| Nafai | Hello from Lucid! | 00:03 |
|---|---|---|
| Nafai | It boots way fast, great job guys | 00:04 |
| Sarvatt | bootup times are just getting worse and worse here, 42 seconds on 1-21 and steadily rising to 1 minute 11 seconds today. guess I need to buy a SSD for this netbook :D | 00:05 |
| seb128 | do you have a bootchart of your boot? | 00:06 |
| Sarvatt | http://sarvatt.com/downloads/asuka-lucid-20100127-1.png | 00:07 |
| Amaranth | Sarvatt: you have to reboot twice after an upgrade :) | 00:08 |
| seb128 | hey Amaranth | 00:08 |
| Amaranth | howdy | 00:08 |
| seb128 | it has been a while | 00:08 |
| seb128 | how are you? | 00:08 |
| Amaranth | I've been going to bed at a proper time and thus missing you :) | 00:09 |
| rickspencer3 | Amaranth! | 00:09 |
| Amaranth | good, doing some contract work on top of my day job, crazy busy | 00:09 |
| rickspencer3 | welcome back | 00:09 |
| seb128 | hehe | 00:09 |
| rickspencer3 | Nafai sweet | 00:09 |
| Amaranth | one part of the contract work: make compiz start faster | 00:09 |
| seb128 | Sarvatt, try booting again, it was profiling on this one | 00:09 |
| Amaranth | handy, that | 00:09 |
| seb128 | Amaranth, who contracted you for that? | 00:09 |
| seb128 | Amaranth, speaking of which do you still plan to work on cleaning things to install by default? | 00:10 |
| Amaranth | hmm, don't really want to say right now | 00:10 |
| seb128 | k | 00:10 |
| Amaranth | seb128: dunno if I'll have time for it any time soon | 00:10 |
| seb128 | I planned to look at that with mvo next week since you didn't reply to my pings from some weeks ago | 00:10 |
| seb128 | ok | 00:10 |
| Amaranth | It's easy enough, just split the packaging into stuff we use + cube/rotate and stuff we don't | 00:10 |
| seb128 | right | 00:11 |
| Amaranth | oh, and wobbly, need to keep wobbly in the default install | 00:11 |
| Sarvatt | that might explain it, i dont think i've ever rebooted without having upgraded something inbetween unless I crashed.. | 00:11 |
| seb128 | it's just that I didn't want to go through every .xml and .so to figure which ones are used | 00:11 |
| Amaranth | I spent all my time on it making separate packages for everything | 00:11 |
| seb128 | especially if you did that already | 00:11 |
| seb128 | is there an easy way to list those used? | 00:11 |
| Amaranth | $ gconftool-2 --get /apps/compiz/general/allscreens/options/active_plugins | 00:12 |
| seb128 | the file matches the gconf list? | 00:12 |
| seb128 | and there is no depends system or anything to take in consideration? | 00:12 |
| Amaranth | yeah, fade plugin has libfade.so and fade.xml files, etc | 00:12 |
| Amaranth | if there are dependencies we have those plugins loaded too so if you're just splitting it in half you don't need to care about those | 00:13 |
| Amaranth | s/half/two packages/ | 00:13 |
| seb128 | ok good | 00:13 |
| seb128 | I want a least to delete the not used one there to see what difference it makes on boot | 00:13 |
| seb128 | not used ones rather | 00:14 |
| seb128 | I expect there is several of those ;-) | 00:14 |
| Amaranth | you can do that without doing any packaging work then, just remove all the lib*.so and *.xml files that aren't in that list and reboot a couple times :) | 00:14 |
| Amaranth | probably gain you 0.5s | 00:14 |
| seb128 | yeah, I will do that | 00:14 |
| seb128 | ok, almost nothing then | 00:15 |
| seb128 | I'm wondering where those 10 seconds of cpu use go | 00:15 |
| Amaranth | highest I could see would be 1 second | 00:15 |
| Amaranth | probably plugins interacting with all these windows loading | 00:15 |
| Amaranth | hack gnome-session to make compiz load last, see what happens | 00:15 |
| seb128 | we sort of do that now, well we don't load it first | 00:16 |
| seb128 | we load it as a standard application | 00:16 |
| seb128 | but I will try to delay it | 00:16 |
| Amaranth | really it needs to load (and be done loading) right before xsplash goes away | 00:16 |
| Amaranth | I was talking about that with keybuk | 00:16 |
| Amaranth | If we have xsplash we can hide the fact that things are ugly while compiz is loading by making them talk | 00:17 |
| seb128 | well officially we don't need to speed compiz since it's too slow anyway and we changed targets | 00:17 |
| seb128 | but still would be nice to have faster desktop boot | 00:17 |
| Amaranth | changed targets? | 00:17 |
| seb128 | boot target is une now | 00:17 |
| Amaranth | ah | 00:17 |
| Sarvatt | there we go, a little better that time. http://sarvatt.com/downloads/asuka-lucid-20100127-2.png i think that solar plymouth theme is a little too nice for this atom cpu :D | 00:18 |
| seb128 | 'night everybody | 00:29 |
| seb128 | robert_ancell, I've accepted your ubuntu-desktop post and added you to the whitelist | 00:34 |
| seb128 | robert_ancell, quicker to reply there than by email ;-) | 00:35 |
| djsiegel | TheMuso: did you find anything about about webkit accessibility? | 00:36 |
| robert_ancell | seb128, thanks! | 00:38 |
| seb128 | np | 00:38 |
| seb128 | really off to bed this time ;-) | 00:38 |
| seb128 | 'night | 00:38 |
| chrisccoulson | hey robert_ancell | 00:50 |
| robert_ancell | chrisccoulson, hi | 00:52 |
| chrisccoulson | how are you? | 00:52 |
| robert_ancell | good | 00:53 |
| hyperair | dpkg-deb: building package `gnome-power-manager' in `../gnome-power-manager_2.28.1-0ubuntu1.3_amd64.deb' | 00:53 |
| hyperair | woo | 00:53 |
| hyperair | pitti: ^^ | 00:53 |
| chrisccoulson | another gpm update? it's taking up all my bandwidth this week ;) | 00:54 |
| hyperair | chrisccoulson: ;-) this is the final one. | 00:54 |
| chrisccoulson | cool! | 00:54 |
| hyperair | chrisccoulson: final one for the double suspend issue. | 00:54 |
| hyperair | chrisccoulson: would you prefer i just paste the patch here or upload it to launchpad? | 00:55 |
| chrisccoulson | i think it would be better in launchpad | 00:55 |
| hyperair | okay then | 00:55 |
| * hyperair reluctantly lets the huge bug page load | 00:55 | |
| Nafai | yay, lucid fixed one of my major complaints about the ubuntu desktop | 01:23 |
| LLStarks | ArneGoetje, would package should i file that antialiasing issue against, fontconfig? | 01:32 |
| hyperair | chrisccoulson: the patch is attached. | 01:53 |
| chrisccoulson | hyperair - thanks | 01:53 |
| chrisccoulson | i'm going to go to bed in a minute anyway, so i will look at it in the morning | 01:53 |
| hyperair | sure | 01:54 |
| ArneGoetje | LLStarks: if it's a general issue, yes. If it's only with some fonts, it might be a configuration issue in the font package. | 02:01 |
| ArneGoetje | LLStarks: please also consider the application to play a role there. Please do test if it only affects one application or multiple or all. | 02:02 |
| LLStarks | ArneGoetje, i'm a bit curious as to what ubuntu falls back on in firefox when tahoma fonts are called and ttf-tahoma-replacement is not installed. | 02:15 |
| ArneGoetje | LLStarks: depends on which other fonts are installed on the system | 02:22 |
| kenvandine | TheMuso, ping | 04:23 |
| === robbiew is now known as robbiew_ | ||
| === bjf is now known as bjf-afk | ||
| didrocks | good morning | 08:02 |
| seb128 | hey there | 08:47 |
| didrocks | salut seb128 | 08:49 |
| didrocks | ça va ? | 08:49 |
| seb128 | lut didrocks | 08:49 |
| seb128 | ouais, et toi ? | 08:49 |
| didrocks | ça va bien, couché tôt ;) | 08:50 |
| seb128 | didrocks, lucky you ;-) | 08:52 |
| seb128 | hey slomo | 08:52 |
| slomo | hi seb128 | 08:53 |
| seb128 | slomo, did you read my comments about totem-pl-parser yesterday? | 08:53 |
| didrocks | seb128: heh, I saw that you were still active at 01:40 ;) | 08:53 |
| slomo | seb128: sorry for choosing a different package name than ubuntu, i wasn't expecting this to be in ubuntu already (i mean, i updated the package yesterday morning very few hours after the release) | 08:53 |
| seb128 | didrocks, yeah, I was out in the evening and did read bug emails to make sure I didn't break anything when coming back | 08:54 |
| didrocks | ok :) | 08:54 |
| seb128 | slomo, we update some minutes after the tarballs if those are duing work hours ;-) | 08:54 |
| seb128 | slomo, no problem, it's just that the name you picked don't match the debian gir policy | 08:54 |
| seb128 | slomo, ie you didn't use the gir version there for example | 08:54 |
| pitti | Good morning | 08:55 |
| didrocks | (and upstream gir version is incorrect, we have a patch for this release which has been integrated upstream) | 08:55 |
| didrocks | hey pitti | 08:55 |
| seb128 | hello pitti! | 08:55 |
| pitti | crimsun: if we need to keep it, nevermind; I'll just try to trim it a little then | 08:55 |
| * pitti waves bonjour to the French mafia | 08:56 | |
| slomo | seb128: the gir has no version... the only thing that was wrong was the '-' unless i misunderstood the policy | 08:56 |
| slomo | seb128: which version did you add in ubuntu? | 08:56 |
| seb128 | slomo, the "no version" is an upstream bug that didrocks fixed in ubuntu and upstream git | 08:56 |
| slomo | ok | 08:57 |
| seb128 | slomo, http://git.gnome.org/browse/totem-pl-parser/commit/?id=2d51c9ad64a0b4b6504d99e2f29716701bcf0c6b | 08:57 |
| seb128 | slomo, or https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=608176 | 08:57 |
| ubottu | Gnome bug 608176 in General "Gir file aren't properly generated" [Normal,Resolved: fixed] | 08:57 |
| slomo | thanks | 08:58 |
| seb128 | np | 08:59 |
| seb128 | slomo, btw http://launchpadlibrarian.net/38478987/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-i386.gstreamer0.10_0.10.25.2-2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz | 09:00 |
| seb128 | slomo, known issue? | 09:01 |
