[01:03] <ArneGoetje> asac: it's fixable, and it's on my todo list.
[01:04] <ArneGoetje> pitti: let's review the list of packages for language-support later, when you come online, shall we?
[01:04] <asac> ArneGoetje: talk to ccheney and pitti
[01:04] <asac> they seem to think they can fix it in the bug i filed
[01:04] <asac> or comment there ;)
[01:04] <asac> thanks!!
[01:04] <asac> let me know if you need something
[01:04] <asac> info etc ;)
[01:05] <ArneGoetje> asac: ok
[01:06] <ArneGoetje> asac: which bug number?
[01:08] <asac> 23:46 < ubottu> Launchpad bug 532262 in openoffice.org-dictionaries "openoffice gets installed when adding a language in language-selector" [High,Triaged]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/532262
[01:08] <asac> ArneGoetje: ^^
[01:14] <ArneGoetje> asac: thanks
[03:50] <Sarvatt> does UNE call glxinfo to determine if it should run in 2D or 3D mode? I remember someone asking about ways to determine which was in use in #ubuntu-x a month or two ago about that. mesa-utils is now in universe for some reason (making GL compositing not work on the kubuntu livecd also)
[03:57] <Sarvatt> hmm yeah, netbook-launcher doesn't depend on mesa-utils but netbook-launcher/nl-config.c is calling glxinfo
[04:13] <RAOF> Cool.  Both save & save as now work.
[04:13] <RAOF> And undo is a matter of hooking up an appropriate button.
[04:13] <RAOF> And checking that memory consumption doesn't fly to Mars with large images.
[04:15] <Sarvatt> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/netbook-launcher/+bug/532405
[04:18] <RAOF> That aubergine really is a soothing colour for the terminal background.
[04:19] <Sarvatt> being forced to that new profile didn't make me happy, i lost a 2 hour long build log because i didnt notice it forced me into a new profile with a 512 line scrollback :)
[04:19] <RAOF> ...!
[04:19] <Sarvatt> looked exactly the same as my old setup at low screen brightness
[04:19] <RAOF> Thanks for the heads up!
[04:20]  * RAOF checks the new “unlimited” button.
[05:00] <RAOF> Yup, there it is.  Memory usage FTW!
[05:05] <robert_ancell> RAOF, oh, I hadn't noticed the unlimited button.  I've been wanting that for so long :)
[05:06] <RAOF> robert_ancell: It's clearly the correct behaviour, too.
[05:11] <RAOF> f-spot is now an excellent way of evicting unused pages from RAM.
[05:13] <crimsun> better than tmpfs mounted /var/cache/pbuilder/build/ and g++?
[05:13] <RAOF> Not quite as good as that.
[05:35] <RAOF> f-spot would be easier to hack on if random pieces of code didn't call Dispose() on perfectly good pixmaps.
[06:01] <kayve> anybody have an idea how to help me install libdap for Matlab I have on my Ubuntu?
[06:02] <RAOF> kayve: By joining #ubuntu and asking there?  Or checking on ubuntuforums.org?
[06:04] <kayve> nobody listens on #ubuntu
[06:04] <kayve> ever.
[06:05] <RAOF> Hm.  It'd make sense for Undo to be a button on the Edit sidebar, wouldn't it.
[06:06] <kayve> ubuntuforums.org is a total desolate wasteland for my question
[06:06] <RAOF> Are there Matlab-specific forums you could investigate?
[06:22] <kayve> RAOF: u is a real WISE guy.. a WISE guy
[06:55]  * RAOF has visions of smart undo/redo managers, with memory-limits pushing old data out to disc and pulling it back in as needed...
[06:55] <RAOF> Warning: Architecture abstronaught boarding the shuttle!
[07:27] <didrocks> good morning
[07:28] <RAOF> didrocks: Good morning.
[07:29] <didrocks> hey RAOF, how was your day?
[07:29] <RAOF> Pretty good.
[07:29] <RAOF> Well, frustrating at times.
[07:29] <didrocks> oh?
[07:30] <RAOF> The f-spot code has a habit of Dispose()ing Pixbufs in strange places.
[07:30] <RAOF> But I got 3 f-spot work items this morning, and am pretty much done on the 2nd now.
[07:30] <didrocks> argh, so it doesn't make your edit/undo code like easier :)
[07:30] <didrocks> sweet!
[07:30] <didrocks> life*
[07:31] <RAOF> Right.
[07:32] <didrocks> well, you have to assume to be the Mono rockstar there :)
[07:33] <RAOF> So now the undo passes copies around, and everything is groovy.  And just needs to be hooked up to a button!
[07:34]  * didrocks hugs RAOF for his good work
[07:34] <didrocks> and the memory consumption isn't too scary?
[07:34]  * RAOF hugs didrocks for being awesome.
[07:34] <RAOF> Ahem.
[07:34] <RAOF> Weeeeeell...
[07:34] <RAOF> :)
[07:34] <didrocks> ok :-)
[07:34] <RAOF> Currently memory consumption is scary.
[07:35] <RAOF> It's obvious how to deal with that, though, and the undo API won't need any changes to make it file-backed rather than memory-backed.
[07:35] <RAOF> (Or, indeed, to make it a mixture of memory-backed & file-backed, depending on mem-usage and undo length).
[07:36] <didrocks> do you know how gimp do for that? It just eats memory IIRC
[07:36] <RAOF> The gimp's much smarter than I am, I think; I'm pretty sure it's tile-based and will only copy the changed tiles & such.
[07:37] <RAOF> Also, the gimp doesn't have to store a pixmap for each operation, it can just store the operation.
[07:37] <didrocks> oh ok. That's because my gf uses more than 3000x2500 px images than  it's just scary :)
[07:38] <didrocks> but a file backend in /tmp sounds good for f-spot :)
[07:38] <RAOF> Ideally that's what I'd be doing here, too, but it'd need a bit of a re-architecturing before that'd work - f-spot is all about passing pixmaps around.
[07:38] <RAOF> Yeah.
[07:38] <didrocks> oh sweet if you can do that! But that's more intrusive :)
[07:39] <RAOF> I'm not going to attempt it.
[07:39] <RAOF> It's not the sort of patch I'd be pushing a couple of days away from beta freeze :)
[07:40] <didrocks> no, after release candidate is fine :)
[07:40] <didrocks> I guess storing pixmaps as a first approach is good, especially for an LTS
[07:42] <RAOF> Yeah.
[07:44] <RAOF> Woot!  One working undo button!
[07:44] <didrocks> \o/
[07:45] <pitti> Good morning
[07:45] <didrocks> oh, the edit button is already translated in French
[07:45] <didrocks> good morning pitti, how are you?
[07:45] <RAOF> And with that, I'm out for dinner with my beautiful wife.  Have a good day!
[07:45] <pitti> bonjour didrocks
[07:45] <pitti> much better, a good night's sleep helped a lot :)
[07:45] <pitti> how are you guys?
[07:45] <pitti> RAOF: bye!
[07:45] <didrocks> RAOF: enjoy your dinner and your week-end, too!
[07:46] <didrocks> pitti: same here :-)
[08:11] <pitti> hmm, it's snowing like mad
[08:11] <pitti> I thought winter was finally over..
