[00:25] <ScottK> ryanakca: Same bug is fine.
[00:25] <ScottK> Riddell: I have a board, but no peripherals/case and it's not assembled.
[01:30] <DarkwingDuck> oh god, this is going to take forever
[01:31] <DarkwingDuck> Amarok has to rescan me collection?! I have like 50,000 songs. *sigh*
[03:24] <ScottK> Tm_T and NCommander: Lucid powerpc live CD image that's not oversized: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu/ports/daily-live/20100407/  <-- Please test.
[03:24] <NCommander> ScottK: can't, PPC is dead ATM
[03:24] <ScottK> Meh.
[03:24] <ScottK> NCommander: OK, how about KNR armel?
[03:25] <NCommander> ScottK: will once I have a PSU for my board
[03:25] <ScottK> You're no help.
[03:26] <ScottK> Tm_T: It's up to you (unless nixternal reappears) - He's got hardware too.
[03:26] <DiegoTc> ping JontheEchidna
[03:28] <DiegoTc> hi guys I am developing a small aplication on QT4 c++, and I was trying to package (I am using this guide for this https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#Basic%20Packaging)
[03:28] <DiegoTc> but I have this error http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/SxXdCtzc each time I do the debuild http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/SxXdCtzc
[03:34] <NCommander> ScottK: sorry, I'm not in a great place hardware wise, but I'll ask Gruemaster
[03:55] <ScottK> NCommander: Thanks.
[07:56] <shadeslayer> Riddell: did you get my mail ?
[08:05] <jussi01> Hrm, Ive an idea. its probably been said before and possibly been done without me knowing.
[08:06] <shadeslayer> can someone tell me if this : https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/digikam/+bug/556826 and : https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=199801 are related? ive marked them as such
[08:07] <jussi01> However, would it be possible to put packages into the repos that provide preset configuratiosn for programs? for example program A has 3 or 4 different usecases, and as such, come mostly un configured. If we had the most common options configuration files in 3 or 4 different packages, that could make things a heck of a lot easier for people.
[08:10] <shadeslayer> jussi01: um.. kubuntu-default-settings does that
[08:10] <shadeslayer> i think....
[08:11] <jussi01> shadeslayer: no, I mean for programs that currently come with minimal configurations.
[08:11] <shadeslayer> jussi01: ohh... that would mean we will have to chalk out the default settings...
[08:11] <jussi01> shadeslayer: correct.
[08:12] <jussi01> or move them to a different file.
[08:12] <shadeslayer> jussi01: and how would one determine which is the best config for the user?
[08:12] <shadeslayer> jussi01: well we can have a package that installs the config in ~/.kde/apps/config
[08:12] <shadeslayer> or whatever the config path is...
[08:12] <jussi01> shadeslayer: there could be 3 or 4 different packes, all conflicting.
[08:13] <jussi01> but you are right, -default-settings does do that for certain items.
[08:13] <shadeslayer> jussi01: well package versioning ensures that doesnt happen
[08:14] <jussi01> shadeslayer: no, you miss my point
[08:14] <shadeslayer> jussi01: another problem... suppose the user changes the config and we release a new version of x-default-settings... user loses his config and gets back to default
[08:14] <shadeslayer> jussi01: ohh
[08:15] <shadeslayer> jussi01: we can patch the default config files from upstream...
[08:15] <jussi01> shadeslayer: say we talk about err.. wordpress. you could have worpress-settings-1 wordpress-settings-2 wordpress-settings-3 - you can only have one settings package installed at any one time.
[08:15] <shadeslayer> imo we already do that..
[08:15] <shadeslayer> jussi01: hmmm
[08:15] <jussi01> mind, Im pretty sure it breaks about 5000 packaging rules
[08:16] <shadeslayer> yeah probably :P
[08:16] <jussi01> perhaps its worth including the files and making them available.
[08:16]  * jussi01 doesnt know. 
[08:17] <shadeslayer> jussi01: hehe... idk too... this is all hypothetical
[08:19] <shadeslayer> ok gtg
[08:19] <shadeslayer> jussi01: bye :)
[09:57] <ghostcube> o/
[11:08] <Tonio_> hi everyone
[11:09] <Tonio_> Riddell: can I upload a fix for Qt to fix bug 280113 ?
[11:11] <kdelogger> hai Tonio_
[11:11] <Tonio_> hey kdelogger
[11:11] <kdelogger> Tonio_: I think we are still frozen
[11:11] <Tonio_> hum, that was my question in fact :)
[11:11] <Tonio_> is beta2 expected ?
[11:11] <Tonio_> I have to check out for knetworkmanager too
[11:12] <kdelogger> tomorrow I would suppose
[11:12] <Tonio_> kk
[11:13] <Riddell> Tonio_: yes put it in bzr and upload it is fine, it'll get held until after beta 2
[11:14] <amichair> Tonio_: is that the years-old bug? I think I once took a look at it, it was deep in Qt land...
[11:14] <kdelogger> JontheEchidna: if/should we create a proper standalone bug policy I am strongly suggesting to sort out naming
[11:14] <amichair> nice to see it's finally closed!
[11:15] <kdelogger> JontheEchidna: like prefixing patches that originate in upstream svn with kdesvn_, those coming form bugzilla kdebug_
[11:15] <kdelogger> JontheEchidna: ideally followed by revision/bug no I would suppose
[11:16] <Tonio_> Riddell: nice, thanks :)
[11:16] <Tonio_> Riddell: this is the one I've been tracking for more than a year now :)
[11:16] <Tonio_> sounds like a special upload for me
[11:16] <Tonio_> hehe
[11:16] <Tonio_> amichair: yes it's that one, I HAVE THE FIX !
[11:17] <amichair> Tonio_: You the man!
[11:17] <Tonio_> amichair: in fact I was about to give up when I found out that it could be fixed somewhere else
[11:17] <kdelogger> Oh
[11:17] <kdelogger> My
[11:17] <kdelogger> Sun
[11:17] <Tonio_> amichair: and googeling for that class, I found out someone wrote a patch that partially worked out 3 month ago
[11:17] <kdelogger> !
[11:17] <Tonio_> I just fixed the fix
[11:18] <kdelogger> why in the name of darth vader does choqok have a splash
[11:18] <amichair> Tonio_: You still de man!
[11:18] <kdelogger> a very ugly one actually
[11:18] <kdelogger> neversfelde: !!!!
[11:18] <Tonio_> amichair: I never give up that's hte trick :)
[11:19] <Tonio_> Riddell: do we have qt in bzr ?
[11:19] <Riddell> Tonio_: yes
[11:20] <Tonio_> Riddell: kk
[11:21] <Tonio_> Riddell: oh and do you know I quit smocking ?
[11:21] <Tonio_> among the good news....
[11:22] <kdelogger> \o/ longer life for kubuntu developers
[11:22]  * kdelogger hugs Tonio_, congratualtes him and hands him a cookie :)
[11:23] <Riddell> Tonio_: awooga!
[11:24] <Tonio_> ;)
[11:24] <Tonio_> not that hard to be honnest
[11:24] <Tonio_> restarting to do sport is a lot harder after 15 years smocking :'(
[11:24] <Tonio_> but that's for the best so...
[11:25]  * kdelogger notes from experience that quitting is indeed not very hard, not starting again is :/
[11:25] <Tonio_> kdelogger: probably
[11:25] <Tonio_> kdelogger: I'll tell you when that happens to me :)
[11:28] <kdelogger> ah, if you are doing sports you are too busy for smoking anyway :)
[11:29] <kdelogger> bug 342729
[11:29] <kdelogger> any mad python dev around to implement this? ^^
[11:30] <Tonio_> Riddell: which group owns the qt4-x11 branch ?
[11:31] <Tonio_> oh it's called qt, not qt4....
[11:32] <kdelogger> Tonio_: naming policy of branches always follows what upstream calls it
[11:32] <kdelogger> hence there is kdelibs and not kde4libs for example
[11:32] <Tonio_> kdelogger: yeah but hopefully we don't have to maintain the 3 and 4 branches of qt...
[11:33] <kdelogger> technically we do I think, now that MOTU is theoretically no more
[11:33] <kdelogger> technicaly we always did ^^
[11:38] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Harald Sitter <apachelogger@ubuntu.com> * rapachelogger@ubuntu.com-20100407103837-js4nvuytoe4ucsgn kubuntu-default-settings/ (13 files in 13 dirs):
[11:38] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Bring kubuntu icon from 1:10.04ubuntu13 in line with oxygen naming. It is
[11:38] <CIA-6> kubuntu: now named start-here-kubuntu.png and located in the places/ directory.
[11:38] <kdelogger> \o/
[11:38] <kdelogger> return of the bot flood ^^
[11:40] <Tonio_> Riddell: qt uploaded
[11:40] <Tonio_> Riddell: also I'll ping sebas about knetworkmanager
[11:40] <Tonio_> Riddell: svn stopped receiving updates, so it could be they consider it mature now
[11:40] <Tonio_> I hope
[11:41] <Tonio_> sebas: you there ?
