[00:01] <jtx> also the idea of running jack in realtime, since when running fruity loops in wine using the wineasio dll it wont work since that doesnt run in realtime
[00:04] <frandieguez> Hi all! I've installed Lucid at my Macbook 1,1. All works fine but when I plug in my headphones at audio output the sound doesn't work... Do you have a little idea or solution for this? Thanks
[00:12] <jtx> jackd is running in realtime even if u tell in qjack to dont
[00:16] <olmari> Hello, pretty major issue with dualscreen + compiz + lucid
[00:16] <olmari> Screenshot: http://koti.mbnet.fi/jaarli/kuvat/dualscreen.png
[00:17] <penguin42> olmari: Most likely a graphics driver bug - which graphics card?
[00:17] <olmari> penguin42: 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc M10 NT [FireGL Mobility T2] (rev 80), ibm t42p laptop
[00:18] <penguin42> olmari: Are you running with the frglx or the open source drivers?
[00:18] <olmari> penguin42: with no compiz it works fine
[00:18] <olmari> penguin42: OSS
[00:18] <penguin42> olmari: Report the bug
[00:19] <olmari> penguin42: would compiz need more GPU memory? if that would make this kind of issue, toigh it would be bug as allowing to do this =)
[00:20] <penguin42> compiz really uses all the 3d features of the card, without it its mostly 2d which is a LOT easier
[00:23] <olmari> penguin42: will apport-gtk suffice?
[00:25] <mikeconcepts_> network browse cpu 100 percent not working? any work around?
[00:26] <penguin42> olmari: Not sure, the ubuntu-bug is broken and might stay that way until monday
[00:28] <olmari> penguin42: crap =)
[00:28] <mikeconcepts_> penguin42, are you familiar with the network browse issue?
[00:28] <penguin42> mikeconcepts_: Sorry, no
[00:30] <olmari> penguin42: is there anything to do but wait it out? (sorry to bother so much :p )
[00:31] <penguin42> olmari: You could try asking on http://lists.x.org/mailman/listinfo/xorg-driver-ati
[00:31] <penguin42> olmari: also, you could try running the xorg-edgers X libraries which are bleeding edge
[00:31] <olmari> penguin42: does it differ that afaik it is radeon, not ati, specifically?
[00:32] <penguin42> olmari: I'm fairly sure that all even vaguely recent ATIs are actually radeon (or radeonhd)
[00:33] <olmari> penguin42: I meant the driver in running
[00:33] <penguin42> olmari: Acutally, T2 (M10) is listed in the set of cards supported by the Radeon driver (I've got an Rv710)
[00:33] <vanishing> yofel: sup man
[00:34] <penguin42> olmari: I'd mail that
[00:34] <olmari> penguin42: ookay, I'll see what the outcome is :)
[00:37] <olmari> penguin42: One thing I do like with nVidia, easy to use control panel, as a side note
[00:40] <penguin42> olmari: You can run the frglx closed source ati drivers and control panel (I think?)
[00:41] <mamefan2> I just installed lucid on a MAC G4.  The keyboard doesn't work for me in X but I can use the on-screen KB to get to a console and the KB works fine there.
[00:41] <olmari> penguin42: I know I could, but those drivers sux, and ati control panel equally sucks in comparison to nvidia :D
[00:41] <mamefan2> I'm using the standard Apple KB and Mouse.  The mouse works fine.  Just the KB doesn't and only in X.
[00:42] <penguin42> olmari: The open source drivers have impressed me for ati, they still have a few rough edges but are OK for me; they're a lot better than a year ago - haven't tried dual head on them though
[00:42] <penguin42> mamefan2: Sounds like you've found a bug!
[00:42] <tamran> I compile pioneers on another machine, then made a package and installed it on this machine fine.  If I try to install the same version in the repos, it wants to install 59 other packages (57 of which are not pioneers related).  I've played with it and it works just fine
[00:42] <tamran> this is in Kubuntu lucid
[00:42] <olmari> penguin42: indeed, with ones came with lucid they're dirst time actually working for me as in generally usable daily
[00:43] <tamran> the 9.10 kubuntu didn't need all that stuff I don't believe
[00:43] <mamefan2> I don't think so.  I think I've got a configuration problem.  Googling around for this issue I find that other have encountered it on previous releases.  I just don't know enough about how to troubleshoot the issue and would appreciate any guidance.
[00:43] <olmari> penguin42: I don't bash the open source drivers at all itself :)
[00:43] <tamran> is there something new with the repos and gnome apps using special stuff in lucid?
[00:43] <penguin42> olmari: You could try xorg-edgers for the real bleeding edge version :-)
[00:44] <mamefan2> what's really frustrating me is that at one point I did get it (the keyboard) to work.  But I don't know what I did and when I rebooted it was broken again.
[00:44] <Okidesu> Any idea why Ubuntu One doesn't want to start ?
[00:45] <mamefan2> I think it may be related to the AllowEmptyInput X server option.  I seems that the mac keyboard is listed twice
[00:45] <jarlath> Can anyone verify this behaviour for me? If I right click on the Apps menu and untick some of the games - they still remain in the menu.
[00:45] <mamefan2> So, any advice?
[00:47] <Andre_Gondim> does any one know how to use hdmi to have output sound at tv?
[00:47] <Xepera> I just "upgraded" to lucid lynx, and I want to downgrade back to Karmic Koala.  Is there any way to do this?  I cannot get to the standard console shell (ctrl+alt+f2), and X windows is crashing on boot.  I am on the Karmic LiveCD now
[00:48] <penguin42> Andre_Gondim: That depends I think on the particular card; if you open up sound preferences and go to hardware do you see the separate sound card there?
[00:48] <penguin42> Xepera: Downgrading is generally not doable
[00:48] <Okidesu> Xepera try pressing OrtSc+alt+k or J
[00:49] <Xepera> Okidesu: what is OrtSc?
[00:49] <Okidesu> Xepera, if you get stuck at boot o-o
[00:49] <Okidesu> Xepera, oops PrtSc
[00:49] <Xepera> penguin42: surely there has to be a way to write packages to the system from the livecd?
[00:49] <Okidesu> print screen or SysRq jet
[00:49] <Okidesu> *key damn it >_<
[00:50] <penguin42> Xepera: That's probably do able, but you'll have to figure out how to downgrade all the packages, and some of the configs may well have changed in ways the older packages won't understand
[00:50] <Xepera> the problem is it's not showing anything at all during boot.  looks like a bunch of jumbled garbage.  X windows loads up to the login screen, but crashed beyond that
[00:50] <penguin42> Xepera: Which graphics card?
[00:50] <Xepera> nvidia
[00:51] <penguin42> I'm no nvidia expert, I'd check to see if there are any answers for fixing nvidia drivers for it
[00:51] <penguin42> Xepera: I'd make sure it's up to date as well
[00:51] <Okidesu> Xepera can't you run a session in low resolution or what was it and then install nvidia drivers from hardware drivers ?
[00:52] <Xepera> penguin42: i cannot boot into the system.  my network will not connect.  I cannot get to the console to do any manual maintenance
[00:52] <Xepera> Okidesu: no, that results in a crash too
[00:52] <Okidesu> Can't het alt+f2 to go to console ?
[00:52] <Okidesu> *he
[00:52] <Xepera> no.
[00:53] <penguin42> Xepera: Hmm tricky, I'd check the forums for fixes for nvidia - or ways to forcibly remove it, possibly from your current boot consider trying to disable the nvidia drivers on the installation
[00:53] <Xepera> at this point i want to edit my sources.list from this livecd and attempt to downgrade.  I would rather deal with a few broken config files than not have a working system at all
[00:53] <bjsnider> Xepera, is you /usr directory mounted on a separate partition?
[00:53] <penguin42> Xepera: Seriously, your chances of downgrading are less than the chances of fixing the nvidia driver installation
[00:53] <Xepera> bjsnider: no, unfortunately not
[00:53] <Xepera> penguin42: it is not simply an nvidia drivers problem.
[00:54] <LADmaticCA> anyone gotten any disk failure warnings from disk utility?
[00:54] <Okidesu> Xepera, do you have embaded GPU in your motherboard !?
[00:54] <Xepera> Okidesu: yes, but it's disabled in the bios
[00:55] <Okidesu> Xepera, why don't you try to enable it and remove your normal card, ofc if nothing else works o-o
[00:55] <Xepera> nobody's willing to tell me how to edit the sources.list so i can downgrade?
[00:55] <Xepera> i don't want to fix the system since it's broken well beyond what is usable
[00:55] <penguin42> Xepera: I've never heard of a downgrade working - ever
[00:56] <Xepera> the console should not be looking for a graphics driver
[00:56] <penguin42> Xepera: If you really want to downgrade then reinstall
[00:56] <Xepera> reinstall requires format iirc
[00:56] <penguin42> yep
[00:56] <Xepera> ok... i will look into this myself
[00:57] <Okidesu> isn't there an option not to format ?
[00:57] <fatbrain> Hi, can I somehow set the x/yres in my terminals? :S (vt1)
[00:57] <Xepera> Okidesu: not that i've seen, unfortunately
[00:57] <penguin42> fatbrain: What do you mean by res exactly?
[00:57] <Okidesu> Xepera, even in the advanced patitioning menu ?
[00:58] <fatbrain> penguin42: I want ... to fit more text in my screen :)
[00:58] <fatbrain> penguin42: i.e. more rows/cols.
[00:58] <penguin42> Okidesu: To do that I'd use debootstrap to reinstall a fresh image
[00:58] <penguin42> fatbrain: In the text console or in one in X ?
[00:58] <penguin42> Okidesu: debootstrap should be able to do it on an existing filesystem if you clear out the rest of the installation but leave your own data
[00:59] <olmari> penguin42: by xorg edgers, do you mean https://launchpad.net/~xorg-edgers/+archive/ppa
[00:59] <fatbrain> penguin42: : text console
[00:59] <penguin42> olmari: Yes
[00:59] <Xepera> Okidesu: no, it whines about "no root system is defined"
[00:59] <Okidesu> fatbrain Edit > Profiles > Legacy > Edit > Scrolling > Lines :p
[01:00] <penguin42> fatbrain: you can load a smaller font (setfont) or you can change the resolution, I think fbset should be able to do that for you (there are some bootlines to do it as well) - although things have changed a bit with the new kernel mode setting I haven't fully got my head around
[01:00] <Okidesu> Xepera even if you edit your sources wouldn't it complain that the versions you have are newer then the ones you are trying to install anyway ?!
[01:00] <Xepera> Okidesu, yes, but i can work around that
[01:01] <fatbrain> penguin42: indeed, I'll fiddle around a bit, thanks.
[01:01] <Xepera> Okidesu: I really just need to know *how* to get it to write to the system from the livecd
[01:01] <Xepera> I will deal with the fallout.  I understand the warnings.
[01:03] <Xepera> the system is completely unusable, as i have no access to console or X windows at this point
[01:03] <Okidesu> Xepera, you said that the system boots to login ?
[01:03] <Xepera> Yes, but crashed immediately upon entering login information
[01:04] <Okidesu> dude -_-
[01:04] <penguin42> Xepera: Instead of entering login info do ctrl-alt-f1 and see if you can get a text console
[01:04] <Xepera> and switching to console fails
[01:04] <Okidesu> i'm pritty sure that you can Alt+F2 without entering login information
[01:04] <Xepera> like i said
[01:04] <Okidesu> and go to console
[01:04] <Xepera> i cannot get to text console
[01:04] <Okidesu> right ctrl+alt+f1 or F2 or F3 sorry
[01:04] <Xepera> ...
[01:05] <Xepera> i mentioned right off that that is failing as well
[01:05] <penguin42> Xepera: I'd mount the root file system and knock out the nvidia driver
[01:05] <mamefan2> is there some way I can boot to a console instead of loading GDM.  My kb and mouse are now both failing in X.
[01:05] <olmari> penguin42: same results :)
[01:05] <olmari> penguin42: also posted into mailinglist
[01:05] <Xepera> penguin42: the text console has nothing to do with the nvidia driver
[01:05] <penguin42> olmari: Could - good luck
[01:06] <Okidesu> Xepera, so the text console fails or it crashes when you try to load it with ctrl+alt+f1 ?
[01:06] <penguin42> Xepera: It still loads a kernel module and I'm not sure how it interacts with the new kernel mode switch stuff
[01:06] <Okidesu> what do you mean by fails, it fails after you try to login in the console or it crashes when you use the shortcut keys ?
[01:07] <Xepera> Okidesu: I don't know how to describe it, but it simply doesn't display anything but a bunch of white boxes toward the top of the screen (like nothing i've seen before)
[01:07] <Xepera> Okidesu: it doesn't crash - i just can't access the text console at all because it won't display anything when i switch
[01:07] <mamefan2> is there some way I can boot to a console instead of loading GDM?  My kb and mouse are now both failing in X.
[01:08] <Okidesu> Xepera, open box remove Nvidia card try that or reinstall and format, or get another Hdd install linux on it, copy files from your crashed hdd
[01:08] <Xepera> really, nobody will tell me how to modify my current system from livecd?
[01:08] <Okidesu> can you browse it ?
[01:08] <Xepera> there is nothing wrong with my hardware.  it works fine
[01:09] <Xepera> yes
[01:09] <Okidesu> ok replace "crashed hdd" with "destroyed ubuntu install"
[01:09] <Okidesu> ok
[01:09] <Okidesu> where is sources located
[01:09] <Okidesu> wait a minute which sources you want to edit lol :)
[01:09] <Okidesu> on the not working lucid install ?
[01:09] <Xepera> located in /media/disk-1/etc/apt/sources.list
[01:10] <Okidesu> someone should slap me and tell me to shat ap now XD
[01:11] <SalmonSam> anyone unable to enable desktop effects with the nvidia drivers?
[01:12] <Xepera> Okidesu: i know how to edit the sources.list.  I don't know how to tell this livecd to use that sources file, and to write those files to the appropriate partition
[01:12] <Okidesu> Xepera, you said you are on Karmic live cd right ?
[01:12] <Xepera> Okidesu, Yes
[01:12] <Okidesu> Xepera, and you want to edit the sources with sources for ?
[01:13] <Xepera> what?
[01:14] <Okidesu> well is there a "force install" on the installer on the live cd or something ?
[01:15] <penguin42> Xepera: I think I'd edit the sources.list, chroot into the hard disk directory, mount /proc in there and then try and apt-get - but I still think you're chances are miniscule
[01:15] <Okidesu> Xepera, or if you have Ubuntu One account maybe you can store the files you need there and restore them afterwords
[01:15] <Xepera> Okidesu: you mean through the installer program?
[01:20] <Okidesu> gosh i sux in helping in linux :)
[01:20] <penguin42> the installer ain't going to help here
[01:21] <Okidesu> not sure what he's trying to save
[01:22] <kavurt> I'm experiencing a joke. In my two different computers, after todays updates my kubuntu turned into ubuntu. see http://imagebin.ca/view/RZiOJMF.html unbelievable
[01:23] <penguin42> kavurt: When you login does it offer you a choice of KDE or Gnome?
[01:24] <kavurt> no, I didn't install gnome at all.
[01:24] <penguin42> kavurt: Whether you wanted to or not, does it offer you a choice - that sure looks like gnome
[01:25] <kavurt> I'll check. It logged in automatically. I'll be back
[01:26] <Okidesu> Xepera, but my best bet is remove Nvidia card and try with your onboard one :) think there's a good chance there
[01:30]  * penguin42 would still try and fix the current installation
[01:31] <contrast> Greets, everyone... I just installed Lucid via the minimal CD, then installed kubuntu-desktop. Now the system fails to boot, even in recovery mode. Any suggestions would be much appreciated.
[01:31] <Okidesu> contrast, do you get a blinking cursor
[01:32] <Xepera> just trying to do this from a chrooted environment... will update you all on the results
[01:32] <Okidesu> Xepera, best of luck :)
[01:32] <researcher1> I have upgraded to Ubuntu 10.04 LTS- the Lucid Lynx, but now want to downgrade to 9.10 again. What should I do?
[01:32] <Xepera> modified source.list and the apt preferences file
[01:32] <Xepera> sources.list*
[01:33] <contrast> Okidesu: Nope, just a solid one. Can't even switch to a TTY via Ctrl+Alt+F[1-6]. I _am_ able to reboot via Alt+SysRq+RSEIUB though, so it's obviously not the kernel itself that's crashing.
[01:33] <Xepera> researcher1: you too, huh?
[01:33] <Xepera> :)
[01:33] <penguin42> researcher1: Downgrades aren't supported; I suggest you watch Xepera one as he tries to downgrade and see how painful it is and then reconsider
[01:33] <Xepera> researcher1: i'm trying to do that right now - i will be updating this chat on the results
[01:34] <researcher1> Xepera because I want to use Vbox 3.1.4 which is available for Ubuntu 9.10 n not above
[01:34] <penguin42> time for bed
[01:34] <Xepera> researcher1: ahhh, for something like that i would just find an alternative man
[01:34] <ZykoticK9> researcher1, VBox 3.1.4 is working fine on my Lucid install
[01:34] <Okidesu> contrast get random hangs like that, no idea what causes them :/ but with 2-3 reboots and spamming SysRq+alt+J or K it boots  lol
[01:34] <Xepera> researcher1: i can't even boot my system -- that's why i'm doing this
[01:34] <Okidesu> contrast, after installing the Nvidia drivers from hardware drivers it stoped
[01:35] <researcher1> ok. then my system is enough stable. So far no trouble except the need to enjoy the benefits of Vbox 3.1.4
[01:36] <contrast> Okidesu: Oohhh, that's comforting... Gonna try it, thanks... It's on its third attempted boot now, so I should just spam Alt+SysRq+J/K now, right?
[01:36] <ZykoticK9> researcher1, just install the DEB from http://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Linux_Downloads works great
[01:37] <Okidesu> contrast, well i cross my fingers, at least here that's how it worked, also one time it worked when i booted to my Live USB stick and then when i went back it just worked ...
[01:37] <Xepera> Okidesu: thanks for the good wishes :P
[01:37] <Xepera> Okidesu: running the "upgrade" from chrooted console now
[01:37] <Okidesu> Xepera, too bad i'm too much of a noob to help more ^^
[01:38] <researcher1> Thanks  ZykoticK9: Im going to try this
[01:38] <contrast> Okidesu: Good to know, thanks again.
[01:38] <Xepera> Okidesu: the only issue so far was that I had to tell resolv.conf to point to the livecd version, otherwise apt-get upgrade laughed at me
[01:39] <Okidesu> Xepera, is it installing now ?!
[01:40] <Xepera> Okidesu: It's running the upgrade... pulling all the karmic packages and replacing the lucid ones
[01:40] <Okidesu> aside from that i'm very happy with Lucid, my dual monitors work, surround sound, webcam, satellite tv card, wacom tablet :) it feels great.
[01:41] <Okidesu> Xepera, it's not complaining that they are newer version or anything ?
[01:41] <Xepera> Okidesu: I wish I could say the same!
[01:41] <Xepera> Okidesu: I just edited sources.list, and the apt preferences file.  In the preferences file, I told it to ignore the newer version warning
[01:41] <Okidesu> Xepera, oh don't worry after a few updates i will be here with your problems hahaha
[01:41] <Okidesu> Xepera, ooo nice O-O
[01:41] <Xepera> Okidesu: Hopefully I'll be able to help :P
[01:42] <Okidesu> Xepera, haahaha :D
[01:42] <Okidesu> for now i will just enjoy the dream of not needing windows for anything thou :D
[01:42] <Xepera> Okidesu: I don't know what went wrong, but I'll be trying lucid out once it's officially released
[01:43] <Xepera> Okidesu: yeah, i haven't used windows for some years now... i'm pretty new to ubuntu, though
[01:43] <Okidesu> Xepera, i know what you mean by the "cubes" rendering and everything looking weird
[01:43] <Xepera> But I do have Windows 7 on my netbook
[01:43] <Okidesu> Xepera, experienced that one once, and it was nvidia drivers problem
[01:43] <Xepera> really?  i never saw that before, and it was crazy as hell... i don't know why i can't even get to the console.
