cachedHi, Was what I said so horrible to get perma ban?01:04
Tm_Tcached: you are not permanently banned, it's just that you haven't discussed about it yet (:01:04
cachedCan we discuss about it?01:04
Tm_Tsorry but I'm not familiar with the case01:05
cachedwho do i need to speak too?01:05
cachedtopyli: are you there?01:06
Tm_The should be sleeping, and apparently is01:06
cachedThen who can helpme?01:06
cachedLast time I waited for someone to help I got kicked by topyli01:07
cachedAnd I was just waiting on some help01:07
cachedlike 10 min ago01:07
cachedI am pretty sure I have discussed this with someone and got my privs back01:08
cachedthen somereason I'm banned again after I havent logged in for a while01:09
geniicached: The op responsible for your ban currently is not available to review. Please return later and try again.02:13
cachedMay I ask who the OP is?02:14
geniicached: topyli02:14
cachedalright, can I wait for him to show up?02:15
cachedOr could you tell me a good time to check back?02:15
geniicached: Their timezone is now at 4:17am. So possibly soonest to try would be 5-6 hours but probably later than that02:17
cachedok thx for your help02:18
geniiAh I see now the original ban was for -ot by elky and that topyli marked the logs about -ops02:19
* genii makes more coffee02:20
geniiGnite all03:17
Flannelnight genii03:17
ubottuIn ubottu, rww said: !compose is <reply> To set up and use a Compose key, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ComposeKey03:39
jussi01Morning all06:12
cachedhow can i apply for cloak plz07:00
Flannelcached: What sort of cloak?07:01
cachedsomeone hacked my box changed my pw and disable my nic07:01
cachedso my IP isnt broadcast07:01
cachedbecause tor is banned07:01
Flannelcached: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#cloaks07:02
cachedWould you please direct me to the url?07:02
cachedSo can you turn it on for me?07:03
Flannelcached: That's #freenode and/or staffers, not this channel07:04
cachedalright, thx again07:06
jussi01genii:I know you are asleep, but when you wake up, fyi, you are able to deal with anyones ban, unless so marked in th BT.07:19
elkyjussi01, doesn't mean they're obliged to.07:22
elkyand making people say "but i don't want to" to people is asking for conflicts07:23
jussi01elky: of course not. However his comment makes on thingk he was not aware of the current guideline.07:24
jussi01[04:15:55] <genii> cached: The op responsible for your ban currently is not available to review. Please return later and try again.07:24
elkyjussi01, how would you prefer he had said that, without saying "but i don't want to"07:25
jussi01elky: Im not saying he cant say that, just making sure he is aware of that he is _able_ to do it.07:26
dholbachgood morning07:59
rwwHola. folkkors is being offtopic and enter-ful in #ubuntu.08:45
rww... and just left as I said that. Never mind :\08:45
ubottuFloodBotK1 called the ops in #kubuntu-ops-monitor (repeated abuse from Ahmed\)09:43
nikolamwhy i still can not join #ubuntu11:35
nikolamexplanation was that I said go away to the op. while i was talking only to him, to to others11:35
nikolamAnd now is another day and i still can not access #ubuntu11:35
nikolamone mistake goes to another but beside that, when my mistake was gone now and ops one needs to be corected.11:36
nikolamsorry for my english, btw11:37
topylinikolam, your english is just fine11:38
nikolamthanks topyli11:38
topylii'm not an operator on #ubuntu, and i did not follow your issue here closely at all, but i seem to remember that the issue was not completed11:38
nikolamwell, only issue is i can not acces channel11:39
nikolamreasoning was only one word. after years of nicely coegsisting on ubuntu11:39
nikolamit needs to be fixed or problem is not at my side if it continues11:40
nikolamtopyli, since you are only one that responded, do you think i should stay for a while on #ubuntu-ops or , after saying this, wait offline to be fixed (since this is op-only channel)11:42
nikolamok, going away11:44
TheSheepIt has to be resolved by the operator who set the ban, so I'd advise you to come back later and talk to mneptok. However, I'm sure that "it's your fault, now fix it" won't be accepted, you need to think what really happened.11:45
TheSheepdamn, took too long to juggle the words :/11:45
topylidamn, took too long reading the logs11:45
topyliTheSheep, btw, other ops can remove bans too11:45
bazhanghe told mneptok to go away when asked to stop with the away message iirc11:45