[08:12] <didrocks> oh really? it's nice and sunny there
[08:37] <seb128> good morning there
[08:38] <pitti> bonjour seb128
[08:38] <seb128> hey pitti!
[08:38] <pitti> seb128: do you still remember what the requirements for the gdm cursor are?
[08:39] <pitti> seb128: hide it from X start until gdm is ready, that much I know
[08:39] <seb128> requirements?
[08:39] <seb128> hide it
[08:39] <pitti> seb128: but also from "press login" to "session is ready"?
[08:39]  * pitti would like to keep that one, but isn't sure
[08:39] <seb128> I think sabdfl would like no spinning cursor at all on login
[08:39] <didrocks> hey seb128
[08:39] <pitti> seb128: ok, I'll see what I can do
[08:39] <pitti> looks rather easy to do
[08:39] <seb128> especially in the autologin case
[08:40] <seb128> no need to have a cursor on an empty screen
[08:40] <seb128> we want it to be displayed when the desktop is loaded
[08:40] <pitti> ack
[08:40] <seb128> lut didrocks
[08:40] <seb128> how lucid looks for everybody?
[08:40]  * seb128 did several rounds of updates and fixing until late and hope theming is ok
[08:40] <pitti> shiny!
[08:40] <didrocks> seb128: look awesome. I like the new defaults (and new g-t color)
[08:41] <pitti> I still need to restart my session to get the full love
[08:41] <seb128> good ;-)
[08:41] <seb128> pitti, I screwed the gdm bzr btw
[08:41] <pitti> oh, how?
[08:41] <seb128> you didn't push your 0ubuntu5
[08:41] <seb128> so I did debcommit and tag my 0ubuntu5
[08:41] <seb128> got the uploaded bounced back
[08:41] <pitti> argh, I'm so sorry
[08:42] <seb128> so I had to merge your changes, do mines again and push that as 0ubuntu6
[08:42] <seb128> so 0ubuntu5 tag is not what it should
[08:42] <seb128> but I'm not sure how to fix that afterward
[08:42] <seb128> pitti, np
[08:42] <seb128> it was just starting be late and I'm not sure how much we care about tags being right
[08:42] <seb128> just letting you know they are wrong for this upload
[08:43] <pitti> right, thanks
[08:45] <mvo> seb128: I think you can untag/override tags
[08:45] <seb128> mvo, I tried deleted one and failed
[08:45] <pitti> yes, but the last two uploads are all in one commit now
[08:45] <pitti> nevermind
[08:45] <mvo> seb128: bzr tag ---force does not work?
[08:45] <pitti> bzr tag --remove <tag>, and then retag
[08:45] <seb128> mvo, I get warnings about duplicate tags when I tag again
[08:45] <seb128> pitti, that remove it locally but not online
[08:45] <pitti> but you'd need separate commits for ubuntu5 and ubuntu6 for that
[08:46] <pitti> seb128: for that you need to push --overwrite
[08:46] <seb128> when you push it complains about duplicate tag still
[08:46] <seb128> ah, that might be it
[08:46] <seb128> pitti, well either we let it this way
[08:46] <pitti> seb128: just leave it, it's not a biggie
[08:46] <seb128> or we uncommit my change, push yours and then I do the bzr update again
[08:46] <seb128> ok, good
[08:47]  * pitti cdbs-edit-patch debian/patches/32-hide-mouse-cursor.patch
[08:47] <seb128> where? gdm?
[08:47] <seb128> or xorg?
[08:47] <pitti> yes
[08:47]  * seb128 curious
[08:47] <pitti> xorg is fine
[08:48] <pitti> it already starts with an invisible mouse cursor
[08:48] <pitti> so the --enable-null-root-cursor option is obsolete
[08:48] <pitti> it was also removed entirely in git head
[08:48] <pitti> so we just need to stop gdm from displaying the busy one
[08:48] <seb128> there is a patch on launchpad for that IIRC
[08:48] <pitti> and remove it again after you press the login button
[08:48] <seb128> or hack rather
[08:49] <seb128> let me look
[08:49] <seb128> dx guys did one where they commented some gtk calls previous cycle
[08:50] <pitti> it looks rather easy to do anyway
[08:50] <pitti> I didn't see a bug about it
[08:50] <pitti> seb128: btw, is it intended to have a kind of frame around the close/minimize buttons?
[08:50] <pitti> looks a bit weird
[08:50] <pitti> the color shading is opposite to the main window title bar there
[08:51] <pitti> it looks like a drawing error to me
[08:51] <pitti> ARGH ARGH!
[08:51] <seb128> I'm not sure
[08:51] <seb128> pitti, what?
[08:51] <pitti> wo set white text on violet background by default in the terminal?
[08:51]  * pitti sighs
[08:51] <seb128> sabdfl
[08:52] <seb128> he's the one who sent the settings to use for that one
[08:52] <pitti> well, I guess only in the dark theme anyway
[08:52] <pitti> seb128: in g-appearance-props, my theme is now set to "custom"; is that just local configuration?
[08:53] <seb128> pitti, what ubuntu-artwork version do you have?
[08:53] <pitti> both Ambiance and Radiacne look different
[08:53] <seb128> ambiance is dark, radiance is light
[08:54] <pitti> right, but the "custom" one (which I got after upgrade) has slightly different colors than ambiance
[08:54] <pitti> seb128: 53.1
[08:54] <seb128> weird
[08:54] <seb128> do you get it in a guest session too?
[08:54] <seb128> can't find the gdm patch from previous cycle
[08:55] <pitti> seb128: don't worry about gdm, it's really not rocket science so far
[08:56] <seb128> ok
[08:56]  * seb128 away a few minutes to get coffee
[08:56] <pitti> so, need to dist-upgrade my laptop still - this morning it wanted to remove empathy, so I just upgraded
[08:56] <pitti> ah, it's there now
[08:56] <seb128> pitti, wfm in a guest session
[08:57] <pitti> seb128: ok, I blame local configuration then; so it's intended that ambiance is the default?
[09:03] <seb128> pitti, yes
[09:03] <seb128> I use radiance there
[09:03] <pitti> hm, terminal doesn't use the system theme by default, so it's white-on-black for the bright theme as well
[09:04] <seb128> right, design said there was no need to make 2 themes there
[09:04] <seb128> only one with the current settings
[09:04] <pitti> but that means that the terminal defaults to white-on-black in any theme..
