[02:07] <kermiac_> what should I do if a user manually reports a bug & uploads the crash file due to bug 538097?
[02:07] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 538097 in apport (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "+storeblob fails with "500 Internal server error" on production (works on edge) (affects: 101) (dups: 6)" [High,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/538097
[02:10] <persia> kermiac_: if you have a compatible system, pull the .crash file and retrace locally.
[02:10] <persia> If you don't, ask the user to do so.
[02:10] <persia> Warn the user that the .crash file may contain sensitive information.
[02:10] <persia> The key thing is to get something useful in the bug, and to get the .crash file deleted (as one might delete a coredump)
[02:11] <persia> (as there's usually a coredump *inside* the .crash file)
[02:11] <kermiac_> I was going to mark it as private for now as I noticed there is a coredump inside the crash file
[02:11] <kermiac_> ah, yes
[02:12] <persia> marking it private later doesn't help much.  The librarian URL for the .crash file has been made public.
[02:12] <persia> (because of bugmail)
[02:12] <kermiac_> i keep forgetting about bugs being aggregated to mailing lists
[02:15] <kermiac_> I can't retrace... is there some kind of standard response to ask the user to retrace locally? or should I maybe refer them to 5328097 & ask them to submit later? Should I delete the crash file as the url has been made public & I really don't know if I should expect the OP to retrace it
[02:16] <persia> You can't retrace because of architecture skew?  Which architecture is the bug?
[02:16] <kermiac_> no, I can't because I'm at work atm. bug & my system are both 32bit
[02:17] <kermiac_> just doing some quick triage on a break & happened to find these 2 bugs
[02:17] <kermiac_> you want the bug #'s to look at them as I can't get that involved whilst still at work
[02:20] <kermiac_> bug 539346 and bug 539345
[02:20] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 539346 in tracker (Ubuntu) "Crash will not report right (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/539346
[02:20] <ubot4> kermiac_: Bug 539345 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/539345 is private
[02:21] <kermiac_> i had already marked 539345 as private before you reminded me about the url already being public
[02:23] <persia> Given the affected packages, I suspect these bugs need to be retested and re-crashed against upstream, etc.
[02:24] <persia> I'd suggest deleting the .crash files, making them public, and asking for a typical expected/actual report with information on what was done to create the crash.
[02:24] <persia> Note that the .crash files may contain private informaiton (especially for tracker), and try to triage from there.
[02:26] <kermiac_> ok thanks for the advice persia :) I haven't been around when something like this has happened before, so I didn't know exactly what I should do
[02:26] <persia> Something like this has not happened before.
[02:27] <persia> My advice is mostly based on the pre-apport model.
[02:27] <kermiac_> persia: is that model documented anywhere? I haven't had to look for it before
[02:28] <persia> Not anymore.
[02:28] <persia> It's mostly the same wiki pages, but old revisions.
[02:28] <kermiac_> ok, np :)
[02:28] <persia> Basically, assume no apport.  Find out what went wrong.  Get a stacktrace using gdb, etc.
[03:03] <Damascene> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=8944731
[03:03] <Damascene> Another gnome-terminal profile!
[03:03] <Damascene> is it a bug?
[05:46] <Damascene> hello, I want to report bug against freeserif font
[05:46] <Damascene> dpkg -S freeserif comes with nothing
[05:52] <micahg> Damascene: that doesn't seem to be a valid package
[05:53] <Damascene> got it thanks
[05:53] <Damascene> https://bugs.launchpad.net/firefox/+bug/468898
[05:53] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 468898 in ubuntu (and 2 other projects) "FreeSerif should not be default Serif font (affects: 2) (dups: 1)" [Undecided,Invalid]
[05:54] <Damascene> again I suggest bugs title to be simple or to add a special section for what user might search to get to a bug
[05:54] <Damascene> many duplicates are cause by so much technical titles
[05:55] <Damascene> a user might search for default firefox font is ugly wouldn't find "freeserif should not be default serif font"
[05:57] <micahg> Damascene: k, but once hte bug is duped, it'll show up
[05:57] <micahg> I think
[05:57] <micahg> maybe now
[05:57] <micahg> *not
[05:57] <ddecator> that's why you use google to search for bugs =)
[05:57] <Damascene> so what did you do?
[05:57] <Damascene> :)
[05:58] <micahg> nothing, just change the firefox project to null :P
[05:58] <Damascene> what we are supposed to do now?
[05:58] <micahg> Damascene: what do you want to do?
