[00:09] <Nafai> Back again, sorry
[00:10] <Nafai> Trying now
[00:24] <jcastro> Nafai: let's hope this is it!
[00:25] <Nafai> Doesn't appear to be any difference :(
[00:27] <jcastro> :-/
[00:32] <Nafai> But I will finish vino tonight!
[00:32] <jcastro> \o/
[00:33] <jcastro> Nafai: tomorrow I think while you, ted, jan and cody try to fix the submenus I'll ask smithj to take on gnome-1-polkit so we can get that out of the way
[00:33] <Nafai> Sounds good, since I haven't yet touched it
[04:01] <bratsche> jcastro: I fixed up the gtk+ issues today, so let me know if you need me for anything tomorrow.
[04:01] <jcastro> bratsche: awesome
[04:01] <jcastro> bratsche: if we can fix submenus tomorrow that would be great
[04:02] <jcastro> bratsche: you should go to sleep now though, heh
[04:02] <bratsche> I'm doing some Javascript hacking now before bed. :)
[13:59] <jcastro> jpetersen: good morning!
[13:59] <jpetersen> jcastro, good morning
[14:00] <jcastro> jpetersen: bratsche was able to fix the gtk problems yesterday which mean he should be able to help today with those menus
[14:02] <jpetersen> jcastro, ah yes ok, i am just trying to figure out, what gnome-bluetooth does with that menu items
[14:02] <jcastro> yeah
[14:03] <jcastro> if we can figure that out today that gives us brasero and gnome-bt done, he nearly finished vino yesterday, and that just leaves policykit-1-gnome
[14:03] <jcastro> smithj: when do you think you can finish policykit-1-gnome?
[14:04] <jcastro> seb128: when does the archive open back up, friday?
[14:04] <seb128> jcastro, it's soft frozen
[14:04] <seb128> but otherwise yes
[14:04] <seb128> we can still upload though
[14:04] <jcastro> ok
[14:05] <jcastro> seb128: g-s-d and hplip are ready 
[14:05] <jcastro> hplip is odd, we need till to look at it
[14:05] <seb128> g-s-d is waiting on a zillion lines patches for libgnomekb which I don't want to review :p
[14:05] <jcastro> hah
[14:06] <seb128> it's adding new sources etc to the code
[14:06] <jcastro> ok so want to "save" that one for friday?
[14:06] <seb128> I doubt I will want to review it later too ;-)
[14:06] <seb128> but I will try to have a look
[14:06] <seb128> would be nice if upstream could review this one
[14:06] <seb128> I will try pinging svu
[14:06] <seb128> I don't get why so much code need to be changed right now
[14:07] <seb128> but I didn't really look at the issue and the bug is not really descriptive about that
[14:07] <jcastro> seb128: can you CC me if you mail him?
[14:07] <seb128> jcastro, I was going for the IRC ping rather
[14:08] <jcastro> ok
[14:08] <seb128> I avoid writting formal emails when I can use IRC
[14:10] <jpetersen> seb128, basically we cannot just change gkbd-status.[ch] because it is a public API of libgnomekbd, so it is some nicely refactored API from gkbd-status.[ch] which can be used by an application-indicator
[14:12] <seb128> jpetersen, did you upstream that change yet?
[14:12] <seb128> I will try to have a look later today
[14:12] <jpetersen> seb128, i will send it to upstream today
[14:13] <seb128> thanks
[14:15] <jcastro> jpetersen: any other work you have outstanding that needs review from seb?
[14:17] <jpetersen> there is just g-s-d and connman-gnome I think
[14:26] <jpetersen> I updated the patch for https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/524150 and tested it with gnome-bluetooth
[14:26] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 524150 in indicator-application "Menus updated at runtime aren't rendered correctly (affects: 1)" [High,In progress]
[14:26] <jpetersen> It should work now correctly
[14:36] <tedg> jpetersen: Cool, I merged it into my branch where I think we have all the fixes to make gnome-bt work correctly: lp:~ted/indicator-application/menu-updates
[14:39] <tedg> jpetersen: Just an FYI, you can build your own branches of any project in LP without commit rights to trunk.  It's not like git in that way, in that the branches can have independent sets of permissions.
[14:40] <jcastro> morning tedg!
[14:40] <jpetersen> tedg, ah ok I will try it out next :)
[14:41] <tedg> jcastro: I think we've got a full set of patches for gnome-bluetooth now.
[14:41] <tedg> jcastro: We probably should get Nafai to confirm, but I've posted the branch for review.
[14:42] <jcastro> tedg: awesome, he should be around in a bit.
[14:42] <seb128> tedg, let me know if you need those in lucid
[14:42] <jcastro> tedg: that just leaves brasero, vino (which are both nearly done), and then just gnome-1-polkit
[14:43] <jcastro> tedg: and then that's basically it.
[14:43] <tedg> seb128: Archive is froze for A3, right?  I was thinking we'd just get them on Thursday release day when it opens again.