| pitti | http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-lucid-20100128-1.png | 09:01 |
| seb128 | pitti, any special change in that one? | 09:02 |
| slomo | seb128: no, thanks | 09:02 |
| pitti | seb128: just the daily; but I wanted to look at g-panel | 09:02 |
| pitti | with yesterday's change | 09:02 |
| seb128 | pitti, doesn't seem to make a real difference | 09:03 |
| pitti | *nod* | 09:03 |
| seb128 | still 7 seconds of desktop loading | 09:04 |
| seb128 | almost twice the budget | 09:04 |
| chrisccoulson | good morning everyone | 09:04 |
| pitti | I'll try the new kernel | 09:04 |
| pitti | hey chrisccoulson | 09:04 |
| seb128 | rather 8 seconds | 09:04 |
| seb128 | hey chrisccoulson | 09:04 |
| chrisccoulson | hey pitti - i've got something for you to try this morning. we discussed yesterday about starting gconfd from Xsession.d, so I hosted the work I initially did at http://people.ubuntu.com/~chrisccoulson/desktop-startup-speed/crack/ | 09:05 |
| chrisccoulson | hey seb128, how are you? | 09:05 |
| seb128 | chrisccoulson, a bit tired but good otherwise thanks | 09:05 |
| seb128 | chrisccoulson, you? | 09:05 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - it's not packaged in any way at all, and the helper needs compiling | 09:05 |
| chrisccoulson | seb128 - i'm quite tired too this morning. we have a sick baby, so i didn't get much sleep last night | 09:06 |
| seb128 | oh :-( | 09:06 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: nice! will do | 09:07 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - cool, thanks! | 09:08 |
| seb128 | pitti, seems we won 1 seconds compared to yesterday though | 09:08 |
| seb128 | pitti, do you know what boot speed changes landed yesterday? | 09:08 |
| seb128 | out of the gnome-panel one | 09:08 |
| pitti | seb128: not using gnome-wm any more | 09:09 |
| pitti | that made a big difference | 09:09 |
| seb128 | pitti, that should was 2 days ago though no? | 09:10 |
| seb128 | pitti, it should have been in yesterday's chart of yours? | 09:10 |
| pitti | hm, could be | 09:10 |
| pitti | right, it was | 09:11 |
| pitti | seb128: the new wncksync perhaps | 09:11 |
| seb128 | I'm just wondering if after all the gnome-panel did win some 0.1 seconds | 09:11 |
| pitti | ah, no, that landed Tuesday evening, and was on yesterday's | 09:11 |
| seb128 | bootchart is not reliable enough to be affirmative on such differences | 09:11 |
| pitti | *nod* | 09:12 |
| seb128 | so next win is the background caching | 09:13 |
| seb128 | I still need to investigate the nm-applet today | 09:13 |
| seb128 | and chrisccoulson's gconf change | 09:13 |
| seb128 | pitti, the "sh" process is not on today's daily btw | 09:14 |
| pitti | seb128: it sometimes disappears in the noise | 09:14 |
| seb128 | ok | 09:14 |
| pitti | gosh, is g-s-d still calling xkbcomp? | 09:18 |
| seb128 | pitti, it should not, why? | 09:20 |
| pitti | http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/osiris-lucid-20100127-3.png | 09:21 |
| seb128 | pitti, it's probably coming from libxklavier | 09:26 |
| chrisccoulson | it is | 09:28 |
| chrisccoulson | xkl_config_get_keyboard | 09:28 |
| chrisccoulson | oh, actually, that's not public | 09:29 |
| chrisccoulson | it's xkl_xkb_activate_config_rec | 09:29 |
| seb128 | chrisccoulson, that one is not used in libgnomekbd or g-s-d though... | 09:30 |
| pitti | hm, no difference with 2.6.32-12 | 09:30 |
| seb128 | I've been trying to find which call lead to that without luck though | 09:30 |
| chrisccoulson | hmmm | 09:31 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: | 10:08 |
| pitti | old: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-lucid-20100128-1-2.6.32-12.png | 10:08 |
| pitti | with your hack: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-lucid-20100128-gconf-xsession.d.png | 10:08 |
| seb128 | no win | 10:09 |
| pitti | it increased the latency for the apps a tad (could also be noise, though), and there's still a slight CPU drop | 10:09 |
| pitti | structually it worked, though | 10:09 |
| pitti | I'll check what the difference is to drop sanity-check | 10:09 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: any chance we could sqeeze it before ssh-agent? | 10:19 |
| pitti | http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-lucid-20100128-gconf-xsession.d-disabledsanitycheck.png | 10:20 |
| pitti | this ^ already looks better | 10:21 |
| seb128 | seems to win 0.1 second? | 10:22 |
| * pitti tries 91x11-gconfd-helper | 10:22 | |
| === kermiac is now known as Kermiac_ | ||
| pitti | no real difference | 10:27 |
| === Kermiac_ is now known as Kermiac | ||
| didrocks | seb128, pitti: wallpaper caching seems to work well, I'll do additional test this afternoon | 10:30 |
| * didrocks gets in Paris to meet lool | 10:30 | |
| pitti | didrocks: wow! | 10:30 |
| pitti | didrocks: where are you doing this? postinst magic? or at runtime? | 10:30 |
| didrocks | pitti: runtime | 10:30 |
| * didrocks back in a couple of hours | 10:31 | |
| pitti | o/ | 10:31 |
| pitti | didrocks: let's look over this when you are back; there are some gotchas that come to my mind | 10:32 |
| baptistemm | hello | 10:36 |
| pitti | eww, gst-plugins-bad now pulls in jack | 10:37 |
| pitti | is that intended? | 10:38 |
| seb128_ | dunno | 10:38 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - just checking the scrollback | 10:52 |
| chrisccoulson | (sorry, i was away from my desk) | 10:52 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - is this with my build of gconf too? | 10:53 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: no, stock lucid otherwise | 10:54 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: shall I reinstall your other packages again? | 10:54 |
| chrisccoulson | i think i need to hack gnome-session to comment out the gconf_init bit, to stop it from spawning gconf-sanity-check | 10:54 |
| pitti | I just chmodded that to 0 | 10:54 |
| chrisccoulson | also, gconfd has to be loaded with a working session bus, so it can't load before ssh-agent unfortunately | 10:54 |
| === asac_ is now known as asac | ||
| seb128_ | so compiz is much less busy when delayed | 10:55 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: I thought it just needs to be dbus-launch gconfhelper ssh-agent gnome-session ? | 10:55 |
| seb128_ | (just checking delay desktop boot on the mini to see how that changed) | 10:56 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti, yeah, we could do it that way. i think it is currently ssh-agent dbus-launch gcond-helper gnome-session isn't it? | 10:56 |
| seb128_ | seems quite some compiz work is due to things moving on screen | 10:56 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: I moved the gconfhelper to 91, that should have done it; no real difference in the chart, thuogh | 10:56 |
| pitti | seb128_: ah, due to re-rendering? | 10:56 |
| seb128_ | pitti, that's what amaranth suggested | 10:56 |
| seb128_ | the compiz bar is also twice less busy when using a sleep 5 to start it | 10:57 |
| seb128_ | it takes less than 5 second then | 10:57 |
| vuntz | pitti, chrisccoulson: may I ask why you still put ssh-agent everywhere? :-) | 10:57 |
| seb128_ | rather than some 9 seconds | 10:57 |
| chrisccoulson | vuntz - good question ;) | 10:57 |
| pitti | for the non-GNOME sessions and for people who prefer the openssh agent | 10:57 |
| seb128_ | vuntz, we don't, the script check if ssh-agent should be used or not | 10:57 |
| vuntz | (not that it'd be a huge win, but well) | 10:57 |
| pitti | seb128_: well, that was the plan, but I gave up on it | 10:58 |
| vuntz | seb128_: ah, ok | 10:58 |
| seb128_ | vuntz, also the openssh maintainer argue than ssh-agent is robust compared to gnome-keyring | 10:58 |
| seb128_ | vuntz, so that we should make hard to opt gnome-keyring out | 10:58 |
| pitti | since asking gconf whether gnome-keyring will have ssh agent support is more expensive than just starting it | 10:58 |
| vuntz | pitti: so, if you're using GNOME, it's not possible to use the ssh-agent launched in the startup scripts | 10:58 |
| seb128_ | vuntz, not to mention features gnome-keyring lacks | 10:58 |
| pitti | vuntz: if it was so easy.. | 10:58 |
| vuntz | ah, yes, unless you look at the gconf key | 10:58 |
| vuntz | hrm | 10:58 |
| pitti | vuntz: in reality, it's "if you are using gnome _and_ yuo did not disable the g-keyring gconf key" | 10:59 |
| seb128_ | vuntz, we were considering using ssh-agent instead of gnome-keyring as an agant | 10:59 |
| seb128_ | agent | 10:59 |
| vuntz | pitti: indeed, I forgot about the gconf key | 10:59 |
| pitti | vuntz: and since ssh-agent has to start before g-keyring, it becomes a game of looking into the future | 10:59 |
| vuntz | on the other hand... | 11:00 |
| vuntz | a workaround would be to have ssh-agent started by gnome-session in the initialization phase, and set the env var via the gnome-session dbus method | 11:00 |
| vuntz | (using a wrapper app, I guess) | 11:00 |
| vuntz | but then, might not be worth the 0.05s win | 11:01 |
| vuntz | or whatever it is | 11:01 |
| seb128_ | we still need it to be started out of GNOME though | 11:01 |
| vuntz | seb128_: why? | 11:01 |
| pitti | XFCE and the like | 11:01 |
| vuntz | ah, I misunderstood. Yes, of course | 11:02 |
| pitti | although we could just package this script separately | 11:02 |
| pitti | and pull it in with XFCE, etc. | 11:02 |
| pitti | but not in UNE | 11:02 |
| seb128_ | would help those boxes with several desktops installed | 11:02 |
| seb128_ | like une session on ubuntu desktop | 11:02 |
| vuntz | but yeah, in the end, it's probably not worth it, so just discard what I said for now ;-) | 11:02 |
