/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/02/15/#ubuntu-manual.txt

humphreybcwhat's happening everyone00:21
humphreybcdutchie, ping00:30
humphreybcoh wait you're probably asleep00:30
humphreybcnevermind xD00:30
godbykHe was around an hour ago.00:31
humphreybcthat's all good00:50
humphreybcit's like 2am there now00:50
humphreybcgodbyk: i read your comments, and I think they're valid. i'll rewrite some of the quickshot wiki00:51
godbykhumphreybc: did they make sense?00:51
humphreybcsort of00:51
humphreybc:P00:51
godbykBasically, your program should do everything automatically if it can, and only involve the user when it must.00:51
humphreybci get the idea00:51
humphreybcyup00:51
godbykDon't pester the user with questions that it can answer itself.00:51
godbykMake it as easy as possible for the user.00:51
humphreybctrue00:51
humphreybccould you clarify " QuickShot sets the default language to match the system language"00:53
godbykOh, in the dropdown list of languages, it should default to the current (system) language.00:53
humphreybcokay gotcha00:54
humphreybcgodbyk: read over the new workflow: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/quickshot01:03
godbykhumphreybc: Sounds a lot better.01:11
humphreybccool... right now just have to write it :P01:29
humphreybcgodbyk: i'm just trying to think what would be the best way to run the "database" of screenshots02:11
godbykhumphreybc: Just have a small MySQL db running on a web server that responds to requests from the QuickShot app for data.02:11
humphreybcyup that's what i was thinking. we need some test screenshots... and some way of populating the database from the latex screenshot thing02:12
godbykWell, the list of screenshots that LaTeX is spitting out right now will change as the \screenshotTODOs get replaced by actual screenshots.02:18
humphreybcrighto02:19
humphreybcso where should i start?02:19
humphreybchttps://edge.launchpad.net/~quickshotdevs xD02:27
humphreybchttps://edge.launchpad.net/quickshot02:27
humphreybci added you as a member :)02:28
godbykcool02:39
godbykI'd start working on the UI stuff first.. to get the workflow set up.02:39
godbykthen figure out how to take the screenshots and whatnot.02:39
godbykwe can fill in the data later.02:39
godbyk(that's the easy part)02:39
humphreybcsweet02:53
humphreybcso the UI i guess i should use glade or something?02:53
humphreybcwhat do you think of the logo too: http://humphreybc.files.wordpress.com/2010/02/icon192.png02:53
godbykthe ubuntu logo isn't necessary02:57
godbykthe camera icon is okay.02:57
godbykbut the desktop screenshot doesn't really fit.02:57
humphreybctrue02:57
humphreybcbut i can't be bothered changing it now :)02:57
humphreybcmaybe in the future sometime02:58
* humphreybc is blindly trying to work out glade03:07
humphreybcgodbyk: you can use bzr branch lp:quickshot to see what I have so far06:38
godbyksure06:38
humphreybcI'm using quickly and glade to create the UI. So you'd probably want to open them using those06:38
humphreybcotherwise it'll just look like nothing06:39
humphreybcif you could write a couple of lines of python that runs the program thus far, that'd be great xD06:39
humphreybcwait for about 5 mins till i push lots of changes06:39
humphreybcheh i just chatted to jono on facebook, he thinks it's a "fucking awesome" project... his words!06:40
humphreybcxD06:40
godbykAdobe Photoshop?  Oh noes!06:52
humphreybcyeah hold up06:54
humphreybci just lost all the work i was just doing06:54
humphreybcbloody bzr06:54
* humphreybc hates diverged branches with a passion07:07
* humphreybc also thinks that launchpad is ridiculously slow07:11
humphreybcokay i had to delete the branch and set up a new one07:14
humphreybcgodbyk: try this one now. bzr branch lp:quickshot07:14
godbykhumphreybc: you're missing the icon.png file07:17
humphreybchuh? where?07:17
godbykin data/media/07:18
humphreybcoh right07:18
humphreybcsure07:18
humphreybcpushing through with the icon now07:19
humphreybchmm07:20
humphreybcit's loading the icon in glade07:21
humphreybcbut not when it's run07:21
godbykit's also looking for it in data/ui/logo.png07:22
humphreybci wonder why the buttons are so ginormous07:23
humphreybci fixed the icon thing07:23
humphreybcjust put it in /ui07:23
humphreybcok i've fixed the huge buttons07:24
humphreybci can't get it to make the window smaller tho07:25
godbykturn off the fill under the packing tab07:25
godbykwhat are you using to create/edit the UI?07:25
humphreybcah sweet07:29
humphreybcnope i got it07:29
humphreybcglade07:29
humphreybcunder height request07:29