[14:43] <jcastro> seb128: will we be allowed to continue porting past A3? We have some left like epiphany, packagekit-gnome, etc. that aren't really in the default install
[14:44] <seb128> tedg, soft frozen we can get bug fixes in
[14:44] <seb128> jcastro, yes
[14:44] <jcastro> jpetersen: ok so after all this menu stuff lands you can continue with packagekit-gnome
[14:44] <jcastro> jpetersen: thanks for being flexible on this menu thing, I thought we were doomed
[14:47] <jpetersen> jcastro, yes ok
[14:57] <qense> jcastro: Maybe we should generate a report from the indicator-application tag with all applications that are in the default install.
[14:57] <qense> (and give those bugs the status Low instead of Wishlist)
[14:58] <jcastro> ooh, I can do that.
[14:58] <qense> It would give the developers an overview of applications that have priority.
[14:58] <jcastro> good idea
[14:58]  * jcastro goes
[14:59] <qense> thanks
[15:00] <jcastro> qense: I noticed you claimed gnome-1-polkit, have you started it yet?
[15:00] <qense> did I?
[15:00] <qense> I claimed guake and gnome-do
[15:00] <qense> (and am still working on Banshee)
[15:00] <qense> but no gnome-1-polkit
[15:00] <jcastro> oh, my bad, you just triaged it
[15:00] <jcastro> ignore me
[15:00] <qense> will do!
[15:01] <jcastro> qense: in hindsight I should have done the bugs papercut style with different milestones
[15:01] <jcastro> and layed out over a timeline
[15:02] <qense> jcastro: Maybe that would have worked better, yes. Maybe something for the next release?
[15:03] <qense> I'd say: write it down somewhere
[15:10] <jcastro> qense: ok done.
[15:10] <qense> good
[15:10] <jcastro> seb128: I see mdeslaur did virt-manager, would that fall under you guys?
[15:11] <seb128> jcastro, not really, why doesn't he just upload?
[15:11] <jcastro> seb128: he's subbed the release team already: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/virt-manager/+bug/525462
[15:11] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 525462 in virt-manager (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "FFe: Support Application Indicators (affects: 1)" [Wishlist,Triaged]
[15:11] <seb128> jcastro, subscribe the standard sponsor team to the bug
[15:11] <seb128> ok
[15:12] <jcastro> seb128: release team is subbed, should I assign it to the canonical-desk-team?
[15:12] <qense> do you think bug 526499 is because Transmission needs a X-GNOME-Delaything key?
[15:12] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 526499 in transmission (Ubuntu) "Transmission doesnt use indicator-application if present in the startup applications (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/526499
[15:12]  * jcastro isn't sure where the package lives
[15:12] <seb128> jcastro, no, let it this way for now
[15:12] <jcastro> ok
[15:13] <jcastro> qense: that's a question for tedg 
[15:13] <qense> tedg! What do you think of bug 526499
[15:13] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 526499 in transmission (Ubuntu) "Transmission doesnt use indicator-application if present in the startup applications (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/526499
[15:14] <tedg> Is transmission using a custom fallback?
[15:14] <vish> damn that was quick ;p
[15:15] <qense> tedg: nope
[15:16] <vish> qense: how the world did you notice that bug?  i just reported it 7 mins ago and you have found it in 2 mins o.0  
[15:17] <vish> how in *
[15:17] <qense> vish: charles pointed me at it
[15:17] <vish> ah.. :)
[15:17] <jcastro> vish: the man is a legend
[15:18] <vish> truly ;)
[15:42] <jcastro> Nafai: ping me as soon as you're around please.
[15:49] <jpetersen> how do I link a gnome bug to lp?
[15:51] <jcastro> jpetersen: in bugzilla there is a "Add Bug URLs" text box
[15:51] <jcastro> on the bottom right, above the version dropboxes
[15:54] <jpetersen> jcastro, ah yes and the other way around with "Also affects project" in launchpad?
[15:56] <qense> jpetersen: yes indeed
[15:57] <jpetersen> ok thanks
[15:59] <jpetersen> I will be just offline for dinner, will be back in some hours
[16:02] <jcastro> tedg: seb128: have you noticed keyboard scrubbing in the app indicator area is messed up now? when I get to the sound indicator it grabs the keyboard and starts adjusting the volume
[16:02] <jcastro> which doesn't make sense unless I stop at the sound one, press down, and then left/right
[16:02] <seb128> jcastro, yes, ronoc knows about it
[16:02] <jcastro> oh ok, cool
[16:02] <seb128> it's due to the fix to make the slider works
[16:02]  * jcastro nods
[16:03] <seb128> works with keyboard
[16:03] <seb128> rather
[16:05] <seb128> jcastro, bug #497909 is NOTABUG
[16:05] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 497909 in libwnck (Ubuntu) "Support Application Indicators (affects: 1)" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/497909
[16:06] <seb128> jcastro, it uses the notification area for a test program in the source
[16:06] <seb128> that's nowhere in the distro
[16:06] <seb128> and I don't think we need to add a testcase there
[16:06] <seb128> should I just close the bug?
[16:06] <jcastro> seb128: awesome, please invalid it
[16:06]  * jcastro nods
[16:23] <tgpraveen12>  jcastro: is someone working on adding indicator for vlc?
[16:23] <jcastro> not afaik
[16:23] <jcastro> hmm, why would a video player need that?