| pitti | by and large I think the "package separately" idea will work best | 11:03 |
| seb128_ | the easier would be to disable gnome-keyring agent and just use the ssh one everybody | 11:03 |
| seb128_ | one *for* everybody | 11:03 |
| pitti | or that | 11:03 |
| pitti | but you loose a lot of nice integration with that | 11:03 |
| seb128_ | I'm not sure how much the agent is "integrated" | 11:03 |
| pitti | openssh's doesn't cache passphrases by default | 11:03 |
| pitti | and you have no way to put it into your normal keyring, of course | 11:04 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - sorry, i didn't see the 3rd chart there when you dropped gconf-sanity-check | 11:04 |
| seb128_ | right... | 11:04 |
| chrisccoulson | i just saw it now | 11:04 |
| pitti | from my POV, g-keyring is so much nicer than the openssh one | 11:04 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - how are you measuring the improvement on the bootchart? | 11:05 |
| seb128_ | right | 11:05 |
| * pitti reduces the gconf loading time by 10% with some silly seddery trick and wonders if it's worth it | 11:05 | |
| seb128_ | what did you sed out? | 11:05 |
| chrisccoulson | the red line doesnt seem to move, but g-s-d starts quite a bit earlier | 11:05 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: first, looking at the latency of the general app stage, and second looking at the time between the long gnome-session start line and the red "end" line | 11:06 |
| pitti | seb128_: tabs, empty string default values, and mtime | 11:06 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - what about comments? | 11:06 |
| pitti | what annoys me much more is that this has millions of locale specific defaults | 11:07 |
| seb128_ | I would have though that space, etc would win so much | 11:07 |
| pitti | which would be handled much more elegantly with gettext | 11:07 |
| seb128_ | wouldn't | 11:07 |
| pitti | seb128_: well, that alone reduces it from 2.2 to 1.8 MB | 11:07 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: it doesn't have any | 11:07 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - there's no short and long descriptions in the defaults? | 11:08 |
| pitti | there are | 11:08 |
| chrisccoulson | do we need them? | 11:08 |
| pitti | hah, another such thing: %s/short_desc=""//g | 11:08 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: unfortunately yes | 11:08 |
| chrisccoulson | :( | 11:08 |
| pitti | I think the biggest potential win would be to throw out locale specific defualts and get them through gettext | 11:09 |
| seb128_ | then you would get the "load the mo files to get the value".. | 11:09 |
| seb128_ | which I'm not sure would turn to be a win | 11:09 |
| pitti | that could be done on the client side only, though | 11:09 |
| pitti | similar to the translated descriptiosn | 11:09 |
| seb128_ | well I though you didn't do it for the values to avoid the mo reading? | 11:10 |
| pitti | I just didn't consider teh values at all back then | 11:10 |
| seb128_ | are you sure? | 11:10 |
| pitti | I thought they were for real localized default values | 11:10 |
| seb128_ | I though we discussed that | 11:10 |
| pitti | not for translated text strings | 11:10 |
| pitti | seb128_: I'm not sure, no | 11:10 |
| pitti | <entry name="description" | 11:11 |
| pitti | <stringvalue>CD 수준의 | 11:11 |
| pitti | [...] | 11:11 |
| pitti | this is pure abuse of gconf | 11:11 |
| pitti | having a gconf value being used as a three-line text value which is human visible | 11:11 |
| seb128_ | well usually translation of default are for specific usecases... | 11:11 |
| seb128_ | like gedit has a key with default encodings | 11:11 |
| pitti | yeah, it does make sense for those | 11:11 |
| seb128_ | the one you describe seems a bug | 11:12 |
| seb128_ | do we have many of those? | 11:12 |
| pitti | but gnome-media is really abusing it | 11:12 |
| pitti | /usr/share/gconf/schemas/gnome-audio-profiles.schemas | 11:13 |
| pitti | that's plain crazy | 11:13 |
| seb128_ | urg, yes | 11:14 |
| === seb128_ is now known as seb128 | ||
| pitti | seb128: moving away /usr/share/gconf/schemas/gnome-audio-profiles.schemas alone already saves 10% | 11:17 |
| pitti | and reduces file size from 2.3 to 2.0 MB | 11:17 |
| pitti | this might be worth fixing in the package itself | 11:19 |
| seb128 | what do you call "fix"? | 11:20 |
| pitti | drop the audio profile descriptions from gconf | 11:20 |
| seb128 | to put it where? | 11:20 |
| pitti | using gettext on the value in the app itself perhaps? | 11:21 |
| seb128 | pitti, well those profiles are used in different apps | 11:21 |
| seb128 | ie rhythmbox let you choose the profile to use on cd copies | 11:21 |
| pitti | well, it was just an idea | 11:22 |
| pitti | but this is not "configuration", it's a huge translation database | 11:22 |
| pitti | anyway,just looking at the hogs here | 11:22 |
| seb128 | right, wrong use in any case, but I can understand why they do that | 11:22 |
| pitti | with the easy seddery we already win 10%, so that might be worth doing | 11:22 |
| seb128 | should rather be a file on disk | 11:22 |
| pitti | *nod* | 11:22 |
| seb128 | how much are we speaking about btw? | 11:22 |
| seb128 | gconf is 0.5s? | 11:23 |
| pitti | with a libgnome-media API around | 11:23 |
| seb128 | so 10% is 50ms? | 11:23 |
| pitti | somethign like this | 11:23 |
| pitti | little effort, little gain kind of thing | 11:23 |
| seb128 | right, I was rather thinking about either it's worth breaking the profiles thing if that requires apps updates | 11:23 |
| seb128 | I'm trying to check if they use the libgnome-media lib to get those | 11:24 |
| seb128 | or if things get the gconf values directly | 11:24 |
| pitti | the three compiz-*schemas are huge as well | 11:24 |
| pitti | l -Sr /usr/share/gconf/schemas/ | 11:25 |
| pitti | ls -lSr /usr/share/gconf/schemas/ | 11:25 |
| pitti | sorry | 11:25 |
| * pitti checks if compiz is installed by default | 11:25 | |
| seb128 | tomboy too | 11:25 |
| pitti | oh? | 11:26 |
| pitti | oh, I purged it from my laptop, so I don't see it | 11:26 |
| * pitti does on the mini | 11:26 | |
| seb128 | pitti, the tomboy schemas seems to not be stripped from translations | 11:27 |
| seb128 | what build component does that again? cdbs | 11:27 |
| seb128 | tomboy doesn't use cdbs | 11:27 |
| pitti | /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/langpack.mk | 11:28 |
| pitti | GETTEXT_DOMAIN="$$DOMAIN" perl /usr/lib/cdbs/strip-schema.pl $$d > $$d.new; mv $$d.new $$d | 11:28 |
| pitti | urgh | 11:28 |
| pitti | indeed, tomboy should be fixed | 11:28 |
| seb128 | they use dh7 | 11:29 |
| pitti | seb128: you could just add the strip-schema.pl call to debian/rules manually? | 11:29 |
| seb128 | yes | 11:29 |
| seb128 | I will do that | 11:29 |
| seb128 | the .desktop doesn't have the gettext domain either | 11:30 |
| seb128 | we should make those cdbs magics work on dh7 too one day | 11:30 |
| pitti | why does libcompizconfig0 depend on compiz-core? | 11:30 |
| pitti | ah, nevermind; can be purgd along | 11:31 |
| * pitti unseeds compiz from netbook then | 11:33 | |
| pitti | $ bzr commit -m 'drop compiz, we use mutter now' | 11:33 |
| pitti | that was an easy one :-) | 11:33 |
| seb128 | does it make any difference on boot? | 11:34 |
| pitti | twiddling thumnbs, waiting on bootchart | 11:34 |
| seb128 | we didn't want to have a GNOME session on UNE install? | 11:34 |
| pitti | you can install it (apt-get install ubuntu-desktop) | 11:34 |
| seb128 | right, I meant by default | 11:35 |
| pitti | didrocks: ^ | 11:35 |
| pitti | I don't konw | 11:35 |
| seb128 | I didn't use the une a lot before this cycle | 11:35 |
| seb128 | but they use to have a desktop switcher | 11:35 |
| seb128 | I know rick says he uses the GNOME mode to hack usually | 11:35 |
| seb128 | and the une mode for other things | 11:35 |
| seb128 | use -> used | 11:35 |
| pitti | well, but structurally the "netbook" seed should stop pulling in compiz | 11:36 |
| seb128 | pitti, didrocks is not around I think, let him reply later | 11:36 |
| pitti | if we want to add GNOME to the UNE build, it should be pulled in through the desktop seed | 11:36 |
| seb128 | he's having lunch with lool today iirc | 11:36 |
| pitti | so I'm not actually sure whether that really dropped compiz | 11:36 |
| seb128 | ok | 11:36 |
| pitti | but we didn't drop compiz from the netbook seed when changing from netbook-launcher to the mutter plugin | 11:37 |
| seb128 | still worth doing a chart without compiz | 11:37 |
| kklimonda | pitti, is mutter going to replace both compiz and nautilus in lucid? | 11:38 |
| pitti | seb128: nice one; gconf reduced to 60% after purging tomboy and compiz | 11:39 |
| pitti | kklimonda: no, nautilus stays around as a file browser; it just won't render the desktop (as in previous UNEs) | 11:39 |
| kklimonda | erm, I was thinking about metacity.. | 11:40 |
| kklimonda | my bad | 11:40 |
| pitti | kklimonda: yes, mutter is a composite-enabled fork of metacity | 11:40 |
| pitti | seb128: hmm | 11:51 |
| pitti | seb128: WDYT about removing the locale defaults for locales which aren't actually available on the system? | 11:51 |
| pitti | seb128: I thought about writing a "gconf-trim-defaults" script (via dpkg trigger) which removes the tabs, empty defaults, etc.; this could also filter out those localized default values which we don't need | 11:52 |
| pitti | I'll write such a thing and see what difference it'll make | 11:54 |
| pitti | ... after lunch | 11:54 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - could that not be added to whatever registers the schemas? | 11:54 |
