/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/03/01/#ubuntu-motu.txt

mohadibhello02:20
mohadibim building a deb to hopefully be included in ubuntu02:20
mohadibi am making an ant file for the package02:20
mohadibmy pacjage depends on swt-gtk, and needs it to compile02:21
mohadibshould i refrence where apt put the swt lib in my ant file?02:21
mohadibor should i include the lib? im pretty confused02:21
persiaYou should reference the system library.02:21
mohadibok, thanks02:22
persiaIdeally, your package won't contain any libraries, and just use the system libraries.02:22
mohadibaye, i made one that does that02:22
mohadibbut i was told i did it wrong02:22
persiaThe normal way to do this is to set up ant to not care which one is used, and to set the CLASSPATH in debian/rules02:22
mohadiband i got to use dh_make and all this stuff02:22
persiaPlease don't use dh_make :)02:22
mohadibok02:22
mohadibi have a java app i want to package02:23
mohadibcan you tell me the most straight forward way to do it?02:23
mohadibi have 100 conflicting answers so far02:23
persiaHrm.02:23
persiaSo, I have an opinion as to which I think to be the easiest.02:23
persiaBut that's not necessarily the easiest for *you*02:24
mohadibplease to share it :)02:24
mohadibah02:24
persiaThere's no true way to package :)02:24
persiaAs long as the result package is policy-compliant, it is correct.02:24
mohadibdo i have to submit source and a make file so ubuntu can compile it?02:24
mohadibi cant just submit a jar?02:24
mohadib:S02:24
persiaI tend to recommend not using dh_make because it leaves around lots of extra files and sets some incorrect defaults.02:24
persiaA source jar is fine :)  But we need to compile it to ensure that the binaries released match the source.  Otherwise we can't know that we can fix bugs in it.02:25
mohadibah02:25
mohadibso the idea is to submit a source package with directions to build and install?02:25
persiaWell, directions to build/install, licensing documentation, and hints on how the package relates to other packages.02:26
mohadibi see02:26
persiaWe encode these in the debian/rules, debian/copyright, and debian/control files.02:26
mohadibok, so i hsould have rules call ant?02:26
persiaWe also have a debian/changelog file that tracks changes to the package.02:26
persiaRight.02:26
persiaThere's lots of different ways to do this.  My current favorite is to use /usr/share/doc/debhelper/rules.tiny for debian/rules02:27
mohadibhttp://openactive.org/pastebin/paste/show/602:28
mohadibdoes that look ok for rules?02:28
persiaThis will call dh_auto_clean, dh_auto_configure, dh_auto_build, and dh_auto_install to make a best guess as to how to build the package.02:28
persiaYou'll need a clean: rule.02:29
persiaclean: should return the package to the state it was in prior to the build.02:29
persiaThis usually involves a call to `ant clean` or similar.02:30
mohadibok thanks02:30
nigelbA few of the sugar packges have been deleted from karmic and lucid, but the deps are failing rebuild.  Okay to request removal of all of them?02:41
persianigelb: Why were they removed?02:43
nigelbwe moved to a newer version02:43
nigelbin lucid the version is sugar-0.8802:43
nigelbbut there are a bunch of .84 and .86 packages in failed to rebuild queue02:43
persiaThat's confusing.  Why do the package names change for a version change?02:44
nigelbI have no idea :(02:45
nigelbsugar seems to have names based on version, sugar-0.84, sugar-0.86, sugar-0.8802:45
persiaMy suggestion would be to investigate this.  While we both have no idea, we're not qualified to say what to do with these packages :)02:45
nigelblfaraone: thoughts on this ^02:45
nigelbsince you're on the sugar team :)02:46
nigelbpersia: I'm out of anything I can understand on umet deps and failed to rebuild :(02:46
persianigelb: What don't you understand?  I'd be happy to help for some of these things (where I know something, or generic information is likely to be correct).02:47
nigelbI'll take the first unmet dep then02:47
nigelblemme load up the chroot02:47
lfaraonenigelb: Uh, .86 was re02:53
lfaraone*removed?02:53
lfaraonenigelb: That seems odd, since .88 is still not out yet (.87 will eventually become .88)02:54
nigelblfaraone: appologies, 0.84 was removed02:55
lfaraonenigelb: so what ftbfs?02:56
nigelbsome thing that depends on .8402:56
nigelbhold on, I'll get the exact packages02:56
nigelbsugar-chat-activity-0.84 and sugar-read-activity-0.8402:57
persialfaraone: Do you know why these packages have these names instead of e.g. sugar-chat-activity ?02:59
persia(at a sourcepackage level: binary is entirely different)02:59
lfaraonepersia: because it's an activity (what sugar calls Applixations) and it is called Chat. It only works with sugar.03:00
nigelbit makes it a bit different hunting through LP for it, I went by pure instinct03:00
lfaraoneOh, didn't see your earlier message.03:00
persialfaraone: That explains the "sugar" and "activity" parts.  I'm presuming the binary version is important for compatibilility.  Why does it have that *source* package name?  Do we really expect parallel installations of different versions of sugar?03:01
persiaand is there a strong reason to support this?03:01
lfaraoneNo idea, that's imported from Debian. I haven't done much work on sugar packaging in a while03:01
nigelbpersia: we can't have it anyway03:01
nigelbbecause the main build deps are not around03:01
persianigelb: That's a different issue.03:01
lfaraonepersia: Well, the Peru and Uruguay deployments are on .84/.82, so no.03:02
ScottKDebian does support parallel Sugar versions.03:02
persiaYes.  I just don't understand why.03:02
lfaraonepersia: Because the maintainer, Jonas, decided to do so.03:02
persiaOh well.03:03
nigelbum, so what can we do now?03:04
lfaraonepersia: He uses git, which I find incredibily difficult to package with. Attempts to work with him in the past have been futile.03:04
lfaraonenigelb: Remove the packages which depend on .84.03:04
nigelbwill file a bug03:08
nigelblfaraone: take a look at this http://paste.ubuntu.com/386038/03:11
nigelbshould I request removal of the entire bunch?03:11
lfaraonenigelb: Nock yourself out :)03:13
nigelblfaraone: another of my doubts is, when sugar-0.84 is already removed in lucid, why is it showing in my apt-cache03:13
lfaraonenigelb: because it's cached :)03:15
nigelbah, so I only request removal of the ftbfs?03:15
persianigelb: Better to request removal of the entire -0.84 stack, if it's not complete.  I suspect some were just missed in the partial removal effort.03:21
nigelbpersia: on grepping unmet, I find a bunch of sugar packages03:21
persiaI suspect that once you clean up the FTBFS, you'll find some in unmetdeps, and the last few will end up as (relatively) unmaintained orphans.03:21
nigelbdont I have to file a request for each package individually?03:22
micahgmozilla team was already going to remove sugar-browser-activity-0.84 nigelb03:22
persiaWell, don't remove sugar, just the old version that we know is gone :)  The rest may need a bit of work to get both 0.86 and 0.88 in good shape for lucid.03:22
micahgs/remove/request removal03:22
nigelbah, well, yaay, I found something to do ;)03:22
nigelbmicahg: I'll do it for ya :)03:22
nigelbmicahg: sugar browse 0.84 isn't already removed?03:24
nigelbI dont see it in my cache03:24
mohadibim looking at an exmple rules file, to build it issues ant -f build/build.xml03:25
mohadibfor clean it calls the ant task clean that deletes ${build}03:25
mohadibwouldnt that delete the build.xml file?03:25
mohadib<property name="build" location="build"/>03:25
mohadibthat means /build in the root?03:25
mohadiboh03:26
mohadibits create /build/build, sorry03:26
persiamohadib: /usr/share/perl5/Debian/Debhelper/Buildsystem/ant.pm has build.xml in ./ which makes me think this is a common practice.03:27
nigelbokay, in case of deletion, I follow the same procedure as sponsorship? (since I'm not yet MOTU)03:28
ScottKYes.03:28
nigelbthank you :)03:28
nigelbbug 529824 good enough? anything more I should be adding?03:29
ubottuLaunchpad bug 529824 in sugar-chat-activity-0.84 "Please remove sugar-chat-activity-0.84 from Lucid" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/52982403:29
micahgnigelb: yep, already gone03:29
nigelbmicahg: :)03:29
persiamohadib: You may also find #ubuntu-java to be a better place for java-specific questions.03:29
nigelboh no!03:31
nigelbI accidentally subcribed main sponsers instead of universe03:31
nigelbugh! how do I fix this ugly mistake03:31
lfaraoneJust switch it over.03:31
lfaraoneNo big.03:31
nigelbI cant remove the main guys03:32