[05:58] <ddecator> google searching "site:bugs.launchpad.net <search terms>" searches descriptions of bugs as well, so even if the title is odd you can usually still find what you're looking for
[05:58] <micahg> the translators know about the issue
[05:58] <Damascene> I want this problem to be fixed
[05:58] <Damascene> so it's up to translators to chose which font serif is using?
[05:59] <micahg> that team decides the defaults
[05:59] <micahg> Damascene: you can hop in #ubuntu-translators During european business hours and ask
[05:59] <Damascene> so we need to add the arabic translator team as well, right?
[06:00] <micahg> Damascene: ask in #ubuntu-translators in a few hours
[06:00] <Damascene> ok
[06:01] <Damascene> I want to report that the freeserif font has problem
[06:01] <Damascene> should I open new bug?
[06:01] <micahg> what problem?
[06:01] <Damascene> there is gaps between some letters
[06:02] <micahg> Damascene: in all programs?
[06:02] <Damascene> yes
[06:02] <micahg> Damascene: package is ttf-freefont
[06:03] <Damascene> not freetype?
[06:03] <micahg> Damascene: well, depends if it's a problem with the font or the engine
[06:04] <Damascene> I'll report it as soon as I get more information
[06:04] <micahg> Damascene: idk, I guess I should just say that :)
[06:05] <Damascene> what if the same problem is in dejavu serif :(
[06:06] <micahg> Damascene: engine issue
[06:06] <Damascene> there is a big deference between the font in Arabic and in English
[06:07] <Damascene> it more than a work of art font than a general reading font in Arabic
[06:07] <micahg> Damascene: maybe as the translators
[06:08] <Damascene> I'll ask them
[08:49] <BUGabundo_remote> 0/
[09:02] <Damascene> any known bug of user can't creat boot partition smaller than 16G on 1T disk?
[09:07] <BUGabundo_remote> Damascene: in what FS?
[09:07] <BUGabundo_remote> and kernel?
[09:08] <BUGabundo_remote> cause I have a single partition on a 1.5T
[09:08] <Damascene> the man in ubuntu+1
[09:08] <Damascene> http://tavasti.fi/~tavasti/ubuntu/installer-20100315/
[09:09] <Damascene> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/daily/20100315/lucid-alternate-amd64.iso
[09:09] <Damascene> as he said
[09:10] <Damascene> and he tested it with ext2 and ext3
[09:11] <Damascene>  Damascene, however, when there is that 16.8G partition with 16.8G offset, I can create another partition with correct size. So bug happens only when creating first partition to empty disk?
[09:16] <Damascene> BUGabundo_remote, are you here?
[09:16] <Damascene> the man is asking for what package and version
[09:16] <BUGabundo_remote> sometimes
[09:16] <BUGabundo_remote> working
[09:17] <BUGabundo_remote> AFAICS would be kernel (linux) or installer (ubiquity)
[09:24] <vish> bdmurray: you should probably add exclusions for the patch script , the light-themes , ubuntu-mono  dont need review from the review team :)
[09:25] <tavasti> problems creating small /boot partition, see full detail http://tavasti.fi/~tavasti/ubuntu/installer-20100315/bug.txt
[09:25] <persia> vish: Why not?  How do they differ?
[09:26] <persia> vish: If you mean "because we have a close relationship with upstream", then that's just a matter of upsteam getting to them first.
[09:26] <persia> (and we've often had close relationships with upstreams before that got dropped or orphaned, etc. making hardcoded exceptions less than ideal)
[09:27] <vish> persia: no , some of the users attach icons and check it as patch..
[09:27] <vish> persia: Bug #538093 , this is a change in the theme which was intentional , too
[09:27] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 538093 in light-themes (Ubuntu) "Maximised/unmaximised not level below gnome-panel (affects: 1)" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/538093
[09:27] <persia> And what's wrong with that?
[09:27]  * persia much prefers full icons to xdiff output
[09:28] <vish> persia: the review team are not responsible for those choices or even approving them
[09:28] <vish> persia: seems like extra bug queue for the team :)
[09:28] <persia> vish: Who do you believe is responsible?
[09:29] <vish> persia: i dont believe , i know who is responsible ;)  the design folks :)
[09:29] <persia> Aren't they upstream?
[09:30] <vish> persia: there is no upstream project yet for either themes/icons , they are not hosted publicly yet
[09:30] <persia> Rather, there is an upstream, but it's not a public upstream.
[09:30] <vish> yeah that ;)
[09:31] <persia> So, the patch reviewers may just submit these upstream.
[09:31] <persia> Alternately, they may push to get them uploaded.
[09:31] <persia> Doesn't really matter.
[09:31] <persia> But the patch reviewers are acting on behalf of Ubuntu, rather than on behalf of a private upstream.