[09:04] <seb128> don't tell me
[09:04] <pitti> well, I'll file a bug
[09:04] <pitti> this is WRONG
[09:05] <seb128> if you ask me we should fiddle with command line themes at all
[09:05] <seb128> shouldn't
[09:05] <seb128> it's tricky anyway
[09:05] <seb128> those don't get set by GNOME themes in the appareance capplet
[09:05] <seb128> so you can't get them changed by switching GNOME themes
[09:06] <pitti> seb128: hm, I removed my entire ~/.gconf/ (on the mini), rebooted, and it still says "custom"; hmm
[09:06] <seb128> pitti, so
[09:06] <seb128> can you get me the gconf key for mouse cursor, gtk, wm themes
[09:07] <seb128> pitti, look to /usr/share/gconf/defaults/16_ubuntu-artwork
[09:07] <seb128> for the key names
[09:07] <seb128> and gconftool --get the one I listed
[09:08] <seb128> those are the first 3 in the gconf-default
[09:08] <seb128> or rather 1 to 5
[09:09] <pitti> gtk_theme: Dust
[09:09] <pitti> icon_theme: Humanity-Dark
[09:09] <seb128> urg
[09:10] <seb128> that's not coming from the packaging for sure
[09:10] <seb128> grep Dust /usr/share/gconf/defaults/*
[09:10] <seb128> grep Dust .gconf/* -r
[09:11] <pitti> seb128: ok, local b0rkage, nevermind
[09:11] <seb128> ok
[09:11] <seb128> good ;-)
[09:11] <seb128> I've confirmed it's ok on my mini
[09:12] <seb128> which has an alpha3 untouched installed
[09:12] <seb128> install
[09:23] <didrocks> hum, maybe netbook-launcher should use the Ambiance theme
[09:24] <didrocks> that doesn't break UI freeze?
[09:25] <seb128> what ui freeze?
[09:25] <seb128> ui freeze was yesterday and the theme uploaded yesterday
[09:26] <didrocks> seb128: right, but I'm talking about changing the default theme for netbook-launcher session…
[09:28] <pitti> urgh
[09:28] <pitti> seb128: did the new theme do anything to force new settings over existing terminal gconf keys?
[09:28] <pitti> seb128: I previously had no menu bar, no scrollbar, and a different font
[09:28] <pitti> (and different colors0
[09:28] <pitti> )
[09:28] <pitti> it's all messed up now
[09:28] <seb128> pitti, ask chrisccoulson when he joins
[09:29] <pitti> ok
[09:29] <seb128> he did all the g-t changes
[09:29] <seb128> he said he took care of having the new profile applied on upgrade
[09:29] <seb128> that might be a sideeffect
[09:30] <pitti> seb128: so that's in gnome-terminal itself? just want to know where to file the bug against
[09:31] <Laney> yeah mine was changed to Ambience too
[09:31] <seb128> pitti, yes
[09:31] <pitti> I flipped it back to "default", and it's back to normal
[09:31] <seb128> "legacy"?
[09:31] <pitti> or that
[09:31] <pitti> "Vorgabe" :)
[09:31] <pitti> which doesn't mean "legacy", but "default"
[09:33] <seb128> ok
[09:40] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[09:40] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson!
[09:40] <seb128> how are you?
[09:40] <chrisccoulson> yeah, good thanks. how are you?
[09:41] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson
[09:41] <chrisccoulson> hey pitti, how are you?
[09:41] <pitti> Laney: please feel free to confirm bug 532511
[09:41] <pitti> chrisccoulson: you destroyed my terminals!
[09:41] <pitti> chrisccoulson: I'm great, thanks! how are you?
[09:41] <chrisccoulson> pitti - what happened?
[09:41] <pitti> chrisccoulson: bug 532511
[09:42] <chrisccoulson> looking now
[09:43] <didrocks> good morning chrisccoulson
[09:43] <chrisccoulson> hey didrocks
[09:48] <pitti> chrisccoulson: I attached my original gconf settings now
[09:49] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm confused slightly. those gconf settings are post-upgrade aren't they?
[09:49] <pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, they are
[09:49] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: you changed the default theme gconf key and as most of user change in the default profile and don't create a new one…
[09:49] <pitti> right
[09:49] <chrisccoulson> it hasn't migrated you to the new profile according to the settings (it's only merged in the new system profile, so that it appears in your profile list)
[09:50] <pitti> chrisccoulson: I think what happened is
[09:50] <pitti> 1) I have changed the default profile, since that's what "profile settings..." does
[09:50] <pitti> 2) Default was changd to Legacy
[09:50] <pitti> 3) the new default theme is "Ambience"
[09:50] <chrisccoulson> didrocks - that was intentional as the request was that people would see the new settings on upgrade
[09:50] <pitti> so it would have totally ignored my settings in "Default"
[09:50] <pitti> chrisccoulson: but that doesn't work at all with customizations
[09:51] <pitti> black on black text is bad..
[09:51] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i only changed the visible UI string from Default to Legacy - the actual (previously default) theme is actually still called "Default" really
[09:51] <chrisccoulson> i'll try upgrading a few times this morning and see if i can trigger that too
[09:52] <Laney> I saw it too, btw
[09:52] <Laney> upgrade, restart g-t, got new theme
[09:52] <pitti> chrisccoulson: but it apparently didn't use the settings in /apps/gnome-terminal/profiles/Default
[09:52] <Laney> I had just modified some colours of the default theme
[09:52] <pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, I have an idea
[09:52] <pitti> chrisccoulson: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/40235420/gnome-terminal.gconf-original.xml
[09:53] <pitti> chrisccoulson: my gconf tree only has changes for "Default"
[09:53] <pitti> chrisccoulson: but it doesn't have a custom gconf key for /apps/gnome-terminal/global/default_profile
[09:53] <pitti> so I assume I got that from the schema
[09:54] <pitti> it wouldn't be so bad if the upgrade wouldn't have disabled "use colors from system theme"
[09:54] <pitti> now terminal is white-on-black in all themes, even the light ones
[10:08] <kayve> CURSEs.. foiled again
[10:11]  * seb128 is away for a bit
[10:11] <mvo> mpt: good morning. i need a error message (in addition to "not connected to the internet") for the ratings&reviews submission when the server is not availalbe (or in read only mode). I except this will happen quite a bit when the server is launched. something like "Sorry, the server is not ready, please try again later." (well, text and place)
[10:13] <didrocks> any idea against which package this bug can be opened against (see video): https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/netbook-launcher/+bug/531997/comments/5 ?
[10:23] <mpt> mvo, the spec has "Couldn’t connect to the review service." Is that ok?
[10:27] <mvo> mpt: sure, that is fine. sorry, seems like I have overlooked that. anything like "please try again later" or is that obvious anyway?
[10:29] <mpt> mvo, good point. We have limited room there, though. How about "Sorry, couldn’t connect. Try again later." ?
[10:30] <tseliot> pitti: does jockey remove the nvidia packages when you disable nvidia? Or does it only disable the driver?
[10:30] <pitti> tseliot: it removes the package
[10:30] <mpt> mvo, if so, that case we could use the same string for sign-on errors as for review submission errors
[10:31] <mvo> mpt: fine as well. limitied space is a problem indeed, maybe we could move it to a different place or something? I suppose some languages will make it long.
[10:31] <tseliot> pitti: can't we just make it switch to the free driver?
[10:31] <pitti> tseliot: since it overwrote libGL (before the alternatives setup), and we also want to untaint the kernel by removing the module
[10:31] <pitti> tseliot: I guess with the alternatives setup we could just switch
[10:31] <pitti> tseliot: but then you woulnd't have a GUI way to actually uninstall it
[10:31] <tseliot> pitti: right as nouveau would prevent nvidia from loading
[10:31] <pitti> but I don't mind either way
[10:31] <pitti> whichever you like better
[10:32] <mpt> mvo, how about we move it above the Cancel/Publish buttons? (But still left aligned.) So if there's an error the window lengthens a bit.
