[00:23] <didrocks> time to go to bed, have a good week-end :)
[00:26] <bryceh> cya didrocks
[10:41] <didrocks> RAOF: btw, I'm thinking about the --as-needed patch we often add to packages, do you know why it's not part of GNOME autogen.sh when generating ltmain.sh.?
[15:23] <asac> !test
[15:23] <asac> thanks for confirming that i am still here
[15:28] <asac_> yay another reconnect
[15:29]  * asac goes for tea time rather than wasting time fiddling with router and /reconnect
[16:00] <LaserJock> any UNE people around?
[16:02] <geser> is it about the mandatory settings?
[16:03] <didrocks> LaserJock: I'm there :)
[16:04] <LaserJock> geser: yes
[16:04] <LaserJock> I was wondering what the "plan" was with that
[16:04] <didrocks> LaserJock: there are some keys which are mandatories and others that are default now
[16:05] <LaserJock> my panel looks terrible but I figured there must be some master plan
[16:05] <didrocks> LaserJock: terrible?
[16:05] <LaserJock> yeah
[16:05] <didrocks> LaserJock: how? can you be a little bit more precise, please?
[16:05] <LaserJock> things are out of place
[16:05] <didrocks> LaserJock: can you post a screenshot?
[16:06] <LaserJock> yeah, one sec
[16:06] <LaserJock> basically, it's impossible to add applets from within UNE
[16:06] <didrocks> right
[16:06] <LaserJock> so I went in to regular GNOME and added them
[16:06] <LaserJock> and when I went back in to UNE things were a bit messed up
[16:06] <didrocks> hum, normally you can't add new applets in UNE and those are default
[16:07] <didrocks> adding into the GNOME session shouldn't add them to UNE
[16:08] <LaserJock> well, I didn't get new ones in UNE (bad) and my existing ones got re-arranged
[16:08] <LaserJock> one sec on the screenie
[16:08] <didrocks> that shouldn't happen, strange :)
[16:08] <didrocks> and yes, you shouldn't get new one in UNE, this is by design and tech limitation
[16:09] <didrocks> (because of providing the new capability to run both GNOME and UNE in the same machine)
[16:10] <LaserJock> http://laserjock.us/Screenshot-1.png
[16:10] <LaserJock> but why are the applets mandatory? wouldn't default be better?
[16:10] <didrocks> LaserJock: as told just before, that internal to gconf settings if you want both UNE and GNOME session
[16:11] <didrocks> so ok, the calendar isn't in the right place
[16:11] <didrocks> (time applet)
[16:11] <didrocks> that can be fixed
[16:12] <LaserJock> at first I didn't have any time applet
[16:12] <didrocks> right, this is an issue I have to fix
[16:12] <didrocks> gconf bug about mandatory settings :)
[16:12] <LaserJock> I was trying to add the time applet, tomboy, and system monitor
[16:12] <didrocks> (this is to share the same applet)
[16:12] <didrocks> normally, you won't be able to edit the panel, just your GNOME one, but not in UNE
[16:13] <LaserJock> that's ... strange
[16:13] <didrocks> this is less than optimal, I agree, but it involve heavily patching in gconf (too much for an LTS)
[16:13] <didrocks> so, if you know a better way, without messing up user config, I'm open to any suggestion
[16:13] <LaserJock> why not do it in the user config?
[16:14] <didrocks> because if a user change something in the GNOME session in the panel and the value aren't mandatory in UNE
[16:14] <LaserJock> well, but you can do the same thing
[16:14] <LaserJock> but let it be user-editable
[16:14] <didrocks> tell me how to do it
[16:14] <LaserJock> throw a GUI in front of the mandatory bits for UNE
[16:14] <didrocks> or let me finish my explanation :)
[16:15] <didrocks> because if a user change something in the GNOME session in the panel and the value aren't mandatory in UNE, you get that:
[16:15] <didrocks> - GNOME session panel will be drawn
[16:15] <didrocks> - no home switcher applet
[16:15] <didrocks> - no "personal taskbar in UNE"
[16:16] <didrocks> this is related to gconf internals, you can't say "but those are default for UNE, discaring user configuration"
[16:16] <didrocks> or having one gconf user configuration in GNOME session and another one for UNE
[16:17] <LaserJock> ok, so throw the UNE gconf keys in /var and make then editable
[16:17] <LaserJock> ?