[09:31] <vish> persia: i suggested it mostly because none of the people listed here > https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-reviewers/+members#active , decide it
[09:32] <persia> So, if that private upstream wants to get involved in the patch review, they ought do that.
[09:32] <tavasti> lucid installer cannot create partitions smaller than 16.8GB, see full detail http://tavasti.fi/~tavasti/ubuntu/installer-20100315/bug.txt Do I report it as a bug, and to what package?
[09:32] <vish> except sabdfl ofcouse ;)
[09:32] <vish> persia: i'v been mentioning the bugs which require attention to the concerned people and they are watch the bugs themselves too
[09:32] <persia> vish: It's much more complicated than you describe.  There's no reason why any developer who can upload the package can't make the change : it's done through collective consensus.
[09:32] <vish> watching*
[09:33] <persia> vish: There isn't some decider, as such.
[09:33] <vish> persia: they dont/cant approve the changes in the theme/icon. there _is_ a decider :)  these choices are not open for review or much discussion
[09:34]  * vish already spoke too much :s
[09:35] <persia> vish: Um, yes they do.  I could upload a completely different theme right now.  I'm not going to do so because I don't believe I'd be acting as part of consensus, not because I need some approval.
[09:36] <vish> persia: nope ,you cant, why dont you give it a shot ;)   these bugs are not consensus based
[09:36] <persia> vish: I'm not going to for the reason I stated.  But you can check the launchpad permissions structures if you like.
[09:37] <persia> *Everything* in Ubuntu is consensus-based.
[09:37] <persia> There are currently no exceptions.
[09:37] <persia> There is a provision for exceptions to be defined, but it has yet to be exercised, because there has been no case where consensus has failed to the degree that changing this is necessary.
[09:38] <persia> That doesn't mean that we don't collectively grant some groups authority over certain areas, but that authority remains subject to consensus.
[09:57] <persia> Just for those following the above : vish has now joined the reviewers team, and will be upstreaming the icon patches, etc. to help get them out of the review queue.
[10:01] <kermiac> hey persia, when a package isn't showing up in the software centre, the bug should be filed against the actual package - not software-centre - right? It seems that way looking through similar bugs as to fix the issue a "category" needs to be added to the .desktop file in the package
[10:01] <kermiac> do you know much about software-centre?
[10:02] <persia> kermiac: Yes, and yes.
[10:02] <kermiac> thanks persia - you're like the ubuntu version of google/wikipedia :)
[10:03] <persia> kermiac: No, that would be search.ubuntu.com :p
[10:04] <kermiac> haha :)
[10:07] <Damascene> WARNING: at /build/buildd/linux-2.6.32/net/wireless/core.c:614 wdev_cleanup_work 0xa7/0xd0  cfg80211
[10:07] <Damascene> is suggested as title for a kernel bug I had
[10:07] <Damascene> there is many similar bug already but have some deferences
[10:36] <Damascene> from ubuntu+1: <Damascene> is there a known bug when empathy has issues if you didn't unlock the keyring
[10:41] <Damascene> bug 468372
[10:41] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 468372 in empathy (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "empathy makes accounts invisible on keyring failure (affects: 5)" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/468372
[10:51] <seb128> Damascene, right that one
[10:52] <Damascene> ok thanks
[10:52] <Damascene> do you have a list for most common bugs asked about here?
[10:55] <seb128> no
[10:55] <seb128> we have several ten thousand open bugs
[10:56] <seb128> not something you can go through or list easily
[10:56] <persia> actually, don't we have a list for the most common bugs?
[10:57]  * persia hunts in LP, thinking it was automatically generated
[10:59] <persia> Damascene: Check the top of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?orderby=-users_affected_count&search=Search&field.status%3Alist=NEW&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=CONFIRMED&field.status%3Alist=TRIAGED&field.status%3Alist=INPROGRESS&field.status%3Alist=FIXCOMMITTED&field.omit_dupes=on
[10:59] <persia> Also try other sort orders.
[10:59] <persia> For several of the sort orders, you can get approximations of the most frequently reported / commented / etc. bugs.
[11:00] <persia> And those are approximations of the ones most visible.
[11:00] <seb128> persia, that's different of what is asked on IRC though
[11:00] <persia> seb128: Strictly speaking, that's true, but I suspect there's some correlation :)
[11:00] <Damascene> the original idea is for what is asked here
[11:01] <persia> Damascene: You'd have to parse the logs and extract it.  Not trivial, really.  Go ahead if you like.