[10:32] <tseliot> pitti: synaptic or software center should allow you to remove the driver
[10:32] <mvo> mpt: I wonder if we should show something more verbose while the server is in beta mode so that users do not get put off, I'm not sure that this makes sense though
[10:32] <pitti> yes
[10:32] <mpt> mvo, then we could make it more verbose
[10:32] <mvo> mpt: good idea, I can do that can send you a screenshot?
[10:32] <mpt> mvo, sure
[10:33] <mvo> mpt: the window should not resize, right. when its hidden there is just blank space?
[10:33] <tseliot> pitti: is there anything that needs to be overridden in the nvidia handler to do this?
[10:33]  * pitti checks
[10:34] <didrocks> seb128: when you will be back: (cf upper): any idea against which package this bug can be opened against this comment: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/netbook-launcher/+bug/531997/comments/5 (the video show, even in gnome session, all flickering: gnome panel, nautilus…). That's stop when opening a menu. xorg, maybe?
[10:35] <pitti> tseliot: hm, uninstalling the package is pretty deeply woven into the basic Handler
[10:35] <pitti> tseliot: so far we assumed that you want to completely get rid of it to avoid side effects from leftover files
[10:35] <pitti> tseliot: you could hack around it by temporarily unsetting self.package in nvidia.py's disable()
[10:35] <tseliot> pitti: right, that used to be the case
[10:36] <pitti> tseliot: this was originally written with this "freedom" idea in mind, thus removing a driver should purge the evil^Wnonfree bits from the computer
[10:36] <tseliot> pitti: ah, I think I'll have to do that we I reenable fglrx too
[10:36] <tseliot> hehe
[10:37] <mpt> mvo, I was suggesting that it should resize
[10:38] <mpt> mvo, it would be a jump in 2.0, but in Lucid+1 it would slide smoothly
[10:39] <mvo> mpt: ok, fine with me. so just error there or connection label as well?
[10:39] <mvo> http://people.canonical.com/~mvo/tmp/Screenshot-Review%202vcard.png
[10:45] <mpt> mvo, just errors -- "Submitting review…" shouldn't make it resize.
[10:48] <mvo> mpt: yep
[10:49] <mpt> mvo, and remember the mini error icon at the leading end
[10:49] <mvo> mpt: ok, thanks.
[10:51] <mpt> mvo, also the border around the review field. ;-)
[10:51] <mpt> (ok, I'll stop now)
[10:52] <mvo> mpt: border?
[10:52] <mvo> mpt: oh, I think thats a iside effect of it being "sensitive(False)"
[10:53] <mpt> mvo, for some reason in Glade, text fields are missing their border by default, so you need to add it. It should obviously be there even when insensitive.
[10:53] <mvo> mpt: *cough* how are your glade skills doing ;) *cough*
[10:53] <mpt> mvo, I have card sorting sessions for the next 4.5 hours, but if it can wait until after that, sure. :-)
[10:54] <mvo> mpt: no worries, I can fix it now
[10:54] <mvo> mpt: but for stuff that looks incorrect, just jump in and fix it in the glade file, I will merge then
[10:55] <mvo> mpt: +4.5h? woah!
[10:55] <mpt> ok, will do
[10:55] <mvo> mpt: what kind of border do you need exactly? shadow_type?
[10:56] <mvo> or a explicit gtk.Frame?
[10:57] <mpt> mvo, 1/2 hour preparation, 1 hour session, 1/2 hour data collection, lunch, 1 hour session, 1/2 hour data collection
[10:58]  * mvo nods
[11:02] <mpt> mvo, sorry, I asked bratsche and he didn't know. I know it's been fixed before in other applications.
[11:03] <mpt> mvo, e.g. the Gnome Dictionary does it.
[11:04] <mpt> I can't find it in Glade.
[11:07] <mpt> mvo, separate topic, I don't know why the categories branch is showing up as conflicting, I just merged trunk and there were no conflicts
[11:07] <mpt> I committed the merge
[11:14] <chrisccoulson> i'm completely confused by this terminal issue now
[11:18] <pitti> asac, chrisccoulson: do you have an opinion about network-manager-pptp?
[11:22] <asac> pitti: yes, MIR
[11:23] <asac> on CD
[11:23] <asac> its essential for 80% of russian DSL users
[11:23] <pitti> asac: I mean, do you know if it's good, or crap, or didn't you use it so far?
[11:23] <asac> we shouldnt forget to do it
[11:23] <asac> pitti: its one of the things i actually use from time to time ;)
[11:23] <pitti> it looks pretty okay to me, but I haven't ever used it
[11:23] <asac> should be fine
[11:23] <pitti> ok, thanks
[11:24] <asac> pitti: do you need it for private?
[11:24] <pitti> asac: no, just looking at the MIR
[11:24] <asac> aah
[11:24] <asac> yes. the main problem was that in the past the vpn plugins werent really maintained as first class citizen upstream
[11:24] <asac> but that has changed now in 0.8
[11:25] <asac> e.g. they were released together with nm/nma
[11:37] <robert_ancell> pitti, ok to upload simple-scan 0.9.6?
[11:37] <mpt> robert_ancell, do you have "Scanning" Category in its .desktop file?
[11:38] <mpt> robert_ancell, ah, nm, I see it does
[11:38] <robert_ancell> mpt, no, way to spoil my release candidate :)
[11:38] <robert_ancell> mpt, oh good. it does :)
[11:44] <chrisccoulson> pitti - so, i'm not too sure how to get around this terminal issue. gnome-terminal seems to write user-specific gconf keys for the colour settings even if you don't change them
[11:45] <chrisccoulson> so, if i just change the default colour settings in the "Default" profile, then only new users get the new colours, and no upgrader will see them
[11:45] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: same issue than with gnome-panel, welcome :)
[11:45] <chrisccoulson> which is why I created a whole new profile
[11:46] <chrisccoulson> and then the patch I wrote ensures the new profile is merged in to the users list of available profiles
[11:55] <pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, I was going to suggest to just change the default gconf keys
[11:55] <pitti> so that customizations don't get lost
[11:55] <pitti> creating a new profile and forcing upgraders to it will always cause trouble like that
[11:55] <pitti> chrisccoulson: and if a user customized his settings, we should respect that IMHO
[11:56] <pitti> chrisccoulson: and for the default case the new schema values should take over, shouldn't they?
[11:56] <pitti> chrisccoulson: "write user-specific gconf keys for the colour settings even if you don't change them" -> shouldn't we fix that instead?
[11:56] <chrisccoulson> pitti - well, that's the issue. gnome-terminal seems to write user-specific keys even if you don't change any settings
[11:56] <chrisccoulson> i'll have a look and see if i can make it work anyway
[11:56] <pitti> chrisccoulson: with fixing that, and changing your patch to unset keys which are equal to the default value (for fixing upgrades) we might get much closer to where we want to be?
[11:57] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i think so
[11:59] <robert_ancell> pitti, ok to upload ^^^ ?
[11:59] <pitti> robert_ancell: oh, hello; unusual time for you :)
[11:59] <pitti> robert_ancell: what does it change?