[01:44] <Okidesu> Xepera, that's why if i were you i was going to take out the card and hope that Ubuntu will load different driver for it and it will all work
[01:44] <Xepera> Okidesu: if this downgrade fails, I'll just upgrade back to lucid and try that :P
[01:44] <Okidesu> Xepera, yep it is crazy and when you start something you can't tell if it's running or not :) at best 1 or 2 cubes change their chaos patterns lol
[01:44] <Okidesu> lol
[01:45] <Xepera> I'm way too impatient to troubleshoot all the broken stuff
[01:45] <Xepera> lol yeah, they were moving around randomly
[01:45] <Okidesu> yep exactly the same thing
[01:45] <Xepera> only at the top of the screen though
[01:45] <Okidesu> it doesn't matter
[01:46] <Okidesu> but if you can disable it from bios withotu opening your box that would be great
[01:46] <Okidesu> i can't do that because i have Intel motherboard god bless em ......
[01:46] <Xepera> i'm pretty sure i could do that
[01:46] <Xepera> but i love my nvidia card :)
[01:46] <Okidesu> lol ok
[01:48] <Xepera> i think i should go to taco bell and get some burritos.  it may be a long night.
[01:49] <Okidesu> :)
[01:50] <SalmonSam> was IRC support removed from telepathy-idle?
[01:56] <csgeek> I did an upgrade from karmic to the current dev release of lucid.  When I boot I get a error: the symbol 'grub_puts_' not found.  sda + sdb are raided,encrypted drive, sdc is the OS drive.. no raid..only has sdc1 is / and swap no other partitions
[01:57] <csgeek> I tried doing a chroot and forcing a re-install of grub.  Ran the grub-install /dev/sdc manually
[01:57] <ZykoticK9> csgeek, regarding the "grub_puts_" part you might want to see this forum post http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1397629
[01:57] <csgeek> any other ideas?
[01:58] <LLStarks> hi.
[01:59] <LLStarks> why did people think it was a good idea to remove all references to usb in the startup disk creator?
[01:59] <csgeek> thanks ZykoticK9
[01:59] <ZykoticK9> csgeek, hope it works for you man
[02:00] <cjohnston> Is anyone using a lappy on +1? When you put your mouse over the battery icon, do you get a popup saying the %/amount of time left?
[02:08] <csgeek> not yet.. but that's my next upgrade depending on the amount of pain the desktop upgrade entails.
[02:08] <csgeek> here's a question.  sda && sdb are raided encrypted drive.. just data drive.
[02:09] <Okidesu> what's os2mac up to
[02:09] <csgeek> would it hurt anything if I install the bootloaded on sda ?
[02:10] <csgeek> *sigh* even nicks with mac are annoying it seems
[02:10] <Okidesu> lol
[02:14] <csgeek> I'm running out of ideas
[02:15] <contrast> Okidesu: w00t w00t. Removed the nVidia card, booted to a TTY, installed the nvidia-glx, popped the card back in and now everything appears to be fine. Thanks again. :)
[02:16] <Okidesu> contrast, woot :D nice !
[02:21] <csgeek> wtf.. okay why did that work...
[02:21] <csgeek> and why does my computer look like it's on acid
[02:23] <csgeek> so.. I had to install the bootloader to sda
[02:23] <csgeek> it seems
[02:32] <syk> any temp fix for this bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/plymouth/+bug/538214
[02:37] <lancifer> So, has anyone else been having issues with the X login not loading until you hit the enter key?
[02:38] <ZykoticK9> lancifer, actually hitting the enter key crashes Xorg -- this is a longstanding and very common bug
[02:39] <ZykoticK9> lancifer, bug #532047
[02:40] <lancifer> wierd, it sits on a blank screen with a blinking cursor. I hit enter and the Xorg logon screen loads
[02:40] <FFForever> what is the best dock?
[02:41] <ZykoticK9> FFForever, like #ubuntu this isn't really the place for polls - personally i'm enjoying the newly separted from GnomeDo, Docky program - but it requires Compiz
[02:42] <FFForever> docky?, what is the project page?
[02:45] <ZykoticK9> !info docky
[02:46] <ZykoticK9> FFForever, if you ever saw GnomeDo with the Docky theme - this is a fork/split of that (new in Lucid)
[04:01] <amit1_> Hello all
[04:02] <amit1_> Is power consumption optimized in 10.04 alpha3 or is there a way to turn this feature "on"?
[04:03] <ZykoticK9> amit1_, i don't know about the power consumption - but this channel is DEAD tonight... You might have to re-ask at another time, when people are actually here.  You where the first post in over an hour.
[04:03] <amit1_> haha
[04:03] <amit1_> okay thats fine, #ubuntu seems to be full
[04:04] <ZykoticK9> amit1_, buy you're liking Lucid so far?  Saw you entering #ubuntu - thought you'd been suggested to leave
[04:04] <ddecator> haha, yah, happy saturday before st. patricks day =p
[04:04] <amit1_> I just installed Lucid today
[04:04] <amit1_> So far it seems stable and I like the improvements
[04:04] <amit1_> I just ran the update manager and did all the updates
[04:04] <tcsoccerman> Has anybody confirmed the ipod touch support?
[04:05] <ddecator> tcsoccerman, i haven't tried, but i've heard it's buggy
[04:05] <ZykoticK9> amit1_, get use to LOTS of updates with Lucid
[04:05] <amit1_> midway through the update, GNOME kicked me out to low color graphics mode
[04:05] <amit1_> I just rebooted and it worked fine, but reported that synaptics crashed
[04:05] <tcsoccerman> ddecator, hopefully it is stable for release. it would help ubuntu immensely.
[04:05] <amit1_> hey is anyone here familiar with kernel modules?
[04:06] <ddecator> tcsoccerman, agreed. i guess you can access the music on the itouch and play them on the comp, but syncing music to the itouch doesn't work quite right
[04:06] <ddecator> and yes, i know it's "ipod touch" but itouch is easier...
[04:06] <ZykoticK9> tcsoccerman, i don't even own an ipod or iphone and i think support in ubuntu would be a great thing
[04:06] <amit1_> I'm going to try it with my IPhone
[04:07] <ddecator> amit1_, back it up on itunes first
[04:07] <ddecator> just in case
[04:07] <amit1_> whats a good software for ITunes-like syncing etc?
[04:07] <tcsoccerman> ya. the only reason i am dual botting vista right now is for itunes.
[04:07] <amit1_> amarok?
[04:07] <ddecator> amit1_, i think rhythmbox is the only one with official itouch and iphone support...
[04:07] <ddecator> but for itunes style, songbird is amazing...but not available in lucid yet, even with ppa
[04:08] <ddecator> i need to get to work on that...
[04:08] <tcsoccerman> i love songbird
[04:08] <ZykoticK9> ddecator, i'm using Songbird on Lucid
[04:08] <tcsoccerman> but it needs to start living up to what people expect of it
[04:08] <ddecator> ZykoticK9, and it works for you? the upgrade borked the daily for me
[04:08] <amit1_> by the way, cairo dock is awesome
[04:08] <Dr_Willis> songbird often has fights with the gstreamer libs ive seen :)
[04:08] <ddecator> docky is better ;)
[04:09] <ddecator> Dr_Willis, that's what the daily is doing i think
[04:09] <ddecator> maybe the stable works, but the daily is a no-go for me right now
[04:09] <Dr_Willis> ive seen pages with fix's to try. One was a simple EXPORT variable.
[04:09] <Dr_Willis> I think it forced it to use the system libs and not its own
[04:09] <amit1_> hmm.. I guess Rhythmbox comes built in with Lucid...
[04:09] <ddecator> i guess one of the files got deleted at some point, so the ppa hasn't been updated in a long time
[04:09] <Dr_Willis> i used the tar.gz version from the songbird homepage the other day
[04:10] <Dr_Willis> Not tried it on 10.04 yet
[04:10] <tcsoccerman> ddecator, can docky be themed to look like mac os style?
[04:10] <ZykoticK9> ddecator, i just checked and i am using PPA daily - is working fine?!
[04:10] <amit1_> I guess theres no need to install iphone apps through the PC...we can just do it on the phone itself
[04:10] <kindofabuzz> is this the place to ask lucid server questions too?
[04:10] <tcsoccerman> kindofabuzz, yes
[04:11] <ddecator> amit1_, yup, it's the default right now
[04:11] <ddecator> tcsoccerman, yes
[04:11] <amit1_> okay guys, i'm about to plug in my Iphone...
[04:11] <tcsoccerman> amit1_,ooooo
[04:11] <ddecator> ZykoticK9, really? it keeps repeating the same song for me, but it SHOWS that it's playing the next song...even in safe mode
[04:11] <amit1_> If i dont respond in 5 minutes, don't come looking for me, just RUN
[04:11] <tcsoccerman> lol
[04:11] <ZykoticK9> ddecator, will i'll tell you what happens at the end of this song then
[04:11] <ZykoticK9> s/will/well
[04:12] <ddecator> ZykoticK9, it might take a few songs to happen
[04:12] <kindofabuzz> i tried to upgrade webmin and it just hung. so i stopped it, now i can't uninstall webmin because it says "E: The package webmin needs to be reinstalled, but I can't find an archive for it." but when i try to reinstall it just hangs again
[04:12] <ZykoticK9> !webmin > kindofabuzz
[04:12] <amit1_> "Iphone is now mounted" !!
[04:12] <tcsoccerman> nice! that is awesome
[04:12] <kindofabuzz> ZykoticK9, doh! i love webmin!
[04:13] <amit1_> wow it shows up in Rhythmbox right away....
[04:13] <tcsoccerman> try and sync a song. i dare you.
[04:13] <ZykoticK9> kindofabuzz, have you tried "sudo apt-get -f install" ?
[04:13] <kindofabuzz> ZykoticK9, i get the same error
[04:14] <amit1_> aw damnit, it won't play a song, it says I am missing a plugin...
[04:14] <amit1_> gstreamer
[04:14] <ZykoticK9> kindofabuzz, ? sorry man, no idea
[04:14] <amit1_> gstreamer is missing a plugin...
[04:14] <tcsoccerman> i think that is normal
[04:14] <tcsoccerman> amit1_, install the plugin
[04:14] <amit1_> yeh but what plugin
[04:15] <ddecator> do you have gstreamer installed?
[04:15] <ddecator> i don't think there is a separate plugin for it...
[04:15] <tcsoccerman> amit1_,http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=8889369&postcount=15
[04:15] <amit1_> let the games begin
[04:16] <ddecator> it's the thrill of the chase ;)
[04:19] <tcsoccerman> any luck amit1_?
[04:21] <amit1_> okay, well the cool thing is that Rhthmbox can actually search for the correct plugins to download
[04:21] <amit1_> SUCCESS, it plays, it plays!
[04:21] <ddecator> yes, but can you put music onto your iphone and have it play after disconnecting it?
[04:21] <tcsoccerman> ^
[04:21] <ddecator> i think that's where most people get stuck...
[04:22] <amit1_> hmm let me try..
[04:23] <ddecator> i've already abandoned itunes, but i can't upgrade my bb with ubuntu or watch netflix instant watch yet...get those two, and i can free up half of my hdd
[04:23] <amit1_> thats interesting, it shows up as a camera device and an Iphone on my desktop
[04:24] <tcsoccerman> both at the same time?
[04:24] <amit1_> yes
[04:24] <amit1_> I dont see any "Sync" button here
[04:24] <ZykoticK9> ddecator, well my 5 song playlist completed without repeating, i'll try the library now
[04:24] <chelz> where are the changes detailed for each alpha/beta release listed? such as the moving the window icons stuff
[04:24] <ddecator> ZykoticK9, son of a...might just be my system
[04:25] <ddecator> my sound indicator keeps resetting...
[04:25] <tcsoccerman> amit1_, you are supposed to drag and drop
[04:26] <amit1_> that worked from phone -> PC
[04:26] <tcsoccerman> amit1_, where people have trouble is that it does not sync after the drag and drop. well it does but only every other time.
[04:26] <amit1_> I dont think I can delete songs from the Iphone..
[04:27] <amit1_> "delete" is grayed out
[04:27] <ZykoticK9> chelz, i don't know of a changelog for all of lucid (other then the notes on the download page of each alpha so far), i think it's the individual packages that get changelogs - not too handy really
[04:27] <amit1_> oh wait it just deleted :)
[04:28] <chelz> ZykoticK9: i was hoping for some kind of official blog that would talk about the current status, things left to be done, things needing overhauls still, etc
[04:28] <chelz> is there no face of ubuntu+1?
[04:29] <ZykoticK9> chelz, have a look at Milestones - link wiki.ubuntu.com/LucidLynxSchedule
[04:29] <ddecator> yah, i think it's all for individual packages...a changelog of EVERYTHING in lucid would be extremely hectic to try and read
[04:29] <amit1_> okay, so heres an issue, it showed the file being deleted from the Iphone, but it actually didn't delete anything
[04:29] <ZykoticK9> chelz, face?
[04:29] <tcsoccerman> amit1_, cool. so everything has worked so far?
[04:29] <chelz> ZykoticK9: pr people almost
[04:29] <tcsoccerman> amit1_, nvm.
[04:30] <ZykoticK9> chelz, ?
[04:30] <chelz> ZykoticK9: say just something to announce all these new icons and themes, something more official than people loading up the discs themselves and reporting
[04:31] <ZykoticK9> chelz, "UserInterfaceFreeze" on March 4th so on that day we got the new theme
[04:31] <ZykoticK9> chelz, that way it wasn't up for debate
[04:32] <tcsoccerman> amit!_, have you successfully synced a file to the iphone from cp?
[04:33] <amit1_> well, it won't delete a song
[04:33] <chelz> ZykoticK9: isn't that really bad?
[04:33] <tcsoccerman> have you tried sync though?
[04:33] <amit1_> I didnt see a sync option
[04:34] <ZykoticK9> tcsoccerman, personally i think the design team need to re-read the Ubuntu Code of Conduct, but hey - Ubuntu != democracy
[04:34] <ZykoticK9> chelz, ^
[04:35] <tcsoccerman> zyk, what are you talking about?
[04:35] <chelz> ZykoticK9: so who said it was ok to push something out without community input?
[04:35] <tcsoccerman> amit1_, try dragging a file from cp library to iphone
[04:35] <ZykoticK9> tcsoccerman, sorry wrong person
[04:35] <amit1_> yes, thats what i'm going to try next
[04:35] <amit1_> copy mp3 from PC -> Iphone
[04:35] <amit1_> Iphone -> PC worked...
[04:36] <ZykoticK9> chelz, the Ubuntu designers get to do whatever they wish - and we live/deal with the fallout... that's life.
[04:36] <ZykoticK9> chelz, if you can't already tell - i'm NOT a fan of the theme/button change
[04:37] <chelz> well i heard the button location switched back to the right side. was this discussed with the design team on mailing lists anywhere
[04:37] <chelz> ?
[04:37] <ZykoticK9> chelz, BUT because it's linux we can customize it the way we want - so not too much to complain about really
[04:37] <ddecator> probably, just hard to know what ML
[04:38] <tcsoccerman> chelz, what butto nare you talking about
[04:38] <chelz> ZykoticK9: average users go with the default
[04:38] <chelz> tcsoccerman: the close/minimize/maximize window control buttons
[04:38] <Damascene> Hello, I've read the bug in the topic but when I start it goes to tty instead of X
[04:38] <ZykoticK9> tcsoccerman, the buttons for close/minimize/maximize where moved to the left like a mac
[04:39] <tcsoccerman> hmmmm
[04:39] <tcsoccerman> not sure if that isgood or bad yet
[04:39] <ZykoticK9> tcsoccerman, they can be changed though
[04:39] <tcsoccerman> of course, it is linux :)
[04:39] <chelz> i heard it's back to normal, but i haven't verified that
[04:39] <ZykoticK9> exactly!
[04:39] <tcsoccerman> i actually think it is good
[04:39] <amit1_> Error while getting peer-to-peer dbus connection: The name :1.180 was not provided by any .service files
[04:40] <amit1_> thats when trying PC -> Iphone
[04:40] <amit1_> .mp3 file
[04:40] <tcsoccerman> people view mac's as stylish so if linux does same thing linux is stylish too
[04:41] <ZykoticK9> chelz, buttons are NOT back to normal, just confirmed it in a default install VM
[04:41] <chelz> ZykoticK9: of the latest iso?
[04:41] <tcsoccerman> amit1_, that is after a simple drag and drop?
[04:42] <amit1_> yup
[04:42] <tcsoccerman> well that stinks
[04:42] <ZykoticK9> chelz, iso doesn't make a difference, no updates available for the vm
[04:42] <chelz> ZykoticK9: is this the design team you were talking about? https://launchpad.net/~canonical-ux
[04:42] <amit1_> I think its a known issue, I'm reading abouta  fix
[04:42] <tcsoccerman> link?
[04:42] <ZykoticK9> chelz, not sure - but i'd guess yes
[04:43] <ZykoticK9> chelz, i read it was 3 people that got thanks from Mark S. for the design
[04:45] <amit1_> You know what, it might now support the newer Iphone Firmwares
[04:45] <amit1_> *might NOT i mean
[04:46] <tcsoccerman> amit1_, the guy that got it working on the forum topic was running 3.1.3... the latest
[04:46] <amit1_> oh
[04:48] <amit1_> i think maybe my dbus is broken
[04:48] <amit1_> i recall seeing some random error messages about dbus
[04:48] <amit1_> let me try rebooting...see you in a little bit
[04:49] <mrenouf> So what's this about crazy button placement?
[04:49] <tcsoccerman> haha
[04:49] <ZykoticK9> mrenouf, they're on the left side a-la-mac
[04:49] <ZykoticK9> mrenouf, and in a different order then mac as well
[04:50] <mrenouf> Is this a Gnome 2.28 thing?
[04:50] <ZykoticK9> mrenouf, nope - just an Ubuntu thing
[04:50] <chelz> ZykoticK9: i think it's changed in the latest isos
[04:50]  * mrenouf *facepalm*
[04:50] <ZykoticK9> chelz, it hasn't
[04:50] <Blue1> getting some odd lockups
[04:51] <mrenouf> well, not major worries. I need to start evaluating it for a kiosk type system I maintain for my company.
[04:51] <mrenouf> display is all web based anyhow.
[04:51] <ZykoticK9> mrenouf, until this button thing - I loved Lucid!  much better then karmic.
[04:51] <Blue1> oh you can switch the buttons
[04:52] <Blue1> http://pkill-9.com/wordpress/?p=207
[04:52] <ZykoticK9> oh course Blue1 http://sites.google.com/site/alucidfs/how-i-do/move-buttons-to-right-side for my instruction on that matter
[04:52] <ZykoticK9> lol - i bet that pkill stole my directions
[04:52] <mrenouf> things I'm tracking are Flash flickering, intel X11 issues related to kms, audio level settings (pulseaudio)
[04:52] <Blue1> hopefully what emerges on april 29, won't have that option - it's VERY unpopular
[04:53] <Blue1> I have pixalisation with x's on my display
[04:53] <Blue1> yeah the speaker icon disappeared
[04:53] <ZykoticK9> Blue1, that person did steal my directions!
[04:53] <Blue1> sorry
[04:54] <ZykoticK9> Blue1, if it wasn't you - don't say sorry.
[04:54] <mrenouf> (*reads pkill-9 link*) Ooooh...  min/max/close buttons?! On the LEFT?! Oh noes....