[16:17] <didrocks> LaserJock: that's what is already been done
[16:17] <didrocks> but again
[16:17] <didrocks> the user gconf configuration is in ~/.gconfd
[16:17] <didrocks> if you change something in a panel, the _whole_ default is then ignoreed
[16:17] <didrocks> and so you impact the UNE and the GNOME session conf
[16:18] <didrocks> got back the two panels, and so on…
[16:18] <LaserJock> right, I'm saying keep them mandatory and all, what you've got now
[16:18] <didrocks> is that clear?
[16:18] <didrocks> right
[16:18] <LaserJock> but just provide a way for people to edit them
[16:18] <LaserJock> so that we can add applets
[16:18] <didrocks> hum, that would be complicating an FF is closed
[16:19] <didrocks> that means rewrite a new 'add applet'
[16:19] <LaserJock> right, but as it is now UNE has just become usless for anybody who wants to add a single applet
[16:19] <didrocks> if you want to do that, do not hesitate :)
[16:20] <didrocks> it was hardly doable in the last version too (just a little empty space)
[16:20] <LaserJock> this is a rather noticable regression and in an LTS release :(
[16:20] <didrocks> LaserJock: do you want to work on that? honestly, I won't have the time
[16:21] <didrocks> but I agree that this is less than ideal
[16:21] <LaserJock> no, I honestly just want to not have regressions in LTS releases
[16:21] <didrocks> LaserJock: if nobody wants to work on that… :(
[16:21] <LaserJock> the seperation of GNOME from UNE sessions shouldn't have been done then
[16:21] <didrocks> LaserJock: this was hardly asked by users
[16:22] <LaserJock> if nobody is willing to do it all the way, including patch up regressions, it shouldn't have been done in the first place
[16:22] <didrocks> and that's why there was a session at UDS
[16:22] <didrocks> LaserJock: people who really wanted to add panels can still edit files in /usr/share/gconf/une/mandatory
[16:23] <LaserJock> yeah
[16:23] <LaserJock> my choices are to either abandon UNE (sucks) or provide my own ubuntu-netbook-default-settings package (sucks slightly less)
[16:23] <didrocks> LaserJock: can you log a bug on the time issue please? I'll fix it next week
[16:24] <didrocks> LaserJock: how would you fix not having the two panels? that's what I'm interested in
[16:24] <didrocks> LaserJock: you know, I had a look for more than one week on that issue, so I think I know the internals
[16:24] <LaserJock> don't do the split until you know you can do it right, simple as that
[16:25] <didrocks> LaserJock: that's not constructive
[16:25] <LaserJock> why?
[16:25] <LaserJock> it should be common sense
[16:26] <didrocks> LaserJock: because having a gnome session was more asked that the "I can't change my panel" (what karmic's panel didn't allow you as well as there were a small space to add a new applet)
[16:27] <LaserJock> but the behavior was the same as any normal gnome session
[16:27] <LaserJock> move applet then add
[16:27] <LaserJock> but now you can't do that
[16:28] <LaserJock> and having changes in GNOME affect UNE was unlikely to be much of an issue with people
[16:28] <LaserJock> they aren't likely to switch between the two regularly
[16:28] <LaserJock> so for seemingly minimal gain, the is a pretty significant cost
[16:28] <didrocks> LaserJock: let me rephrase, if you add/move any applet in GNOME panel and keys are default (not mandatory) in UNE, you got the two panels in UNE as well
[16:29] <didrocks> or if you change any in UNE as well, you crash your gnome setting
[16:29] <didrocks> LaserJock: I'm thinking of a way, maybe, is to change XDG dir for gnome-panel only
[16:29] <LaserJock> that's not great
[16:30] <didrocks> LaserJock: right, that's why I put them as mandatory
[16:30] <LaserJock> ok, I really gotta run
[16:30] <LaserJock> I understand the problem
[16:30] <LaserJock> I still think LTS is a bad time for this, but whatever
[16:30] <didrocks> LaserJock: if you want to discuss about that later, I'm trying to figure out of how to do it right
[16:30] <LaserJock> I'll file bugs when I get back from errands
[16:30] <LaserJock> well, you might look at sabayon
[16:31] <LaserJock> or XDG seems sort of reasonable
[16:31] <didrocks> LaserJock: I just hope you can at least understand it's not an easy thing to deal with :)
[16:31] <LaserJock> of course
[16:31] <didrocks> I know and maintained sabayon
[16:31] <LaserJock> I've dealt with similar issues before
[16:31] <didrocks> LaserJock: let discuss about that later, right?