[12:00] <robert_ancell> pitti, just bug fixes.  It's the 1.0 release candidate
[12:00] <pitti> robert_ancell: bug fixes are alright, UI changes and new features need exceptions now
[12:00] <seb128> re
[12:00] <seb128> didrocks, what was the question?
[12:00] <seb128> I don't fancy reading all the backlog
[12:00] <pitti> robert_ancell: bug fix only is fine, we don't have a "bug fix freeze"
[12:00] <seb128> robert_ancell, hey
[12:00]  * pitti -> lunch
[12:01] <robert_ancell> pitti, I think I have to ask because it's a new upstream version right?  If it was Ubuntu patches it wouldn't need permission
[12:01] <robert_ancell> seb128, hey
[12:01] <didrocks> seb128: no pb. It was just "do you have any idea against which package the bug should be reported": the user (on the video) have a flickering screen (gnome-panel and nautilus for instance). It stops when clicking on a menu
[12:02] <seb128> didrocks, xorg? ;-)
[12:02] <seb128> didrocks, no real clue otherwise no
[12:02] <didrocks> well, I would have said that too, let's choose it :)
[12:02] <didrocks> thanks
[12:02] <tjaalton> which bug?
[12:03] <tjaalton> er, feature
[12:04] <didrocks> tjaalton: the feature is that one: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/netbook-launcher/+bug/531997/comments/5 there is even a nice video :)
[12:04] <didrocks> I just find the story not really funny ^^
[12:07] <tjaalton> huh, weird
[12:07] <tjaalton> probably file it against xserver-xorg-video-intel then
[12:11] <didrocks> tjaalton: ok, I'll advise him that. thanks :)
[12:11] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: FYI, I've pushed a slight change in g-t, you probably want to grab the package again
[12:20] <rickspencer3> good morning
[12:20] <rickspencer3> has the new theme melted the world yet?
[12:21] <seb128> hey rickspencer3
[12:21] <rickspencer3> hi seb128
[12:21]  * ogra heard a good bunch of complaints about the button ordering
[12:21] <ogra> apart from that only positive stuff :)
[12:21] <seb128> rickspencer3, not yet, a few bugs but mostly good
[12:22] <pitti> hey rickspencer3
[12:22] <rickspencer3> hi pitti
[12:23] <pitti> rickspencer3: terminals are messed up, and button order is weird, otherwise it seems to have landed well
[12:23] <rickspencer3> terminals are "messed up"?
[12:23] <seb128> rickspencer3, he doesn't like the sabdfl theme :p
[12:23] <seb128> (+some minor upgrade bugs resetting your settings for it)
[12:24] <pitti> rickspencer3: well, on upgrade it resets all your configurations and I got black text on black background :)
[12:24] <seb128> pitti, you did?
[12:24] <pitti> (yes, I don't like black themes, but I don't mind switching to it on upgrade if there are no user settings)
[12:24] <pitti> seb128: yes
[12:24] <seb128> I got that on none of my box and that's not what the new theme should have
[12:24] <pitti> seb128: that's what $PS1 says :)
[12:25] <seb128> I get white text and some transparency
[12:28]  * ogra got white text on violet transparent Bg ... a scrollbar and a manubar 
[12:28] <ogra> *menu
[12:29] <ogra> i had selected white on black, no scrollbar no menubar before
[12:29] <seb128> right, the color as the right ones
[12:30] <seb128> it should probably not touch your other settings though
[12:30] <ogra> it shouldnt touch my color setting either :)
[12:31] <ogra> it was set to user-defined .... because i turned the white text a bit grey
[12:31] <rickspencer3_> seb128, I presume this terminal problem is a bug?
[12:31] <seb128> yes
[12:31]  * rickspencer3_ still has 2 minutes of downloading
[12:32]  * seb128 is away some minutes
[12:32] <pitti> rickspencer3_: bug 532511
[12:32]  * pitti -> lunch for real now
[12:32] <rickspencer3_> bye pitti
[12:32] <pitti> hm, where did network-manager go?
[12:32] <pitti> hm, it's running
[12:33] <pitti> oh noes -- they made the icon really incomprehensible
[12:33] <pitti> two arrows?!?
[12:33]  * ogra does have a funnel, not two arrows
[12:33] <pitti> how is that supposed to connote a network?
[12:33] <ogra> are you connected wired ?
[12:33] <pitti> that's ethernet, yes
[12:33] <pitti> and for you?
[12:33] <ogra> ah
[12:34] <ogra> its like a funnel with arcs showing the link quality
[12:35] <pitti> ah, wifi
[12:35] <ogra> yeah
[12:35] <pitti> ok, lunch attempt the 3rd, for really real now :)
[12:35] <ogra> heh
[12:37] <huats> hello eveyrone !
[12:48] <james_w> dobey: are these new u1 packages bugfix only?
[13:00] <seb128> rickspencer3_, having internet issues?
[13:02] <rickspencer3_> seb128, sort of
[13:02] <rickspencer3_> switching between different connections
[13:02] <rickspencer3_> it works, but not for xchat
[13:02] <rickspencer3_> I find I have to reconnect when I change interfaces :(
[13:03] <seb128> it usually works for me if I'm quick enough
[13:04] <rickspencer3_> seb128, heh
[13:10] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i've got an updated package for bug 352118 (just cherry-picking a patch from upstream git), if you feel like doing any sponsoring ;)
[13:35] <pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, sure; thanks!
[13:36] <pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, I seem to remember that we could sync the package
[13:36] <pitti> chrisccoulson: anyway, where is it? should I apply/upload http://launchpadlibrarian.net/28178677/wpa-supplicant.patch ?
[13:36] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i had a look at the changes, and thought it might be best to sync next cycle
[13:37] <chrisccoulson> one second, i'll attach the patch to the bug report
[13:39] <dpm> ccheney, the Latvian translator building OO.o we've been talking about is asking: <pecisk> dpm: what is debinan/l10n/ooo-guide-* files? We can't find how to map them with actual OO.o source, do you think you could tell him a bit more about this?
[13:40] <chrisccoulson> pitti - attached
[13:41] <pitti> chrisccoulson: uploaded; thanks!
[13:57] <seb128> bah, can't try pitti's gdm cursor change
[13:57]  * seb128 grrr at plymouth sending him on a text vt at boot
[13:57] <pitti> :(
[13:58] <seb128> pitti, I'm sure it works don't worry ;-)
[13:58] <pitti> seb128: it's not perfect yet, at some (early) point gnome-session etc. takes over and shows the normal arrow again
[13:58] <pitti> but it at least gets rid of the initial part from plymouhth to gdm
[14:06] <Nafai> Good morning
[14:07] <pitti> hey Nafai, how are you?
[14:07] <Nafai> Doing well.
[14:07] <seb128> hey Nafa
[14:07] <seb128> hey Nafai
[14:08] <Nafai> I haven't had that weird X clients error since I removed the LastPass Chrome extension
[14:08] <pitti> aah
[14:10] <dobey> james_w: not exactly. it's the release for ui freeze, but I had to upload it yesterday morning, because the ui freeze deadline was in the middle of when LP was down for 2.5 hours wed. night
[14:10] <james_w> dobey: do you have an exception?
[14:11] <james_w> are there new features, or just bug fixes that require interface changes?
