[00:07] I'll be around another 4-5 hours if more testing etc is required [00:07] apachelogger: no idea [00:07] apachelogger: iirc it does not [00:07] ok :) [00:07] cause it uses the oo text [00:07] hm [00:07] oh, I could check the buildlog I suppose [00:08] UDS announced, sponsorship https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDS-M/Sponsorship [00:09] Riddell: where/when is it gonna be? [00:09] nvm [00:09] the exciting land of Belgium! [00:09] I see that :) [00:10] * genii thinks about the variety of Belgian beers [00:10] * apachelogger remembers fosdem and blinks once and goes back to poking sed with his laser screwdriver [00:12] hm [00:12] apparently sed is not very much into ! [00:21] ryanakca: waa, I can't edit the URL path settings on https://www-admin.kubuntu.org/node/135/edit [00:21] none of those boxes will expand [00:22] smells like broken js :S [00:22] Riddell: karmic upgrade from 4.4.0 went fine [00:23] lovely [00:28] so is there anything interesting going on in kubuntuland? slackware user here wanting to check it out [00:33] manwichmakeameal: depends on the defiition of interesting I suppose [00:33] just curious what people are working on, i suppose [00:34] * apachelogger is working on superior kde-l10n packaging ;) [00:36] i've got 9.10 downloading right now. saw project timelord and figured i'd try to hunt some bugs or so [00:44] There are bugs?? ;-o [00:46] i guess we'll find out === dendrobates is now known as dendro-afk === dendro-afk is now known as dendrobates [01:39] Riddell: Any word on Lucid 64bit kdebase-runtime yet? [01:49] wow lots of updates on karmic today [01:55] apachelogger: How did you fix the akoandi problem? [01:56] * genii checks ftbs [02:40] Riddell: Oh nooes. Hmm... does tabing between boxes work? [02:48] Looks like it doesn't. [02:50] Riddell: Temporarily, this-really-sucks fix: Konqueror -> Configuration -> Configure Konqueror -> Internet Navigation -> Java & Javascript -> Javascript -> New domain -> add www-admin.kubuntu.org and set to refuse / disable javascript for it. [02:50] (Liberal translation from French for menu paths) [02:51] s/menu paths/konqueror menu paths/ [02:52] * ryanakca is really looking forward to ofirk's theme so that we can get rid of the current breaks-if-you-look-at-it-the-wrong-way theme. [03:07] plasma-widget-folderview seems to be currently the package which is stalling the Lucid 64bit 4.4.1 upgrade for me here [04:43] * genii puts on more coffee [08:44] anyone looking at the kdebluetooth 0.4.2 bugfix release? i suppose we want that one for lucid [08:45] a|wen: already did, there is a bug report in launchpad [08:47] neversfelde: ahh, great ... should've seen that one [08:59] neversfelde: can u check blogilo in ninja ppa .. its keep available upgrade .. even i already upgrade it .. [09:01] http://paste.ubuntu.com/387485/ [09:08] ejat: will do [09:16] neversfelde: thanks .. [09:18] Riddell, Lex79: We have kdepim - 4:4.4.1a-0ubuntu1~karmic1~ppa1 isn't that a problem, when upgrading to lucid? [09:33] oh, and BTW, blogilio still refuses to understand it was upgraded... [09:33] -i [10:35] DarkwingDuck: bug 448705 [10:35] Launchpad bug 448705 in akonadi "akonadi server doesn't start at login" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/448705 [10:35] DarkwingDuck: I didnt [11:05] hm [11:05] I am magnificent [11:05] and you are all beautiful [11:05] and life is awesome [11:13] sounds like someone is having a good day :) [11:16] ever since I saw a blue headed unicorn flying up in the sky yesterday! [11:18] * a|wen likes blue headed unicorns [11:20] http://pastebin.ca/1821019 [11:20] created by one tiny bash script from one common packaging branch :D [11:28] Can somebody retry kdepimlibs on amd64? [11:31] Lure-android: done [11:31] Thanks. Will need further retries for kdebase* [11:50] Lure-android: rofl, was going to make same comment on daviey's blog [11:51] ;-) , it was obvious suggestion [11:53] * Lure-android hates irc from phone due to stupid company firewall :-( [11:54] * jussi01 wishes for decent ircable phone... [11:55] It is not that bad, but still sucks [11:56] Jussi01: but nexus one rocks [11:57] Lure-android: it still doesnt have a physical keyboard, which is a must for me [11:57] * jussi01 has an e66... [11:58] it works ok, but screen size