[16:29] <qense> tgpraveen12, jcastro: VLC is Qt, if it would get support it should use KNotify, or a Qt equivalent if such a thing exists.
[16:29] <jcastro> QStatusNotifier
[16:29] <qense> although I'm in favour of getting rid of the thing as well.
[16:30] <jcastro> from what seigo mentioned to me if KStatusNotifierIcon is successful it might be a good thing to move into Qt at some point
[16:30] <qense> ok
[16:30] <jcastro> I don't really see the point of a video player having an icon there.
[16:30] <hyperair> i think some people use vlc as a media player akin to banshee
[16:31] <hyperair> vlc has a playlist of sorts, doesn't it?
[16:31] <qense> tedg: Sorry to bother you, but why is there one more argument in the g_signal_new call for the connection_changed signal (pasted here: <http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/382357/>) than the GLib documentation says?
[16:31] <qense> hyperair: yes, it does
[16:31] <qense> you can also add streams to that playlist
[16:31] <qense> e.g., you could have used it like you say during the UDS
[16:31] <hyperair> jcastro: and there's the point =p
[16:31] <hyperair> qense: UDS?
[16:32] <qense> Ubuntu Developer Summit
[16:32] <jcastro> I didn't know it has a playlist thing
[16:32] <tedg> qense: No good reason.  Probably got changed from something else.
[16:32] <hyperair> qense: no i mean what use case is this?
[16:32] <jcastro> qense: so like streams get queued and listed in the dropdown?
[16:32] <hyperair> qense: for the shoutcast streams or something?
[16:32] <qense> jcastro: no, more like bookmarks
[16:32] <tedg> qense: It should get ignored.
[16:32] <qense> tedg: Does it do any harm?
[16:32] <qense> ok
[16:33] <qense> tedg: I get (test:9378): GLib-GObject-WARNING **: /build/buildd/glib2.0-2.23.4/gobject/gsignal.c:2199: signal `' is invalid for instance `0x2293850' when I try to use the ConnectionChanged event in C#, I thought that was related.
[16:33] <tedg> qense: It probably should be "connection-changed" ?
[16:33] <qense> not in C#
[16:33] <tedg> qense: Though, I'm unsure if the C# bindings change that.
[16:33] <qense> there it is ConnectionChanged
[16:34] <qense> <attr path="/api/namespace/object[@cname='AppIndicator']/signal[@field_name='connection_changed']" name="name">ConnectionChanged</attr>
[16:34] <tedg> Ah, okay.
[16:44] <Nafai> I'm in now
[16:45] <seb128> tedg, hum
[16:45] <Nafai> Sorry, had labs this morning
[16:45] <seb128> tedg, can you do a merge request for application-indicator based on 0.0.13-0ubuntu7 
[16:45] <seb128> and not 0.0.13-0ubuntu2
[16:45] <seb128> there has been 5 revisions since
[16:45] <seb128> tedg, or tell me the rev numbers to backport
[16:46] <tedg> seb128: I merged it... 
[16:46] <tedg> seb128: It just put the changelog in the middle.
[16:46] <seb128> ok, let me try
[16:46] <seb128> could be the email diff being weird
[16:46] <tedg> seb128: You can kill my changelog entries.
[16:46] <Nafai> tedg, So there is a full set of patches in menu-updates-lucid?
[16:47] <tedg> Nafai: Uhm, no, it doesn't have jpeterson's latest patch in there.
[16:47] <Nafai> Okay
[16:47] <tedg> Nafai: Everything is being merged by seb128 right now, so best to just wait :)
[16:47] <Nafai> Ok, I can do that :)
[16:47] <jcastro> Nafai: and after that it's all up to you for today!
[16:48] <Nafai> sweet
[16:48] <jcastro> Nafai: can you finish off vino while they upload the new app indicator bits?
[16:48] <Nafai> Yes, indeed
[16:48] <Nafai> mainly verifying I've got everything and I've followed the coding standard right now
[16:48] <jcastro> Nafai: gnome-bt, brasero, and vino done today would be epic win
[16:48] <Nafai> Yes, indeed
[16:48] <jcastro> Nafai: that gives you the rest of the week to figure out this display properties crackrock
[16:48] <Nafai> heh
[16:53] <seb128> tedg, the application-indicator change is uploaded
[16:53] <seb128> jcastro, Nafai^
[16:54] <Nafai> Yay
[16:54] <Nafai> you are awesome seb128
[16:54] <seb128> ;-)
[16:54] <seb128> kudos to ted who did all the work
[16:54] <seb128> I just uploaded
[16:54] <jcastro> Nafai: finish gnome-bt first since that is on the default panel
[16:54] <tedg> seb128: Sweet!  Thanks!
[16:55] <tedg> seb128: Heh, now jpetersen did a significant amount of it too!
[16:55]  * tedg thinks we now know jono's secret chat ID
[16:56] <seb128> kudos to jpetersen too then!
[16:56] <seb128> tedg, you scared him away now ;-)
[16:56] <Nafai> jcastro: Ok
[17:16] <qense> tedg: Again a question: in the monobindings metadata you have "<attr path="/api/namespace/object[@cname='AppIndicator']/signal[@field_name='connection_changed']" name="name">ConnectionChanged</attr>": it uses connection_changed with an underscore. However, APP_INDICATOR_SIGNAL_CONNECTION_CHANGED -- the name passed to g_signal_new() as the signal name -- is defined as "connection-changed". Can you use an underscore for an hyphen in the metadata?
