <bialix> right now it's inactive
[09:36] <mneptok> http://lp.net
[09:36] <bialix> that's why I've said what I said
[09:37] <mneptok> Kevin M. Buck. Chicago guitarist.
[09:37] <wgrant> It looks parked to me.
[09:37] <bialix> empty page for me
[09:37] <bialix> my firefox can connect to it
[09:37] <mneptok> yeah, it just went parked here.
[09:37] <bialix> cant
[09:38] <mneptok> a few minutes ago it redirected me to http://www.kevinmbuck.com/
[09:38] <wgrant> Thank you for your interest in purchasing Lp.net. This domain is no longer available.
[09:38] <bialix> rats
[09:38] <bialix> it was fast
[09:39] <mneptok> and as a registered Libertarian, i know that lp.org is not available
[09:43] <doctormo> mneptok: Your a lib in the UK or US or somewhere else?
[09:43] <mneptok> doctormo: US
[09:44] <doctormo> mneptok: Clasic Republican Libertarian, Vermont Libertarian or Social Lib?
[09:45] <mneptok> doctormo: i believe we need to stick with the principles of our foudning documents, with necessary updates due to human advancement (e.g. highways)
[10:33] <vish> guys when lp was in maintenance , the link in the yellow warning pointed to > http://blog.launchpad.net/maintenance , which is an outdated link... you might want to update that
[10:36] <Peng> That bug page doesn't OOPS anymore, BTW.
[10:49] <soren> Will uploading a source package in format 3.0 to a Hardy PPA work?
[10:49] <wgrant> soren: No.
[10:49] <geser> I guess soyuz won't accept it
[10:49] <soren> wgrant: Alright. Thanks.
[10:49] <wgrant> Correct, it hasn't been enabled in < Lucid.
[10:50] <wgrant> Hardy's dpkg would need a few patches to work with all 3.0 packages.
[10:51] <soren> Right. I just couldn't recall off the top of my head whether it was unpacked outside the schroot and then passed on, or if dpkg inside the schroot did the unpacking.
[10:52] <wgrant> The latter, now, but there are other defenses in front of that.
[10:52] <soren> Oh.
[10:59] <soren> I've never really understood why the PPA buildds bother with "dpkg --purge" in the end. They're blown away entirely once the build is finished anyway, aren't they?
[10:59] <wgrant> Yeah, that's always struck me as odd.
[11:48] <ad-530> hiho
[11:49] <ad-530> my svn branch import was marked as invalid with the comment: "his doesn't look like the root directory of a tarball would."
[11:49] <ad-530> what means this?
[13:11] <thekorn> hi, when looking at a bug page, what do this four flame icons at the top tell me?
[13:11] <soren> thekorn: http://blog.launchpad.net/bug-tracking/bug-heat
[13:13] <thekorn> soren, thanks
[13:13] <soren> sure
[13:13]  * thekorn wonders why this post is not showing up in his feed reade
[13:13] <thekorn> r
[14:40] <kangarooo> what is Authorized applications ? i maybe want to authorize some aplication also :)
[14:54] <deadwill> hi, I need some help to merge my old LP account.
[14:57] <deadwill> anyone?
[15:05] <maxb> deadwill: Try https://launchpad.net/people/+requestmerge
[15:06] <deadwill> maxb, thx
[15:12] <mrand> Howdy, I'm here on behalf of the Mythbuntu distribution.  In hopes of increasing our productivity while using launchpad, we were wondering if the launchpad team would be receptive to changing the "Show package report screen" (for example:  https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/~mythbuntu-bugs/+packagebugs)
[15:12] <mrand> While the unassigned and in progress might be useful to commercial applications, unassigned is not useful at all to the countless open-source applications that use launchpad, and in progress is of low value.  We'd much prefer to have the new, committed, triaged, fix committed, and then maybe in progress if there is width left over.
[15:39] <noodles775> intellec` or deryck : see mrand's idea above?
[15:43] <deryck> noodles775, thanks.  mrand, yes, I think we would be open to changing this, certainly.
[15:43] <deryck> mrand, I don't think we have time to get it scheduled to do ourselves anytime soon, however.
[15:46] <abentley> kangarooo: They are applications you have authorized to use launchpad on your behalf.  Actually adding the authorization is usually done the first time you use an application.
[15:50] <henninge> kfogel: ping
[15:51] <mrand> deryck[lunch]: Thank you.  what would be the best avenue to document this request?  launchpad ticket or someplace else?
[15:52] <kfogel> henninge: ack
[15:53] <henninge> kfogel: hi, how much detail about LP development will you be giving in your UDW session?
[15:53] <henninge> kfogel: Will you talk about the developement and submit process?
[15:53] <henninge> like in https://dev.launchpad.net/PatchSubmission
[15:55] <kfogel> henninge: I expect to, yes.
[15:55] <kfogel> henninge: (I also expect to have much more detailed answers by the end of today :-) )
[15:55] <henninge> ;-)
[15:56] <henninge> kfogel: ok, just wanted to check how much overlap our sessions might have.
[15:56] <kfogel> henninge: what's yours again?
[15:56] <mrand> Related question: We can't seem to find a way to have the bugs for the generic Mythbuntu distro show up here:  https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/~mythbuntu-bugs/+packagebugs   is there a way to do that, or is that an oversight?
[15:57] <henninge> kfogel: in an hour ;) "Launchpd Translations under the hood"
[15:57] <henninge> we were planning to point people to your session, anyway.
[15:58] <kfogel> henninge: have a great session!  I may look over the transcript while preparing mine.
[15:58] <henninge> kfogel: thanks
[16:54] <bdmurray> some of these new launchpad features make my day
[17:25] <intellectronica> bdmurray: especially having developed some of them, eh? :)
[17:25] <intellectronica> bdmurray: btw don't know if mrevell has already chatted to you about this, but maybe you feel like blogging about some of the new api exports?