[14:12] <dobey> an exception for UI freeze? no, there are other things we'll be asking exceptions for that we want to get in next week though. it's mostly bug fixes, and UI changes for features that were already in
[14:13] <james_w> ok
[14:13] <james_w> not storage-protocol I assume?
[14:13] <dobey> protocol is just bug fixes
[14:14] <james_w> ok, I'll upload that, and can you speak to the release team about the UI changes?
[14:15] <dobey> we have to get an exception just because LP was down and thus made it impossible to actually do a release when I was ready to?
[14:15] <james_w> I asked you to speak to them?
[14:16] <james_w> I can't grant you a freeze exception, and so I can't tell you whether you need one or not.
[14:16] <dobey> ok
[14:16] <james_w> W: ubuntuone-storage-protocol source: obsolete-relation-form-in-source in source build-depends-indep: protobuf-compiler (> 2.0.3-0ubuntu1)
[14:16] <james_w> W: ubuntuone-storage-protocol source: build-depends-on-python-dev-with-no-arch-any
[14:17] <james_w> could you fix the first one of those warnings in your storage-protocol branch?
[14:17] <james_w> and is there a reason to override the second warning, or is it pointing out and oversight?
[14:18] <dobey> i don't know what it means? is that something that changed in lucid?
[14:18] <dobey> i don't recall seeing it before
[14:19] <james_w> you can use lintian-info -t obsolete-relation-form-in-source to get more information
[14:20] <james_w> I'm going to grab some dinner, I'm happy to help you further when I return if you need it
[14:22] <pitti> asac: do you think there'll be a solution for bug 512615, or do we just have to live with it? (it's not the end of the world, after all)
[14:22] <pitti> chrisccoulson: ^ FYI
[14:24] <dobey> james_w: fixed/pushed in that branch
[14:25] <asac> pitti: there are two regressions:
[14:25] <asac> a) upstream cairo lacks a patch they refuse to take for 2 years at least ... but which we ship
[14:25] <james_w> thanks dobey
[14:25] <asac> lcd patch
[14:26] <james_w> dobey: let me know what the release team say and I'll upload as soon as they are happy with it
[14:26] <asac> b) the gtk font settings are parsed by the system cairo, but then NULLED out in the in-source cairo, so firefox uses whatever fontconfig says
[14:26] <asac> for a) we could use a patch
[14:26] <asac> but i would prefer not to, because upstrema explicitly rejected it multiple times
[14:27] <asac> fr b) serious debugging is required
[14:27] <pitti> asac: right, I think I understand the problem; so it doesn't look like this would be fixed anytime soon, right?
[14:27] <asac> we should try to escalate it upstream ... let me ask reed if he thinks it would help for this one to nominate it as a release blockewr
[14:28] <asac> stay tuned
[14:28]  * asac has another call now
[14:29] <pitti> asac: thanks for the reads-up!
[14:29] <dobey> why is there no ReleaseTeam wiki page
[14:30] <pitti> dobey: what do you need to know? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess is probably most interesting in these days
[14:31] <dobey> i need to know where to send an e-mail to ask if i even need a freeze exception
[14:31] <pitti> just subscribe ubuntu-release to the bug and ask
[14:32] <dobey> there's no bug
[14:35] <pitti> kenvandine, Riddell: can you please update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus for DX/Kubuntu? Thanks!
[14:35] <dobey> well i requested merge review from ubuntu-release then, and added a comment explaining why
[14:35] <dobey> for https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-control-tower/ubuntu/lucid/ubuntuone-client/trunk/+merge/20669
[14:36] <pitti> dobey: how much UI does it change?
[14:38] <kenvandine> pitti, sure
[14:41] <dobey> pitti: not much... location of the "Connect" button, and a couple of menu items in the nautilus extension to manage user defined folders
[14:41] <pitti> dobey: ok, sounds fine
[14:42] <pitti> dobey: replied
[14:43] <dobey> pitti: cool, thanks
[14:47] <seb128> rickspencer3, wb
[14:47] <seb128> rickspencer3, did it work?
[14:47] <rickspencer3> thanks seb128
[14:47] <rickspencer3> yup, all working
[14:47] <seb128> good ;-)
[14:47] <rickspencer3> seb128, great job with landing this stuff!
[14:48] <seb128> thanks!
[14:48]  * pitti hugs seb128
[14:48]  * seb128 hugs pitti
[15:39] <seb128> pitti, what is stripping the .desktop translations?
[15:40] <pitti> seb128: /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/langpack.mk
[15:40] <seb128> oh the sed call
[15:40] <seb128> stupid me
[15:40] <seb128> pitti, thanks
[15:44] <pitti> seb128: you need it in a non-cdbs package?
[15:44] <seb128> pitti, yes
[15:44]  * pitti guesses we need to port this to dh at some point
[15:44] <seb128> we do
[15:44] <seb128> it's on my list of infrastructure changes needed for next cycle
[15:44] <pitti> or better yet, get that damn thing upstream
[15:45] <seb128> that would be nice indeed!
[15:49] <nigelb> pitti: when you get the time (after the release), if could help me learn how to port to dh, I could try to help :)
[15:50] <pitti> nigelb, seb128: I think we should create a new dh_gnome and dh_langpack which do what langpack.mk and gnome.mk currently do, change those two .mk to just call dh_{gnome,langpack}, and change dh to call those two
[15:51] <seb128> pitti, seems a good plan to me
[15:51] <pitti> the two new dh scripts could be in gnome-pkg-tools
[15:51] <pitti> I don't think we can/should add them to DH itself
[15:51] <pitti> but then I don't knwo whether you can extend dh with external plugins
[15:51] <didrocks> pitti: seems a good idea, right
[15:51] <pitti> cdbs is much nicer and more flexible in that regard, dh is very static
[15:52] <pitti> ooh
[15:52] <pitti> quilt does something similar
[15:52] <pitti> /usr/share/perl5/Debian/Debhelper/Sequence/quilt.pm
[15:52] <pitti> it ships two new dh_quilt and adds them to the sequencer in quilt.pm
[15:52] <pitti> nice!
[15:52] <didrocks> pitti: yes, that's what is trigger with dh --with-quilt
[15:53] <pitti> so, that seems to be a workable plan
[15:53] <pitti> nigelb: if you want to work on that, that'd be great
[15:53] <didrocks> so, not sure if debhelper still need --with-<pluging>
[15:54] <nigelb> pitti: I'd to learn more about dh in that case, my knowledge is almost minimal
[15:54] <pitti> didrocks: presumably yes
[15:54] <pitti> seb128: ^ hm, it occurs to me that in this case we'd need to modify packages again
[15:54] <didrocks> pitti: let's see if we can patch debhelper to have that in an evironment variable
[15:54] <didrocks> environment
[15:54] <pitti> for adding gnome-pkg-tools and the --with-gnome/--with-langpack?
[15:55] <didrocks> so that we don't have to patch every package debian/rules :/
[15:55] <pitti> didrocks: how would that help us?