[17:17] <tedg> qense: Honestly, I'm not sure.  bratsche or DBO may know?
[17:17] <qense> tedg: lets hope that. Thank you for your answering my questions.
[17:17] <DBO> qense, not sure but generally _ and - are not interchangeable
[17:18] <qense> I'll build the libraries with the hyphens in the mono bindings metadata and will see if that works.
[17:38] <Nafai> So confused
[17:38] <jcastro> Nafai: how's it going? (sorry I'm going to be annoying today)
[17:38] <Nafai> I *think* I have the lastest version seb128 uploaded
[17:38] <Nafai> I recompiled, even restarted because I think I had a kernel upgrade since I last rebooted, but the menu is still rendered the same
[17:39] <jcastro> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/lucid-changes/2010-February/006503.html
[17:39] <jcastro> do you have ubuntu8?
[17:40] <jono_> is there a content limit on a notify-osd bubble?
[17:40] <Nafai> nope, I guess I don't :)
[17:41] <jcastro> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+source/indicator-application/0.0.13-0ubuntu8
[17:41] <jcastro> snag it from there
[17:41] <jcastro> Nafai: I usually subscribe to lucid-changes and if I need something that hasn't been published yet that gets me a link to the lp packages
[17:42] <jcastro> Nafai: someone can probably explain it better but there's a lag between "I've pushed this to lucid" to when it's built (based on the builder load) and then when it's published. Add to that a mirror lag.
[17:43] <Nafai> *nods*
[17:43] <Nafai> Yeah, I'm subscribed to lucid changes, but hadn't thought to check there
[17:50] <Nafai> BEAUTIFUL!
[17:51] <Nafai> It works!!!!!
[17:51] <jcastro> YEAH!
[17:51] <Nafai> Now a final code review and make sure all of the code paths work
[17:51] <Nafai> Thanks a ton bratsche, tedg, jpetersen, seb128 and everyone else :)
[17:52] <jcastro> Nafai: be quick but be thorough, it would suck to have to ping pong with the desktop team over a mistake.
[17:52] <jcastro> ie. err on the side of caution
[17:53] <Nafai> right
[18:17] <jpetersen> jcastro, whom shall I assign LP #497904 to?
[18:17] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 497904 in connman-gnome (Ubuntu) "Support Application Indicators (affects: 1)" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/497904
[18:21] <jcastro> jpetersen: canonical-desktop-team from now on 
[18:22] <jcastro> smithj: around?
[18:23] <jpetersen> jcastro, ok i will do
[18:49] <qense> Could someone merge this already accepted merge request of mine <https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~qense/notify-osd/fix-465801/+merge/14265>? It has been lingering around for quite a while already and it would be nice if this issue would be fixed in time for Lucid.
[18:50] <seb128> qense, try pinging Macslow when he's around
[18:50] <qense> seb128: ok, thx
[19:03] <Nafai> Right now I'm just looking to see what I have to do to get a checkbox updating correctly
[19:06] <qense> Nafai: there is a bug report for that
[19:06] <Nafai> Oh, okay.  bug #?  I'd like to make sure it applies to mine.
[19:06] <qense> bug 524308
[19:06] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 524308 in indicator-application (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Application Indicator doesn't process menu changes (e.g. checkboxes) (affects: 5) (dups: 2)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524308
[19:06] <Nafai> Thanks
[19:08] <Nafai> ok, I can verify that choosing the option is indeed working, it's just not rendering correct
[19:08] <Nafai> -ly
[19:12] <Nafai> ls
[19:12] <Nafai> whoops, wrong window :)
[19:12] <Nafai> quick design question, perhaps jcastro or someone could answer since mpt isn't around
[19:13] <Nafai> gnome-bt already has a insensitive menu item that indicates if bluetooth is on or off
[19:13] <Nafai> the original applet additionally sets a tooltip that says (as far as I can see, these are the only options) Bluetooth: Enabled or Bluetooth: Disabled
[19:14] <Nafai> That seems to be redundant, should I just forego replicating what the tooltip says?
[19:14] <jcastro> Nafai: yeah we don't do tooltips.
[19:14] <jcastro> Nafai: the icon should be sufficient 
[19:14] <Nafai> Well, I usually would just set the info in an insensitive menu item
[19:14] <Nafai> But that same info is already there, just expressed slightly differently
[19:15]  * jcastro checks his laptop
[19:16] <jcastro> Nafai: I think just replicating the menu is fine
[19:17] <Nafai> Okay, I'll leave out the tooltip stuff
[19:17] <jcastro> I don't think it supports tooltips anyway
[19:17] <Nafai> Yay, now time for cleanups
[19:17] <jcastro> seb128: get ready!
[19:19] <jcastro> tedg: chrisccoulson and I had some questions about gnome-settings-daemon
[19:19] <tedg> jcastro: K
[19:19] <jcastro> and how when you launch it it does that overlay on your screens
[19:19] <chrisccoulson> hey tedg / jcastro
[19:21] <tedg> Okay.  For keybindings?