lfaraonenigelb: Just sub univ, someone in main sponsors will sort it out.03:33
nigelbokay, just did that now.03:33
* lfaraone is out for the night. 03:34
nigelblfaraone: good night :)03:34
ScottKnigelb: Fixed03:37
nigelbScottK: thanks again :)03:37
nigelbThe epiphany-extensions-more is no longer being maintained and doesn't work with epiphany version in lucid, another target for removal?03:42
persianigelb: I generally try first to fix it, and only seek removal if there is some reason it cannot be fixed (which is different than there being some reason I can't fix it)03:43
nigelbpersia: but upstream says it won't work with epiphany 2.28 and above03:44
nigelband lucid version is now 2.2903:44
ScottKThat'd be good enough for me.03:45
persianigelb: That calls into "cannot be fixed" :)03:46
nigelbthats what I thought too!03:46
nigelbpersia: If it were possible to be be fixed, I'd bug you for teaching me how ;)03:47
persiaI'd be the wrong person: for that bug, I'd point at micahg03:47
nigelbwell, anyone who could ;)03:48
micahgnigelb: epiphany changed to webkit only with 2.28+03:53
micahgnigelb: extensions were gecko based03:53
nigelbmicahg: so now, we end up having to remove it03:53
nigelbmicahg: it didn't work with karmic either I guess03:53
micahgnigelb: wait, it seems like the extensions were ported03:54
nigelbmicahg: oh?03:55
nigelbthe gnome site said, it work anymore and they use something new, which is extremely unstable03:55
nigelbhttp://live.gnome.org/Epiphany/ThirdPartyExtensions03:55
micahgoh, nm, the regular extenions were, but the -more wasn't03:55
nigelbyup03:56
nigelbI did a thorough read :)03:56
mohadibis this wrong? http://openactive.org/pastebin/paste/show/704:05
mohadibthe deb gets made04:05
mohadibbut my files are not included04:05
mohadibjust readme and changelog, stuff created by dh_build04:05
mohadibah, think i see the problem04:07
mohadibhm no04:09
persiamohadib: The last paste you had included a dh_install call.04:16
persiamohadib: You probably also don't want to use the cp calls (especially because they install to an unsired location)04:17
mohadibwell, i changed to debian/syspage/ and it seems to do what i want now04:18
mohadibis ok?04:18
persiamohadib: creating debian/install with http://openactive.org/pastebin/paste/show/8 adding dh_install, and dropping the cp calls should work.04:18
persiaIf it does what you want, it's OK, but it may not be best practice :)04:18
mohadibno, ill do what you said04:19
mohadibthank you04:19
mohadibno point in getting into bad practices now04:19
persiaWell, I'm not sure not using debhelper is a bad practice, but in general, debhelper makes things easier and the same model used for dh_install also works for other dh_* calls.04:20
persiaBut I think using cp is poor practice, and if one wants to avoid using debhelper, using the "install" program is better.04:21
* persia notes that some of the exposition is just for those reading along04:21
mohadibcan i see how the files will be installed from a deb without installing the deb04:22
mohadiblike dpkg -L04:22
persiadpkg --contents04:22
mohadibahh ty04:22
mohadibthat worked great, the dh_install thanks04:23
AnzenkethHello I am developing a patch for bug 529744 I have edited it on my karmic system I was wondering how to test the patch to make sure It did what I said I wanted it to do.07:21
ubottuLaunchpad bug 529744 in gnome-system-tools "When creating a new user, "Shortname" should really be "Username" ." [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/52974407:21
persiaAnzenketh: I can't see the patch in the bug report.07:22
persiaBut in general patch testing consists of 1) download or unpack fresh source, 2) apply the patch, 3) build, 4) test07:23
AnzenkethYep I just removed it forgot to so I could change karmic to lucid07:23
nigelbAnzenketh: how did you get the source?07:23
Anzenkethdget -xu07:24
ddecatorin everyone's opinion, how much programming knowledge is needed to work on patches? i'm learning basic python, and i'm wondering if by the time i'm done i'll be able to actually do any patch work07:24
Anzenkethpersia: So just run ./config make make install then launch it from wherever I find the binary.07:24
nigelbum, no07:24
persiaAnzenketh: Depending on your level of familiarity with debian-format packaging, you may find other ways to work better, but that *ought* to work.  You may want to run `debian/rules patch` beforehand: this doesn't always work, but should apply any pending patches.07:25
persia(or check debian/README.source for closer guidance : again this isn't always there, but it *ought* be)07:25
Anzenkethok will read README.source07:26
Anzenkeththe pdbuilder just though me though a loop07:26
AnzenkethNo clue what it is or how to use it. My familiary with debian-format packaging is close to none07:26
persiaAnzenketh: Then just ignore the packaging, except for applying patches.07:28
persiaAnzenketh: And if you're not doing the packaging, talking about patches in #ubuntu-bugs is likely more on topic.07:28
nigelbpersia: would it be okay if I just packaged it for him and gave credit?07:36
AnzenkethThanks for your help I will go read more of the wiki.07:37
persianigelb: Absolutely.  The usual way to do that would be for you to be listed in the changelog, and to credit Anzenketh in a comment for the specific line you add to Debian changelog when making the change.07:37
persiae.g. "Patch to frob quux (thanks J. Hacker)"07:38
nigelbah, I'll get that done in a few07:38
AnzenkethI almost got the fixed debdiff up there nigelb07:40
nigelbAnzenketh: dont worry on errors.  I'll fix the whole thing up and give you a feedback (though I may just start afresh and credit you with it)07:41
persianigelb: Thanks for helping out the Reviewers team!07:41
nigelbpersia: are there any requirements to join there?07:41
persianigelb: There's ~2000 more patches in the bugtracker that could use the same attention, if you're up for hitting some of them.07:41
nigelbI'm sure I can read patches well enough07:41
persianigelb: You're expected to be competent to review patches and familiar enough with Ubuntu Development to be able to get stuff uploaded.07:42
nigelbbah, uploaded07:42
nigelbmeaning, I should have upload rights or I should have uploaded packages?07:42
=== NCommander_ is now known as NCommander
=== NCommander is now known as Guest88162
persianigelb: You should be capable of getting stuff uploaded.  That can be directly or indirectly.  Doesn't matter.07:43
=== Guest88162 is now known as NCommmander
nigelbpersia: I'll help out with a few of those ~2000 patches and apply to join :)07:44
persianigelb: Some Reviewers work closely with upstreams to get stuff accepted there, and get it uploaded by the sync/merge process.  Others are Debian developers (or nascent ones) and get stuff uploaded there.  Some are Ubuntu Developers.07:44
Anzenkethnigelb: I changed the changelog.07:45
nigelbI'm pretty much blind on Debian Development.07:45
persiaAny of those are good working models: much of patch review is like bug triage, except with code rather than problems.07:45
* Anzenketh goes back to reading the wiki07:45
nigelbI know.  I have had this team in sights for something07:45
nigelbpersia: I think we need an easier process for new contributors.  Like for fixing a proper bug from launchpad07:45
nigelbI'm thinking of writing a small blog post based on this bug fix for future reference.07:46
nigelbs/easier process/easier documentation07:46
nigelbAnzenketh: okay, a few things you should remember for future.07:49
nigelbeach package uses its own patch system, so that any new patch can be unapplied if its not working.  When working on a bug fix, you must ensure that you write a patch under this system07:49
persianigelb: I wrote one: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToFix?action=recall&rev=16 is the most modern copy available.  Someone else made it complicated, and I haven't gotten around to fixing it yet.  Feel free to wade in if you like :)07:49
nigelbthis package for example, uses quilt.07:49
nigelbpersia: I will write a post of my own and ask for review to be included in the wiki.07:50
nigelbwhich seems saner07:50
persiaPlease work to fix what we have, rather than adding more.07:50
persiaLots of different conflicting documents just confuse users.07:51
nigelbokay :)07:52
nigelbAre patching systems like quilt, cdbs used only downstream?  Or does upstream use them too?08:01
slytherinnigelb: Why would upstream use a patch system?08:01
persiaThere's no good answer to that question :)08:01
nigelbI'm just asking something that just popped in ;)08:01