[04:54] <Blue1> it was me
[04:54] <Blue1> I did however, say at the top "reposted from"
[04:54] <amit1_> okay no more dbus errors
[04:54] <ZykoticK9> Blue1, thief!  lol ;)
[04:55] <ZykoticK9> Blue1, nice
[04:55] <amit1_> but the Iphone doesnt actually get the mp3 file I send itg
[04:55] <Blue1> ZykoticK9: pkill is sort of a permanent memory thing so I don't forget
[04:56] <tcsoccerman> amit1_, hmm that stinks
[04:56] <ZykoticK9> Blue1, it's all good man - i was just joking
[04:56] <tcsoccerman> hopefully itouch is better
[04:56] <amit1_> yeh, so Rhthmbox shows everything working, uploading and deleting songs, but nothing is actually happening to the iphone
[04:57] <Blue1> ZykoticK9: /me breathes a sigh of relief --
[04:57] <ZykoticK9> Blue1, :)
[04:58] <Blue1> ZykoticK9: these were half-truths - which is worse then bald face lies:  http://pkill-9.com/wordpress/?p=167
[04:59] <Blue1> oops this one:  http://pkill-9.com/wordpress/?p=89
[05:00] <Blue1> that was a 6 month on/off thing
[05:02] <amit1_> now time to play with Mono Develop
[05:04] <Debian911> Anyone know if the issue with SSH not being started after an upgrade from Ubuntu Server 9.10 to 10.4 has been resolved?
[05:05] <amit1_> sshd you mean?
[05:47] <Debian911> All I know is that when I upgraded from Ubtunu Server 9.10 to 10.4 - rebooted server, it could respond to pings but port 22 OR 9004 weren't open so couldn't get in
[05:48] <Debian911> apparantly another user - who had physical access to their box (i dont) - did the update and reproduced it - it was stuck on a grub screen I believe
[06:18] <syddraf> I'm running lucid with gnome and there appears to be some kind of graphical error. There is a one or two pixels line around my wallpaper that changes color depending on the gnome theme. I've never had this problem with gnome before and am wondering if it has something to do with the 10.04 release or gnome itself.
[06:19] <Dr_Willis> syddraf:  ive noticed that also
[06:19] <Dr_Willis> not sure whats causeing it
[06:20] <syddraf> Dr_Willis: Alright. Guess I'll wait for official release to see if it gets fixed. It's not a usability problem, just annoying. =P
[06:34] <ZykoticK9> syddraf, try running "nautilus --quit"
[06:38] <ZykoticK9> Dr_Willis, you might be interested in ^^ as well
[06:47] <syddraf> ZykoticK9: AMG! It works! Thanks
[06:47] <ZykoticK9> syddraf, don't think that is a permanent fix, you might have to rerun the command
[06:48] <syddraf> ZykoticK9: is it possible to uninstall nautilus since I use Konqueror anyway?
[06:48] <ZykoticK9> syddraf, no idea - i don't use KDE at all i'm affraid
[06:49] <syddraf> Let's try it!
[06:49] <syddraf> Looks like not, it wants to remove gnome-session too
[06:50] <ZykoticK9> syddraf, then it's probably not a good idea then :(  sorry man
[06:50] <syddraf> ah well thanks for telling me how to get rid of it ^_^
[06:50] <ZykoticK9> glad to help
[07:05] <Dr_Willis> replaceing nautilus with konqueror - is a rather complex task
[07:06] <Dr_Willis> i recall guides on doing it ages ago...
[07:06] <ZykoticK9> Dr_Willis, did you see the "nautilus --quit" to fix the pixel boarder around wallpaper?
[07:06] <Dr_Willis> ZykoticK9:  so kill off the desktop icons? :)
[07:06] <Dr_Willis> or restart nautilus
[07:06] <ZykoticK9> Dr_Willis, just restart's nautilus without the boarder
[07:07] <Dr_Willis> so its a Nautilus bug then it seems
[07:07] <ZykoticK9> yup
[07:07]  * holstein is just going to pretend the border is a new feature ;)
[07:11] <Dr_Willis> like the buttons on the left...
[07:14] <tgpraveen12> in the downloads folder now i always have a bar at the top telling me "you can receive files via bluetooth in this folder" and there is no way to close this bar.
[07:14] <tgpraveen12> known bug?
[07:16] <ZykoticK9> tgpraveen12, same thing here... don't know if it's a bug or not?
[07:18] <tgpraveen12> it bugs me a lot
[07:18] <om26er> I removed bluez and now its gone
[07:20] <robert__> is there a way to make the gyachi repos work with lucid?
[07:23] <nigelb> tgpraveen12: its a top bar in nautilius?
[07:26] <robert__> is there a way to make the gyachi repos work with lucid?
[08:02] <Dr_Willis> tgpraveen12:  never seen a way to get rid of those IDIOTIC 'tips' either
[08:03] <Dr_Willis> its an info bar with a single button. Like you see with  media with photos and so forth
[08:03] <Dr_Willis> or some windows cd's
[08:03] <Dr_Willis> 'this is a photo cd - open fProt?'  (its NOT a photo cd. and i NEVER want to use that app...) :)
[08:05] <tgpraveen12> Dr_Willis: iirc those bars have a close button and anyways u can permanently disable those bar types by going
[08:05] <tgpraveen12> in prefs->preffered apps
[08:05] <tgpraveen12> sorry not there
[08:05] <tgpraveen12> but in nautilius prefs
[08:06] <tgpraveen12> i think
[08:23] <Dr_Willis> tgpraveen12:  ive seen no close button on them here
[08:23] <Dr_Willis> let me look again
[08:24] <Dr_Willis> zeven my 'downloads' directory has one  To  "Launch preferances"
[08:25] <Dr_Willis> and the screen space it takes up is at least as much as the titlebar/menu combined. So on my netbook its a real eyesoar
[08:26] <Dr_Willis> i dont see any settingsd in Nautilus perferances to disable them
[08:26] <tgpraveen12> Dr_Willis: in nautilius prefs
[08:26] <tgpraveen12> go in media tab
[08:27] <tgpraveen12> there set the photos thing to do nothing
[08:27] <tgpraveen12> and voila ur happy again
[08:27] <Dr_Willis> they are all set to DO nothing now :)
[08:27] <Dr_Willis> and i still get it on the 'Downloads' directory
[08:27] <ZykoticK9> tgpraveen12, that didn't effect my ~/Downloads directory either
[08:28] <Dr_Willis> Heh. It may affect other stuff.. but not the downloads dir at least
[08:28] <tgpraveen12> yes the problem i had originally is that there is no way to remove that bar in downloads
[08:28] <Dr_Willis> and gee on my netbook gnome STILL makes dialogs like that preferances one Too tall to fit on the screen
[08:28] <nigelb> tgpraveen12: isn't just a help kinda thing?
[08:28] <nigelb> I dont think its a bug, its a feature
[08:28] <tgpraveen12> this will of course not make it go away there as it deals with meida
[08:29] <tgpraveen12> nigelb: it being there is of help sure. but not being able to make it go away once it informs, or once user clicks it, or users sets it up or something
[08:29] <tgpraveen12> is the bug
[08:29] <ddecator> nigelb, way to sound like a dev =p
[08:29] <nigelb> ddecator: lol
[08:30] <Dr_Willis> and it definatly dosetn need tobe so tall
[08:31] <tgpraveen12> Dr_Willis: could u please file a bug for the downloads folder bar
[08:31] <tgpraveen12> and give us the link
[08:34] <dto> hi robert__
[08:34] <robert__> hey
[08:34] <nigelb> Dr_Willis: probably against nautilus package
[08:34] <robert__> is kde 4.4 fast as gnome? just curious about tryin it out
[08:34] <ddecator> what's the bug?
[08:36] <ddecator> i'm too tired to read backlog right now =p
[08:37] <ZykoticK9> ddecator, the ~/Downloads and the Personal File Sharing bar along the top
[08:37] <Dr_Willis> i imagien it will get said its a feature. :)
[08:37] <Dr_Willis> i even wonder how it knows its a special dir.
[08:37] <ZykoticK9> ddecator, not being able to disable it is the actual bug
[08:38] <ddecator> ZykoticK9, oh, didn't notice that there...
[08:38] <robert__> is kde 4.4 fast as gnome? just curious about tryin it out
[08:39] <ddecator> robert__, i think they're about the same, but it depends on how you set them up
[08:39] <robert__> ok thanks
[08:39] <robert__> i know the previous ones were slow just checkin
[08:40] <nigelb> Dr_Willis: its either a gconf entry or there is a hidden file
[08:40]  * ddecator checks gconf
[08:41] <hifi> oh cmon, dpkg *is* slow with fsync
[08:42] <ddecator> i don't see anything in regards to that in gconf (looked at nautilus)
[09:01] <Debian911> Is there anything we need to enable in kernel 2.6.33 .config for TRIM with SDD drives or automatic?
[09:02] <rsk> TRIM?
[09:05] <Dr_Willis> i thought6 that feture was a work in progress with SDD and some filesystems
[09:33] <Debian911> TRIM being implemented in 2.6.33 for SSDs
[09:36] <YaManicKill> rsk: trim is essentially like defragging for SSDs
[09:36] <YaManicKill> but not quite
[09:36] <YaManicKill> its hard to explain...
[09:37] <Dr_Willis> dosent the filesystem also have to support the feature? I recaall btrfs (brfs?) having it as a work in progress
[09:37] <YaManicKill> i would immagine so...
[09:54] <Dr_Willis> joy - nvidida decuded to go back to low gfx mode. Heh
[09:54] <Dr_Willis> lets see if it can fix itself now
[09:58] <tgpraveen12> hey guys
[09:58] <tgpraveen12> am in somewhat trouble i decided to try kubuntu so installed kubuntu-desktop on my gnome lucid
[09:58] <tgpraveen12> but now i want to remove it how do i do so?
[09:59] <tgpraveen12> since kubuntu-desktop is a metapackage removing it is not removing anything else like amarok etc
[09:59] <tgpraveen12> please hlep i want to get rid of all traces of kubuntu/kde?
[10:00] <Dr_Willis> hmm
[10:00] <Dr_Willis> !puregnome
[10:00] <Dr_Willis> try that
[10:00] <tamran> !purekde
[10:00] <tamran> awesome, this bot is great
[10:00] <Dr_Willis> I keep kubuntu and ubuntu on the same system all the time.
[10:00] <Dr_Willis> just a few quirks
[10:01] <tamran> howdy Dr_Willis
[10:02] <tgpraveen12> Dr_Willis: i wont loose any of my gnome data by puregnome command right?
[10:02] <tgpraveen12> and also from what i see it is removing only kdelibs4c2a kdelibs5-data . will all kubuntu packages get removed by this?
[10:04] <tgpraveen12> Dr_Willis: ??
[10:04] <dns53> i have a bug with the nouvau driver leaving me with a black screen, i have set VESA in the xorg.conf but it is ignoring that, i have moved the upstart jobs and still i have a blank screen on boot
[10:05] <Dr_Willis> 'data' as in settings in the users home dirs should NEVER ever get touched by the package manager systems
[10:05] <Dr_Willis> that command might not be valid for 10.04 - ive not tried it
[10:06] <tgpraveen12> Dr_Willis: hmm and why is it installing ubuntu-desktop?
[10:06] <Dr_Willis> you told it to?
[10:06] <tgpraveen12> resintalling rather
[10:06] <Dr_Willis> to replace anythign that might got removed..
[10:06] <tgpraveen12> ok
[10:06] <tgpraveen12> giving it a shot
[10:08] <tgpraveen12> hmm Dr_Willis from the looks of it is not working completely it says only 297 MB will be freed but when i installed it said installatioon would take up around 650 MB
[10:09] <tgpraveen12> or is that because the size given during installation included the size of pakcages which were already present on my system (but also required by kubuntu-desktop)
[10:11] <Dr_Willis> no idea
[10:11] <Dr_Willis> very likely however id think
[10:12] <tgpraveen12> just for everyone's information http://orangesquash.org.uk/2007/12/14/removing-kubuntu-desktop/
[10:12] <tgpraveen12> the info at that link worked like a charm.
[10:13] <tgpraveen12> Dr_Willis: puregnome thing does not work completely.
[10:14] <Dr_Willis> Im not suprised at that. :)
[10:15] <Dr_Willis> the use of meta-packages to install whole desktops - is a little.. goofy in ways
[10:16] <tgpraveen12> i still dont understand why when it installs it pulls in all the dependencies and acts as a proper meta package but not while uninstalling
[10:16] <tgpraveen12> the exact reverse should occur
[10:16] <Dr_Willis> because its a meta-package
[10:16] <Dr_Willis> a packaget that JUST depends on other packages
[10:17] <Dr_Willis> removeing ubuntu-desktop package does not remove all of gnome
[10:17] <Dr_Willis> same with other XXXXX-desktop packages
[10:17] <tgpraveen12> well imo it either should/
[10:17] <tgpraveen12> synaptic should have a option/interface
[10:17] <tgpraveen12> to remove all dependencies of one package in a single click
[10:18] <Dr_Willis> you can get into  catch-22 situations and other oddities that can be worse. :)
[10:18] <yofel> tgpraveen12: it's set in /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/01autoremove (see the Never MarkAuto Section)
[10:18] <Dr_Willis> remove openoffice.. oh wait.. that removes ubuntu-desktop.. that removes... everything? ":)
[10:19] <Dr_Willis> not a good idea.
[10:19] <Dr_Willis> aptitude does a better job in this area i hear.
[10:19] <Dr_Willis> but i rarely remove stuff
[10:20] <yofel> Dr_Willis: as I said to tgpraveen12, this is a setting in apt for all metapackages, aptitude doesn't behave any different when removing them
[10:20] <Dr_Willis> yofel:  makes you wonder why its not the default then.
[10:21] <yofel> hm? not removing depends on metapackages should be the default
[10:21] <yofel> s/on/of
[10:22] <kermiac> anyone else seeing non graphical plymouth after todays updates? bug 538662
[10:22] <Dr_Willis> theres several suggestions on  that Brainstorm site abut ways to improve it..  Perhaps that may be fix.
[10:22] <Dr_Willis> kermiac:  it worked just a little bit ago for me.
[10:23] <kermiac> hmm.. OP has nvidia, I saw it on ati
[10:23] <Dr_Willis> I got nvidia
[10:23] <Dr_Willis> but my NV system booted to Low-res again today
[10:23] <kermiac> ok, I'll keep digging - thanks anyway Dr_Willis :)
[10:24] <Dr_Willis> I hage to wonder at the manpower devoted to xplash and plymouth. and cant help but think. itd be better to just remove the 2 things...
[10:24] <Dr_Willis> :)
[10:25] <Dr_Willis> Hmm.. the position slider in a video in totem is.. err.. errattic....
[10:48] <Debian911> Anyone tried updating from Ubuntu Server 9.10 to 10.4 lately (last 3 days)?
[10:53] <yofel> Debian911: I tried an upgrade test in a VM 2 days ago, went fine on x86, and failed with a dependency cycle on amd64
[10:53] <yofel> I'll try it again tomorrow
[10:54] <Debian911> yofel: yea, looking to move from 64bit 9.10 to 10.4
[10:54] <Debian911> last time myself and another user in here tried it
[10:54] <Debian911> gets stuck on bootup
[10:54] <Debian911> pingable, but yea
[10:58] <yofel> Debian911: plymouth I guess
[10:59] <yofel> the only minor thing I found was that when 10.04 server boots it stays on tty7 after plymouth exits
[10:59] <yofel> you have to manually switch to tty1 to log in
[11:02] <Dr_Willis> thats odd..
[11:02] <Dr_Willis> normally X is on tty7
[11:02] <om26er> it is
[11:04] <hifi> what does notify-osd use for transparency?
[11:04] <hifi> (like, how do I make it work without gnome and compiz)
[11:06] <dns53> clutter
[11:06] <dns53> you need a compositing manager to use the transpareny
[11:06] <hifi> would xcompmgr do the trick?
[11:06] <dns53> yes
[11:06] <hifi> lets see...
[11:06] <hifi> and thanks
[11:09] <hifi> ah, looks nice
[11:09] <Debian911> yofel: Ah that would explain it, I dont have physical axx to server so thats whats stopping me atm - do you know if it has been resolved?
[11:10] <yofel> don't know
[11:11] <yofel> Debian911: ssh doesn't work?
[11:11] <Debian911> yofel: nope thats the issue
[11:11] <Debian911> yofel: both 22 and 9004 are down, however its pingable
[11:11] <yofel> :/
[11:11] <Debian911> the user I was testing with the otha day could reproduce it - but he said when he turned on monitor that was an error
[11:11] <Debian911> cant for the life of me remeber
[11:11] <Debian911> grub pos?
[11:23] <airtonix> what is the font called thats being used in the new ubuntu identity?
[11:24] <om26er> airtonix, that's for Lucid+1 and no name yet
[11:25] <airtonix> woops
[11:25] <Dr_Willis> airtonix:  its called the 'ubuntu' font last i looked into it.
[11:25] <om26er> ah
[11:25] <Dr_Willis> saw it mentioned on some Webup8 site or OMGubuntu blog
[11:26] <om26er> I saw it at markshuttleworth.com and forgot
[12:04] <xsacha> how can i configure Xorg on lucid lynx? is there anything like xorg.conf? im using a radeon r600 (opensource drivers)
[12:04] <penguin42> xsacha: You can create an xorg.conf and it will get used, but it normally doesn't need it
[12:05] <xsacha> oh ok thanks
[12:10] <penguin42> xsacha: What are you trying to do?
[12:10] <xsacha> it seems it uses radeon driver by default. i wanted to use radeonhd driver
[12:12] <penguin42> xsacha: Ah OK - I'm usign Radeon driver on an Rv710 (although I'm usign the xorg-edgers bleeding edge X packages)
[12:12] <vistakiller> hi
[12:12] <xsacha> is radeonhd driver better than radeon driver for anything?
[12:12] <vistakiller> i still have problme with synaptic and plasma dekstop
[12:13] <vistakiller> when i use it to unistall or install a package plasma crash
[12:13] <xsacha> im just annoyed with this problem. the radeon driver has no power management for my card. it is like it is running at full load. laptop really hot, fans running hard
[12:13] <penguin42> xsacha: I haven't really tried switching between them, I came to the conclusion Radeon was developing more and kept with that
[12:15] <xsacha> oh radeonhd only lists r500 and r600 cards. but im sure r600 is very similar to r700. just wish catalyst 10.3 was out
[12:16] <penguin42> xsacha: Yeh r700 seems pretty similar, I think they had to make a few tweeks for it though
[12:16] <vistakiller> if i have to bug report this problem where i have to do it?
[12:16] <vistakiller> to synaptic or plasma?
[12:16] <penguin42> vistakiller: If plasma crashes I say the bug is in plasma - I might be wrong bu tit's a good start
[12:17] <vistakiller> ok
[12:21] <yofel> vistakiller: didn't we debug this yesterday?
[12:21] <vistakiller> yes but today i try to unistall some package
[12:22] <vistakiller> and it crash again with this now
[12:22] <vistakiller> http://pastebin.ubuntu-gr.org/m627d9cd3
[12:22] <vistakiller> i dont run synaptic with daisy but from kmenu
[12:22] <yofel> hm, ok, daisy crashed again, seems like it just needs to be running to crash
[12:23] <vistakiller> but i dont run it from daisy
[12:23] <vistakiller> i think i must unistall it
[12:24] <yofel> vistakiller: well, I don't know, but the crash says: #6  0x00007f68fd778869 in ?? () from /usr/lib/kde4/plasma_applet_daisy.so
[12:24] <vistakiller> strange problem...
[12:24] <vistakiller> i have to unistall it then
[12:24] <yofel> vistakiller: can you install 'plasma-widget-daisy-dbgsym' and try to crash it again?
[12:24] <vistakiller> ok
[12:24] <yofel> that way we won't see just ?? in the crash
[12:25] <vistakiller> ok i do
[12:25] <vistakiller> and something else
[12:25] <vistakiller> they have change the kontack programme?
[12:25] <xsacha> penguin42, i also have an rv710.. how do i get your driver? do i need git mesa and git xorg?
