[00:00] <JontheEchidna> ah, that bug should be fixed in kubuntu 10.04
[00:00] <ejat> JontheEchidna: ok .. thanks ..
[00:00] <JontheEchidna> turning of translations for root should fix that
[00:00] <JontheEchidna> but that's a bit not nice :(
[00:01] <ejat> ic ..
[00:01] <ejat> is that a temp fix to that bugs ?
[00:02] <JontheEchidna> yeah
[00:02] <JontheEchidna> a real fix is in the software-properties-kde in 10.04
[00:03] <ejat> JontheEchidna: r u using lucid already ? :)
[00:03] <JontheEchidna> yeah :)
[00:04] <Lex79> ejat: me and JontheEchidna updated to Lucid when karmic was released :D
[00:05] <ejat> Lex79: i do it last time before karmic release .. ...
[00:05] <ejat> now my projects end .. thinking to upgrade to lucid next week :)
[00:05] <Lex79> :)
[00:05] <ejat> any big issues in lucid b4 i upgrade ? :)
[00:06] <JontheEchidna> not that I can recall. things have smoothed out
[00:06] <ejat> the most important is working with projector + krandrtray :)
[00:06] <ejat> JontheEchidna: c00l .. so no issue for me to upgrade :)
[00:07] <ejat> \0/
[00:07] <ejat> how about suspend n hibernate ?
[00:07] <JontheEchidna> let me see :P
[00:07] <ejat> JontheEchidna: :)
[00:08] <ejat> JontheEchidna: btw .. if ya dont mind asking .. will kde/kubuntu support thinkpad function key? :)
[00:09] <ejat> since in ubuntu all keys working out of the box .. just wondering if in kubuntu it also can work flawlessly .. ;p
[00:12] <JontheEchidna> works for me, your mileage may vary
[00:12] <ejat> wb JontheEchidna .. r u trying the suspend n hibernate ?
[00:12] <JontheEchidna> suspend
[00:12] <ejat> ok .. thanks
[00:13] <ejat> JontheEchidna: btw .. if ya dont mind asking .. will kde/kubuntu support thinkpad function key? :)
[00:13] <ejat> since in ubuntu all keys working out of the box .. just wondering if in kubuntu it also can work flawlessly .. ;p
[00:13] <JontheEchidna> dunno
[00:13] <ejat> its ok ..
[00:14] <ejat> anyway .. thanks for trying it for me .. either next week before the alpha3 release
[00:16] <Lex79> good, I need kleo_export.h to build kopete-cryptography, but it's in not-installed in kdepim :(
[00:19] <Lex79> btw kdepim-dev is empty
[02:48] <verbalshadow> is koffice-kde4 broken, rather krita-kde4 broken for anyone else?
[05:57] <shadeslayer> any triagers around?
[07:26] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna, Lex79: dpkg --compare-versions 4:2.0.3-kde4.4.0-0ubuntu1 gt 4:2.0.3really2.0.2-kde4.4.0-0ubuntu1; echo $?
[07:26] <apachelogger> when in doubt :)
[07:40] <markey> huhu apachelogger
[07:43] <apachelogger> ahoy markey
[08:06] <Xand3r> ahoy apachelogger
[08:10] <apachelogger> hoy Xand3r
[09:06] <Nightrose> apachelogger: update just killed my session for the 3rd time in 2 days :(
[09:07] <apachelogger> Nightrose: final kill that should have been
[09:07] <Nightrose> ok
[09:07] <Nightrose> hopefully
[09:07] <Nightrose> cause that's no fun tbh :(
[09:07] <apachelogger> postrm (the script responsible for all the killery) is used from the old package, so that last kill was necessary to get the new postrm that does not kill everything in ;)
[09:08] <Nightrose> i see
[09:08] <apachelogger> otherwise I would have to hack up the preinst script of the other thingy manually mangling the postrm script of the other thing, which is kind of dangerous to just think about :)
[09:17] <markey> aaaargs
[09:17] <markey> HARALD
[09:17] <markey> apachelogger: latest upgrade crashed my whole desktop
[09:17] <markey> used Synaptic
[09:17] <markey> same happened to Mamarok
[09:17] <Mamarok> markey: read above
[09:18] <markey> ah
[09:37] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: I really think that you should use this when calling own methods
[09:37] <apachelogger> in cpp it gets easily confusing otherwise IMHO
[09:45] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: fixed the cpp kfi up a bit
[09:54]  * Sput never uses the this pointer for calling methods, except when technically required
[09:54] <Sput> and I also don't see that in others' code
[09:54]  * jussi01 waits for the crash
[09:55] <jussi01> mind you may take a bit to get, only got a 3g connection here.