| chrisccoulson | rather than adding another script? | 11:54 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: could, yes | 11:54 |
| pitti | gconf-schemas is python, but it calls gconftool | 11:55 |
| pitti | and there it becomes hairy and requries touching C | 11:55 |
| pitti | I'll see whether this will be easier, though | 11:55 |
| pitti | it would be more elegant for sure | 11:55 |
| seb128 | pitti, sorry i was away for lunch | 12:26 |
| seb128 | pitti, could we split the .xml by locale as upstream is doing? | 12:27 |
| seb128 | pitti, would be even better than have several locales and having to rebuild the file on new locales install... | 12:27 |
| seb128 | you would read one .xml matching your locale only | 12:28 |
| pitti | seb128: we already have per-locale files today | 12:38 |
| pitti | hm, indeed that would be even better | 12:38 |
| pitti | for me it parses /var/lib/gconf/defaults/%gconf-tree.xml first, then /var/lib/gconf/defaults/%gconf-tree-de.xml | 12:39 |
| seb128 | pitti, shouldn't all those translations be stripped from the default one? | 12:41 |
| seb128 | I would expect that one to be C locale... | 12:41 |
| pitti | it is C, yes | 12:41 |
| seb128 | but it has defaults for all locales? | 12:42 |
| pitti | seb128: the only stripping that we do during build right now is localized descriptions (since we can use gettext on them) | 12:42 |
| seb128 | but it has defaults for all locales? | 12:42 |
| seb128 | grrr | 12:42 |
| seb128 | (sorry focus) | 12:42 |
| pitti | I don't know why the locale defaults end up in the C file | 12:42 |
| pitti | I'll investigate this | 12:42 |
| seb128 | pitti, right but upstream does do those by locale xml? | 12:42 |
| seb128 | thanks | 12:42 |
| seb128 | it would be sense to have the defaults in the corresponding xml | 12:43 |
| seb128 | ie the -de.xml for the german defaults | 12:43 |
| seb128 | and not on the C one | 12:43 |
| pitti | agreed | 12:43 |
| pitti | meh | 12:51 |
| pitti | (process:19416): GConf-CRITICAL **: Failed to load file "/var/lib/gconf/defaults/%gconf-tree-de.xml": Line 162 character 1: Element <default> is not allowed below <local_schema> | 12:51 |
| pitti | seems the %gconf-tree-locale.xml file is only for descriptions?? | 12:52 |
| seb128 | vuntz, ^ do you know? | 12:52 |
| pitti | parse_local_schema_child_element() does have a case for <default>, though | 12:53 |
| pitti | and ./backends/markup-tree.c only writes <default> tags if (!is_locale_file ...) | 12:55 |
| seb128 | pitti, oh, I just found an apport bug | 13:24 |
| seb128 | pitti, oh, I just found an apport bug but I'm not sure how you want to fix it | 13:25 |
| seb128 | pitti, the .desktop has no gettext domain or translations stripped | 13:25 |
| seb128 | pitti, that's because the langpack magic looks for GETTEXT_PACKAGE in po/Makefile | 13:26 |
| seb128 | which you don't have | 13:26 |
| seb128 | either create one with "GETTEXT_PACKAGE="apport"" | 13:26 |
| pitti | hm, that .desktop is just for the mimetype link, though; does it need to be translated at all? | 13:26 |
| seb128 | or add debian/rules lines to do the change | 13:26 |
| seb128 | pitti, it's listed in nautilus context menu when right clicking on a .crash | 13:27 |
| seb128 | open with "name" | 13:27 |
| pitti | ah, I see | 13:27 |
| seb128 | do you want a bug about that? | 13:27 |
| pitti | seb128: I'll just manually add it to the desktop file in the ubuntu branch | 13:27 |
| seb128 | it's a minor issue | 13:27 |
| seb128 | but I was checking what .desktop miss the gettext domain and stripping | 13:27 |
| seb128 | I've some 18 of those there | 13:28 |
| seb128 | I will fix some like tomboy and file some bugs | 13:28 |
| seb128 | firefox and openoffice are buggy too | 13:28 |
| dpm | seb128, here are some more that the translations team has been collecting -> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-translations/+bugs?field.tag=needs-desktop-entry-i18n | 13:28 |
| dpm | yeah, ff and oo are in there, too | 13:29 |
| seb128 | I see you have the firefox and openoffice ones | 13:29 |
| dpm | :) | 13:29 |
| seb128 | any reason scim is still in main? I though we used ibus now... | 13:29 |
| pitti | seb128: committed, thanks for spotting | 13:29 |
| seb128 | pitti, thanks! | 13:30 |
| seb128 | pitti, ArneGoetje: ^ scim should go in universe? | 13:32 |
| pitti | seb128: ideally yes | 13:32 |
| seb128 | but in practice there is an issue? | 13:32 |
| pitti | perhaps we kept it in main for karmic for the transition | 13:32 |
| pitti | seb128: deferring to ArneGoetje about that | 13:33 |
| seb128 | ok | 13:33 |
| seb128 | dpm, btw you want to open tasks on the corresponding ubuntu packages if you want somebody in the distribution to ever read those... | 13:36 |
| seb128 | dpm, I did that now for you | 13:36 |
| seb128 | I assigned the firefox and openoffice ones to our team too | 13:37 |
| dpm | thanks seb128! | 13:37 |
| seb128 | pitti, should we move ekiga to universe? | 13:38 |
| pitti | seb128: fine for me; not really maintained anyway, and it won't disappear either way | 13:38 |
| dpm | seb128, on the ones I filed, I wasn't quite sure which was the correct package to open the bug task against - I'll open them on the ubuntu pkgs from now on, thanks for the heads up! | 13:39 |
| seb128 | dpm, you're welcome | 13:39 |
| seb128 | pitti, right but it might be easier to find a motu to work on it | 13:39 |
| pitti | seb128: so, please go ahead and unseed then | 13:40 |
| seb128 | thanks | 13:40 |
| seb128 | didrocks, back from lunch? | 13:42 |
| pitti | -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 2302656 2010-01-28 14:51 %gconf-tree.xml | 13:51 |
| pitti | -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1486799 2010-01-28 14:51 %gconf-tree.xml.new | 13:51 |
| pitti | now, not too bad for such a gross hack | 13:51 |
| didrocks | seb128: right, finishing to backlog :) | 13:51 |
| pitti | hey didrocks, enjoyed an elaborate Parisian lunch? | 13:51 |
| didrocks | pitti: italian food in fact :) | 13:52 |
| didrocks | but it was good ;) | 13:52 |
| seb128 | didrocks, after a 3 hours lunch time for a nap now right? ;-) | 13:52 |
| seb128 | didrocks, could you push the work you did on tomboy the other day? I've other changes to do on it | 13:53 |
| seb128 | didrocks, I think you said you started on the version update | 13:53 |
| didrocks | seb128: not really :-) the longest part was to go to Paris and to come back (and also, to take some dollars in La Poste) | 13:53 |
| seb128 | lol | 13:53 |
| seb128 | another of those people taking money before leaving! ;-) | 13:53 |
| didrocks | seb128: didn't have the time to work on the update. It was failing and I delayed it (huats was supposed to tackle it) | 13:53 |
| didrocks | seb128: right :) | 13:53 |
| seb128 | didrocks, ok, it's not failing there, so doing it, thanks | 13:54 |
| didrocks | pitti: seb128: concerning your question about GNOME desktop session in UNE | 13:54 |
| didrocks | seb128: oh? really? perfect so… strange, maybe a bad lib :/ | 13:54 |
| seb128 | didrocks, you probably didn't update the build-depends for the mono changes | 13:54 |
| seb128 | they put the .pc in new binaries | 13:54 |
| didrocks | seb128: I guess something related to that, right | 13:54 |
| Laney | you should look at what we did to tomboy in debian | 13:54 |
| didrocks | so, there will be a GNOME session available (gnome.desktop is shipped by gdm package) | 13:55 |
| didrocks | but it won't have all ubuntu-dekstop seed package (and so, no more compiz if we drop it from UNE seed) | 13:55 |
| didrocks | people will have to install ubuntu-desktop to get those back | 13:55 |
| seb128 | Laney, I'm looking at that and fixing it too, the switch from cdbs to dh7 broke all the translations magics be have | 13:55 |
| seb128 | be -> we | 13:56 |
| seb128 | Laney, some for f-spot | 13:56 |
| didrocks | maybe, we can notify the first time the user "you don't have all apps from ubuntu-desktop full experience, do you want to install them?" | 13:56 |
| seb128 | same | 13:56 |
| Laney | seb128: didn't we add that in debian? | 13:56 |
| seb128 | Laney, you added the template update | 13:56 |
| seb128 | Laney, not the "add the ubuntu gettext domain" not the "strip translations from the desktop entry" | 13:57 |
| seb128 | Laney, not the "clean the schemas" | 13:57 |
| Laney | ok well if you have not-too-intrusive patches then we can take them | 13:57 |
| seb128 | I doubt you want to add ubuntu gettext domains in debian... | 13:57 |
| seb128 | I'm pondering switching it back to cdbs in ubuntu | 13:57 |
| Laney | those are handled transparently by cdbs? | 13:57 |
| seb128 | yes | 13:58 |
| Laney | well i would wonder if the same cannot be done for dh | 13:58 |
| seb128 | it can probably | 13:58 |
| seb128 | but until somebody steps for that... | 13:58 |
| Laney | it would probably be less long term work | 13:58 |
| Laney | than merging all the time | 13:59 |
| seb128 | we don't need to merge | 13:59 |
| seb128 | we usually have newer version than debian anyway | 13:59 |
| seb128 | but well, would be nice in any case yes | 13:59 |
| czajkowski | Could anyone explain - why does Software Centre present a "different version" than apt-get or an actual package GUI ? | 14:00 |
| czajkowski | to me ? | 14:00 |
| seb128 | czajkowski, hi, what version of ubuntu and do you have a specific example? | 14:00 |
| pitti | nice, that script shrinks %gconf-tree.xml from 1.7 MB to 910 kB | 14:00 |
| seb128 | pitti, waouh | 14:01 |
| czajkowski | seb128: Karmic fresh install | 14:01 |
| pitti | seb128: I added the trimming to gconf-schemas now | 14:01 |