[11:01] <Damascene> I've the desire not the knowledge
[12:23] <kamusin> :)
[13:18] <BUGabundo_remote> hey charlie-tca
[13:27] <charlie-tca__> Hello, BUGabundo_remote
[15:20] <vish> the keyboard language selector is part of the gnome-setting-daemon right?
[15:20] <seb128> vish, no
[15:21] <seb128> vish, or what do you call keyboard language?
[15:21] <vish> seb128: i want to assign this bug to the right package > Bug #537053
[15:21] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 537053 in light-themes (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Keyboard layout language indicator text color blends into dark panel background (affects: 4)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/537053
[15:21] <vish> seb128: the gnome-themes is not the package , wanted to change that
[15:24] <seb128> vish, it's a duplicate
[15:24] <seb128> see bug #513152
[15:24] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 513152 in libgnomekbd (Ubuntu Lucid) (and 2 other projects) "Keyboard layout panel indicator ignores theme font color settings (affects: 7) (dups: 2)" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/513152
[15:24] <vish> seb128: thanks :)
[15:24] <seb128> np
[15:39] <jcastro> vish: you know art people don't you? https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/testdrive/+bug/538299
[15:39] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 538299 in testdrive (Ubuntu) "testdrive needs a better icon (affects: 1)" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
[15:39] <jcastro> any help there would be appreciated
[15:46] <vish> jcastro: lol , until it was mentioned on the bug , i never realized it looked like a thong .. :D
[15:46] <vish> jcastro: i'll try to come up with a better one
[15:53] <jcastro> vish: I was thinking something like this could be cool: http://www.zazzle.com/5_speed_shift_pattern_2_tshirt-235377477345566626
[15:56] <vish> jcastro: oh , just replied on the bug , transmission uses the shifter too.. how does this work > http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/dc/Volvo_steering_wheel.jpg
[15:56] <jcastro> vish: whatever works on a dark panel. That looks fine
[15:57] <vish> jcastro: ok..
[15:57] <vish> jcastro: what sizes are the icon required?
[15:58] <jcastro> vish: whatever goes on the panel, it doesn't use app indicators or anything fancy
[15:58] <vish> neat ty
[16:50] <Laibsch> anybody here still running a mediawiki installation on hardy?
[17:10] <Laibsch> I'd love somebody to confirm bug 539697
[17:10] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 539697 in mediawiki (Ubuntu) "mediawiki hardy package does not support $wgDBprefix at installation time (affects: 1)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/539697
[17:44] <nigelb> bug 528017
[17:45] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 528017 in xchat-gnome (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Button press events force xchat into text selection mode that can't be broken. (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/528017
[17:45] <nigelb> persia: thoughts on ^
[17:46] <persia> drop xchat-gnome from the archive?
[17:46] <persia> No seriously.
[17:46]  * persia looks
[17:48] <persia> nigelb: Active cooperative patch submitter, patch upstream, all is good.
[17:48] <persia> nigelb: The patch submitter can presumably work with upstream to get it accepted, etc.
[17:48] <nigelb> persia: worth a fix in lucid?
[17:48] <nigelb> oh, second thing, what does the bug mean?
[17:49] <persia> heh.
[17:49] <persia> The answer to the first question is kinda dependent on the second.
[17:49] <nigelb> aha
[17:50] <persia> So you need to find out if client-side decorations are enabled in lucid by default.
[17:52] <nigelb> persia: oh well, the person working on csd in lucid gave the patch
[17:52] <nigelb> so I suppose it needs to be integrated into lucid
[17:53] <persia> I'd recommend confirming that.  From the patch, I expect that the bug would manifest *with* the patch if CSD is disabled.
[17:54] <persia> Personally, I don't like the patch at all : i'd rather have it check to see if CSD is enabled or not, and then return the right value.
[17:54] <nigelb> so recommended course of action is ?
[17:54] <persia> So return csd_enabled or return (! csd_enabled)
[17:55] <nigelb> I'll add your comments to the bug?
[17:55] <nigelb> or just wait for upstream comments?
[17:55] <persia> As whether the proposed patch will have correct behaviour also when CSD is disabled.  Also, ask whether CSD is expected to be enabled in lucid (Cody ought have some idea).  Ideally, get a patch that works everywhere so you don't have to care if CSD is enabled or not, and get that uploaded.
[17:56] <persia> No, add *your* comments to the bug :)  You can use mine to inform yours, but it's you who needs to understand if you're handling this patch.
[17:57]  * nigelb knew you'd say that
[18:02] <persia> nigelb: I'm always happy to help you, but don't think that my help doesn't usually involve you ending up with more work :)
[18:03] <nigelb> persia: I don't really mind as long as I learn :)
[18:03] <persia> Cool.  I may have a strange price for helping folks, but I think it's fair :)
[18:03] <nigelb> I'm pretty sure in the past 1 month or so I've been more confident of my packaging skills than ever :)
[18:16] <nigelb> seb128: you'll be syncing rhythmbox from upstream again?
