[00:08] charlie-tca: the more emails I catch up, the more I see that ppl think a _discuss_ ML is for support :(. so many requests for <+1 stuff [00:09] yup [00:09] ppl don't even politely push them to ubuntu-users or LP anymore [00:09] they simply ignore it [00:10] is this _it_, is this what *we* community became after just 5 years? [00:10] is this what we want to be? [00:10] I think that is because there are so many now. There is one or two new ones a day for support [00:10] almost makes me feel like writing a mad email [00:10] but it would just be ignored too [00:11] plus would not *fix* the root cause: new users [00:11] I really am starting to think it is big growing pains now. The "we" is going away fast, being replaced by "they" [00:11] I wonder if the ml description could be improvrd [00:12] LP users used to be flooded by this kind of _spam_ and fixed it by being very aggressive on comunicating that was the wrong place [00:12] There is also the "I wasn't at UDS, and only found out about half of what was discussed" and is being changed [00:13] who is 'we' an they [00:13] do you 'we' really split ? [00:13] ohh those UDS seem to have improved this cycle [00:14] _we_ users learned the hard way [00:14] 'We' should be the community [00:14] cauth desing team cauth [00:15] BUGabundo: what? [00:15] "team" was the only word i could find in there [00:16] back [00:17] my brother decided to turn the AP off :( [00:17] what what mac? [00:21] cauth desing team cauth [00:21] BUGabundo, ^ that was what maco was asking about [00:21] ahh [00:21] typo [00:21] :) [00:21] sleepy [00:21] writing with only one finger from left hand [00:22] I know how you feel [00:22] while trying to watch Heroes [00:22] without sleeping [00:22] ahhh beloved vacations :D [01:30] Anyone seeing Lucid reproducibly hang today? I had to back off to the old kernel because SOMETHING changed today such that the current kernel hangs as soon as I hit in a terminal session. [01:35] And nothing under /lib/modules/2.6.32-12-generic changed today, yet the hang is reproducible with that kernel and not the -11. [02:28] how come when i am drunk off my moms vodka it ¨ seems¨ like lucid is sooooo i am not swearing AWESOME!!! [02:31] and seriously i have my ram footprint on first boot down to 92mb and everything i want to work.................works [02:31] omg laura croft is so hot shes on the tele right now [02:32] DanaG, your old nvidia chip will now have a 3d driver [02:34] hmm, how about my ATI? [02:34] oh yeah, and I'm going to laugh if the nv 96 still just segfaults. [02:34] who cares about ati [02:34] Just curious, actually. [02:35] Radeon non-kms works well enough (has basic power management) for me, for until the KMS one gets effective power management. [02:35] oh, and random: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=22239 [02:35] Freedesktop bug 22239 in plymouth general "improve console= handling" [Normal,New] [02:35] wonder if I should bother reporting this same issue on launchpad. [02:36] er, let me rephrase that: should I bother? [02:39] you will be able to run your precious compiz on that old laptop now [02:39] with its excellent and very useful plugins that display random crap on the screen [02:40] oh yeah, random issue I have on a samsung netbook: it doesn't offer the lowest c-states when running on AC... and thus runs hot, with the fan always running -- and it's in fact louder than my "good" laptop. [02:40] Stupid Samsung. [02:42] samsung makes laptops? i thought they made monitors [02:43] yes [02:43] they make great laptops [02:43] very light [02:43] very thin [02:43] most of them with hot swap batteries [02:43] bjsnider: samsung is the 2nd biggest industrial company in the world [02:44] they are in almost any developed prodution area you can think of [02:44] are you in their public relations department? [02:44] NO [02:44] :p [02:45] just like to state facts [02:46] BUGabundo: You own stock shares, don't fib!! ;) [02:46] don't own stock in anything, sorry [02:47] Heh [02:55] i own stock on sampson [02:55] heh [02:58] ext4 on /boot but