is tiny and its... symbian... [11:58] That is probably the reason why irc sucks for me ;-) [11:58] I had E65 before [11:58] Im not sure what phone I want [11:58] Im umming and erring [11:59] wouldve liked the n900 +1 but then they went and did meego... [11:59] Yep, that sucks [12:03] apachelogger: yes, we forgot to drop "a" in version, now is a problem for users wants upgrade to lucid [12:04] makes sense [12:04] only recently I thought about the danger of that happening :) [12:04] need to find a way to prevent it in future [12:04] yes [12:05] bug first I'll go do some work @university :P [12:05] because I can't find a solution, a version > of 4.4.1a~karmic1~ppa1 but < of 4.4.1-0ubuntu1 :D [12:07] apachelogger: kdebase-workspace, kdegraphics, kdepim, kdemultimedia on amd64 needs your retry now [12:08] Lex79: just bump the one in lucid to 4.4.1a [12:08] * Lure-android thinks kdepimlibs is published by now [12:08] yes, but is not elegant I think [12:08] Lure-android: oh man, I wont get any lunch because of you :P [12:08] Lex79: I do find it elegant :P [12:08] not to mention clear [12:09] because they tarballs are the same I suppose [12:09] so they should have the same upstream version [12:09] which means lucid must be bumped [12:09] yes, they are the same [12:09] kdepimlibs too needs bumping [12:10] lazr.restfulclient.errors.HTTPError: HTTP Error 401: Unauthorized [12:10] this python stuff [12:10] ... [12:10] going with 4.4.1a in lucid is probably best for now. in general we should probably copy from ninjas to staging except for any "a" packages and rebuild the "a" packages in staging before copying to backports [12:10] If you retry those, you can be excused for lunch then ;-) [12:10] * Lure-android need to fibd next coredev target [12:11] Lure-android: if only the pyware would allow me to [12:17] well it is broken [12:17] Lure-android: I suppose Riddell can retry [12:17] * apachelogger really must go [12:17] can do === yofel_ is now known as yofel [13:58] neversfelde: the fix for bilbo works :) [14:02] Lex79: good :) [14:02] hello [14:02] the link to the KDE SC 4.4.1 announcement is wrong here: http://www.kubuntu.org/node/135 [14:03] the correct link is http://kde.org/announcements/announce-4.4.1.php [14:12] ulysses: corrected, thank you [14:15] hi :) [14:16] * ghostcube sponsors coffee for all :) === dendrobates is now known as dendro-afk === rdieter_ is now known as rdieter [15:13] ehem.. is ubuntuone supporting kde till now or the music store ? havent seen any kde app using it only gnomi [15:13] :) === dendro-afk is now known as dendrobates [15:19] Riddell: http://www.packagekit.org/releases/PackageKit-0.5.7.tar.bz2 this includes various fix in aptcc and that update system patch that apachelogger send to me.. [15:20] *fixes [15:20] groovy [15:20] dantti: is there a full changelog? [15:21] * dantti checks [15:22] Riddell: the NEWS files inside of it only misses the two last fixes in aptcc (but the fix is there) [15:23] thanks [15:23] if you need you can add aptcc: Fix show broken packages and aptcc: Don't allow essential packages to be removed [15:27] ghostcube: no kde support [15:27] damn, is this planned so far apachelogger :) [15:28] would be nice to have this in amarok or so [15:28] that you would have to ask canonical [15:28] :| oha [15:28] then i maybe dont do it :D [15:36] Canonical were considering working on KDE integration for Ubuntu One until some community person volunteered to do it for them. [15:40] ghostcube: +1 [15:40] * Lex79 coughs [15:41] * maco2 pouts [15:41] that 4.4.1 update in kubuntu-backports? it lost contacts from kontact again [15:46] great...we now have competing touchpad interfaces [15:59] ScottK: ah thx for the info :) [16:03] shtylman: we always had :P [16:08] apachelogger: welll... I just chimed in on the kde-devel mailing list about it [16:08] cause it would be nice to get something integrated into kde 4.5 [16:08] *nod* [16:09] ghostcube: if you care about proper music store support, then you migth wanna support amarok in negotiating with amazon [16:09] amarok is negotiating with amazon? [16:10] there were plans [16:10] amazon has watermarks [16:10] ubuntuone not :| [16:10] I don't think amazon does reselling [16:10] so wouldnt it be better to join ubuntuone store than amazon [16:10] * ScottK doesn't