| pitti | seb128: it just means that I need to add a --register-all call to locale-gen when adding a new locale | 14:02 |
| seb128 | pitti, did you measure how much speed win that makes? | 14:02 |
| seb128 | pitti, do you still get the correct default? | 14:02 |
| pitti | seb128: getting to that now | 14:02 |
| seb128 | ok | 14:02 |
| pitti | $ gconftool -g /desktop/gnome/keybindings/onscreenkeyboard/name | 14:10 |
| pitti | that's a good test case | 14:10 |
| pitti | it has localized defaults | 14:10 |
| seb128 | I get an english screen there | 14:10 |
| pitti | "Bildschirmtastatur ein- oder ausschalten" for me | 14:11 |
| pitti | perhaps there's no French translation for that one | 14:11 |
| seb128 | right | 14:11 |
| seb128 | the media profiles you listed before work too for testing | 14:11 |
| pitti | yep | 14:11 |
| seb128 | bah, strip-schema.pl is in cdbs | 14:12 |
| pitti | ok, so current stripping on my laptop reduces parsing from 0.107137 to 0.0709558 s | 14:12 |
| seb128 | I'm pondering adding a cdbs build-depends to tomboy | 14:12 |
| seb128 | or doing a local copy | 14:12 |
| pitti | sure | 14:12 |
| seb128 | I think I will go with the build-depends | 14:12 |
| pitti | but on the netbook the cpu is slower | 14:12 |
| * pitti tries another change | 14:12 | |
| seb128 | that's hot cache right? | 14:13 |
| pitti | right | 14:13 |
| pitti | pure CPU | 14:13 |
| seb128 | is there a way to empty cpu cache without disk cache? | 14:14 |
| pitti | "cpu cache"? | 14:14 |
| pitti | ok, removing all the \n just reduces it to 0.0695608 | 14:14 |
| pitti | not really worth it | 14:14 |
| seb128 | well cpu have caching too | 14:14 |
| pitti | well, but I restart the process | 14:15 |
| pitti | (gconf) | 14:15 |
| pitti | I don't think CPU caches are that good | 14:15 |
| pitti | so, confirmed to work, off to doing a bootchart | 14:15 |
| seb128 | I think they are quite useful | 14:16 |
| seb128 | hot cache benchmarks are far from first run ones | 14:16 |
| seb128 | ie gnome-panel starts in 0.6 seconds there | 14:16 |
| seb128 | and it takes over 3 seconds of cpu use on boot | 14:16 |
| pitti | isn't that more because it shares the CPU with a bazillion other processes? | 14:17 |
| seb128 | no | 14:17 |
| seb128 | I made a session entry which runs gnome-panel and not gnome-session | 14:17 |
| seb128 | so there is only it in the session | 14:18 |
| chrisccoulson | good afternoon everyone | 14:24 |
| czajkowski | seb128: any thoughts ? | 14:24 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: wb | 14:24 |
| chrisccoulson | hey pitti | 14:24 |
| seb128 | czajkowski, no, you didn't reply to my questions though | 14:25 |
| czajkowski | I did | 14:25 |
| seb128 | chrisccoulson, hey again | 14:25 |
| czajkowski | 14:01 < czajkowski> seb128: Karmic fresh install | 14:25 |
| seb128 | czajkowski, what about the "do you have a specific example"? | 14:25 |
| czajkowski | didn't see that. I don't it was someone who asked me who's just installed it on a dell machine and I don't have clean install to see. just wondered did anyone know off hand. | 14:26 |
| czajkowski | seb128: sorry. | 14:26 |
| seb128 | I don't know then but maybe mvo does | 14:26 |
| * pitti grins at http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-lucid-20100128-optimized-gconf-defaults.png | 14:27 | |
| pitti | chrisccoulson, seb128 ^ | 14:27 |
| pitti | much better | 14:27 |
| seb128 | nice | 14:27 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - what did you change? | 14:27 |
| mvo | czajkowski: that sounds like a bug, what version number are there? | 14:27 |
| seb128 | pitti, seems another 0.3 seconds win | 14:28 |
| seb128 | so we are down to 7 seconds login | 14:28 |
| czajkowski | mvo: I can try and find out | 14:28 |
| seb128 | Laney, did you send your tomboy .pc change upstream btw? | 14:30 |
| Laney | no, I mentioned it in IRC afaik but didn't file a report yet | 14:32 |
| seb128 | could you do that? | 14:32 |
| Laney | its on the stack | 14:32 |
| Laney | i should make that into a queue one day... | 14:32 |
| seb128 | Laney, thanks | 14:33 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: trimmed %gconf-tree.xml | 14:39 |
| * pitti packages the stuff now | 14:40 | |
| rickspencer3 | kenvandine, working with Gwibber via desktopcouch is incredibly easy | 14:40 |
| rickspencer3 | last night I was easily able to pull all the images in the streams in | 14:40 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - awesome. so, you didn't need to make any actual changes to gconf itself? | 14:41 |
| rickspencer3 | tonight I will use the protocol settings to go up to facebook and pull down albums and such | 14:41 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: no; I'm very hesitant to doing that, since it will immediately also apply to user's gconf, etc. | 14:41 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: and I don't want the locale sorting there | 14:41 |
| pitti | like calling locale -a, etc. | 14:41 |
| pitti | or suppressing them | 14:41 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: it's not a very clean solution, but then again gconf is an evolutionary dead-end anyway | 14:42 |
| kenvandine | rickspencer3, awesome! | 14:42 |
| pitti | so hacking it is bearable, I think | 14:42 |
| kenvandine | rickspencer3, desktopcouch really makes things far simpler | 14:42 |
| chrisccoulson | thats good anyway, that's the one thing that was delaying the whole session from loading | 14:42 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: do you think it's worth doing another chart with your patched gconf/gsd _and_ the early start of gconf? | 14:45 |
| pitti | (recent chart reverted both of that, for better comparability) | 14:45 |
| tseliot | pitti: shall I merge all the things from jockey trunk or only my commit with the ubuntu branch? | 14:55 |
| pitti | tseliot: are there so many more? yes, a general merge is easier | 14:56 |
| tseliot | pitti: a few kde and test related things | 14:56 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - it would be worth doing it with the patched gconf and gconf early start stuff | 14:59 |
| pitti | seb128, chrisccoulson: AFAICS that's about as much as we can do with an adequate amount of effort, so I close the WI for now | 14:59 |
| pitti | we can revisit it again later on if necessary | 14:59 |
| seb128 | pitti, on gconf you mean? | 14:59 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: ack | 14:59 |
| seb128 | pitti, or on boot sequence out of optimizing code now? | 14:59 |
| pitti | seb128: yes; I don't know what else to take out, and I'm not yet despearate enough to write a new gconf backend just yet | 14:59 |
| pitti | seb128: with a different file format we'll still need some CPU time to load everything | 15:00 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: will do now | 15:00 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: that will introduce the hardcoded gnome-wm file again, won't it? or should I just try with the updated gconf package and leave g-s-d alone? | 15:01 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - yeah, i'd forget about gnome-session and g-s-d for now, as I don't think they'll give that much win with the gconf changes | 15:02 |
| chrisccoulson | it would be good to see if starting gconfd earlier helps though (and not calling gconf-sanity-check) | 15:02 |
| pitti | g-sanity-check is still disabled here | 15:02 |
| pitti | do we really need to run it? | 15:02 |
| pitti | i. e. does it keep the user from running a session if something is damaged, etc.? | 15:03 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - all it does is pop up an error dialog if the configuration sources are broken or it can't do file locking etc | 15:04 |
| chrisccoulson | it doesn't block the session from loading, and the error message isn't useful anyway | 15:04 |
| pitti | hm, I guess we should continue to install it | 15:04 |
| pitti | and then perhaps just not call it from g-s | 15:05 |
| pitti | so that you at least can run it manually for debugging? | 15:05 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - it only runs properly before gconfd is started (ie, it doesn't do a lot when it's already running) | 15:05 |
| chrisccoulson | so, once gconfd is started, it's no use really | 15:06 |
| pitti | so with the 56gconf Xsession.d script it's just a waste either way? | 15:06 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - yeah, it is | 15:06 |
| seb128 | bah | 15:08 |
| seb128 | I'm wondering what buildds are so busy with today | 15:08 |
| seb128 | uploads on i386 get over 10 hours delay now | 15:08 |
| seb128 | before starting build | 15:08 |
| pitti | openjdk, linux | 15:08 |
| pitti | https://edge.launchpad.net/builders | 15:09 |
| pitti | and now OO.o | 15:09 |
| chrisccoulson | there was an openoffice upload 21 hours ago too | 15:09 |
| chrisccoulson | ah | 15:09 |
| pitti | it was blocked by a MIR | 15:09 |
| chrisccoulson | oh yeah, openoffice is currently building | 15:09 |
| pitti | I promoted that package some 4 hours ago | 15:09 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-lucid-20100128-optimized-gconf-defaults.png | 15:13 |
| pitti | ^ old | 15:14 |
| pitti | http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-lucid-20100128-gconf-xsession.d-disabledsanitycheck-optimized-gconf-defaults.png | 15:14 |
| pitti | ^ with your hacked gconf and early gconf loading | 15:14 |
| chrisccoulson | hmmm, it seems to make it slower | 15:14 |
| pitti | it doesn't really seem to help indeed | 15:15 |
| pitti | and it doesn't help to fill in the empty CPU slot either :( | 15:15 |
| pitti | we just get a new I/O wait spike | 15:15 |
| pitti | I wonder why | 15:15 |