[09:59] <apachelogger> Sput: oh well, from looking at other's misuse of C I  must conclude that "others" are no good example to go by ;)
[09:59] <Sput> apachelogger: in C++ you are not supposed to have global methods, so anything that's not called via another object *is* a local method
[10:00] <Sput> no need for the this pointer
[10:00] <Sput> if you really need global methods, use ::myMethod()
[10:00] <apachelogger> Sput: true, maybe I am just too much of a C wrapper these days
[10:00] <Sput> wasting precious bytes for writing this-> all over the place is unnecessary :)_
[10:01] <Sput> and C doesn't have this-> !
[10:01] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: letz reimplement kfi in nicely C ontained asm
[10:02] <apachelogger> Sput: I know, I meant the fact that I find methods in cpp without object preceeding it awful looking
[10:03] <Sput> apachelogger: don't ever look at Qt, KDE or any other cpp code then :)
[10:07] <apachelogger> Sput: nah, I'll just spend the next semester implementing some wacko SVG app in cpp, that should straighten me up again ;)
[10:47] <Tm_T> gah, it's a nightmare to try to find ppa repositories
[11:19] <apachelogger> ScottK: if you could take a glimps at bug 477922
[11:19] <apachelogger> Tm_T: how very true
[11:34] <apachelogger> a|wen: ping
[11:34] <a|wen> apachelogger: pong
[11:34] <apachelogger> a|wen: you were looking into iso mounting, werent you?
[11:37] <a|wen> apachelogger: jup; the best of existing options i could find is kfuseiso (but it only works for konqueror), so i'm thinking about simply going with some servicemenu shortcuts for it instead
[11:37] <apachelogger> a|wen: as long as we can get bugs fixed ... bug 66508 please :)
[11:37] <apachelogger> a|wen: why does kfuseiso only work with konqueror btw?
[11:41] <a|wen> apachelogger: it registers as a special protocol, and for some reason this is still only supported in konqueror
[11:43] <a|wen> apachelogger: I've added some service-menu shortcuts which makes sure to do things the same way as kfuseiso, so it works in dolphin (with less features) and mounted isos can then be seen and viewed in konqueror as if it was done using kfuseiso
[11:44] <a|wen> apachelogger: we could either distribute that as a whole; or it could be split up into two (having the service-menu entries by itself)
[11:46] <apachelogger> a|wen: your choice, if you think the servicemenu is enough, then we should just include that and save CD space :)
[11:46] <apachelogger> otherwise JontheEchidna has to go around porting python stuff to cpp and that is gonna be a bit more work than kfi ;)
[11:49] <a|wen> apachelogger: as dolphin is the default, not much point in having a lot of extra features in konqueror for this ... then comes the question if it should be a seperate source-package; and what we should name it (or if we simply should add it to dolphin and have it recommend fuseiso (needs MIR))
[11:50] <apachelogger> I still would just be rejecting the wish altogether :P
[11:50] <apachelogger> mount -o loop is not that much a hassle really :P
[11:50] <apachelogger> could do more useful things with the disc space
[11:51] <apachelogger> a|wen: kde-service-menu-iso or something probably is a good name
[11:53] <a|wen> apachelogger: heh; i have a wrapper for those as well (but some people don't like that they have to have admin access)
[12:28] <apachelogger> some people dont think that mounting a iso is a common task either :P
[13:13] <a|wen> apachelogger: true; well in any case http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/kde-service-menu-iso
[13:14] <apachelogger> a|wen: imho it should be non-native
[13:16] <apachelogger> a|wen: maybe -fuseiso is a better name after all ;)
[13:18] <apachelogger> a|wen: kde-open > xdg-open
[13:19] <apachelogger> descriptions exceed 80 chars/line
[13:27] <a|wen> then I should find somewhere to put it and all :P well i'll go make it non-native and change the name later today
[13:28] <a|wen> thx for the quick review
[15:53] <Guest65514> hello nixternal
[16:27] <apachelogger> Quintasan1: you were working on the input method stuff? ... http://primalcortex.wordpress.com/2010/02/12/kde-4-4-sc-kubuntu-backports-dead-keys-acentos-nos-caracteres-portugueses sounds like something related to that stuff
[16:31]  * apachelogger is wondering if this is positive for lucid too
[16:41] <jtechidna> apachelogger: confirming the kdm upgrade is fixed here
[16:42] <apachelogger> jtechidna: did you doubt my superior timelord intellect :P
[16:46] <jtechidna> nope
[16:46] <apachelogger> ok ^^
[16:51] <ryanakca> apachelogger: assuming you were asking if dead keys were broken with lucid's 4.4.0 ... not here, áőîñ :)
[16:51] <apachelogger> ryanakca: I hope you are using ibus as input method?