[15:55] <seb128> well ideally there would be a dh_gnome in debian too
[15:55] <didrocks> pitti: adding the environment variable to our build system, like when binarymangler is specially adding
[15:55] <pitti> seb128: do you know if Debian has gnome dh7 packages? do they b-dep on something in particular like gnome-pkg-tools? i. e. the equivalent of including gnome.mk?
[15:56] <seb128> which does schemas registration etc
[15:56] <seb128> and we would just tweak it in ubuntu
[15:56] <seb128> to do some extra things
[15:56] <pitti> seb128: that'd be best, then we could just change it
[15:56] <didrocks> something like DEBHELPER_PLUGIN="gnome:langpack"
[15:56] <seb128> pitti, I don't think they do no
[15:56] <seb128> they use cdbs
[15:56] <pitti> ok, as long as they do, that should be fine
[15:56] <seb128> the packages I've issue with are those from the mono team
[15:56] <seb128> ie tomboy and f-spot
[15:57] <seb128> so far it's limited to 2 so that's ok to workaround
[16:20]  * LaserJock thinks somebody needs to create an irssi-ubuntu-theme script that automatically sets a good theme depending on if you use Radiance or Ambiance
[16:25] <didrocks> the default weechat theme fits with new gnome-terminal background :)
[16:29] <rickspencer3_> kenvandine, I see a few "Done" work items for SFTS
[16:29] <rickspencer3_> nice
[16:29] <kenvandine> more coming :)
[16:29] <pitti> just saw them as well, great work!
[16:29] <kenvandine> about to release gwibber 2.29.91 :)
[16:30] <pitti> kenvandine: so it autostarts now iff you have configured accounts?
[16:30] <kenvandine> been waiting for desktopcouch to not blow up :)
[16:30] <hyperair> gnome-terminal has a background now?
[16:30] <kenvandine> yup
[16:30] <kenvandine> with a 30s delay
[16:30] <kenvandine> hyperair, i noticed that too... nice touch imho
[16:30] <pitti> hyperair: I think just a mild transparency
[16:30] <pitti> fortunately easy enough to disable again
[16:31] <hyperair> kenvandine: i'm still using my customized green-on-black gnome-terminal in karmic
[16:31] <hyperair> kenvandine: sscreenshot?
[16:31] <kenvandine> it's just transparent
[16:31] <hyperair> ah
[16:31] <kenvandine> nothing to really see :)
[16:31] <hyperair> i see.
[16:31] <kenvandine> but
[16:31] <hyperair> hehe
[16:31] <kenvandine> it is a new profile
[16:31] <hyperair> i see.
[16:32] <kenvandine> so you can just change back if you like
[16:32] <LaserJock> transparent?
[16:32] <kenvandine> nice way of doing it :)
[16:32] <LaserJock> it's rather solid purple here
[16:32] <pitti> kenvandine: well, it causes a lot of grief that way, though (bug is filed), so it might not be a new theme in the final version
[16:33] <hyperair> LaserJock: i can't imagine working with a solid purple terminal, actually.
[16:33] <hyperair> mine's translucent black
[16:33] <kenvandine> pitti, i like it that way, so simple to revert if you want
[16:34] <LaserJock> hyperair: it's actually not bad, I like it a lot better than green-on-black
[16:34] <pitti> kenvandine: but it tramps over all your settings
[16:34] <hyperair> LaserJock: /me shudders
[16:34] <pitti> kenvandine: this morning I had the menu bar, scroll bar, and huge font, and black text on black bg
[16:40] <chrisccoulson> kenvandine, so you like the gnome-terminal theme change?
[16:40] <kenvandine> kindof :)
[16:40] <kenvandine> i doubt i will keep it
[16:41] <kenvandine> but my initial thought was "wow, they even themed the terminal"
[16:41] <jcastro> needs to be darker
[16:41] <jcastro> harder to read, I filed a bug
[16:41] <didrocks> jcastro: it'll, I changed the value, but didn't update it
[16:41] <jcastro> didrocks: thanks!
[16:41] <didrocks> jcastro: I checked with kwwii to have the official value :)
[16:42] <didrocks> jcastro: I can update with your bug number, do you have it handy?
[16:46] <chrisccoulson> i'm still not sure how we're going to implement the theme in a way which doesn't make lots of people unhappy
[16:46] <chrisccoulson> but, i'll have a think about that over the weekend
[16:48] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: I just upload the color change then
[16:49] <chrisccoulson> didrocks - please do. i need a bit longer to think of implentation detail
[16:49] <seb128> chrisccoulson, just change the color of the default theme?
[16:49] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: no pb :)
[16:49] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - the only issue with that is gnome-terminal writes user-specific keys when you run it, even if you don't change anything
[16:49] <seb128> that's a recurrent issue
[16:50] <chrisccoulson> so, only new profiles will see it, and no upgraders will ever get it even if they didn't change any settings
[16:50] <seb128> how did you workaround that in your upload?
[16:50] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - i created a new profile, set the new profile as the default, and wrote a patch to merge any new system profiles in to the users list of available ones
[16:51] <chrisccoulson> so, the way it works at the moment is:
[16:51] <chrisccoulson> 1) New installs get it
[16:51] <chrisccoulson> 2) People who have changed settings within the default profile also get it, but they're existing settings will still be available in the old profile to revert back to
[16:52] <chrisccoulson> 3) People who have created new profiles will get the new profile in the list of available ones, but it won't be default
[16:52] <seb128> that seems good
[16:52] <seb128> only 2) seems to confuse people?
[16:52] <chrisccoulson> yeah, it seems so
[16:53] <chrisccoulson> and it seems that pitti ended up with black text on black background with the new profile too, which I still don't really understand
[16:53] <seb128> I'm wondering if we should just don't touch user datas out of adding it as an available profile
[16:53] <seb128> and just make it default on new installs
[16:53] <seb128> me neither
[16:53] <pitti> chrisccoulson: my $PS1 sets black text (after some other colors in the prompt)
[16:53] <seb128> seems pitti is the only one who got that so far though
[16:53] <seb128> ah
[16:53] <seb128> so it's not really a bug
[16:53] <chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, that makes more sense then
[16:54] <chrisccoulson> pitti - but your existing profile was still intact?
[16:54] <seb128> it's just a config conflict
[16:54] <pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, when I switched back to "Vorgabe" (default? legacy?) it worked again
[16:54] <seb128> well that seems quite ok to me
[16:54] <seb128> the other alternative would be to let alone people who changed their config
[16:55] <seb128> ie not upgrade upgraders
[16:55]  * pitti is lagged, release meeting going on, sorry
[16:55] <chrisccoulson> config migration really sucks at the moment
[16:56] <pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, why?
[16:56] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i was just making a comment in general there ;)
[16:56] <pitti> the usual "change schema and don't touch user config" seems to work quite well?
[16:57] <pitti> it's not unlike we have with conffiles in packages
[16:57] <chrisccoulson> we seem to have the same issues with changing the panel config etc...