| pitti | in gnome-session | 15:15 |
| * lool is finally home | 15:15 | |
| rickspencer3 | hi lool, welcome home! | 15:16 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: want me to include your gconf patch in my upload? | 15:16 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: that by itself shouldn't make a big difference, since gconfd is triggered on first use anyway | 15:17 |
| lool | asac: So didrocks has the board + a SATA 2.5" hard disk + a SATA cable; packed in a marvell box with foam | 15:17 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - i don't think it's worth including it yet until i understand why it's not making any difference | 15:17 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: but it doesn't hurt either | 15:17 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: ok | 15:17 |
| pitti | then I'll just upload the %gconf-tree.xml deflating for now | 15:17 |
| lool | asac: The hard disk probably has an installed system; feel free to wipe it | 15:17 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: thanks a lot so far! (don't worry, we'll crack this nut) | 15:17 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - i'm still confused what the 0.5 second gap is where gnome-sesion appears to be doing nothing | 15:18 |
| chrisccoulson | the gap wasn't shown on the profiling work i did, and i'm convinced it's actually not really gnome-session yet at that point (that bar becomes gnome-session at some point, but doesn't start life as that) | 15:19 |
| asac | lool: you rock!!! | 15:19 |
| seb128 | pitti, useful hint from rickspencer3, you can change the mini fn keys behaviour in the bios to do fn directly | 15:19 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: the gnome-session bar starts out as ssh-agent; couln't it be that? | 15:19 |
| seb128 | without to use the fn key | 15:19 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - yeah, i'm fairly sure what happens, but didn't you already profile ssh-agent? | 15:19 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: gnome-session starts right at the time when the ssh-agent process starts on the chart | 15:20 |
| pitti | ssh-agent initializes, forks, and execs g-s in the parent | 15:21 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - yeah, that seems to be the case | 15:21 |
| pitti | so it seems g-s is having its small CPU blip right at the start | 15:21 |
| chrisccoulson | (although, it's actually ssh-agent -> dbus-launch -> gnome-session) | 15:21 |
| chrisccoulson | but dbus-launch fork's and exec's so quickly that it doesnt have any effect | 15:21 |
| pitti | ah, right | 15:21 |
| pitti | I'm off for some 30 minutes for some fresh air and buying new printer toner | 15:22 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - the small CPU blip is expected as it loads the autostart files | 15:22 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: yes, and a program which doesn't even do such a small blip is probably not worth having in the first place :) | 15:22 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - yeah, definately :) | 15:23 |
| chrisccoulson | ssh-agent isn't taking 0.5 seconds to fork is it? | 15:23 |
| pitti | it's not that much | 15:23 |
| chrisccoulson | so, that bar must be starting life as something else | 15:23 |
| pitti | I did a comparison without it yesterday, and it's impact is below the noise level | 15:23 |
| chrisccoulson | perhaps something gdm related? | 15:23 |
| pitti | I don't truly understand why we have the ssh-agent offset, but g-s-d doesn't start any earlier when removing ssh-agent | 15:24 |
| chrisccoulson | yeah, so i think we're looking at the wrong thing then | 15:24 |
| chrisccoulson | that process must start life as something other than ssh-agent | 15:25 |
| pitti | 90consolekit should be intert | 15:25 |
| pitti | inert | 15:25 |
| pitti | there's dbus-launch | 15:25 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: perhaps it's just the general shellery from Xsession.d/* ? | 15:26 |
| pitti | that calls some programs as well | 15:26 |
| pitti | tests, stats, readlink, etc. | 15:26 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: I'll try removing xsession.d/* and check its impact when I'm back home | 15:27 |
| * pitti -> really out now | 15:27 | |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - so, that bar actually starts out as gdm-session-worker | 15:40 |
| chrisccoulson | the delay could be there | 15:40 |
| chrisccoulson | asac - did you have a look through the GVFS diff you attached to bug 512959? | 15:56 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 512959 in gvfs "nautilus assert failure: *** stack smashing detected ***: nautilus terminated" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/512959 | 15:56 |
| chrisccoulson | asac - this looks wrong to me: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/364651/ | 16:01 |
| chrisccoulson | "current" isn't an array of strings | 16:01 |
| chrisccoulson | oh, hang on | 16:03 |
| chrisccoulson | it is | 16:03 |
| chrisccoulson | the diff is confusing though without looking at the whole file | 16:03 |
| asac | chrisccoulson: i just made the diff | 16:04 |
| asac | yeah | 16:04 |
| asac | that looked suspicious to me on a quick glance too | 16:04 |
| chrisccoulson | i don't think that's the issue though | 16:04 |
| === robbiew_ is now known as robbiew | ||
| asac | what does meta_tree_lookup_string do ? | 16:04 |
| chrisccoulson | "current" is defined twice in the same file, not very far apart (once as a string, and then again as a string array a bit further down), but i don't think that's the issue | 16:05 |
| seb128 | not easy to say what the issue is without a correct stacktrace | 16:06 |
| seb128 | the bug stacktrace has only 3 ?? in libc... | 16:07 |
| didrocks | pitti: wallpaper cache is now ready and warning cleaned :) You talked about some gotchas to think about, what are they? | 16:09 |
| seb128 | didrocks, do you need patch review? | 16:10 |
| seb128 | or did pitti do that already for you? | 16:10 |
| didrocks | seb128: he didn't yet, if you want, let me make a final test before pastebinit somewhere | 16:10 |
| seb128 | ok | 16:10 |
| seb128 | didrocks, what gotchas are you talking about? | 16:11 |
| didrocks | seb128: don't know, just backlogged and see "pitti | didrocks: let's look over this when you are back; there are some gotchas that come to my mind" | 16:11 |
| seb128 | ok | 16:12 |
| asac | chrisccoulson: i think i need to get the full code to understand what might be problematic | 16:12 |
| asac | chrisccoulson: what is in gvfs-common? | 16:12 |
| asac | maybe we can narrow it down a bit like that | 16:13 |
| asac | libgvfscommon i think | 16:13 |
| seb128 | asac, can somebody maybe get a stracktrace? | 16:13 |
| asac | of a stack smack? thats probably a bad one | 16:14 |
| asac | but sure | 16:14 |
| * asac forwards | 16:14 | |
| seb128 | well valgrind log would be useful | 16:14 |
| seb128 | but apparently you don't have valgrind there | 16:14 |
| seb128 | not sure what we can get from a stacktrace but worth looking | 16:15 |
| chrisccoulson | the changes in libgvfscommon are minimal | 16:15 |
| chrisccoulson | in that delta | 16:15 |
| rickspencer3 | desktoppers ... hey ... if you are attending the sprint next week, please add goals to the wiki | 16:17 |
| rickspencer3 | it's looking a bit slim atm | 16:17 |
| rickspencer3 | ArneGoetje, bryceh, ccheney, didrocks, kenvandine, pitti, seb128 ^ | 16:18 |
| rickspencer3 | who did I orget? | 16:18 |
| rickspencer3 | Riddell, ^ | 16:18 |
| rickspencer3 | tseliot, ^ | 16:18 |
| kenvandine | ok | 16:20 |
| didrocks | seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/364665/ | 16:20 |
| didrocks | rickspencer3: ok, will do | 16:21 |
| seb128 | didrocks, you can use g_build_filename rather there | 16:22 |
| didrocks | seb128: ok, changing that | 16:23 |
| Nafai | where are you guys sprinting? | 16:28 |
| rickspencer3 | Nafai Portland, OR | 16:32 |
| seb128 | didrocks, one issue is that we don't do clean caches there | 16:33 |
| didrocks | seb128: right, I was targetting that one second attempt, as I don't think that we'll have too many file from user | 16:34 |
| seb128 | one other issue is that not every api customer might want that | 16:34 |
| didrocks | seb128: another issue is that we cache thumbnails too | 16:34 |
| seb128 | should probably require a new api or adding a parameter | 16:34 |
| didrocks | hum, a switch? | 16:35 |
| seb128 | yes | 16:35 |
| seb128 | though adding a switch would mean breaking abi... | 16:35 |
| seb128 | I start wondering if that's specific enough to the wallpaper case to be on the g-s-d side | 16:35 |
| seb128 | could be nice to check maybe with vuntz what he thinks as upstream there | 16:36 |
| seb128 | vuntz, ^ any opinion if background image caching should be done in gnome-bg? | 16:36 |
| huats | does anyone running karmic on amd64 experience firefox crashes after a few minutes ? | 16:36 |
| seb128 | not me | 16:37 |
| qense | not here as well | 16:37 |
| hyperair | not me either | 16:37 |
| huats | pfff I don't understand then | 16:37 |
| hyperair | but then i'm using the daily firefox. | 16:37 |
| huats | thanks everyone | 16:37 |
| om26er | I have seen many empathy bugs assigned to ubuntu-desktop even if they are upstream. so when triaging an empathy bug should I assign them to ubuntu desktop? | 16:37 |
| seb128 | huats, well I'm neither using karmic nor amd64 so I can't confirm either way | 16:38 |
| huats | seb128, and btw I am ready for some updates | 16:38 |
| huats | I'll have a look at the page | 16:38 |
| seb128 | huats, you can do gnome-menus if you want | 16:38 |
