[07:45] hello [07:45] good morning [12:25] asac: hi, i'm doing some research on bug 509738. Is there a bazaar repo or alike for the modemmanager builds? I consider to do a bisection to detect what causes the problem with the 3G card [12:25] Launchpad bug 509738 in network-manager "ModemManager from PPA not working in Lucid" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/509738 [13:50] Hi all; reporting for duty! :) [14:09] hey Nafai ;) [14:09] Nafai: are you in Portland? [14:09] I wish. [14:09] At home in Utah [14:10] oh ok :) [14:10] Today is the first day of my control though. :) [14:10] s/control/contract/ [14:13] Nafai: :) [14:13] Nafai: I guess dx team guys will ping you [14:13] I figured as much [14:15] hey didrocks [14:15] hey chrisccoulson, you are you? :) [14:15] i'm good thanks. are you in portland this week? [14:17] right :) [14:25] I have a doctor appointment, I'll be back in a couple hours [15:20] asac: found it on Launchpad [16:40] Back [16:41] Hey rickspencer3 :) [16:42] Hi Nafai [17:22] hi [17:25] hey chrisccoulson, how are you? [17:25] hey pitti, i'm good thanks [17:25] chrisccoulson: thanks for pointing out the gconf breakage, sorry for that [17:25] how are you? [17:26] I'm great, I slept suspiciously well :) [17:26] i was going to fix gconf, but i can't upload it :( [17:26] did you have a good day today? [17:26] it only just started [17:26] -9 hours [17:27] ah, i didn't realise you were that many hours behind ;) [17:27] we are in Portland, OR now [18:41] seb128, I've updated the hook on bug 418156; May you have a look into it later? [18:41] Launchpad bug 418156 in yelp "Yelp Apport Hook" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/418156 [18:42] hello [18:43] hey baptistemm [18:45] pedro_, ok [18:46] seb128, thank you [18:46] heya chrisccoulson [18:46] hello seb128 [18:51] http://bmm80.free.fr/public/oak-lucid-20100131-4.png <-- ultra fast boot :) [18:52] I should enable autlogin to win 1 sec or 2 [18:52] baptistemm - yeah, i was just about to suggest trying with autologin [18:53] baptistemm - also, it seems you need to profile ureadahead too [18:53] ah [18:54] hey pitti, I forgot to mention it when you where here - ArneGoetje tells me it is not possible to build PPAs in the new server due to a missing LP credentials file. Do you think you could copy it over? ArneGoetje knows the details [18:55] baptistemm, quite impressive [18:56] dpm, ArneGoetje: it should give you an URL to open, where you can ack the authorization, and then press enter [18:57] seb128, isn't it? :) [18:58] yipee it appears someone reverted the breakage to gweather :) [18:58] * ccheney just noticed it when adding locations to his clock [18:58] thanks pitti, ArneGoetje, will that solve the problem you were telling me about and then the PPA langpacks be built again? [18:58] the HD bandwidth is impressive, it goes to 150 MB/s [18:59] "up to" [19:02] baptistemm: what kind of ssd? [19:02] * ccheney thinks his system boots in ~ 17s but hasn't run the program to verify it [19:02] i have a regular hd though [19:13] ccheney, intel X25-m [19:19] why evolution 2.29 won't be packaged for lucid? [19:20] baptistemm, because lucid is a lts [19:20] baptistemm, and getting a rewrite in a lts is not good [19:20] a rewrite? [19:22] did you look at how much code changed? [19:22] rewritting all the bonobo code to use dbus instead... [19:22] and bonoboui to gtk [19:22] not at all, I don't know anything about changes in evo in 2.29 [19:23] ah okay [19:23] I'm little beyond anython currently in GNOME world [19:24] baptistemm: ah [19:24] seb128: ah so they are getting evolution ready for gnome 3.0 :) [19:24] yes [19:30] ccheney, that's a terrific model :) [19:31] i have a seagate 7200.4 500gb drive in my laptop, pretty fast but no ssd, heh [19:32] ~ 100MB/s under hdparm but has seek time as its a hd [19:45] shoot, got booted when I asked a question it looks like -- is gdm's :0.log supposed to contain