[12:26] <vistakiller> i have set my contacts in previous edition with groups etc
[12:26] <vistakiller> and now i cant fine anything
[12:26] <yofel> vistakiller: dunno, lucid has whatever kontact is shipped with KDE SC 4.4.1
[12:26] <vistakiller> found*
[12:26] <penguin42> xsacha: I *think* the only special thing I have is the PPA from here https://launchpad.net/~xorg-edgers
[12:26] <yofel> vistakiller: maybe you'll get a better answer in #kubuntu-devel about kontact
[12:26] <vistakiller> ok
[12:27] <xsacha> penguin42, thx
[12:27] <penguin42> xsacha: Probably best at this page actually - half way down is adding the PPA: https://launchpad.net/~xorg-edgers/+archive/ppa
[12:27] <vistakiller> i cant find this package plasma-widget-daisy-dbgsym
[12:28] <yofel> vistakiller: oh yes, please add the dbgsym repository like described on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProgramCrash first
[12:28] <yofel> vistakiller: you'll just need the first command for lucid
[12:29] <yofel> (right now)
[12:29] <vistakiller> ok
[12:31] <vistakiller> wait to realog because i am in black screen now
[12:31] <vistakiller> ok lets see...
[12:32] <Vigo> Hello, can I install Lucid on the same HDD as a 9.10,8.04LTS and BSD partition/slice?
[12:32] <yofel> vistakiller: instead of re-login, can't you just press alt+f2 and run 'plasma-desktop' there? should get your desktop back
[12:32] <vistakiller> yes is better this?
[12:33] <penguin42> Vigo: I think so, if you have spare space I think it will offer you the chance to install in an extra partition, I'm not sure what it will do with the boot loader
[12:33] <vistakiller> i have to do something else now that i have install the debug package?
[12:34] <yofel> vistakiller: don't think, but if you crash daisy now you should get a backtrace with more information (required if you want to file a bug)
[12:34] <vistakiller> yes but it says that it dont have too much information...
[12:34] <yofel> vistakiller: does the crash app offer you to install more debug packages?
[12:35] <Vigo> penguin42: Thank you, I had to alter the BSD loader already, that was no real trouble , it is now a triple boot. This box is just a testing/Alpha/Beta box, so any crash or data loss is of no real concern.
[12:35] <yofel> (there should be a button)
[12:35] <vistakiller> no
[12:35] <vistakiller> is gray
[12:35] <vistakiller> i cant sellect it
[12:35] <penguin42> Vigo: Cool!
[12:35] <yofel> vistakiller: can you check if you have 'kubuntu-debug-installer' installed?
[12:35] <vistakiller> ok
[12:36] <vistakiller> was not
[12:36] <vistakiller> and there is more package
[12:36] <vistakiller> installer-dbg and installer-dbgsy
[12:36] <vistakiller> i have to install and that
[12:36] <vistakiller> ?
[12:37] <yofel> vistakiller: for now you won't need those (unless you crash the debug installer ;) )
[12:37] <vistakiller> a ok
[12:37] <Vigo> good one yofel. This is fun! again
[12:38] <AngryParsley> is there a way to have my desktop icons auto-arrange by name? that way if I delete one, the others move to fill in the gap?
[12:38] <vistakiller> ok not i cant sellect the option but...
[12:39] <vistakiller> one message says "could not find debug symbol for this application" :P
[12:39] <AngryParsley> as it is, I have to right click on the desktop and hit "clean up by name" every time I add or delete something on my desktop
[12:39] <yofel> vistakiller: o.O ok...
[12:39] <yofel> vistakiller: let's try it the manual way
[12:39] <vistakiller> ok i do it second time and now it works
[12:39] <yofel> ah ok :)
[12:39] <vistakiller> we is very funky my dekstop today
[12:39] <vistakiller> he want to play with me i think :D
[12:39] <yofel> ^^
[12:40] <vistakiller> ok i install it now
[12:40] <vistakiller> and now i have dependency problem :P
[12:41] <Vigo> AngryParsley,: No auto-arrange thingy?
[12:41] <Vigo> yet?
[12:41] <vistakiller> "the following packages block the installation:kdelibs5-dbpg
[12:41] <dodddummy> is 10.04 about as stable as past releases this far out from release date?
[12:41] <AngryParsley> Vigo: there's an option to keep them aligned, but that doesn't stop them from overlapping or having huge gaps between them
[12:41] <AngryParsley> it just aligns them to a grid
[12:41] <Dr_Willis> seems decently stable to me dodddummy
[12:42] <AngryParsley> it doesn't sort them alphabetically either
[12:42] <Dr_Willis> every so often theres a quirk or 2 or packages get messed up
[12:42] <Dr_Willis> and last week there was some nvidia issues..
[12:42] <yofel> vistakiller: o.O can you try to install the packages it tells you from synaptic (kpackagekit is indeed stupid sometimes)
[12:42] <vistakiller> i do it now
[12:43] <dodddummy> Dr_Willis, haven't seen you in a while.  i used to think you were following me.  guess, the change in nick threw you off my trail
[12:43] <dodddummy> :)
[12:43] <Vigo> AngryParsley: I am just getting back into Debian/Linux, is the desktop Qt or C?
[12:43] <dodddummy> Dr_Willis, that's good enough for me.  i'll install.
[12:43] <yofel> Vigo: gtk/gnome is C, Qt/KDE is c++
[12:43] <Vigo> Thank you.
[12:44] <yofel> Vigo: but some apps use PyGTK and PyQt, python is quite popular in ubuntu
[12:44] <AngryParsley> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=172128
[12:44] <AngryParsley> :(
[12:44] <AngryParsley> 5 years and no progress on it
[12:44] <Vigo> I like Py
[12:45] <Vigo> thon
[12:45] <vistakiller> ok i think i can install this package from synaptic
[12:46] <Vigo> Thank you for the assistance and input, I will triple load this old HDD now and be back or go sailing.
[12:46] <vistakiller> why kpackagekit is so crap programme?
[12:46] <vistakiller> and why they have put it in kubuntu
[12:46] <vistakiller> adept was better and synaptic is great
[12:46] <yofel> vistakiller: no idea, haven't used it much and I think they use it since it uses packagekit
[12:46] <yofel> yep
[12:47] <xsacha> kpackagekit doesnt even work for me
[12:47] <yofel> actually kpackagekit is still in KDE playground, I liked adept better too
[12:47] <xsacha> complains about not having root access if i run it normally
[12:47] <xsacha> i run it with kdesudo and it crashes lol
[12:48] <Dr_Willis> auto sorting icons will confuse new users.. :)
[12:48] <vistakiller> ok now i will crash it again
[12:48] <Dr_Willis> like being able to confgure screensaver settings.. too confuseing
[12:48] <yofel> Dr_Willis: who said by default, but it's odd that nautilus can't do that...
[12:49] <Dr_Willis> cant have this confuseing stuff..  But moving the Min/Max/Close button is ok.. :P
[12:49] <yofel> lol
[12:49] <vistakiller> yofel now it works
[12:49] <Dr_Willis> next you will be wanting animated gif icons
[12:49] <vistakiller> i have to bug report it i think?
[12:49] <vistakiller> to bugs kde?
[12:49] <yofel> vistakiller: nice, can you pastebin the crash (just curious)
[12:49] <yofel> vistakiller: and yes, please file a bug at bugs.kde.org
[12:50] <vistakiller> here http://pastebin.ubuntu-gr.org/m63f9030b
[12:51] <vistakiller> i report now to bugs.kde but first i will make a coffee :D
[12:53] <Dr_Willis_> Found a new cool renamer app ->  http://file-folder-ren.sourceforge.net/index.php?page=Download
[12:53] <AngryParsley> has anyone else had a problem with trackerd using 100% CPU and tons of memory and doing tons of disk IO? I think it's trying to index/decode a blu-ray rip or something
[12:53] <Dr_Willis_> Now perhaps i can stop using 'bulk rename utility' in wine
[12:54] <dns53> ok i have a bug where something is causing my screen to go black on boot, i have moved all the upstart scripts that might start x to another directory but that has not fixed anything
[12:56] <dodddummy> Dr_Willis, there is a bulk rename function in thunar.  did you not or just didn't like it?
[12:56] <Dr_Willis> i hate thunar
[12:56] <Dr_Willis> rox-filer has  a good renamer feature also.. but its lacking in some ways
[12:56] <vistakiller> yofek have you see anything?
[12:57] <yofel> dns53: did you try to disable plymouth
[12:57] <tgpraveen12> is it just me or for last few days nautilius seems to be very fast at opening folders
[12:57] <yofel> vistakiller: nope, but the crash looks ok now
[12:57] <dodddummy> Dr_Willis, aha.  i like it because so far every time i've asked them to add something they did.
[12:57] <dns53> yofel plymoth, upstart, gdm, kdm, failsafe-x
[12:57] <tgpraveen12> i think it's caching/prefetching or something but whatever it is it rocks
[12:57] <vistakiller> ok thanks for one more time for your help :)
[12:57] <yofel> vistakiller: yw ;)
[12:58] <xsacha> penguin42, any idea if there is a driver that has power management?
[13:00] <yofel> hmpf, ubuntu-vm-builder crashes when trying to build a hardy vm -.-
[13:02] <vistakiller> yofel programme search for other bug report and show 10 more
[13:02] <vistakiller> but from other programmes like amarok
[13:02] <vistakiller> do i have to do a new?
[13:02] <Cyberkilla> When is Plymouth going to be the only thing I see when I boot up one of my computers? I still see a few lines of fsck, kernel logs and a blinking cursor before Plymouth loads :-( Then, on shutdown, I see a few seconds of TERM signals and a final line "disconnected from system bus".
[13:02] <yofel> vistakiller: check if the backtrace is *exactly* the same, if not, file a new bug
[13:03] <red> Cyberkilla: I removed Plymouth and my Ubuntu gets to desktop twice faster :P
[13:03] <red> And does not "double login" boot anymore.
[13:03] <Cyberkilla> red: Plymouth does not double-login for my on Nouveau any more btw.
[13:03] <red> I have automatic login and if Plymouth is enabled, I get thrown back into login screen after being few seconds.
[13:03] <Cyberkilla> red: Also, I tried removing Plymouth, but I found that standby wouldn't work.
[13:03] <vistakiller> ok is difficult but i try
[13:04] <red> Cyberkilla: when was the bug sorted out for you?
[13:04] <red> I removed it 2 days ago and been happy without, I don't use standby ever tho so that's not an issue for me.
[13:04] <Cyberkilla> red: A few days ago. I haven't tried it with the nVidia proprietary drivers yet though.
[13:04] <yofel> vistakiller: the relevant crash lines that start with [KCrash handler] #5 ...
[13:04] <red> Alright
[13:04] <vistakiller> ok
[13:04] <red> Suppose I'll reinstall it after few weeks and see if it still goes apeshit
[13:05] <Cyberkilla> red: Also, I would love to be able to auto-login, but my keyring isn't unlocked, which means I get prompted for a wifi password every time - this defeats the object, I think you'll agree:)
[13:05] <red> Cyberkilla: it's easy to remove keyring locking
[13:05] <Cyberkilla> red: Remove the password for the keyring?
[13:06] <vistakiller> and one title for the bug report?
[13:06] <red> Applications -> Accessories -> Passwords and Encryption keys -> then unlock login one (if that is the default for you too) and change it to an empty pw.
[13:06] <vistakiller> do you have something in your mind?
[13:06] <yofel> vistakiller: hm, I would use something like 'daisy plasma applet crashes while using synaptic'
[13:06] <Cyberkilla> red: Thanks. I think I'll try it. It's a shame I can't use a separate keyring for wifi.
[13:06] <red> For my laptop I would not remove the keyring, but for the desk pc I do, cause I hate the wifi not jumping online automaticly if I remote powerup my pc
[13:07] <yofel> vistakiller: anything more specific goes into the bug description
[13:07] <vistakiller> ok
[13:07] <red> Cyberkilla: it might not "stick" sometimes btw, even if you change it to empty I got the password prompt for keyring on the next boot, but I redid the changes and it persisted.
[13:07] <red> And for gfs PC I had to do it three times iirc
[13:08] <red> She doesn't want to enter passwords for going online to play facebook games and msn :)
[13:09] <Cyberkilla> red: It is a bit of a flaw really. Anybody coming from OS X or Windows will expect autologin to actually automatically log you in. Hitting the desktop and having to give applications passwords separately isn't what most people have in mind:)
[13:10] <vistakiller> ok done
[13:11] <red> yeah, i don't really see the difference in supplying a password on a login menu or a nag screen
[13:11] <red> automatic should be what it's named, automatic :)
[13:12] <vistakiller> https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=230709
[13:14] <xsacha> damn.. core i7 4.3GHz hex-core...
[13:15] <yofel> vistakiller: thanks
[13:15] <penguin42> xsacha: That must fly :-))
[13:16] <xsacha> origin pc are selling it pre-overclocked
[13:16] <vistakiller> one nice launcher have kde and i cant use it anymore :(
[13:16] <xsacha> maybe it's fast enough to run kde4 :P
[13:17] <vistakiller> yeah kde4.4 is too unstabble general
[13:17] <yofel> well, all crashes that I had are finally fixed with 4.4.1
[13:17] <vistakiller> now in every major upgrade to new version in kde we have many problems
[13:17] <vistakiller> i just see that i have lost and my contacts
[13:18] <vistakiller> i have my contacts with groups but now i cant find them
[13:18] <vistakiller> i realog
[13:29] <vistakiller> i have and a strange problem with akonadi every startup and first time i login to the dekstop
[13:30] <vistakiller> http://kubuntuforums.net/forums/index.php?topic=3110507.0
[13:30] <vistakiller> i have this errors
[13:41] <dodddummy> just tried the live cd.  please tell me i can turn off the apple emulation.
[13:42] <TheInfinity> apple emulation?
[13:44] <dodddummy> TheInfinity, the buttons are all apple like.
[13:44] <dodddummy> i suppose that's a theme i can change.
[13:44] <dodddummy> apple is so non free is just a sore point for me.  i'll get over it.
[13:45] <dodddummy> or change distros :)
[13:45] <yofel> dodddummy: the buttons aren't theme related, google a bit and you'll find out how to change them back
[13:45] <dodddummy> yofel, i will.
[13:46] <AngryParsley> dodddummy: so if you didn't know about apple your reaction would be, "oh, pretty icons"?
[13:46] <AngryParsley> and not, "these icons are pretty. pretty icons remind me of apple. I don't like apple. by the transitive property, I don't like these icons"
[13:47] <dodddummy> AngryParsley, no, my reaction would be, "why in the world would they change the default after i've been used to it for many years now instead of making it an option i can change to if i like?"
[13:47] <TheInfinity> AngryParsley: computers always have been religious wars.  just accept it. :)
[13:47] <penguin42> dodddummy: You aren't the only person to dislike it - I agree with you, as do many others
[13:47] <yofel> dodddummy: because ubuntu wants to revolutionate usability ;)
[13:48] <AngryParsley> wait, what?
[13:48] <AngryParsley> I thought you said you didn't like the look of the buttons
[13:48] <dodddummy> penguin42, i just don't like it when the defaults change instead of giving me the option to switch.
[13:48] <AngryParsley> just changing some icon colors/bitmaps shouldn't change usability
[13:48] <penguin42> dodddummy: Yep, I believe it should be part of the theme
[13:49] <dodddummy> yofel, changing the order of those three buttons makes for better usability?
[13:49] <yofel> dodddummy: don't ask me, ask the artwork theme, their idea...
[13:49] <yofel> s/theme/team
[13:49] <AngryParsley> ohh you mean _that_ thing. the placing of the window buttons on the left side and reversing them so the close button is right next to the file menu
[13:49] <penguin42> dodddummy: There's an argument going on on the ayatanna mailing list about this
[13:49] <AngryParsley> yeah I hate that too. apparently it has been fixed though
[13:50] <AngryParsley> that whole business is quite a CF. I mean new UI stuff a month before an LTS release?
[13:50] <dodddummy> AngryParsley, yeah, it's only 20? years now.  anyway, it's a not much.  i'll just change its.
[13:51] <dodddummy> AngryParsley, that's a reasonable point though.  why not change for the next release.  oh well.
[13:51] <Sioux_33> hi question i cant use my tv box in ubuntu cos there is no driver for it. i have win7 and ubuntu 9.01 on hdd in win7 my box is working perfect i want to ask is there any chance to open win media center in ubuntu using wine or something?
[13:52] <balas> is there any way to get around the lucid not rebooting issue ?  or fails to boot ?  i've got an nvidia 8600 gt
[13:52] <AngryParsley> I wouldn't mind it if ubuntu put the three window button on the left side, but they need to order them the same as OS X and center the window title
[13:52] <AngryParsley> *buttons
[13:52] <dodddummy> AngryParsley, i'm still going to install in a minute
[13:52] <om26er> balas, what do you see?
[13:53] <balas> i haven't tried it for some days, the past week or so, i used a daily build, did a reboot, and nothing came up :(
[13:53] <balas> i was using an ati card at the time
[13:53] <AngryParsley> heh, in 8.10 and 9.04 it was the intel cards that had issues. how the tables have turned!
[13:53] <om26er> balas, have you tried the latest daily?
[13:53] <balas> actually you know i didn't use a daily build i don't think
[13:54] <balas> nope
[13:54] <balas> i think i may have sudo update-manager -d
[13:54] <st4aluck> can somebody tell me if I can make my webcam pleomax pwc-3800 works in 10.04
[13:54] <balas> i'll give it a shot.
[13:55] <st4aluck> can somebody tell me if I can make my webcam pleomax pwc-3800 to work in 10.04
[13:56] <robin0800> penguin42: you can change the position of the buttons but not sure you can change their order
[13:57] <penguin42> robin0800: Well there is the general/button_layout in gconf
[13:57] <om26er> st4aluck, it worked in karimc?
[13:57] <AngryParsley> grumble grumble. the keyboard layout indicator says the same thing for dvorak or querty
[13:58] <AngryParsley> *qwerty
[13:58] <AngryParsley> it just says "USA"
[13:59] <st4aluck> om26er: yes it worked but after I upgraded  the kernel it stoped again, so I need solution for the new kernel
[14:01] <st4aluck> om26er: and if possible for the 10.04 cause it will be the futer LTS
[14:01] <kblin> hi folks
[14:02] <om26er> st4aluck, I think you should report a bug if it worked in karmic
[14:03] <kblin> I've been asked to test lucid for a kernel bug I've reported against jaunty. however, the lucid installer gets stuck after trying to set up a framebuffer. can I tell it to use a ncurses-based install like the older server installs used?
[14:19] <AngryParsley> how do I fix the window buttons in lucid?
[14:19] <AngryParsley> I got them on the right side, but the button with the program icon isn't on the left side anymore
[14:22] <xxploit> AngryParsley, gconf-editor
[14:22] <AngryParsley> xxploit: yeah, I did that
[14:22] <om26er> is there any shortcut to memenu?
[14:23] <om26er> shorkey
[14:23] <AngryParsley> but there should also be one button on the left that shows a menu with window-related stuff
[14:23] <AngryParsley> like resize, maximize, minimize, close, etc
[14:23] <xxploit> AngryParsley, in the gconf-editor under metacity there will be something called window buttons/items or something
[14:23] <AngryParsley> xxploit: I _did_ that already
[14:23] <st4aluck> om26er:  It worked in Karmic till the upgrade of the kernel. If I run the old kernel no problems
[14:23] <xxploit> AngryParsley, readd the app icon there
[14:24] <xxploit> AngryParsley, menu:maximize,minimize,close
[14:24] <om26er> kernel regression
[14:25] <AngryParsley> ahh, menu
[14:25] <AngryParsley> thanks
[14:25] <st4aluck> om26er: !?!?!