topylii'm now somewhat up to date with the original #ubuntu situation, studying -ops :)11:46
TheSheepbasically he complains that he was "spammed"11:47
bazhangand he has two years of good karma11:47
topyliapparently we again spent a lot of energy here last night on a relatively simple matter :)11:48
TheSheepwell, relatively good, he's always been a little rude, but I suppose it goes with age11:49
topylii would support lifting the ban, even though it looks like nikolam doesn't quite understand there was a real reason for it11:49
Tm_The refuses to listen, and as long as he refuses to sit down for a moment and listen...11:50
TheSheepTm_T: that may go on for eternity11:51
topyliyeah he does need to be back once more and receive the advice instead of rejecting it11:51
Tm_TTheSheep: that's his choice11:51
TheSheepTm_T: "choice" assumes knowledge about situation11:52
Tm_TTheSheep: ah, but if he refuses to listen when we try to tell the situation... the refusal is his choice, so the rest is too11:52
Tm_TI know this sounds harsh11:53
bazhangIf he is unbanned without seeing how it was not spam, and he needs to follow the channel rules, then I feel that its not wise to unban at this point11:53
TheSheepI wish there was a different way of making people think than putting a wall in front of their face...11:54
Tm_TTheSheep: me too, I often try to find some friendly way to do things11:54
Tm_Tbut when they refuse to listen, there's not much one can do11:55
bazhangcatalyzing is a superb strategy. it does take two to work things out though11:58
Tm_Twho knows where bazhang would be now if he wasnt handled with care back then11:59
bazhangtried it tons of times with the guadalinex kids, all to no avail: they completely ignore my PMs11:59
bazhangTm_T, very true :)11:59
Tm_Tsame might be with me too12:00
Tm_Tfirst impression is nothing in IRC it seems12:00
Tm_T...says the one with bad first impression12:05
topylioh, btw the guadalinex xchat defaults have now been fixed, launchpad told me so today :)12:07
Tm_Tso as soon as they roll in the new package...12:07
topyliyeah, they said they'll push it in an update, we don't need to wait for a new distro version12:08
Tm_Tmakes sense, it's just small patch in one package12:08
geniijussi01: Ok, good to know.14:12
* genii makes a pot of coffee14:12
ikoniais my connection being rubbish again or are we having a lot of netsplits ?14:31
Tm_Thaven't seen any splits no14:32
ikoniaHmmm must be my connection14:32
elkyI haven't seen you drop off either14:37
elkyabout 12hrs ago was the latest I see14:37
ikoniathat's not good though14:38
ikoniashould be rock solid14:38
ikoniaspeaking to ISP14:38
* genii ponders the word "complete" in !ubuntu14:46
ertugrulcould i talk with a director of admins?15:24
TheSheepa what?15:24
ertugrulabout Turkey channel admin _paco_15:25
TheSheepsee /topic15:25
ertugrulhe doesnt speak good with users15:26
ertugrulalways bad, agrasivve verbs...15:26
ertugrulnearly 11 hours i am working with a trouble15:26
ertugrulwith network manager15:27
geniiertugrul: #ubuntu-irc channel for issues you may have with operators of Ubuntu channels which are for support in specific language please15:37
ubot3In #ubuntu-us-wi, douglasawh-work said: ubot3: that is sweet18:53
mneptokubot3: stop dispensing donuts18:55
ubot3mneptok: Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)18:55
mneptokubot3: Error: I am only a meatsack, please don't think I'm intelligent :)18:56
ubot3mneptok: Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)18:56
nikolamwhy I am still banned on #ubuntu19:17
nikolamis that some 24 hour thing or what19:17
nikolamitts not wuite right19:17
nikolamand it was terribly wrong19:17
Myrttiyou hadn't finished discussing your situation on the channel19:18
Myrttiwe do not remove bans automatically - you need do discuss them with us19:18
nikolamwhat situation19:18
Myrttibeing banned.19:19
nikolamexplanation was that i said Once: go away. After several people started sending me messages19:19
nikolamand it should be removed now19:19
nikolamYou are not serious to get permanent ban for one word?19:19
nikolamWhat kind of meessed up thinking is that???19:20
Myrttino ban is permanent. But we do not remove them automatically either.19:20
macoyou're not banned permanently19:20
mneptoknikolam: you said "go away" to me twice. and to other people a few times.19:20
macoif it was permanent you wouldnt be being told "discuss it and we'll remove it"19:20