everything else is all XFS YEAA BBOOYYIIEE [03:07] This samsung laptop sucks at power management. [03:07] When you resume from suspend, it doesn't offer the lowest-power C-states. [03:07] So, it uses unnecessarily much power, to the detriment of battery life. [03:08] Then, some time later, it gives a SATA bus exception (that takes 30 seconds to recover from)... and the c-states are back. [03:08] 30- second hard lock is quite annoying. [03:08] http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Samsung_N140 [03:08] mine's n130, but it's essentially the same. [03:10] bleh, realtek wifi. bleh. [03:11] oh, and it doesn't send key-up events for some hotkeys. [03:11] http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/hal/2009-August/013536.html [03:11] BWARHARHARHAR [03:15] Is there a workaround for a crash after using gksudo? [03:21] bjsnider, ping :-) [03:27] NoelJB, what's up? [03:32] bjsnider, as of today, I have a situation where (and I have uninstalled and reinstalled to check), 2.6.32-11 works with nvidia-current, and 2.6.32-12 will start with it, but as soon as I open a terminal window and do nothing other than hit , the system hangs (requires hard power-off). [03:32] have you seen anything? which kernel and driver are you running? [03:33] i'm not running lucid. you should ask in #ubuntu-x [03:33] OK [03:43] !find dbus-send-ping [03:43] Package/file dbus-send-ping does not exist in lucid [03:56] phail: the sample code for how to get started with dbus... segfaults. [03:57] http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-dbus.html [03:57] though, granted, it is old. [04:05] bjsnider: is that new nvidia-legacy in main repos? [04:06] DanaG: http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/dbus#head-f208dd08ee19201b857adb8c80c8e02a9ccf9ff1 might be better. [04:06] thanks. I'm trying to write my own thing (preferably in C or C++) that'll talk to bluez over dbus... but first, I have to teach myself how to talk to dbus. [04:07] er, wait, I think I already saw that. [04:07] http://developer.pidgin.im/wiki/DbusHowto [04:07] the Qt stuff is a decent starting point [04:11] argh, my mouse keeps freezing. [04:12] er, oh, it's that "disable touchpad while typing" thing. Annoying. [04:17] DanaG, no, i'm talking about the new properties added to the nouveau driver. there's a blurb about it on phoronix [04:18] so if you install it, you will be that much closer to world domination [04:19] anyone using Handbrake with Alpha2? installed 9.10 DEB but the "Picture" tab is greyed out [04:20] hmm, is there a ppa? [04:20] or rather, perhaps I wanna' wait until it's at least in master. [04:23] http://lists.lm-sensors.org/pipermail/lm-sensors/2009-October/026830.html [04:23] hmm, "I'm attaching the source here".... so where is it? [04:23] oh, at the bottom. [04:24] actualy RAOF was mentioning it in another channel, so it might be in the edgers ppa, but you'll have to ax him [04:24] !find heci.h [04:24] File heci.h found in linux-headers-2.6.31-10-rt [04:24] hmm, not in current linux headers? [04:26] bjsnider: Oh, you mean the classic mesa nouveau DRI? Noooooooooooooo. That's not in xorg-edgers, no :) [04:32] RAOF, wasn't that what you were talking about today when you mentioned it to hyperair? [04:33] No, I was mentioning that it existed as a merge proposal on the nouveau mailing list. [04:34] the only 3d thing I regularly use, on any of my computers, in Linux: compiz. [04:34] right, but you were talking about the same code as i'm talking about [04:34] Yes, we're talking about the same code. [04:34] so undoubtedly it will be in ubuntu before too long if it is accepted [04:35] No? [04:36] The (much better developed) nv4x & nv5x gallium drivers aren't going to be in Lucid, and aren't even in xorg-edgers; I don't think the classic mesa driver is likely to make it before the gallium drivers. [04:36] hmm, if it's in a ppa, that's good enough. [04:36] well, if not lucid, then a ppa, and beyond lucid it will [04:36] oh yeah, I tried that samsung-laptop driver... setting the thing to "silent" mode (hopefully to have it give