[14:25] <AngryParsley> also I think the correct order is minimize, maximize, close
[14:25] <xxploit> the correct order is whatever works for u
[14:25] <om26er> yeah
[14:26] <AngryParsley> well appearance prefs shows the menu icon on the left, the title text left-aligned, and then min, max, close on the right
[14:26] <AngryParsley> but the actual windows don't look anything like the previews unless you screw around with obscure gconf-settings
[14:26] <st4aluck> om26er: for that reason I turned back to 8.04
[14:28] <om26er> st4aluck, can you try the latest kernel in Lucid just to check if that solves the problem (latest is 2.6.33)
[14:28] <xxploit> AngryParsley, if your using the new dark theme, using the order u listed will cause the controls to become square, kind of hard to explain unless u change the order and look at what i mean
[14:29] <st4aluck> om26er:
[14:29] <AngryParsley> I switched it to my old theme
[14:30] <st4aluck> om26er: I tryed 3 alfa alredy and it's the same like the latest kernel of karmic
[14:31] <om26er> st4aluck, lucid dont have the latest kernel it uses 2.6.32 and the latest is 2.6.33
[14:32] <st4aluck> om26er: do you think it will work!?!
[14:33] <om26er> st4aluck, not really as it did not work in karmic or lucid but newer kernels have many bug fixes
[14:33] <st4aluck> om26er: I think the newr kernels are more unstable
[14:35] <om26er> st4aluck, you should report a bug
[14:36] <st4aluck> om26er:  The problem is well known and you can find info easy
[14:38] <st4aluck> om26er:  I meant for karmic, there are drivers you can install but with it latest kernel the don't work
[14:39] <kklimonda> st4aluck: why?
[14:39] <kklimonda> st4aluck: is the problem you can't compile them?
[14:40] <st4aluck> om26er:  Itryed to comp with the new kernel and it doesn't work
[14:42] <kklimonda> st4aluck: it isn't a bug in kernel, your drivers need an update
[14:43] <st4aluck> om26er: a french guy who made the drivers I think. Yeah and I Alway have to wait till somebody make them.
[14:43] <om26er> its quite old webcam
[14:44] <om26er> ubuntuforums have a problem with this back in 2006
[14:44] <om26er> not ubuntuforums a person at ubuntu forums
[14:44] <st4aluck> om26er:  I better give up and buy one wich is supported
[15:20] <rniamo> hi
[15:20] <rniamo> in lucid there is no more interface tab in system->appearance
[15:21] <rniamo> is it normal?
[15:21] <rniamo> i would like to hide text near icons to keep only icons
[15:21] <om26er> rniamo, yes its by design
[15:21] <rniamo> oh, and properties in this tabs are removed or moved somewhere ?
[15:22] <red> bad design taking the OS backwards in usability :p
[15:22] <red> thats the punchline of Lucid
[15:23] <rniamo> can i set this property with gconf-editor ?
[15:23] <om26er> people dont think anything and just say it
[15:23] <rniamo> ?
[15:23] <om26er> I dont understand any change in lucid is a step backward how
[15:24] <om26er> red, this is change, oh,, this is a step bakwards for ubuntu
[15:24] <om26er> sighs
[15:26] <red> any change? no
[15:26] <red> changes taking things away is, even tho available via gconf-editor, it's backwards step in my eyes. and I think I have a right to have an opinion :)
[15:26] <red> upstart is a good change for one, no hal is another
[15:27] <om26er> red, how is this a step backward to not show un-needed icons, the interface looks much better without those icons
[15:27] <rniamo> it's a strange choice to remove this option
[15:27] <om26er> its better choice
[15:28] <rniamo> why ?
[15:28] <om26er> why not?
[15:28] <rniamo> technycallly ?
[15:28] <om26er> visually
[15:28] <rniamo> because to allow user to choose its interface is a good choice
[15:29] <om26er> bye bye ubottu
[15:29] <rniamo> ++
[15:30] <om26er> rniamo, for what I know any change in ubuntu is treated badly, window buttons moved to the left side and people say this is a step backwards
[15:30] <rniamo> to fix interface is a step backwards, to let user choose is nice
[15:31] <rniamo> before i chose "icons only", now it is not p ossible
[15:31] <red>  < rniamo> because to allow user to choose its interface is a good choice
[15:31] <red> this is exactly what I ment
[15:32] <rniamo> but  not om26er
[15:32] <red> om26er: and for my taste, going MacOs style isn't a good thing
[15:32] <red> ubuntu looked original with the brownish look
[15:32] <tcsoccerman> what about the users that are "noobs" and need it to just look good from the start?
[15:32] <red> now it looks like mac for many parts =)
[15:32] <om26er> red, much better than being windows style
[15:32] <red> it wasn't windows style imo
[15:32] <rniamo> it can be look good from start and let the user make some choice
[15:32] <red> most Os have the buttons placed on right, so i'd call it the general way
[15:33] <Trewas> I would say that changing the window buttons to left is even objectively bad idea, as people have to get used to it being different to everything else
[15:33] <rniamo> because if they remove options, next version will remove the choice of the gtk theme
[15:33] <ChogyDan> are the buttons still on the left?
[15:33] <red> we're ubuntu users, we've used to having them certain way and then they are changed by default to another style
[15:33] <red> luckily you can tweak it via gconf-editor, but a lot of users dont know that
[15:34] <smknight> yeah, they will complain a week or two and adapt then
[15:34] <red> why do they need to adapt?
[15:34] <dodddummy> got it and all my favorite packages installed.  so far so good.  only complaint is the volume control thingie in the 'systray' but there seems to be a work around for that.
[15:34] <red> my point is - does it help in some way to change basic functionality?
[15:34] <om26er> red, everything starts from left side
[15:34] <red> other than to just blatantly copy Mac Os :P
[15:35] <smknight> red: people need to adapt when they change operating systems/desktops all the time
[15:35] <rniamo> red : can you give me the gconf path please
[15:35] <red> the monochrome icons, placement, color scheme, nautilus extra panel (the only good copying :p)
[15:35] <om26er> you write from left, toolbar icons start from left, file,edit, etc is on left
[15:35] <Trewas> smknight: adapting is quite difficult if people use anything else than ubuntu (and most use), where the window controls stay on the right
[15:35] <AngryParsley> gconftool --set /apps/metacity/general/button_layout --type string menu:minimize,maximize,close
[15:35] <smknight> everybody had to adapt when changing from windows/macos to ubuntu
[15:35] <red> rniamo: its under metacity in applications
[15:35] <red> change the : to the left side of the minimize,maximize,close text
[15:35] <xxploit> honestly i think everything is crammed. Menu/Window Controls/Title all right there in the same space
[15:35] <Some_Person> How stable is lucid at this point?
[15:35] <rniamo> i speak about app icons not metacity ones
[15:36] <rniamo> lucid is stale if you have no nvidia card
[15:36] <smknight> you will always have people complaining when you test something
[15:36] <om26er> Some_Person, its not stable
[15:36] <Some_Person> Ok, how unstable is it?
[15:36] <red> om26er: and yet my hand and brain expects them to be on right hand side for they have been there since in most guis for nearly 20 years
[15:36] <xxploit> stale? whats an nvidia card have to do with it?
[15:36] <red> yay for the people first time touching pcs
[15:36] <AngryParsley> red: I use a mac most of the time and the button change annoyed me too
[15:36] <om26er> Some_Person, as unstable that things can break bad
[15:36] <dodddummy> red,  the idea i think is so you can get it from the left like the other 'menu' type things.  i still prefer them to be on the right side since i'm used to going there and as a means to separate the two.  i have in my mind when i'm working on the window stuff i go to the right and when i'm working on the app i go to the left.  seems silly to me to change the default but it's about a 10 second change to go back to the other way.
[15:37] <Some_Person> om26er: Even though the freeze is over?
[15:37] <AngryParsley> I mean the ubuntu button change. I never touch the buttons on my mac since I use multitouch trackpad gestures for minimize/maximize/close window
[15:37] <yofel> Some_Person: just because the freeze is over doesn't mean that everything will work for you
[15:38] <Some_Person> I understand that
[15:38] <red> dodddummy: aye, agree. im just saying it's a bad change and a stupid mistake from graphic design team :)
[15:38] <red> cluttering too many options to an area and navigation gets slower
[15:38] <smknight> bad for you, certainly not for everybody :p
[15:39] <AngryParsley> it is a bad change, and a stupid design mistake
[15:39] <om26er> red, probably you might have read in some article i guess
[15:39] <AngryParsley> it's certainly not good for anyone
[15:39] <red> om26er: no?
[15:39] <yofel> Some_Person: if you have backups feel free to try it, testers are always welcome
[15:39] <smknight> AngryParsley: proof that
[15:39] <dodddummy> red i do agree.  and besides, i have a 10 year old bug it seems like they should fix before moving buttons around :)
[15:39] <red> why do you mock me for not agreeing with you? :)
[15:39] <AngryParsley> smknight: it puts the close button really close to the file/edit/view menus
[15:39] <Some_Person> yofel: I'm thinking of installing it to an SD card so I won't lose my current install
[15:40] <AngryParsley> and the button ordering is unlike any other OS
[15:40] <AngryParsley> OS X has the close button on the far left
[15:40] <red> smknight: I dislike clutter
[15:40] <smknight> you have to test such things
[15:40] <dodddummy> i say fix the slow main menu launching first :)
[15:40] <yofel> Some_Person: should work, but don't forget to check where grub will be installed
[15:40] <rniamo> my answer is /desktop/gnome/interface/toolbar_style
[15:40] <rniamo> ++
[15:40] <AngryParsley> so going from OS X -> new ubuntu layout means I kept clicking close when I meant to click maximize
[15:40] <smknight> i remember the time apple showed the osx interface for the first time
[15:40] <Some_Person> yofel: It should go to the SD card
[15:40] <smknight> everybody complained the same way you complain about the buttons now
[15:40] <red> smknight: people do get used to
[15:41] <red> it doesn't mean it's a good thing still
[15:41] <dodddummy> smknight, everyone was right then, too!
[15:41] <Some_Person> So is Alpha 3 the latest Lucid release?
[15:41] <AngryParsley> smknight: I don't think OS X's button positions are amazing or anything, but they make a lot more sense than ubuntu's right now
[15:41] <red> as a metaphore, people get used to living in bad conditions too, doesn't mean they are good conditions
[15:41] <yofel> Some_Person: if you can later boot from that card I see no reason why it shouldn't work (as long as the installer doesn't crash or something like that)
[15:41] <smknight> the osx desktop is considered one of the best desktops on the market for a long time
[15:41] <smknight> many ppl really love it
[15:41] <om26er> Some_Person, beta1 is coming next week
[15:41] <smknight> you have to test such radical things
[15:41] <AngryParsley> and like I said, I use jitouch for window operations on my mac
[15:41] <yofel> Some_Person: wait, use a daily image at this point
[15:41] <Some_Person> yofel: Yes, this system can boot to SD cards
[15:41] <smknight> elsewhere you wont ever make any real progress
[15:41] <yofel> !daily > Some_Person
[15:41] <AngryParsley> smknight: everyone tested it and everyone hates it
[15:42] <smknight> AngryParsley: thats not true
[15:42] <AngryParsley> Hyperbole is a rhetorical device in which statements are exaggerated. It may be used to evoke strong feelings or to create a strong impression, but is not meant to be taken literally.
[15:42] <smknight> im not that dumb AngryParsley
[15:43] <smknight> a lot of ppl think it sucks and most ppl really dont care
[15:43] <dodddummy> on the plus side, it got me to looking for thems and i found one i like better
[15:44] <Some_Person> yofel: What's the advantage of the daily image?
[15:44] <smknight> and nothing is final, who knows if they change it back in the next version
[15:45] <smknight> making such changes and getting feedback from the community is a key factor for user interface design imho
[15:45] <yofel> Some_Person: the alpha3 has the os from quite a while ago, the daily images are the builds with the current packages so you won't have to update as much
[15:45] <Some_Person> all righty then
[15:45] <yofel> Some_Person: also if you use the daily images you can test helping them to make sure the beta images work this week ;)
[15:46] <yofel> er... help testing
[15:46] <Some_Person> ok
[15:46] <AngryParsley> smknight: not one day before a UI freeze for an LTS release!
[15:47] <AngryParsley> get feedback from the community at any time besides that
[15:48] <sburwood> I would like to know how to do two things with Lucid.  One, remove the choice in Sane.  The primary device for Sane is a USB camera, and not the scanner that should be its only device
[15:48] <sburwood> It recognizes the scanner, but it prefers the USB camera
[15:48] <sburwood> this might not be the chat room for that question
[15:49] <sburwood> also, I want to remove feedback (asterixes when you type the password
[15:50] <red> < smknight> the osx desktop is considered one of the best desktops on the market for a long time
[15:51] <smknight> *by many people :)
[15:51] <red> I only know a few Apple fanboys who love most things apple throws out, and love the GUI etc
[15:51] <maco> i only know 1. he works for Apple.
[15:51] <red> then I have a lot of Windows and UNIX friends who all consider using macs an annoyance (at school in certain classes for example)
[15:51] <maco> o/
[15:51]  * maco can't stand macs
[15:51] <red> and myself included, I hate the Mac GUI
[15:52] <smknight> i really know a LOT of people who switched to a mac because of the user interface
[15:52] <red> Dock is awful, I mean, you close an app but instead it's just "running in the background", you can't see with a quick look what is actually on and not, the Finder is terrible
[15:52] <red> the keyboard is annoying, ctrl has to be manually binded to work as a ctrl cause they want you to use badly placed Fn key
[15:53] <smknight> red: the first thing is not true
[15:53] <smknight> you can see that on first sight
[15:53] <red> it wasn't obvious atleast
[15:53] <smknight> it totally is :p
[15:53] <red> I had to use one during a 6 week course of Flash CS4, In Design etc
[15:53] <AngryParsley> macs have multitouch trackpads, so I really don't care about anything else
[15:54] <smknight> dont want to argue about that, but its a fact that a lot of people really love the interface
[15:54] <red> so just hated the experience overall
[15:54] <AngryParsley> it's really nice to be able to drum my fingers across the trackpad and have it maximize the current window
[15:54] <red> like did 90% of the people sharing the class with me
[15:54] <red> in the end it's a personal opinion for everyone, but im just saying that most people do not like it :p
[15:55] <red> even thought it might be that many people you know do, and vice versa for my situation
[15:55] <smknight> most of the people you know
[15:56] <dodddummy> it's not so bad when you compare it to copying window's registry!  got to duck for that one.
[15:56] <red> I'm guessing the graph desing team uses Macs rather than Linux for their graphical work
[15:56] <red> so might be natural choice for them to copycapt Mac Os
[15:56] <AngryParsley> most developers I know user macs
[15:56] <red> I know some too
[15:56] <AngryParsley> and yes, they actually do run OS X on them
[15:56] <dodddummy> AngryParsley, that's the sin.  developers using macs.
[15:56] <red> I prefer Linux, since i'm more a coder than graphical worker (don't depend that much on Adobe)
[15:56] <smknight> i used osx at a time where gnome/kde werent even remotely comparable to osx in design and function
[15:57] <smknight> 2004/2005 or so
[15:57] <AngryParsley> dodddummy: eh, most code monkeys in the bay area make more than enough money to afford macs
[15:57] <red> for me it's enough to have virtual windows for occasional photoshopping and flash
[15:57] <AngryParsley> it's basically BSD but with a pretty UI and no need to screw around with wireless driver
[15:57] <AngryParsley> *drivers
[15:57] <smknight> but some time after that gnome evolved into a really usable desktop(for me)
[15:58] <dodddummy> AngryParsley, i see a dev using macs without being forced by work and my opinion drops for me.  i think it's a genetic flaw i can't overcome.
[15:59] <red> I don't hate Macs generally
[15:59] <dodddummy> it's the license i hate.
[15:59] <red> just the GUI choices, since they seem to do a lot "backwards" from what I've used to
[15:59] <dodddummy> time to make the donuts.
[15:59] <AngryParsley> dodddummy: why? I bought a mac after I got tired of editing xorg.conf
[15:59] <red> I had 3 iPhones too
[16:00] <red> now a Nokia N900 with Maemo 5 linux
[16:00] <dodddummy> AngryParsley, it's all about the freedom.
[16:00] <smknight> i switched from iphone to a droid with android
[16:00] <AngryParsley> the freedom? I'm willing to pay more for something that helps me get stuff done faster and with less frustration
[16:00] <red> iPhone GUI was awesome, but I had bad luck and two of them had wifi problems and 3rd one a broken mic so I picked a nokia instead
[16:00] <smknight> but only because it has a harware keyboard :/
[16:00] <AngryParsley> I don't care if the OS code is open or not. I'm not a kernel developer
[16:00] <dodddummy> AngryParsley, and i'm not.
[16:01] <smknight> the osx kernel is free software :p
[16:02] <AngryParsley> no, it isn't. the BSD stuff bolted on to the microkernel is BSD licensed, but apple doesn't have to contribute their changes
[16:06] <smknight> it totally is
[16:07] <smknight> the license conforms with the FSF guidelines :<
[16:08] <AngryParsley> many of apple's kexts are proprietary. apple's license allows linking to proprietary code
[16:09] <AngryParsley> that's why you can't download all the source for OS X's kernel, build it, and run it
[16:09] <smknight> thats why they are put into extensions :>
[16:09] <smknight> :<
[16:10] <AndyGraybeal> hi i was wondering if the recommended backup application for 10.04 is going to be Bacula (like it was in 8.04)
[16:11] <AngryParsley> extensions in a microkernel are usually much more basic than modules in a monolithic kernel
[16:12] <smknight> you could argue about that topic all day
[16:12] <smknight> :/
[16:12] <smknight> same with user interface design decisions :p
[16:12] <AngryParsley> basic stuff like reading info from the EFI is a kernel extension in OS X
[16:13] <AngryParsley> a proprietary kernel extension. so while some parts of OS X are BSD or APL licensed, it requires proprietary code to even boot up
[16:15] <smknight> *with efi
[16:16] <AngryParsley> smknight: a BIOS kext doesn't exist. you need EFI to boot OS X
[16:17] <smknight> im not into that whole topic anymore, thanks for info
[16:17] <smknight> what about the darwin thing
[16:17] <AngryParsley> opendarwin? that project is dead
[16:17] <smknight> yeah, but it should boot without efi
[16:21] <AngryParsley> all intel macs are EFI. all PPC macs are openfirmware
[16:21] <smknight> yeah, but you could boot opendarwin on normal pcs in the past
[16:21] <smknight> :/
[16:22] <AngryParsley> could you?
[16:22] <smknight> yeah
[16:40] <Xeper> I'm running kubuntu+1, and wondering if there is a way to install plasma themes from a simple interface instead of manually downloading from kde-look and mucking around with the files...
[16:44] <yofel> Xeper: systemsettings -> appearance -> style -> workspace maybe?
[16:44] <yofel> there is a 'get new themes...' button at the bottom
[16:45] <Xeper> ahhhh ok, great!!  thank you very much yofel
[16:45] <yofel> Xeper: yw :)
[17:01] <amit1_> Hi everybody
[17:01] <amit1_> I don't see a boot screen when I start up
[17:01] <amit1_> it just gives me a black screen until the login screen
[17:03] <robin0800> amit1_: mine dosen't always get to the logon screen
[17:04] <amit1_> you mean it just locks up?
[17:05] <robin0800> amit1_: no it goes to a ctrl alt f1 promot
[17:05] <amit1_> oh you mean you don't get to the GDM login, just the console
[17:06] <amit1_> Ya I guess the Plymouth boot screen is broken for me
[17:06] <robin0800> amit1_: yes the I do ctl alt F7 for the login screen
[17:06] <amit1_> is your system fully updated?
[17:07] <robin0800> amit1_: do you see it on shutdown?
[17:07] <amit1_> yes i do
[17:07] <amit1_> i mean it has the little red dots that light up right?
[17:07] <amit1_> as its shutting down...i believe thats the proper shutdown screen
[17:08] <happyface>  why does my wifi card not show up in nm-applet unless I reinstall gnome-network-manager and reboot?
[17:10] <amit1_> did you override your /etc/networks/interfaces file?
[17:12] <happyface> amit1_: not personally but could wicd have done that?
[17:13] <amit1_> happyface: wicd could have overridden NM
[17:13] <amit1_> happyface: i believe wicd is a drop in replacement for NM
[17:13] <happyface> amit1_: this has been happening since koala when I switched from wicd to gnome-net, then I switched back
[17:13] <amit1_> look at your /etc/network/interfaces file
[17:14] <happyface> what should I be looking for?