nigelbwhy is there no good answer?08:02
persiaSo, we have some systems (cdbs-simplepatchsys, dpatch) that are only used in Debian and derivatives.08:02
persiaOther patch systems are more widely used.08:02
Rhondanigelb: upstream as in Debian uses patch systems too, yes. :P08:02
nigelbI counted debian as downstream too :)08:02
RhondaIt's upstream from Ubuntu's point of view.08:02
nigelbsince I *know* debian uses them08:02
nigelbI should framed properly08:03
persiaGenerally patch systems are used by various distributors who are *not* the original authors, or for release that are not trunk.08:03
RhondaUbuntu is downstream from Debian's point of view.08:03
persiaVCSs that support branches are often used for this as well.08:03
nigelblike git having several branches08:03
nigelbRhonda: I wanted to ask from a debian standpoint.  But I framed wrongly :)08:03
RhondaI know one upstream that uses plain patch/diff as patch system, though. For carrying extra patches.08:04
persiaOriginal software authors rarely need to maintain sets of patches to their code, generally instead maintaining a single trunk source.  VCSs are commonly used to keep track of patches applied.08:04
nigelbah, that pretty much answers my question and beyond :)08:04
Rhondat-prot carries some patches in the "contrib/" subdirectory, even though the developer produces those patches himself.08:04
persiaSince distributors (like Debian or Ubuntu) may be pulling from the authors directly, or from some patched version distributed by a more specialised distributor, there exists no correct answer to "Does upstream use patch systems".  Debian certainly does.  upstream from there gets murky.  Original authors are unlikely to use them.08:05
persia(except in special cases, as Rhonda notes)08:05
RhondaIsn't there these php patches that are also distributed seperately that gets applied?08:06
Rhondakishino or something like that? Never can remember the name.08:06
persiaThere are.  There's also sets of patches for MAME and vim that get developed as essentially separate upstreams.08:08
persia(and likely several more cases)08:08
nigelbIt does get really murky then08:09
nigelbbtw, if the new patch tagging guidelines are out, why arent all the patches according to them?08:09
Rhondapersia, btw., LP #528957 about that sdl issue, it starts to pop up now from various places.  :/08:10
ubottuLaunchpad bug 528957 in wesnoth "mouse button clicks not detected in windowed mode" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/52895708:10
persianigelb: My rule of thumb is to just submit an ordinary patch upstream unless I'm willing to act as a (nascent) upstream developer.08:10
Rhondanigelb: Because it's a guideline and not a policy must and people are lazy.08:10
persiaRhonda: It's all over the place :(  Do you know if a good general solution is available?08:10
nigelbpersia: makes sense :)08:10
Rhondapersia: Not totally sure. Maybe rolling back to 1.2.13 would be worthwhile, depending on the influence of the issue that triggered the sync in the first place. Maybe even the solution for that one could get cherry-picked, I'm unsure. :/08:11
nigelbI see like 9 patches in the debian/patches directory and none of them are tagged per debian/ubuntu guidelines.  Is that normal?08:11
persianigelb: Unfortunately DEP3 has little takeup so far.08:12
Rhondapersia: If I would have some more time at my hands I really would dig into git bisect and try to pin down which commit did break the click thing in sdl. :(08:12
* Rhonda really wonders why noone has done that so far. %-/08:12
nigelbI'm going to tag if off anyway.08:12
nigelball the bugs I have worked on, I have tagged, going to keep tradition here08:12
persialool: Have you any thoughts on the matter?08:13
Rhondanigelb: Yes, that's completely normal. Like said, it's a pretty new thing, it's not enforced, lintian only recently started to mention it, …08:13
persianigelb: Please do tag your patches.  Please don't tag other people's patches arbitrarily.08:13
nigelbpersia: I dont have the patience to do that for others ;)08:13
persiaExcellent :)08:13
persiaSome people do, and it's always frustrating, because their tags are almost universally ignored or rejected when received.08:14
slytherinAny members of SRU team around?08:14
persiaThe effort is appreciated, but misdirected.  it's like uploads to Ubuntu that create a variance with Debian to only bump the standards version (with no other changes).08:14
persiaslytherin: SRU is consolidated: check in -devel :)08:15
slytherinok08:15
RhondaSubmit such things back, maybe they are appreciated. :)08:15
nigelbI have to learn debian bts one day08:17
nigelbIt totally scares me right now08:17
persiaRhonda: Reports that e.g. Standards-Version can be bumped from 3.8.3 to 3.8.4?  Lots of people got complaints submitting stuff as bugs that was available from the PTS.08:18
RhondaErm, yes, that doesn't make sense, I agree. :)08:18
Rhondanigelb: It's not that complicated, once you got around that it's mainly a mail interface. :)08:19
nigelbRhonda: I got that figured out only earlier today. :/08:19
persiaWe've had folks that aggressively tested stuff and submitted that class of report.  I think we don't have any right now, but those folk aren't folk I want to share with Debian yet :)08:19
duanedesignhello nigelb08:21
nigelbAnzenketh: you need a little bit more of eduction with debian packing before you attempt to upload a debdiff08:24
nigelbso, I would suggest uploading simple patches for now.  :)08:25
AnzenkethI was not planning on doing anything besides string-fixes08:25
nigelbAnzenketh: even so.  Take a look at my debdiff once I upload it.  you'll understand what I mean.08:26
persiaAnzenketh: I'd second nigelb's recommendations.  When I was starting, I found it was much more effective to just fix the bugs with patches, and get someone else to worry about getting it integrated and uploaded.  Looking at the differences between what I produced and what was uploaded helped me to understand how to work with packaging.08:37
AnzenkethYa the link you gave me on how to get started helped a lot08:38
AnzenkethI found out what what-patch did08:38
loolpersia: on DEP3?08:46
persialool: On libsdl1.2 and bugs like 52895708:47
* lool loads08:48
persiacrimsun suggested that it fixed some stuff, but you did another merge, and I wonder if you'd had a chance to look at the issues that are keeping .14 out of squeeze as part of that.08:48
persiaDebian bug #565788 has some of the details, but I don't think anyone has really dug into it.08:49
ubottuDebian bug 565788 in libsdl1.2debian-all "Upgrading SDL breaks Wesnoth" [Critical,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/56578808:49
persiaRight now, we have a situation where some stuff seems broken with .13 and other stuff with .14 and we're shipping .1408:49
loolI only merged packaging changes AFAIR; the previous merge had been from experimental and mine was from unstable, I was a bit surprized to see we picked up an experimental package for lucid though08:49
loolI personally have many weirdnesses with mouse clicks08:50
persiaOh well.  I have a feeling crimsun has far to much already needing to be looked at for lucid.  Maybe someone else can find time to track down the issue.08:50
loolI think that someone should talk with SDL upstream mentionning imminence of debian and ubuntu releases affected by this bug and perhaps others08:50
persialool: In apps other than wesnoth, but using SDL, or generally?08:51
loolI'm not on top of sdl bugs, sorry; it fixed a static build issue for me08:51
loolIn one SDL app and generally08:51
persiaNo worries.  I was just hoping that you'd noticed when you merged.08:51
nigelbAnzenketh: deleting your patch and uploading my debdiff09:09
Anzenkethok09:10
persianigelb: We usually leave the original patches in the bug for the historical record.09:11
nigelbpersia: oh no!09:12
AnzenkethYa it does look differnt.09:12
nigelbpersia: I'll make sure I dont do that next time.  anything to be done now?09:12
persianigelb: Adding a comment when uploading your debdiff like "debdiff applying Anzenketh 's patch" makes it extra clear for sponsors.09:12
persianigelb: Just follow the same procedure as if you're getting your own fix uploaded.09:12
nigelbI never wrote a simple patch :(09:13
nigelbI never got to learn how to do that09:13
persiaRead revision 16 of Bugs/HowToPatch :)09:14
persia(or any earlier revision, but 16 is the most polished before the attack of the debdiff instructions)09:14
AnzenkethAttack of debdiff instructions?09:14
nigelbAnything I can do now to rectify the situation09:14
persianigelb: Not really.  Needs discussion.09:15