[19:21] <chrisccoulson> tedg - this is for the xrandr settings
[19:21] <chrisccoulson> currently, when you click on the status icon to show the menu, g-s-d draws some identifiers on each screen
[19:22] <chrisccoulson> i'm just wondering how we handle this with libappindicator
[19:22]  * tedg looks
[19:23] <tedg> Hmm, doesn't work with -nvidia
[19:24] <jcastro> yeah but it shows the overlay thing
[19:24] <qense> tedg: Try executing System->Preferences->Screen
[19:24] <qense> it does give a warning, but it does draw the identifiers
[19:28] <tedg> That's pretty crazy
[19:29] <qense> yeah
[19:29] <tedg> Does it list all the things possible in the applet there, or just ones you've prechosen?
[19:30] <Nafai> How do I link to another bug in a comment in launchpad?
[19:30] <Nafai> (any special syntax or do I just put the full URL?)
[19:31] <tedg> Oh, so it's just the rotations in the applet.
[19:31] <tedg> http://people.gnome.org/~federico/misc/randr-tray-icon.png
[19:31] <qense> Nafai: just type bug {bug_number}, or bug #{bug_number}
[19:32] <Nafai> Okay, thanks
[19:32] <tedg> I'm a little concerned that since we can't do the colored backgrounds, showing the rectangles at all would be confusing :-/
[19:33] <tedg> For instance, with two "Acer 19"s how would the menu be useful?
[19:33] <jpetersen> tedg, i thought about having the rectangles as an icon for the menu item?
[19:33] <jpetersen> so that would show the colour
[19:33] <jpetersen> but we would need a signal when the menu is shown/hidden
[19:34] <Nafai> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-bluetooth/+bug/497856/comments/1
[19:34] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 497856 in gnome-bluetooth (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Support application indicator (affects: 2)" [Wishlist,Fix committed]
[19:35] <Nafai> jcastro: I'm probably closest on vino, should I go back to that and then brasero?
[19:35] <tedg> jpetersen: Yeah.  Hmmm...
[19:35] <jcastro> yessir!
[19:35] <Nafai> As soon as I get initial feedback on that patch, I'll attach it upstream
[19:35] <tedg> jcastro: Have you been told whether we'd get any of mpt's time this week?  I know he's at the hackfest, but I'd hate to do something like that and have him come up with a really clever solution :)
[19:36] <jcastro> tedg: no idea, but looking at the calendar ...
[19:36] <tedg> The colors seem bad overall, as it's an a11y issue.  And, I'm skeptical that the most important thing to do quickly is rotate your monitor?  Seems like adjusting size is *much* more useful.
[19:37] <tedg> That's what OSX has in there.
[19:37] <jcastro> the whole applet needs a UI redo IMO. but given then time and scope I think 1-for-1 for lucid should be the goal
[19:37] <tedg> (I think)
[19:37] <jcastro> and then for +1 fix it for real
[19:37] <jpetersen> yes I agree that the applet is not really good UI wise
[19:39] <tedg> For 1:1, we need to get AboutToShow working in dbusmenu, which isn't simple though.
[19:39] <qense> jcastro: I think I've found the solution to the problem of all those people complaining about the new Application Indicators lacking functionality. AppInds are meant for allowing quick access to a small subset of the actions an application offers. If you want something else, something more complicated, then you should write a panel applet.
[19:39] <qense> We should tell that too all those people.
[19:40] <tedg> qense: The problem there is that panel applets are deprecated.
[19:40] <qense> ah, that's a problem indeed
[19:40] <tedg> Uhg, GSD has turned out to be a problem all over the place.
[19:41] <jcastro> tedg: ok so we need to determine (probably today) if it's worth the risk to look into this (given the schedule and desktop team workload) or if we do like we did for Tomboy
[19:42] <tedg> jcastro: Yeah.
[19:42] <tedg> jcastro: Personally, I'm leaning toward don't touch it for Lucid, and fix it for Lucid + 1.  It seems kinda silly to port it to IA and the blow it up.
[19:42] <jcastro> I agree
[19:42] <jcastro> jono: any objections?
[19:43]  * jono reads up
[19:43] <jcastro> tedg: the icon is off by default anyway
[19:43] <jcastro> chrisccoulson: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-bluetooth/+bug/497856 is ready to go!
[19:43] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 497856 in gnome-bluetooth (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Support application indicator (affects: 2)" [Wishlist,Fix committed]
[19:43] <jcastro> chrisccoulson: vino will be next
[19:44] <jono> jcastro, what specifically are you asking?
[19:45] <jcastro> jono: in display properties you can check a box and it shows you a label on each screen when you're like connected to a projector
[19:45] <jcastro> it uses custom UI (this is that xrandr thing we discussed last week)
[19:45] <jcastro> http://people.gnome.org/~federico/news-2010-02.html#12 <-- this thing
[19:46] <jcastro> jono: basically it's not a standard GtkStatusIcon thing and supporting the labels would be non-trivial
[19:46] <jcastro> tedg: ^^ right?