[17:14] <amit1_> it should only have two lines if NM is in control
[17:14] <amit1_> auto lo
[17:14] <amit1_> and
[17:14] <amit1_> iface lo inet loopback
[17:15] <happyface> Thanks amit1_: I'll check it out - gotta switch to that partition brb
[17:16] <amit1_> you're not in 10.04 right now?
[17:16] <amit1_> robin0800: I saw this in my syslog:  init: plymouth main process (261) killed by TERM signal
[17:17] <happyface> amit1_: yea im in 10.04 now
[17:17] <happyface> booting it up
[17:17] <amit1_> happyface: oh, on a different machine?
[17:18] <happyface> im on a shell now, using my phone atm
[17:18] <happyface> amit1_: yes, my interfaces file looks good
[17:19] <happyface> amit1_: but nm-applet shows wireless as disabled, even though i can see it with iwconfig
[17:20] <apparle> is firefox kde integration going to be implemented on lucid https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-firefox-kde-integration
[17:20] <amit1_> happyface: and the only way to get it to see the wifi is to reinstall NM?
[17:20] <happyface> amit1_: correct
[17:20] <happyface> amit1_: and reboot
[17:21] <amit1_> happyface: and wicd is completely uninstalled?
[17:21] <amit1_> happyface: i'm not familiar with wicd, but you need to make sure its not running
[17:21] <happyface> amit1_: yes, it was purged
[17:31] <ellar> kklimonda, thank you for your help yesterday. I finally opened a new bug #538764. Anyone may feel free to comment.
[17:31] <ellar> ubottu, bug#538764
[17:31] <happyface> amit1_: thanks anyway but it's a lost cause.. nobody has been able to fix this problem for a month or so, so i guess its time to reinstall
[17:35] <duffydack> what happend to the U1 icon in panel when synchronising?
[17:38] <Boondoklife> duffydack: I was wondering the same thing, dont even get the dbus message telling you it is updating files. I dont care to see the icon but the info bubble was nice.
[17:39] <duffydack> its only with netspeed/looking at my router, I know its updating
[17:42] <Boondoklife> If I am in the folder the file is updating I see the check change to the reload then back to the check, other than that I have to use u1sdtool to see what is going on.
[17:44] <duffydack> I like the fact I can right click a folder and set it to sync with U1.. rather than have to copy the files/folders to U1 folder.
[17:45] <Boondoklife> Yea, That is a very nice addition, along with the machine accounts now being part of the applet
[17:45] <Boondoklife> have you got evolution to work with it on lucid yet?
[17:45] <Boondoklife> the contact part atleast
[17:46] <duffydack> not tried.
[17:47] <xfact> Hello I really want to upgrade to 10.04 because I want to test it with some regular wars like music, and web browsing I do, do you think it's stable enough for me?
[17:47] <xfact> *works
[17:47] <duffydack> ive sync`d my pics folder but its not showing anything on the webpage
[17:47] <Boondoklife> That is the only part that seems to be lacking at this point. Well the bookmarks in firefox would be nice but last time i tried that it was a disaster.
[17:47] <balas> i can't get my CMI8788 chipset sound card to work in lucid
[17:48] <Italian_Plumber> not unless you don't care if your machine becomes unusable and you lose all your data
[17:48] <xfact> please suggest
[17:48] <Italian_Plumber> that's the worst that could happen, but you get the idea
[17:48] <Boondoklife> xfact: I use it every day and have not had any real major issues. Every now and then there is a change that I have to wait for the repo's to catch up on. But overall the system is stable for me.
[17:49] <xfact> Italian_Plumber, Is that happened already in 10.04?
[17:49] <Boondoklife> xfact: like Italian_Plumber said, do make sure you have your data backed up though.
[17:49] <Boondoklife> xfact: data loss is a just a fact of life with computers if you dont have a proper backup
[17:49] <Italian_Plumber> I don't know... I'm only testing the live CD, not a real installation.  I haven't had any major problems.
[17:50] <yofel> xfact: I haven't lost data yet, but pylmouth did make my system unsusable (thanks to an issue with my nvidia card) until I purged it from a live session chroot
[17:50] <Boondoklife> xfact: Only real issue I had was with plymouth but I just removed it till it becomes a little more stable. weird login/logout bug
[17:50] <Italian_Plumber> I only use desktop as a Live CD -- something to get me totally away from the work-issued windows installation on my laptop
[17:50] <Boondoklife> ati here
[17:52] <xfact> Boondoklife, Well, I am just home user so I do not have any 'important' data, and I really like the thrill of testing the premature releases, the only problem is I do not know much then error reporting via apport, so is that ok to upgrade?
[17:52] <xfact> I want to be assure before taking the 'risk' "|
[17:52] <Boondoklife> xfact: If you are asking my opinion, go for it! the error reporting is not that hard, but it is not required.
[17:52] <xfact> Thanks and cheers Boondoklife
[17:53] <yofel> xfact: first, get yourself a daily live disk and see if it works at all for you
[17:53] <Boondoklife> xfact: likewise mate.
[17:53] <yofel> xfact: if you then decide to install/upgrade come again, we'll be here to help ;)
[17:54] <xfact> yofel, No I am just directly upgrading from Karmic to Lucid vai 'update-manager -d'
[17:54] <xfact> *via
[17:54] <Boondoklife> xfact: That may not be too good of an idea.
[17:55] <yofel> xfact: ok, but it is sometimes a good idea to have a live disk ready if you need it
[17:55] <yofel> Boondoklife: why not? we need upgrade testing too
[17:55] <Boondoklife> xfact: nothing crazy should happen but I have run into apps acting a lil weird after doing an upgrade like that
[17:55] <Boondoklife> yofel: For the sake of uptime I was refering
[17:56] <xfact> Ok if consequently my system gets blocked, then will I able to reinstall karmic Koala?
[17:56] <yofel> well yes, reinstalling is usually safer than upgrading, but how is upgrading supposed to be safe if nobody tests it?
[17:56] <yofel> xfact: if you reinstall the system certainly
[17:57] <xfact> and also by upgrading I am getting the next release with all existing updates
[17:57] <Boondoklife> yofel: point taken on the upgrade. But I just try to suit my answers to what I think the person is asking for. In his case I was thinking uptime would be wanted.
[17:58] <yofel> Boondoklife: ack
[17:58]  * xfact 14 yrs old kid should wait for at least beta 1 cause maybe he is taking a fast decision! 
[17:58] <Boondoklife> xfact: Yea upgrades get you to the new version and all updates, but you can always run the update manager again to double check.
[17:58] <xfact> Yup
[17:59] <Boondoklife> xfact: heh I remember killing a sound card when I was 14. I was pissed. Bent some of the onboard cdrom pins.
[17:59] <woRg> there is a way to downgrade?
[17:59] <yofel> woRg: No
[17:59] <Boondoklife> woRg: reinstall of course silly
[18:00] <xfact> I am already running Lucid in my Vbox, and it's stable
[18:00] <Boondoklife> xfact: really the only diff will be any hardware issues.
[18:01] <Boondoklife> xfact: but like yofel said give the livecd a go. If all runs good then you could try to upgrade. worst case you have the install cd already and can reinstall 10.04 from scratch
[18:01] <xfact> Boondoklife, yup, that maybe, how is the nvidia 190 driver is that stable?
[18:02] <Boondoklife> xfact: I have not tested out a nvidia box yet, well I have one but the live cd wont load up. Just black screens after I choose to install or try first.
[18:02] <xfact> My live cd is the first release of alpha and so it's old
[18:02] <yofel> xfact: nvidia-current is 195 at the moment
[18:02] <woRg> Boondoklife: I know that reinstall it's the 'better way', also I know that using alpha state software brings his own troubles, but I'm still wondering if with all the power of apt why there's not a way to downgrade?
[18:02] <Boondoklife> xfact: Download the latest live cd iamge to be safe
[18:03] <xfact> Where to download a recent live cd image of lucid lynx?
[18:03] <Boondoklife> woRg: Im with you on that one, but Im sure there is a real reason for it.
[18:03] <yofel> xfact: It works fine on my nvidia quadro nvs 140m and my geforce 7300GT, but that's all I can say
[18:03] <xfact> from the daily builds?
[18:03] <yofel> !daily > xfact
[18:03] <xfact> Daily or daily-live? I have two links
[18:04] <yofel> xfact: daily-live
[18:04] <caravena> Hello, ubuntu-bug not work fine https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/apport/+bug/538769
[18:04] <yofel> xfact: daily is the alternate cd
[18:04] <xfact> ok
[18:04] <yofel> caravena: known issue
[18:05] <yofel> caravena: I'll mark your bug a duplicate of bug 538097
[18:05] <yofel> caravena: the admins will look at it tomorrow
[18:05] <caravena> yofel, ok
[18:06] <xfact> Well, Thanks yofel and Boondoklife
[18:06] <Boondoklife> xfact: no worries and have fun with it!
[18:06] <yofel> xfact: you're welcome
[18:07] <xfact> Can you please suggest a gui based easy to use backup tool for backing up my home folder anyway?
[18:09] <penguin42> xfact: Just doing a search how about sbackup - never tried it though
[18:10] <Boondoklife> xfact: I have used backintime and it works great, but dejadupe is supposed to be good too
[18:12] <xfact> Boondoklife, I tried DejaDup but it's saving the backed up data in thousands of files each of 5 MBs, flood!
[18:12] <Boondoklife> ouch, yea try backintime. I dont think it does that
[18:12] <Boondoklife> lemme hit my file server and check
[18:12] <duffydack> with ambiance, I dont like the hightlighted applications in panel colour, makes it hard to see what the app icon/text is.. its a lot 'less' using ambiance in karmic.
[18:13] <xfact> ok
[18:14] <wolter> Hi, can I get a 32bit cd image of lucid?
[18:14] <yofel> wolter: sure, the i386 one
[18:15] <wolter> yofel, where can i download isos from?
[18:15] <wolter> i say it because i have 64bit version now, and a terminal upgrade would give me 64bit lucid too
[18:16] <yofel> !dialy | wolter
[18:17] <yofel> !daily | wolter
[18:17] <wolter> thanks yofel
[18:17] <Boondoklife> xfact: backintime just makes a dupe of the files, same structure of the source
[18:17] <duffydack> Boondoklife, btw, the option to enable contact updating is greyed out in U1
[18:18] <xfact> humm
[18:18] <Boondoklife> duffydack: Yea I noticed that. I wonder why though.
[18:18] <Boondoklife> xfact: you could always just tar up the directory
[18:19] <duffydack> Boondoklife, I setup evolution using a backup.tar I made in evolution in karmic..   evolution keeps hanging..
[18:19] <xfact> Boondoklife, good idea :)
[18:20] <Boondoklife> hmm I didnt back mine up as I use imap for my email. But When I try to get to the ubuntuone contacts it just tells me it cant get to the server.. bummer
[18:20]  * xfact observing this chat room for getting a concept of what kind of potential threat he may face! 
[18:21] <wolter> hm, now i'm having doubts about if to use 32 bit or 64...
[18:21] <wolter> first off, does the default i386 iso include pae option for +4 GB RAM?
[18:21] <xfact> wolter, If you have less then 4GB ram, then you should use 32 bit
[18:22] <wolter> I have 4GB RAM
[18:22] <Boondoklife> I really love the ubuntuone server but wish they had an intermediate plan. Like 10GB for $2 or something I just dont need 50GB.
[18:22] <wolter> And I've been using 64bit all the way
[18:22] <xfact> wolter, Yup then 64 bit is good
[18:22] <duffydack> Boondoklife, ah... maybe you need to put the contacts in the Couchdb/U1 section in evo
[18:22] <wolter> so don't worry about that, I just want to know, is compiling code a lot slower in 32bit? And video decoding/encoding? How about general performance, does it change much?
[18:24] <penguin42> wolter: Generally things are a bit faster, most stuff there isn't a vast difference, but some things really fly with 64bit
[18:24] <penguin42> very occasionally there is something faster in 32bit
[18:24] <duffydack> Boondoklife, nah its not done anything...  there is still nothing displayed on the webpage, even tho I have 73meg thee.
[18:24] <duffydack> there*
[18:25] <Boondoklife> duffydack: hmm.. well It just might be disabled for some reason. Or they are working on it.
[18:26] <xfact> Bye, gotta give it a try
[18:28] <duffydack> uh, now only my documents folder is set to sync, not pictures. I keep setting it but the icons arent changing to identify wether its sync`d or not.
[18:31] <rye> is there something wrong with lp/apport reporting? Can't file anything - Cannot connect to crash database, please check your Internet connection.
[18:31] <rye> launchpad status page does not say anything
[18:33] <yofel> rye: known
[18:33] <yofel>  bug 538097
[18:33] <jakubo> hi, plymouth is broken, doesnt find a file
[18:34] <yofel> jakubo: mountall doesn't find libplymouth...?
[18:34] <jakubo> correct
[18:34] <yofel> jakubo: see topic please
[18:34] <yofel> bug 538292
[18:34] <yofel> jakubo: an update should fix it
[18:34] <jakubo> ok thanks
[18:34] <jakubo> yes, but its unbootable
[18:34] <yofel> nice... bye ubottu :'(
[18:35] <ZykoticK9> jakubo, for a step-by-step on how to fix with the livecd see http://sites.google.com/site/alucidfs/quick-fixes
[18:35] <jakubo> and i got home and root partitions on separate drives
[18:36] <jakubo> oh, so its just a missing link
[18:36] <jakubo> thats good
[18:40] <orion_SuN> help
[18:41] <orion_SuN> start firefox >>>>> firefox
[18:41] <orion_SuN> Attempting to load the system libmoon
[18:41] <orion_SuN> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
[18:41] <orion_SuN> help ,me !
[18:43] <ZykoticK9> orion_SuN, just to test I'd try firefox without plugins/config etc. -- from your home directory "mv .mozilla mozilla_backup" then try restarting firefox (undo change with "mv mozilla_backup .mozilla") - i believe libmoon has something to do with Mono/Silverlight
[18:46] <yofel> ZykoticK9: that won't help if he installed the mono package from the repository, as that will be in /usr/lib/mozilla/plugins/
[18:47] <ZykoticK9> orion_SuN, see yofel comment above.  Thanks yofel.
[18:47] <yofel> orion_SuN: can you try what ZykoticK9 said and purge moonlight-plugin-mozilla and moonlight-plugin-core if it still doesn't work?
[18:48] <orion_SuN> :))) work perfekt
[18:49] <orion_SuN>  how to put it back
[18:49] <orion_SuN> moonlight-plugin-core
[18:50] <Azelphur> trying to install lucid on a laptop from cd, I get the ubuntu splash screen, then it goes black screen with the backlight off and hangs
[18:50] <Azelphur> any ideas?
[18:56]  * Azelphur pokes the smart people
[18:57] <robin0800> Azelphur: lspci look for network controller
[18:58]  * Azelphur boots it up in karmic to get that
[18:59] <Azelphur> aww, he's gone D:
[19:00] <Azelphur> it's an Intel Corporation PRO/Wireless 2200BG [Calexico2] Network connection (Rev 05)
[19:03] <IdleOne> any issues with flash not working?
[19:03]  * IdleOne can't get any flash to run
[19:04] <BUGabundo> wfm IdleOne
[19:05] <IdleOne> BUGabundo: you using the flashplugin-installer?
[19:05] <BUGabundo> yes
[19:05] <IdleOne> hmmm
[19:06] <IdleOne> I just did an upgrade to lucid but flash is not happy
[19:06] <bjsnider> BUGabundo, seen any chromium bugs related to dns resolving in the past week?
[19:06] <orion_SuN> now install vlc ?
[19:08] <orion_SuN> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
[19:08] <orion_SuN>   vlc: Depends: vlc-nox (= 1.1.0+svn20100222-gitb3e2929~ppa5~karmic1) but it is not going to be installed
[19:08] <orion_SuN>        Recommends: vlc-plugin-pulse (= 1.1.0+svn20100222-gitb3e2929~ppa5~karmic1) but it is not going to be installed
[19:08] <orion_SuN> E: Broken packages
[19:08] <orion_SuN> orion@orion:~$
[19:09] <orion_SuN> ????
[19:09] <BUGabundo> bjsnider: not exatly
[19:09] <BUGabundo> what are you looking for?
[19:09] <IdleOne> BUGabundo: reinstalling flashplugin-installer fixed the issue :)
[19:09] <bjsnider> i've just been having trouble with it resolving sites the past few days
[19:09] <BUGabundo> it happened to me
[19:09] <bjsnider> could be an isp issue i'm not sure
[19:09] <BUGabundo> to two sites from work
[19:10] <BUGabundo> but home laptop always fine
[19:10] <bjsnider> you've had that problem?
[19:10] <BUGabundo> but I atributed it to work firewall
[19:10] <BUGabundo> btaccel.com would not open
[19:10] <BUGabundo> and some other site
[19:11] <BUGabundo> I though the sites were down, until I tried it remotelly from home
[19:11] <BUGabundo> bjsnider: two sites in so many, I can't really pinpoint it to browser prob
[19:11] <BUGabundo> but Monday, ill test with lynks and FF
[19:13] <phillw> Hi, I know it is a bug, but as I don't know the package, or who else it affects... Independant of browser / IRC programme, every so often when I click in the middle of it to bring it to the front, it just closes ... which is somewhat annoying -- has any one else been sufferring from this ?
[19:13] <phillw> it == tab
[19:15] <om26er> that would go for gtk ?
[19:44] <Some_Person> Why the hell is lucid's close button not in the corner?!
[19:45] <IdleOne> look on the other side
[19:45] <Some_Person> It's 3rd from the end
[19:45] <Some_Person> Doesn't follow the conventions of any other OS AFAIK
[19:46] <ZykoticK9> Some_Person, if you don't like there left side buttons (and prefer the old layout) you may want to add yourself to bug #532633
[19:46] <rye> Some_Person, why should it be at the corner, btw? I am not asking this to start some kind of flamewar, but I'm just interested why this is thought as being a stable convention, about the close button ?
[19:47] <Some_Person> At the very least, the close button should be in the corner. I usually lazily move my cursor to the corner and click whatever's there. Now if I do that, it maximizes/minimizes
[19:47] <ZykoticK9> rye, I'm with Some_Person on this -- even on the left side i would prefer close,min,max - but that breaks the default theme
[19:47] <Some_Person> I don't really care which corner, it just should be in one
[19:48] <rye> ZykoticK9, re: breaks - the sprites are broken?
[19:48] <ZykoticK9> rye, yup - because of the design they cant be used out-of-order or they look wrong
[19:49] <IdleOne> gconftool-2 --set /apps/metacity/general/button_layout --type string  "menu:close,minimize,maximize"
[19:49] <ZykoticK9> rye, "breaks" is too strong a word really
[19:49] <rye> ZykoticK9, I understood what you mean :)
[19:49] <IdleOne> err , not :
[19:50] <Some_Person> IdleOne: Now they're in the right corner, but the close button still is 3rd from the end!
[19:50] <penguin42> my problem is that this change isn't part of the theme; I dislike the change but if it was just part of a new theme then I'd be happy because it would be an easy way to switch if you disliked it
[19:50] <IdleOne> Some_Person: haha ok
[19:50] <rye> penguin42, so all themes start drawing buttons at the left?
[19:50] <IdleOne> then use menu:minize,maximize,close
[19:50] <Some_Person> IdleOne: Like I said, I don't care which corner, as long as the close button is at the end
[19:50] <rye> hmm
[19:50] <ZykoticK9> Some_Person, use "gconftool-2 --set "/apps/metacity/general/button_layout" --type string "menu:minimize,maximize,close""
[19:50] <penguin42> rye: Yeh, changing your theme won't revert the button position
[19:51] <ZykoticK9> Some_Person, one too man " at the end there
[19:51] <Some_Person> Thanks, that worked
[19:51] <Some_Person> Now you'll have to tell me that again once I have this thing installed
[19:51] <IdleOne> Some_Person: you could also use menu,close,maximize,minimize if you want them on the left
[19:52] <rye> hm, actually I liked the new button layout but I haven't actually checked whether that affects all themes.