[16:57] <pitti> yes, every time we try to override user customizations :)
[16:57] <chrisccoulson> it would be nicer if we could theme the VteTerminal from the actual gtk theme instead
[16:58] <seb128> pitti, well those are case where we can't tell if user customized
[16:58] <seb128> which is the issue
[16:58] <didrocks> I guess chrisccoulson said "what is bad is that even when you don't change anything, some apps writes in .gconf/ at first launched"
[16:58] <pitti> right, those ^ are real bugs
[16:58] <didrocks> same with gnome-panel and that's what makes the session switching hackish
[16:58] <seb128> or with any setting
[16:59] <seb128> if you ever change your background and go back to the default one it's an user setting
[16:59] <didrocks> right
[16:59] <seb128> apply to any setting you ever tried to change
[16:59] <seb128> we have to way to say if (user_value == system_value) then reset it
[16:59] <seb128> we is often what we would like to do on upgrade
[17:03]  * didrocks upgrades his last netbook and say bye bye to brown :)
[17:16] <seb128> ok, enough for today
[17:16]  * seb128 calls it a week
[17:16] <seb128> have fun everybody, see you next week!
[17:17] <Nafai> later seb128!
[17:49] <didrocks> well, week-end time for me as well
[17:49] <didrocks> see you next week everyone, enjoy a little rest o/
[17:50] <chrisccoulson> hey didrocks, have a good weekend
[17:57] <pitti> bye didrocks
[18:23]  * pitti waves good night as well
[18:35] <chrisccoulson> good night pitti, have a good weekend
[19:39] <debfx> pitti: do you know why hal sets laptop_panel.brightness_in_hardware to true if /sys/module/video/parameters/brightness_switch_enabled == Y ?
[19:56] <baptiste_> huuu
[19:56] <baptiste_> Did lucid broke my gconf parameters?
[19:57] <geser> why?
[19:57] <baptiste_> a new profile was created and used in gnome-terminal
[19:58] <ccheney> baptiste_: yea easy to switch back to normal one, but i found that a little annoying as well
[19:58] <baptiste_> and few others parameters were changed here and there in various applications
[19:59] <baptiste_> and I can't delete it ...
[19:59] <ccheney> the other profile? its system wide
[19:59] <ccheney> or at least i would expect it is
[20:00] <ccheney> baptiste_: yea its listed in /usr/share/gconf/defaults/10_gnome-terminal-data
[20:01] <chrisccoulson> hey, i see you're talking about gnome-terminal
[20:01] <baptiste_> chrisccoulson, :) yeah
[20:01] <baptiste_> are you the guilty guy ?
[20:01] <chrisccoulson> baptiste_, yes
[20:01] <ccheney> lol :)
[20:01] <baptiste_> :)
[20:01] <chrisccoulson> are you having issues?
[20:02] <chrisccoulson> bbiab, baby to feed
[20:02] <baptiste_> no problemo
[20:02] <baptiste_> as I saw the background was purple, I  suspected a related a relation with ubuntu changes :)
[20:04] <baptiste_> another weird thing I saw is the metacity button layout has changed after using the new ubuntu theme and witching back to my usual theme
[20:05] <ccheney> baptiste_: yea that annoyed me a lot, apparently there isn't any easy way to fix that other than just overriding the gconf setting, apparently not settable per theme :-\
[20:05] <ccheney> baptiste_: you can switch it back in gconf-editor
[20:05] <baptiste_> so now I have [maximize] [minimize] [close] on left, instead of [minimize]  [maximize] [close]
[20:05] <baptiste_> oh true, this is not theme - wise parameter
[20:05] <ccheney> baptiste_: well in old themes its on the right but max min close instead of min max close
[20:06] <ccheney> the switch to the left was done with the light-themes which also changed button order, but for all themes not just its own probably due to lack of ability to do that
[20:06] <ccheney> baptiste_: edit /apps/metacity/general/button_layout to fix the layout
[20:06] <baptiste_> yea yeah :) thanks
[20:06] <baptiste_> I'm an old timer in gnome world :)
[20:07] <ccheney> actually to get the old style you need to set it to "menu:minimize,maximize,close"
[20:07] <baptiste_> I'm just reporting that some changes had an impact on other people parameters :)
[20:07] <ccheney> baptiste_: well its been that way since win 2.0 also aiui
[20:07] <baptiste_> okay
[20:07] <ccheney> afaik only mac does it the new ubuntu way
[20:07] <baptiste_> "that way"?
[20:08] <ccheney> the old gnome way
[20:08] <ccheney> well really the gnome way period, i think this change is ubuntu specific
[20:08] <ccheney> but its relatively easy to fix it back to sane (what 95% of computer users expect) defaults
[20:08] <ccheney> new users probably won't care either way
[20:09]  * baptiste_ did gconftool-2 -u /apps/metacity/general/button_layout
[20:09] <baptiste_> I prefer the reset way
[20:09] <ccheney> ah ok
[20:09] <ccheney> i didn't know about that option
[20:10] <baptiste_> yeah, gconftool permits you to manipulate gconf in command-line
[20:16] <Technoviking> I'm getting a loud noise at shutdown for a second or two in Lucid, even with sound muted. Got a suggestion what package I should file a bug againist
[20:41] <jcastro> kenvandine: are these "ghost" people in my messaging-indicator still supposed to be there? It's from when they sign into IM.
[20:41] <jcastro> kenvandine: I think there was a bug about it
[20:42] <jcastro> also I don't think dbarth's fix to indicator-me's photo thing works (or wasn't applied or whatever)
[20:43] <LaserJock> hmm, does it make sense that the messaging-indicator now has things that aren't indicators?
[20:48] <chrisccoulson> baptiste_, were you having specific issues with the terminal then, or just noticed the new colour?
[20:49] <baptiste_> chrisccoulson, the small problem I had, is that your change make yubntu theme my default
[20:49] <baptiste_> ... the Ambiance profil became the default (rahter than theme)
[20:50] <chrisccoulson> yeah, a few people have been somewhat unhappy with that, but it's a difficult one to solve
[20:50] <kenvandine> jcastro, i haven't seen the ghost people
[20:50] <kenvandine> and i didn't know he fixed the people thing in indicator-me
[20:51] <chrisccoulson> baptiste_, how we implement the theme change might alter slightly. i need to think about that over the weekend really
[20:52] <kenvandine> didrocks, ping
[20:53] <chrisccoulson> kenvandine, he left for the weekend already
[20:53] <kenvandine> bummer... chrisccoulson can you sponsor something?
[20:53] <chrisccoulson> kenvandine, as long as it is in the desktop package set or universe
[20:54] <kenvandine> ok... same boat as me then
[20:54] <chrisccoulson> heh
[20:54] <kenvandine> some of the desktop packages have bad acls
[20:54] <kenvandine> cjwatson is working on it...
[20:54] <chrisccoulson> which ones?
[20:54] <kenvandine> in this case gwibber
[20:54] <kenvandine> but about half of the DX team indicator-* packages too
[20:54] <chrisccoulson> yeah, that should be in the desktop package set
[20:55] <kenvandine> the script that runs over the archive setting acls gets confused on some packages
[20:55] <kenvandine> he doesn't know why yet
[20:55] <chrisccoulson> unfortunately, a lot of the things i work on are in desktop-core, because they are seeded by other ubuntu flavors
[20:55] <chrisccoulson> and i can't upload anything there
[22:18] <kenvandine> anyone around that can sponsor lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gwibber/ubuntu, lp:ubuntu/libubuntuone, and lp:ubuntu/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store ?