[11:41] <sebas> Tonio_: yes
[11:42] <Tonio_> sebas: what is your feeling about what we should do with the networkmanager for lucid ?
[11:42] <sebas> any specific bugs?
[11:42] <Tonio_> sebas: go with the plasmoid ?
[11:42] <Tonio_> sebas: not at all it all works like a charm for me :)
[11:42] <sebas> it's really your call, I've been using the plasmoid exclusively, and it's good for me
[11:42] <sebas> but it cannot easily connect to hidden wifis
[11:43] <Tonio_> sebas: I'd go with the plasmoid too
[11:43] <Tonio_> sebas: is there any advantage according to you to go with the plasmoid ?
[11:43] <sebas> I'm also not aware of regressions, but error handling isn't very good
[11:43] <sebas> You mean other than it's nicer, more informative? :)
[11:43] <Tonio_> yep other than this
[11:43] <sebas> "The Plasmoid totally has UX built in" :)
[11:43] <Tonio_> sebas: what about handling hidden networks now ?
[11:44] <sebas> other than that, no, I  don't think so
[11:44] <Tonio_> kk
[11:44] <sebas> the plasmoid ignores them
[11:44] <Tonio_> but they can be added manually and it works or ?
[11:44] <sebas> I'm actually waiting for will to implement it in the lower levels
[11:44] <sebas> didn't try :O
[11:44] <Tonio_> kk that's a major issue in fact (but not related to the plasmoid so..)
[11:44] <sebas> btw, I just fixed a possible crasher yesterday
[11:45] <Tonio_> Riddell: so what is your feeling ?
[11:45] <sebas> yes, no hidden wifi support is the biggest problem left with wifi support IMO
[11:45] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'd personaly go with the plasmoid, since it works like a charm here, and yes, it is more invormative and nicer
[11:45] <Tonio_> Riddell: on the other hand I understand we're late in the cycle....
[11:46] <Tonio_> Riddell: just in case we keep knetworkmanager, I think we should update to current svn tree...
[11:46] <Tonio_> there are lots of fixes in them, and switching to the plasmoid will be easier
[11:46] <Tonio_> Riddell: also the packaging is better (splitted vpn plugins and so on)
[11:46] <Tonio_> sebas: I'll see with the guys what to do... thanks for your time
[11:48] <Riddell> Tonio_: I don't want to change UI now, it's too late in the cycle
[11:48] <alvin> I have no problems myself with knetworkmanager, but if you read the kubuntu-users list, you'll see them recommending wicd to everyone who has a question about wireless.
[11:49] <freeflying> Riddell: I'm going to demo Kubuntu to some OEM
[11:49] <Tonio_> Riddell: ok so should we go with the current svn ?
[11:49] <Riddell> freeflying: ooh, great
[11:49] <alvin> (Well, they do also recommend synaptic to everyone who asks a question about installing packages)
[11:49] <Riddell> Tonio_: if upstream thinks it's a stable snapshot and we get suitable testing on the mailing list
[11:49] <Tonio_> kk
[11:49] <kdelogger> hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
[11:50] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'm calling for testers on the mailing list
[11:50] <kdelogger> anyone wanna check why 3rd party plasma themes do not use our branding.svg?
[11:50] <kdelogger> even though they should
[11:52] <sebas> Riddell: which one are you shipping with lucid?
[11:52] <sebas> I don't think stability has decreased, so latest == greatest
[11:52] <sebas> in fact, I've just dismissed a bugreport about knm in lucid this morning that was clearly more than a month old
[11:53] <sebas> not sure though it the user failed to upgrade, or if it was standard packages
[11:53] <Riddell> sebas: 0.9~svn1075616-0ubuntu3  so not new
[11:53] <sebas> aight, please update
[11:54] <sebas> that makes bugreports useful to us, and as I said, we were quite careful lately
[11:54] <Riddell> Tonio_: find us some testers and we'll update it
[11:54] <kdelogger> ohm
[11:54] <kdelogger> omg
[11:54] <kdelogger> there is a bug in plasma
[11:54] <kdelogger> *surprise*
[11:54] <kdelogger> :P
[11:55] <sebas> I can try to fix bugs quickly when you find them
[11:55] <Tonio_> Riddell: yup I'll call on the mailing lists :)
[11:58] <Tonio_> sebas: since you there, I noticed a little issue with the plasmoid
[11:58] <Tonio_> sebas: when loading, regularly, it will display all the networks instead of the short list
[11:59] <Tonio_> sebas: when I click on "show more" and then "show less" it comes back to normal
[11:59] <kdelogger> hm
[11:59] <kdelogger> sebas: do you happen to know why  the plasma fallback themes contain oxygen? ... indeed prefer oxygen over the defaulttheme?
[12:01] <sebas> Tonio_: hm, I'll investigate
[12:01] <sebas> kdelogger: no
[12:01]  * kdelogger looks at svn log
[12:03] <kdelogger> kde rev 987538
[12:04]  * kdelogger doesnt find that kind of backwards compability very good from a performance POV, but oh well
[12:05] <Tonio_> sebas: thx
[12:05] <Tonio_> Riddell: I called for feedback to the mailing lists
[12:12] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Harald Sitter <apachelogger@ubuntu.com> * rapachelogger@ubuntu.com-20100407111227-8k7wile5ypp7n2c0 kubuntu-default-settings/ (2 files in 2 dirs):
[12:12] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Make branding.svg background white, so that it remains readable on themes with
[12:12] <CIA-6> kubuntu: black background
[12:13] <Riddell> JontheEchidna: bug 557217 may be my misunderstanding it but I don't think so
[12:13] <Riddell> JontheEchidna: also ksplash still disappears before plasma-netbook is shown
[12:17] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Harald Sitter <apachelogger@ubuntu.com> * rapachelogger@ubuntu.com-20100407111657-tg3gsat15bf00e66 kubuntu-default-settings/debian/ (changelog kubuntu-default-settings.links):
[12:17] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Via dh_link link default plasma theme to oxygen, to work around oxygen
[12:17] <CIA-6> kubuntu: preference over air in theme fallback list (see kde rev 987538)
[12:19] <JontheEchidna> Riddell: could you attatch that hook to the bug?
[12:19] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Harald Sitter <apachelogger@ubuntu.com> * rapachelogger@ubuntu.com-20100407111913-vfjmw7nqnly1ewns kubuntu-default-settings/debian/ (source source/format changelog): Fix changelog entry length + make source format 3 = happy lintian
[12:19] <JontheEchidna> (and fwiw, kplash works for me (tm) with my clean netbook test user)
[12:22] <JontheEchidna> gotta go now
[12:22] <Riddell> JontheEchidna: attached
[12:23] <JontheEchidna> k, bbl
[12:23] <Riddell> JontheEchidna: doesn't work from a live image, maybe our packages are missing something?
[12:23] <Riddell> dpm: my launchpad foo is failing me, how do I make https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/557192 also apply to the ubuntu-translations project?
[12:26] <dpm> Riddell, I don't know how to do it with the e-mail interface. I usually do it manually, by clicking on the "Also affects project link". Then you can just add 'ubuntu-translations' on the next screen. If the Ubuntu package already has an upstream project assigned, you might have to additionally click on "Choose another project" and then enter 'ubuntu-translations'
[12:27]  * Sput notices that CIA's output looks *much* better and more readable if colors are allowed in the channel
[12:27] <Riddell> dpm: thanks, done
[12:27] <dpm> no worries
[12:28] <kdelogger> there is a page in the lp wiki explaining all the email magic
[12:28]  * kdelogger thinks that plasma is messing with him on intention!
[12:29] <kdelogger> oh
[12:29] <kdelogger> I am just stupid ^^
[12:29] <Riddell> I've never used e-mail for bugs, e-mail as a user interface is a bad idea
[12:33] <Riddell> amichair: did you get an e-mail from colin?
[12:34] <amichair> Riddell: yeah, I'm at #ubuntu-installer
[12:35] <kdelogger> Riddell: could you please take a look at the ibus warning stuff when starting a qt app in lucid
[12:35]  * kdelogger finds it super annoying
[12:36] <ghostcube> hmm isnt it against coc to set an ubuntu channel as invite only?
[12:39] <kdelogger> woah
[12:39] <kdelogger> that looks super silly
[12:39] <kdelogger> ^^
[12:40] <persia> ghostcube: No, but no channel managed by the IRCC is set in such a way.  Ask in #ubuntu-irc (with details) if you seek investigation.
[12:40] <kdelogger>  http://imagebin.ca/view/soZox7I.html
[12:40] <kdelogger> suggestions anyone?
[12:41] <Riddell> kdelogger: does the image have a white background?