[19:47] <tedg> jcastro: jono: The labels, and we also don't today, have a signal for menu opened.  Plus, having an applet to rotate your screen (not set size) seems a little silly :)
[19:48] <jono> hmmm
[19:50] <jcastro> tedg: in other news, can you look at LP #524308
[19:50] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 524308 in indicator-application (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Application Indicator doesn't process menu changes (e.g. checkboxes) (affects: 5) (dups: 2)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524308
[19:53] <jcastro> jono: fwiw the rest of g-s-d is done (they keyboard bits), it's just this display thing that's the problem
[19:54] <jono> sorry have been on a call and network issues
[19:54] <jono> brb
[19:54] <tedg> jcastro: Hmm, we most of broken something.  That used to work.
[19:55] <tedg> s/most of/must have/
[19:56] <jcastro> tedg: ok I have a call with jono in an hour anyway I'll explain it to him
[19:57] <qense> :P My AppInd implementation for GNOME Do apparently is one big memory leak.
[19:57] <qense> I couldn't do anything else but resetting my system.
[20:03] <jono> jcastro, can we do our call now?
[20:05] <jono> jcastro, I might drop off the wireless in a sec, so if you can, just call my phone
[20:06] <jcastro> jono: ok on it
[20:06] <jono> ready when you are
[20:40] <jcastro> tedg: ok so jono doesn't feel strongly one way or the other and basically said "what does seb128 think?"
[20:41] <jcastro> seb128: gnome-bt is ready fyi!
[20:41] <seb128> jcastro, context?
[20:41] <seb128> think about what?
[20:41] <jcastro> seb128: the icon in the display properties thing
[20:41] <tedg> seb128: Wrong answer, try again "I agree with what ever tedg says"
[20:42] <seb128> jcastro, I would say do the opposite of what tedg suggested ;-)
[20:42] <jcastro> seb128: wondering wether it's worth the effort to port that "click me to rotate the screen" thing
[20:42] <seb128> is that complicated to do?
[20:42] <jcastro> seb128: actually he makes sense, I agree that it's  not worth porting and look at it for +1 since the whole applet UI is kind of crap
[20:42] <tedg> seb128: The problem is the colored backgrounds on the menu items, plus the "AboutToShow" for the menu coming up to do the floating windows.
[20:43] <jcastro> http://people.gnome.org/~federico/misc/randr-tray-icon.png
[20:43] <tedg> seb128: I'm contending that most people don't need to rotate their screens quickly. :)
[20:44] <seb128> I don't know of anybody using tha ticon
[20:44] <seb128> that icon
[20:44] <seb128> I don't really care if it's not ported 
[20:44]  * tedg is kinda curious if we should kill the checkbox to put it on the panel as well.
[20:44] <jcastro> ok, let's leave it then.
[20:44] <seb128> does that reply to your question? ;-)
[20:44] <jcastro> tedg: I was thinking the same thing
[20:45] <seb128> what checkbox?
[20:45] <tedg> jcastro: It's probably the humane thing to do ;)
[20:45] <tedg> seb128: In the display settings, at the bottom.  It turns on the notification area icon.
[20:45] <jcastro> http://people.gnome.org/~federico/news-photos/gnome-display-properties-pretty.png
[20:45] <jcastro> seb128: the "Show monitors in panel"
[20:45] <seb128> oh right
[20:46] <seb128> no strong opinion
[20:46] <qense> do we support the Ctrl+An_arrow_key shortcut for rotating the screen?
[20:46] <seb128> I like our layout change better than federico's one btw ;-)
[20:46] <qense> If that is supported then the applet is less useful than it already was.
[20:48] <jcastro> tedg: I don't have a strong opinion either, I think we should just leave it. It's off by default and for +1 we need to look at that entire applet anyway
[20:48] <tedg> jcastro: Sounds good to me.  You gonna schedule the UDS session? :)
[20:48] <seb128> +1
[20:49] <seb128> no need of a session for such small changes
[20:49] <jcastro> right
[20:49] <jcastro> tedg: I'd rather revisit it for +1 than carry a patch for 3 years because the app is full of crack. :D
[20:50] <tedg> seb128: Heh, I was told that app indicators are life changing (not in a good way) :)
[20:51] <jcastro> tedg: fixing 524308 is a much better investment. \o/
[20:51] <seb128> tedg, yeah, we don't do UDS session for life changes things
[20:51] <seb128> tedg, we do just those for fun topics usually
[20:51] <seb128> ;-)
[20:52] <tedg> Sadly, the paintball session has been thrown out every year...
[20:53] <qense> We should held the next DX meeting in Amsterdam... :) I'm curious what the results will be of such a session.
[20:55] <jcastro> oh hey qense 
[20:55] <jcastro> I made something to show people who don't like the idea
[20:55] <jcastro> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5720/whyappindicators%3F.png
[20:55] <qense> jcastro: wonderful!
[20:55] <qense> :D
[20:55] <qense> now spam it all over the place!
[20:56] <Nafai> jcastro, Nice! :)
[20:57]  * Nafai tries out transmission
[20:57] <Nafai> Yay for app indicators!
[20:58] <qense> jcastro, it's the most eloquent explanation of the reason we've got AppInd I've seen so far!