| huats | ok I am it then | 16:38 |
| seb128 | huats, how are you btw? is everybody doing fine? | 16:39 |
| huats | seb128, everyone is great ! | 16:39 |
| huats | :) | 16:39 |
| huats | I am just back home :) | 16:39 |
| huats | thanks ! | 16:39 |
| seb128 | good to know ;-) | 16:40 |
| huats | yep :D | 16:40 |
| seb128 | don't feel forced to work on updates | 16:40 |
| seb128 | you probably have plenty to do out of computer work atm | 16:40 |
| didrocks | seb128: new version available at http://paste.ubuntu.com/364677/ using g_build_filename and fixing a memleak | 16:41 |
| pitti | re | 16:41 |
| pitti | seb128, didrocks: gotchas> like, if you generate the cache as part of g-s-d, you'll have two effects: | 16:41 |
| pitti | 1) you won't benefit from ureadahead (since that will read the big file, not the small cached one) | 16:42 |
| seb128 | pitti, wb | 16:42 |
| huats | seb128, actually I do have a lot to do, but I am really happy to find some little time to do some updates... | 16:42 |
| pitti | 2) every use needs its own cache file | 16:42 |
| chrisccoulson | huats - you have a baby now? | 16:42 |
| pitti | 3) it clutters the home dir (but that's the least of my concerns) | 16:42 |
| huats | YES ! | 16:42 |
| seb128 | huats, ok ;-) | 16:42 |
| huats | chrisccoulson, a lille guy | 16:42 |
| chrisccoulson | huats - congratulations :) | 16:42 |
| Tm_T | huats: noooooooo! | 16:42 |
| pitti | huats: oh, congratulations! | 16:42 |
| didrocks | pitti: right, it's currently at ~/.cache/wallpaper for every users | 16:42 |
| huats | theo is born last week exactly :) | 16:43 |
| seb128 | pitti, about 2) the change is to gnome-desktop gnome-bg api | 16:43 |
| Tm_T | huats: congrats (: | 16:43 |
| seb128 | pitti, but as said before I think we need to add a flag for cache use rather than make every client do caching automatically | 16:43 |
| huats | thanks everyone | 16:43 |
| Tm_T | huats: I have little over 1-year old daughter here and have to say this baby ate my productivity | 16:44 |
| pitti | so my original idea was to ship a pre-generated 1024x600 image (since you need to do clipping etc. as well), and introduce a new gconf lookup for that (backgrounds/<resolution>/{path,size,...} | 16:45 |
| pitti | didrocks: could we modify your patch to first look for $FILENAME_1024x600.png first before looking for $FILENAME ? | 16:45 |
| seb128 | pitti, I don't like that much | 16:46 |
| pitti | didrocks: this would avoid my three points, could be done in postinst, and probably won't change your code much | 16:46 |
| seb128 | pitti, the pre-generated image will work for one screen config and one image | 16:46 |
| pitti | and it doesn't need to be done at runtime | 16:46 |
| seb128 | pitti, ie it's purely for benchmark but not much for real world benefit | 16:46 |
| pitti | seb128: well, but without ureadahead you reintroduce I/O again | 16:46 |
| seb128 | doesn't that include user datas? | 16:47 |
| seb128 | like gconf dir, etc? | 16:47 |
| pitti | seb128: the postinst could look up the current resolution and generate the image for that one? | 16:47 |
| pitti | seb128: probably; but you generate it too late | 16:47 |
| pitti | seb128: when ureadahead collector runs first, then you don't have a cache yet | 16:47 |
| seb128 | pitti, do you know many users using the default pre-installed background? | 16:47 |
| pitti | you are just building it | 16:47 |
| === bjf-afk is now known as _bjf | ||
| pitti | seb128: I don't know, no | 16:47 |
| seb128 | I don't think I know anybody not changing the background | 16:48 |
| seb128 | not just on ubuntu | 16:48 |
| pitti | seb128: but what's wrong with additionally looking for /usr/share/filename_resolution.png and using it if it exists? | 16:48 |
| pitti | seb128: it doesn't preclude looking for it in ~/.cache as well | 16:48 |
| seb128 | but it's something people tend to set to something personal or something they like | 16:48 |
| seb128 | nothing | 16:48 |
| seb128 | it justs seems to me a waste of CD space to put a special case image there | 16:48 |
| pitti | it's 30 KB.. | 16:49 |
| seb128 | still we will get people asking to get a <their_screen_setting> one there too | 16:49 |
| pitti | but well, we can certainly avoid shipping it | 16:49 |
| seb128 | because why only x600 | 16:49 |
| seb128 | why not 1028x768 | 16:49 |
| seb128 | etc | 16:49 |
| didrocks | (also, we should take the transformation effect in the filename) | 16:50 |
| pitti | hm, so how can we trigger an ureadahead update then.. | 16:51 |
| vuntz | seb128: I'm really not the right person for the GnomeBG stuff. You should ask halfline | 16:52 |
| seb128 | vuntz, ok | 16:52 |
| seb128 | to avoid the user dir cluttering we could save one filename only | 16:54 |
| seb128 | ie caching only the current wallpaper | 16:54 |
| didrocks | seb128: doesn't work for slideshow | 16:55 |
| seb128 | I would argue that slideshow are a special case and it's fine if they are not cached | 16:55 |
| pitti | don't worry about slideshow | 16:55 |
| didrocks | ok, so, removing everything but the last one? | 16:56 |
| seb128 | I would rather have .cache/wallpaper.jpg | 16:56 |
| seb128 | or .cache/wallpaper as the image | 16:57 |
| seb128 | and cache whatever is in gconf key there | 16:57 |
| seb128 | and make g-s-d read it | 16:57 |
| pitti | like .cache/warty-final-ubuntu_1024x600.png ? | 16:57 |
| pitti | (you need to remember file and resolution, in case you change it) | 16:57 |
| didrocks | pitti: it's already the case | 16:57 |
| didrocks | pitti: filename + resolution + transformation type | 16:57 |
| pitti | didrocks: nice | 16:57 |
| seb128 | hum right | 16:58 |
| didrocks | but need to remove previous one when updating | 16:58 |
| didrocks | (and also, fix the thumbnails caching) | 16:58 |
| seb128 | starts sounding complicated | 17:00 |
| didrocks | right | 17:00 |
| pitti | didrocks: so you already implemented that now? | 17:02 |
| didrocks | pitti: right, http://paste.ubuntu.com/364677/ | 17:03 |
| pitti | didrocks: so, looks correct to me (apart from the indentation problem in get_wallpaper_cache_filename() | 17:10 |
| didrocks | pitti: oh right | 17:10 |
| pitti | I'm still unsure how to solve the ureadahead integration | 17:11 |
| didrocks | but still, this clutter .cache/wallpaper | 17:11 |
| seb128 | I'm a bit concerned by the lack of flag to turn that on though | 17:11 |
| seb128 | not sure if that api has other "customers" | 17:11 |
| seb128 | and if they want their datas to be cached | 17:11 |
| seb128 | it should be an opt-in by the client maybe? | 17:11 |
| === MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch | ||
| pitti | this should perhaps be added to an upstream bug and discussed there first? | 17:12 |
| seb128 | yes | 17:13 |
| pitti | introducing the concept of different resolutions into the API does seem to make sense to me | 17:14 |
| seb128 | didrocks, or maybe try #gnome-hackers, halfline is there usually | 17:14 |
| pitti | it's not that easy to have a bg image which suits a netbook as well as a 1920x1600 screen | 17:14 |
| seb128 | right | 17:15 |
| seb128 | pitti, I was suggesting a flag for turning caching on or not | 17:15 |
| didrocks | seb128: ok, I will, just fix that tab stuff first | 17:15 |
| pitti | didrocks: merci for working on this! | 17:17 |
| didrocks | pitti: you're welcome :) | 17:17 |
| didrocks | ok, tabs fixed | 17:18 |
| mvo | seb128: does the recent gstreamer upload require a rebuild or upload of some of the plugins as well ? it appears that the upgrade currently wants to remove sound-juicer for some gstreamer dependencies | 17:24 |
| seb128 | mvo, it conflicts on gst-plugins-base not current yes | 17:25 |
| seb128 | mvo, it conflicts on gst-plugins-base not current yes | 17:25 |
| seb128 | ups | 17:25 |
| mvo | ok, if its a known issue, no problem | 17:26 |
| seb128 | mvo, and the buildd got DoSed meanwhile by 2 openoffice + 1 openjdk builds | 17:26 |
| mvo | heh :) | 17:26 |
| seb128 | and we only have 3 i386 buildds | 17:26 |
| mvo | so its waiting in the queue? | 17:26 |
| seb128 | it should be building now | 17:26 |
| seb128 | openoffice failed to build after 6 hours | 17:26 |
| mvo | cool, thanks | 17:26 |
| seb128 | ;-) | 17:26 |
| mvo | haha | 17:26 |
| seb128 | mvo, you're welcome | 17:26 |
| === asac_ is now known as asac | ||
| rickspencer3 | is Amaranth_ around? | 17:59 |
| Amaranth_ | sort of | 17:59 |
| === Amaranth_ is now known as Amaranth | ||
| rickspencer3 | wondering if we should close out the bug task on bug https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/flashplugin-nonfree/+bug/410407 | 17:59 |
| ubottu | Ubuntu bug 410407 in flashplugin-nonfree "Clicking on items in Flash player does nothing [READ DESCRIPTION]" [High,Confirmed] | 17:59 |
| Amaranth | iz gtk boog :) | 18:00 |
| Amaranth | or flash, dunno | 18:00 |
| rickspencer3 | hmm | 18:00 |
| Amaranth | mozilla is having the same problem now that they do out of process plugins | 18:00 |
| rickspencer3 | it's got lots of "gravity" | 18:00 |
| Amaranth | GDK_NATIVE_WINDOWS fixes it | 18:00 |
| rickspencer3 | Amaranth, is it possible to fix in the distro? | 18:00 |
| Amaranth | sure, if you patch everything that uses flash to use GDK_NATIVE_WINDOWS either for the whole app or for the flash part (if they run it out of process) | 18:01 |
| rickspencer3 | hmmm | 18:01 |
| rickspencer3 | that sounds technically possible, but not too feasible | 18:02 |
| Amaranth | Otherwise since we don't have the source to flash it's rather hard to figure out why gtk's client side windows break it | 18:02 |
| Amaranth | chrome/chromium already use GDK_NATIVE_WINDOWS when loading flash so you just have to do nspluginwrapper, firefox, epiphany, etc :) | 18:03 |