[16:31] <didrocks> I may have an idea
[16:31] <LaserJock> I think a simple GUI to edit the manditory keys would maybe work
[16:31] <didrocks> (the XDG thing, but should be discuss)
[16:31] <LaserJock> ok, talk to you later
[16:31] <didrocks> ttyl
[16:43] <chrisccoulson> working today didrocks?
[18:40] <baptistemm> someone to help me debugging a build issue for bluez
[18:45] <baptistemm> asac, around ? (as this is related to bluez)
[18:50] <baptistemm> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/39149642/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-amd64.bluez_4.61-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[20:18] <baptistemm> hey chrisccoulson
[20:18] <chrisccoulson> hey baptistemm
[20:18] <baptistemm> have you some minutes for me?
[20:18] <chrisccoulson> how are you?
[20:18] <baptistemm> fine, trying to package latest bluez
[20:18] <chrisccoulson> i have a few minutes, possibly ;)
[20:18] <baptistemm> My wife and my son are away for a week
[20:18] <baptistemm> :)
[20:18] <chrisccoulson> heh, enjoying the quiet? ;)
[20:19] <baptistemm> being a little sad when my son left
[20:19] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i can imagine
[20:19] <baptistemm> but I'm quite happy to have the quiet yeah ;)
[20:20] <baptistemm> back to bluez, the latest version has a symbols which was renamed, and so, the build fails
[20:20] <baptistemm> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/39149642/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-amd64.bluez_4.61-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[20:21] <chrisccoulson> you want to know how to resolve that?
[20:21] <baptistemm> I added the new symbols, but I don"t what to do with the missing one
[20:22] <baptistemm> should I bump the soname
[20:22] <baptistemm> ?
[20:22] <baptistemm> yeah
[20:22] <chrisccoulson> the soname should have been bumped upstream - that's not something we should do at a distro level
[20:22] <chrisccoulson> did they not bump the soname?
[20:27] <chrisccoulson> ah, so no soname change then
[20:27] <chrisccoulson> that would need reporting upstream really
[20:29] <baptistemm> hmm, I don't know how bluez define soname
[20:30] <baptistemm> I asked on #bluez earlier but noone was there to answer
[20:30] <chrisccoulson> baptistemm, the soname is defined in Makefile.am (lib_libbluetooth_la_LDFLAGS = -version-info 8:0:5)
[20:31] <chrisccoulson> we should avoid uploading this though until that issue is resolved, as there might be other things using that symbol
[20:32] <chrisccoulson> libbluetooth3 has a lot of rdepends
[20:32] <baptistemm> yep
[20:32] <james_w> hey chrisccoulson
[20:32] <james_w> hi baptistemm
[20:32] <baptistemm> at least the previous one (4.60) was never been uploaded, in the mean time this one doesn't break something
[20:32] <baptistemm> hi james_w
[20:32] <chrisccoulson> hey james_w, how are you?
[20:32] <james_w> good thanks, how about you?
[20:33] <chrisccoulson> i'm not too bad, thanks
[20:35] <james_w> chrisccoulson: did you have a chance to look at gnome-desktop again?
[20:35] <chrisccoulson> james_w - not yet, unfortunately. i can try and look at that this evening though
[20:36] <james_w> no rush
[20:36] <chrisccoulson> i need to have a look really for a crasher anyway