humphreybcgodbyk: just pushing through some more changes07:30
humphreybcI fixed a lot of the height, spacing, padding, button sizes and logo07:30
humphreybclooks nice now07:30
humphreybchttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/quickshot07:35
humphreybci put a screenshot on the wiki07:35
humphreybcgodbyk: i was talking to martin owens over skype today07:39
humphreybcand he suggested that quickshot creates an entire new user07:40
humphreybcso we don't mess with people's themes and such07:40
humphreybcthen we just ask them to switch user to the new user and take shots07:40
godbykThat could work.07:40
godbykOr use the guest account.07:40
humphreybcalso, instead of uploading every shot each time, he said we should create a projects directory or something in the "quickshot users" home directory, where the images are stored. Then they can capture as many as they want, and once they're finished, upload them all07:41
godbyk(The guest account would clean up after itself)07:41
humphreybcno no guest account is bad because there is hardly any read/write privilages07:41
godbykThat's true.07:41
humphreybcand he suggested instead of having a mysql database, we should just use a bzr branch07:41
humphreybcwith a directory structure for languages07:41
humphreybcthen quickshot can just get the bzr branch, add the images the user takes from their projects directory and push. we could enable auto merging07:41
humphreybcand to prevent the branch from getting too big, we could have one branch for each language, or one branch for each chapter07:42
humphreybcand he said something about using empty files or empty folders as a way of the app knowing if that shot has already been taken or not07:43
godbykwell, you wouldn't want to force someone to check out a branch full of images just to see which ones may still need to be created.07:44
godbykbrb07:44
godbykback07:47
humphreybci think i just broke the quickly run command somehow07:50
humphreybcshould i push it for you to have a look?07:50
humphreybcTraceback (most recent call last):07:50
humphreybc  File "bin/quickshot", line 111, in <module>07:50
humphreybc    window = NewQuickshotWindow()07:50
humphreybc  File "bin/quickshot", line 95, in NewQuickshotWindow07:50
humphreybc    window.finish_initializing(builder)07:50
humphreybcAttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'finish_initializing'07:50
humphreybcis dutchie awake yet?07:52
godbykHey, komsas. Did you figure out how to compile the translated manual?07:52
komsasHi, yes dutchie gave me https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/msg00548.html07:53
godbykPerfect! Let me know if you run into any problems.07:54
komsasbut I have one problem. But I get error "! LaTeX Error: File `polyglossia.sty' not found."07:54
komsasI dont find anything how to solve it.07:55
godbykkomsas: Did you install the TeX Live 2009?  The polyglossia package is in there.07:56
komsasyes I did07:56
godbykIt's *not* in the version of TeX Live that is in the Ubuntu repositories, unfortunately.07:56
komsasI know, I did like your wrote in that mini manual07:56
godbykWhat does it say when you type: "which xelatex"?07:57
komsas/usr/bin/xelatex07:57
godbykHow about "kpsewhich polyglossia.sty"?07:58
komsasnothing07:58
godbykOkay.  How about: "dpkg-query -s texlive-xetex | grep Status"07:59
komsas"Status: install ok installed"08:00
godbykAh, so it's using the old texlive stuff.08:00
godbykopen synaptic and remove all the texlive-* packages.08:00
komsasBut I remove all packages08:00
godbykStrange.  It thinks it's still installed.  Does Synaptic think it's still installed?08:00
komsasI will look..08:01
godbykAlso, what does "which tlmgr" return?08:01
komsasnothing, it strange but apt-get showing that texlive-xetex installed08:02
godbykokay.  uninstall that.  and remove and other texlive packages that are still installed, too.08:02
komsasok I will try08:03
komsasand after remove install text live 2009?08:05
godbykYes, if you haven't already installed TeX Live 2009, you'll need to do that.08:06
komsasthanks godbyk08:12
godbykkomsas: No problem.  If you continue to run into problems, feel free to pester me.08:12
humphreybcgodbyk: I've changed the quickshot workflow, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/quickshot08:17
godbykhumphreybc: It may also have to install apps that aren't installed (bzr, the app that screenshot is of, the language packs and fonts)..08:22
humphreybctrue08:23
humphreybcjesus i'm getting sick of this slow internet08:25
humphreybci'm going to ring the ISP tomorrow and demand answers08:25