| Amaranth | you may only have to do nspluginwrapper and firefox 3.6, actually | 18:03 |
| Amaranth | err, no, 3.6 doesn't do plugins that way | 18:04 |
| Amaranth | so hopefully just nspluginwrapper | 18:04 |
| rickspencer3 | hmmm | 18:05 |
| rickspencer3 | seems to be marked Invalid on all packages in any case | 18:05 |
| rickspencer3 | except flash-plugin-nonfree, of course | 18:05 |
| seb128 | it's technically a flash bug | 18:05 |
| Amaranth | and gtk and flash | 18:05 |
| rickspencer3 | thanks Amaranth | 18:06 |
| seb128 | Amaranth, hey | 18:06 |
| rickspencer3 | ah yes | 18:06 |
| seb128 | Amaranth, so you were right, delaying compiz from some seconds make it much less busy | 18:07 |
| Amaranth | thought so | 18:07 |
| seb128 | Amaranth, cleaning the .xml and .so makes no difference | 18:07 |
| Amaranth | hrm, that sucks | 18:07 |
| seb128 | Amaranth, still it's quite slow, almost 5 seconds delayed after everything else | 18:07 |
| Amaranth | guess protobuf is very efficient | 18:07 |
| seb128 | but that's better than the 9 seconds otherwise | 18:07 |
| pitti | seb128: delaying by how much? | 18:12 |
| pitti | i. e. does it literally end at the same time if you delay it by 4 s? | 18:12 |
| pitti | just has a more compact CPU usage? | 18:13 |
| seb128 | yes | 18:13 |
| seb128 | between 3 and 5 seconds I tried | 18:13 |
| pitti | seb128: FYI, deferring g-screensaver buys .1 to .2 s, will do tomorrow | 18:13 |
| seb128 | 3 seconds is a bit too early | 18:13 |
| seb128 | 5 seconds is after other busy things but doesn't change the boot mark then | 18:13 |
| seb128 | pitti, ok | 18:13 |
| pitti | that's only for the mini platform, though | 18:13 |
| pitti | would be interesting to see how that performs on my slow disk (the other extreme) | 18:14 |
| pitti | seb128: did you just add a sh -c and sleep to the .desktop? | 18:14 |
| seb128 | no, to the gnome-wm command | 18:14 |
| pitti | ah, good idea | 18:14 |
| * pitti -> dinner, bbl | 18:15 | |
| * seb128 sport and dinner | 18:15 | |
| seb128 | bbl too | 18:15 |
| rickspencer3 | pedro_, hi | 18:17 |
| rickspencer3 | seems this bug has lots of gravity: | 18:18 |
| rickspencer3 | https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/404351 | 18:18 |
| ubottu | Ubuntu bug 404351 in ubuntuone-client "nautilus crashed with SIGSEGV in exit()" [Undecided,Invalid] | 18:18 |
| rickspencer3 | anything we can do to help it along? | 18:18 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - i see you're deferring gnome-screensaver | 18:19 |
| chrisccoulson | you just going to use a sleep for now? | 18:19 |
| chrisccoulson | ah, you've disappeared already | 18:19 |
| pedro_ | rickspencer3, well there's no clear way on how to reproduce the issue, we thought it was an ubuntuone-client issue but it wasn't | 18:19 |
| pedro_ | rickspencer3, seems to only affect karmic though | 18:20 |
| pedro_ | rickspencer3, and we don't have a new report about it since 2009-12-10 | 18:20 |
| rickspencer3 | pedro_, should we close the bug then? | 18:20 |
| pedro_ | rickspencer3, i can ask again to the reporters if they are able to reproduce it with latest packages, maybe it's fixed now | 18:20 |
| pedro_ | rickspencer3, let's ask first, i'll do that | 18:20 |
| rickspencer3 | ok | 18:20 |
| rickspencer3 | if it's not going to get fixed we should mark it as such | 18:21 |
| rickspencer3 | if it's not an issue anymore, we should definately mark it as such ;) | 18:21 |
| pedro_ | totally agreed ;-) | 18:21 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: I thought about adding a --delay option, and call nice(10) in it | 18:37 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: to avoid having yet another shell/sleep invocation | 18:37 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: I'll disappear for dinner in a bit again, so far it was just prep; but it's in the oven now :) | 18:38 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - i think for now you should probably go with the sleep, and i will implement a proper X-GNOME-Autostartdelay option for the autostart files | 18:38 |
| chrisccoulson | sometime over the weekend | 18:38 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: so, external sleep and patch it to nice? | 18:38 |
| chrisccoulson | pitti - yeah, can do | 18:39 |
| pitti | ok, I'll go with that then | 18:39 |
| pitti | chrisccoulson: but it's not that urgent, I can as well wait for your X-GNOME-AutostartDelay to land | 18:39 |
| chrisccoulson | i'll work on implementing a proper key for autostart delay, so we can mass-convert all of our autostart apps which have a delay to use the new key, rather than spawning a shell | 18:39 |
| pitti | \o/ | 18:39 |
| * pitti hugs chrisccoulson | 18:39 | |
| * chrisccoulson hugs pitti | 18:40 | |
| pitti | kenvandine: do you know whether there was some investigation about why indicator-{messages,applet,applet-session} burning so much CPU? | 18:42 |
| kenvandine | pitti, at start time? | 18:42 |
| pitti | yes | 18:42 |
| kenvandine | tedg was going to add some instrumentation code | 18:42 |
| kenvandine | not sure if he has though | 18:42 |
| jcastro | qense: hey, jono and I were thinking a hack day for app indicators would be a good idea, interested? | 18:55 |
| qense | jcastro: Sure, sounds neat. HackDay! | 18:55 |
| jcastro | next week we'll figure out a day, etc. | 18:56 |
| qense | Maybe we should collect a list of applications that still need support on the beforehand. | 18:56 |
| qense | jcastro: ok | 18:57 |
| jcastro | qense: we used source.debian.net to find things using GtkStatusIcon, but it seems to be down right now | 18:57 |
| qense | yep, times out here | 18:58 |
| qense | What about sending a mail to the devel-discuss maillist with a request for suggestions? | 18:59 |
| Burgundavia | anybody around to talk about artwork in Lucid? is for the official book | 19:16 |
| jcastro | qense: I'm going to grep through the archive first | 19:19 |
| jcastro | qense: we'll do a call for help as a last resort | 19:19 |
| Burgundavia | win 3 | 19:21 |
| qense | jcastro: sounds good | 19:21 |
| chrisccoulson | vuntz - there? | 19:47 |
| vuntz | chrisccoulson: yep | 19:53 |
| chrisccoulson | vuntz - do you remember reviewing a patch I wrote for gnome-session a while ago, to lazy-initialize dk-power? | 19:54 |
| chrisccoulson | this patch: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-session/ubuntu/annotate/head%3A/debian/patches/21_dkp_start_on_demand.patch | 19:54 |
| chrisccoulson | i seem to remember that you had some concerns with it | 19:54 |
| vuntz | I remember it | 19:55 |
| vuntz | but I don't remember what I thought of it :-) | 19:55 |
| chrisccoulson | i think you were concerned that it's too easy to forget to call manager_ensure_dkp_client | 19:56 |
| vuntz | chrisccoulson: yep | 19:57 |
| vuntz | that's it | 19:57 |
| chrisccoulson | vuntz - i'd like to try and tidy it up, but i'm not sure how to address that concern, short of creating a new class for fetching information from dk-power (eg, a GsmDkpower class, or something similar) | 19:58 |
| chrisccoulson | but that seems a bit overkill | 19:59 |
| vuntz | chrisccoulson: was wondering about a new class too | 19:59 |
| chrisccoulson | untz - i don't mind doing that then | 19:59 |
| chrisccoulson | oops | 19:59 |
| chrisccoulson | s/untz/vuntz | 19:59 |
| vuntz | chrisccoulson: maybe talk to hughsie to see what he thinks | 19:59 |
| chrisccoulson | yeah, i can do | 20:00 |
| vuntz | chrisccoulson: maybe he'll be willing to make the DkpClient object more flexible | 20:00 |
| chrisccoulson | yeah, that might be a better idea | 20:00 |
| chrisccoulson | ie, only fetch the properties from the daemon when you first try to get them | 20:00 |
| pitti | good night everyone | 20:36 |
| didrocks | good night pitti! | 20:37 |
| seb128 | good night pitti | 20:39 |
| didrocks | well, time to go to bed :) | 21:15 |
| didrocks | have a good night everyone | 21:16 |
| seb128 | 'night didrocks | 21:25 |
| chrisccoulson | hey seb128 | 22:03 |
| seb128 | hello chrisccoulson | 22:03 |
| seb128 | how are you? | 22:03 |
| chrisccoulson | yeah, good thanks | 22:03 |
| chrisccoulson | and you? | 22:04 |
| seb128 | good too | 22:04 |
| seb128 | good night everybody | 23:11 |
| Nafai | jcastro: btw, I'm not sure what apt-daemon is that jono mentioned in his e-mail. I can't find a package of that name or anything in any package by that name (using apt-file) | 23:25 |
| chrisccoulson | Nafai - aptdaemon? | 23:38 |
| chrisccoulson | !info aptdaemon | 23:38 |
| ubottu | aptdaemon (source: aptdaemon): transaction based package management service. In component main, is extra. Version 0.10+bzr264-0ubuntu1 (karmic), package size 5 kB, installed size 320 kB | 23:38 |
| Nafai | doh | 23:43 |
| Nafai | jono included a - in the name and I didn't think to try without the - :) | 23:44 |
| Nafai | Thanks | 23:44 |
| jono | Nafai, hehe | 23:51 |
| Nafai | :) | 23:51 |
| jono | you getting the hang of things? | 23:51 |
| Nafai | getting there | 23:51 |
| jono | Nafai, what have you been working on? | 23:52 |
| Nafai | unfortunately, not a ton this week (luckily, I don't start paid work until next week)...mainly getting my dev environment set up and such | 23:52 |
| Nafai | upgraded to lucid and such | 23:52 |
| jono | no worries! | 23:52 |
| Nafai | following the developer week stuff | 23:52 |
| jono | I am not expecting you to work this week :) | 23:52 |
| jono | cool :) | 23:53 |
| Nafai | btw, I loved dholbach and jcastro's tag team this morning | 23:53 |
| jono | Nafai, awesome :) | 23:57 |
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