[00:00] whoa, I don't get it [00:00] hehe [00:00] seidos, yeah [00:00] I'll read it a few more times [00:00] Camus = Absurdism! [00:00] MadameTock, camus is cool man [00:01] pedro3005, very much so. [00:01] MadameTock, :D [00:01] MadameTock, it is hard to read, though. maybe I just suck at philosphy [00:02] pedro3005, maybe philosophy is hard, like python [00:02] pedro3005, maybe I have read too much :p [00:02] MadameTock, are you the Oracle? [00:02] Philosophy is harder than Python :P [00:02] seidos, it's a basic logic game. If we say everything is true, we are saying that a statement which conditions itself as false being true, thus a contradiction [00:02] seidos, I have been accused of such in the past :p [00:03] seidos, if we say all is false, our own affirmation is false. [00:03] MadameTock, tricky. perhaps accusations are enough to make one the Oracle [00:04] Camus' whole point was that reality is beyond the grasp of human consciousness, but not beyond logic, wasn't it? [00:04] and if we nit-pick, that is, affirm that only ours or only ours affirmation and its opposite is true, we still need to affirm an infinite number of statements [00:04] pedro3005, I don't get it. I suck at philosophy worse than you :) [00:04] seidos, so I have heard. I guess that being the Oracle isn't so bad. [00:05] MadameTock, I like cookies [00:05] MadameTock, he indeed say (at least, I believe) that reality is beyond our grasp. [00:05] It is not the world that is absurd, nor human thought: the absurd arises when the human need to understand meets the unreasonableness of the world, when "my appetite for the absolute and for unity" meets "the impossibility of reducing this world to a rational and reasonable principle." [00:05] seidos, I'll have to beam some to you [00:06] Ah ha! [00:06] MadameTock, he is then denying science [00:06] so camus is saying reality is logical? [00:06] seidos, I suppose so; and I would most definitely agree with him, if he is [00:07] MadameTock, isn't science all about reducing the world to rational principles? [00:07] pedro3005, I'm not sure that I can affirm reality is logical [00:07] life and death are illogical when seen together, are they not? [00:07] "Science (from the Latin scientia, meaning "knowledge") is, in its broadest sense, any systematic knowledge-base or prescriptive practice that is capable of resulting in a prediction or predictable type of outcome. In this sense, science may refer to a highly skilled technique or practice." [00:07] or perhaps I'm missing the definition of logic [00:08] pedro3005, Depends on which science you are talking about. There is a science for everything. [00:08] seidos, it's not illogical; it is absurd! [00:08] if everyone knew all the science that there was to know, would everything become predictable? [00:08] Everything is possibly logical [00:09] seidos, It would become unpredictable in x predictable ways :P [00:09] But, we, as humans, cannot grasp that logic [00:09] seidos, you view it as illogical because " the absurd arises when the human need to understand meets the unreasonableness of the world" [00:09] if Everything is possibly logical then there really isn't any real hope in logic, ultimately [00:09] still gotta' die [00:09] still gotta suffer [00:09] that's why Buddhism is so attractive [00:09] But that does not take away existence! [00:09] it supposedly has the solution to suffering [00:09] tenach, ultimately, it boils down to establishing rational principles to explain the universe [00:09] pedro3005, and getting others to believe your word as fact. [00:10] Camus, even Sartre dismissed suicide as a viable option to escape existence [00:10] MadameTock, yes. and am yet to understand why [00:10] MadameTock, what about a natural death? [00:10] I am* [00:10] pedro3005, seidos, because existence of the mind, perhaps, does not stop [00:10] seidos, a natural death is ultimately random; it does not fit any purpose [00:11] pedro3005, random? if reality is indeed logical then it isn't random, a natural death is logical [00:11] And so therefore you are trapped in a loop of existence, until accepting absurdity. [00:11] but when you accept absurdity you're not free from existence, you are just accepting of it [00:11] seidos, random in the sense of essentially unpredictable, undefined [00:12] it's kind of like Buddhism, except Buddhism proposes escape is possible by eliminating craving [00:12] seidos, and therefore, happy. xD [00:12] (in regard to accepting absurdity) [00:12] there is no force controlling it, therefore essentially random [00:12] * seidos thinks he should meditate [00:12] :D [00:12] it's kind of the same thing accepting the absurd and eliminating craving [00:13] MadameTock, did he really say that? [00:13] pedro3005, there are all kinds of forces controlling it [00:14] seidos, well, yes. but it is ultimately random [00:14] pedro3005, that is how I understand it [00:14] pedro3005, not understood doesn't necessarily mean it's random [00:14] pedro3005, in fact, with enough knowledge random things become less random [00:15] well maybe not the quantum stuff [00:15] seidos, I disagree [00:15] that might truly be random by its nature [00:15] this is the debate einstein had with bohr I think [00:15] does randomness truly exist? [00:16] Einstein believed in a deterministic Universe [00:16] seidos, if you know all the facts about the universe, you can exactly dictate the next instant; but not the one after it [00:16] I tend to lean towards that [00:16] randomness comes essentially with time [00:16] or else, every fact and every time line has been defined since the very first instance of existence [00:16] pedro3005, but if you can dictate the next instant, couldn't you dictate the one after that ad infinitum? [00:16] instant* [00:17] I think we found the absurd [00:17] maybe there is no answer to whether the Universe is random or deterministic [00:17] hm [00:17] MadameTock, what do you think? [00:18] good call, ask the Oracle [00:18] shhhh [00:18] I mean ask MadameTock [00:19] My thoughts on whether the world is random or deterministic? [00:19] MadameTock, yes, your thoughts on our last few messages [00:20] Deterministic would infer that the universe and indeed, existence, has parameters that are clearly defined. [00:21] seidos, duee [00:21] dude [00:21] seidos, I think this is really the absurd [00:21] But can we grasp the greater logic that is needed to define those parameters? [00:21] Can we create formulae for existence? [00:22] Randomness comes essentially with time, and we are trying to determine the exact instant of randomness; that is our hunger for the absolute and the unity [00:22] A stochastic model [00:22] Randomness is present, [00:22] MadameTock, if we theoretically could, would we be able to predict the future? [00:23] variables are not described by unique values, but instead by probability distribution. [00:23] Within reason. Within the probability parameters. [00:24] Is it possible to predict the next state of a certain atom? [00:24] Ah, specifics! [00:25] Are you in control? Are there outside forces? [00:25] bgs100, there is the heisenberg uncertainty principle [00:26] pedro3005, seidos, I break things down in to mathematical terms a lot, when I am discussing philosophy, because for me they are quite close. Stochastic models are often compared to Deterministic models. [00:26] never heard of Stochastic models [00:27] MadameTock, is it possible for everyone to predict the future without some person ruining it for everybody through their hunger for power? [00:27] MadameTock, what are your thoughts on Buddhism? [00:27] Let's compare it to a tossed coin [00:28] It is not random; if you knew all the facts of the universe, you could calculate the side a tossed coin will fall [00:28] pedro3005, I do so often [00:28] seidos, I think that it is a valid system of belief [00:28] Are our actions (for instance) also essentially determinable? Meaning we would only need enough information to predict them? [00:29] Can you predict the actions of a single bacterium? [00:29] MadameTock, Christianity? [00:30] pedro3005, I think the answer is yes [00:30] bgs100, if the bacterium is known and understood. [00:31] seidos, yes? So every choice you ever made in your life, everything you ever did, was determined before it happened? [00:31] pedro3005, again, if we are known and understood completely. But, you see, I think that we operate on a Stochastic base. [00:31] seidos, that's a tough one. At it's base, I think that Christianity is quite similar to any other religion. Achieve higher thought and existence, escape the cycle. [00:32] I don't view it as valid [00:32] It's a mere escape route of the absurd [00:32] pedro3005, you see, similar. Not necessarily valid. [00:34] So, this is what you guys talk about all day? [00:34] MadameTock, not at all [00:34] This is a first that I've seen it, MadameTock [00:34] MadameTock, well me and seidos usually talk about it [00:34] not openly [00:35] Glad you've come out of the philosophical closet [00:35] I was going to say, I should have joined this channel long ago. :p [00:37] MadameTock, probably won't last. someone is bound to bitch about how this isn't support and demand us go elsewhere [00:37] pedro3005: this 'is' a support channel [00:37] hey tenach [00:37] Uh ohs. [00:38] Hello Bodsda [00:38] pedro3005, we're in trouble. :p [00:38] MadameTock: quite