have a problem with watermarks. [16:10] * apachelogger doesnt either [16:10] it runs against any opensource thinking in my opinion [16:10] Watermarks != DRM. [16:10] I however do have a problem with mp3 [16:10] ScottK: i know not the thing i had in mind [16:11] flac for the world [16:11] :D [16:11] or mpc [16:13] I'm on my 9.04 again, the last partial updates last night killed the X on my 10.04/amd64/4.4.1 [16:13] * apachelogger is wondering why there is an or [16:13] mpc is lossy compression [16:13] :| i know flac is loseless [16:13] my fault [16:13] s/or/and [16:13] bug in loss destection system [16:13] * apachelogger reports bug ^^ [16:13] :D [16:14] ghostcube: flac and vorbis I would go :P [16:14] hmmm ok we can go this way too wouldnt do me any harm so far :D [16:14] well [16:15] mpc is derifed from mp2 IIRC [16:15] yep [16:15] so there is no way of telling if it really does not violate patents anymore [16:15] thats true [16:15] and I for one would assume that the theoretical risk of a non-patent-derifed codes is lower [16:16] will raise if mpc would be promoted i think so [16:16] and since mpc and vorbis reach about the same quality I would say vorbis wins :P [16:16] yep if you look at it this way youre absolutely correct [16:16] is anyone of the devs on cebit ?? [16:16] well, there is no advantage to mpc anyway :P [16:17] nah i just play mpc files here so it was the first i shoot out apachelogger [16:17] :) [16:17] which means I would go for vorbis eitherway since they got xiph in the back [16:17] ghostcube: kk ^^ [16:18] how many portable music players play ogg? [16:18] 2 out of 10 [16:19] Riddell: thats another problem :) [16:19] all players by sansa now play ogg out of the box [16:19] oh cool [16:19] android does too [16:19] so we have the 2 out of 10 [16:19] :D [16:19] maemo does too [16:20] and chrome os [16:20] I suspect nokia devices will get support at some point too [16:20] with qt and all [16:20] plus with sansa, some of them like the e260 v1 firmware allow you to install rockbox on them [16:20] oi o.O [16:20] v2 is usable too :P [16:20] nokia doesn't want ogg in HTML5 [16:20] rockbox is nice i got it on my old nano [16:20] just not stable [16:20] Riddell: that is another business though [16:21] ooh, all e200 modles by sansa now run rockbox...groovy [16:21] but [16:21] I suppose if ogg became more popular due to html5 it would also increase hardware support [16:23] http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3402958&CatId=15 <- get a micro sd car for more storage and you are golden :) [16:23] * apachelogger has a htc goldcard to unbrick his magic ^^ [16:24] apachelogger: I'd say it's strongly related. if one part of nokia does the legal nonsense to approve ogg then all parts can [16:24] Riddell: do they dislike ogv for legal reasons? [16:25] then again, if alleged free software vendors do not even support ogg in their branded solutions, why would anyone... [16:25] apachelogger: yes, their lawyers haven't certified it "hidden patent free" [16:25] Nothing can be certified for that. [16:26] apachelogger: on the Ubuntu Music Store side, it's also an issue with the music industry, they approve the formats [16:26] nixternal: sansa fuse's rock anyway :) [16:26] ScottK: well, but you can certify it to imply patents and which ones, so I suppose you have a better idea of what you are getting yourself into [16:26] which makes mpeg4 less a risk I suppose [16:27] Riddell: as I understand the mp3's distributed by the UMS are neither watermarked nor DRM protected, so they could distribute it as wav and it would make no difference [16:28] anyhow [16:29] * apachelogger does not really care until someone pays him to care or reports a bug :P [16:29] on more important business... [16:29] Riddell: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/kubuntu-dev-tools/kde-l10n-common [16:29] my blueheaded flying unicorn that is :D [16:40] kde integration has been merged into the firefox 3.6 packaging branch :) [16:40] \o/ [16:40] debfx: \0/ [16:40] cant wait for it :) [16:41] I should upload kmozillahelper too [16:42] Riddell: has the usage of the firefox icon in kmozillahelper already been approved? [16:43] * apachelogger notes that you don't need to seek approval [16:43] kmozillahelper doesn't contain the firefox icon that