persiaAnzenketh: There are continual efforts to update the wiki.  At one point the instructions to create a simple patch were overwritten with instructions to create a debdiff for a candidate upload.  This was done to reduce the number of different ways we instructed people to do things.  Unfortunately, it's a lot more complex to create a candidate upload than to create a patch.09:17
persiaUntil we sort our the procedures and processes for handling different categories of code contributions, it's hard to change the documentation to match current practices.09:17
nigelbyea, like patching system, tagging - all needs to get integrated09:18
persiaSo I've not changed it back until more discussion happens (my last email on the subject was in December, but only got one reply)09:18
persianigelb: Right.  I don't think everyone who contributes code should need to learn that stuff, but I do think anyone who wants to be an Ubuntu developer should.09:18
nigelbpersia: yup.  everyone generating debdiff should know09:19
persiaI think lots of people agree with that, but there are many people who think we shouldn't have two completely different procedures for code contributors, and that all code contributors should be treated the same.09:19
persiaThat debate is not yet concluded.09:19
nigelbIn my case maco_ was kind enough to teach me.  So i know.09:19
nigelbpersia: could you unsubsribe reviewers? I've subscribed main sponsers09:21
persiaNo, but I'll see if I can fix things so I can next time :)09:22
AnzenkethSo if the current instructions are wrong what are prospective developers to do?09:22
persiaAnzenketh: Right now, prospective developers are told they have to learn how to make debdiffs.09:23
persiaAnd random folk submit random patches that the reviewers review.09:23
nigelbpersia: the reviews team wiki seems to indicate the same thing09:23
persianigelb: Which thing?09:23
nigelb"For patch authors who can't upload yet we have the SponsorshipProcess. Unfortunately, there's also a big list of bugs with patches that are not following the process. Likely, because they are not aware of it. "09:23
nigelbEveryone is expected to use sponsorship.  Not just give a patch.09:24
persiaOh, yeah.09:24
persiaI personally disagree strongly with that.09:24
persiaI don't think everyone needs to do that.09:24
persiaIt's too much work, and most folk just give up because it's hard.09:24
nigelbexactly09:24
nigelbthat isn't fair to prospective contributors09:24
AnzenkethI don't even know how to do the sponcership process.09:25
persiaBut I'm not going to overwrite someone's wiki changes without discussion, and I only try to restart the discussion every few months.09:25
AnzenkethDirections on that are not verry clear either.09:25
nigelbits pretty easy, once you have a debdiff, subscribe sponsors depending on where your package is09:25
persiaAnzenketh: Don't worry about it.  if you can make patches, submit them and pretend you didn't read the wiki.  Folk like nigelb will be happy to help get those to the right place (sometimes Ubuntu, sometimes upstream, sometimes Debian, sometimes all three).09:25
Rhondapersia, I know nothing about gnome-app-install, can you take a look at #82436 with respect to wether gnome-app-install (still?) wants to pull in the wesnoth-core package instead of wesnoth?09:26
persiaBut a discussion of how to create/submit patches *not* using the sponsorship process really doesn't belong here.  it belongs in #ubuntu-bugs (or maybe somewhere else, if there's a channel I don't know about).09:27
RhondaThe bug is still open for that somehow.09:27
persiabug #8243609:27
ubottuLaunchpad bug 82436 in gnome-app-install "wesnoth-all meta-package request (for gnome-app-install)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/8243609:27
* persia suspects that's really a bug in app-install-data-ubuntu09:28
persiaOr not.  Seems I said gnome-app-install last time I investigated it :)09:29
Rhonda:)09:29
* Anzenketh just relized what they ment by subscribe09:31
persiaRhonda: I think that bug doesn't matter anymore.  software-center seems to look at app-install-data, which has the correct package hint to install "wesnoth" rather then "wesnoth-all" or "wesnoth-core".09:41
persiaAnd this is unlikely to be fixed as a stable release update.09:41
persiaSo, I think gnome-app-install still has a bug, but I suspect it won't be fixed, and that most users won't encounter it.09:42
RhondaI encounter it in my bugs page. :)09:42
persiaWhich page?  I think that's a bug.09:43
Rhondabugs.lp.net/~rhonda shows it to me everytime I go there09:44
RhondaIt's the only five-digit bugnumber on my page. :P09:45
persiaAha.  It's there because you commented on it.09:46
persiaRhonda: mvo is looking at it, and will apparently sort it.09:49
Rhondapersia: I commented it because it was also a wesnoth bug. :)09:56
RhondaIt's a bit annoying that one can add "also-affects" but can't remove that anymore it seems. :/09:57
nigelbRhonda: we can :)09:57
persiaThere's a bug open about that.09:57
persianigelb: No, we can't.09:57
Rhonda09:57
* Rhonda nibbles on nigelb. :)09:57
persianigelb: We can reassign, but never remove.09:57
nigelbokay, so the last time I did that was quite a while back then09:57
persiaNo, you've never been able to do it :)09:58
* nigelb got confused with "also affects me" and and "also affects project"09:59
persiaWell, one could reassign to no package, but that just destroys (likely valid) history.09:59
persiaheh09:59
* nigelb notes that Rhonda didn't really elaborate which affects-me it was09:59
Rhondanigelb: Then again, one can't unsubscribe from bugs that one got subscribed through other means, this is also a long-standing bug.10:00
RhondaI got told of to have set that bug back from Triaged to Confirmed because nothing at all happened in over a year …  But it's annoying to have it in a state that says "yeah, we know how to do it" for such a long time without any progress, at all. :(10:00
nigelbRhonda: you have a clean bugs.lp page?10:01
persiaIt's bug #20498010:01
ubottuLaunchpad bug 204980 in malone "bug contacts should be able to unsubscribe from implicit subscriptions" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/20498010:01
persiaAnd bug #48431910:01
ubottuLaunchpad bug 484319 in malone "Add unsubscribe link in bug mail for structural and implicit subscriptions" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/48431910:01
Rhondanigelb: What do you mean with a "clean bugs.lp page"?10:01
nigelbRhonda: everything fix released only ;)10:01
nigelbexcept for this one probably10:01
RhondaNo, but like said, this is the only 5 digit issue. :)10:02
nigelboh, is there a difference in number of digits for different bugs?10:02
RhondaI never will have a clean page, that's totally out of scope with that much interests on my hands.10:02
nigelbI didn't know10:02
RhondaSure, there is even LP #1  ;)10:02
persianigelb: fewer digits indicate older bugs.10:02
nigelboh, so this must be really old and ticking you off somewhat ;)10:03
RhondaIt in fact is because _I_ did my part of fixing the issue. :)10:03
RhondaGiven that LP seems to want to track the same bug in multiple packages not as seperate bugs but rather merges all the packages into it it can get easily annoying, especially since one can't unsubscribe from implicit subcriptions anymore.10:04
nigelbhaha10:04
Rhondanigelb: You might laugh, it was the thing that got me unsubscribing from irssi because of that multitude-merged perl transition bug that affected tons of packages and I received lots of mails that were totally unrelated to irssi.10:05
persiaAnd weren't technically the same bug, but rather the same *class* of bug.10:06
nigelbthat isn't fun10:06
nigelbbut look at me, I'm subscribed to rhythmbox.  I'll get mails like ubuntu cheated me of my money, I didn't get my mp3 and they kill kittens10:06
Rhondasigwtf, bug #49329910:07
ubottuLaunchpad bug 493299 in irssi "irssi does not show notification bubbles" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/49329910:07
* Rhonda now is happy to have unsubscribed from irssi all together. … %-)10:07
persiaRhonda: Just mark it duplicate to 493297.10:08
RhondaSure, but … wtf :)10:09
nigelbno one packaged it?10:09
RhondaIt's a terminal based irc client! libnotify??!10:09
RhondaThe world is going crazy. :)10:10
nigelblol, but most users use the libnotify script for irssi10:10
RhondaI extremely highly doubt that.10:10
* arand does..10:11
LaneyI doubt that you could ever have evidence to support that, even if it were true10:11
* nigelb edits10:11
nigelbMany irssi users tend to use libnotify scripts for irssi10:11