[16:52] <apachelogger> right click input field -> select im
[16:52] <apachelogger> should have ibus selected
[16:53] <ryanakca> apachelogger: Yes, looks like I am. Never played with it though...
[16:53] <apachelogger> ok
[16:53] <apachelogger> ryanakca: I'll prepare to revert the ibus-for-default-patch for karmic then
[16:54] <apachelogger> in case Quintasan1 chooses to agree with reverting
[17:10] <apachelogger> jtechidna: ping
[17:17] <shtylman> do we have something to manage encrypted folders in kubuntu?
[17:19] <apachelogger> I do not think so
[17:19] <apachelogger> unless KDE comes with something builtin
[17:19] <shtylman> apachelogger: gotcha
[17:27] <claydoh> eye <3 u guys!
[17:27] <claydoh> 4.4 is very nice
[17:49] <a|wen> apachelogger: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/kde-service-menu-fuseiso <-- all points fixed; now it even uses cmake to install
[17:49] <Xand3r> moin apachelogger
[17:49] <mcguire> Hi everybody, I want to start to help development of Kubuntu specific software (programming, not packaging), could someone point me to the right documentation/wiki page that explain from where to checkout code, ...  I've only found https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/GettingInvolved/Development#Programming which is not really helpful in this case. Sorry if I missed something.
[17:59] <a|wen> apachelogger: have to run now; just leave a comment on revu if you find something missing
[18:16] <shtylman> ScottK: are we aware that our iso does not fit on a cd?
[18:32] <Lex79> apachelogger: thanks for the dpkg --compare-versions  command, it's usefull sometimes :)
[18:40] <mcguire> Riddell: esdaniel on #kubuntu tell me to ask you where/how to start with programming in Kubuntu specific software. Have you some time to help me?
[18:51] <jtechidna> apachelogger: pong
[18:52] <apachelogger> Lex79: yeah, it helps quite a bit with them fancy long version constructs :)
[18:52] <Lex79> :)
[18:53] <apachelogger> jtechidna: zander suggested that we get a group of kubuntu users to try koffice, any thoughts on that?
[18:54] <apachelogger> jtechidna: http://identi.ca/notice/21886573
[18:56] <apachelogger> mcguire: define programming kubuntu specific software?
[18:56] <apachelogger> usually I would suspect that you have some itch you want to scratch
[18:56] <apachelogger> it is not particular fun to get started with programming stuff someone else tells you to program ;)
[18:57] <jtechidna> apachelogger: would be quite interesting
[18:57] <jtechidna> sounds a bit like usability testing?
[18:57] <apachelogger> yes
[18:57] <apachelogger> though on a broarder scale than usability
[18:57] <apachelogger> I suspect
[18:58] <jtechidna> usability + functionality
[18:58] <apachelogger> also more casual
[18:58] <apachelogger> since we cannot really test specific cases at all
[18:58] <apachelogger> well, not not at all, but only limited ;)
[18:58] <jtechidna> so, we set up a wiki table, make an announcement on kubuntu.org and let the users go nuts?