I can see [16:43] the icon was approved and hence can be used within all packages, that is if upstream agreed though [16:45] the package contains the icon [16:46] debfx: where? [16:47] Riddell: in the .diff.gz as an xpm [16:48] mm yes [16:48] debfx: what's that used for? [16:49] Riddell: I included it in the package so the icon is displayed in the notification system settings even if firefox isn't installed [16:50] debfx: why would kmozillahelper be installed without firefox? [16:52] Riddell: how do you want to make sure that kmozillahelper is installed on kubuntu when a user installs firefox? or should it be a non-default feature? [16:53] debfx: I was expecting the firefox installer would install it [16:58] Final U/I for Quassel will be uploaded shortly. [17:00] no chance to put firefox into cd ? neither a voting ? :) [17:02] Riddell: I wouldn't expect the firefox installer to produce a different result than installing firefox from the package manager [17:04] debfx: so I still don't get why would kmozillahelper be installed without firefox? [17:04] and why does it have notifications without firefox? [17:06] it could be installed by default (if that is an option) [17:08] it doesn't display notifications without firefox, but there is an entry in the system settings [17:12] so no need to install it without firefox :) [17:12] I don't see how else we could enable the kde integration by default (e.g. dist upgrades) [17:12] debfx: Because installing firefox from the package manager gives you a generally good firefox install. I think it's reasonable to have the Kubuntu Firefox Installer provide an install that's optimized for use with Kubuntu. [17:16] man... I really wanna use kmail but it just doesn't play nice with my gmail imap [17:16] maybe I have too much email [17:16] shtylman: Did you try dimap? [17:16] IME it works a lot better than regular IMAP with Kmail. [17:16] I'm not a Gmail user though. [17:17] ScottK: not a gmail user? what are you... communist? [17:17] No. Privacy snob. [17:17] ScottK: on another note...ive never heard of dimap [17:17] how does one use it? [17:17] It's disconnected IMAP. [17:17] When you set up a new account in Kmail, it's an option. [17:17] interesting... [17:18] * shtylman looks [17:28] ok, so I'll remove the firefox icon from kmozillahelper and make it depend on firefox [17:29] debfx: where is kmozillahelper source? just curiosity.. [17:29] Lex79: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/kmozillahelper [17:29] THANKS [17:29] ops...sorry [17:32] debfx: Don't forget to entice apachelogger to changing the Firefox installer to install it too. [17:34] Riddell: just to remind you, I've still some packages in ninja to upload to Lucid archive [17:34] Lex79: oh yes sorry, getting distracted by this kdebindings on arm issue [17:35] ScottK: firefox installer is a jonathan thomas baby now, it's in c++ [17:35] Ah. Forgot that. [17:36] Thanks [17:37] https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdebase/4:4.4.1-0ubuntu1/+build/1539208 [17:37] https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdeedu/4:4.4.1-0ubuntu1/+build/1539247 [17:37] retry please.... [17:43] Lex79: done [17:45] ok [17:53] Riddell: what do i need to install for the virtuoso rdf server under lucid (or does package not yet exist) [17:54] virtuoso-nepomuk has the bits needed by KDE [17:54] Riddell: are the icon chaches stripped from the iso yet? [17:56] apachelogger: no I don't think livecd-rootfs has been uploaded, also casper needs to regerate them on install [17:56] it's on my todo, can do tomorrow [17:56] ok cool [17:56] kdebindings in the ARM ppa now, crossing fingers [17:56] though, I am wondering how the iso slipped below 690 then [18:01] NCommander ^^ === yofel_ is now known as yofel === rickspencer3_ is now known as rickspencer3 [18:25] Is 4.4.1 only partially built / in the repo ? [18:26] amd64 isn't all built [18:26] Ahh ok. [18:26] I noticed after an upgrade that some things, like konqueror, were missing ;) [18:29] Riddell: updated kmozillahelper on revu [18:30] debfx: groovy, will get to it shortly [18:47] Riddell: you got an ARM PPA? [18:49] * jussi01 goes to reboot after installing grub and uninstalling lilo... wish me luck... [18:51] NCommander: so do you [18:51] Riddell: ~ppa1 in your upload :( [18:52] oh