the opposite [00:38] tenach: how goes you? [00:38] * bgs100 never knew there was a ##philosophy channel. [00:38] Bodsda, I'm doing pretty good, MadameTock here just made a bunch of baked goodies. :) [00:39] pedro3005, we can go to #ubuntu-beginners-team [00:39] tenach: sounds good to me - cookies make the world go round [00:39] Indeed they do, Bodsda [00:39] I like making baked goods [00:39] How about yourself? How goes you? [00:40] Infused with THC! [00:40] seidos, no way in hell! [00:40] tenach: not bad, went to the hospital today [00:40] Nose_Pick, :o [00:40] Bodsda, good or bad visit? [00:40] tenach: I have pictures of my baby :) [00:40] Bodsda, very good then, I see! [00:40] Good vibes pedro [00:40] yeah, 13 weeks and 5 days [00:41] well, 6 days now [00:42] Nose_Pick, my experience with THC resulted in psychosis [00:42] tenach: just to check, have you signed the ubuntu CoC? [00:43] Bodsda, several times, since I never remember how to recover a gpg key :( [00:43] guys, sorry to be a downer, but can we keep that sort of discussion out of this channel please. If you want to discuss the affects of drugs, it can be done elsewhere or in PM [00:43] tenach: lol, good stuff [00:44] Nose_Pick, indeed [00:44] Agreed [00:45] seidos, maybe that's why you're so crazy nowadays [00:45] :P [00:46] Would leaving the CMOS jumper on clear while booting cause damage to a system? [00:46] tenach: just saving the wiki page, everything is in place for your nominatiosn at the next meeting [00:46] pedro3005, there's no doubt in my mind that it was a mitigating factor. THC affects the brain in mysterious ways [00:46] running_rabbit07, I suppose not.. that would be a huge designing flaw [00:46] running_rabbit07: no, but the jumper is used to reset CMOS/BIOS settings [00:47] seidos, it's not permanent [00:47] seidos: seriuosly, not in this channel [00:47] ok, there is a psycho posting for people to do that to get rid of root kits [00:47] in UF [00:47] running_rabbit07: link please [00:47] Bodsda, roger [00:47] thank you [00:47] Guys, could we please move general chatter to #ubuntu-beginners-team ? [00:47] http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=9057647#post9057647 [00:48] running_rabbit07: what was the name of the user who posted this? [00:49] ricyaun [00:49] running_rabbit07: as these posts are so long, could you give me the post number, otherwise i'm gonna read the whole thread, which takes a while :) [00:50] #25 [00:50] running_rabbit07: excellent, thank you [00:50] anytime [00:50] Weird, my gnome session logged me out after I walked away. [00:51] tenach: it was clearly lonely and trying to make a statement [00:53] Bodsda, apparently so [00:53] running_rabbit07: it doesnt seem that he is telling people to leave the jumper on, but he is saying that is what he did [00:53] ok [00:54] I am sure if anyone sees it, they'll see my post below it and think twice before trying it. Thanks for looking at it. [00:54] running_rabbit07: I would be inclined to let the thread die. It does not seem to be very active and to be honest, I think his problems with booting a livecd were not related to this apparent rootkit. [00:55] This is before mentioning that if you managed to write code to the bios/cmos you would have to flash it, and afaik a jumper reset would not clear this 'upgrade' [00:56] Hello! [00:56] hello dronkot [00:56] I have a question. [00:57] dronkot, what is it? [00:57] I have Karmic Koala. And i tried to update to 10.04. I tried [00:58] Ubuntu 10.04 is still pre-release software - it shouldn't show up as a release until it's release date. [00:59] os[Linux 2.6.32-16-generic i686] distro[Ubuntu "lucid" 10.04] cpu[1 x Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 1.80GHz (GenuineIntel) @ 1.79GHz] mem[Physical: 1002.0MB, 30.3% free] disk[Total: 55.0GB, 44.1% free] video[nVidia Corporation NV44A [GeForce 6200]] sound[ICH - Intel 82801BA-ICH2] [00:59] ^ <3 that script [01:00] what kernel does karmic use? [01:00] I have Karmic Koala. And i tried to update to 10.04. I tried use Synaptic software but it didn't recogniezed new stable version Ubuntu. [01:00] 2.6.30 [01:00] dronkot, 10.04 isn't out yet [01:00] dronkot: 10.04 isn't stable - it's still prelease/beta software. [01:00] It hasen't been officially released yet. [01:00] How i can fix this or i need use different method to update Ubuntu to 10.04 [01:00] How i can fix this or i need use different method to update Ubuntu to 10.04? [01:00] dronkot, 10.04 isn't out yet [01:01] dronkot: 10.04 isn't stable - it's still prelease/beta software. [01:01] It hasen't been officially released yet. [01:01] If you are wanting to test it, then it is best to download and do a clean