what ~/.xsession-errors contains? the ~/.xsession-errors output seems like it should be whats in :0.log instead of the Xorg.x.log and xserver's stderr output thats in it now? [19:53] Riddell, asac told me there is something you want fixed in the packaging for the vpn plugins? [19:58] cyphermox: I'd like to split out the gnome bits [19:58] cyphermox: they're currently brining gnome stuff onto the kubuntu CD and we don't have the space for that [19:58] it's also how suse does it so I don't think it would be a problem [19:58] Riddell, sure. I think I saw a bug about that too [20:05] pitti, btw Terri and I are going out to the Widmer Pub for dinner prior to karaoke; interested in joining us? [20:07] bryce2: I'd love to [20:08] ok, we'll be meeting up in the hotel lobby at 6:30 [20:19] cyphermox: how's this look? http://people.canonical.com/~jriddell/tmp/vpnc.diff [20:26] Riddell, looks good. It's pretty much exactly what I was going to do. I plan on working on this more later tonight though :) [20:36] cyphermox: ok I'll commit to bzr and let you make any other changes you want and upload this evening [20:37] cyphermox: I'll do the same for pptp and openvpn for completeness [20:37] Riddell, there is a slight issue with that [20:38] cyphermox: what's that? [20:38] Riddell, do you mean that you'll upload? [20:38] also, there is also the network-manager-openconnect plugin you may be interested in [20:39] cyphermox: I can upload if you want me to [20:40] Riddell, that might be wise, as I don't have any upload permissions ;) [20:40] cyphermox: but you want to make more changes this evening first? [20:41] Riddell, no. from what asac had told me, I thought I was going to do the splitting of these packages [20:42] cyphermox: I'm an impatient sort :) [20:42] I'll upload shortly then [20:42] Riddell, that's fine. from the diff I saw it looks perfect [20:43] the only thing is how current users will install the plugins in the future: it will mean they will have to specifically install network-manager-vpnc-gnome, not just network-manager-vpnc [20:45] cyphermox: well how do they know what to install currently? asac mentioned getting them onto the CD which seems sensible [20:46] right know, I guess they look it up in synaptic. [20:46] cyphermox: oh and that diff wasn't perfect, the auth dialog needed moved to -gnome and DESTDIR unset in debian/rules :) [20:47] Riddell, hard to say without looking at the full thing :) [20:48] Riddell, what I mean is, some could still try to install network-manager-vpnc and wonder why there is still no plugin available [20:49] new installs I expect people to search and find the right package, upgrades are an issue, maybe a hook should be added to the dist upgrade tool [21:04] Riddell: bzr bd-do [21:54] seb128, pitti, hey [21:54] hello robert_ancell [21:54] how are you? [21:55] hey robert_ancell, how are you? [21:55] good, how is the sprint going? [21:55] quite fine so far [21:55] just starting a few hours ago but good so far [21:55] any big plans? [21:55] hey robert_ancell :) [21:55] didrocks, hey [21:55] boot speed, and some stragglers [21:55] robert_ancell, out of booting in 10 seconds? [21:56] well, you'll have that done by the end of today right? ;) [21:56] I was on my road to that [21:56] and the mini decided to break [21:56] ug [21:56] I still have my laptop though [21:56] but no reference platform for testing anymore [21:56] damn [21:57] I'm currently battling plymouth+upstart. Both seem hard to debug [21:57] it froze and since beep an error code on power on [21:57] oh? [21:57] no spare ones there? Have one shipped over [21:57] what issue do you have with it [21:58] robert_ancell, rick asked one for me, not sure when that will arrive though [21:58] Is there a good log you can get from upstart after boot showing what events occurred, and what scripts were run (and the results of the scripts) [21:58] shame it broke at the start of the sprint; but I can work