[19:52] <Some_Person> Eh, I'm used to them being on the right
[19:52] <IdleOne> close button would be in far left corner
[19:52] <IdleOne> ok
[19:52] <ZykoticK9> rye, it does - button layout is not a theme setting
[19:52] <xxploit> any1 else keep getting a crash report upon login refering to telepathy-butterfly?
[19:52] <Some_Person> I'm just saying that if the ubuntu devs want it on the left, that's fine with me. I just want the close button on the end
[19:53] <Boondoklife> Some_Person: I like the order it is now cause it makes a bit of sence. Big, little, gone
[19:54] <Some_Person> Urgh, why is the ubuntu installer not detecting my SD card?
[19:55] <Some_Person> GParted sees it
[19:55] <Some_Person> Oddly though, both GParted and the installer see a partition-less HD
[20:00] <Some_Person> "Unable to open /dev/sda read-write  (Read-only file system)"
[20:00] <Some_Person> *sdb
[20:00] <Some_Person> What the hell does that mean? /dev/sdb is my SD card
[20:01] <rye> ZykoticK9, ah - "it's worth noting though that the order should apply only to light themes, it doesn't now but the issue will be fixed for lucid". Ok, I am no longer worrying :)
[20:01] <ZykoticK9> rye, where did you find that statement?
[20:01] <rye> ZykoticK9, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/light-themes/+bug/532633/comments/39
[20:02] <ZykoticK9> rye, ya - i wouldn't hold your breath on that one...
[20:03] <rye> ZykoticK9, I like the new layout and ordering, but I just find it a bit wrong to break all other, non-Light themes. However, it is still a month and a half until the final release
[20:04] <Some_Person> Why is /dev/sdb read-only?
[20:04] <ZykoticK9> rye, well we'll both have to wait and see what happens
[20:06] <Some_Person> Holy crap, I am an idiot. The lock switch was on on the SD card
[20:07] <Boondoklife> lol it is always something simple
[20:08] <Boondoklife> I do like that tweak ubuntu now lets you change the button positions
[20:08] <ZykoticK9> Boondoklife, Occam's razor :)
[20:09] <Boondoklife> ZykoticK9: cut myself on the lil so-and-so plenty of times!
[20:14] <Some_Person> If the buttons are kept in their current default positions, I will make a PPA to fix it
[20:15] <Some_Person> It'll have a tweaked version of light-theme, with the buttons made to look right with the old layout, and it'll automatically run that thing to move them to the right in the old order
[20:16] <BUGabundo> Some_Person: you only need to run a gconf key to change them back
[20:16] <BUGabundo> why use a PPA for it ?
[20:16] <Some_Person> But they don't look quite right
[20:16] <BUGabundo> look fine for me
[20:16] <Some_Person> The minimize is in a little box of its own
[20:16] <BUGabundo> correct
[20:16] <BUGabundo> doesn't affect me
[20:16] <BUGabundo> talk to the guy in charge
[20:16] <Some_Person> The PPA can fix that
[20:16] <BUGabundo> cjohnston ^^^^^
[20:17] <cjohnston> whos the guy in charge?
[20:18] <cjohnston> Some_Person: here is my request.. if this is something in your abilities
[20:18] <cjohnston> I personally like the new theme.. but..
[20:18] <cjohnston> in the preferences > appearances dialog, allow a user to check left or right for the buttons and title text
[20:19] <BUGabundo> cjohnston: that's not what he is talking about
[20:19] <BUGabundo> (2010-03-14 20:16:32) Some_Person: The minimize is in a little box of its own
[20:19] <BUGabundo> this is!
[20:19] <Some_Person> cjohnston: I don't think that's something I could do
[20:19] <Some_Person> My programming knowledge is very limited
[20:19] <cjohnston> ok.. maybe i didnt scroll back far enough
[20:20] <Some_Person> A few graphical changes and running a command is easy, but I can't do GUI design yet
[20:21] <cjohnston> gotcha
[20:21] <Some_Person> I could make a command line program to switch it, though since there's already a gconf command, that would be kinda pointless
[20:27] <cjohnston> ya
[20:27] <Some_Person> "An attempt to configure apt to install additional packages from the CD failed"
[20:28] <cjohnston> make what ya can and attach it to the bug report if you would
[20:33] <JEEBsv> Hmm, I've installed the LAMP stack onto my current lucid install and I don't get PHP scripts ran with mod_userdir
[20:34] <JEEBsv> Anyone else had this problem? I just need a little LAMP playground on my laptop to test/dev some stuff :3
[20:37] <dutchie> JEEBsv: iirc, PHP is disabled in user dirs by default
[20:37] <dutchie> there's a config option to tweak somewhere I think
[20:38] <JEEBsv> hmm, it certainly IIRC wasn't disabled in 9.10 but I'll google some on settings
[20:48] <JEEBsv> bleh, I'll try to re-install the lamp package first via tasksel >_>
[20:58] <JEEBsv> ok, found the solution via a cached google result... but I don't think commenting the whole ifmodule part in php5.conf is a _GOOD_ idea >_>
[20:58] <JEEBsv> php works now, but it sure as hell doesn't feel like a good solution
[21:05] <acamargo> hey! I added Partner repository and that updated sun-java* packages. but, firefox still haven't java plugin. any clue?
[21:06] <yofel> acamargo: bug 532174
[21:06] <acamargo> unfortunately for me, no java means no homebanking :-)
[21:06] <yofel> acamargo: there's a workaround
[21:07] <histo> Anyone having an issue with their laptop battery charging?
[21:07] <acamargo> yofel, great! I'm going there to see
[21:07] <histo> acamargo: theres a reason its alpha
[21:08] <acamargo> histo, yes I know ;-)
[21:08] <yofel> acamargo: 'sudo ln -s /etc/alternatives/mozilla-javaplugin.so /usr/lib/mozilla/plugins/libjavaplugin.so'
[21:09] <acamargo> histo, we need to test alpha, right?
[21:09] <acamargo> hehe
[21:09] <histo> acamargo: Yeah but you were saying that it meant no home banking for you.
[21:09] <histo> acamargo: hopefully you have an alternative to run to get to your banking
[21:09] <BUGabundo> the parner repo has sun java??
[21:09]  * BUGabundo goes try it
[21:09] <yofel> BUGabundo: since about a week or 2 ago yes
[21:10] <BUGabundo> I never enable it
[21:10] <acamargo> histo, I'm trying to say that's important. I'm sorry
[21:10] <Daemonik> Does the Lucid installer support nilfs?
[21:13] <histo> acamargo: ahh
[21:14] <histo> Daemonik: I don't remember seeing it as an option. But I really wasn't lookign for it.
[21:17] <happyface> should lucid lynx auto mount usb drives?
[21:18] <Daemonik> hmm
[21:18] <Daemonik> How difficult would it be to debootstrap and make my own initrd etc to use nilfs2?
[21:21] <AngryParsley> is there some way to close notifications? clicking on them does nothing
[21:22] <AngryParsley> hovering makes them blurry, but it's still hard to read any text underneath them
[21:22] <yofel> AngryParsley: no, that's just how notify-osd is designed
[21:23] <AngryParsley> can I disable notifications for certain apps? I don't really need a notification telling me my battery is discharging
[21:24] <benje2> hello where is define the sample rate for sound card in lucid ?
[21:25] <benje2> do you know problem with alsactl even with sudo that it cannot write to sound devices
[21:26] <acamargo> yofel, creating that symbolic link fixed your java plugin on firefox?
[21:26] <yofel> acamargo: it did here, if it doesn't for you then check if it's listed in about:plugins in firefox
[21:27] <yofel> acamargo: maybe you'll have to remove the icedtea plugin
[21:28] <tcsoccerman> not the iced tea!
[21:29] <acamargo> yofel, I created the link, but it doesn't show in about:plugins. I'll investigate icedtea
[21:29] <benje2> alsactl doesn-t work when pusleaudio is active
[21:29] <crimsun> benje2: yes it does.
[21:30] <yofel> acamargo: 'ls -l /usr/lib/mozilla/plugins/libjavaplugin.so' shows something like this?
[21:30] <yofel> 0 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 39 2010-02-25 21:52 /usr/lib/mozilla/plugins/libjavaplugin.so -> /etc/alternatives/mozilla-javaplugin.so
[21:30] <benje2> crimsun: the restore control said operation not permitted even with sudo
[21:30] <yofel> acamargo: and you do have sun-java6-plugin installed?
[21:31] <benje2> i have to unistall pulseaudio crimsun
[21:31] <crimsun> benje2: please get me an strace -f
[21:32] <acamargo> yofel, yep twice :-)
[21:32] <acamargo> yofel, no icedtea installed here
[21:32] <yofel> o.O
[21:32] <benje2> crimsun: ok i install pulse again , envy24control cannot change the sample rate too do you know where is it store
[21:32] <acamargo> yofel, I always used sun packages
[21:33] <yofel> acamargo: oh, I don't know how they work
[21:33] <benje2> crimsun: i have many problem with audio
[21:33] <acamargo> yofel, lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 64 2009-09-11 08:11 /etc/alternatives/mozilla-javaplugin.so -> /usr/lib/jvm/java-6-sun/jre/plugin/i386/ns7/libjavaplugin_oji.so right?
[21:33] <benje2> crimsun: i presume you want it in "lang C"
[21:33] <benje2> ?
[21:34] <yofel> acamargo: here's what I have: 0 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 48 2010-02-25 21:52 /etc/alternatives/mozilla-javaplugin.so -> /usr/lib/jvm/java-6-sun/jre/lib/i386/libnpjp2.so
[21:34] <crimsun> benje2: yes, using LANG=C
[21:35] <acamargo> yofel, hum... let's see
[21:35] <Some_Person> Ok, I've finally got Lucid up and running
[21:35] <benje2> crimsun: with mainline kernel ?
[21:35] <yofel> acamargo: what do you get if you run this? update-alternatives --list mozilla-javaplugin.so
[21:36] <crimsun> benje2: sure, whatever.
[21:37] <benje2> crimsun: the ubuntu kernel
[21:37] <acamargo> yofel, /usr/lib/jvm/java-6-sun/jre/plugin/i386/ns7/libjavaplugin_oji.so
[21:38] <yofel> acamargo: hm, what version of sun-java6-jre do you have installed?
[21:39] <benje2> crimsun: for the mutiple audio card i see that clock is on spdif by default wxith snd_ice1712 too and interface or jack cannot change them
[21:39] <benje2> i came back
[21:41] <alex-weej> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dpkg/+bug/537241
[21:41] <alex-weej> anyone else seeing this? dpkg is just taking forEVER
[21:41] <yofel> alex-weej: yep
[21:41] <kklimonda> alex-weej: yes, it's a know problem
[21:42] <alex-weej> any known workaround?
[21:42] <alex-weej> this has had 3 hours to do an update now
[21:42] <acamargo> yofel, 6.18-2
[21:42] <alex-weej> kinda bored
[21:42] <yofel> acamargo: then I don't know, could be because I'm using the debian package, not the one from the partner repos, but it *should* work
[21:43] <acamargo> yofel, np. thank you! I'm going to research a bit more
[21:45] <crimsun> alex-weej: it's intentional due to the fsync changes.
[21:45] <alex-weej> but there is a fix on the roadmap...?
[21:45] <crimsun> alex-weej: debian #430958, bug #512096
[21:46] <crimsun> alex-weej: please check the bugs for dpkg; I don't know offhand
[21:46] <alex-weej> i just upgraded to lucid today to test and it's been going over 3 hours now
[21:47] <yofel> alex-weej: the performance tests and analyzing is still being done and it will be optimized at some point, but for now data integrity is more important than performance
[21:48] <yofel> alex-weej: but it might very well be that we'll have to wait for the proper fix from the debian developers for that to happen
[21:49] <AngryParsley> is there a way to show the battery % in the indicator applet thingy? right now I just see a small battery icon that slowly drains
[21:53] <benje2> crimsun : http://paste.ubuntu.com/395324/ dmesg + alsactl restore +strace -f aslactl restore
[21:53] <benje2> for the lucid kernel
[21:53] <crimsun> benje2: I'm pretty busy ATM
[21:53] <Some_Person> How likely do y'all think it is that Lucid's buttons will be restored to the proper order?
[21:53] <Some_Person> (before release)
[21:54] <benje2> erf i do it again with lang=C
[21:58] <happyface> ubottu, bug#538292
[21:58] <acamargo> yofel, hey... link for libnpjp2.so worked
[21:58] <acamargo> yofel, nice! homebanking working fine
[21:58] <yofel> acamargo: :)
[21:59] <ZykoticK9> happyface, use a space like, bug #53292
[21:59] <happyface> thanks ZykoticK9
[22:00] <ZykoticK9> happyface, guess ubottu is busy right now :)
[22:00] <yofel> bug 538292
[22:00] <yofel> happyface: now ;)
[22:01] <AtomicSpark> If you guys are using the ambience theme and have noticed a light gray "bar" next to the show desktop icon, unlock the window list, move it right, move it left, relock it. ??? Profit!
[22:01] <AtomicSpark> Much better.
[22:02] <AtomicSpark> yofel: aren't alphas fun? :P
[22:02] <yofel> AtomicSpark: sure are :D
[22:03] <ZykoticK9> does the Apport bug 538097 affect Karmic as well?
[22:03] <Some_Person> Where is the button to swap nautilus's folder buttons with a location bar?
[22:03] <benje2> crimsun: alsa-info.sh http://www.alsa-project.org/db/?f=98856c5aa3f77e9485a5695744d7f7d04dbf70a3
[22:03] <yofel> ZykoticK9: it should, as it's the launchpad database that's broken
[22:03] <ZykoticK9> yofel, thanks
[22:03] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: It doesnt exist. Control+L or use the location menu.
[22:03] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: Why did they get rid of this? Who knows. :(
[22:04] <Some_Person> Is there a way to permanently make it a location bar?
[22:04] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: Er go menu, sorry.
[22:04] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: I am not sure.
[22:04] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: I dont see a preference for that.
[22:05] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: Maybe gconf? :(
[22:05] <Volkodav> /etc/init.d/samba restart
[22:05] <Volkodav> bash: /etc/init.d/samba: No such file or directory
[22:05] <Volkodav> ??
[22:05] <yofel> Volkodav: smbd not samba
[22:05] <Volkodav> it is installed I know
[22:05] <AtomicSpark> Volkodav: tab complete!
[22:06] <AtomicSpark> Volkodav: try sudo service samba restart
[22:06] <Volkodav> why the change things around /
[22:06] <Volkodav> ?
[22:06] <yofel> Volkodav: dunno, but yes, the proper way is 'sudo server smbd restart' now
[22:06] <Volkodav> service samba restart
[22:06] <Volkodav> samba: unrecognized service
[22:06] <AtomicSpark> Volkodav: What? It's just a shortcut command introduced a few releases ago. It's not a change.
[22:06] <benje2> Volkodav: shares-admin does samba is installed
[22:07] <yofel> Volkodav: argh, sry 'sudo service smbd restart'
[22:07] <Volkodav>  service smbd restart
[22:07] <Volkodav> smbd start/running, process 3288
[22:07] <AtomicSpark> yay!
[22:07] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: I found the setting in gconf
[22:08] <yofel> btw, 'dpkg -L samba' shows the name of the config files
[22:08] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: Path por favor.
[22:08] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: /apps/nautilus/preferences/always_use_location_entry
[22:08] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: Nice!
[22:09] <yofel> Volkodav: also, lucid uses upstart and not sysvinit anymore to handle system services in case you didn't know
[22:09] <Volkodav> oh ok that's why - how is it better though ?
[22:09] <AtomicSpark> !upstart > Volkodav
[22:10] <AtomicSpark> No ubottu :(
[22:10] <yofel> Volkodav: event driven model, can start things in parallel
[22:10] <yofel> makes for a faster boot :)
[22:10] <AtomicSpark> Volkodav: Basically that, it's "faster"
[22:10] <Some_Person> This is very unintuative. What was wrong with the button anyway?
[22:10] <yofel> is horrible to configure though -.-
[22:10] <AtomicSpark> ubottu: lag
[22:10] <benje2> erf still no sound with snd_ice1712
[22:11] <yofel> !upstart > Volkodav
[22:11] <AtomicSpark> yofel: Shh. It's loading. Leave it alone. :(
[22:11] <Volkodav> this faster thing makes you learn more commands:-D
[22:11] <AtomicSpark> Basically this http://upstart.ubuntu.com/
[22:11] <Volkodav> still can't see the Mac directory
[22:11] <yofel> that's at least the 3rd time today that ubottu timed out o.O
[22:11] <Volkodav> windoze boxen see it ok though
[22:12] <AtomicSpark> Huh. more people use upstart than i remembered.
[22:13] <AtomicSpark> Old people hang onto that runlevel system. They want their server running in single user mode. :(
[22:13] <yofel> AtomicSpark: actually when it comes to a easy to configure server I would still use Lenny because it still has sysvinit
[22:14] <yofel> at least until there's a sane way to configure upstart
[22:14] <yofel> finally...
[22:14] <AtomicSpark> yofel: I love my Ubuntu Servers.
[22:15] <Some_Person> Also, why does ubuntu only come with 5 games?
[22:15] <yofel> AtomicSpark: I said, easy to configure, once you finally unstand how upstart works it's ok
[22:15] <yofel> AtomicSpark: but yeah, I do generally prefer ubuntu to debian :)
[22:16] <yofel> Some_Person: err.. you can find a lot more in the software center if you want them
[22:16] <ZykoticK9> Some_Person, if you're looking for one of the games from the old versions, i think they are still installed, just not in the menu
[22:16] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: A lot of the games weren't maintained, ugly, and had usability issues.
[22:16] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: So they purged them.
[22:16] <AndyGraybeal> is Bacula going to be the preferred or recommended backup software in 10.04?  if not what program will be?
[22:16] <AtomicSpark> AndyGraybeal: I didn't know we had a preferred app :P
[22:17] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: Can they still be installed?
[22:17] <AndyGraybeal> AtomicSpark: i'm not sure either, but Ubuntu 8.04 actually has documentation for Bacula, as opposed to Amanda or something.
[22:17] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: Yes. Of course.
[22:18] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: I was actually trying to add some commercial apps, but ran into licensing issues.
[22:18] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: what apps?
[22:18] <lenios> there is no chance in the backup part in lucid
[22:19] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: ID games, other games that have been ported. Either demos or linux "patchers"
[22:19] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: But the packaging team doesnt assume. The must know. Ubuntu likes to stay legit.
[22:20] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: So they wont host a game patcher just because it's on fileplanet, they have to make sure the license says they can.
[22:20] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: I don't think demos are a good idea
[22:20] <ddecator> there is a whole big process involving licenses and copyright
[22:20] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: We already have shareware, why not? :P
[22:20] <yofel> hey ddecator
[22:21] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: see rott
[22:21] <xTheGoat121x> So, i'm reading a blog that mentions that Pidgin isn't minimizing to indicator-applet as it should, is that correct?
[22:21] <ddecator> hey yofel =)
[22:21] <AtomicSpark> xTheGoat121x: They probably changed the plugin option or it wasn't set correctly in lucid.
[22:21] <AtomicSpark> Empathy is looking pretty nice. I converted, so should you!
[22:22] <xTheGoat121x> AtomicSpark, well the reason I ask is b/c Pidgin is unstable for me in Karmic. Oh, and I can't stand Empathy -- I highly dislike the lack of CTRL-TAB
[22:22] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: Is rott not fully functional when you install it?
[22:23] <AtomicSpark> xTheGoat121x: i see what you mean. unstable how? are you having account issues?
[22:23] <dupondje> Evening :)
[22:23] <ZykoticK9> xTheGoat121x, Pidgin is minimizing to the Notification Area ok on my system
[22:23] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: It works fine for me. Only lets you get to the third level. It's the same demo that shipped with DN3D years back.