install. The upgrade will break your machine. [01:02] running_rabbit07: ...not really, but it can cause conflicts. [01:02] otrue [01:02] true [01:02] (I upgraded when the toolchain was initially uploaded to the repositories - when the Lucid repos were first opened for upload) [01:02] to some that equals broken [01:02] same here [01:02] in a vbox [01:03] If you don't want a busted system, don't run beta software. [01:03] very true [01:03] I don't care, since I can actually fix my system without very many problems. [01:03] I have it on my netbook, it purrs. [01:03] Ok i got it. Thanks you a lot. Have somebody tried 10.04 unstaible release? [01:03] virtual machines are useful [01:03] dronkot: I've been running it since they first announced it and opened the repositories for it for package upload. [01:04] It's turning out nicely, but it still has problems. [01:04] the vbox finds some bugs but not the important ones [01:05] Collinp do you like new version? [01:05] Yes. [01:05] I despise one thing in Lucid [01:05] no gimp! [01:06] one of the reasons is this - Since Windows doesn’t carry any powerful image editing software as default, so no need to provide that bulky software in Ubuntu as well [01:06] that is disgraceful as far as I am concerned [01:06] dronkot: I've been running it as my 'main' install (production) since end of January -- I keep lots of backups, but it hasn't borked on me :-D [01:06] I use mtPaint, but it is MT of good tools [01:06] Bodsda: GIMP - and it's dependencies - are huge, and most people wont' use most of the features it provides. [01:07] s/wont'/won't [01:07] Bodsda: is the Lucid image still going to be the same size? [01:07] collinp: so ditch gnome for the same rason, use a lightweight WM [01:07] I hope 10.04 is a bit smaller [01:07] I wonder what they're going to fill that space with :/ [01:07] And we should probably move this discussion to #ubuntu-beginners-team ;) [01:07] swoody: probably [01:08] Bodsda: You are right i agree with. Ubuntu users need this powerfull image editor!!!118 [01:08] You can alwasy install it after you install Ubuntu. :) [01:08] *alwys [01:08] *always [01:08] "sudo apt-get install gimp" - problem solved. [01:08] even if they don't, not installing because windows doesnt have an equivalent is pathetic. Since when does ubuntu model its OS as a Windows replacement. - anyway, enough about gimp [01:09] No need to include it by default, you can easily install it if you want it, and it'll save a ton of install disk space. [01:10] I still think there are other things that waste space, OOo, Gnome, Games, Nautilus, Synaptic, rhythmbox - all of these are replaced on my system asap [01:10] replaced or removed [01:11] Likewise. [01:11] I started using ubuntu-minimal to install it on my machines. [01:11] *machine [01:11] or ubuntu server [01:11] And we should probably move this discussion to #ubuntu-beginners-team ;) [01:12] And I'll brb - gotta reboot. [01:12] night guys [01:12] Night [01:33] does anybody know how to stop root password being changed with the sudo command? [01:39] Nose_Pick, not typing the command? [01:42] I would not have thought this is possible Nose_Pick - you could remove peoples ability to sudo but im unsure about disabling changing of passwords [01:49] But if you where say ssh into a server [01:50] There would be no way too [01:50] sudo passwd root [01:50] and change [01:51] thanks bodsda [01:56] Nose_Pick: actually, depending on the account that you are ssh'ing too, you could change the root passwd [01:58] Nose_Pick: http://paste.ubuntu.com/407346/ [01:58] im off for the night this time [01:58] * Bodsda is afk === mohi1 is now known as mohi_away [02:26] Night === bgs100 is now known as bgs000 [03:28] hello compiledkernel [03:32] compiledkernel, i realised that your links no longer work! [03:32] yvan300, thank god [03:40] pedro3005, that ain't a good thing! [03:41] yvan300, you liked that links? [04:13] pedro3005, XD [04:13] MadameTock, you ever seen them? [04:13] it's horrible [04:13] Links? [04:13] What what? [04:14] MadameTock, the compiledkernel stuff [04:14] Hmm mm. I have not. [04:14] MadameTock, then don't [04:14] Okay, I'll try not to. [04:30] welcome david_vasta [04:34] there are 7 unanswered threads on the first page if anyone feels like donating a few minutes. [04:34] General Help [04:35] running_rabbit07: gonna just say and not do eh? [04:35] running_rabbit07: kidding [04:35] lol, I am trying [04:37] so... [04:38] hmmm [04:38] nice...there we go... [04:38] settings.... [04:39] lol [04:39] Some are beyond my skills to heel [04:40] running_rabbit07: i see [04:40] ;) [04:42] so..... [04:42] what's goin on? [04:44] is there any way to change the account name