[18:58] <jtechidna> mayhaps an announcement on kubuntu-users
[19:00] <mcguire> apachelogger: kubuntu specific software=developed for Kubuntu, not in Ubuntu nor KDE
[19:00] <claydoh> the forum would get more users than the puny amount in kubuntu-users :(
[19:01] <apachelogger> mcguire: yeah well, what in particular, what do you think is missing
[19:01] <claydoh> but I just answered a koffice -specific q in the list just now :)
[19:02] <apachelogger> jtechidna: I think we need more organization than that
[19:02] <apachelogger> claydoh: I expect we want to drain people from multiple resources
[19:03] <mcguire> apachelogger: no particular idea, I just just want to help other dev to create maintain and correct bugs in Kubuntu utilities, scripts and so on...
[19:03] <claydoh> drain away :) I think there would be good feedback from the few in there
[19:06] <apachelogger> jtechidna: how about ... prepare packages for all sorts of setups if necessary, prepare a questionnaire ("how did you like it? 0-4 points" "how did you like kword? 0-4 points" ...), aggregate general feedback in wiki or somewhere
[19:06] <apachelogger> jtechidna: use some forum for discussion and organization (in favor of mailing list as pointed out by claydoh)
[19:07] <apachelogger> claydoh: btw, how about that ppa policy discussion you started? ;)
[19:07] <apachelogger> mcguire: do you speak python?
[19:07] <claydoh> apachelogger: I forget that one, will look at it again
[19:08] <apachelogger> kthx
[19:10] <mcguire> apachelogger: I've read and patch some program in this language in my company, don't appear to be a complex language to learn
[19:12] <apachelogger> it isn't
[19:12] <apachelogger> to use it in a bug free way is impossible though ;)
[19:12] <apachelogger> mcguire: anyhow, you could look for bugs at launchpad
[19:13] <apachelogger> in the packages apturl and jockey and install-package and software-properties
[19:13] <shadeslayer> Xand3r: ping
[19:16] <mcguire> apachelogger: ok, I will look at these projects
[19:18] <apachelogger> omg jtechidna is not talking to me anymore
[19:19] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: maybe you went deaf? :P
[19:20] <apachelogger> more like blind in this particular case
[19:20] <apachelogger> claydoh: ping
[19:23] <claydoh> apachelogger: pong?
[19:24] <apachelogger> wanna be my new brainstorm buddy, jtechidna doesnt have any time for me :P
[19:24] <claydoh> apachelogger: I always do for you :)
[19:25] <apachelogger> claydoh: so, where do we organize that koffice review?
[19:25] <apachelogger> I suspect a wiki would be most appropriate
[19:26] <apachelogger> and I would go towards a KDE wiki because they support openid (hence one can login using launchpad stuff)
[19:26] <claydoh> a wiki , yes
[19:26] <apachelogger> question is ... techbase or userbase
[19:26] <apachelogger> former is probably more appropriate for organization, latter for execution?
[19:26] <claydoh> userbase? I dunno
[19:26] <claydoh> I need to look
[19:27] <apachelogger> or maybe use techbase for both
[19:27] <apachelogger> Nightrose: ping
[19:27] <apachelogger> claydoh: in any case I think using a kde wiki has loads of advantages over the ubuntu wiki
[19:27] <apachelogger> e.g. koffice devs can be included more easily in the preps
[19:27] <claydoh> apachelogger: true
[19:28] <claydoh> tho depending on the wiki, user input can be daunting for some folks
[19:28] <apachelogger> then again, usually when I try to use the powas of kubuntu to better kde I get bashed for treating kubuntu better or something ;)
[19:29] <apachelogger> claydoh: maybe get input via google spreadsheet or other means of questionnairing?
[19:29] <apachelogger> kind of depends on which information we want to aggregate I suppose
[19:29] <claydoh> apachelogger: that is key: what are we looking to find out?
[19:29] <apachelogger> how far along koffice is in terms of replacing ooo with it
[19:30] <apachelogger> i.e. how good does koffice match the home user use case at this point
[19:30] <claydoh> so doc import/export and usefulness
[19:30] <apachelogger> also overall usefulness vs. buggyness I suspect
[19:30] <claydoh> printing, etc
[19:30] <apachelogger> aight
[19:30] <apachelogger> the stuff a regular home user would want to do with his office
[19:32] <persia> Why not also the stuff a regular office user might want?