me back my danged c-states) didn't work! [04:36] * DanaG slaps samsung with this output: [04:37] Your CPU supports the following C-States: C1 C2 C4 [04:37] Your BIOS reports the following C-states: C1 C2 [04:44] hmm, I know hal is supposedly being / has been deprecated... but when I watch on dbus, I don't see anything coming from bare udev itself. [04:45] As far as I'm aware, udev doesn't dbus. [04:45] You'd be after libgudev, I believe. [04:47] hmm, so I'll have to learn how to interact with that, too. [04:48] bluez gives me these nice things: signal sender=:1.89 -> dest=(null destination) serial=146 path=/org/bluez/17792/hci0/dev_20_42_11_04_14_63; interface=org.bluez.Input; member=PropertyChanged string "Connected" variant boolean false [04:49] has MAC address, and what happened. [04:49] Random lame joke: "I don't own any Apple hardware, but my laptop does have two MACs: one wired, and one wireless." [04:50] Or rather, I have 3, if you count bluetooth. [04:50] libgudev looked like it had a nice simple interface, when I looked at it. [04:51] You shouldn't have trouble if you need it. [04:52] " Gets all devices belonging to subsystem." [04:54] ' To listen to uevents, connect to the "uevent" signal.' ... then off I go, fishing for what it means to connect... it sure isn't the typical posix signal. [04:54] http://library.gnome.org/devel/gtk/stable/gtk-Signals.html [04:56] random thing the samsung netbook does: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/hal/2009-August/013536.html [04:59] BWAAAHARAHARRRAHHAHAHAR [05:00] That's one of the most hideous hacks I've ever seen. [05:00] And not even "hideous, but working". [05:00] It's just stupid. [05:01] DanaG: That's a glib signal; g_signal_connect is your friend. [05:30] Anyone know how to stop the console/keyboard from visibly showing the ^C when I issue it? [05:31] screenshot coming... [05:32] http://code.gnu-designs.com/setuid/ctrl-c-flub.png [05:45] interesting... the samsung netbook's rfkill key sends xf86wlan, and does nothing else. [06:13] seems like openoffice is broken ? [06:15] Hello, I've bug in lucid and I wonder where should I start. the report is ready and I should chose a name for the bug [06:19] "a bug" [06:19] sorry ;) [06:19] just describe the problem [06:20] package ecryptfs-utils 82-0ubuntu2 failed to install/upgrade: [06:20] that would be fine [06:20] I've screen shot. it showed up first at the end of installer [06:20] I fixed it by doing apt-get -f install [06:21] I just want to help avoiding this for new users [06:30] Gnome-Do crashing on Lucid when attempting to open Preferences [06:32] ZykoticK9, try from PPA [06:38] I've noticed that the installer have an update option but once it starts it can't be ended and it has no option to configure the connection or even just to change the ip [06:40] petsounds, good idea - but it appears the do-core PPA doesn't have Lucid support yet, getting a 404 during "apt-get update" regarding do-core PPA [06:41] ZykoticK9, let me check :) [06:41] brb [06:52] ZykoticK9: Please report a bug. Lucid has the latest version of Do. [06:52] (You should be reporting a bug *anyway*) [06:54] ZykoticK9, sorry i can't help you because do running fine here http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2075532/UBUNTU/Ubuntu%20Screenshot/do-lucid.png :) [06:54] thanks anyways petsounds :) [06:55] RAOF, i'm working on figuring how how to post bug [07:02] ZykoticK9: “ubuntu-bug gnome-do” will do it. [07:05] RAOF, thanks - i figured it out -- turns out it's already recorded as bug #448094, so just added to "affects me too" [07:05] Launchpad bug 448094 in do "Gnome-do crashes when Preferences window is shown for the first time" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/448094 [07:13] I requested a sync for gnome-do [07:13] newer version with alot of fixes availible :) [07:17] I've problem. I'm doing system testing but it stops at the disk testing and I don't find any way to skip it [07:46] hi [07:47] for the ati driver, the xorg entry should be ati or radeon [07:48] you probably don't need an xorg.conf