fooey [18:52] :D [18:52] I'll re-upload without it [18:52] ok [18:53] Lex79: blogilo could u check y its always need upgrade? [18:53] even its already been upgrade..... [18:54] Lex79: eigen2, kopete-cryptography, ktorrent, plasma-widget-smooth-tasks, virtuosoconverter uploaded. is that it? [18:55] it seems so, I have to check, second [18:55] Riddell: well, I blocked some time tolook at it if it segfaults again [18:56] Riddell: yes [18:56] NCommander: it does segfault, I've disabled smoke/ruby/csharp in this upload as the workaround. a proper fix would be niver [18:56] nicer [18:56] Lex79: lovely, thanks for your packaging [18:56] Riddell: EUGH :-/ [18:56] no problem [18:56] Riddell: sorry for my delays in looking at this [18:57] ejat: that bug should be fixed [18:57] ok .. [18:57] in karmic and lucid [18:59] Man, this aptitude core dump bug is awful :/ [18:59] * apachelogger is wondering why everyone is using aptitude anyway [19:00] Cause its got a tude. [19:01] apitutde is evil [19:01] NCommander: congrats on joining kubuntu-dev btw :) [19:02] apachelogger: yup. Next stop. core dev ;-) [19:06] Riddell: any reason why this (virtuoso-nepomuk) wasn't installed on upgrade from karmic to lucid? [19:06] rgreening: not that I know of [19:07] it's a recommends of soprano-daemon, do you have that? [19:07] let me see [19:08] yip [19:11] for me soprano should depends on virtuoso-nepomuk instead of recommends, since strigi and nepomuk needs virtuoso to work and nepomuk is needed by akonadi [19:12] worth considering. my thinking was that we'd have people who want to remove it though [19:12] and you can't remove soprano-daemon [19:19] uhmm, I'm confused now :) [19:19] well I can imagine people going "I hate this resource hungry virtuoso thing, how do I remove it" [19:20] of course they can just turn off nepomuk so that probably isn't an issue [19:20] we can disable by default [19:23] strigi integration is, that's the real resource hog [19:29] Riddell: btw, I don't like that strigi indexes all directories in $HOME after Kubuntu installation, the correct behaviour should be only $Documents, $Pictures, $Download etc..I'm thinking about users/developers have KDE svn or many sources directories... [19:29] or many files in general in Home [19:32] why wouldn't they want those indexed? [19:32] if you have lots of files that's when you want searching [19:34] I personally like that it indexs all of my netbeans projects. ;) [19:34] Just wish I could actually search through them once it indexes the code. [19:36] why can't you? [19:37] I don't know, it never brings up search results for me. [19:37] in dolphin? [19:38] I thought I only needed to do alt+f2 to search ? [19:38] ditto for dolphin [19:38] E.g. I have a library I wrote - MMSMessage (MMSMessage.java) - I type in MMSMessage and MMSMessage.java and neither give me results. [19:39] debfx: kmozillahelper uploaded [19:39] It seems like a really good idea, it's just never worked for me. :) [19:39] maybe you're right Riddell, but I thought usually users wants search photos in picture folder, documents in documents etc... :) [19:40] maybe I'm too ordered :) [19:40] Lex79: other issue with those is they change depending on your locale, it's not a static string we could set in a config file [19:41] can't we use XDG? doesn't work with locale? [19:43] it means code changes rather than a config file change is what I mean, bit more fiddly [19:43] ok, I see [19:44] krunner doesn't seem to use the nepomuk index here on my lucid install [19:44] even when enabled in krunner [19:46] it works here [19:47] hmm.. my indexing failed for some reason.. time to restart [19:52] neversfelde: where's the bluetooth bug report? [19:54] Riddell: this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdebluetooth/+bug/525658 ? [19:54] Launchpad bug 525658 in kdebluetooth "new upstream bugfix release 0.4.2" [Undecided,In progress] [20:19] could someone package the other touchpad configuration tool (synaptiks) so we can figure out which one we should use? [20:34] * high-rez wonders how the 4.4.1 x86_64 is coming along.... [20:35] oh wow, rebranding [20:37] yuriy_work: yup o.O [20:37] sounds like an opportunity to come up with a logo that works in small sizes [20:37] and go back to a purple theme!?? [20:38] purple is the new