[18:17] <seb128> nigelb, I will backport some fixes from git, not sure what you mean by syncing
[18:17] <seb128> the bug fix commited in launchpad will be fixed for lucid
[18:17] <nigelb> seb128: forgive my terminology, thats what I meant
[18:17] <nigelb> I was wondering if you needed a hand with that :)
[18:50] <MightyTweek> Hey all. I've got an issue with gwibber-service crashing at launch which I'll deal with seperately, but it's causing the Gwibber client to crash as well. I see bug #439325 is the master bug, which has been marked as "fix released". There's obviously still a bug, but I don't know how to make Apport attach its stack trace to that bug. Should I just create a new bug and mark it as a duplicate of that one?
[18:50] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 439325 in gwibber (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "MASTER gwibber lacks error/exception handling for dbus calls (crashes in call_blocking) (affects: 76) (dups: 14)" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/439325
[18:50] <nigelb> MightyTweek: is this on Lucid?
[18:51] <MightyTweek> nigelb, yes
[18:52] <nigelb> MightyTweek: open a new bug, and if its a dup, it will be link to that one
[18:52] <MightyTweek> thanks
[20:03] <charlie-tca__> Not being of sound mind or body today, I am going to attempt to triage some the "sshfs" package bugs
[20:03] <charlie-tca__> Anybody got any experience with sending these upstream?
[20:05] <jcastro> nigelb: any feedback on the patches view would be useful! http://castrojo.wordpress.com/2010/03/04/keeping-track-of-patches-and-getting-them-visibility/
[20:05] <jcastro> nigelb: just read your blog post!
[20:05] <nigelb> jcastro: I copied you on a mail about a potential new workflow
[20:05] <nigelb> (sent yesterday I think)
[20:06] <jcastro> nigelb: I did, I am partway through it but need to think more before I respond
[20:06] <jcastro> I will get to it today though!
[20:06] <nigelb> jcastro: great.  I've been working with persia to get it perfected
[20:07] <nigelb> jcastro: the basic idea, we get to keep track of what is happening with each bug with patches with the help of tags
[20:07] <jcastro> yeah
[20:07] <nigelb> so, we know if a patch has been reviewed, upstreamed, rejected/accepted, etc
[20:07] <jcastro> my concern is that we're flooding people with too many tags these days
[20:08] <nigelb> yes, brian also expressed the same concern
[20:08] <nigelb> at the same time, we need to have all the features we need from a system
[20:08] <nigelb> Its a bit of a catch-22
[20:09] <nigelb> jcastro: anyway, I'll await your take on the idea :)
[20:12] <vish> nigelb: you could have asked the person who commented on the blog for the bug# ;)
[20:12] <nigelb> vish: I already found his bug, got the source and trying to get the thing to build
[20:13] <vish> neat
[20:13] <nigelb> if you see the bug report, well,
[20:13] <nigelb> bug  you could have asked the person who commented on the blog for the
[20:13] <nigelb> bug 260918
[20:13] <nigelb> gah, paste error
[20:13] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 260918 in xawtv (Fedora) (and 37 other projects) "needed: libv4l and associated application patches (or "gspca stopped working in 2.6.27") (affects: 71) (dups: 28)" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/260918
[20:14] <vish> nigelb: traitor ;p
[20:14] <vish> fedora bug^
[20:15] <nigelb> where?
[20:15] <nigelb> gah, I dont know.. see the bug... its in 37 projects
[20:15] <nigelb> I touch the bug, around 100 people would get mails
[20:15] <vish> gosh that bug is a trash can :/
[20:16] <nigelb> its no surprise that the patch went missing
[20:16] <vish> nigelb: i initially just saw this  "in xawtv (Fedora)"
[20:16] <nigelb> I thought so
[20:16] <nigelb> this package he submitted patch for hasn't changed since intrepid
[20:16] <nigelb> (and isn't working either I think)
[20:18] <nigelb> I can't think clearly.  Need sleep
[21:10] <jibel> what do we do with reports filed against a package removed from the archive ?
[21:14] <charlie-tca__> Mark them as invalid, with a comment that they are no longer valid packages, if the bug is not reproducable in a valid version
[21:14] <charlie-tca__> some packages are removed from lucid, but the bugs are very valid in karmic
[21:19] <jibel> charlie-tca__, thanks
[21:20] <charlie-tca__> You are welcome