LaneySome ...10:12
Laneyand regardless, that doesn't make it a bug in irssi10:12
RhondaI still don't buy the "many"10:12
* nigelb edits to "Some"10:12
nigelband I agree, it does not make it a bug10:12
RhondaIn xchat, yes. In kopete, yes. But … hell, irssi usually runs inside screen on a remote system. :)10:13
persiaRhonda: You do know about the telepathy irssi plugin, right?10:17
* Rhonda drops dead.10:18
Rhondapersia: Do you want to take over maintenance of irssi? :)10:18
persiaRhonda: Not in the least bit :)10:22
nigelbRhonda: if you want help with the bugs I could try :)10:23
Rhondanigelb: I rather want help with the other irssi bugs, triaged. Including those reported in Debian. ;)10:23
nigelbRhonda: I'll make you a deal.  teach me how to deal with debian bts, I'll help you after finishing 1 round of rhythmbox10:24
Rhondanigelb: Install devscripts and reportbug, for a start. :)10:27
nigelbboth are here10:27
persianigelb: Be careful with reportbug: you may want to read the docs (especially about Ubuntu changes), or install it in a Debian chroot.10:29
nigelbyes, a debian chroot is impending, especially to give back upstream.  I've been lazy10:30
persias/impending/pending/10:31
* nigelb needs to use smaller words10:31
rawanghi, when I type "debuild -S", everything looks perfect, but when i dput, it doesn't upload the .orig.tar.gz?10:31
RhondaHow do I get bug #493048 linked to the upstream bugreport?10:31
ubottuLaunchpad bug 493048 in irssi "Tab-completion of channel names cannot be properly used with /join in irssi" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/49304810:32
nigelbI think flyspray is not supported10:32
nigelb(or whatever the upstream is)10:32
rawangnigelb, you mean me?10:33
persiaRhonda: Also, for bug manipulation, you may find more folk with more developed bug tweaking skills in #ubuntu-bugs (although nigelb is definitely one of them)10:33
Rhondarawang: Also use the -sa switch, it seems that dpkg seems from your version number dpkg seems to think the orig.tar.gz should already bee in the archive.10:33
nigelbrawang: nope10:33
Rhondanigelb: Yes, seems to be flyspay.10:33
persiarawang: Examine your source.changes file : it likely doesn't include a reference to the orig.tar.gz.  You may want -sa as well.10:33
rawangsure10:33
nigelbRhonda: I once ran into same issue.  LP doesn't support flyspray tracking yet.10:33
nigelbyou'll have to leave it as a comment10:34
rawangpersia, but why it foget the orig.tar.gz?  I just use "debuilld -S" with lots of packages and without any problem? :)10:35
=== shadeslayer is now known as shadeslayer_
Rhondarawang: What's the version number? dpkg decides according to that wether it wants to include the .orig.tar.gz or not.10:35
persiarawang: debuild believed, based on the revision string, that you didn't need it.10:35
persia(version doesn't matter, only revision, but that's a quibble)10:36
rawangthe package version? it's 0.1.7-1~pre1 in changelog file10:36
RhondaThe revision is part of the version</nitpick>10:37
Rhondarawang: Ah, because it's not a plain -1 or -0 it thinks that the source should be in the pool already, yes.10:37
rawangbut with my other packages, no problem with "x.x.x-1~pre1"10:37
persiaRhonda: Ah.  I perhaps have different semantics than you.  I always say that the version and revision are separated by the final '-' in the changelog entry.  Do you know of an authoritative source of correct semantics?10:38
nigelbRhonda: small world10:39
nigelbRhonda: the same bug that I once triaged is what you're trying to link ;)10:40
Rhondanigelb: I just stumbled upon it, yes. :)10:40
Rhondapersia: The overall thing is the version. :)10:40
Rhondapersia: dpkg --compare-version takes the whole thing, not only the part before the dash.10:41
Rhonda--compare-versions even.10:41
rawangRhonda, 0.1.7 and 0.1.7-1, which one is newer?10:42
Rhondapersia: A version is compare of (optional) epoch + colon, upstream version, and optional dash + revision.10:42
Rhondarawang: dpkg --compare-versions 0.1.7 '<<' 0.1.7-1 && "echo 0.1.7-1 is newer"10:42
persiaRhonda: OK.  and what would you call #\(.*\)-[^-]*# ?10:42
Rhondapersia: a regular expression statement10:42
persiaAh, ${EPOCH}:${UVERSION}-${REVISION} ?10:43
persiaI meant the match :p10:43
Rhondarawang: erm, s/"echo /echo "/ of course. :)10:43
Rhondapersia: (${EPOCH}:)?${UVERSION}(-${REVISION})? - I said optional. :)10:44
rawangRhonda, http://pastebin.org/99347   is the reason why orig.tar.gz is not include while i type "debuild -S" ?10:44
persiaRhonda: Thanks.  I'll adjust my semantic map.10:44
Rhondarawang: And the .orig.tar.gz is referenced in the .dsc file?10:45
rawangRhonda, yes, it was10:45
Rhondawas, or is?10:45
rawangRhonda, it is :)10:46
persiarawang: That looks suspiciously like it's being packaged for a PPA or other 3rd party repository.  I'll recommend you use a revision like "-0ppaX" or "-0rawangX" rather than "-1~ppaX".10:46
rawangand i have compared the sha1 and sha256, it's identical10:46
Rhondapersia: trivia: what epoch is considered equal to version x?  :)10:47
rawangpersia, ok, my goal is to upload to debian archive, that's just a test environment :)10:47
persiaRhonda: 0?10:47
Rhondarawang: I wouldn't go musing around what went wrong where too much and just add the -sa switch. Much less trouble and time waste. :)10:47
Rhondapersia: Right! :)   0:x = :x = x  :)10:48
rawangRhonda, sure, thanks a lot! :)10:48
* persia decides to upload the next new packaged project as ~:... just to see what breaks10:48
Rhondaepochs aren't allowed to contain ~ so the upload will get rejected.10:49
rawangRhonda, but seems that there is no explanation about "-sa" in debuild manpage10:49
nigelbthere should be -s and -a10:49
Rhondarawang: Indirect explenation: dpkg-buildpackage(1) options may be given on the command line.10:50
Rhondanigelb: No, there shouldn't.10:50
rawangnigelb, Rhonda ok, got it.10:50
nigelbRhonda: my mistake :)10:50
Rhondarawang: A lot of building tools hand over all options they don't know themself to dpkg-buildpackage.10:51
RhondaActually, I can't think of one that doesn't, or at least has a special flag to pass such options along.10:51
* Rhonda . o O ( like --debbuildopts in cowbuilder )10:51
rawangRhonda, yes, make sense, -sa option belongs to dpkg-genchanges. :)10:51
persiaRhonda: Do you know that to be true for Soyuz ? :)10:52
Rhondapersia: No, but then, I wouldn't mind if that thing breaks, so be my guest. :P10:52
nigelbI'm off folks, later :)10:52
rawangnigelb, byebye :)10:54
shadeslayer_nigelb: bye! :010:54
shadeslayer_*:)10:54
arandI'm trying to rebuild maxima to use libread6 instead of libread5, would I in this case simply change the line in debian/control from "libreadline5-dev | libreadline-dev" to "libreadline6-dev | libreadline-dev" ?11:45
hyperairshouldn't libreadline-dev be enough?11:47
Laneynot if it's a virtual package11:47
Laney(is it?)11:47
hyperairit isn't11:47
RhondaIt isn't11:47
RhondaAnd libreadline-dev depends on libreadline6-dev. :)11:48
hyperairyep11:48
Rhondaarand: Simply drop the "libreadline5-dev | " part.11:48
arandRhonda: Ok, and then just put something in changelog? (No patch-making necessary here?)11:49
* Laney eyes maxima11:50
RhondaIf you change something you need to document that change in the changelog, yes. :)   "drop libreadline5-dev alternative to build with libreadline6" or such.11:50
Laneythose changes should be forwarded to Debian11:50
RhondaI would expect that there is already such a bugreport.11:50
RhondaThere was some massbug filing about that issue.11:51
Laneynot readline, all the other ones11:51
Laneyhttp://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/m/maxima/maxima_5.20.1-5ubuntu1/changelog11:51
hyperairwhy not readline?11:55
Laneythat's just not what I was talking about11:56
randomactionthe readline change was already made in 5.20.0-112:04
arandHmm, I'm getting failed builds for no-changes now on maxima (karmic)12:04
arandrandomaction: Yea, but it's not in karmic.12:04
arandhence Bug #52990212:05
ubottuLaunchpad bug 529902 in maxima "maxima tries to find /lib/libreadline.so.5 but 9.10 has .6" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/52990212:05
arandSo if I'm getting build errors and failure to build when using a fresh pbuilder (after dpkg-source, debuild -S -uc -us), something bad is afoot?12:12
shadeslayer_arand: probably12:13
shadeslayer_arand: is the chroot updated and working?12:13
arandI just ran a "pbuilder --create" that should be sufficient?12:14
shadeslayer_arand: can you pastebin the errors?12:14
arandhttp://pastebin.ubuntu.com/386252/12:14