nikolamonce only once19:20
nikolamand to you only19:20
nikolamand didnt know you are an op eather19:21
nikolamand now we 2 days explain ONE word to you19:21
mneptoknikolam: and that is not the big issue. the major issue is that people were informing you of the channel rules, and you completely dismissed them.19:21
nikolamyou are So much important19:21
nikolamAnd I am on channel for 2 years or more19:21
nikolamand i was saying to all, I do not need patronising19:21
nikolamand they continued19:22
macoso you should know the rules by now19:22
mneptokthen you sould know that using /nick instead of /away is against the channel policies.19:22
MyrttiI've been on the channel for 5 years or so. It still doesn't give me a pardon to do whatever I want there19:22
nikolammneptok, that was new to me19:22
nikolamsince i changed nick in first time in several months19:22
nikolami banned for one word19:22
mneptoknikolam: and so why, when people were trying to educate you as to proper procedures, did you tell them to "go away" and accuse them of spamming you?19:22
macomy impression was that the ban was for your *attitude* not your words19:23
nikolam1st thing I said to channel is taht BOT is sending annoying messages19:23
nikolamI never recieved in Life messages from bot19:23
nikolamI think banning is retribution for expressed thinking about bot19:23
nikolamFirst answer I recieved was : no, you are.19:24
nikolamSo that is quite ok19:24
mneptokyour thinking is flawed. you were banned for being dismissive, accusatory, and acting against the CoC and channel guidelines.19:24
nikolamI am after one day simly sick of this conversation, please remove ban because it was wrong to do so.19:25
nikolammneptok, well I undersand you reasoning now19:25
nikolamwhy dont you remove such thing then Now19:25
mneptokif you see no problem with your actions, that is certainly your right. it is our right to keep the ban in place until you demonstrate that you understand that being informed of channel policy, be it by a bot or by humans, is not "spamming"19:25
nikolamKEEP tha ban in place???????19:25
nikolamFor what reason???19:26
mneptokand that reacting by accusing people trying to help you is not acceptable.19:26
nikolammneptok, you are not right19:26
nikolamIt was yesterday man19:26
nikolamand you are actively now abusing me.19:26
nikolamyou keep ban for no reason now.19:26
nikolamIf you had reason yesterday and you explained why19:27
nikolamwhy you are continuing with it19:27
mneptoki just told you why.19:27
nikolamwhy, because you think I think you are wrong19:27
nikolamI think you reacted over line19:27
mneptokyou're certainly free to believe that.19:28
nikolamMost thing unapropriate here is your reaction19:28
nikolamto ONE word.19:28
nikolamits very much ashame what things have gone into19:28
mneptok12:21 <+mneptok> nikolam: and that is not the big issue. the major issue is that people were informing you of the channel rules, and you completely dismissed them.19:28
mneptoknot "one word"19:28
nikolamI did not tell that, you was telling that19:29
mneptokcorrect. i banned you. and i know why i did.19:29
mneptokit was not just for "go away"19:29
nikolamAnd WHY mneptok you Love to argue about this instead of resolvin issue?19:29
nikolammneptok, well, when that ban, goes away?19:30
nikolamAfter what time?19:30
mneptoki'm trying to resolve it. i have told you why you were banned. and what you need to do to get the ban removed.19:30
nikolamWhat I need to do to get it removed?19:30
mneptokif you see no problem with your actions, that is certainly your right. it is our right to keep the ban in place until you demonstrate that you understand that being informed of channel policy, be it by a bot or by humans, is not "spamming"19:30
mneptokalso, i'd like you to read the CoC and IRC guidelines and agree to abide by them19:31
ubottuThe Ubuntu Code of Conduct is a community etiquette document to which we ask all Ubuntu users to adhere, and can be found at http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct/ .  For information on how to electronically sign the CoC, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SigningCodeofConduct .19:31
ubottuThe guidelines for using the Ubuntu channels can be found here: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Guidelines19:31
nikolamI understand that being informed is channel policy.19:31
nikolamOk, satisfied?19:31
mneptokplease read those and agree to abide by them.19:32