[22:24] <xTheGoat121x> AtomicSpark, to make as much of a long story as short as possible... Not account problems, it seems that occasionally, Pidgin will redirect new conversations to windows that don't exist (I can give a pastebin of a backtrace if you want it), and now, I can't close my buddy list without the program completely closing on me.
[22:25] <Some_Person> I am pleased with the way empathy is improving at least
[22:25] <Ganymede> so in karmic, i had to go through hoops and hurdles to get mozilla firefox and google-chrome beta (unsupported) to embed evince when viewing PDFs, is there any progress towards this on lucid? (i had to install mozplugger from ppa or cvs to work around a bug, then edit the mozplugger config file, and that's relatively complicated considering the research that went into figuring out the exact steps)
[22:25] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: Yes, it still has a ways to go. It's too late in the game sadly, but I have a list of feature improvements. :P
[22:26] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: But at least it's not so darned ugly anymore. :(
[22:27] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: And / commands work in IRC
[22:27] <AndyGraybeal> AtomicSpark: it seemed when 8.04 was out that everyone was hinting towards using Bacula for backups.  i'm wondering if that is the same now as it was then.
[22:27] <AtomicSpark> AndyGraybeal: I use rsync :P
[22:28] <AndyGraybeal> okay, thank you
[22:29] <AtomicSpark> AndyGraybeal: You could always try bestbot in #ubuntu-bots? I think that's the channel.
[22:30] <AndyGraybeal> wow nice AtomicSpark  :)
[22:30] <AtomicSpark> AndyGraybeal: I use encrypted homes, not much works with that in my expeince. I need something that works with that or only backs up when the user is logged in.
[22:31] <AndyGraybeal> AtomicSpark: interesting.  does it have some type of cataloging thing?
[22:31] <AtomicSpark> AndyGraybeal: I believe it just records the number of times someone types a word. Donno.
[22:32] <Some_Person> The default search engine is now yahoo?
[22:33] <dupondje> Some_Person: yes
[22:33] <Some_Person> why?
[22:33] <AngryParsley> does it matter? the first thing I did was install chrome
[22:33] <Some_Person> You do know that Microsoft bought Yahoo's search backend, right?
[22:33] <yofel> Some_Person: because canonical earned some money by doing that
[22:34] <ZykoticK9> Some_Person, therefore Microsoft is indirectly funding Ubuntu usage
[22:34] <benje2> in empathy you cannot made a irc account in first screen, you have to create one proposed and after you can create it in menu,
[22:34] <ZykoticK9> benje2, that is a know "won't fix" issue
[22:34] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: You pretty much wouldn't be using anything if you boycotted against something partnered with a "bad company".
[22:35] <Andre_Gondim> is there any news about report bug's problem?
[22:35] <ZykoticK9> Andre_Gondim, still not working ;)
[22:35] <AtomicSpark> AndyGraybeal: about launchpad being broken?
[22:35] <benje2> why ZykoticK9 people who want to use only irc cannot ?
[22:35] <yofel> AtomicSpark: nope, the admins well look at it once they get back to work tomorrow
[22:35] <yofel> err Andre_Gondim ^^^
[22:35] <benje2> with empathy they have to get an other account before :/
[22:35] <ZykoticK9> benje2, the upstream Empathy people feel irc if very poorly supported in there program so...
[22:36] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: true
[22:36] <benje2> ZykoticK9: but this is proposed after stange thingsd
[22:36] <AtomicSpark> ZykoticK9: Honestly? I dont even know why they're trying. IM clients have never been good at IRC.
[22:36] <ZykoticK9> AtomicSpark, +1
[22:36] <AtomicSpark> They should focus on making the IM part better. :P
[22:36] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: +1
[22:36] <yofel> AtomicSpark: +1
[22:37] <Some_Person> Ubuntu should just come with a decent IRC client
[22:37] <AtomicSpark> I know. I am teh awesome.
[22:37] <Volkodav> Xchat
[22:37] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: The problem is it doesnt. I hear it used to.
[22:37] <kklimonda> are there any known problems with open radeon driver?
[22:37] <AtomicSpark> They'd put in xchat-gnome which is :(
[22:37]  * yofel notes that kubuntu comes with quassel by default
[22:37] <Andre_Gondim> and, any one has a problem with gwibber? I didn't see any update at main windows
[22:37] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: I've heard that too, but I don't recall it ever coming with one since I started with breezy
[22:38] <kklimonda> like it not being used at all with Xorg.0.log http://pastebin.com/4M69e5VD
[22:38] <AtomicSpark> kklimonda: HD cards work well. as far as gaming? some games dont play, some do only to a certain quality setting.
[22:38] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: Kubuntu ships with something afaik
[22:38] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: Yep, Konversation
[22:38] <yofel> AtomicSpark Some_Person, kubuntu includes quassel atm
[22:39] <Some_Person> ok, so they changed. but it still comes with something intended for IRC alone, right?
[22:39] <yofel> Some_Person: yes, quassel is irc only
[22:39] <yofel> Some_Person: pretty nice, but lacks DCC support
[22:39] <Some_Person> Why not include something in ubuntu?
[22:40] <AtomicSpark> The issue probably comes from xchat breaking Gnome HIG, not working with indicator applet. And xchat-gnome is so oudated it's not even funny.
[22:40] <yofel> Some_Person: no idea, propose a few apps on brainstorm maybe
[22:40] <yofel> hm, could be
[22:41]  * yofel doesn't know any GTK apps for IRC besides xchat
[22:41] <AtomicSpark> Learnid would be nice if they made it generic so that you could also have a "support" version, so it asks you for a username and then connects you to #ubuntu, etc.
[22:41] <yofel> we could include chatzilla XD
[22:41] <Volkodav> pidgin
[22:41] <AtomicSpark> Volkodav: No.
[22:42] <Volkodav> ?
[22:42] <Volkodav> it is in xubuntu
[22:42] <yofel> Volkodav: they intentionally dropped pidgin, so I doubt that
[22:42] <kermiac> yofel: are you using quassel on lucid?
[22:42] <yofel> kermiac: yees
[22:42] <yofel> *yes
[22:42] <yofel> kermiac: git head thoug
[22:42] <kermiac> can you highlight text?
[22:42] <Some_Person> Include Xchat, but disable the tray icon?
[22:42] <yofel> *though
[22:42] <Volkodav> dropped in ubuntu to move to xubuntu ?
[22:42] <Volkodav> makes no sense
[22:42] <AtomicSpark> Force the users to use irssi, if they get scared and use a different distor, then we're all for the better. Natrual selection I calls it.
[22:43] <Volkodav> weechat
[22:43] <benje2> does someone know how to change clock source for audiocard ?
[22:43] <yofel> kermiac: I'll install the client and try in a moment
[22:43] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: No! I don't tend to like text-based IRC clients
[22:43] <Volkodav> is decent
[22:43] <kermiac> ok, ty yofel
[22:43] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: But IRC is text. It makes sense. ):
[22:44] <AtomicSpark> Ooo. Have you noticed Software Center's theme yet?
[22:44] <yofel> kermiac: ok, highlight in what way?
[22:44] <kermiac> yofel: I'm using quassel-client-qt4: 0.6~rc1+git100312-0ubuntu1
[22:44] <kermiac> sorry, i just want to select text to copy & paste
[22:44] <kermiac> can select text
[22:45] <Some_Person> Xchat seems like the most logical one to include. It's popular, has a GUI, and has a good featureset
[22:45] <AtomicSpark> Oh lawd. Flash is back. :(
[22:45] <kermiac> s/can/can't
[22:45]  * kermiac tries to wake up his fingers
[22:45] <AtomicSpark> Lemme install xchat and I'll tell you what's wrong with it.
[22:46] <Some_Person> I'm using Xchat now
[22:46] <yofel> kermiac: o.O If I select text and: click somewhere: no copy in menu / click on the selected text: copy there in menu
[22:46] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: which version do you have installed?
[22:46] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: Whatever's in the repository
[22:46] <kermiac> yofel: ok, thanks. I can't even select the text :(
[22:47] <Some_Person> Currently, in my lucid install, I have 2.8.6
[22:47] <yofel> ah, that's the same in the git head
[22:47] <yofel> kermiac: o.O, that works here
[22:47]  * kermiac shrugs
[22:47] <AtomicSpark> Some_Person: there is xchat and xchat-gnome, main vs universe
[22:47] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: Not xchat-gnome
[22:48] <Some_Person> regular xchat
[22:48] <kermiac> only thing I may have done differently is using --no-recommends to keep kde libs of my computer
[22:48] <kermiac> yofel: I might pull in k3b so it will install kde libs & see if that helps
[22:49] <yofel> kermiac: can be, I use KDE so I can't really test that ^^
[22:49] <AtomicSpark> kermiac: not having recommends shouldn't break an application.
[22:49] <yofel> indeed
[22:49] <kermiac> i realise that... but I don't know what else *may* have caused it
[22:51] <kermiac> ah. k3b doesn't pull in the kde libs anymore,lol
[22:52] <Some_Person> AtomicSp*rk: So what's wrong with Xchat?
[22:52] <yofel> Some_Person: they probably won't include something from universe in the default installation
[22:53] <solid_liq> I can't believe there haven't been any updates to apt in > 24 hours
[22:53] <solid_liq> but, it's running nice and stable for me right now, so I'm not complaining :)
[22:53] <yofel> solid_liq: well, we do have beta1freeze in effect and it's weekend :)
[22:53] <AtomicSp0rk> Doesnt seem to support Indicator Applet. Canonical wont include it until a plugin is made (I'm not familiar with it's pluginability) or the functionality is added.
[22:53] <solid_liq> yofel, oh, so that's why!  :D
[22:53] <AtomicSp0rk> Ugh, xchats tab complete is annoying.
[22:53] <Some_Person> AtomicSp*rk: Anything else wrong with it?
[22:53] <solid_liq> yofel, I don't think the weekend part is an issue though.  I had lots of updates come in last weekend
[22:54] <solid_liq> AtomicSp0rk, it's configurable
[22:54] <AtomicSp0rk> Some_Person, It probably doesnt support libnotify either.
[22:54] <AtomicSp0rk> Some_Person, but it not being in main doesnt help. :P
[22:54] <AtomicSp0rk> brb xchat-gnome
[22:55] <yofel> last time I tried xchat-gnome I found it horrible
[22:55] <Some_Person> I hate xchat-gnome
[22:55] <yofel> it just doesn't feel right if you've used xchat before it
[22:55] <Some_Person> I actually tried xchat-gnome first and hated it
[22:56] <solid_liq> yeah, xchat-gnome sucks
[22:56] <AtomicSp0rk> The UI looks better. :\
[22:56] <yofel> oh nice, my ubuntu hardy upgrade test just gave a package error in KVM, hahahaaahaaaaa.... *sigh*
[22:56] <solid_liq> the original xchat is much better
[22:56] <Some_Person> AtomicSp0rk: That's the only good thing about it
[22:57] <solid_liq> AtomicSp0rk, I like "last-spoke order" for tab completion
[22:57] <AtomicSp0rk> Some_Person, also doesnt break the HIG. Still lacks other support though.
[22:57] <solid_liq> irssi is also nice if you find that you don't like xchat
[22:58] <yofel> I actually like irssi, used it in combination with screen+ssh for a while, but now that quassel does pretty much the same for me I only use it if I'm stuck in a tty
[22:58] <AtomicSpark> Closing xchat feels like it freezes :(
[22:58] <solid_liq> yeah, that's how I used to always use it too
[22:59] <solid_liq> I need to get my server up and running again before I do that again
[22:59] <yofel> the bad thing about irssi is that the gui menu entry is only available if you install 'menu-xdg'
[22:59] <AtomicSpark> Menu?
[22:59] <Some_Person> AtomicSpark: installing xchat-indicator adds basic indicator integration
[22:59] <AtomicSpark> Why do you need a menu?
[23:00] <yofel> AtomicSpark: you don't need it, but someone once requested a .desktop entry and the debian folkes closed it with won't fix
[23:00] <solid_liq> heh, I actually made a set of libnotify scripts for irssi to have a remote irssi client running in screen put notifications on my desktop
[23:02] <benje2> it's in asound.state now i can change clocksource and switch to other than spdif
[23:02] <solid_liq> djburns, are you tethered to your phone?
[23:03] <pastyhermit> Can someone explain to me what "Merge" and "Merge All" are referring to?
[23:03] <pastyhermit> its a very confusing terminology, does the file system now have version control?
[23:03] <yofel> pastyhermit: in what context?
[23:03] <ZykoticK9> !crosspost > pastyhermit
[23:03] <pastyhermit> can it merge ascii or binary files now when I copy them?
[23:03] <djburns> Solid: Nope. On an irc app. Why?
[23:03] <pastyhermit> ZykoticK9, sorry went to the wrong channel first
[23:04] <solid_liq> djburns, the 't-mobile.co.uk' part when you joined made me curious
[23:04] <pastyhermit> ubottu, in terms of nautilus
[23:04] <ZykoticK9> pastyhermit, ahhh - sorry all good then
[23:04] <pastyhermit> will it merge the items at a file level? content level?
[23:04] <pastyhermit> Im confused... And I know alot about computers and linux ...
[23:04] <djburns> solid_liq: fe
[23:04] <solid_liq> heh, just went to google...
[23:04] <solid_liq> happy pi day!  lol
[23:05] <pastyhermit> If my computer tells me that it is going to merge some files I think that it will combine both of those files at a content level.
[23:05] <yofel> hm, I don't get either why nautilus would want to merge stuff, execpt if its u1 related
[23:05] <yofel> pastyhermit: merge folders maybe?
[23:05] <pastyhermit> yofel, I think it means "Replace" and "Replace All"
[23:05] <pastyhermit> but I am not sure.
[23:05] <pastyhermit> By the way the new theme is absolutely gorgeous
[23:05] <yofel> well, merging folders isn't the same as replacing them
[23:06] <yofel> pastyhermit: oh, you like buttons on the left?
[23:06] <pastyhermit> though I changed the background to something very similar that has a bit more color variations...
[23:06] <pastyhermit> yofel, yes the nautilus buttons
[23:06] <yofel> pastyhermit: I meant the window buttons, max/min/close
[23:09] <pastyhermit> no, the "Merge" and "Merge All" do not appear where the max/min/close buttons appear
[23:09] <pastyhermit> yofel, I changed the background as in the wallpaper to something that I found on deviant art.
[23:12] <IdleOne> I absolutely love how the backgrounds fade in when you select a different one :)
[23:13] <NullEntity> Has anyone gotten Java applets working in Lucid?
[23:13] <ZykoticK9> NullEntity, it's currently a bug see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sun-java6/+bug/532174
[23:14] <NullEntity> Huh, I didn't think it was a Lucid bug.
[23:14] <yofel> NullEntity: yep, as I said on the bug, you need to fix a  symlink for sun-java6 and firefox
[23:14] <yofel> NullEntity: or use the icedtea6-plugin from openjdk
[23:20] <solid_liq> I love the group and tab plugin for compiz
[23:20] <solid_liq> I just played with it for the first time
[23:24] <ddbt> hello, does anyone know whether the new ubuntu UI look gets an update/bugfix before the actual release?
[23:25] <yofel> ddbt: bugfix? what's broken?
[23:26] <ddbt> well, nothing is really broken, but there are still some things left to polish
[23:26] <ddbt> like the "squared" rounded corners.. the "background" of the 3 buttons, whenever there is only one.. (the close button)
[23:27] <ddbt> etc.
[23:27] <ddbt> little things
[23:27] <pastyhermit> yofel, any idea?
[23:27] <yofel> pastyhermit: nope, sry, haven't used nautilus in a while
[23:28] <ZykoticK9> ddbt, you can see currently working on bugs regarding light at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/light-themes
[23:28] <pastyhermit> yofel, :D
[23:28] <pastyhermit> let me guess... fluxbox for you :D
[23:28] <yofel> pastyhermit: nope, KDE :P
[23:29] <ddbt> well thanks zykotick9!
[23:30] <ddbt> but are these 'bugs' still relevant for the upcoming release.. since there has been a ui freeze
[23:30] <ddbt> ?
[23:31] <ZykoticK9> pastyhermit, how are you getting this merge message?  if i use nautilus to copy to a folder with the same files - i just get the regular "overright" message
[23:31] <yofel> ddbt: I hope they are, they duped the light theme on use one day before ui freeze... a bit short to test something
[23:31] <pastyhermit> ZykoticK9, when I copy things from one folder to another in ubuntu
[23:32] <ZykoticK9> pastyhermit, i'm not getting that behaviour?
[23:32] <pastyhermit> yofel, sorry no light theme for 10.4?
[23:32] <NullEntity> How do I sudo-open a file browser?
[23:33] <pastyhermit> NullEntity, sudo -c "nautilus --no-desktop"
[23:33] <yofel> pastyhermit: no, I mean they pused the theme into the repos one day before ui freeze
[23:33]  * yofel is getting tired
[23:33] <yofel> *pushed
[23:34] <pastyhermit> oh...
[23:34]  * BUGabundo pulls yofel back
[23:34] <pastyhermit> so it will be there
[23:34] <ZykoticK9> NullEntity, "gksu nautilus" works for me (this is NOT recommended mind you, except in emergencies)
[23:34] <pastyhermit> its really nice...
[23:34]  * yofel thanks BUGabundo :D
[23:34] <pastyhermit> now I wont change the default theme everytime I sit infront of an ubuntu install :D
[23:34] <BUGabundo> yofel: don't you go leaving us, like bruce89 did
[23:35] <BUGabundo> cause he , like many of us, disagree with upstream changes, and not caring to what we say
[23:35] <NullEntity> Well I just need to create that sym link. I just suck with the Terminal
[23:35] <yofel> BUGabundo: I do disagree with gnome, that's why I use KDE now, but I don't disagree enough with ubuntu to leave you guys ;)
[23:36] <yofel> NullEntity: it should be: 'sudo ln -s /etc/alternatives/mozilla-javaplugin.so /usr/lib/mozilla/plugins/libjavaplugin.so'
[23:38] <NullEntity> And then I need to remove that code chunk?
[23:38] <yofel> NullEntity: wait a moment
[23:38] <yofel> need to check something
[23:39] <yofel> NullEntity: ok, try to run that command and see if it works
[23:40] <NullEntity> Link seems to be broken
[23:40] <sqwertle> I seem to be having troubles with nautilus and was wondering if anyone couild help me install a particular font?
[23:41] <richthegeek> hey guys, another day another issue
[23:41] <yofel> NullEntity: oh, wait, do you have a /etc/alternatives/xulrunner-1.9-javaplugin.so?
[23:41] <NullEntity> yeah, just found it
[23:41] <richthegeek> default scroll action on the volume-indicator applet has changed from +1 to +5... how do i revert this?
[23:41] <yofel> NullEntity: sorry, I use a different fix here so I made a mistake there
[23:42] <NullEntity> Do I need to link to that instead?
[23:44] <yofel> NullEntity: yes
[23:45] <yofel> NullEntity: I mean, if that file links to a libnpjp2.so then yes
[23:48] <NullEntity> Thanks a lot!
[23:48] <NullEntity> It's working now!
[23:49] <yofel> NullEntity: you're welcom
[23:49] <yofel> e
[23:49] <NullEntity> Now I can get my bro off our new gaming desktop >.<
[23:50] <blindndangerous> anyone here?
[23:50] <NullEntity> ofc.
[23:51] <blindndangerous> I'm trying to get ubuntu 10.04 running on a virtual machine, but can't figure out how to get orca to start for the installer.
[23:53] <blindndangerous> When I start up vmware player, and start, I see a bunch of lines go real quick across my screan, then something white or gray go from the bottom to top, then the screen turns blue, and I see diaolgue boxes start poping up.
[23:53] <blindndangerous> dialogue popping*
[23:59] <ZykoticK9> blindndangerous, perhaps if there is a Vmware channel you could ask there (I'm unaware of one, but never looked for one either).  FYI VirtualBox can install Lucid.