[12:41] <kdelogger> Riddell: I added it
[12:41] <kdelogger> otherwise it looks even crappier, because it is transparent
[12:42] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Harald Sitter <apachelogger@ubuntu.com> * rapachelogger@ubuntu.com-20100407114156-iperlr98dy543p4k kubuntu-default-settings/share/apps/desktoptheme/default/widgets/branding.svgz: Fix background white properly, looks like ewww though
[12:42] <Tonio__> am I the only one who gets a lot of problem with kopete contet menu ?
[12:42] <Nightrose> Tonio__: me too
[12:42] <Tonio__> submenus are going insanely on the top of the current menu and so on
[12:42] <kdelogger> dbusmenu is at fault
[12:42] <Tonio__> that's a PAIN to use
[12:42] <kdelogger> and I am getting told it is all fixed in the versin that Riddell refuses to upload :P
[12:43]  * Tonio__ looks lovelly at Riddell....
[12:43]  * kdelogger should go an a bike ride
[12:43] <kdelogger> way to nice weather
[12:43] <Riddell> what am I refusing to upload?
[12:43] <Tonio_> kdelogger: can I get that package to test please ?
[12:43]  * kdelogger checks windiness
[12:43] <kdelogger> 1.7m/s
[12:43] <kdelogger> Tonio_: I dont have it
[12:44] <kdelogger> Riddell: the fix for dbusmenu, or whether the load of dbusmenu related bugs were fixed
[12:44] <kdelogger> s/whether/where ever
[12:44] <Riddell> I have some updated patches from agateau waiting for beta to be done with, I don't think I've refused to upload anything
[12:44]  * apachelogger didnt even have breakfast yet ^^
[12:44] <apachelogger> kubotu: time
[12:44] <ghostcube> persia: thx, will do
[12:44] <apachelogger> kubotu: I think you are broken
[12:45] <apachelogger> kubotu: lets have a look, shall we?
[12:45] <ghostcube> apachelogger: and we all know who broke him :P
[12:45] <ghostcube> höhö
[12:45] <apachelogger> Riddell: I just claimed that you refused :P
[12:45] <Tonio_> Riddell: may I test if that fixes kopete's issues ?
[12:45] <Tonio_> Riddell: where's that patch please ?
[12:46] <Riddell> somewhere in my inbox I think
[12:46]  * apachelogger notes that this stuff should go in as soon as beta2 is out, because it really makes using tray menus a PITA
[12:47] <apachelogger> latest xkcd is awesome :D
[12:47] <Tonio_> Riddell: ah :)
[12:48] <apachelogger> Tonio_: I suppose you could try latest dbusmenu-qt bzr branch
[12:48] <Riddell> Tonio_: http://people.canonical.com/~agateau/dbusmenu/index.html
[12:48] <Tonio_> nice
[12:48] <Tonio_> ouch.... that's quite a lot of patches to just test....
[12:49] <Tonio_> Riddell: I think I'll wait for that to reach out the repos ;)
[12:51] <apachelogger> kubotu: version
[12:51] <kubotu> I'm a v. 0.9.15-git (master branch, revision f00ee3b [IRC: support 'CASEMAPPING=charset' from some idiotic servers]) [8 days, 19 hours, 10 minutes and 19 seconds ago] rubybot, (c) Tom Gilbert and the rbot development team - http://ruby-rbot.org
[12:51] <apachelogger> kubotu: time
[12:51] <kubotu> apachelogger: Europe - Vienna - Wed Apr 07 13:51 CEST
[12:51] <apachelogger> perfect
[12:51]  * apachelogger goes breakfasting
[13:16] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Harald Sitter <apachelogger@ubuntu.com> * rapachelogger@ubuntu.com-20100407121604-cl8n1oump5lk7vod kdebase-workspace/debian/ (3 files in 2 dirs):
[13:16] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Add kubuntu_01_fix_dateandtimekcm.diff from upstream to fix a whole
[13:16] <CIA-6> kubuntu: set of funy bugs in the date&time KCM, amongst them LP: #367164
[13:25] <ScottK> apachelogger: re a comment you made quite a while ago, MOTU is not going away.
[13:25] <apachelogger> just being refactored
[13:25] <ScottK> Slightly.
[13:27]  * apachelogger goes out a bit
[13:33] <rgreening> hey, when did we get CIA running here
[13:33] <rgreening> :)
[13:53] <ScottK> Tm_T: Around?
[17:49] <bipolar> I have a sierra wireless 885 usb GSM adaptor. I think networkmanager is trying to use the wrong ttyUSB device for the data connection. I'm in the process of searching for/submitting a bug for this issue. does anyone have any insight on what I should include other then the output in /var/log/syslog?
[17:52] <Riddell> bipolar: seems our resident network manager guy isn't on the channel currently
[17:52] <bipolar> Riddell: np. he'll get the bug report :)
[17:53] <bipolar> just getting the data together now
[18:04] <evilshadeslayer> bipolar: just do : ubuntu-bug package_name
[18:04] <evilshadeslayer> that will put together everything :P
[18:10] <bipolar> evilshadeslayer: bah! get off my lawn! :P
[18:11] <evilshadeslayer> bipolar: hehe :D
[18:12] <evilshadeslayer> bipolar: if you already reported it do : apport-collect bug_number : :D
[18:16] <bipolar> gah! I guess I'll use the newfangled app. I just hit submit on launchpad and it returned me to the package page without submitting the bug. :|
[18:17] <Riddell> bipolar: oh one thing to try is the packages of the newer snapshot
[18:18] <Riddell> https://edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ppa/+archive/experimental
[18:18] <bipolar> Riddell: I'll give that a shot and append to the bug with results.
[18:19] <shtylman> ryanakca: we gonna get new site for lucid?
[18:19]  * shtylman looks with longing eyes :)
[18:19] <Riddell> shtylman: ofir is working on it
[18:19] <shtylman> Riddell: will it hit for lucid?
[18:19] <Riddell> I doubt we'll get it launched on lucid release day I think the sysadmins are too busy
[18:19] <Riddell> we could aim for before of course
[18:19] <shtylman> :9
[18:19] <shtylman> :(
[18:20] <shtylman> Riddell: why you gonna crush hopes and dreams like that?
[18:21] <Mamarok> Riddell: just read that they again diminished the amount of Kubuntu CDs in the LoCo Team packs...
[18:22] <apachelogger> o/
[18:23] <amichair> how do I ask the bot which version of nvidia drivers will be shipped with lucid?
[18:23] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Harald Sitter <apachelogger@ubuntu.com> * rapachelogger@ubuntu.com-20100407172201-bcemqay89pirp0u9 kubuntu-default-settings/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Revert branding.svg related changes, the only real fix to the problem of visiblity is creating a special logo version for dark backgrounds and expect dark themes to define oxygen as fallback
[18:23] <Mamarok> amichair: try info nvidia
[18:24] <amichair> kubotu: info nvidia
[18:24] <Mamarok> !info nvidia
[18:24] <Mamarok> oh, right, it has to be the package name
[18:24] <davmor2> !info nvidia-glx
[18:24] <apachelogger> + lucid too ;)
[18:25] <Mamarok> amichair: apparently nvidia-96
[18:26] <Mamarok> for the restricted driver
[18:26] <amichair> what's 96? latest is 195.36.15
[18:26] <Mamarok> must be some version of the 195 I guess
[18:27] <Mamarok> apt-cache search nividia finds 4 different versions
[18:28] <Mamarok> amichair: its 195.36.15
[18:28] <Mamarok> !info nvidia-current
[18:28] <Mamarok> gah, it still shows the karmic repos only
[18:28] <apachelogger> !info nvidia-current lucid
[18:29] <amichair> ah... apachelogger ftw!
[18:29] <Mamarok> apachelogger: thx :)
[18:30] <amichair> Mamarok: thanks too!
[18:30] <Mamarok> amichair: de nada :)
[18:31] <neversfelde> apachelogger: I do not like the splash either, it should be disabled by default. I will talk to mtux, if I find the time in the next days.
[18:31] <apachelogger> it should just not be ther
[18:31] <apachelogger> e
[18:31] <amichair> how strange, nvidia-glx-185 is driver version 195... something in the naming scheme there is off
[18:31] <apachelogger> besides the fact that splashes are mostly pointless anyway
[18:31] <apachelogger> it is especiallyf or choqok
[18:32] <apachelogger> because if an app that size requires long enough to start that a splash becomes necessary there is a lot more buggy then just the lack of feedback
[18:32] <apachelogger> neversfelde: I disbaled it via kds trunk now
[18:32] <apachelogger> will upload once beta2 is out
[18:33] <neversfelde> apachelogger: ok
[18:35] <evilshadeslayer> apachelogger: hehe... default browser might change on 10.10 .... Riddell made a brainstorm wiki page :D
[18:36] <evilshadeslayer> apachelogger: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/10.10/Brainstorm
[18:38] <apachelogger> we all know that rekonq is not even remotely mature enough, right?