listed in the indicator on the top panel to a user's full name without changing the account name? [05:27] Does someone uses DjVu format? is it still actual? the doc I come across on the net is fairly old (~y2006) [05:27] nomnex, never used it [05:28] anyone else how uses (used) it? [05:29] pedro3005, seems to be a popular format, but not to me either, till this day [05:29] nomnex, what's it for? [05:30] archiving books with pictures or heavy graphics (same function as a .pdf but different) [05:31] nope, never tried it either [05:31] I was wondering is DjVu was deprecated? [05:32] okay folks, thanks for the feedback [05:32] FIY http://djvu.sourceforge.net/ [06:11] Does anyone know an irc chan that posts RSS feeds? [06:30] Nose_Pick, what do you mean? [08:14] http://xkcd.com/ [08:14] <3 [09:14] Welcome back Akos === Akos is now known as Guest43952 === Guest43952 is now known as Go === Go is now known as Guest90330 === Guest90330 is now known as Akos_ [09:23] thx Silver_Fox_ (: [09:23] Having trouble with IRC Akos_ ? :) [09:24] Silver_Fox_: this nickserv thing is killing me, i can't auth to Akos, it sais it's not available atm [09:24] Not seen that one before [09:25] (10:22:49)[freenode] -!- Nick Akos is temporarily unavailable [09:26] Akos_, Have a look at this: http://michielvwessem.wordpress.com/2010/02/01/irssi-freenode-nickname-temporarily-unavailable/ [09:26] okay,i'll hump nicks now, beware :P [09:26] Silver_Fox_: thank you, i talked to a staffer in #freenode === Akos_ is now known as go [09:26] Okay. === go is now known as Akos [09:26] there we go (: [09:27] * Silver_Fox_ bets you needed to release the nickname [09:27] yepp, that was it, release (: [09:27] Amazing [09:28] When is your next show Akos ? [09:28] Silver_Fox_: i dunno, maybe on saturday .. ? [09:28] Awww [09:28] i always go online at random times, but you can listen to the shows on my blog, i always record them and post them as podcasts [09:29] Oh, okay, that works :) [09:29] * Silver_Fox_ kills ABT: http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=326 [09:30] Hehe [09:30] Hmm, daoes just posted [09:34] ((: [09:38] Any plans for the day Akos ? [09:39] * Silver_Fox_ has seriously boring day ahead [09:42] Silver_Fox_: oh yeah, me too :P Not much, work and work .. [09:42] :( [09:42] Seen the google april 1st joke ? [09:43] Akos -> http://www.google.co.uk/intl/en/landing/translateforanimals/tour.html [09:44] haha, yeah, heard about it on twitter, although i didn't check it out, i can't open links on this pc [09:45] :( [09:46] so you're going to the US eh? (: [09:46] Yes, I need a break [09:46] :) [09:48] California,right? [09:48] 3 weeks in the sun [09:48] :) [09:48] ouh wow, sun and heat (: [09:49] Flying May 21st [09:49] Next month!!!! Argh!!! [10:06] Silver_Fox_: I hope you'll enjoy it (: [10:06] hi ZachK_ [10:06] Thank you Akos [10:07] hi Akos [10:11] what's goin on ya'll? [10:32] freezeloud: welcome [10:33] ZachK_: hi :) [10:33] freezeloud: and how are u today? [10:40] ZachK_: quite well i thought [10:40] freezeloud: ok... [10:42] ZachK_: i'm just at school... what about you [10:42] freezeloud: at home...no school for me... [10:43] ZachK_: lucky you [10:43] freezeloud: what school highschool or college? [10:46] ZachK_: college [10:46] freezeloud: cool [10:49] ZachK_: yes, if i did not have to repeat last 3 years because of lack of interest in previous study [10:49] freezeloud: ouch [10:49] ZachK_: btw. sorry, my english is not as well as i wish :) [10:50] freezeloud: it's fine [10:52] ZachK_: and what you? work? [10:52] freezeloud: yup [10:52] freezeloud: as for Ubuntu speciality I do wiki work/forums [10:53] ZachK_: wow, nice [10:54] freezeloud: my wiki page is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ZachK_ [10:54] just for peeps [10:57] ZachK_: ubuntu wiki and forums are greate help to anyone who use ubuntu. I spent a lot time there [10:58] ZachK_: btw. are you using lucid beta or still karmic? [10:58] freezeloud: i use karmic but right now i'm running windows vista [11:09] ZachK_: so you probably don't know anything about bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/535640 - lucid on laptops log you out if you close lid... I can't get ridd of it... [11:14] freezeloud: nope...sorry [11:14] ZachK_: no problem [11:16] ZachK_: I'm just installing new intel-gpu-tools from ppa so will see, thanks for you time :) [11:16] freezeloud: ok [15:20] hmm [15:33] J [15:33] J === running_rabbit07 is now known as iRock_ === iRock_ is now known as running_rabbit07 === Silver_Fox_ is now known as Fae === running_rabbit07 is now known as iRock_ === iRock_ is now known as uRock === uRock is now known as running_rabbit07 [19:19] !foo [19:19]