[17:26] <intellectronica> bdmurray: also, sorry that some of them didn't make it into the release. they had several problems and it was too late to fix. will land them asap
[17:27] <bdmurray> intellectronica: heh, I was just writing that blog post!
[17:27] <intellectronica> nice!
[17:27] <cumulus007> Rosette appears to be down
[17:27] <cumulus007> *Rossetta.
[17:28] <bdmurray> I was going through some bug listings and found a bug with a patch though which was aweseome
[17:28] <cumulus007> lol never mind, it was a browser settings
[17:29] <bdmurray> intellectronica: I know the linked branches had issues but what was up with the messages_count one?
[17:30] <intellectronica> bdmurray: some test failure. don't remember exactly what but will have a look shortly and try to land it again
[19:15] <kangarooo> abentley: where can i see thouse applications? what are thouse names or list of them?
[19:16] <abentley> kangarooo: There is no list of them.  Any application that uses the launchpad API can be added to that list.
[19:22] <kangarooo> how many aplications there is already? twitter has aplication list http://twitter.pbworks.com/Apps why launchpad shouldnt have? i want to know what are thouse aplications so maybe ill have an idea what aplication to make
[19:24] <kangarooo> abentley: see previous post :)
[19:25] <abentley> kangarooo: We don't know how many applications there are already.  We don't exert any control over which applications use the Launchpad API, so there is no registration process, so we have no list.
[19:37] <kangarooo> abentley: then there should be made a wiki page like twitter made
[19:38] <abentley> kangarooo: You are certainly welcome to make one, or you can file a bug.
[19:49] <abentley> kangarooo: The list you pointed at appears to be unofficial.  The site says: "This site is not affiliated with Twitter in any way."
[19:52] <jml> actually, there's a list at https://help.launchpad.net/API/Uses
[19:53] <jml> it's not comprehensive, of course, for the reasons abentley gave.
[20:37] <wgrant> poolie: Launchpad does run on Lucid, with a bit of tweaking. Try downgrading python-setuptools and python-pkg-resources to their Karmic versions.
[20:39] <wgrant> Why does every bug have four dark grey flames on it?
[20:39] <wgrant> Is this just a broken heat implementation with dodgy UI?
[20:45] <beuno> wgrant, yes
[20:46] <geser> wgrant: perhaps due to bug #511382
[20:48] <wgrant> Ah.
[21:06] <intellectronica> wgrant: note that even after we start calculating bug heat as a ratio to the hottest bug in a bugtarget still most bugs will be grey, since the majority of bugs in a project are by definition not hot
[21:07] <intellectronica> so i do think we'll need to improve the icon design regardless
[21:07] <intellectronica> any gimpers out there?
[21:08] <wgrant> The heat algorithm seems to be suboptimal. Only 40ish Ubuntu bugs have any.
[21:08] <intellectronica> wgrant: yes, that sounds too few for ubuntu
[21:09] <intellectronica> wgrant: we know that it's suboptimal, but we really wanted to get something out there so that we can start playing with it. otherwise it's a chicken/egg problem. any suggestions for improvement are welcome
[21:09] <intellectronica> especially in the form of patches :)
[21:09] <wgrant> Aha.
[21:09] <wgrant> I see.
[21:56] <geser> is the bug heat intended to be per project (i.e. over the whole Ubuntu) or per package (for the Ubuntu project)?
[22:00] <abentley> geser: I'd point at bug #511382, but you've already seen that, so I don't understand the question.
[22:01] <geser> didn't read the latest comments yet
[22:05] <abentley> geser: So, I think we're agreed that heat should be relative.
[22:05] <abentley> geser: Ubuntu, is actually a distro, not a project.  Bazaar is a project, and it is also an Ubuntu package.
[22:06] <abentley> geser: The idea would be that if you're looking at the bug in the context of Ubuntu, its heat would be relative to other Ubuntu bugs.  If you look at the bug in the context of its package, you'd see the heat relative to other bugs in that package.
[22:07] <geser> yes, that would be fine
[23:50] <kirkland> hey, is there a launchpad admin here who can help aliguori with a troublesome user?
[23:50] <spm> kirkland: sure; whats up?
[23:51] <aliguori> spm, we have someone constantly reopening the same bug reports
[23:51] <kirkland> spm: aliguori has a troll user that keeps reopening bug reports that he has marked "won't fix"
[23:51] <kirkland> spm: what's the process?  you guys usually send the user a "cease and desist" notice first, right?
[23:52] <spm> hitting the obvious things first. have you tried sending them a contact this user: please dont. ?
[23:52] <aliguori> #494500, #498107, and #493519 in particular
[23:52] <aliguori> yes
[23:52] <spm> kirkland: it's fuzzy. we use the hammer only in *very* rare circumstances.
[23:52] <aliguori> honestly, i'm happy to give him one more chance, i just closed them again with a polite explanation
[23:53] <kirkland> spm: okay, no problem.  aliguori was asking me for the process.  I usually just poke you guys.
[23:53] <aliguori> i'm just not sure how to respond in a situation like this
[23:53] <aliguori> he's clearly unhappy about a decision we've made upstream (removing kqemu), but this is the wrong venue for it
[23:54] <spm> so I'm seeing... (still reading the first bug)
[23:57] <wgrant> Oh no, not that guy...
[23:58] <spm> wgrant: ? you've come across him before I gather?
[23:59] <spm> kirkland: aliguori: my 2c from reading those; me doing any admistrative suspension or like will only make things worse. they're already irritated; that would piss them off.
[23:59] <wgrant> ah, no, different guy, but same sort of bugs.