[00:18] # service autofs status [00:18] autofs stop/killed, process 3690 [00:18] # pgrep automount [00:18] 3687 [00:19] I think Upstart is getting very confused :-( [00:19] # service autofs stop [00:19] stop: Job has already been stopped: autofs [00:20] http://paste.ubuntu.com/389279/ has my Upstart job definition, which I'm trying to test [00:26] (on Ubuntu 10.04) [00:53] Caesar: bug #406397 [00:56] Yarp [00:58] probably got confused following the pid chain and ended up with something that isn't actually autofs [00:58] like one of the fork parents [01:07] Yeah [01:07] "expect fork" after a clean boot fixed it [01:12] sweet [01:12] sorry about that one [01:12] I have a fix for it ;) [01:12] but it's a M one [01:12] Doh [01:12] It's pretty bad how busted things get in this situation [01:13] start and stop just hang [01:16] yeah [01:16] it's because it's not supposed to be able to happen :p [01:20] heh [01:21] So what's currently doing my head in is the timing between the legacy init scripts and the upstart jobs [01:22] Because a lot of the upstart jobs aren't runlevel dependent (maybe if I follow the dependency chain back I'll find that they are) [01:23] they're not supposed to be [01:23] there's a vague wishy-washy attempt to make runlevels go away :p [01:23] heh [01:23] btw are you coming to the-woods-outside-Brussels? [01:24] Sadly not, as my wife is due on May 24 [01:24] And I'm transferring off Goobuntu after my paternity leave, so I won't have a justification for coming to future UDSes [01:24] aww :-( where are you transferring to? [01:24] The security team [01:25] before you go, I'd really appreciate it if I could get a kind of "what Google would like from Upstart" mail [01:25] what you've found difficult about it [01:25] problems you've had [01:25] what you wish it did [01:25] what you wish it did better [01:25] etc. [01:25] I can do that, particularly after we've deployed 10.04 [01:25] Right now I'm just having a hell of a time debugging the boot process. That's due to a combination of factors though [01:26] yeah, as I think I've talked to you before, I want Upstart to keep an event log [01:27] so after a boot you can get a log like [01:27] "the foo event happened, so I started apache, but I couldn't start squid yet because it was still waiting on apache" [01:27] "the started apache happened, so I started squid" [01:27] That sounds perfect [01:27] and want that to be hooked up in a way that on a hung system, you can have upstart squirt it out to netconsole [01:27] "dump my brain" [01:28] The startup event is the root of everything isn't it? [01:30] yes [01:30] though in later versions you may be able to do "on system starting" and "on system started" [01:30] as two separate bits [01:31] Okay, so startup -> mountall -> (local-filesystems) -> (run level 2) -> rc 2 [01:31] Meanwhile, (local-filesystems) -> networking [01:31] So it sounds like the rc 2 legacy init scripts are going to run in parallel with the network coming up [01:49] Keybuk: something my cubemate was just lamenting is how restart isn't "restart or start" [01:52] Caesar: that's deliberate ;-) [01:52] I thought as much [01:52] Is there a "start or restart" equivalent? [01:52] I really hate how "/etc/init.d/foo restart" can start a service that wasn't running to begin with [01:52] stop foo ; start foo [01:52] Right [01:53] A bit more typing [01:55] Keybuk: I thought there was a restart. moreover I thought it was slightly different than stop;start [01:55] or was that for 1.0 [01:55] there is a restart [01:55] and it is slightly different ;) [01:56] Caesar had just asked whether there was an alternative to it that wasn't slightly different to stop;start ;) [02:17] Keybuk: I'd think the preference would be restart foo || start foo [03:44] that'd work too ;) [04:32] Keybuk: I have an ubuntu user who says he would like to "bitch slap ubuntu for making it look like a friggin mac" and would like me to direct him to your art department. Might you be of assistance? === me_ is now known as alphainu [05:37] sadmac: if we want to be better than a Mac, first we have to catch up with them ;) [05:38] ~_~ [13:56] I *wish* Ubuntu looked like MacOSX (except for the even more blurry fonts and a dock that takes up a huge amount of screen real estate). :-P They have very stylish things going on, such as no left/bottom/right borders in windows, as the shadows are enough to differentiate a window of a certain color from another similar one. I love that. [16:32] much as I liked making brown jokes in the past, I don't much care what ubuntu looks like in the end.