shadeslayer_arand: not necessarily... the main servers are a bit wobbly these days,i failed 3 times to create a chroot with the main servers12:15
shadeslayer_and then i used a local server in india12:15
shadeslayer_arand: any errors while creating the chroot?12:15
arandI do not think so, I can recheck..12:16
shadeslayer_please do :)12:17
shadeslayer_arand: if its fine,then i cant think of the solution :P12:17
arandIt's just using the downloaded cache now I guess, but no errors on creating the chroot...12:21
shadeslayer_hmm.. no idea then :(12:21
arandmore bork in maxima, bleh!12:21
arandSo in this case i should be reportin a "fail to build from source" bug?12:26
persiaWell, best to try to fix it :)12:28
persiaAnd if you're fixing it whilst you're working on the unmetdeps bug, no need to file a new bug.12:29
arandEh, well, I have no idea how to fix it though, which is the crux..12:29
persiaarand: Well, are you willing to try?12:30
arandpersia: Definitely.12:30
persiaIf it was my bug, I'd start by trying to run the build under gdb in a chroot.12:31
persiaYou seem to be using pbuilder, so pbuilder-dist lucid login, apt-get install gdb, apt-get build-dep maxima.12:31
persiaGrab the sources.12:31
randomactionarand: which version of maxima are you building, and for which release of ubuntu? (sorry, I've been disconnected and may have missed this information)12:32
persiaDo a local build with debuild -b (you'll discard this, so don't worry about it not being clean)12:32
arandpersia: it's for karmic.12:32
persiaarand: Once it fails, rerun the last entry from debian/rules under gdb, and dig up a backtrace.12:32
persiaThen s/lucid/karmic/ :p12:32
arandpersia: ok, I'm on it12:34
arandpersia: Hmm, something is a bit odd, I get no prompt in "pbuilder-dist karmic login" and no bash-completion, etc...12:49
* persia doesn't use pbuilder, and so is poorly-qualified to troubleshoot this class of issue12:50
guardianhello, when i want to build a 32bit package on a 64bit box, I'm launching ./configure CC="gcc -m32" -- are there cross compiling options that would let autoconf pass the -m32 option to gcc? I mean explicitly telling "the compiler is gcc and it has to be invoked with the -m32" kinda defeats the purpose of autoconf isn't it?12:50
persiaguardian: What is your larger goal?12:51
joaopintoguardian, it's easier to setup a 32bits schroot and build from there12:51
guardianthe large goal is to be able to build my package for any 64b or 32bit platform that supports autotools12:51
bjsnideris the cdrkit vs. cdrtools fight ever going to be resolved?12:52
guardianthe next step, after linux build, is to use autotools on mac but i'm still polishing linux builds on ubuntu :)12:52
persiabjsnider: No.12:52
bjsniderthen someone is going to have to write brand new software that does what cdrtools does12:52
persiaguardian: I'm not that familiar with cross-compilation, but we generally build stuff in a way such that it doesn't matter if the underlying hardware is 32 or 64 bit, but rather the environment as a whole.12:53
persiabjsnider: It's been done a couple times before.12:53
bjsnideri don't mean a fork, i mean brand new code12:53
persiaguardian: So, we tend to build in managed chroots (using pbuilder or sbuild/schroot) that are constructed to believe they are 32-bit or 64-bit.12:53
guardianok12:54
persiabjsnider: Yes, so do I :)  Anyway, the easiest way to resolve it is for optical drives to become obsolete.12:54
guardianso, invoking configure --host=x86_64-pc-linux-gnu isn't supposed to work?12:54
guardianapparently it lloks for x86_64-pc-linux-gcc that doesn't exist12:55
persiaIt's suppsoed.  We just don't do it that way :)12:55
joaopintocross compiling is not trivial12:55
persiaNot at all.12:56
bjsniderpersia, i was hoping for a less depressing answer than that12:56
guardianit's not trivial and it often is as trivial as invoking configure with CC="gcc -m32 or CC="gcc -m64", that's why I was looking for an option that would let autoconf do it12:56
guardiani'm building a shared library btw12:56
bjsnideri don't have enough coffee in me right now to handle that12:57
guardianthat only has the C runtime as a dependency12:57
persiaguardian: -m32 vs. -m64 ignores a whole heap of valid -m values in Ubuntu :)12:57
persiaWe have 6 mainline architectures, most of which have a couple of different available personalities.12:58
guardianok so the way to go is to chroot and let autoconf decide, that's what you're telling12:59
persiaThat's what we usually do, because it's easier to write portable software than to write cross-compilable software.13:00
guardianside question, let say I want to ease someone's life for a corporate internal tool, so that she launches "make" and it builds both x86 32b and 64b versions of my library -- according to what you just said, I'm better of writing a shell script that asserts gcc has multilib support and then launches configure 2 times from different build trees (one for i386, one for x86_64) with either CC="gcc -m32" or CC="gcc -m64" and finally invoke make one time in13:06
guardianbuild tree?13:06
persiaguardian: For that case, I'd probably want to make cross-compile work.  It's just not how we do it :)13:13
=== myrtti is now known as Myrtti
guardianpersia: and in case of cross compiling, what should i pass to the --host option? x86_64-something-but-what ?13:16
persiaI'm not an especially good person to ask.  Like I said, we don't usually do it that way.13:17
guardianok13:17
guardianthank you anyway13:18
=== dyfet` is now known as dyfet
arandDoes these lines indicate why it fails to build: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/386283/ ?? Or do I need to look further into the automake procedure?13:35
persiaarand: That's likely the issue, yes.13:37
persiaarand: Now you just have to track down where gcl-depends.mk is supposed to be created.13:38
arandpersia: Hmm and how would I do that?...13:39
persiaarand: I'd probably start with `grep -rin gcl-depends .` in the base directory.13:40
arandpersia: What i found; http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/386303/ (ignoring./share/contrib/lurkmathml/maximadiffs.txt AND ./ChangeLog) With what little I can tell to mee it looks as though it should be created in src...?13:54
* persia consults the make manual13:55
bjsniderpersia, what i can't figure out is why opensuse agreed to include cdrtools13:56
persiabjsnider: Does it matter that they did?13:58
persiaEven if it does, does it matter why?13:58
persiaAnd even if it matters why, does it matter for Ubuntu?13:58
bjsniderpersia, because they should be facing the same issues ubuntu is with regard to cdrtools13:59
eolo999hi, i' trying to package sphinx-search for hardy, everything works out except when i try to install the package i got a wronge version dependency error: sphinx depends on libpq5 (>= 8.4~0cvs20090328); however: Version of libpq5 on system is 8.3.9-0ubuntu8.04. Where does that dependency came out if the only thing I addded in control file was postgresql-server-dev-8.3?14:00
eolo999and another question: how much time does it take to a package to be shown in launchpad PPA?14:01
persiaarand: I'm getting confused about when include directives happen.14:03
persiaarand: But try running the command that's supposed to generate the file, and see what happens.14:03
kreuterhi, #ubuntu-motu.  can anybody help me make some progress on a sync request?14:05
arandeolo999: Depends on build queue, you can check the status of build and get a rough ETA14:06
persiakreuter: Sure.  Where are you now?14:07
eolo999arand: where do i find the queue?14:07
kreuterpersia: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/52061014:07
ubottuLaunchpad bug 520610 in ubuntu "mongodb sync request" [Undecided,New]14:07
arandeolo999: view package details, and on that page "view all builds"14:08
eolo999ok14:08
eolo999thx14:08
kreuterI'm not clear from the last comment what I'm supposed to do next.14:08
arandeolo999: However, that will only say something useful if you do have packages that are building..14:09
persiakreuter: The last comment isn't actually that helpful, unfortunately.14:09
persiakreuter: it's a new package, so the first step is to request a freeze exception from the release managers.14:10
kreuterokay.  how do I do that?14:10
persiakreuter: Update the description to indicate why mongodb is so cool that it *must* be in lucid, and subscribe ubuntu-release.14:10
kreuterdoes "we (10gen) receive continuous requests for Ubuntu packages" suffice?14:11
arandpersia: I'm not quite sure what to do with all the $VARs ...14:12
kreuterand should I create a new lp bug, or just append to the current one?14:13