brown... [20:38] unsure about that one [20:38] but it did make edgy stand out [20:46] Hmm. The purple looks good. Heck, even gnome almost looks good. [20:59] Hello. I am a CS student, a long-time KDE user, and a slightly-shorter-time Kubuntu user until recently. I am really interested in making Project Timelord happening. I am curious if there are any potential GSoC projects. === gatlin is now known as gatlinAFK [21:16] gatlinAFK: I think Canonical plans to participate in GSoC, so it's a possiblity. [21:16] Riddell: The U/I freeze version of Quassel is uploaded. It grew some new translations too. === gatlinAFK is now known as gatlin [21:26] ScottK: That's very exciting. I would love to stay tuned. I'm subscribed to the mailing list so I hope to be intimately familiar with the project [21:31] if you are interested in a very eager student, though, my email is rokenrol@gmail.com [21:31] yuriy_work: Do you know if blue is a traditional xfce color? [21:31] gatlin: Hang around and we'll put you to work. [21:31] that sounds _perfect_ [21:32] I've been wanting to get involved but I'm always either at school or my job. Both have relaxed this semester so I'm game [21:35] Riddell or apachelogger: Got something for a new minion to work on? [21:40] Riddell: What's the Kubuntu rebranding look like? Jono says you were the Kubuntu person involved? [22:00] ScottK: only complicate stuff on my todo ... though getting a FFe and updating the kontrolpack package might be an option [22:00] upadating the package should be straight forward from what I saw [22:02] ScottK: about the branding ... last thing I know was that Riddell went to meet the design team and discuss what we do, and that we defentiely want to follow the logo change to not get left behind [22:02] yuriy_work: opportunistic artwork? [22:03] we might want to do a opportunistic artwork week, maybe we can buzz around a bit [22:06] ok so ubuntu's getting a new ugly theme. we're sticking to the pretty stuff created by kde folks for themes and wallpapers and suchlike, right? [22:06] oh right, jr also mentioned that he wants to stick with KDE artwork ^^ [22:07] * apachelogger is with that a 100% [22:07] maco2: why is it ugly? [22:07] * shtylman hasn't seen it [22:09] hm [22:09] ubuntu wiki seems to be dead [22:09] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Brand [22:10] that is what you get for storing loads of pictures in a software that is written in python and even under normal load way to slow :P [22:11] shtylman: it looks like a giant bruise [22:11] * shtylman hasn't seen ihahaha [22:11] I think the windwo buttons look horrible [22:12] shtylman: or at least the wallpaper does. i didnt look that close at the gtk stuff [22:12] remind me of some of the old kde themes with strange buttons [22:12] yeah [22:13] the new canonical logo is horrible [22:13] I much preferred the simple text [22:13] the new ubuntu logo isn't bad [22:13] a friend said that it all looks like a bastard child of mac and windows limited by gtkware ^^ [22:13] the text is alright [22:13] yea [22:13] <3 my mac friends ^^ [22:13] always got the right words at hand [22:13] (also i really liked the old text. it's actually how i print when i print slowly, and has been for about 10 years) [22:14] wait canonical has a new logo too? [22:14] (hmm canonical had a logo to begin with?) [22:14] I think you can see it in the website example [22:15] that was also marked very applish btw [22:15] * Mamarok is quite happy we have everything in a beautiful blue :) [22:15] hold on [22:15] that screenshot theyve got shows a transparent tooltip on the menu [22:15] gtk can do that?? [22:15] does Gnome actually have a color? [22:16] Mamarok: i think their wallpapers tend to be greenish, but the theme itself is generally light grey with tango icons by default [22:16] and tango icons are pretty much "whatever colour that thing would be in meatspace" not "force it to be blue" (like crystal svg) [22:16] maco2: I would suppose real transparency would be controlled by clutter so technically any popup could be transparent [22:16] that is an assumption though [22:16] * apachelogger aint got a clue about them graphics magic :D [22:17] oh ewwww i do NOT like the close button on the left [22:17] maybe if i spoke arabic i'd like it and it'd make sense [22:17]