[00:00] k [00:01] Red_HamsterX: Does the screenshots.ubuntu-manual.org site work as expected now? [00:02] Nope. Seems to be failing at bzr again... [00:03] lemme look [00:07] Red_HamsterX try again [00:07] I think the env command ignores the environment variables or something. [00:08] I set the $bzr_line explicitly to /home/godbyk/local/bin/bzr [00:24] Seems to bbe working now. [00:24] Yay. :) [00:24] :) [00:24] :) begets :) [00:37] Is there anyway to view existing bug reports on the manual? Thanks! [00:48] Odd-rationale: You can view them here: http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AiussLy2MfjjdHRrYlR0Q0RMRXRTaXJuR2w0QjFUcXc&hl=en [00:51] godbyk: thank you! [00:53] Also, when we specify a page number, do we use the page number of the book page or the page number of the pdf page? [00:59] Odd-rationale: I would go with the printed page number in the PDF [01:01] godbyk: you mean the number printed on the page. not the actual pdf page number (which counts the cover page as 1) [01:01] Odd-rationale: Correct. [01:06] Have you considered using Launchpad and bzr for the bug reporting? [01:06] The spreadsheet does not seem like it could scale very well... [01:07] Odd-rationale: We wanted to try to reduce the barriers to reporting bugs. [01:07] Using launchpad requires having a launchpad login, filling out a bug report that has no structure and then someone has to triage it and flag it a dozen different ways. [01:08] Using the custom form and spreadsheet allows us to ask specific questions that help us deal with the bugs more quickly. [01:08] And makes it easier for the bug reporter to give us the info we require on the first try (instead of the back-and-forth you see in many launchpad bug reports). [01:09] I see. Well that makes sense in some ways. But it is rather difficult to see if a bug has already been reported, or to comment on someone else's bug report. [01:10] Odd-rationale: That's true. But it's fairly easy for us to triage the bugs and flag the duplicates. And most of the bugs are 'missing comma' or 'misspelled word' that don't require conversation. [01:10] Odd-rationale: If you have a larger bug that you'd like to track and have a conversation about, you're welcome to report it against the ubuntu-manual project in launchpad, however. [01:13] godbyk: ok. well I was searching the bug reports to make sure I didn't post a duplicate, and I found a similar one and wanted to comment on it... [01:13] Ah, never fear. You don't have to spend time checking for dupes. We'll take care of it on our end as we make edits. [01:17] ok. Thanks for the help! [01:18] Odd-rationale: On the contrary -- thanks for *your* help! :) [01:51] godbyk, one question [01:51] $ bzr launchpad-login your-id [01:51] daker: fire away [01:51] you-id ? [01:51] 'your-id' should be your launchpad login id. [01:52] my username ? [01:52] yes [01:52] my username =? my email [01:53] nope, just your username [01:53] when you log in to launchpad, click on your name in the upper-right corner [01:54] https://launchpad.net/~adnane002 [01:54] it'll take you to an address like: http://launchpad.net/~username [01:54] oki [01:54] so adnane002 is your username [01:54] oki [01:55] https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-manual/ubuntu-manual/main [01:56] it look like he doesn't know me [01:57] what does 'bzr whoami' say? [01:57] Daker [01:59] did you set up an ssh key in your launchpad profile? [01:59] yes [02:00] you should be set then. [02:00] https://launchpad.net/%7Eadnane002/+sshkeys [02:02] hi children, i'm back [02:02] hi [02:02] godbyk, what's the problem ? [02:02] daker: I'm not sure. was launchpad-login set before you committed? [02:03] yes [02:03] humphreybc, !! [02:03] https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-manual/ubuntu-manual/main [02:03] it look like he doesn't know me [02:03] I'm out of ideas, then. Sorry. [02:03] huh who what where when what [02:07] humphreybc, Daker , lp doesn't give a link to my profil [02:08] you need