persiaarand: Try running "make gcl-depends.mk" in ./src/14:13
persiakreuter: I'd just keep reusing the bug, for easier tracking of all the history.14:13
kreuterok14:13
* persia has never done an FFe for a NEW package, and hopes someone else has a good hint for rationale14:13
Laneydon't forget about lucid-backports14:14
persiaLaney: There's a bit of history here: kreuter came by just around FF and asked for inclusion, and was told to talk to Debian, and has done so.  Do you know if there's a way to start populating lucid-backports prior to lucid release?14:15
LaneyI'm not sure when it opens (ScottK or jdong might know though), but I guess that it can be pre-approved in any case.14:16
arandpersia: just "make" gives "no rule..." and if I secify the makefile: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/386319/14:16
eolo999is it possible that debuild take dependencies version from my karmic install and doesn't use pbuilder environment?14:17
persiaarand: Ah, right, you'd have to generate all the makefiles first.14:17
Laneyeolo999: not just possible, but certain14:17
Laneyyou need to call it with pbuilder build xxx.dsc or pdebuild14:18
persiaarand: do you not get a Makefile with debuild -b ?14:18
kreuterI'm supposed to subscribe "Ubuntu Release Team"?14:18
persiakreuter: Yes.14:18
kreuterok.  done.14:18
kreuternow I wait?14:18
eolo999Laney: great! so i can "run pdebuild -S"?14:19
LimCorehi, I was thinking, would it be nice to have a security tool that interactivly warns when a new application tries to connect to internet, and then remember user's decissions? (sort of like well known ZoneAlarm or Outpost products where for windows)14:19
arandpersia: if you mean Makefile.am I do have one in src/ (and in ../)14:19
persiaarand: No, I mean Makefile14:20
persiaarand: Makefile.am probably generates Makefile.in which probably generates Makefile14:20
eolo999I created the env with: sudo pbuilder-dist hardy amd64 create. How do i use it to build a source package based on that env?14:22
* eolo999 is really a newbie14:23
Laneyyou don't need to build a source package in the chroot14:23
persiaWell, for some packages you might, depending.14:24
persiaFor instance, if you're running MoeOS, and you want to compile for lucid, and the package has versioned build-depends required for building sources ...14:24
Laneyalright, if you can't satisfy the build-depends required to run clean: then yes you do.14:25
arandpersia: No I have none of that, hmm, I found this bit earlier in the debuild -b output, is it relevant?: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/386322/14:25
eolo999ok, found something in the packaging guide, i stopped reading too early14:25
persiaarand: That looks like the output of the call to clean.14:25
persiaarand: Did you manually delete anything or run clean after your call to debuild -b?14:26
arandpersia: I still get that error if I dpkg-source in a fresh dir and run debuild -b again14:31
kklimondaLimCore: most people don't even read what is written on the popup dialog so they would probably just press "Allow" to dismiss it faster and use the program they have installed. I'm not sure if it's going to help them.14:31
persiaarand: That's expected.  The trick is that once you have run debuild-b, you are at the point of the crash.14:31
LimCorekklimonda: it will help thoes users that do read14:31
persiaarand: And *then* you can run `cd src; make gcl-depends.mk` to try to replicate.14:32
LimCorethe users that do not read can not be helped, but then other then general secure by default system, they can only blame themselves, if they will run a binary from internet or smth14:32
persiaarand: and if you're extra lucky, you can edit Makefile to add a debugger call, and get a backtrace, and fix it.14:32
kklimondaLimCore: but to answer the question you have asked on #-bugs the libboost and wxwidgets are kinda heavy dependencies and wxwidgets is not in the main so getting such an application to the default cd would be hard task14:32
eolo999it seems that even dh_make should have run with different env settings14:32
arandpersia: Yea, ok, now it seems I have all the makefiles as they should be14:33
arandpersia: So I would want to add $(how do I add a debugger call?) somewhere in here?: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/386327/ (that's from the makefile)14:38
persiaarand: Right.  I'd probably insert echo at the beginning, and then add another line with gdb $(EXECUTEGCL)14:39
persiaYou can then add the arguments back inside gdb14:40
persiaThere are, of course, lots of other ways to do it :)14:40
* persia grumbles at the massive dependency list for aptitude in sid14:41
arandpersia: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/386330/ like so?14:42
kreuterpersia: so now I'm supposed to get a sponsor review.  how do I do that?14:45
persiakreuter: Wait for me to finish building the package :)14:46
kreuterok :)14:46
persiaAt this point the rest is out of your hands.  Just watch the bug traffic, and it should tell you the status.14:46
kreuter<nod>14:46
persiaUnless something unexpected happens, it will probably be available in the next week or so.14:46
persiakreuter: Once it is accepted, you probably want to subscribe to bugmail, and try to make sure fixes are made available.  You may also want to subscribe to the package in the Debian BTS.14:47
arandpersia: And then run "gdb make" "makefile" "break EXECUTEGCL" and "run" ?14:49
kreuterpersia: okay.14:50
kreuterthanks again!14:50
persiaNo, just run make `gcl-depends.mk`the gdb call inteh makefile will run gdb.14:50
persiaBut like I said, there's lots of ways.  You can run gdb outside make too.14:51
kreuterhm.  was I also supposed to have subscribed ubuntu-main-sponsors?14:52
arandOk, I'll try that.14:52
kreuter(and is it still important for me to do so now?)14:52
persiakreuter: No, and no.14:53
kreuterokay and okay!14:54
arandpersia: That just gave meMakefile:2398: *** missing separator.  Stop.14:54
persiakreuter: For now, MOTU remains in charge of new packages.  This ought change at some point, but it's not yet clear how to implement that.14:54
persiaarand: That means there's a syntax errror in your makefile.14:54
arandpersia: Hmm, seems I ran make at the wrong point before, now when I simply removed the gdb things from the makefile (I apparently didn't fit them in syntax properly) i instead get this on "make gcl-depends.mk": http://paste.ubuntu.com/386344/15:02
persiaarand: Excellent!  You've found the bug,  Try typing ":H" for help.15:04
persiaI have no idea how to tell you to fix this, but you're getting to the point where you can probably track it down.15:04
persia(and it's a great opportunity to improve your lisp)15:04
arandI don't know a single bit of lisp :(15:05
* persia suspects that will no longer be true in a couple hours15:06
=== debfx_ is now known as debfx
hyperairany motu-release people around?16:07
persiahyperair: MOTU Release is going away.  Go find ubuntu-release in -devel.16:08
hyperairoh whoops16:08
ScottKGone, not going.16:08
hyperairheheh16:08
persiaOh cool.16:08
iktgone?16:09
hyperairikt: yeah, archive reorg.16:09
iktopps16:10
iktread that wrong16:10
iktmotu release is going away16:10
iktnot motu16:10
persiaikt: No, MOTU still exists.16:11
persiaikt: But please feel free to participate in the discussion of the transitoin from Masters of the Universe to Masters of the Unseeded (or whatever MOTU ends up expanding as)16:11
persia(on the ubuntu-motu@ mailing list)16:11
iktthat's cool, I'm just getting used to bug triage, so I'm sure I'll be more active here soon >.>16:13
hyperairunseeded eh16:13
hyperairheheh16:13
hyperairi think masters of the universe sounds cooler =p16:14
hyperairbut it wouldn't make much sense if universe itself disappears.16:14
persiaMe too, but that requires a definition of "universe" that doesn't include lots of stuff, which is tricky once there are no components.16:14
arandpersia: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/maxima/+bug/296643/comments/12 :( Should I just fix the dependency and test-build it in ppa instead?16:15
ubottuLaunchpad bug 296643 in maxima "Please merge maxima 5.17.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,Fix released]16:15
hyperairpersia: components are going away?16:15
* persia thinks people should actually read mail and check the references16:16
persiahttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArchiveReorganisation/Components16:16
ScottKUniverse of everything else.16:22