at all. [07:48] but, to answer your question, it should be ati. [07:48] ati will chain radeon if necessary. [07:50] crimsun, ok thannks, the fglrx doesnt work , and i used radeon in there xorg but it wont boot [07:50] ill change to 'ati' [07:52] eh, you might need to use vesa in one of those cases [07:52] I vaguely remember needing it for a certain radeon [07:52] crimsun, well, it was fine with the installation, but i installed fglrx which of course doesnt support the new xorg , but hardware drivers offered it so i installed [07:53] the problem with the free drivers is, i dont see any gui tool which says its in use and etc [07:53] like nvidia-settings or something [07:53] i mean, is there such a tool [07:54] There is a similar tool, driconf or somesuch. [07:54] RAOF, yes i installed it separately [07:54] thats the tool? hmm [07:55] But I'm not sure what you actually want out of it. You can tell that the drivers are working when... the drivers work; you get compiz & such. [07:55] actually, iam trying to run a quake 4 with the free driver, and i need to setup s3tc (s3 texture compression ) enabled in driconf [07:55] RAOF, yes compiz works, but when i restart X, monitor wont turn on [07:56] nvm ,ill try 'ati' and see [07:56] I'd just delete your xorg.conf [07:56] RAOF, hmm ok maybe ill try that [07:56] (Or move it somewhere else as a backup) [07:56] or that [07:57] i think xorg does auto backup [07:57] anyways , i heard fglrx is coming ,from a site [07:57] i have applied for testing [07:58] :) [07:58] Heh. [07:58] phoronix mentioned it, from a qa mailing list [07:58] ok one question , my live usb lucid probes for floppy for 10 min [07:58] after installation it boots fine though [07:59] do you know ara from ubuntu x team [07:59] well, i guess you already heard it [08:00] he said its testing call for fglrx driver [08:01] i just have one big question > which is the ppa which gives the latest fglrx [08:01] Yeah, it is. [08:01] or fglrx is not available from ppa? [08:02] RAOF, have you already start testing the fglrx driver ? [08:02] ara is a "she", btw. [08:02] oh sh*t [08:02] ok ill address her as such [08:02] thanks [08:02] np :) [08:03] heh lunch is here [08:04] i hope she replies to my mail soon, iam eager to test the fglrx since i got a brand new 4850 [08:04] ok bye guys [08:04] thanks [11:13] Will mondrian be part of Lucid Lynx? [11:26] Hi! I see that lucid still has thunderbird version 2. Will it be upgraded to v3? And how about the kernel - will it stay at 2.6.32? [11:27] bartmon: kernel is said to be 2.6.32, yes. [11:27] bartmon: tb3, I think not. [11:28] bartmon: tb3 is planned for alpha3 [11:28] Thank you for the quick replies. [11:28] kklimonda: That's very good news, thanks. :) [11:28] kklimonda: oh? But as a thunderbird-3 package or actually default? [11:30] arand: no idea but I guess they won't be keeping old version for LTS [11:31] kernel will stay at .32 afaik [11:32] kklimonda: Hmm, maintenace-wise it makes sense... Although I'm not sure I trust tb3 fully for prime-time yet... Although for a non-default (something I've never understood) app I guess.. [11:32] as far as i know [11:46] After update to 10.04 on my nvidia ion machine, xbmc does no longer keep up with 720p/1080p. what could cause this? [11:46] nvidia-current is installed. [11:51] Can grub in lucid boot from lvm? [11:53] screen-x: Yes, but not dm-crypt devices. [11:54] It's been able to do that for some time; certianly Karmic's grub2 can boot from lvm. [11:55] anyone else getting "*over range" error ? [11:56] i cant recall first word [11:56] RAOF: thanks. Ive mostly done upgrades since hardy, so havent tried a reinstall without /boot. Now i will :-) [11:56] 2.6.32-12 is the only kernel it happens on [11:58] I wonder where to report bug related to Lucid. here or in #ubuntu-bugs [11:59] *bugs [11:59] launchpad. [12:00] I know that I want to see where to discuss it before reporting [12:00] btw, regarding dm-crypt, the passphrase question handling has been broken since 9.10 (worked in 9.04), still broken in 10.04, does someone care? [12:00] tester01: then you can discuss it here. [12:01] tester01: if its on Lucid you can here or #ubuntu-bugs maybe [12:02] SwedeMike: obviously you care [12:02] kklimonda: thanks for nothing. [12:05] any one running Lucid can test the System Testing tool and try to build report of Audio and Disk drive? [12:05] SwedeMike: then don't ask questions whenever someone care - a lot of us do about bugs but we have no means of fixing all bugs. You haven't even pasted bug number so we don't know whenever developers know about it. [12:13] I should run ubuntu-bug command against which package name? [12:14] tester01: yes, "ubuntu-bug linux" e.g. [12:14] ..replacing linux with your package name [12:14] tester01, ubuntu-bug -p linux [12:15] tester01, ubuntu-bug -p grub etc [12:15] that what I want to know. what is the package name of System Testing tool [12:15] tester01, i think its called checkbox [12:15] indus: I think the -p is uneccessary, used for apport-cli though... [12:16] ok [12:16] kklimonda: whenever you see someone talking about "caring" then I guess you should read it as "is this something that should work and someone will actually fix if it's reported" [12:16] tester01: ubuntu-bug checkbox probably [12:16] kklimonda: obviously it's not part of the release testing. [12:17] tester01, run the tool,then go to system monitor and see the process, it should say the name [12:17] also, what should I report the bug against? it's not a dm-crypt problem, because dropping to shell and fixing it manually works every time. [12:18] it's the bootup process that is the problem, but it sounds silly to report it as an "init" problem. [12:23] SwedeMike: in 10.04 it's probably plymouth [12:34] I've opened a bug now, let's see what happens. [12:57] hmm, I get no xv with nouveau :/ [12:58] RAOF: how to debug missing xvideo support with nouveau drivers from xorg-edgers/nouveau ? In your mail you have stated that video should play nicely [13:11] RAOF: looks like it's related to -pae kernel [13:13] suspend also works fine on -generic kernel but not on -pae === nhandler_ is now known as nhandler [13:57] bRoas o/ [13:57] * BUGabundo likes the new boot splash [13:57] simple yet good looking [13:57] * BUGabundo wishes for 10 sec boot [14:01] BUGabundo: there is a new bootsplash? [14:01] BUGabundo: I find my 23 sec boot quite enough :) [14:02] kklimonda: there's is, and mine is way longer [14:03] actually it got bigger and weirder today [14:03] I wonder whenever my switch to nouveau have something to do with that [14:04] lets see now [14:06] BUGabundo: so what boot splash were you talking about? I get none :/ [14:08] the blue one bars in the bottom [14:08] 3 collors of progress [14:08] blah, I don't see them and I have kms :/ [14:08] my new bootchart looks weird: http://syntaxhighlighted.com/media/bootchart/laptop-lucid-20100203-6.png [14:09] (well, even apart of the fact that I've lost like 5 seconds - graphs look weird) [14:09] and there is this init process painted in red.. [14:10] http://bootcharts.f.bugabundo.net/ [14:10] mine [14:10] I'll upload the new ones [14:10] whoa [14:11] it does boot really slow [14:11] is it upgrade or a fresh install? [14:11] fresh [14:11] if you recall, I lost my disk a few weeks [14:11] had to reinstal [14:11] http://syntaxhighlighted.com/media/bootchart/laptop-lucid-20100129-1.png - it's my bootchart for 23 seconds.. [14:12] and it was a stock lucid install [14:12] any gnome user, motivated enough to go head bang some devs for killing the keyb shortcut to change tabs?? [14:12] BUGabundo: hmm - there is no ureadahead I can see on your bootcharts - are you sure you have let ureadahead collect data? [14:13] what tabs? [14:13] uploading now via dropbox [14:14] kklimonda: the new F***ng tabs that appear in the bottom [14:14] not at top [14:14] and that *lost* alt+NUM shortcut [14:14] let me ask seb [14:14] oh, in nautilus? [14:14] mew [14:14] I've never really used them [14:14] he is not online [14:15] I like the new split option though [14:15] seb's in portland sprinting this week [14:15] the single ONLY feature they still