[18:39] <EagleScreen> yes
[18:39] <apachelogger> k
[18:39] <evilshadeslayer> apachelogger: i disagree... what feature is missing?
[18:39] <EagleScreen> the only really good browser is Firefox
[18:39] <apachelogger> features?
[18:39] <apachelogger> who is talking about features?
[18:39] <evilshadeslayer> apachelogger: then?
[18:39] <JontheEchidna> features != maturity
[18:40]  * apachelogger doesnt give a cookie about features
[18:40] <EagleScreen> can rekonq manage well certificates?
[18:40] <JontheEchidna> ~order cookies
[18:40]  * kubotu slides a whole bunch of world's finest cookies down the bar to JontheEchidna.
[18:40] <evilshadeslayer> EagleScreen: SSL certificates?
[18:40] <Riddell> Mamarok: where's this?
[18:40] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: now you must make om nom nom :P
[18:40]  * JontheEchidna nom
[18:40]  * JontheEchidna noms
[18:41] <Mamarok> Riddell: the mail we just got on the loco-contacts mailing list today, I will forward it to you
[18:41]  * apachelogger giggles
[18:41] <EagleScreen> personal certificates, can I use rekonq to acess to my laboral data, using my identification certificate provided by my goverment? I dude it
[18:42] <Mamarok> Riddell: mail is sent
[18:42] <evilshadeslayer> EagleScreen: you dude it? lol.... and no i dont think it does that right now
[18:43] <EagleScreen> does Rekonq work enought well with java stuff? can I upload photos to tuenti.com with its java web application? I can't with Arora, so i supose I can't with Rekonq
[18:43] <evilshadeslayer> EagleScreen: um Arora!=rekonq
[18:43] <EagleScreen> Firefox is th onñy browser which safitfy all these features
[18:43] <evilshadeslayer> EagleScreen: rekonq uses kdewebkit... arora is qtwebkit
[18:43] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: bug 370229 .. kdm postinst returned with 1?
[18:44]  * apachelogger would close as untriagable ^^
[18:44] <JontheEchidna> e.g. the most useless error ever
[18:44] <apachelogger> evilshadeslayer: kdewebkits is nothing but a convenience layer ontop of qtwebkit
[18:44]  * apachelogger does the looky looky
[18:45] <EagleScreen> in my opinion we (or you) shoud focus to better Firefox KDE integration, because it is the best browser
[18:45] <evilshadeslayer> EagleScreen: heh.. it says cookies disabled 0_o
[18:45] <evilshadeslayer> but then again.. im on the latest git build
[18:45] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: bug in dpkg I would think ... the postinst does not ever return with 1 unless it was called with an unkown arg
[18:46] <apachelogger> in which case it even echos an error before exiting
[18:46] <evilshadeslayer> anyways... gtg :)
[18:46] <amichair> +1 FireFox. It's the only option for newcomers (and veterans), most mature. Should be default.
[18:47] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: it would be nice if you could come up with some decent message for closing the bug ;)
[18:47]  * apachelogger always sounds grumpy
[18:47] <apachelogger> mostly because I am grumpy when I have to close a bug :/
[18:48] <amichair> apachelogger: you can always cite reasons of national security as an explanation for closing it.
[18:48] <JontheEchidna> ugh, the ones when they start listing all their problems are the worst...
[18:49] <apachelogger> mgraesslin: any ideas on bug 377704 ?
[18:49] <JontheEchidna> +1 firefox. We have the space now, and we already have gtk on the cd since 9.10
[18:49] <apachelogger> amichair: lol
[18:51] <mgraesslin> no idea, normally with NVIDIA it just works
[18:51] <apachelogger> hm
[18:51] <apachelogger> mgraesslin: thanks anyway :)
[18:58] <apachelogger> ScottK: I suppose bug 431164 can be closed as fixed?
[18:58] <apachelogger> didnt reappear AFAIK
[18:58] <apachelogger> also FWIW the shutdown dialogs are from ksmserver, not powerdevil :)
[18:58] <shtylman> apachelogger: any word on that printer dialog bug? where it expands beyond the size of the screen?
[18:58] <shtylman> or maybe JontheEchidna ^ :)
[18:59] <apachelogger> more like JontheEchidna :P
[19:01] <JontheEchidna> system-config-printer-kde is scary
[19:02] <apachelogger> lol
[19:02] <apachelogger> not as scary as krandr(tray)
[19:02] <apachelogger> trust me
[19:05] <shtylman> JontheEchidna: haha ... alright... I will take a look at that bug :)
[19:06] <shtylman> know off hand where those files live on disk?
[19:16] <apachelogger> Riddell, JontheEchidna: btw, I think we should strip the crappy looking default window decorations from the defualt installation
[19:16]  * JontheEchidna saw a bugreport today with somebody actually using Redmond :S
[19:16] <apachelogger> ewww
[19:17] <apachelogger> s/window decorations/window decorations and styles/
[19:17] <JontheEchidna> My dad uses Keramik for windeco, so I must conclude people do not have good taste in general
[19:18] <apachelogger> because we give them the option to opt for crappyness :P
[19:18] <apachelogger> we just shouldnt do that IMHO
[19:18] <apachelogger> + those that have good taste will throw up on their displays
[19:18] <apachelogger> and that is one bloody mess to clean :P
[19:19] <shtylman> Riddell: I have the fixed system-config-printer.ui file
[19:19] <shtylman> what should I do with it :)
[19:20] <shtylman> it adds a scrollbar to the options tab... which is needed with some printers cause they have lots of options
[19:20] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: bug 179389 could you upstream that?
[19:20] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: I am 98% sure ossi will go "wah, dont care" though :P
[19:21] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: I think those are mostly theming decisions
[19:21] <shtylman> JontheEchidna apachelogger: I am upstream for the kdm login theme :)
[19:21] <apachelogger> password thingy deactivated is defenitely backend stuff
[19:21] <JontheEchidna> :)
[19:21] <apachelogger> didnt read beyond that :P
[19:22] <apachelogger> shtylman: maybe 2 and 3 are interesting for you then
[19:22] <shtylman> yea
[19:22] <apachelogger> 1 defenitely is something ossi should do globally for all and every theme
[19:22] <shtylman> I can take a look at 2 and 3 for 4.5 release
[19:22] <apachelogger> maybe even hide the password widget
[19:23] <shtylman> amichair: is bug 556402 still an issue?
[19:26] <amichair> shtylman: unless it was fixed since yesterday
[19:26] <shtylman> k
[19:27] <bipolar> Riddell: just fyi, I reported the issue with my gsm card as modemmanager bug 557449 but I'm sure the necessary people got the email.
[19:27] <bipolar> !hug ubottu
[19:39] <nixternal> oi oi
[19:40] <nixternal> finally, tethered to my freakin' phone and using this webchat garbage
[19:41] <jussi01> How does one set xdg_open things? (cause chrome wants to use one that isnt set)
[19:41] <jussi01> hiya nixternal
[19:42] <nigelb> nixternal, hey :)
[19:42] <nixternal> oi, tethering to the internet is super slow
[19:42] <nixternal> howdy jussi01 and nigelb
[19:43] <nigelb> nixternal, can you find time to sign up for a few hours on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PatchDay ?
[19:43] <nixternal> then again, this laptop I am on is ancient...hopefully we will be allowed back into the house soon to see just how much damage was done to my puters
[19:43] <nixternal> nigelb: I can't do anything...our house took pretty good storm damage the other night and I don't have any computers or decent internet
[19:44] <nixternal> don't know when I will have Internet let alone a computer
[19:44] <nigelb> nixternal, ahhhh
[19:44] <maco> nixternal: what happened to your house?