mneptokespecially the thirds point in the IRC Guidelines19:32
nikolamJust to repeat. i was on #ubuntu for few Years now and never had even contact with an op.19:33
nikolamOk, but what to do when multiple people start telling you things you already know19:34
nikolamand recieving dozen of messages at once19:34
nikolamI have read it. mneptok19:36
nikolamWhat now?19:37
nikolam(I also have long-living launchpad account from 2006/7 i think, with same text signed)19:38
mneptokyou already knew that changing nicks for /away was against the Guidelines?19:38
nikolami did not know that19:38
nikolamthat was very much new to me19:38
mneptokthen people were telling you about a policy you did NOT know about.19:38
mneptoki certainly was.19:38
nikolamits relatively new policy?19:39
mneptokthat has been a policy for years19:39
nikolamwell that is because i almost never was changing names..19:39
nikolamand i think i do not remember when i was actually changing it last time but yesterday19:40
mneptokand that's fine. and when people tell you the policy, dismissing them and telling them to "go away" is not considerate, and is not respectful.19:40
mneptokdo you think it's considerate or respectful to talk to people as you did yesterday?19:41
nikolamOk, mneptok will we stop this conversation now resolved, it ha been very much hard for me to talk all this about this issue. uhh.19:41
nikolamNo it was not19:41
mneptokthat's very good to hear.19:41
nikolamit was not to tell them that19:41
mneptoknow, you say you have signed the Code Of Conduct via Launchpad.19:42
mneptokplease read the first 2 items in the Code Of Conduct19:42
mneptoknow do you understand why you were banned?19:42
nikolamyes I understand. And I understand someone could just point it to me briefly. And I would not react so defensively.19:43
nikolamI also think, beside that I understand reasons, that banning was overreacting.19:44
nikolamI very much see myself as productive and always there for help19:45
nikolamWe have our Loco where we solve newcomers questions and problems every day19:45
mneptoki have removed the ban19:45
nikolamAnd I am almost all day at my loco19:45
nikolamthanks mneptok19:45
mneptokthank you for reading those pages, and thank you for thinking carefully about what was the real cause of the issue.19:45
nikolamAnd we just are trying to make somethink of it locally19:46
mneptokare you near Belgrade?19:46
nikolamAnd I am even on ubuntu channel for say, historical reasons anyway19:46
nikolamyes I am19:46
mneptokthere is an active group there19:47
mneptokas well as a Canonical employee19:47
nikolamI know i am almost from start there19:48
nikolamthere were some activities last year too19:48
nikolamsome companies use ubuntu in their intranet exclusively, etc etc19:48
nikolamBut I thing one thing maybe is missing is Wider pressure to the market19:49
mneptokgood good.19:49
mneptokwe should not discuss that for too long on this channel.19:49
nikolamSince sending cds is good thing.. for those who know about that19:49
mneptokis there anything else you need from us?19:49
mneptoktry joining #ubuntu to make sure the ban is lifted, please19:49
nikolamwell, people come to chat. Ok, will try it.19:50
nikolamthink it works. And mo too much bot messages, i hope ;)19:50
mneptokOK, good to know19:51
nikolamok, will part now from ops19:51
mneptokwe have a no-idle policy in -ops, so if you do not need anything else, we ask people to leave19:51
macowhats that?19:51
nikolamits serbian for welcome :)19:51
mneptok"cheers" "to your health" etc etc19:52
mneptokOK, shower time.19:53
* mneptok smells of pickles and the grave19:53
macoi'll have to remember that word19:53
macoi just know "zdrave. kako si ti?"19:53
macooh and "bijelo dugme" and "divlje jagode" ;-)19:54
macobut yeah typing in latin letters cuz i learned from a bosnian and ive forgotten how to touchtype in cyrillic19:54
rwwHola op people. Could someone with #ubuntu+1 access take a look at the scrollback for the last few minutes and change the topic if appropriate, please? Apparently Lucid's going through some happy fun gnome dependency breakage right now.21:59
jpdsrww: Woo, awesome.22:42
jpdsrww: Do you have a bug # for it?22:42
rwwjpds: Nope. yofel in #ubuntu+1 was the one who mentioned it, you might want to ask them.22:44
Tm_Tyummy, coffee and cola drink mixed23:00
jribeww, coffee. eww, cola23:03
ubottuIn ubottu, rww said: !currentissues =~ s/ , kindly/,/23:18

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