[21:00] <qense> chrisccoulson, do you think bug 526499 can be solved with a "X-GNOME-Autostart-Delay"?
[21:00] <seb128> bug #526499
[21:00] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 526499 in transmission (Ubuntu) "Transmission doesnt use indicator-application if present in the startup applications (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/526499
[21:01] <qense> is the dash really needed?
[21:01] <seb128> qense, what dash?
[21:01] <jcastro> seb128: vino will be done next
[21:01] <seb128> good!
[21:01] <qense> the hash?
[21:01] <jcastro> what you didn't finished gnome-bt yet? :)
[21:01] <qense> I used the wrong English word
[21:06] <chrisccoulson> qense - i'd prefer not to do that
[21:06] <chrisccoulson> that seems like a hacky solution
[21:07] <chrisccoulson> i'd rather fix the real issue, which is that it falls apart if transmission starts before indicator-application-service
[21:07] <qense> shouldn't the library launch the service over DBus?
[21:08] <jpetersen_> qense, that bug also happens with other autostarted applications like gnome-settings-daemon and gnome-power-manager
[21:08] <qense> jpetersen_: do you know if there are bugs reported for those?
[21:09] <jpetersen_> qense, I think not yet
[21:09] <qense> ok, then I'll assign the Transmission bug report to Indicator Applicaiton
[21:09] <qense> thanks!
[21:09] <seb128> that's a design thing
[21:09] <seb128> did you ask to ted?
[21:11] <qense> tedg?
[21:11] <qense> I haven't got a response from him on the issue, but I did ask. I think it got lost in the many other questions people ask him.
[21:12] <tedg> qense: Sorry.
[21:12] <qense> no point
[21:12] <tedg> qense: Should the application start indicator-application-service?
[21:12] <qense> tedg: here it is causing problems
[21:12] <qense> but it might be desired behaviour when people remove the applet
[21:12] <qense> from their pannel
[21:12] <qense> panel
[21:13] <tedg> qense: I was thinking no, as if they haven't got the applet, they're effectively voting no.
[21:13] <tedg> qense: Plus there is no way to start applets externally.
[21:13] <tedg> qense: We could start the service, but not do much with it.
[21:13] <tedg> qense: This is another reason gnome-panel needs to die :)
[21:14] <qense> that's true, but it would require the autostart applications to use the X-GNOME-Autostart-Delay key
[21:14] <qense> which is a bit hacky
[21:14] <qense> isn't there a way to give the service priority over other applications?
[21:14] <tedg> qense: No, we need to fix it so that they'll wait a bit.
[21:14] <tedg> qense: They already don't fallback immediately.
[21:15] <tedg> qense: There's a bit of hysteresis so that if the service dies, the user shouldn't notice as it'll get restarted. 
[21:15] <tedg> qense: The applet will restart it immediately.
[21:15] <qense> I've noticed that already. :) it's unkillable!
[21:16] <qense> so a delay key it is, you say?
[21:16] <qense> oh, chrisccoulson!
[21:17] <chrisccoulson> i'll have a look at the scrollback in a minute or so ;)
[21:17] <qense> great!
[21:32] <tedg> qense: I think we should probably do it in the library really.
[21:34] <qense> tedg: In that case, shall I assign the bug report to indicator-application and paste this log in the description?
[21:34] <tedg> qense: Hmph.  I'm allergic to bugs :)
[21:35] <qense> I'll only subscribe you to it!
[21:37] <qense> A lot of the bug reports have titles of the type "Indicator Application doesn't support ..."
[21:37] <qense> so this is a change!
[21:38] <qense> tedg: While I'm busy burdening your shoulders with one more bug I would like to ask your opinion about the validity of two bugs: bug #522146 and bug #522153. The titles explain enough.
[21:38] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 522146 in indicator-application (Ubuntu) "indicator-application does not support icon by filename (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522146
[21:38] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 522153 in indicator-application (Ubuntu) "indicator-application does not support text/GdkPixbuf as an icon (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522153
[21:39] <qense> Do you think these are valid, or should the be Won't Fix, considering the fact that this is behaviour we would like to prevent.
[21:39] <qense> Btw, I should reintroduce myself now:
[21:39] <tedg> qense: I think that those could be wishlist.  We'd really like to avoid them as in both those cases we can't theme the icons.  And since we don't provide enough information about the theme to the application, they can't theme them, and to fix that -- well, that'd be a lot of information.
[21:40] <qense> Hi! I'm qense, I'm the new Application Indicator adoptee in Ubuntu! I'll be your downstream contact person regarding bugs!
[21:40] <tedg> qense: I think that in both cases they enable things that we can't do now though.
[21:40] <tedg> qense: Cool!
[21:40] <qense> :P
[21:40] <tedg> qense: I feel like we can't reject them because we don't have  good answer for those use cases.
[21:41] <qense> I'll mark them as Wishlist then.
[21:41] <tedg> qense: Thanks!
[21:41] <qense> tedg: I'm subscribed to the bug reports for AppInd in Ubuntu and will try to keep them manageable. If there is anything you'd like me to do with them, or if you need something form them, please tell.