[19:44] <nixternal> maco: lightening strike and either a f-0 tornado or a microburst
[19:44] <nigelb> maco, hockey puck hit it I tink :D
[19:44] <maco> nixternal: yuck
[19:44] <jussi01> hrrggh
[19:45] <nixternal> the yuck part is waiting for insurance idiots to come through so we can go into the damn house
[19:45] <nixternal> i know my puters are probably sitting in a foot or so of water, but my laptop and netbook should be fine (I hope)
[19:46] <jjesse> dude you have water in your house
[19:46] <jjesse> that sucks
[19:46] <nixternal> better than the tornado
[19:46] <nixternal> or microburst
[19:46] <nixternal> i just hope the insurance covers my puters and gives me decent money
[19:47] <nixternal> thankfully my bikes weren't in the damaged space :)
[19:48] <nixternal> missed a damn job interview too because of this
[19:48] <jjesse> that sucks
[19:50] <nixternal> I want to be in my bed tonight damnit
[19:50] <apachelogger> there there (c)sheldon
[19:50] <nixternal> according to my old man, power will be restored tonight...so there must not be any water in the hizzy
[19:51]  * apachelogger puts on a good smile and hugs nixternal
[19:51] <nixternal> I knew I should have just renewed my damn lease in that condo..then I wouldn't have to deal with this :)
[19:52] <nixternal> now I get to live with mommy and daddy for a little bit...mmm good food finally ;)
[19:53] <nixternal> what good is a girlfriend if she doesn't have internet? and everyone in this complex locks down their wifi, even with their crappy signals
[19:54] <apachelogger> hm
[19:54] <apachelogger> I suppose that is what we get for asking people to secure their wifis -.-
[19:54] <nixternal> wish I knew how to crack wifi :)
[19:55] <nixternal> but tonight, sounds like I should be back up and running at least
[19:56] <apachelogger> nixternal: you never learned how to crack wep? Oo
[19:56] <nixternal> woo, only the upstairs sustained damage...that is a good thing, kind of...means my puters are safe
[19:56] <nixternal> apachelogger: yeah, a long time ago though, and these are all WPA
[19:56] <apachelogger> meh
[19:57] <txwikinger> Is there a Kubuntu-Countdown too ? http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/countdown
[19:58] <apachelogger> there never is
[19:58] <nixternal> ok...gonna get off now, because this is to slow...i guess i could always run up to the starbucks or book store, but tonight I have racing practice...if all goes well, i should have my server fired up and my computers back up and running tonight
[19:58] <nixternal> wish me luck
[19:58] <txwikinger> I thought there was before
[19:58] <apachelogger> nixternal: good luck
[19:59] <JontheEchidna> nookie did one for 9.10, iirc
[19:59] <apachelogger> txwikinger: always after ubuntu throws theirs
[19:59] <apachelogger> then someone here goes like OMG
[19:59] <apachelogger> we then roll our own 1 or 2 weeks before release
[19:59] <apachelogger> and I am like *sigh*
[19:59] <apachelogger> and next release it's the same all over again
[19:59] <txwikinger> Well.. shouldn't be too difficult
[20:00] <apachelogger> and then people say I should have blogged Kubuntu is not Canonical since Kubuntu is not Ubuntu draws the wrong picture :P
[20:00] <jjesse_> wow someone's cranky today :)
[20:00] <apachelogger> someone is always cranky
[20:01] <JontheEchidna> http://www.engadget.com/2009/10/22/burger-king-selling-a-windows-7-whopper-in-japan/#continued
[20:01] <apachelogger> hm
[20:01] <txwikinger> How awful.. for each day there is another image
[20:02] <apachelogger> txwikinger: same i thought when I saw the code
[20:02]  * txwikinger thought we learn programming to avoid such nonsense
[20:02]  * apachelogger is wondering if the lords of X11 have a spec on icon names
[20:02] <apachelogger> txwikinger: opporunistic programming we learned
[20:03] <apachelogger> *cough*
[20:03]  * apachelogger better stops ranting before someone comes beating him again :P
[20:03] <txwikinger> who would dare beating you, apachelogger?
[20:04] <apachelogger> *shrug*
[20:04] <apachelogger> better save than sorry
[20:05] <txwikinger> Well.. or live somewhere where they have to dig through miles of mud before they get to you
[20:07] <apachelogger> there sure is no nice weather though
[20:10]  * apachelogger hates fallbacks
[20:10] <txwikinger> always defends on the definition of nice weather
[20:11] <apachelogger> bug 305201 and bug 288502 are actually the same
[20:11] <apachelogger> and happen because Qt4 looks for an icon named wait for the busy cursors for example
[20:11] <apachelogger> doesnt find it in the theme
[20:12] <apachelogger> goes through fallbacks
[20:12] <apachelogger> ends up with default
[20:12] <apachelogger> default is oxygen
[20:12] <apachelogger> oxygen provides wait
[20:12] <apachelogger> oxygen curosor pixmap gets used
[20:12] <apachelogger> IF OXYGEN WAS NOT DEFAULT
[20:13] <apachelogger> default would be X11 ugly theme, which obviously also doesent contain wait
[20:13] <apachelogger> and then it gets funny
[20:13] <apachelogger> for some reason it then starts looking for a cursor pixmap named watch?!!?!?
[20:13] <apachelogger> watch is available in curosr theme -> gets used
[20:14] <apachelogger> fortunately enough I do not know if our behaviour is valid here --- i.e. the cursor themes are broken in regards of Qt 4
[20:14] <apachelogger> since I cant find a spec defining cursor names I would think so
[20:17] <apachelogger> http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/cursor-spec
[20:17] <apachelogger> there is a draft
[20:21] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: ping ping ping
[20:22]  * txwikinger thinks that sounded like a bycicle bell
[20:22]  * apachelogger is bycicle fan because of nixternal ^^
[20:23] <apachelogger> well, at least until I get my skateboard ;)
[20:48] <rickspencer3> apachelogger, 'sup?
[20:49] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: see aboves mind dump ... apparently there is no spec regarding cursor naming
[20:49] <rickspencer3> oh fudge
[20:49] <apachelogger> and Qt4 uses somewhat different names from those that have been used until then
[20:49] <rickspencer3> apachelogger, can I get back to you in like 2 hours?
[20:49] <apachelogger> sure
[20:49] <rickspencer3> have some stuff going on, and I just got back from the gym
[20:50]  * rickspencer3 drips icky sweat on keyboard
[20:50] <rickspencer3> kk
[20:50] <apachelogger> oh dear ^^
[20:50] <rickspencer3> apachelogger, ping me if I take too long
[20:50] <rickspencer3> ;)
[20:50] <rickspencer3> bbl
[20:50] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: well, I was just thinking, maybe canonical could push above mentioned spec draft a bit ;)
[20:51] <apachelogger> juding from the author it was drafted by/within KDE, so I suppose there it is supported
[20:51] <apachelogger> + the author of the oxygen mouse theme would probably be glad about some spec ^^
[20:51] <yuriy_work> !info doxygen-gui karmic
[20:51] <apachelogger> it's not there in karmic
[20:51] <yuriy_work> how weird, it's in every other version
[20:52] <apachelogger> some build error or something
[20:52] <apachelogger> of course the ultimate fix here was to deactivate its build
[20:52] <apachelogger> and then forget about turning it on again ;)
[20:54] <yuriy_work> oh well, using the jaunty package and hoping it doesn't blow up
[20:56] <JontheEchidna> detonating yuriy_work's computer in 3... 2...
[20:57] <JontheEchidna> stallman have mercy... who thought making apport report things like bug 543949 would be a good idea? :(
[20:58] <apachelogger> yay
[20:58] <apachelogger> "insufficient information -> closing invalid"
[20:58] <JontheEchidna> already did
[20:58] <JontheEchidna> ;)
[20:58] <delight> i upgraded from karmic to current lucid on my laptop ... crashed and i fixed i had to fix it with a rescue-system chroot etc. ... now its working fine but the plymouth comes in a really bad resolution ... looks like 16 colour  vga or something like that ;)  does somebody know how to fix this a little ?
[20:59] <apachelogger> cant fix
[20:59] <apachelogger> get sensible graphics hardware
[20:59] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: hopefully he doesnt really report this at bugs.kde.org
[20:59] <apachelogger> dario might come and eat you :P
[20:59] <JontheEchidna> hmm, yeah. bad idea in retrospect
[20:59] <apachelogger> ^^
[20:59] <delight> the kubuntu daily-live cd shows plymouth fine (1680*1050 full color)
[20:59] <apachelogger> you should have used my text
[21:00] <apachelogger> delight: oh, that is weird then
[21:00] <JontheEchidna> delight: did you install the binary nvidia drivers after the install?
[21:00] <delight> JontheEchidna: i guess it updated it on my box
[21:00] <delight> it got now nvidia-current installed
[21:00] <JontheEchidna> yeah, that's it.
[21:01] <JontheEchidna> The open source drivers on the livecd can do >16 colors
[21:01] <JontheEchidna> proprietary nvidia binaries can't
[21:01] <JontheEchidna> but then the open source ones can't do 3D much at all
[21:01] <JontheEchidna> :(
[21:01] <JontheEchidna> so it's either crappy boot or crappy 3d
[21:01] <delight> got it ... ;) hehe ... so no fix ... just crappy bootscreen :) ... i really liked the new bootscreen btw ... looks slick
[21:02] <JontheEchidna> I'd tell you to direct all bootscreen praise to nixternal, but he's not here at the moment...
[21:03] <JontheEchidna> well, shtylman deserves some praise for the logo, and canonical for the font I suppose
[21:03] <JontheEchidna> be glad that nixternal didn't go with his first idea, though: http://blog.nixternal.com/2010.03.30/updated-kubuntu-plymouth-theme/
[21:03] <JontheEchidna> :P
[21:04] <delight> haha ... funny one
[21:06]  * apachelogger would have liked the first idea better!
[21:06] <apachelogger> it certainly would have made us stand out ;)
[21:07] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: well, we would have to consider how well nixternal's head scales, for the kickoff button ;)
[21:07] <apachelogger> hm
[21:07] <apachelogger> yeah
[21:07] <apachelogger> THOUGH
[21:07] <apachelogger> if I can go through with my proposal of moving all and every button to the left
[21:08] <apachelogger> instead of filling the new gained space on the right with a pink unicorn pony that blinks, we could use a blinking nixternal head
[21:08] <JontheEchidna> hmm, what to do with bug 379820?