to run bzr whoami [02:08] daker@daker-desktop:~/ubuntu-manual$ bzr whoami [02:08] Daker [02:08] odd [02:08] oh [02:08] you need that to be your launchpad email address [02:08] so whatever email you signed up to launchpad with [02:09] odd [02:10] * humphreybc needs a name for a set of questions we ask each week in a weekly interview thing [02:17] * daker fixed the problem [02:18] $ bzr whoami "Adnane Belmadiaf " [02:29] 317 bug reports... [02:29] hohoho [02:29] srsly [02:29] r u srslst?! [02:29] lool [02:31] your time zone humphreybc ? [02:31] +13 [02:32] * humphreybc is pulling the latest manual revision, time to decimate some bugs [02:37] godbyk, it takes time test.ubuntu-manual.org to be sync ? [02:38] daker: I've turned off the sync until after the bzr stuff is fixed. [02:38] if it's fixed, I can turn it back on. [02:38] oki [02:38] daker: when it is syncing, it updates every 30 minutes, though. [02:38] thanks [02:42] this is really hard to find where the bugs are because the page numbers are all out after that big bzr problem [02:49] godbyk could you please update the ubuntu-manual-draft.pdf asap so that bug reporters aren't getting page numbers wrong [02:49] because everything is different now [02:49] omg who wrote the scanning section [02:49] =| [02:50] the page numbers aren't *wrong*, you just have to look at the same revision as the bug reporters are. handily, there's a link on the front page of our site where you can download a copy. :-) [02:51] I'll upload a new revision if you give me the all-clear on the bzr stuff being okay. [02:51] i think the bzr stuff is okay now [02:51] but you should also consider than then we will have to look at two versions of the manual to confirm/fix bugs instead of just one. [02:51] (though it will help reduce dupes) [02:52] we'll need to otherwise we'll have everyone reporting the same bugs in the prologue [02:52] * humphreybc thinks this could turn into a right mess [02:52] have bug fixes been made and committed/pushed to bzr? or are they still sitting on someone's hard drive? [02:52] hang on [02:52] i'll push in a sec [02:52] but jamin's pushed his [02:52] bryan has changed anything yet [02:53] basically: if the bug is flagged as fixed in the spreadsheet, it needs to be fixed in whatever version I pull from bzr. [02:53] i'm committing and pushing now, hold up [02:53] yup [02:53] so we need to push regularly [02:53] yes. and be careful not to step on each others' toes. [02:54] And keep an eye on Sayantan's commits. ;-) [02:54] lol [02:54] there are a couple bugs in his that I'm gonna fix real quick when you're done. [02:54] okay i just pushed up to 539 [02:54] that revision number may confuse people, but oh well. [02:55] yeah [02:56] maybe we should put a halt on people committing this week except for those who have been assigned specific bugs or daker working on the website. [02:56] yeah maybe [02:57] Apparently someone (*cough*Sayantan*cough*) didn't read about how to insert screenshots properly. They left off the captions, so instead, it'll use the first letter of the next sentence as the caption. [02:57] Fixing now. [02:58] oh [02:58] far out [02:58] And when I get done with that, I'm gonna send an email to the list about common errors that I keep seeing. [02:58] awesome [02:58] I don't want to file a bug for each and every quotation mark that's wrong. [02:58] I'll go insane first. [02:59] I may do some crazy global find-and-replaces on the thing before pushing out a new PDF. [02:59] It'll depend on how involved they are. [02:59] kk [02:59] does anyone use tomboy notes in Lucid? [03:00] haven't tried 'em in lucid yet. [03:00] haven't done anything in lucid yet, actually. [03:01] though I caught myself looking for the close button on the right. :) [03:02] haha [03:03] o [03:03] o/ [03:03] hi [03:03] godbyk, cjohnston is going to help us triage and fix bugs [03:03] he firstly will need an @ubuntu-manual.org email address to access the spreadsheet [03:03] cool [03:03] then you'll have to install