[21:41] <qense> I could also write an Apport hook if that's necessary
[21:46] <jcastro> tedg: you said you wanted bug help. *cough*
[21:47] <tedg> qense: Great, thank you for helping out.  An apport hook would be cool, though, I'm not sure what we could collect.
[21:47] <tedg> qense: Perhaps the ~/.cache/indicator-applet.log
[21:47] <tedg> Hmm, we really should put logging in the service.
[21:49] <qense> tedg: I'll have a look at a hook then
[22:00] <qense> I call the day a night and am off
[22:00] <qense> bye!
[22:05] <jcastro> smithj: around?
[22:20] <seb128> jcastro, if you want to build a list of issues, bug #526552 is one due to the appindicator change
[22:20] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 526552 in rhythmbox (Ubuntu) "Music->Close menu item and Ctrl-W do nothing (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/526552
[22:23] <jcastro> seb128: ok I'm just going to compile them under the "indicator-application" tag
[22:25] <jcastro> seb128: and then assign them to the person who did the patch
[22:25] <jcastro> tedg: check this out: wrt. missing track details: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=606972#c8
[22:25] <ubot4> Gnome bug 606972 in User Interface "Support for application-indicators/StatusNotifierIcon" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed]
[22:30] <seb128> jcastro, thanks
[22:36] <tedg> jcastro: Yeah, I think that makes sense.  Just an insensitive item.
[22:36] <jcastro> ok
[22:50] <RAOF> Ah!  I think I may have found qense's gnome-do stack overflow.  It's a pity qense seems to be in the exact opposite time zone to me.
[22:54] <Nafai> :(
[22:56] <RAOF> I wonder if there's a bzr branch available...
[22:57] <jcastro> Nafai: how's vino coming along?
[22:57] <jcastro> smithj: around?
[22:58] <Nafai> jcastro, Pretty well, found some issues (no bugs in outside stuff) in the way I did some things as I tested things.  So I'm going through and cleaning things up
[22:58] <jcastro> cool
[23:02] <seb128> Nafai, don't use fix commited if the fix is not commited yet
[23:03] <seb128> nobody is going to review it though
[23:03] <seb128> ie bug #497856
[23:03] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 497856 in gnome-bluetooth (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Support application indicator (affects: 2)" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/497856
[23:03] <seb128> though -> otherwise
[23:03] <Nafai> Sorry, just following what I was told
[23:03] <Nafai> So, don't change status, just assign to canonical-desktop-team after the patch is attached?
[23:04] <seb128> jcastro, ^ is that you who adviced that?
[23:04] <seb128> Nafai, we use triaged or in progress usually
[23:04] <seb128> those for work being done
[23:04] <jcastro> I thought we just assigned it to canonical-desktop-team?
[23:05] <Nafai> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopExperienceTeam/ApplicationIndicators/ContractorWorkflow <- See #3
[23:05] <seb128> the fix commited status is used when fix is commit upstream or to the ubuntu vcs
[23:06]  * Nafai nods
[23:06] <seb128> Nafai, ok, I'm not blaming you in any case don't worry
[23:06] <Nafai> thanks ;)
[23:06] <seb128> but it will lead people to think the change has been reviewed and commited
[23:06] <seb128> and nobody will look at those again
[23:06] <jcastro> seb128: we can change it to what is right
[23:06] <Nafai> makes sense
[23:07] <seb128> jcastro, you can use in progress rather
[23:07] <jcastro> ok fixing
[23:07] <seb128> jcastro, thanks
[23:08] <jcastro> fixed
[23:08] <seb128> bug #524308
[23:08] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 524308 in indicator-application (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Application Indicator doesn't process menu changes (e.g. checkboxes) (affects: 5) (dups: 2)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524308
[23:08] <seb128> is that being worked?
[23:08] <jcastro> that is the one you uploaded today, that should be fixed committed
[23:08] <seb128> hum
[23:09] <seb128> dx could do a better work at triaging ;-)
[23:09] <jcastro> seb128: qense just adopted indicator-application so he's going to be helping them with that
[23:09] <seb128> excellent
[23:09] <Nafai> qense rocks
[23:09] <jcastro> indeed
[23:46] <smithj> jcastro: am now
[23:47] <smithj> just read your message
[23:47] <smithj> i haven't started on gnome-1-polkit yet, so if jan isn't busy you might want to reassign
[23:48] <jcastro> smithj: ok, when can g-d-u be ready?
[23:50] <seb128> jcastro, bug #526747
[23:50] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 526747 in indicator-applet (Ubuntu) "battery applet popup is empty (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/526747
[23:50] <seb128> jcastro, you might want to assign that one too
[23:51] <smithj> jcastro: i'll work on it today. probably today or tomorrow
[23:52] <jcastro> seb128: done
[23:52] <seb128> jcastro, thanks
[23:52] <smithj> i didn't get a chance to work on it last night. i'm on call at my day job and we had an... incident :-/
[23:52] <jcastro> smithj: ok please assign "canonical-desktop-team" to it as soon as it's done
[23:52] <smithj> ok. not assigning to ken?
[23:52] <smithj> kenvandine: you slacker
[23:52] <jcastro> nope, just the team
[23:53] <seb128> lol