[21:08] <apachelogger> if that works out, we could change all our branding to nixternal head and establish it as new sign of kubuntu
[21:08] <apachelogger> just imagine
[21:08] <JontheEchidna> lulz
[21:09] <JontheEchidna> looks like that bug is pretty much resolved as not fixable?
[21:09] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: I would say ... enhance the dirty files spec with a marker to trigger a logout and login notification
[21:10] <JontheEchidna> oh, you mean add a kdirwatch to k-n-h or somesuch to trigger relogin messages when translations change?
[21:10] <apachelogger> then have the lang-packs touch that new marker so that knh and the gnome thingy can ask the user nicely to logou tand login again
[21:10] <JontheEchidna> or upgrade hooks?
[21:10] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: yes, and to the gnom ethingy, and update the appropriate spec in the wiki ;)
[21:11] <apachelogger> no hooks
[21:11] <apachelogger> hooks only work once ;)
[21:11] <JontheEchidna> speaking of...
[21:11] <JontheEchidna> I was looking at bug 557217, and manually putting that hook in the hookdir does trigger the notification
[21:12] <JontheEchidna> which makes me think that the hook is placed during the kubuntu install livecd session
[21:12] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: I suppose ubiqity does it via casper-ubiquity
[21:12] <apachelogger> or ubiquity-casper, whatever it is named
[21:12] <apachelogger> either way, my guess is that ubiquity does not properly detect that it was not able to install the langpacks or something
[21:13] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: language-selector-qt should have a helper that gets run at startup and launches that kind of notification anyway, whenever necessary
[21:13] <apachelogger> that way the user will also get told to install gnome language stuff for firefox etc.
[21:15] <JontheEchidna> gotta go catch my ride, bbl
[21:18] <delight> JontheEchidna: apachelogger: I just tryed that one http://linuxundich.de/de/ubuntu/plymouth-boot-nvidia-virtualbox/ <<< it worked out in the way that plymouth looked nice even thou the logo was a rather in the left half of the screen ... + i have garbled my tty - screens :-D ... so its semi possible
[21:18] <delight> just for the info .. I think I'll rather roll this back ... you never now when the next time is you need a tty
[21:19] <apachelogger> ttys only waste f* I could fill up with X sessions ;)
[21:21] <delight> so I'm out ... thnx for the tip (nvidia-plymouth) ... whish a nice time guys
[21:21] <apachelogger> o/
[21:40] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Harald Sitter <apachelogger@ubuntu.com> * rapachelogger@ubuntu.com-20100407204026-2k8acbtzuioq19md kubuntu-default-settings/ (debian/changelog share/config/khtmlrc): (log message trimmed)
[21:40] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Don't adblock by default. As reported on various sites across the internet
[21:40] <CIA-6> kubuntu: it tends to break some websites. Also it prevents content providers from
[21:40] <CIA-6> kubuntu: financing the content, ultimately leading to a pay-for-content attitude.
[21:40] <CIA-6> kubuntu: Additionally our current easylist import is from last century and cannot
[21:40] <CIA-6> kubuntu: be updated without markup conversion from adblock+ to khtml (LP: #372379).
[21:40] <CIA-6> kubuntu: In KDE 4.5, khtml will have automatic fetching of blocklists and adblock+
[21:40] <apachelogger> trimmed messages ftw :D
[21:43] <Blizzz> woot
[21:45] <Tscheesy> this wouldn't be Debian-Compatible i guess
[21:50] <apachelogger> Tscheesy: huh?
[21:50] <Tscheesy> the point about providing content providers :)
[21:51] <apachelogger> I dont think I understand :P
[21:51] <apachelogger> what does debian have to do with websites that are financed through advertising
[21:52] <Tscheesy> enforcing free content?
[21:52] <apachelogger> that has nothing to do with the freedom of content
[21:52] <apachelogger> you can have free content and yet frame it in advertising
[21:52] <Tscheesy> anyway /me loves adblock
[21:53] <apachelogger> it's not like providing is fore free
[21:53] <apachelogger> otherwise wikipedia wouldnt constantly ask me for money ;)
[21:54] <ScottK> apachelogger: Probably (431164)
[21:55]  * apachelogger shoots
[21:55] <DarkwingDuck> jjesse: ping
[21:55] <apachelogger> bug dead
[21:55] <apachelogger> \o/
[21:56]  * apachelogger drags dead corps across the channel and leaves a trail of blue slime ;)
[21:58] <ScottK> If I'm not around the next time nixternal makes an appearance would someoneplease ask him to turn his powerpc box back on.
[21:58] <apachelogger> ScottK: see what he wrote
[21:59] <ScottK> Oh.
[21:59]  * ScottK revisits the backscroll
[22:00] <ScottK> apachelogger: Thanks.
[22:01] <apachelogger> np
[22:02] <DarkwingDuck> damn suck for nixternal
[22:03] <DarkwingDuck> who does work with khelpcenter?
[22:06] <apachelogger> no one
[22:06] <Sput> apachelogger: you really should enable colors for this channel, would make CIA's output much more readable :P
[22:06]  * apachelogger once poked into it and was easily driven off by the madness of the code
[22:06] <apachelogger> Sput: I am not even op :P
[22:07] <alvin> Yes, I think no one is pretty close to the real number
[22:08] <alvin> A lot of pieces are missing and a lot of information is obsolete (how to add applications to kicker?)
[22:08] <Sput> apachelogger: but you know how to bribe the ops!
[22:09]  * apachelogger doesnt even know who is op ^^
[22:09] <Sput> ChanServ, most probably
[22:09]  * apachelogger hands Riddell a basket full of cookies
[22:10] <apachelogger> pretty pretty please can we get colors enabled for the channel? :)
[22:10] <Tscheesy> there are also the kubuntu-docs in there and pretty fresh for lucid
[22:12] <apachelogger> hm
[22:12] <apachelogger> kppp is broken
[22:12] <apachelogger> you know
[22:12] <apachelogger> it would be really good if someone here had a dial up connection ^^
[22:12] <Tscheesy> lol
[22:13] <alvin> I tried Lucid today. Too many boot issues. I'll wait a few weeks until next tryout. But I'm happy to know the docs will be waiting there.
[22:14] <Tscheesy> alvin: just startet to translate and don't know to detailed - but all is fresh.. wanted to ask nixternal about it..
[22:16] <alvin> Nice, one day, we'll have a pretty complete system like Ubuntu :-) But we're not there yet. I did notice that we still haven't any buttons on the top left in Lucid. Also, the Xdmcp login option is still there at login.
[22:16] <Tscheesy> apachelogger: did a mochup :D
[22:17] <Tscheesy> *mockup (of the buutons)
[22:17] <alvin> Is there a link?
[22:17] <Tscheesy> mom
[22:18] <apachelogger> I did?
[22:18] <alvin> I can imagine the buttons next to the 'on all desktop' button. That's 5 buttons next to each other to choose from
[22:18] <apachelogger> what is that xdmcp stuff I am hearing about?
[22:19] <alvin> I only heard about it recently from Ubuntu users. In Karmic they lost the ability to log in remote from the gdm login screen
[22:20] <alvin> It's bug 408417
[22:21] <apachelogger> and we do have that?
[22:22] <alvin> We always had
[22:22]  * Tscheesy can't find it - was a joke anyway - with the Unicorn
[22:22]  * apachelogger remembers that he was looking into somehting like that
[22:22] <apachelogger> well
[22:22] <apachelogger> alvin: now that you reminded me I am sure I cared hiding that in kdm ;)
[22:22] <apachelogger> opt-in via kdmrc though
[22:22] <alvin> What they had was the ability to enable xdmcp from the gdm settings. We never had that and need to use kdmrc
[22:22] <alvin> apachelogger: You're joking I hope!
[22:23] <apachelogger> nope
[22:23] <apachelogger> like anyone is gonna now what xdmcp is anyway
[22:23]  * alvin speechless
[22:23] <apachelogger> that is like KDE had seriously a tab in clock&time that was labeld NTP
[22:23] <alvin> You can move my buttons, but please don't take away my xdmcp
[22:24] <apachelogger> I will not only move your buttons!!!! I will also reuse the nicely freed up space on the right :P :P :P
[22:25] <alvin> At a company I work (freelance), we build our main production on Kubuntu servers. They're only running one application, but everyone logs in using XDMCP.
[22:25] <alvin> Nobody will care about the buttons (they're actually used to... CDE), but they will care about the login part.
[22:25] <alvin> Ah, well, torches and pitchforks people. They want to move our buttons!
[22:26] <apachelogger> http://imagebin.ca/view/S2wMq1.html
[22:26] <ScottK> alvin: No one is moving Kubuntu's buttons.