[19:32] <persia> (mostly the same, but usually involves more spreadsheets and presentations)
[19:32] <apachelogger> well
[19:33] <apachelogger> I would expect a regular office user to make use of advanced features ;)
[19:33] <apachelogger> though if indeed they do not, then koffice might also be an option there ;)
[19:33] <apachelogger> persia: there are very rough edges in presentation last I checked
[19:34] <apachelogger> spreadsheet and text processing are in pretty good shape for what a regular user wants to do
[19:34] <persia> At least from what I saw during the time I spent doing helpdesk in an office, most users in offices spend their time writing mail in Word, reading misformatted spreadsheets, and preparing presentations.  This may not have been a typical office, but I doubt it was that far off.
[19:34] <apachelogger> persia: yeah
[19:34] <persia> Ah, if presentation is still very rough, then yeah, probably not suitable for professional use (as it seems that sending presentations rather than documents or email has become popular)
[19:35] <apachelogger> though, as usual the question is if kubuntu actually targets business users :S
[19:35]  * persia inserts a missing "yet"
[19:35] <apachelogger> oh yeah, them darn presentation sending people ^^
[19:35]  * claydoh want koffice to replace ooo  so we can add more kde apps, like kmymoney :)
[19:36] <apachelogger> I did not manage to use kmymoney yet, so that is no good thing to consider :P
[19:36] <persia> the GNOME folks seem to be doing a parallel thing with the netbook flavour.
[19:36] <claydoh> apachelogger: kde4 version not quite there, but almost
[19:36] <apachelogger> persia: build the netbook flavour in ooo impress as presentation?
[19:36] <claydoh> or add more games by default :)
[19:37] <apachelogger> claydoh: yeah, one or two games couldnt hurt
[19:37] <apachelogger> and more translations
[19:37] <claydoh> yes
[19:37] <persia> apachelogger: Right.  It's much easier to get the nice glossy look if you don't need the software to work :)
[19:38] <persia> But no, my comment was about dropping OOo from the default install.
[19:38] <apachelogger> oh, especially for the netbook flavour I see a reason there
[19:38] <apachelogger> ooo is much to fat and clumsy for that use case IMHO
[19:38] <persia> (the little I've seen seems to imply use of abiword/gnumeric, which I thought were GNOME Office, which I thought would parallel KOffice)
[19:38] <apachelogger> yeah
[19:39] <apachelogger> persia: though I dont think it is officially gnome office
[19:39] <claydoh> darn techbase database errors!
[19:39] <persia> apachelogger: I think that the "officialness" of gnome office went away several years back.
[19:39] <apachelogger> back when they lost their presentation app I think
[19:39] <apachelogger> well
[19:39] <persia> apachelogger: But apparently I'm wrong: http://live.gnome.org/GnomeOffice
[19:39] <apachelogger> not particularimportant :D
[19:40] <persia> No ;)
[19:40] <apachelogger> persia: that is just a list of apps one might use in a office with gnome it seems
[19:40] <apachelogger> also not particular important
[19:41] <apachelogger> claydoh: thinking about it... in the fear of getting bashed again I do not think that using techbase is a good idea
[19:41] <apachelogger> people might come and whip my ass until I include more distros etc.
[19:43] <claydoh> yeah, how about this: we don't talk about kubuntu, just what works, doesn't, what needs help, and use that info for our ouwn purposes. Yhis does still give Koffice folks the useful info as well
[19:45] <claydoh> we are just looking to see if Koffice is worthy as a ooo replacement, right?
[19:45] <apachelogger> well, in a kubuntu context
[19:46] <claydoh> or are we trying to also help out the koffice team (which would e cool too )
[19:46] <apachelogger> I'll just use the kubuntu wiki for now to write down notes, we can always move stuff later on
[19:53] <apachelogger> claydoh: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/KOfficeUserReview
[20:06] <ghostcube> o/
[20:09] <Riddell> hi mcguire, you can get our source code with apt-get source foo
[20:15] <mcguire> Riddell: thanks
[21:33] <bambule> hi, i have just updated my kubuntu 9.10 to kde 4.4. i now have the problem that the "kde menubar" gets shown twice.