on my laptop and enough people have some of those to do testing [21:58] It feels a bit like dpkg in that a script can fail but the best debug you get is an error code [21:59] robert_ancell, I've no clue about upstart but I guess you can try asking Keybuk... [21:59] yes === Nafai` is now known as Nafai [22:00] chrisccoulson, hey [22:00] hey seb128 [22:00] how are you? [22:01] good! [22:01] you? [22:01] yeah, not bad thanks [22:01] how was your travelling at the weekend? [22:01] uneventfull which I guess is good ;-) [22:02] weather was ok on the road to the aiport, I had plenty of time for changing plane and we got almost no delay [22:02] spending 10 hours in a plane is no fun but otherwise it was ok [22:03] Keybuk, any upstart debugging hints? [22:05] seb128 - yeah, i don't particularly enjoy long flights ;) [22:05] especially when driving on arrival at the destination [22:06] no driving required there at least ;-) [22:07] chrisccoulson, oh, boot question, did you work on those gnome-session delay change? [22:07] seb128 - the autostart delay stuff? [22:07] yes [22:07] i wrote a patch which works, but vuntz had some review comments on it [22:07] i've not addressed all of those comments yet though [22:07] can we get the change in lucid? [22:08] seb128 - yeah, i think so [22:08] ok, nice [22:08] do you want to do the package update? [22:08] or should I do it [22:08] that would clean a bit our charts [22:08] ie make those easier to read [22:08] so I would like to get it in today [22:08] seb128 - i can push the changes in to bzr, but i can't upload it [22:08] I can sponsor it no problem [22:09] cool, i'll work on that in a second [22:09] thanks! [22:09] my machine has ground to a halt now - i've just turned tracker on! [22:10] yeah, io load is not handled fine under linux [22:10] yeah, it definately doesn't like it very much [22:12] is that 0.7? [22:13] seb128 - yeah, i'm running 0.7.18. i've got packages here: https://edge.launchpad.net/~tracker-team [22:14] nice [22:28] Laney, do you have a clue about bug #515306? [22:28] Launchpad bug 515306 in tomboy "New dep on libnunit2.4-cil pulls 10Mb of dependencies" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/515306 === Nafai is now known as nafai === nafai is now known as Nafai [22:29] seb128: yes, you have to patch out the tests [22:29] or add a build-conflicts [22:29] are the tests installed in the binary [22:30] I guess so, as the dep comes from dh_clideps [22:30] but they were never enabled before, and only happen now because mono-devel pulls in everything [22:33] I might add a configure flag in future [22:35] pitti: whats the gnome bug number for the mm stuff? [22:37] Hey djsiegel [22:39] kenvandine, hum, seems you didn't commit your tomboy changes to bzr which made me revert those [22:39] kenvandine, I'm fixing that now [22:39] Laney, do you plan to keep the depends in debian? [22:40] seb128: we already patched it [22:40] Laney, ok thanks [22:40] looking to what you did there [22:40] this was one of the changes I wanted you to take :) [22:40] is there any other one? [22:40] we can't sync since we are on a newer serie [22:41] djsiegel: This week I do have time to do some a11y webkit testing. What do you want tested, given that webkit was updated in lucid only last week. [22:42] seb128: the gmime2.4 switch, removing the requires from tomboy-addins and the build-dep cleanups [22:42] ok thanks [22:42] dunno which you alreayd have [22:42] I will have a look now [22:43] ;/c [22:43] tomboy-addins.pc.in, that is [22:44] seb128, i didn't? [22:44] kenvandine, apparently not [22:44] seb128, oh i pushed a new version of xchat-indicator [22:44] think you can look at it and upload again? [22:45] sure [22:46] thx [22:53] TheMuso: I'd like you to test webkit themes in empathy (kenvandine) [22:55] djsiegel: What themes use webkit? [22:55] TheMuso: all of them [22:55] we have a guy working on one based on Renkoo [22:56] djsiegel: ok I'll test