[22:26] <apachelogger> I AM
[22:26] <ScottK> Not while  the archive is frozen you aren't.
[22:26] <apachelogger> alvin: well, it would b ea matter of switiching a setting in kdmrc
[22:26] <alvin> I feel like logging a bug. You did not only move the buttons, you also removed the two that stood there!
[22:26] <apachelogger> ScottK: sure I will!!!!
[22:27] <apachelogger> I will hack them stupid servers
[22:27] <apachelogger> and then I will deploy button movement
[22:27] <apachelogger> not only KDE, but also xfce
[22:27] <apachelogger> muhahahahaha
[22:27] <ScottK> apachelogger: I'm sure wgrant can fill you in on the latest security holes in Launchpad.
[22:27] <apachelogger> and fluxbox maybe, not sure about that though
[22:27] <ScottK> apachelogger: Don't forget lxde and lubuntu.
[22:28] <apachelogger> dont care about those
[22:28] <alvin> Wasn't the reasoning behind the buttons the placing of the applications menu? In that regard, you should move them to the bottom left.
[22:28] <apachelogger> Sput: what do you think of http://imagebin.ca/view/S2wMq1.html
[22:28] <apachelogger> can we take chakra with that?
[22:28] <ScottK> alvin: I'm not aware of any reason beyond "We like it better" being made public.
[22:29]  * apachelogger wants to beat their hyping asses with a counter hype
[22:29] <apachelogger> we could ship erotic pictures of the devs with the lucid final builds I suppose
[22:29] <apachelogger> as wallpaper choices
[22:30] <alvin> ScottK: I don't remember where, but I've read that your pointer is closer to the applications menu and so you win some time opening an application after closing an application.
[22:30] <Sput> apachelogger: obviously, chakra doesn't have pink ponies.
[22:30] <apachelogger> well
[22:30] <apachelogger> 3 words
[22:30] <apachelogger> in form of 3 letters
[22:30] <apachelogger> RTL
[22:30] <apachelogger> boom
[22:30] <ryanakca> shtylman: I hope so. ofirk tells me it's in the finishing touches stage.
[22:30] <apachelogger> whole reasoning is down the drain
[22:31]  * apachelogger is evil
[22:31] <apachelogger> muhahahaha
[22:31] <ScottK> alvin: OK.  Odd reasoning.  For me at least closing and opening apps are very rarely closely coupled.
[22:31] <apachelogger> ScottK: maybe they want to make ubuntu run on the iPad
[22:31] <alvin> For ex-Windows users, it is. Closing an app to free some mem, than opening another. Or just to keep the desktop clean
[22:31] <apachelogger> then they must limit themselfs to non-multi-tasking
[22:32] <apachelogger> which then would lead to a close-open-close-open usage paradigm :D
[22:32] <alvin> Oh, it's a conspiracy to boot
[22:32] <apachelogger> alvin: problem is, chances are that you were scrolling down a bar, or pressing some button
[22:33] <apachelogger> usually that stuff is rightis
[22:33] <apachelogger> so you still need to make silly movement
[22:33] <apachelogger> in fact I doubt you can avoid pointless movements by shifting around stuff
[22:34] <alvin> You're right. The reasoning is off. I really can't remember where I've read it. The only logical explanation that's left is the ipad theory then.
[22:34] <apachelogger> it might work better in one case, but then makes another one fail
[22:34] <apachelogger> *nod*
[22:34] <apachelogger> ipad it is
[22:35] <apachelogger> kubotu: identica dent true reason of ubuntu's buttons on the left change: they will remove multi tasking to work better on the iPad
[22:35] <kubotu> status updated
[22:36] <apachelogger> kubotu: np
[22:36] <kubotu> apachelogger listened to "Kellerman's Anthem" by The Emile Bergstein Chorale [More Dirty Dancing] 105 seconds ago; -- see http://www.last.fm/user/apachelogger for more
[22:37] <apachelogger> kubotu: not quite :D
[22:38] <Tscheesy> kubotu: knows much more than our kubine :/
[22:44] <rickspencer3> apachelogger, I'm back
[22:45] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: <apachelogger> rickspencer3: well, I was just thinking, maybe canonical could push above mentioned spec draft a bit ;)
 juding from the author it was drafted by/within KDE, so I suppose there it is supported
 + the author of the oxygen mouse theme would probably be glad about some spec ^^
[22:45] <apachelogger> http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/cursor-spec being the spec
[22:50] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: right now I have been told it is totally up to the app how it calls what cursor, apparently there are even apps that request a specific SHA1 for whatever reason
[23:05] <fooscript> Hello everybody :) I came to you with problem. Hope I will get your support :)
[23:06] <apachelogger> support in #kubuntu please, thanks
[23:08] <fooscript> apachelogger: They told me I should come here. I've problem with compilation trunk KDE under Kubuntu 10.X.
[23:08] <apachelogger> fooscript: and the problem is?
[23:09] <fooscript> While compiling kdelibs :"CMake Error at cmake/modules/MacroEnsureOutOfSourceBuild.cmake:17 (MESSAGE): kdelibs requires an out of source build.  Please create a separate build directory and run 'cmake path_to_kdelibs [options]' there."  I do not understand. Could anybody explain me in simple words? I came do kdelibs, mkdir build, cd build, cmake .. and... no result :/ What is this path_to_kdelibs? aah.. .bashrc is taken from KDE
[23:09] <fooscript>  building tutorial. Anybody?
[23:09] <apachelogger> oh dear
[23:09] <apachelogger> fooscript: google is your friend
[23:10] <apachelogger> kubotu: google kde trunk build
[23:10] <kubotu> Results for kde trunk build: 1. Getting Started/Build/KDE4 - KDE TechBase: http://techbase.kde.org/Getting_Started/Build/KDE4 | 2. Getting Started/Build/KDE4/Prerequisites - KDE TechBase: http://techbase.kde.org/Getting_Started/Build/KDE4/Prerequisites | 3. Lokalize - KDE UserBase: http://userbase.kde.org/Lokalize
[23:10] <apachelogger> fooscript: ^
[23:10] <apachelogger> 1. should have all the information you need
[23:14] <fooscript> apachelogger: Thx. Works  :)
[23:16] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: \o/
[23:16] <JontheEchidna> o/
[23:17] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: aseigo hides from me :P
[23:17] <JontheEchidna> :P
[23:17] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: and rickspencer3 might have passed out because of the wicked cursor-naming spec :/
[23:18]  * apachelogger should stop talking to people ^^
[23:18] <apachelogger> I need a proxy minion! :D
[23:18] <rickspencer3> heh
[23:18] <JontheEchidna> darn you apachelogger!!1!
[23:18] <apachelogger> oh dear
[23:18]  * apachelogger hides
[23:18] <JontheEchidna> :P
[23:18] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: any thoughts on pushing the spec?
[23:18] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: also I wanted to say someting on whatever we were talking about earlier
[23:19] <apachelogger> of course I forgot what we were talking about
[23:19] <JontheEchidna> language notification?
[23:19] <rickspencer3> apachelogger, well, I think it's a good idea
[23:19] <rickspencer3> not sure what you mean by "pushing" it
[23:19] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: getting it out of draft state and enforce it I suppose :)
[23:20] <rickspencer3> this is not something I've done
[23:21] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: well, whom could I poke with it?
[23:22] <rickspencer3> apachelogger, do you want to enforce on *buntu?
[23:22]  * apachelogger recons that application indicator stuff is like a joint-venture of kde and canonical engineering powers rather than kde and xdg ;)
[23:22] <rickspencer3> or freedesktop?
[23:22]  * rgreening pokes rickspencer3 and asks "Kubuntu UbuntuOne Store? or Amarok Ubuntu Music Store? Are these on any forseeable horizon" :)
[23:22] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: freedesktop
[23:22] <rickspencer3> apachelogger, you know where to ask, ayatana
[23:22] <rickspencer3> they're all about freedesktop there
[23:22] <apachelogger> hm, right
[23:22] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: thanks
[23:23] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: you must go talk to ayatana
[23:23] <rickspencer3> rgreening, so U1 music store is wrapped around webkit
[23:23]  * rgreening whistles sheepishly
[23:23] <rickspencer3> so it's made to drop in with just a bit of effort
[23:23] <lex79> apachelogger: Should I wait someone that commit the diff? http://reviewboard.kde.org/r/3512/
[23:23] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: if they know about my ranting then I better do not go there, I might not return alive ;)
[23:23] <rickspencer3> apachelogger, sorry to blow you off
[23:23] <rickspencer3> it's just that feedesktop is not something I'm really part of
[23:23] <rgreening> cool. rickspencer3 any idea if/when? My wife is driving me nuts about getting this and ordering her tango music from there
[23:24] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: I will just never ask you again :P
[23:24] <apachelogger> lex79: mailing kdeedu mailing list usually works better than waiting I might say
[23:24]  * rgreening likes anything not tied to iJunk
[23:24] <apachelogger> lex79: or hunting down the maintainer on irc if he does use it
[23:25] <rickspencer3> rgreening, well, someone would have to write that
[23:25] <lex79> ok thanks
[23:25] <rickspencer3> sorry apachelogger ... the depths of my suckitude is great
[23:25] <apachelogger> oh
[23:25] <rgreening> Riddell: ^ I guess we have one spec for this upcoming cycle
[23:25]  * apachelogger hugs rickspencer3 and hands him a cookie
[23:25] <rickspencer3> apachelogger, someone did it for *cough* banshee *cough*
[23:25] <rickspencer3> so you can probably see there how to do it
[23:25] <apachelogger> rgreening: U1 integration is up for GSOC projecting I know
[23:25] <apachelogger> thing is
[23:26] <rgreening> oh, cool
[23:26] <apachelogger> you cant do it in amaork lik it was done in banshee
[23:26] <rgreening> oh... hrmm
[23:26] <apachelogger> amarok got a superior framework :P
[23:26] <rgreening> ah
[23:26] <apachelogger> which requires some sort of API on the U1 store site
[23:26] <rgreening> that mean easier?