had shortcut too [14:15] as are basically all of the canonical platform team [14:15] anyone in #gnome server? [14:15] can ask there +why*? [14:15] BUGabundo: why moved to the bottom or why removed shortcut? [14:16] the 1st is a choice [14:16] to not polut the top [14:16] yeah [14:16] the second I *hope* a bug [14:17] Ng: you know this guys then? http://www.flickr.com/photos/kwwii/4323419643/sizes/l/ [14:17] BUGabundo: I should do, they're my colleagues :) [14:18] since I don't know almost no one of all this guys around, in person [14:18] other then a few KDE devs from Tokamak II [14:19] I can't guess, right Chris ? [14:19] BUGabundo: btw - haven't you used kde? [14:20] I use KDE apps [14:20] like kmail [14:20] and just a few others [14:20] I'm Desktop agnostic [14:20] I use what ever suits me , and file bugs when it fails :D [14:20] interesting [14:20] why? [14:21] newer bootcharts online now http://bootcharts.f.bugabundo.net/ [14:21] I don't know - I've always assumed that you like most my friends are DE-nazi [14:21] BUGabundo: there is still no ureadahead process so they aren't really interesting [14:22] BUGabundo: after almost every upgrade you have to do one boot to let ureadahead gather data - only next boots are interesting to show ;) [14:23] 27 secs to GDM [14:23] BUGabundo: and it looks.. weird - you have a huge amount of modprobes, working hal.. [14:23] kklimonda: I do several updates daily [14:23] i wonder whenever the don't show up on my bootcharts because they are too fast [14:24] no way you gonna find a reboot in between without updates [14:24] unless it crashes [14:25] so it takes ~65seconds for me to get an usable desktop :\ [14:26] BUGabundo: it takes over 40 when ureadahead is collecting data: http://syntaxhighlighted.com/media/bootchart/laptop-lucid-20100128-1.png but you have gnome-do and mono, dropbox, bzr-notify and quite a few more apps ;) [14:27] BUGabundo: you have gnome-terminal launching at login? [14:27] yeah [14:27] but those are *way* after gdm [14:27] YES [14:27] SHELL POWA [14:27] first app to open :DDDD [14:27] BUGabundo: sure - but they all count towards "65 seconds to get an usable desktop" [14:28] well if it boots in 45, and takes me 10 sec to open a shell [14:29] it's a wonder that you don't launch any KDE app on login ;) [14:30] LOL [14:30] don't always open kmail [14:31] have a keyb shortcut for it [14:31] and gnome do for everything else [14:31] I can with a single Key open most common used apps [14:31] LOVE LOVE LOVE GDO for that [14:31] its learns my needs and it just works [14:31] hmm, I should update lucid to x64 version.. [14:31] shame it crashes so often and use all cores :( [14:32] heh [14:36] hey! Does the latest fglrx really not work in Lucid Alpha2? [14:53] good morning all! Trying out alpha 2 and when I try to enable the proprietary nvidia drivers it says "driver activated but not enabled" [14:54] output from the log file referenced isn't useful I'm afraid [14:54] tamale: A2 is old [14:54] and had probs with X [14:54] update to newer packages [14:54] or try a daily [14:55] BUGabundo: Can I update from within or should I re-install [14:56] are you just running a live cd? [14:56] or have it installed? [14:56] cause live CDs don't let you install close drivers [14:56] well they do, but you need to reboot ... so it doesn't :D [15:14] arghhhhhhhhh [15:15] trying to install Lucid from USB-Key [15:15] using the alternate version [15:15] and somehow it always wants to search for a Cd [15:15] which it does not find of course [15:16] any ideas? i just copied the content of the .iso to the usb-key and did the usual modifications … [15:16] that guy is exactly the kind of thing i'm talking about when i say that milestone releases are more a problem than a solution [15:17] meeee? [15:17] he downloads and presumably installs what he mistakenly thinks is the latest milestone release, but it has old code that's long since been replaced [15:17] then he comes in here and complains about bugs that have already been fixed [15:18] so i guess you are talking about tha tamale guy … [15:18]