them out. [22:56] TheMuso: I have a bug for you [22:56] TheMuso: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/empathy/+bug/392488 [22:56] Ubuntu bug 392488 in hundredpapercuts "Empathy could use an Ubuntu-specific Adium theme" [Low,Triaged] [22:58] djsiegel: ok [23:01] seb128 - you've experienced the missing menus from the session indicator haven't you? [23:01] do you know what causes it yet? [23:01] not really [23:01] it's due to the services not being running [23:02] the bootchart show that sometime they start and exit after less than a second [23:02] but there is nothing in the log [23:02] seb128 - i experience it quite regularly, but the services are all running here [23:02] and no apport crash report [23:02] which menus are missing? [23:02] i just logged out of my session, and it left some stale indicator-* processes [23:02] when i logged in, both menus aren't displayed, but the processes from my previous session are still running [23:04] djsiegel: Well I enabled the blue theme, and if that uses webkit, then nothing gets read, i.e my conversation text is not spoken. [23:05] djsiegel: Sorry, the conversation text is spoken, but not the title which displays the user's nick. [23:06] TheMuso: ok [23:07] TheMuso: that sounds fixable [23:08] chrisccoulson, interesting, I think it's a different issue [23:08] chrisccoulson, try talking to ted about it maybe [23:08] seb128 - yeah, that might be a coincidence [23:09] seb128 - i've pushed gnome-session to bzr now [23:09] chrisccoulson, I was just looking at right now, good timing [23:15] djsiegel: The renku theme does not read at all. All I get is "section" whenever I review the window. [23:15] TheMuso: ok, so, how do we fix it? [23:15] there must be some way to enable reading in the theme [23:15] e.g. use the proper html elements [23:15] or add attributes [23:15] djsiegel: If its using webkit, then I'd say we can't do anything atm. [23:16] My guess is that not enough webkt a11y is enabled to even read text. [23:16] hmm [23:16] Does empathy use gconf? If so, I will set the theme for empathy to classic for accessibility installs. [23:16] TheMuso: I am sure it does. [23:16] TheMuso: that sounds like an excellent approach [23:16] djsiegel: Ok thanks. [23:17] TheMuso: we have the Renkoo theme ready to use with Empathy but we are just waiting to make sure we don't damage experience for users requiring a11y [23:17] TheMuso: if you make the change of theme for accessibility installs, then kenvandine can package and enable the renkoo theme for other installs [23:17] kenvandine: ^ !!! [23:18] djsiegel: Yep, I can do that. [23:18] I think thats the best approach atm. [23:18] TheMuso: awesome [23:18] yes [23:19] tedg: is it known that the indicator applet icon is not accessible in the panel hirarchy with keybard commands? [23:19] gah typing [23:19] hyrarchy even [23:19] TheMuso: Yes. [23:19] TheMuso: We have a bug open on that. [23:20] TheMuso: One of the biggest thing that it's waiting on is someone deciding what key should actually open the menus. [23:20] tedg: Ok [23:20] tedg, alt-f3? [23:20] TheMuso: We'd like it to be the Alt+F1, but there's no way to get from the Application menus over. [23:20] tedg: I would think that simply tabbing to it on the panel and pressing enter should also work, as that is how I access network-manager, audio, blueetooth, etc. [23:21] Alt+F3 for the messaging, application one or the session/me one? [23:21] seb128: I'd agree with that. [23:22] TheMuso: I'm not sure why it'd work differently. What WM are you using? Most don't allow the panel to have focus enough to select stuff in the panel. [23:22] tedg, any, you can do left-right to change then no? [23:22] tedg: I am using metacity, and when the top panel has focus, I can tab between the menu bar, launchers, icons in the notification area, and the clock. [23:23] tedg: I was expecting that accessing the indicator icon would work the same way. [23:24] pitti - did you want to delay gnome-screensaver for 5 seconds? [23:24] chrisccoulson: yes, it's a work item of mine [23:24] pitti - i can do that now [23:24] chrisccoulson: but I'm waiting for the X-Autostart-Delay: feature to land [23:24] TheMuso: Hmm, at least under Compiz I can't recreate that. [23:24] pitti - it's just been uploaded [23:24] chrisccoulson: so that we can convert the existing ones and add that one easily [23:24] chrisccoulson: \o/ [23:24] seb128: The problem is that the panel applets are basically islands. So it's hard to go between them. [23:24] chrisccoulson: thanks muchly [23:24] pitti - yeah, can do. i can do gnome-screensaver now [23:24] chrisccoulson: that'd be lovely, if you have some time? [23:25] yeah, that's not a problem :) [23:25] chrisccoulson: FYI, I settled modemmanager CPU usage now, and discussed the rsyslog/dd debacle; that will be a bit harder to fix, but I hope we can get it [23:25] chrisccoulson: I'll upload system-config-printer and indicator-applet [23:25] pitti - yeah, i saw the work items you added today [23:26] tedg: Well I can't do the same under compiz, since by default, accessing the panel with keyboard shortcuts is not enabled. I'll enable locally, and test myself. [23:26] ok, so seb128 will do indicator-applet and eds [23:26] so I'll fix s-c-p [23:26] sweeet [23:26] mvo, there? [23:27] seb128: yes [23:27] seb128: in a mini-sprint [23:27] but here [23:27] mvo, any objection to drop the delay option from update-notifier? [23:28] mvo, and to use an autostart X-GNOME-Autostart-Delay key instead [23:28] why? is it so fast now? [23:28] oh, ok [23:28] well, just remove it then [23:28] mvo, no, but your --delay delays the icon creation only [23:28] mvo, it still goes through gtk init, etc [23:28] also, this is now a canonical way to defer startup [23:29] mvo, will work on the change now and ping you for review and merge in a few minutes [23:29] sure, fine with me, just commit it to trunk or I do it [23:29] pitti, btw it's "X-GNOME-Autostart-Delay" [23:29] don't forget the -GNOME [23:29] yep [23:32] chrisccoulson: X-GNOME-Autostart-Delay=30 [23:32] ^ like that? [23:33] pitti - yeah, that's right [23:35] s-c-p uploaded [23:35] I'll do jockey as well now [23:37] gnome-screensaver uploaded :) [23:37] bjf: ping, there are a slew of core (kernelspace) pcm fixes that Would Be Really Good to test soon; shall I push those to my branch on zinc? [23:38] bjf: reports from other distros (Fedora 13, Mandriva, openSUSE) are that they fix a number of audio anomalies [23:40] mvo, lp:~seb128/update-notifier/delay [23:40] mvo, want to review it? [23:41] right, i must go and do some tidying up for a bit [23:42] crimsun, are those fixes upstream (would they be in takashi's tree?) [23:42] bjf: they are as of last night, so they're in today's snapshot [23:43] crimsun, so are you asking for them to be put into lucid? [23:43] bjf: I'm working on a bug report, and yes, it would be great to have them in lucid [23:43] crimsun, the lucid lbm is close to being ready [23:44] seb128: looking [23:44] crimsun, please feel free to post them to the kernel team mailing list [23:44] mvo, danke [23:44] crimsun, an request a pull [23:44] bjf: surely, thanks [23:51] seb128: I wonder if it is still useful for say xubuntu, so ripping out the code is probably a bit much [23:51] but removing it from the desktop file is fine with me [23:51] mvo, as you want [23:52] mvo, chart show that the delay is sort of lame though, it's still busy since you don't really delay init but only the notification area icon there [23:53] mvo, let me do a version update which changes the desktop only [23:53] djsiegel: Ok the empathy theme change will be set when casper is next uploaded. [23:54] mvo, if I drop the update-notifier.c change can I upload? ;-) [23:54] mvo, xfce probably use the same .desktop though [23:58] pitti: fyi, dcbw had some questions on the bug [23:58] asac: yep, saw them; will follow up