[21:33] <bambule> both are at the bottom of the screen (as expected). one is a bit larger than the other
[21:34] <bambule> by clicking at the overlapping pixels i can bring one of them to the front
[21:34] <bambule> notifications are shown by both of them. so it get everything twice
[21:34] <bambule> any idea how i can get rid of this situation?
[21:35] <bambule> the bug is stable. restarting showed the same behaviro
[21:35] <bambule> r
[21:36] <claydoh> remove one of them
[21:36] <bambule> :-)
[21:36] <bambule> but how?
[21:36] <claydoh> right-clickmon one
[21:36] <claydoh> right-click on one
[21:37] <claydoh> but remember, support questions go to #kubuntu :)
[21:38] <bambule> claydoh: oh sorry. i thought i was in #kubuntu. the tab of quassel only shows the first bit....
[21:38] <claydoh> :)
[21:38] <bambule> how does right clicking help? btw.
[21:39] <claydoh> you get the option to remove panels, taskbars, etc
[21:39] <bambule> ok thanks!
[21:41] <claydoh> tho another way to remove it is to click the 'cashew' on the right side of a panel, select "more Settings" then 'remove this panel',
[21:42] <bambule> whats a "cashew"?
[21:42] <claydoh> the wierd golden icon on the very right side of the panel
[21:42] <claydoh> well, golden if you mouse over it
[21:48] <claydoh> anyone , what is up with this:
[21:48] <claydoh> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/KnowledgeBase
[21:48] <ulysses> what the hell is this?
[21:49] <claydoh> and why is in the header as well?
[21:49] <yuriy_> i wondered that too when i saw it
[21:49] <jjesse> we talking about the linked wiki page?
[21:49] <ulysses> I think yes
[21:50] <claydoh> and https://edge.launchpad.net/~sakthievel
[21:50] <jjesse> what a silly page
[21:50] <claydoh> hmmm
[21:50] <jjesse> that page returs page not found
[21:51] <yuriy_> and there goes X!
[21:51] <claydoh> exactly, the user who edited it does not exist (anymore?)
[21:51] <claydoh> and why is it in the main kubuntu wiki header
[21:52] <jjesse> no idea
[21:55] <yuriy_> yeah looks like he created it too, no history, so it's not like an old real page that someone messed with
[21:56]  * ryanakca grumbles at debuild -S -sa making changes to upstream's source...
[22:00] <ryanakca> In bangarang's case, is it still appropriate to use 'dh --with kde $@' as I've been doing, even if it isn't a KDE SC app? I'm asking because of http://pastebin.ca/1795661 ...
[22:01] <JontheEchidna> yeah, that's ignorable
[22:01] <JontheEchidna> well, safe to ignore
[22:05] <persia> ryanakca: If that command is changing upstream source, fiddle more with debian/rules: clean
[22:05] <ryanakca> JontheEchidna: OK, and what about modifying upstream's source: http://paste.ubuntu.com/375754/ (1.0.1 is a bugfix release for 1.0, so this particular package will go into Debian and then I can sync it)
[22:05] <JontheEchidna> that field should be removed from upstream's .desktop file
[22:07] <ryanakca> JontheEchidna: Then should I add a lintian override for 'W: bangarang source: patch-system-but-direct-changes-in-diff data/bangarang_play_dvd.desktop'?
[22:08] <JontheEchidna> yeah. there's no harm done by modifying the source in this way
[22:08] <ryanakca> JontheEchidna: OK, thanks
[22:08] <JontheEchidna> It would be nice if the kubuntu l10n stuff didn't touch universe packages, but I suppose that's a bit hard to detect
[22:32] <nixternal> oi
[22:52] <Lex79> JontheEchidna: when you have time to sponsor some packages, they are in ninja wiki
[22:57] <ScottK> apachelogger: Looking at 477922
[22:57] <ScottK> shtylman: Generally, yes.  I didn't look recently at how bad it was (ISO size).  Riddell was working on it.
[23:23] <_Groo_> hi/2 all
[23:24] <_Groo_> is  dput still broken, i wanna contribute some new packages but i cant upload a 25k package!!!
[23:33] <_Groo_> anyone alive?
[23:34] <markey> apachelogger: ping