latex [03:03] gimme his full name and email address and I'll set that up. [03:03] cjohnston: for now, just the next couple of days, if you could help us triage and assign bugs in the spreadsheet that would be good [03:03] humphreybc: just aptitude install latex [03:04] k [03:04] then point him at the authors page on the wiki to get everything setup there. [03:04] cjohnston: nope, we use a later version of latex that's not in the repos [03:04] cjohnston: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/authors [03:04] godbyk: Chris Johnston chrisjohnston@ubuntu.com [03:06] cjohnston: I've emailed you the login info. [03:07] k [03:07] cjohnston: follow these steps to get started with editing: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/authors [03:07] during the tex live 2009 installation, make sure you enable the "create symlinks" option. [03:07] cjohnston: once you've got your @ubuntu-manual.org email set up, join us in the spreadsheet: [03:07] http://spreadsheets.google.com/a/ubuntu-manual.org/ccc?key=0AiussLy2MfjjdHRrYlR0Q0RMRXRTaXJuR2w0QjFUcXc&hl=en [03:07] otherwise you'll be talking to me again when things don't work. :) [03:08] ok [03:12] godbyk what's the latex command to enter a tilde? ~ [03:12] \texttilde [03:13] I think there's a bug in google spreadsheet [03:13] the auto colouring just stops working after 100 rows [03:13] why are yall not just using LP bugs? [03:13] cjohnston: long story [03:13] * godbyk sighs [03:14] you'll see why when you see the spreadsheet [03:14] after all this is over, i'll write a post on why we didn't use launchpad [03:14] I should just write a blog entry about it so I can point people there. :) [03:14] and how we saved time :) [03:14] haha that's what I'm going to do! [03:14] whoops [03:15] Ctrl+W'd on the wrong window! [03:15] focus should follow my gaze, dang it! [03:16] I don't see how its possible [03:16] lol [03:16] maybe im just so used to LP [03:16] possible to what? save time? or follow your gaze? [03:16] save time [03:16] ah right [03:16] well maybe you'll learn something :P [03:17] 1. It's easier for people to report bugs. They don't have to have a launchpad account, log in, fill out fields that don't really matter. [03:17] 2. It's easier for us to deal with the bugs. We get bugs reported in a consistent way and in a meaningful way to us. [03:17] + a bunch of other reasons [03:17] 3. Saves both parties time as we skip the whole, 'Hey, thanks for reporting a bug, but you forgot to tell us all these details.' [03:17] but all of that will be covered in a blog post at some poiont [03:18] humphreybc: anything else that needs to go into the new PDf or shall I push it to the website? [03:18] blah just push it [03:18] you're so cavalier! [03:19] run straight off of main correct? [03:19] yea [03:19] we're badass [03:22] how do yall pick bugs? [03:23] Jamin is assigned to prologue through chapter 3 [03:23] I'm taking on chapters 4, 5 and 6 [03:23] humphreybc: new pdf should be up now. [03:23] Bryan is doing 7, 8 and 9 [03:23] godbyk wicked [03:23] humphreybc: and test.ubuntu-manual.org should point to daker-test now. [03:23] cool [03:24] what should I do [03:24] cjohnston: basically if you could start assigning stuff to people [03:25] so from line 186 onwards, there is no one assigned [03:25] ok [03:25] so assign based on chapter? [03:25] so you need to look at the page number of the bug, find out what chapter it's in, then assign it to one of us three and colour code the box (it's supposed to colour code automatically bug google spreadsheet has a bug) [03:25] yep [03:25] and check for duplicates as you go [03:25] why does the reporter not just include the chapter? [03:26] if you find a duplicate, cross it off and in the notes/fixed part type "duplicate" [03:26] because godbyk thought that was a silly idea :P [03:26] :-Puh huh [03:26] unless it's a formatting or artwork issue, then it's assigned to either me or thorwil [03:26] yeah latex bugs are for godbyk [03:26] art are for thorwil [03:27] one downside of using a spreadsheet for bug tracking is lack of duplicates recognition [03:27] so we have lots of duplicates [03:27] cjohnston: because we're trying to make it as easy for bug reporters as possible. and the chapter number doesn't appear on the page they're looking at. [03:27] but that's something the triagers should pick up :P [03:27] and 'cause it's only helpful in assigning the bug to someone. the page number gets you where you need to go in the end. :) [03:28] well, finding duplicates is pretty easy when you start fixing the bugs. you'll figure out pretty quickly if you've already fixed it. [03:28] yeah [03:28] so it's not as vitally important that it be flagged in the spreadsheet. [03:28] had the whole tilde missing bug three times now [03:28] hopefully that'll be the last of that one now that the new PDF is pushed [03:30] humphreybc: it won't be, 'cause you didn't fix it. [03:30] balls [03:30] i must have fixed it after i pushed it [03:30] oh well [03:30] it's an easy one to recognize as a duplicate [03:30] Now did I or did I not verify like three times that you were ready? :-P [03:31] is there a page that lists who gets what? [03:31] shush [03:31] cjohnston: nope [03:32] humphreybc, http://test.ubuntu-manual.org/?contributors [03:32] first 4 chapters to Jamin [03:32] middle three to me [03:32] last three to Bryan [03:32] * humphreybc has fixed all his assigned bugs! YEA! [03:33] am I supposed to verfiy and assign? [03:33] verify they're not duplicates [03:33] umm [03:34] lol [03:34] don't worry about it for now [03:34] as you go you'll come across some you've already seen [03:34] just make sure they're assigned to the right people [03:34] which are you, yellow or grean [03:34] don't worry so much about dupes [03:34] green [03:34] what the crap [03:34] cjohnston: green [03:34] looks yellow to me [03:34] lol [03:34] huh? [03:34] Jamin is yello [03:35] I'm green [03:35] Bryan is light blue [03:35] you said jamin is the first 4 chapter, but yet someone is changing those to green [03:35] anything page number 0 - 97 is Jamin [03:36] 95 sorry [03:36] ok [03:36] Bryan is 127 - 147 [03:36] not hte pagenumber then [03:36] the [03:36] and i'm 95 - 127 [03:37] cjohnston: look at M3 [03:37] cell M3 [03:37] those are the page numbers [03:37] so anything that falls in 95 - 127, you assign to me [03:38] M3? [03:38] D? [03:38] no [03:38] column M [03:38] row 3 [03:38] top right of the spreadsheet [03:39] http://img697.imageshack.us/i/screenshotubuntumanuale.png/ [03:39] column d [03:40] that should be assigned to me [03:40] what should [03:40] the thing you've highlighted in the screenshot [03:40] no [03:40] i was talking just about the column [03:40] not the bug and not the row [03:40] oh [03:40] wait i'm confused [03:40] scroll to the right and have a look at column M, row 3 [03:41] oooo [03:41] I have put the names of the people to assign stuff to, and the page numbers [03:41] now i see it [03:41] lol [03:41] okie [03:41] so anything between 0 - 95 goes to Jamin [03:41] etc [03:41] i thought you were telling me where to find the page # for each bug [03:41] no [03:42] * humphreybc wishes the stupid auto color thing would work [03:42] it does for me [03:42] really? [03:42] i suppose that's good then [03:42] si [03:43] no more bragging about having all your assigned bugs complete [03:43] loil [03:43] i know [03:43] * daker is going to sleep ,its 3:43 [03:43] stop that [03:44] ill do it and itll have colr [03:44] oh cool nisshh is here now [03:44] he can help you :P [03:44] who? [03:45] nisshh, cjohnston is helping assign bugs now [03:45] we have like 319 now [03:45] oh cool [03:45] yep [03:45] i saw [03:45] i've fixed a few [03:45] ok [03:46] does cjjohnston have access to the spreadsheet yet? [03:46] yes [03:46] he's working on it now [03:46] ok cool [03:46] listen iv got to go out ut ill be back in about 3 hours tops yea? [03:47] godbyk, http://ubuntu-manual.org/?contributors si fixed [03:47] kk [03:47] daker, don't forget to update