humphreybchehe08:25
humphreybc10KB/s is a good speed...08:25
godbykhumphreybc: btw, we might want to change the title of my session to "LaTeX for Authors and Translators"08:25
humphreybcokay sure, do you want to do that?08:25
godbykJust on the wiki? I can do that.08:26
humphreybchttp://www.speedtest.net/result/717233561.png08:29
humphreybcyep just on the wiki08:29
godbykLooks like everyone hates your ISP.08:30
godbykAnd I can see why, with those speeds.08:31
godbykGah.. too many things to do! :-)08:32
godbykI'm going to play on the treadmill and clear my head.  When I get back, I think I'll start working on writing a style guide and work on my presentation for this LaTeX stuff.08:32
godbykBe back in about 20 minutes.08:33
humphreybcsweet as08:33
humphreybcdutchie: could you check my feed is going to Planet UM? I've posted a few things these past couple of days and nothing appears to be getting through08:39
komsashumphreybc: I think you must come to Lithuania http://www.speedtest.net/result/717238607.png we live much better (in virtual world) ;)08:40
humphreybcwow08:41
humphreybcyeah NZ is notorious for it's incredibly slow internet speeds08:41
humphreybcwe're wayy behind the rest of the world in IT advancements and networking08:41
godbykback09:01
humphreybcwell that was cool... my wireless got dropped and then network-manager crashed and refused to restart09:12
humphreybcanyway, should i push my branch for quickshot even though the command to run the program doesn't work?09:12
godbykup to you.09:13
godbykprobably doesn't hurt, since no one's doing anything with it yet.09:13
humphreybcsweet09:15
humphreybcpushing it up now09:15
humphreybcI don't know how much of a python whizz you are09:17
godbykNot much of one.  I haven't written any gui stuff with it yet.09:18
godbykI've used it primarily for text processing and NLP stuff.09:18
humphreybcright09:21
humphreybcthat's all good09:21
humphreybci'll pester dutchie :D09:21
humphreybcdutchie, bzr branch lp:quickshot09:22
humphreybcheh09:22
komsasgodbyk: now I get error when ran make http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/d22fb8f6c something with fonts11:53
ubuntujenkinskomsas I can't help much but did you run the install script?13:30
komsasyes and I get "Done! You should now be able to compile the Ubuntu manual!" so everthing is fine.13:33
ubuntujenkinswhen did you last run it? it was updated yesterday13:35
komsasOk I'm going to pull13:36
komsasubuntujenkins: nothing new, all package are installed13:41
ubuntujenkinsare you compiling in english?13:42
komsasno, lithuanian13:43
ubuntujenkinsWell this may be no help but check you have texlive-fonts-reccomended and texlive-latx-recommended installed. I would think the script looks for those.13:45
ubuntujenkins!paste13:45
manualbotFor posting multi-line texts into the channel, please use http://ubuntu.pastebin.com | To post !screenshots use http://tinyurl.com/imagebin | !pastebinit to paste directly from  command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic13:46
ubuntujenkinskomsas I have to go to a lecture but this is the screen shot of all of the packages that I have installed http://imagebin.org/8489313:47
komsasthanks ubuntujenkins13:47
ubuntujenkinsif i can i will help when i am there13:47
ubuntujenkinskomsas did you solve it?16:13
komsasno, strange I installed TeX Live 2009 but synaptic showing that all packages, not like in your screenshot, are 2007.16:28
komsasbefore compiling texlive 2009 I removed all texlive packages.16:29
ubuntujenkinsI am running Lucid so thats why the packages are different. What you you run to build in lithuainan?16:29
ubuntujenkins*lithuanian16:30
komsas9.1016:30
ubuntujenkinsI think the packages will be older versions in 9.10 should make no difference. Mine complies in english how do I compile it in lithuanian?16:31
komsasmake ubuntu-manual-lt.pdf16:32
dutchiekomsas: what does 'dpkg --get-selections | grep texlive' say?16:33
komsashttp://ubuntu.pastebin.com/m7cd215e16:34
ubuntujenkinshttp://paste.ubuntu.com/376953/16:34
dutchiekomsas: that output says you have texlive packages installed16:34
komsasyes, but they dont work correctly16:35
dutchieyou need them not installed16:35
komsaslast error was ! LaTeX Error: File `ccicons.sty' not found.16:35
dutchieto build in lithuanian16:35
komsasI did everythink like in godbyk said in email16:36
komsasmail *16:36
dutchiethat output says fifferently16:37
dutchiedifferently*16:37
dutchiekomsas: run "sudo aptitude remove texlive*"16:39
komsasand what then?16:39
dutchieit should work16:40
komsaswith aptitude you cant do this, apt-get works :)16:41