lbrinkmaI have a problem with my anjuta-extras package: I can't get away the lintian warning: pkg-has-shlibs-control-file-but-no-actual-shared libs. I've no idea how to solve that, please help me. You can get the package at https://launchpad.net/~lbrinkma/+archive/ppa16:23
kamalmostafaI would like a clarification about the "motu-release is gone" situation please:  How does that affect the FFe process?  (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess still advises that "motu-release" should be subscribed).  What about all the bugs in the motu-release queue right now?16:25
jbernardlbrinkma: have you tried passing the '-I' flag to lintian? I find that often sheds light on what's going on16:25
jbernardlbrinkma: er, '-i' i meant16:26
lbrinkmajbernard: I've tried running 'lintian-info -t pkg-has-shlibs-control-file-but-no-actual-shared libs' and the information was not very helpful. I think, cdbs is causing this problem.16:28
ScottKkamalmostafa: motu-release/ubuntu-release.16:34
=== yofel_ is now known as yofel
lbrinkmaI've tried running with '-i'. It's the same as running lintian-info. I've no idea what to do next and I want to get the package to lucid. Everyday later makes it harder to get it accepted.16:38
hyperairfeaturefreeze is on already. i don't think you can get in any new packges.16:40
lbrinkmahyperair: It's not really new. The splitted up the anjuta package into anjuta and anjuta-extras.16:42
hyperairlbrinkma: can you check the contents of the deb with dpkg-deb -c package.deb? if there is a library in /usr/lib/ then dh_makeshlibs will create a shlibs control file.16:42
kamalmostafaScottK: I think you're saying that motu-release is replaced by ubuntu-release, so I'll subscribe that to my pending FFe request.  thanks.16:44
lbrinkmahyperair: there are files in /usr/lib/anjuta/16:46
hyperairlbrinkma: got a build log?16:46
hyperairlbrinkma: and is the package uploaded somewhere?16:47
wrapsterhow do i list out all the diverts that have currently been provided by dpkg?16:47
LaserJockhey all, I'd like to file a sync request for a new upstream bug-fix-only release, is there anything special I need to do for that?16:47
lbrinkmahyperair: yes, in my ppa https://launchpad.net/~lbrinkma/+archive/ppa16:47
hyperairokay lemme download and see16:47
wrapsterguys anyone knows about it?16:48
hyperairwrapster: man dpkg-divert16:48
hyperairdpkg-divert --list16:48
hyperairlbrinkma: well, i'm not sure why, but dh_makeshlibs is misbehaving.17:06
hyperairlbrinkma: solution is to make it not run, somehow.17:07
hyperairor rather, workaround.17:07
hyperairlbrinkma: or just get rid of cdbs.17:09
lbrinkmahyperair: how to do that? I'm not very familiar with cdbs17:09
hyperairlbrinkma: just get rid of it and use dh717:10
lbrinkmahyperair: How to do that best? I could rebuild the package and copy over the files or what to do?17:11
hyperairjust change debian/control and debian/rules17:11
hyperairrewrite the debian/rules17:11
lbrinkmawhat to do in the control file: just delete cdbs dep17:12
hyperairdelete cdbs dep, make debhelper's version 7.0.5017:14
hyperairreplace the rules with this:17:15
hyperair%:17:15
hyperair<tab>dh $@17:15
hyperairoverride_dh_makeshlibs:17:15
hyperairthe override_dh_makeshlibs is empty to avoid dh_makeshlibs from being called.17:15
lbrinkmahyperair: thank you very much for helping me17:18
hyperairlbrinkma: no problem.17:18
=== dpm is now known as dpm-afk
LaserJockcurse you v3 dpkg format!!!18:57
=== maco2_ is now known as maco2
bdrung_LaserJock: why?20:15
LaserJockbdrung_: because I'm needing to backport a package to karmic20:16
LaserJockbdrung_: which means I need to un-v3 it20:16
LaserJockbdrung_: which meant that I needed to repack the .orig.tar.gz since it was a bz220:17
LaserJockwhich meant I have to reupload a tarball for the exact same thing that's already in the archives20:17
bdrung_LaserJock: yeah, backporting v3 is a PITA, but i love it nonetheless20:18
LaserJockI haven't seen a package that really used it in a way that I was like "oh awesome" but I'm sure there are some about20:18
bdrung_LaserJock: ist a cleaner debian/rules and a not-repacked bz2 source awesome enough?20:20
LaserJockI haven't seen much cleaner debian/rules, but yeah bz2 is great ... unless you're trying to backport :-)20:21
Rhondabdrung_: I'm not that sure how much cleaner v3 makes debian/rules, to be honest. Sounds like buzzword merchandizing to me, can you clearify?20:23
bdrung_Rhonda: you don't need a patch system in there (and you can drop the patch system from B-D)20:24
geserLaserJock: backporting from lucid+1 to lucid won't have this v3 format problem20:24
RhondaLaserJock: And yes, the pain that the v3 format brings doesn't really work for its benefits.20:24
LaserJockgeser: sure, but that doesn't help me now ;p20:24
Rhondabdrung_: That doesn't make it much cleaner, and actually, one does need a patch system if one wants to work properly with it.20:25
azeemhey LaserJock20:25
LaserJockhi azeem20:25
azeemRhonda: patch system cluttering up debian/rules20:25
LaserJockazeem: I'm trying to get gchemutils 0.10.12-1 into Debichem PPA20:25
azeemyay20:25
bdrung_Rhonda: you don't have to. you can extract, edit the source, debuild, and the patch will created for you.20:25
LaserJockazeem: which is causing this v3 mess due needing newer goffice20:25
Rhondaazeem: Sorry, but that's a plain bullshit. A single include line and an patch and unpatch requirements to two targets are *FAR* from "cluttering up debian/rules".20:26
azeemRhonda: please watch your language in here20:26
Rhondas/bullshit/intentionally false advertising/, sorry.20:26
azeemLaserJock: hrm, which packages have been converted to v3? The debichem ones or goffice?20:26
LaserJockit seems like Debhelp 7 has more going for debian/rules maybe20:27
LaserJockazeem: goffice20:27
azeemok20:27
bdrung_Rhonda: compared to a three line debian/rules - it's a huge benefit ;)20:27
LaserJockanyway, there will be benefits to v3 in the future for sure20:27
LaserJockbeing able to do bz2 orig.tar. files is great20:28
Rhondabdrung_: A three line debian/rules is a very bad idea and a regression to readable debian/rules IMHO. It might make things easier for 80% (where things already were easy) but makes it a lot harder for the remaining 20% of the packages.20:28
azeemnobody said you have to use 3-line debian/rules for all packages20:28
* Rhonda points azeem at bdrung_20:28
Rhondaazeem: Unfortunately the documentation isn't there anymore to not get a 3-line debian/rules to start off from.20:29
bdrung_Rhonda: yes, some packages needs more than this20:29
RhondaIt's hiding the posibilities that some packages actually _do_ require behind its three lines, and doesn't document properly how to work.20:30
LaserJock*anyway*  it's not a peeing contest, debian/rules is as long (hopefully) as it needs to be to get the job done20:30
RhondaThat's a huge regression from a usability point of view.20:30
Rhondahmmmmm20:40
RhondaThe requested URL /changelogs/pool/main/d/dpkg/dpkg_1.15.5.6ubuntu1/changelog was not found on this server.20:40
keeswhen motu-release folks get a moment, can two members ACK bug 530309 please?20:54
ubottuLaunchpad bug 530309 in ltp "FFe: sync ltp with Debian" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/53030920:54
=== dpm-afk is now known as dpm
geserkees: motu-release is getting merged into ubuntu-release, but I don't know what's the status is right *now*20:55
keesgeser: yeah, that's why I figured I should just follow existing processes20:56
iuliankees: Done.21:10
keesiulian: thanks21:11
alkisgHow can I discard a bzr push done by someone else? The launchpad tree is in rev. 79, in my local disk I have 78, and I want to discard 79...21:11
jpdsalkisg: bzr pull; bzr uncommit; bzr revert; bzr push --overwrite?21:28
alkisgjpds: thank you :)21:28
wrapsterhi21:34
wrapsterare there any docs available to learn how APT works?21:34
jcastrolucas: I owe you a beer, the debian squid maintainer seems receptive to having the deb proxy thing an optional config21:34
lucasjcastro: perfect :)21:35
matttbeHello nhandler_ and ScottK21:38
matttbeI'm part of the Cairo-Dock team and we need 1 'ack' in order to accept our update on Ubuntu Lucid asked more than 2 weeks ago...21:38
matttbeit seems that you can help us :)21:38
matttbethis is the two bugs: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cairo-dock/+bug/521534 & https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cairo-dock-plug-ins/+bug/52153621:39
ubottuLaunchpad bug 521534 in cairo-dock "Please update cairo-dock to 2.1.3-3 version" [Undecided,Confirmed]21:39
matttbeor maybe someone else can help us?21:46

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