the text on the main page and the downloads page [03:47] what text ? [03:48] daker: I've changed a lot of the text [03:48] in the mockups [03:48] /website/source/index.png etc [03:48] you'll need to reflect the change in the actual website [03:48] and don't forget to have dashes in the feature list, like this - [03:49] right now it's: [03:49] Easy to understand our manual has step by step instructions and is jargon free [03:49] but we need: [03:49] Easy to understand - our manual has step by step instructions and is jargon free [03:49] this is what godbyk says to me [03:49] also, can you have the main text left justified [03:49] so we don't have gargantuan spacing between some words [03:50] oki [03:50] ;) [03:50] i am going to sleep :) [03:50] back [03:50] 3:50 [03:51] see you tomorro :) [03:51] kk [03:51] thanks [03:51] :) [03:52] we are in tomorro :) [03:52] hey so godbyk, what have you got planned for formatting and colouring of the font etc? [03:53] also, should we be using a sans font for the main text? [03:53] who? what? huh? [03:53] well at the moment the manual looks pretty dreary [03:53] formatting and coloring of what fonts? where? [03:53] no colour in the font [03:53] like section headers/chapter headers etc [03:54] and formatting of commands like \button and \keyboardinput or whatever [03:54] the commands are formatted.. though some may change a bit. [03:54] and when is it going back to non-book style? [03:54] (I don't like how much bold we have. It's a little distracting.) [03:54] yeah we have a tonne of bold [03:54] can we please colour the section and subsection headers? [03:55] I've just been making all the commands bold for now 'til I see what we end up with. [03:55] at the moment it's far too black and white [03:55] Then I'll change them. [03:55] if you can use some colours from the title page to make it look pretty, that would be good [03:55] It's not a kaleidoscope, it's a manual. It's meant to be read, not admired from afar. [03:55] :'( [03:55] * humphreybc likes colours [03:56] you also like drop shadows, but I'm not putting those in either! :) [03:56] I liked the maroon we had going on in the section headers [03:56] can you put some aubergine in there? dark orange or something? [03:56] at the moment it looks far too much like the Canonical desktop guide [03:57] ie, boring and commercial [03:57] So far you haven't given me a good reason to. You've just said, 'I like color. Can you throw some color in somewhere?' [03:57] Colored text should serve a purpose. It's used to highlight things and draw attention. [03:57] Give me some examples of where you would use color to good effect and why. Then we'll talk. :) [03:58] are the hyperlinks going to stay red? [03:58] I don't yet. thorwil gave me a new palette to work with, but I haven't plugged them in yet. [03:58] kk [03:58] use that new pallete :) [03:59] I think the links should be colored so people notice they can click on them from the pdf. But they have to be a dark enough color that they're readable when printed in greyscale. [03:59] indeed [03:59] we also need a key at the end of the prologue [03:59] could you file a bug about that in launchpad and assign it to me? I keep forgetting. :-( [04:00] kk [04:00] the texttilde command broke the build [04:00] i think i did it wrong [04:00] what'd it say? err msg? [04:00] ! LaTeX Error: Command \texttilde unavailable in encoding EU1. [04:01] oh, nice. [04:01] eh, assign that bug to me and I'll look into it. [04:01] should i push and let you fix it? [04:01] don't push, I'll look at it here. [04:01] kk [04:01] just tag it with my name in the spreadsheet [04:01] righto [04:02] what's the correct name for the "key" ? [04:03] Nomenclature? [04:03] okay [04:03] global bug: fix the capitalization of the headings. [04:04] are they still screwed? [04:04] personally, I think the chapter headings should be title case, and the section headings should be sentence case. [04:04] also, weren't we going to rename some of the chapters? [04:04]