dutchiewhy does it not work?16:43
komsaswith that command it removed xelatex16:43
dutchieit should remove xelatex16:43
dutchieyou want to remove the xelatex installed from the ubuntu repositories and install one from upstream16:44
komsasbut I did that16:44
dutchieyou didn't remove the ubuntu texlive packages16:44
komsasI did :) 2 times16:45
komsasthan compile 200916:45
dutchiewell, they're still there :)16:45
komsasso I dont know from where they come :))16:45
komsasinstall-pkgs.sh ?16:45
komsasI think it did that, some dependences install packages again16:46
komsasI think so :)16:46
ubuntujenkinsas a test I have the 2009 by default in lucid should I be able to compile it? I do get an error but a different one at the moment. I may just confuse things16:47
dutchieubuntujenkins: maybe, godbyk is really the guy to ask16:48
komsasin what time zone godbyk lives?16:48
dutchieUS somewhere16:48
ubuntujenkinsdutchie I know I have been trying to help16:48
dutchiekomsas: can you post the install-pkgs.log file?16:49
komsashttp://paste.ubuntu.com/376965/16:50
dutchiekomsas: can you run through the steps of that email again?16:51
dutchiepost all the output as it happens :)16:51
komsasOk, but compiling 2009 version take a lot of time :) more then 1h16:51
dutchiesure16:51
dutchiethat's fine16:52
dutchiekomsas: how's it going?18:19
komsascompiling18:19
* dutchie decides to have a go himself18:19
komsasdutchie: thanks for care about me :))18:20
dutchiehmm18:22
dutchielooks like I'll have to remove fedora first18:22
komsasu on fedora?18:23
komsaswow, I thougth everybody on ubuntu :))18:23
dutchiewell, I have a fedora partition that I never use18:24
komsasdutchie: http://paste.ubuntu.com/377050/19:03
dutchieOK, I think it can't find the packages19:04
dutchiewhere are you installing texlive to?19:04
komsasdefault dirs http://paste.ubuntu.com/377052/19:06
dutchiehmm19:06
dutchiemight be able to help more once I've finished doing it19:08
komsasI think one of pacakge from install-pkgs needs all texlive old packages, so it install all them19:08
komsask19:08
dutchiesweet, jono just  tweeted our 48 hours event19:12
annakamillahello19:13
dutchiehi annakamilla, can we help?19:14
annakamillano19:14
annakamillai was reading manual do ubuntu version beta19:19
dutchieannakamilla: did you have any feedback?19:41
thorwilgodbyk: _started_ to compare font with a mean text in inkscape. sans first: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Et-w-/%2Bjunk/ubuntu_manual_cover/download/head%3A/font_test.svg-20100215185059-zy2dcn999qds8tvs-1/font_test.svg19:57
godbykkomsas: Are you still around?21:54
komsasyes, godbyk21:54
komsasdid you saw me log file?21:54
godbykI can help you with compiling the manual if you're still having problems.21:54
godbykYeah.21:54
godbykRunning the install-pkgs.sh script only works with the old 2007 TeX Live.21:54
godbykIt will keep installing the 2007 packages if it thinks something is missing.21:55
komsasso that to do?21:55
komsaswhat *21:55
godbyk(At some point, I'm going to have to migrate everything to the 2009 version -- even the English -- because the 2007 version is tool ancient.)21:55
godbykkomsas: Make sure that all the texlive-* packages are uninstalled.21:55
godbykWhen you ran the TeX Live 2009 installer, did you have it install everything or a smaller subset of the packages?21:56
komsasI did all, but last time I installed only lithuanian21:56
godbykDo you still have the install-tl script?21:57
komsasyes21:57
godbykLet's run it again (I think it will skip things that are already installed) and we'll make sure it's installing the required packages.21:57
godbykGo to the directory with the tl-install script and run: sudo ./tl-install21:58
godbykLet me know when you get to the first menu.21:58
komsasok21:58
godbykYou're at the menu?21:58
dutchiegodbyk: I think the install-pkgs.sh script fails to detect the 2009 packages and then installs 2007 from the repos21:58
godbykdutchie: It may, though it *should* detect them.. (it does on my system, at least).21:59
godbykBut yeah, that's basically what's been happening to komsas.21:59
godbykI've been trying to avoid it, but for the glossaries to work well, and to avoid a lot of extra code, I think I'm going to have everyone switch over to 2009 soon.22:00
komsasgodbyk: I'm in22:00
dutchiethis is one of the reasons I started doing that tonight22:00
godbykcool22:00
godbykSo let's start at the top.22:00
godbykDid it deteect your platform okay?22:00
komsasyes22:01
godbykGood.  What does it say for installation scheme?22:03
godbykDoes it say 'scheme-full'?22:03