[23:26] <rgreening> blarg
[23:26] <apachelogger> rgreening: depends entirely on what is available on the server end
[23:27] <rgreening> my wife is gonna hate me for many more months it seems
[23:27] <apachelogger> well
[23:27] <apachelogger> if there is some API it is all good and easy I would say
[23:27]  * rgreening doesnt think installing a new media player is an option
[23:27] <apachelogger> especially since there is magnatune where one can lend a lot of ideas :)
[23:28] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: does U1 music store happen to have some sensible API?
[23:28] <apachelogger> REST-like stuff
[23:28] <rgreening> and we still need U1 itself for KDE
[23:28] <rgreening> and not a web page only access
[23:28] <apachelogger> rgreening: your defintion of U1 being?
[23:28] <apachelogger> file storage?
[23:29] <rickspencer3> ah, right, unfortunately you need to sync daemon
[23:29] <rickspencer3> I forgot about that part
[23:29] <rgreening> Sry.. there are two things here.. UbuntuOne with the storage and then the Music Store which hooks into storage
[23:29] <rickspencer3> the problem is that the store is designed to work behind a web server
[23:29] <apachelogger> hm
[23:29] <rickspencer3> so they can't support downloads directly to your computer
[23:29] <rickspencer3> or you could just download everything
[23:29]  * rgreening feels like banging head against the wall for fun and enjoyment
[23:30]  * apachelogger blinks
[23:30] <rickspencer3> yeah
[23:30] <rickspencer3> by "them" I mean the actual company that provides the music store
[23:30] <apachelogger> some things I will never understand, amongst them is how web app devs think ^^
[23:31] <rgreening> do they?
[23:31] <rgreening> :P
[23:31] <apachelogger> *shrug*
[23:31] <apachelogger> ohhh
[23:31] <apachelogger> actually
[23:31] <apachelogger> you can use a web page
[23:31] <rgreening> so, maybe we need a quickly template for ubuntu one development
[23:32] <rgreening> rickspencer3: ^ ;)
[23:32] <apachelogger> but depending on how the site scales it might look like crap
[23:32] <rickspencer3> hehe
[23:32] <apachelogger> other than that it might even be easier than doing a full online service implementation as common within amarok
[23:32] <rickspencer3> any chance of the Kubuntu team making a client for the sync daemon?
[23:33] <rickspencer3> I think you could run it with the CLI interface today if you wante
[23:33] <rickspencer3> d
[23:33] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: up for GSOCing
[23:33] <apachelogger> rickspencer3: for a client someone really just needs to take my tech preview code, modify it for the new U1 and hook it up with some UI
[23:34]  * Riddell comes back in for the evening
[23:34] <apachelogger> getting it integrated in dolphin is also more of a political than a technical issues
[23:34] <ScottK> Sounds like something debfx could whip out in an evening.
[23:34]  * apachelogger says hello to Riddell and hands him a cup of tea :)
[23:35] <apachelogger> now
[23:35] <apachelogger> since JontheEchidna is also hiding form me
[23:35] <apachelogger> who wants to go talk to ayatana about the cursor naming spec?
[23:36] <ScottK> Sounds like an rgreening kind of project.
[23:36] <rgreening> lol
[23:37] <JontheEchidna> was eating dinner, back now
[23:37] <ScottK> apachelogger: Look he even raised both hands.
[23:37] <rgreening> If apachelogger wishes to furnish me with enough detail and ammo to speak intelligently on the subject so as to get this moving...
[23:37]  * apachelogger spends rgreening a trip to #ayatana
[23:37]  * apachelogger also sends JontheEchidna to #ayatana land for backup
[23:38] <apachelogger> rgreening: I am babbling about this for hours ^^
[23:38] <apachelogger> just read backlog
[23:38] <rgreening> oh reading... sounds like a problem from the get go
[23:38] <rgreening> :P
[23:38] <apachelogger> oh my
[23:38]  * apachelogger gets his voice recorder
[23:38] <apachelogger> ^^
[23:38] <rgreening> heh
[23:38] <apachelogger> "once upon a time..."
[23:39] <apachelogger> wellt
[23:39] <apachelogger> -t
[23:39] <apachelogger> let me try to sum it up a bit
[23:39] <apachelogger> we have bug 288502
[23:39] <rgreening> do we perhaps want to broach this as a spec for Maverick and put it under the Dx/Ayatan umbrella?
[23:40] <apachelogger> which is caused by most curosr themes not being qt4 compatible
[23:41] <apachelogger> Qt4 comes with somewhat different names (See note for X11 users on http://doc.trolltech.com/4.4/qcursor.html) and so the lookup in the themes themselves fails, going to default, default in our case is oxygen, so the curosr pximap for the required curosr will come from oxygen then
[23:41] <apachelogger> if oxygen wasnt default it would continuing different names until it ends up with something that is available in the theme or a fallback and used that (mostly it will be former though)
[23:42] <apachelogger> so I was talking with ruphy (oxygen cursor master) about this and he stated that there is no whatsoever spec regarding naming of cursors
[23:42] <apachelogger> at this point we have Qt3 names, Qt4 names, GTK names .... individual app names ...
[23:43] <apachelogger> there is however the very nice spec draft http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/cursor-spec that tries to unify this stuff across xdg complient systems at least
[23:43] <apachelogger> which was apparently drafted by/within KDE (juding from the author), but other than that not much seemed to have happend (also the spec draft is rather old)
[23:44] <apachelogger> so what it would be very nice if ayatana could pick up on this and by cool ayatana magic make it impelemted for 10.10
[23:44] <apachelogger> i.e. both on the KDE and the GNOME side
[23:45] <apachelogger> or at the very least get the spec through, accepted and all, so that the individual upstreams can implement it
[23:45] <apachelogger> that way creating cursor themes will be much easier, and users will not run into incomplete cursor themes (at least not concerning standard complient apps)

[23:49] <rgreening> cool
[23:49] <rgreening> I can draft all that up and post to ayatana list for feedback then
[23:49] <rgreening> apachelogger: ^
[23:50] <apachelogger> rgreening: do whatever you deem necessary to get this implemented ;)
[23:50] <DarkwingDuck> someone asking that the doc status earlier?
[23:51] <rgreening> gtg.. bbiab
[23:53] <apachelogger> hm
[23:53] <apachelogger> hmmmmmmm
[23:53] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: your installevent looks more like a installmultimediaevent?
[23:53] <JontheEchidna> yeah
[23:54] <JontheEchidna> feel free to change
[23:54]  * apachelogger is too scared to change it around at this time of cycle really :(
[23:54] <JontheEchidna> it used to be an installmultimediaandsemanticevent
[23:54] <JontheEchidna> so I just called it installevent
[23:56]  * apachelogger is going to kill the ibus stuff
[23:56] <apachelogger> I have never ever seen such annoying messages
[23:56] <apachelogger> and I usually run with debugfull
[23:57] <apachelogger> hm
[23:57] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: that design wouldnt scale very well TBH
[23:57] <apachelogger> anyhow
[23:57] <wgrant> ScottK: I only know of two that remain unfixed, unfortunately.
[23:58] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: well, it was made to implement the current spec for the LTS
[23:58] <JontheEchidna> with minimal changes to the apps (in fact, it's a drop-in replacement)
[23:58] <JontheEchidna> we can do better design for 10.10 onwards
[23:58] <apachelogger> yeah
[23:58] <apachelogger> well
[23:58] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: you know my POV on that
[23:59] <apachelogger> kde should have an api for that stuffz
[23:59] <apachelogger> one to rule them all
[23:59] <apachelogger> distro agnostic et al
[23:59] <apachelogger> oh shitz
[23:59] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: adding a new category would require a new string
[23:59] <apachelogger> ?