komsasfull22:04
godbykgood22:05
godbykpress L and [Enter] so we can see the languages menu22:05
komsasI'm in22:05
godbykWhat languages do you have installed22:05
godbyk(I don't care about the documentation, just the top half)22:05
komsasI can choose22:06
godbykSpecifically, make sure that you have at least Lithuanian installed.22:07
komsasFor me only Lithuanian and english enough22:07
godbyk(This will let us properly hyphenate Lithuanian words.)22:07
godbykRight.22:07
godbykSo if both of those are checked, then press R to go back to the main menu22:07
godbykDo the directories listed look okay?22:07
komsashttp://paste.ubuntu.com/377052/22:08
komsasI think ok22:08
godbykThose should work, yeah.22:09
komsasso start installation?22:09
godbykBack at the main menu, make sure that at least the last 4 options are checked: create all format files, install doc tree, install source tree, and create symlinks.22:09
godbykIf you prefer letterpaper to A4 paper, feel free to check that option as well.22:10
godbykOnce that's done, you should be able to hit I and it'll install.22:10
godbykIf you find errors as it goes along, feel free to ping me with them.22:10
komsasthank godbyk now I jump to bed, tommorow I will ping u, bye22:11
godbykOnce TeX Live 2009 is finished installing, you *should* be able to run 'make ubuntu-manual-lt.pdf' and have it compile the manual.22:11
godbykOkay, sleep well.22:11
godbykAnd with that, I need to go shovel snow off my walk.  I'll be back in a bit.22:13
humphreybcgodbyk: GUI latex editors?22:20
dutchiegedit?22:21
dutchiegvim?22:21
humphreybcokay so there are no apps actually designed for latex22:21
humphreybcyou know, like creating commands and stuff22:21
dutchiethere's lyx, but that has its own version of latex afaict22:22
dutchieyou can use the vim latex suite with gvim22:22
godbykhumphreybc: there's kile (for kde), texmaker or something like that for gnome, there's texworks (not in the repository).22:23
godbykI'd avoid LyX as it translates from tex to lyx and back and makes things a little messier.22:23
humphreybcokay cool, i've got a guy asking is all22:23
dutchie!info texmaker22:28
dutchiehmm22:29
dutchiemanualbot: ping22:29
manualbotpong22:29
manualbotHere I am, brain the size of a planet and you expect me to respond to a ping? How depressing.22:29
dutchie!ping22:29
dutchiebug 52235622:35
manualbotLaunchpad bug 522356 in ubuntu-manual "LaTex-Formatting-Bug" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/52235622:35
dutchie!info texmaker22:36
manualbotdutchie: 'karmic' is not a valid distribution:22:36
dutchie!info texmaker lenny22:37
manualbotdutchie: 'lenny' is not a valid distribution:22:37
dutchie!info texmaker lucid22:37
manualbotdutchie: 'lucid' is not a valid distribution:22:37
dutchiestuff that then22:37
dutchieInstalling [0975/2003, time/total: 03:54:57/08:53:19]: knuth [10137k]22:45
dutchiehmm22:45
dutchienot sure if I want an aging computer scientist on my laptop22:45
dutchieespecially if he's 10M22:45
humphreybclol23:11
humphreybcdutchie: I just pushed some more changes to quickshot23:11
humphreybcadded in draft windows up to step 923:11
humphreybcif you feel like doing some python, i'd very much appreciate it if you could link the window buttons so I can test them xD23:12
dutchielink them up to what?23:17
humphreybceach other23:19
humphreybcso when you click next it closes that window and opens the next window23:19
humphreybclike it would actually do23:19
humphreybcjust so I can get an idea of how the windows are actually rendered23:19
humphreybcactually how do you make it go next but in it's own window...23:19
humphreybchm23:19
* dutchie has forgotten how to use quickly23:20
humphreybcquickly glade23:21
humphreybcquickly run23:21
humphreybcquickly create ubuntu-project <name>23:21
humphreybci think that's about it lol23:21
dutchiewell, yeah23:22
dutchiebut where to put functions23:22
humphreybcoh23:22
dutchiehttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/devweek0909/QuicklyFun23:25
humphreybcdutchie: maybe if you could link main to setup with the next button, and also the "cancel" button so that it closes it as examples, then I can just go off them to link up the rest23:35
dutchiedutchie: I'm working on it :)23:36
humphreybcawesome xD23:36
dutchiehmm23:50
dutchielooks like I'm going to have to completely refactor the glade files23:50
humphreybcdarn23:58
humphreybcdid i do something wrong? :P23:58
dutchieI'm not sure if having loads of windows in one UI definition is the best thing to do23:59

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